Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Things that don't belong anywhere else. (Check first).

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Weeks » Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:35 pm UTC

The Mighty Thesaurus wrote:
Azrael wrote:But to suggest that deleting spam in and of itself should be rewarding? I can't even roll my eyes hard enough. Worse yet? You're suggesting that we should enjoy banning, locking or disciplining users. That's like, 100% the exact opposite of the attitude we do and should hold. That part sucks, and if we enjoyed it? If we took pleasure or reward in it? Shit, you have not thought through your position.

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I vote TMT for moderator.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Wed Apr 02, 2014 7:56 pm UTC

I vote TMT forever.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby pseudoidiot » Wed Apr 02, 2014 8:21 pm UTC

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Jplus » Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:46 pm UTC

I don't want to spoil the fun for the mods, which I think is well deserved, but I feel I should nuance the rhetorical claim that a majority of the forumites enjoys mod madness a little.

From my personal experience as a non-mod I can tell that modness amuses me most of the time, but there are also things that don't amuse me. At some point I decided to postpone further reading until after modness, not because I couldn't laugh about the filters (I could!) but simply because reading took too much effort and I was unsure whether I was translating stuff correctly. For analogous reasons I had to postpone posting. I think this actually caused me to miss quite a lot of the fun.

I really enjoy all the jokes and the filters, and I believe I'm probably a fairly normal forumite in that regard. I also think that the mods deserve to have some fun of their own once a year and that not everything they do during madness needs to be funny for non-mods. Again, I think I might be quite normal in that regard. Given that I seem so normal to myself (fully aware that I might be completely wrong about that), I believe I might not be the only one who feels that the word filtering is being overdone. Not because it isn't funny, but because at this intensity it actually prevents me from enjoying all the funny stuff that I would like to be part of.

So, if "a majority of all forumites enjoys the madness" is actually part of the justification for the event, then I think there might be reason to make some adjustments in order to optimize the fun for all parties involved. You could improve my particular experience dramatically by just doing a bit less of the filtering and a bit more of the other stuff. If it isn't part of the justification, please be clear about that and don't use it as an argument.

Some hard stats about numbers of page views and numbers of posts during mod madness as compared to the rest of the year would also be welcome, if somebody seriously wants to maintain that a majority of forumites is enjoying it. The fact that only a handfull of people complain and a larger handfull of people explicitly support the mods, does not tell us anything about the rest of the community.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby PinkShinyRose » Wed Apr 02, 2014 10:52 pm UTC

Jplus wrote:So, if "a majority of all forumites enjoys the madness" is actually part of the justification for the event, then I think there might be reason to make some adjustments in order to optimize the fun for all parties involved. You could improve my particular experience dramatically by just doing a bit less of the filtering and a bit more of the other stuff. If it isn't part of the justification, please be clear about that and don't use it as an argument.

Awww, I like the heavy filtering. Then again, I also posted in the Time thread before I decided it took too much time so I might just be a weirdo who likes that kind of thing.

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:05 pm UTC

Jplus wrote:I don't want 2 spoil the fun for the Puppetmasters, which I think be waterpit deserved, but I feel I could nuance the rhetorical claim that a majority of the forumites enjoys Puppetmaster madness a little.

From I's personal experience as a non-Puppetmaster I will tell that modness amuses I most of the time, but there be also things that don't amuse I. At some point I decided 2 postpone further reading until after modness, not because I couldn't laugh about the crumbs (I could!) but simply because reading took 2 much effort and I be'd unsure whether I be'd translating stuff correctly. For analogous reasons I had 2 postpone posting. I think this actually caused I 2 miss quite a lot of the fun.

I really enjoy all the jokes and the crumbs, and I believe HULK probably a fairly normal forumite in that regard. I also think that the Puppetmasters deserve 2 have some fun of they's own once a year and that not everything they do during madness needs 2 be funny for non-Puppetmasters. Again, I think I might be quite normal in that regard. Given that I seem so normal 2 myself (fully aware that I might be completely wrong about that), I believe I might not be the only one who feels that the loaf filtering be being overdone. Not because it isn't funny, but because at this intensity it actually prevents I from enjoying all the funny stuff that I would like 2 be part of.

So, if "a majority of all forumites enjoys the madness" be actually part of the justification for the event, then I think there might be reason 2 make some adjustments in order 2 optimize the fun for all parties involved. You could improve I's particular experience dramatically by just doing a bit less of the filtering and a bit more of the other stuff. If it isn't part of the justification, please be clear about that and don't use it as a argument.

Some hard stats about numbers of page views and numbers of posts during mod madness as compared to the rest of the year would also be welcome, if somebody seriously wants to maintain that a majority of forumites is enjoying it. The fact that only a handfull of people complain and a larger handfull of people explicitly support the mods, does not tell us anything about the rest of the community.
From what I can see, the normal ACP page doesn't save statistics over time to allow us to see that sort of information, though davean may have something like it.

A script that regularly checks and records the number after "Total posts" at the bottom of the index page should be fairly straightforward, though. By which I mean, fairly straightforward for someone who knows how to do things like that in the first place.

Edit: It looks like this is a thing, though.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby phlip » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:47 pm UTC

gmalivuk wrote:A script that regularly checks and records the number after "Total posts" at the bottom of the index page should be fairly straightforward, though. By which I mean, fairly straightforward for someone who knows how to do things like that in the first place.

operator[] made a thing for that... [edit] which I see you have also found [/edit]

madness activity.png
madness activity.png (15.36 KiB) Viewed 12482 times

The blue line is the activity for the past week, while the red line is the average week-to-week activity for a baseline (to account for the fact that, for instance, activity is usually lower on the weekends regardless of madness). The period of mod madness is highlighted.

There wasn't really any significant dropoff in activity while the madness was happening... any people who stopped visiting due to the madness were balanced by other people visiting more due to the madness.

Spoiler:
For transparency, that composite graph was edited together from these two, by rotating the "all weeks" one to go Wednesday to Wednesday instead of Monday to Monday, changing the colour and overlaying them:
this week.png
this week.png (8.71 KiB) Viewed 12482 times
all weeks.png
all weeks.png (9.16 KiB) Viewed 12482 times

Code: Select all

enum ಠ_ಠ {°□°╰=1, °Д°╰, ಠ益ಠ╰};
void ┻━┻︵​╰(ಠ_ಠ ⚠) {exit((int)⚠);}
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Apr 02, 2014 11:56 pm UTC

What is the vertical scale on that?
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby phlip » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:05 am UTC

Not a clue.

Code: Select all

enum ಠ_ಠ {°□°╰=1, °Д°╰, ಠ益ಠ╰};
void ┻━┻︵​╰(ಠ_ಠ ⚠) {exit((int)⚠);}
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby addams » Thu Apr 03, 2014 12:09 am UTC

phlip wrote:
gmalivuk wrote:A script that regularly checks and records the number after "Total posts" at the bottom of the index page should be fairly straightforward, though. By which I mean, fairly straightforward for someone who knows how to do things like that in the first place.

operator[] made a thing for that... [edit] which I see you have also found [/edit]

madness activity.png

The blue line is the activity for the past week, while the red line is the average week-to-week activity for a baseline (to account for the fact that, for instance, activity is usually lower on the weekends regardless of madness). The period of mod madness is highlighted.

There wasn't really any significant dropoff in activity while the madness was happening... any people who stopped visiting due to the madness were balanced by other people visiting more due to the madness.

Spoiler:
For transparency, that composite graph was edited together from these two, by rotating the "all weeks" one to go Wednesday to Wednesday instead of Monday to Monday, changing the colour and overlaying them:
this week.png
all weeks.png

What an interesting tool.
We have a Digital Nanny and I am so pleased.

Only the Best Families can have such a thing.
Look at us. We have Digital Nannies that empower.

It is empowering to have access to the tools and the data. right?
I don't want to use the tool. It is nice to know I can and what it looks like when others do.

edit:
It is a darned good thing I don't want to use it.
I can't. How do you do the things you do?

I can see the graph and it is darned funny.
The more a person understands that graph the better a person might understand a poster.

Not what they say, put when they say it.
Interesting? Only a little.

How can you tell where a person is?
Coralate their activity level with the comic Now.
http://xkcd.com/1335/

You have all the tools to stalk a Forum member.
Scary. Or; You can ask them where they are.

Will people tell strangers where they live in 3D?
Why?
Why, Not?

I don't understand digital stuff, very well.
I know it is at this very moment I am using it as an avoidance measure.

I have something to do.
Two things to do, that I don't want to do.

Thinking about tracking and being tracked is more fun.
Track me and I'll help you. (shrug)
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Jplus » Thu Apr 03, 2014 8:07 am UTC

phlip wrote:
madness activity.png

The blue line is the activity for the past week, while the red line is the average week-to-week activity for a baseline (to account for the fact that, for instance, activity is usually lower on the weekends regardless of madness). The period of mod madness is highlighted.

There wasn't really any significant dropoff in activity while the madness was happening... any people who stopped visiting due to the madness were balanced by other people visiting more due to the madness.

Thanks for that statistic. It looks convincing. Because of the high numbers on the vertical axis I suspect it shows numbers of page views. So it's still open whether there is a drop in number of posts.

That dimension of people who visit less being compensated for by people who visit more, didn't cross my mind before. That's two hidden variables: are there lots of people who visit slightly more due to madness and compensate for a small group of people who visit (much) less, or is it the other way round? And what fraction of the community adjusts its behaviour at all (in either direction)? I imagine those questions would be hard to answer.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Dopefish » Thu Apr 03, 2014 9:44 am UTC

I imagine the particular forums might matter too.

Legit science and math questions where being precise and clear is key to their very function I would think mostly break during mod madness, but more general discussions of cheese people can probably get by with less precision on, or even have it enriched by the filters.

Individuals willingness to adapt would in turn probably depend on what forums they frequent.

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby PinkShinyRose » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:15 am UTC

phlip wrote:operator[] made a thing for that... [edit] which I see you have also found [/edit]

madness activity.png

Are the day labels midnight UTC at the start of the day? It makes sense as most peaks are just before that time and I think the forum is mostly used by Americans during office hours.
Dopefish wrote:I imagine the particular forums might matter too.

Legit science and math questions where being precise and clear is key to their very function I would think mostly break during mod madness, but more general discussions of cheese people can probably get by with less precision on, or even have it enriched by the filters.

Individuals willingness to adapt would in turn probably depend on what forums they frequent.

Yes and no, individual comic thread discussions are usually rather frivolous, but the strongest opposition seems to come from the Time thread (in that sub-forum) and seems to skew that statistic (as it does with more statistics). Then again, I can very much imagine that Dear SB is strongly affected by the filters in a negative way and understand there has been an incident. Maybe Time is just the odd one out, not being affected by the filters this year but still being locked and all. I didn't see all that much complaining in other comic threads (confusion, but not really complaining) and FaiD seemed to adapt readily to the event, like last year I guess (although it may contain relatively many long term users).

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby operator[] » Thu Apr 03, 2014 2:02 pm UTC

That page builds on data scraped from the who is online page every hour. I believe the vertical scale is something like "average rows (pointing to that user/forum, if specified) saying "reading topic" or "replying to topic", for the particular time of day, times 1000", which means it's basically only useful for comparisons.

Jplus wrote:That dimension of people who visit less being compensated for by people who visit more, didn't cross my mind before. That's two hidden variables: are there lots of people who visit slightly more due to madness and compensate for a small group of people who visit (much) less, or is it the other way round? And what fraction of the community adjusts its behaviour at all (in either direction)? I imagine those questions would be hard to answer.
I could send you the raw data if you're interested in analyzing it for trends of individual users, but I worry that there might not be enough data points to say much.

PinkShinyRose wrote:Are the day labels midnight UTC at the start of the day? It makes sense as most peaks are just before that time and I think the forum is mostly used by Americans during office hours.
I believe that should be the case for at least the "Every day" and "Every week" options. For the others I think the day labels actually mean "24 hours ago", "48 hours ago", etc., but it's a bit hard to tell because the source code is an unreadable mess (written years ago, in PHP).

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Jplus » Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:00 pm UTC

operator[] wrote:I could send you the raw data if you're interested in analyzing it for trends of individual users, but I worry that there might not be enough data points to say much.

That's a very kind offer, thanks a lot for that. I would love to have a look into it, but I might not find the time within the next few weeks. How many data points are there?
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby operator[] » Thu Apr 03, 2014 3:18 pm UTC

One sample per hour, containing the first 50 entries of the list of (non-hidden) users seen visiting the fora within the last 5 minutes. So when looking at a particular user the data can be rather spiky:
Image

I'll sent you a PM with the raw data.

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby gmalivuk » Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:25 pm UTC

Jplus wrote:Thanks for that statistic. It looks convincing. Because of the high numbers on the vertical axis I suspect it shows numbers of page views. So it's still open whether there is a drop in number of posts.
I personally don't care if there's a drop in posting if there isn't a drop in viewing. It shows that people are still here and active and not being driven away, so are presumably mostly enjoying what they see even if they don't feel like posting something that'll end up incomprehensible.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Whizbang » Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:32 pm UTC

Most of what I post is incomprehensible anyway, so the madness didn't slow me down. It may have even made me bolder, knowing that I can blame any nonsensicallnessity on a filter or something.

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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby addams » Thu Apr 03, 2014 6:51 pm UTC

Jplus wrote:
operator[] wrote:I could send you the raw data if you're interested in analyzing it for trends of individual users, but I worry that there might not be enough data points to say much.

That's a very kind offer, thanks a lot for that. I would love to have a look into it, but I might not find the time within the next few weeks. How many data points are there?

There are 3,450,551 data points.
(possibly more.) that is the number of posts.
The time duration is not clear.
When was the machine told to start counting?

There is a smaller number.
0,382,461 is another set of data.
That is number of members.

Why would you want Raw Data?
Some people love figuring out Average, Median, Mode.

Before computer games, some people did that for fun.
Thank God for the Internet. I'm not good at Math.

The machine does the dirty work, now.
It even gathers the data points and stores them.

How great is that?!
The Machines put people out of work.

Once upon a time someone sat and input data.
Data points were input by keyboard, in a cold basement onto Black and Green Screens.

Now, people with those skills are not needed.
Poor me. Made Redundant by the Marvelous Machine.

The computer has all the Equations inside of it.
And; It can go get the numbers simi-autonomously?

What a Wonderful World you live in.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby eSOANEM » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:19 pm UTC

Also, the madness doesn't generally manage to make things incomprehensible (unless ST's broken everything), at least not after ten minutes working out a few of the most common filters.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby Bakemaster » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:55 pm UTC

Whizbang wrote:Most of what I post is incomprehensible anyway, so the madness didn't slow me down. It may have even made me bolder, knowing that I can blame any nonsensicallnessity on a filter or something.

DID ANYONE GET ANY OF THAT?

I THINK IT WAS BASQUE???

...oh wow, Google Translate has Basque. There goes the next 20 minutes of my life.
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Re: Mod Madness 2014 : The Announcement

Postby The Mighty Thesaurus » Fri Apr 04, 2014 2:16 am UTC

Good luck working out if the inflection is correct.
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