Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn. (blown away from News & Articles)

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Mutex » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:24 pm UTC

Think Pfhorrest should have been the first post in this new thread rather than me.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby SecondTalon » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:26 pm UTC

How about you wait until I'm goddamn done splitting this shit out on a fucking phone before complaining?

Because doing it makes me really really fucking irritated.


Note to self:Lock threads when splitting.



... sorry, Mutex. I let my irritation get the better of me.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:32 pm UTC

Amy Lee wrote:Just what we all need... more lies about a world that never was and never will be.


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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:43 pm UTC

Ginger.

It's very simple.

Teenage sex trafficking. In the legal porn industry.

Either you have articles on it or not. We don't want to see some story about how someone murdered a mayor after gorging on twink porn. Not some story about how a porn addiction ruined a relationship. Not a story about porn turned a guy deranged through unrealistic expectations. Not a story about child porn, which is already extremely illegal and we all assume comes from kidnapped or abused kids. Not a story about stolen pictures. Not a story about revenge porn.

Teenage sex trafficking. In the legal porn industry.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:47 pm UTC

Well, I search EVERY SINGLE SEARCH WORDS, from "teen abuses porn industry" to "teenage sex trafficking porn" or W/EVs and... the legal porn industry is highly secretive. So. Maybe I CAN'T prove, beyond the shadows of doubts, that teenage sex trafficking occurs in the legal porn industry but? They still have questionable schoolgirls' fetishes shoots, w/what LOOK LIKE, skinny, malnourished teen girls to me. So I still think it happens and I also think y'all are UNFAIRLY expecting me to prove, like I am in courts of laws, that it happens when... I got into the sex industry as a teen. I WAS an abused teen girl doing pornographic things for monies. SO whatevs since it wasn't legal on a sanctioned website I can't have my own opinions re: trafficking teen girls in the legal pornography industries? I'll look again using different searches criteria but... dunno if I'll turn up anything?

Human sex trafficking victim speaks: 'I was drugged and forced to do porn.' She an adult yet... it proves sex trafficking occurs re: porn.

More men abusing young women... a 12-year-old that time.
Last edited by Ginger on Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:57 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Thesh » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:57 pm UTC

For the record, there are record keeping laws in the United States to prevent underage actors and actresses:

https://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/2257

Just because they have pigtails and a schoolgirl outfit doesn't mean they are under 18.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Thu Jan 25, 2018 4:59 pm UTC

Um, sure, but that doesn't... stop them... from recruiting forcefully or through deceit and trickery? I JUST SAYING THAT: Just because You like pornography, and it gets you off, doesn't mean... it's totes legit always and forever? And no one ever checked my ages they just do what they wanna whether I like it or not. SO: Not everyone follows the laws, and y'all are STILL UNFAIRLY expecting me to cite UNCONTROVERSIAL and true claims. </3 for u pplz. :(
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Chen » Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:13 pm UTC

If the claims were uncontroversial and true, shouldn't citing them be extremely easy?

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Thu Jan 25, 2018 5:15 pm UTC

SIGHS. Okay... I am fighting the tempting to quit my Own thread forever and ever... 'cause you MEN are not listening. If it happens illegally, you can bet it happens legally, and I've "Cited" AT LEAST OVER FIVE ARTICLES re: ppls abusing women and girls to make pornographic materials. I HAVE CITED MY CLAIMS and y'all are being totally biased and unfair expecting me to cites that supposed, "legal websites or businesses do it too."
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby SecondTalon » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:01 pm UTC

In the last 20 years - basically the start of the professional Web Only porn companies now - I am aware of three US videos total, two US women total, who were underage in a pornographic video released on a US website. The women provided false identification thought they also state that no one really did much checking in to it either.

Two of those videos have been replaced by identically named videos as a way to essentially bury the original on pirate networks. You can't pirate something if you can't find something. I do not know the original name of the third video, one of the two women's only videos, so I do not know if it was buried in the same way.

There may also be an underage woman on a Girls Gone Wild video, but I may just be confusing that with an incident of a woman who did not consent to be on the video being on the video (and advertisements for the video)


Still, assuming the GGW is an underage situation, that's four instances in 20 years.

That's not really evidence of a massive effort to traffic in underage women for pornographic films.

Especially not when the real money's made in other ways.

As far as abuses in the regular legal porn industry... it happens? It's more common than anyone would like (which would be 0% of the time) but it's also less common than one would expect for an industry revolving around sex for money. There are some high profile cases (Deen), some sites that were founded on Doing Better that, surprise, aren't (Kink.com), and some industry known scumbuckets. It's also a bit more open within the industry of who is shit and who isn't than it is in other, non sexual industries.

I'll cite some articles later.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:47 pm UTC

Does GGW even still exist? It wasn't even internet, just stupid videos you had to order. As for consent, they were sued multiple times, and in each time they managed to prove consent, for whatever the consent of a drunk person is worth. Its shady as hell and GGW can go f itself, but legally speaking drunk is still consensual for contract purposes unless the person is falling down passed out drunk, because otherwise the courts would be backed up with people claiming that since the contract was signed over a martini it's Voidable.
Last edited by CorruptUser on Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:55 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Jan 25, 2018 8:50 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:As far as abuses in the regular legal porn industry... it happens?
There was an case recently wherein a female porn star tweeted something that was... I'd say borderline homophobic if not outright homophobic... and received such an intense backlash that she took her own life a few days later.

The industry does seem to not have the best self awareness for the various pressures it places on it's actors, especially given the frequency to which substance abuse seems to be mentioned side by side with any given issue.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:00 pm UTC

That seems to be more a failing of society than of the porn industry itself. Celebrities occupy thus weird place in society, you have people "counting the days" until some underage actress becomes legal, and really if you want to criticize porn then go after the sites that specifically advertise "celebrity" as a category. Talking about you, Pornhub and friends. I don't need to see Kate Uptons stolen videos, stop hosting them and for fucks sake stop advertising them. But, regardless, society tends to do horrible, horrible things to celebrity, many legal, and porn is somehow worse with fans thinking it's ok to be even creepier to a porn star than a movie star just because you already know what their genitals look like. That's the fault of people as a whole, not porn itself.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby SecondTalon » Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:21 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:As for consent, they were sued multiple times, and in each time they managed to prove consent...

Not each time
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 9:35 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:As for consent, they were sued multiple times, and in each time they managed to prove consent...

Not each time

According to Wikipedia, GGW won the first trial. It went to retrial but GGW was a no-show, so the court found in favor for the woman.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby jewish_scientist » Thu Jan 25, 2018 10:34 pm UTC

The only thing that I have read on this thread is when it was created. It was 2 days ago and we are on page 2. I do not even know how to react to this.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby jewish_scientist » Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:37 pm UTC

Ginger wrote:Okay... I am fighting the tempting to quit my Own thread forever and ever... 'cause you MEN are not listening.

I am SO happy you said this. I have held the opinion that sexism against men is a real problem. Admittedly, it happens less than sexism against women, but it is still a thing we have to address. The only problem was that I could never find any clear cut proof. Like, I know that a 14 year old who takes up knitting as a hobby will be horribly bullied, but I could not prove that this is true. At the very least, you've given me an example. Saying, "I've talked to a bigot against men online," is not exactly the best evidence for my case, but it is at least better than unprovable hypothetical.

Will you accept an axiom that I am proposing? Simply tell me if you accept it or not. A 'Yes' or 'No' is all that's needed.

A person's rate of porn consumption is correlated to that person rate of masturbation, because porn consumption causes masturbation.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Zohar » Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:41 pm UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:A person's rate of porn consumption is correlated to that person rate of masturbation, because porn consumption causes masturbation.

This makes zero sense. So I just stumble upon porn and that's the reason I masturbate furiously? I might be on my own here but I'm pretty certain usually one feels like masturbating and only then looks for porn.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Jan 25, 2018 11:42 pm UTC

I think he just reversed cause and effect. Though it's not a definite cause as you can masturbate without porn. Its more like "if Im going to masturbate, there's a 90% chance I'll look at porn" versus "if im going to masturbate then I'm going to look at porn".

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby ivnja » Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:18 am UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:
Ginger wrote:Okay... I am fighting the tempting to quit my Own thread forever and ever... 'cause you MEN are not listening.

I am SO happy you said this. I have held the opinion that sexism against men is a real problem. [...] At the very least, you've given me an example. Saying, "I've talked to a bigot against men online," is not exactly the best evidence for my case, but it is at least better than unprovable hypothetical.

Really? This is the example you're going to swoop in and jump on to try to make a point about sexism against men, and this is the thread you're going to do it in? You're calling out one of your fellow posters as "a bigot against men" because (rightly or wrongly) she's frustrated that her lived experiences as a female sex worker aren't being considered as significantly as she thinks they should in the discussion about women in porn and sex work? Whether or not her argument is good is totally beside the point - it's shitty of you to be "SO happy" to be able to waltz in and impugn somebody's character for your own benefit.

jewish_scientist wrote:Will you accept an axiom that I am proposing? Simply tell me if you accept it or not. A 'Yes' or 'No' is all that's needed.

A person's rate of porn consumption is correlated to that person rate of masturbation, because porn consumption causes masturbation.

This reminds me so much of Waterman trying to "prove" his point by pouncing on an unsuspecting victim during the Pressures/Relativity ridiculousness. Throw up an ill-formed axiom* that doesn't necessarily correspond to real life, convince one person to accept it, make some (usually) shaky calculations, and invariably the end result is a claim that something significant about real life has been said and that that person agrees with you, so there must be some truth to it.


*Keep your axioms single-barreled, for starters
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Grop » Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:23 pm UTC

Brains cause masturbation.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby SecondTalon » Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:39 pm UTC

Genitalia cause masturbation. Brains cause intellectual masturbation.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Thesh » Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:55 pm UTC

As far as I know, there's no evidence of humans masturbating prior to the written word.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Jan 26, 2018 3:57 pm UTC

Sex toys predate the written word, but no archeologist want to be known as that dude who keeps finding dildos.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby orthogon » Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:30 pm UTC

There's definitely prehistoric porn. According to Pinker at least, there are pornographic cave paintings.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Weeks » Fri Jan 26, 2018 4:37 pm UTC

Grop wrote:Brains cause masturbation.
This is your brain on brains.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Sat Jan 27, 2018 12:38 am UTC

jewish_scientist wrote:
Ginger wrote:Okay... I am fighting the tempting to quit my Own thread forever and ever... 'cause you MEN are not listening.

I am SO happy you said this. I have held the opinion that sexism against men is a real problem. [....]

Will you accept an axiom that I am proposing? Simply tell me if you accept it or not. A 'Yes' or 'No' is all that's needed.

A person's rate of porn consumption is correlated to that person rate of masturbation, because porn consumption causes masturbation.

Yes.

SecondTalon wrote:Still, assuming the GGW is an underage situation, that's four instances in 20 years.

I am SO So happiness that ST swooped in with real examples. Underage women DO get caught up in pornography yet: I admit I was wrong to howl at the moon so much about how I had concrete proof. For that I'd rather discuss... other things about re: pornography. Like, even if you're a legal porn star, you still get call a slut. Slut shaming for women with bigger boobs even if require by their jobs. Or people who bash on them for being too skinny. And in my opinion the figures they demand for porn aren't anything I or anyone I know could realistically so?
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:07 am UTC

Bigger boobs are required in Porn? I think that's a myth.

Riley Reid
Sasha Grey
Yhivi
Stoya
Piper Perri
Gina Valentina
Aria Alexandra

Just the ones I can think of. Boobs don't need to have enough mass that NASA needs to adjust the ISS's orbit to account for jigglage, just that they be there. There's a huge market for porn for guys that are sick of unrealistic fake boobs, and would prefer to see a natural B over unnatural DD, where we would like to see the cute girl next door rather than the mammoth mammaried peroxide blonde plastic monstrosity.

I'll go research some more, be back in 10 minutes...

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:23 am UTC

And what is "ethical pornography" forgive me? I... know having sex for money isn't bad. Yet organized porn gives men and women chances to keep secrets and the more monies they get and better computers and security... anyways. So: "Ethical pornography" to me would be like with only consenting models, where they get paid a fair amount and any extras they can keep. Medical and dental coverage. Sick days and vacations time... and even: Maternity leaves.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:31 am UTC

Ethical pornography is, aside from working conditions, where the content of porn isn't objectional beyond a puritanical argument. Depicting consensual sex is good. Depicting coercion, not so good.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:33 am UTC

ivnja wrote:Really? This is the example you're going to swoop in and jump on to try to make a point about sexism against men, and this is the thread you're going to do it in? You're calling out one of your fellow posters as "a bigot against men" because (rightly or wrongly) she's frustrated that her lived experiences as a female sex worker aren't being considered as significantly as she thinks they should in the discussion about women in porn and sex work? Whether or not her argument is good is totally beside the point - it's shitty of you to be "SO happy" to be able to waltz in and impugn somebody's character for your own benefit.

AND I JUST GOTTA JUMP ON THE BANDWAGON... I am not a sexist against men and ivnja pointed it out well. And I'm honestly not sure why saying male posters were doing it mostly was especially wrong? I do agree porn and masturbation can be linked though. Especially re: those women and men in extreme/compulsive touching of themselves mindsets. Why it make three posts in a row? WHY?

CorruptUser wrote:Ethical pornography is, aside from working conditions, where the content of porn isn't objectional beyond a puritanical argument. Depicting consensual sex is good. Depicting coercion, not so good.

What about women that like BDSM? Then their porn isn't ethical pornography anymore? C'mon C.U. You smarter than that! Puritans didn't even approve of pornographic acts and/or materials.
Last edited by Ginger on Sat Jan 27, 2018 1:36 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:33 pm UTC

Ginger wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:Ethical pornography is, aside from working conditions, where the content of porn isn't objectional beyond a puritanical argument. Depicting consensual sex is good. Depicting coercion, not so good.

What about women that like BDSM? Then their porn isn't ethical pornography anymore? C'mon C.U. You smarter than that! Puritans didn't even approve of pornographic acts and/or materials.


Lots of people have rape fantasies. They want to act them out in their own home? Eh, not going to stop them. Should they make porn of it? Probably not.

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Re: Porn, Ethical Porn, Use of Likenesses in Porn.

Postby Ginger » Sat Jan 27, 2018 2:37 pm UTC

Well, maybe you gotta point yet at the same time: Current pornography industries makes hella gross porn that turns me way, way off and I still think it should be made. Just with like consenting models only... so no REALLY REAL rape fantasies that's where I agree with you yet? Like some women like sex that comes close to abuse yet isn't actually abuse... unless... they partner hit them too hard or w/evs. ANYWAYS rambling aside: I would support legal, ethical, non-demeaning versions of every fetishes imaginable. Especially mind control, which some would say is not ethical, 'cause like, MINDS CAN'T BE TOLD WHAT TO DO they must always think for themselves free will y'all guys and gals! ANYWAYS that's my only thing bye thank you for reading. xoxo <3

SecondTalon wrote:That's not really evidence of a massive effort to traffic in underage women for pornographic films.

Especially not when the real money's made in other ways.

As far as abuses in the regular legal porn industry... it happens? It's more common than anyone would like (which would be 0% of the time) but it's also less common than one would expect for an industry revolving around sex for money. There are some high profile cases (Deen), some sites that were founded on Doing Better that, surprise, aren't (Kink.com), and some industry known scumbuckets. It's also a bit more open within the industry of who is shit and who isn't than it is in other, non sexual industries.

I'll cite some articles later.

Be careful ST they only like articles that say the specific words they wanna hear! And anyways even though I couldn't cite it, "in the legal industries," which, pornography shouldn't even be legal w/the more hardcore stuffs in my opinions... I STILL THINK they freely traffic underage girls. Because of... a person close to me... and a lot of young women being abused in pornographic ways. So I can't cite it? Whatever. Those actresses LOOK underage to me. And they abuse adult women too BY SENDING THEM TO THE HOSPITAL. Maybe not routinely? But once is enough... and honestly... I am kinda appalled no one here is willing to admit that their fav getting off to materials might be abusing women and girls? REALLY? Porn abuses women everyday: The way the male actors treat them, the horrible things they have to do.... And teen fetishes shoots are so common I REFUSE TO BELIEVE none of them are real teens. UNwilling real teens.

AND BY THE WAY: Y'all are the ones that made up the massive conspiracy/efforts part. I JUST SAID it happens I did NOT SAY it happens one hundred percent of the time so: NO massive efforts needed. They still traffic, drug, and alcohol-force feed abuse teens and adults WOMEN AND GIRLS AND THAT IS WRONG. It is just wrong and so is pornography, even legal pornography. It's sick, twisted rape. ALL of it.

UPDATE: I know... it was wrong of me to make claims in N and A sans any real proof... I just. Don't think it's controversial that pornography abuses and objectifies women and girls? And the legal pornography industries have the monies necessary to hide their abuses so we'd never see it as far as I'm concerned. But whatever. I'm getting too into the thread and no one cares about my opinions anyways? Not even the other sex workers... I wish that pro that WANNA Actually chat w/me were still here... sighs. :(
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