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by ucim
Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:46 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Then I'm not sure what your point is. You seem to be just looking to assume people cannot solve problems in order to dismiss the idea of functioning democracy, You seem to be of the opinion that I am only capable of considering either an absolute dictatorship, or a free-for-all democracy. In that y...
by ucim
Sun Jul 22, 2018 4:35 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Thesh wrote:My understanding was...
...wrong. Again.

I'll leave it at that, except to point out the subject line of this thread. That is all.

Jose
by ucim
Sat Jul 21, 2018 5:04 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

You said that the customers of a store should not be able to negotiate a contract. No, I didn't say that. Customers of a store should certainly be permitted (within the law) to negotiate a contract. What I am saying is that in practice, (outside of haggling a price or substituting rice for fries) t...
by ucim
Sat Jul 21, 2018 3:04 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Are you deliberately fucking dense? This is getting very close to ad hominum again. Do you really think that, left to their own devices, people naturally operate for the good of others rather than themselves? Sure, sometimes, but it's not the norm. Isn't that your own objection to capitalism to beg...
by ucim
Sat Jul 21, 2018 5:47 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Why would you assume all of that? Because people operate in their own interests, not in the interests of others. Groups do the same thing. If a company can make a cheaper toaster that's not as safe, they will sell more of them, and make more profit wages for the workers. Especially if the knowledge...
by ucim
Sat Jul 21, 2018 4:26 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Regulations that protect workers and consumers should be handled through collective bargaining between employees and customers of a business. This is exceedingly unwieldy. You, as a consumer, would need to join a collective bargaining association (a union) for pretty much everything you buy, and ev...
by ucim
Thu Jul 19, 2018 6:00 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

And that's why you are an authoritarian. That word... I don't think it means what you think it means. Sometimes you need a boss with vision and backing. Movies are not directed by committee. When that starts to happen, the movie will probably end up crap. But sometimes you very much want "the ...
by ucim
Thu Jul 19, 2018 5:21 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

Anyways, in your example, nothing injust has happened. Nobody has been forced into doing anything they didn't want to do. Some people are just dissatisfied with the result of their choices. From a Libertarian standpoint, everything is fine, and no change is necessary. Is libertarianism also fine wi...
by ucim
Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:16 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Everything is racism
Replies: 27
Views: 2696

Re: Everything is racism

When this thread was made, I was expecting a serious discussion about how much white people owe minorities for the crimes/thefts of their forefathers. e.g. Blacks deserve free housing and college education for the next 2 generations. Gays, an gay subsidy. Muslims? Maybe tax free casinos after the c...
by ucim
Thu Jul 19, 2018 3:06 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

And that brings me back to Sweden and co. I say that good governance is the overridingly important factor rather than political philosophy, and I'd say that the Scandinavian countries have been governed pretty well. I would agree here. But getting (and keeping!) the "good" in governance i...
by ucim
Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:01 am UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Libertarianism
Replies: 856
Views: 22717

Re: Libertarianism

First, it's important to separate the (in this case Libertarian) economic philosophy itself, which should work from "any point" forward... separate it from the idea of a "just" starting distribution and how to accomplish it. And even before trying to figure out how to accomplish ...
by ucim
Wed Jul 18, 2018 2:44 pm UTC
Forum: Individual XKCD Comic Threads
Topic: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"
Replies: 80
Views: 5768

Re: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"

Yeah, sorta. And yes. $2 bills are uncommon (too bad because they are the prettiest ones); many people don't know about them. People have been arrested for possessing them. The glue stick makes it seem like the bills come from a pad of paper (and are thus fake, because real money isn't "sold&qu...
by ucim
Tue Jul 17, 2018 4:29 am UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Pfhorrest wrote:A dichotomy means two options are exclusive and exhaustive [...] It can't be both, true; but it could be (and is) neither.
Yup - my mistake. Dang! That's my second one this year! :)

Jose
by ucim
Tue Jul 17, 2018 3:26 am UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Pfhorrest wrote:made up by man vs divinely woven is a false dichotomy
No it's not. If it's divinely woven (which presumes the existence of the divine in the first place), then it cannot be "made up by man". If it's made up by man (and we assume man is not divine), then it cannot be divinely woven.

Jose
by ucim
Mon Jul 16, 2018 11:59 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Not sure the relevance. The point is that unless you actually make a conscious effort to say "this is enough, I don't need more", you will instinctually just continue collecting more and more, regardless of whether it is actually beneficial. I didn't say it explains literally everyone who...
by ucim
Mon Jul 16, 2018 9:58 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Redistributing organs is bad from a utilitarian perspective because of secondary consequences of living in a world where you can't trust you'll survive a hospital visit even (or especially) if you're healthy. We only take organs from "those kinds" of people. If you're one of us, you're fi...
by ucim
Mon Jul 16, 2018 7:10 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Yeah, as time goes on I become more and more convinced that Trump takes orders directly from Putin. Or from Bannon and the like, who take their orders from Putin. Dunno. Any evidence of communication there? Happiness is measured with far less precision than money. Perhaps this is a clue that there ...
by ucim
Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:53 am UTC
Forum: Individual XKCD Comic Threads
Topic: 1190: "Time"
Replies: 106313
Views: 39041613

Re: 1190: "Time"

Yes, the mr*bdex story is too slow. Sorry. Are you really apologizing for making us wait for it? Heresy! Off to the Comfy Chair! Welcome back Aluisio ! I've been wondering what was going on with you! Someday I'll find reason to return "303 See OTTer" in an application You sure you don't m...
by ucim
Sat Jul 14, 2018 10:06 pm UTC
Forum: Individual XKCD Comic Threads
Topic: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"
Replies: 80
Views: 5768

Re: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"

NotAllThere wrote:Perhaps the confusion arises between UK usage of the abbreviation "Maths" and the US usage of "Math".
Yes. That was the joke.

Jose
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 7:53 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

I'm curious as to what the other unit of value is. [...] it seems as if it's mostly a vague "some other value there Yeah, it's vague because it's hard to quantify. That's my point. Not only is it hard to quantify, it's on another axis. There could be several such axes. One of them could be &qu...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 6:20 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

There's no particular reason why people ought to have two categories, far as I can see. Why not three? Two is sufficient to make my point. There may be many, but I claim there are at least two. To give you a dollar value for a plot of land, size and location would be important. As well as the actua...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:58 pm UTC
Forum: Individual XKCD Comic Threads
Topic: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"
Replies: 80
Views: 5768

Re: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"

NotAllThere wrote:
ucim wrote:No. It's how many maths did people do.

Jose
How much maths did people do, surely?

No, it's how many maths. How much of something you measure, how many of something you count. The 's' implies something you count.

Jose
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:54 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

I can't verify that a soul even exists, let alone does anything... It's a ch*rpin' metaphor . You've got a value for it as habitat, and a value for it as road. So, what is the value? This does not stop us from calculating the price of a cheeseburger. You keep confusing price with value. Price is a ...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:36 pm UTC
Forum: Individual XKCD Comic Threads
Topic: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"
Replies: 80
Views: 5768

Re: 2019: "An Apple for a Dollar"

No. It's how many maths did people do.

Jose
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 4:03 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

I have repeatedly noted that Trump is *not* running the country in anything like a cost effective way. And I am saying that cost effectiveness is not the best metric of a country, and in many areas it is not even a good one. You focus too much on the fiscal; yes it's important, but it's not the mea...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 2:43 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

The equivalence of {thing} and money is only valid if it goes both ways. If a tire is destroyed and I get $200 for it, I can take the $200 and get another tire, and be back where I started. But if my sister is destroyed and I get a million dollars for her, I can't just get another sister. And if I g...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 1:51 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: In other news... (humorous news items)
Replies: 14779
Views: 2288580

Re: In other news... (humorous news items)

I think this quote captures it best: " [An open office is] an open expanse of proximal employees choosing to isolate themselves as best they can (e.g. by wearing large headphones) while appearing to be as busy as possible (since everyone can see them) " http://rstb.royalsocietypublishing.o...
by ucim
Fri Jul 13, 2018 3:30 am UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Your friend has a lot of money and/or property sitting idle, and because of it she enjoys a nice leisure life making paintings (that never sell). If you could steal her stuff, you could make much more productive use of it. You've figured out how do to it, the only downside is that your friend will k...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:24 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

This [apparent cost] has a positive dollar value how? It's an investment in the future... Trump's future. He is investing with our money, to get the payout at the end (or to keep the payoff he's getting sub rosa now). That's part of what the whole Trump investigation is about. Granted, this is all ...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 7:05 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

In one sense, that may be what we're discussing here, in that I'm advocating a single metric of value as applying to everything, rather than multiples. Yes, and it's clearly incorrect to do so. Pretty much provably so, unless you stick your fingers in your ears and scream "I can't hear you!&qu...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 6:06 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

If you're valuing things in imaginary numbers, then the problem's with your valuation, not your ordering. No. The "problem" is that the thing itself that you are trying to value is complex . In the simplest sense it has a real part and an imaginary part. ("Real" and "imagin...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 5:46 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Which quantity is bigger: 7, or (4 + 3i)? They are both numbers; if you can't well-order the numbers, how can you even hope to well-order the "general welfare" of a state?

Jose
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:47 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Firearms Regulations
Replies: 213
Views: 13072

Re: Firearms Regulations

Tyndmyr wrote:Firearm-specific liability insurance makes no more sense than swimming pool-specific liability insurance.
Bear in mind that many (general) insurance policies exclude specific perils, such as aviation, swimming pools, and firearms. In some cases you can't even buy a rider for it.

Jose
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:42 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

In any case, the contentious bit is that I believe that government actions ought to be justified on a cost/benefit basis No, the contentious bit is your claim that (monetary) cost/benefit analysis is sufficient to justify action or inaction. A seaish amount of cruelty can be justified that way. Cru...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:27 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Firearms Regulations
Replies: 213
Views: 13072

Re: Firearms Regulations

I don't know what kind of Anarchy you are advocating for. I am advocating for Provable Personal Responsibility. The kind of "anarchy" that liberated us from the British king two hundred or so years ago. And this is not incompatible with Provable Personal Responsibility; that's a false dic...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 4:17 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

This disagreement stems from identifying corporations, charities, and governments as fiscal entities, which Ucim disagreed with. I'm not sure how "they're doing this because it's the best way to make money" is anything other than acknowledgement of the above. Corporations do it to make mo...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:12 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Firearms Regulations
Replies: 213
Views: 13072

Re: Firearms Regulations

Tyndmyr wrote:Even though the training courses are not political, perception is going to greatly blur the two.
Not just perception; putting (a branch of) the NRA in charge of (or closely linked to) licensing makes it political.
cphite wrote:Not sure I like the idea of any single institution; I'd rather there be standards that any institution that wants to teach these courses would have to meet.
I agree wholeheartedly. Good point.

Jose
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 3:07 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Tyndmyr wrote:It's an organization, but it's not very much like a tribe. [...]. The corporation is after cold hard cash
Perhaps you're reading too much into the word "tribe" in this context. Yes, the corp is after cash, and it found out that by banding together in an organized manner, it can get more cash. My original statement was "They organize for the same reason a tribe organizes for the hunt." A tribe doesn't organize for the hunt because of tribal sentiment, it does so because it's a more efficient and effective way to bring home the bacon. Ditto Best Buy.
Tyndmyr wrote:Someone in misery is not as productive...
Yeah, that's a side effect. It's not the primary effect. The primary effect is, well, misery.

Jose
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:45 pm UTC
Forum: News & Articles
Topic: Trump presidency
Replies: 6474
Views: 503007

Re: Trump presidency

Art provides another example. Commodities are easily valued; they are sold in quantity, they are more or less fungible, and they are not rare. This allows the competitive market to set a price through (generalized) arbitrage. Art is not like that; each piece is unique, and each person values that pi...
by ucim
Thu Jul 12, 2018 1:25 pm UTC
Forum: Serious Business
Topic: Everything is racism
Replies: 27
Views: 2696

Re: Everything is racism

At that point, does ["tribe"] mean anything more than just "group of people", with an added negative connotation? It's a group of people that are cohesive in some meaningful way. Classically this means through contact, communication, and some organized power structure, but the c...

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