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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Neil_Boekend » Thu May 28, 2015 5:12 pm UTC

K-R wrote:
Yea I know I'm smart as fuck even though I had somone type this for me


People suck.

They might be right. Fucking isn't always smart.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby K-R » Thu May 28, 2015 7:33 pm UTC

effective.
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Send that to someone with an iPhone it turns their phone off


Is there any way to turn you off?

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Giant Speck » Mon Jun 01, 2015 9:57 am UTC

I'm glad I don't have shitty friends who would send that to me.

I'm also not updated to iOS 8.3 yet, so I don't even know if I was affected by that bug.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Quercus » Mon Jun 01, 2015 1:55 pm UTC

Does it bother anyone else that the modern expectation appears to be for people to be happy all the time?

And if that's not the expectation it's only because it's acknowledged as being unrealistic - not as being bloody terrifying, which is what I find it to be. Being happy all the time sounds like some sort of dystopian nightmare scenario to me. If I was continuously happy I'd be either delusional or manic. I don't want to be more happy, I want a normal emotional range.

My ideal emotional experience would look something like this: an overall affect dialled somewhere about neutral, ideally skewed slightly positive, but naturally oscillating with some phases in the negative half as well; an appreciation of beauty (e.g. in nature), love and friendship, leading to frequent periods of joy, but equally leading to sadness and grief depending on the situation. I want to feel frustrated, angry, sad or melancholy sometimes, ideally not too often, but if it's too rarely that's probably an indication that I'm avoiding engaging with the real world, because the real world contains a fair bit of that stuff. I want to be able to cope with that, to deal with it gracefully and well, but I still want to experience it.

I'm pretty sure that this isn't depressive thinking (I know what that feels like), because experiencing a broad range of situationally appropriate positive and negative emotions feels normal and healthy, whereas continuous happiness sounds exhausting and deeply weird to me.

I appreciate that not everyone is going to feel this way, and if being happy pretty much all the time appeals to you and you can manage it, more power to you, but it's not for me.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Whizbang » Mon Jun 01, 2015 1:57 pm UTC

Land of Happy, by Shel Silverstein.jpg

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Quercus » Mon Jun 01, 2015 2:03 pm UTC

Thanks, that made me laugh!

Edit: Incidentally I've always interpreted the chorus of R.E.Ms I'll take the rain as saying something along the lines of what I wrote above:

I used to think
As birds take wing
They sing through life so why can't we?
You cling to this
You claim the best
If this is what you're offering
I'll take the rain
I'll take the rain
I'll take the rain.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby doogly » Mon Jun 01, 2015 2:14 pm UTC

I find such dualism to be largely a trap.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Quercus » Mon Jun 01, 2015 2:22 pm UTC

doogly wrote:I find such dualism to be largely a trap.


Which dualism are you talking about here? (I'm not disagreeing, just curious)

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby doogly » Mon Jun 01, 2015 2:36 pm UTC

positive / negative experiences, happy / unhappy. "You must have darkness to appreciate light, you need lows to have highs," etc.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Quercus » Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:03 pm UTC

doogly wrote:positive / negative experiences, happy / unhappy. "You must have darkness to appreciate light, you need lows to have highs," etc.


I agree with you, but it's fairly tricky to talk about this sort of thing without using some degree of that dualism at least as a shorthand for communication. It's like Cartesian dualism - I'm a Monist, but I still talk about "the mind" as if it's a discrete entity because it's unwieldy to do otherwise. Heck, in a metaphorical context I might even talk about the soul!

I guess my position could be summed up like this: sometimes I'm (some combination of states which would usually be described as) unhappy. As long as it's only sometimes I'm fine with that and see no need to change it, but I feel there is significant societal pressure to do so and that bothers me.

I'm not really saying "you need lows to have highs", as I'm not at all sure that's true, and I don't know how you would test it even if it were. I'm just looking at my own experience and saying "I have lows, I have highs, and as long as both fall within certain parameters I'm fine with that".

Re-reading my post, it does come across as rather more proscriptive (one might even say preachy) than I intended, sorry.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby doogly » Mon Jun 01, 2015 3:26 pm UTC

Word.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Jun 01, 2015 4:34 pm UTC

I want the capacity to feel the full range of ups and downs as appropriate to the situation… and then I don't want any opportunity to feel down (except for like a sad story or something, but not in real life). It's like how I want to be able to feel (physical, non-emotional) pain, because pain is an important signal that something bad is happening, and the absence is pain should mean that everything is fine… but an inability to feel pain means you have no way of distinguishing whether everything's fine or not, because everything always feels fine whether or not it is.

I want to feel good, both physically and emotionally, all the time... but to know that that good feeling is warranted and justified and not just illusory, and that if things weren't OK, I would feel it.

I guess the occasional and slight feeling of not-OKness would then serve as a bit of a check that my feelings are still responsive to reality (and that the good feelings therefore indicate real goodness), and that that would lend some more credible interpretation to the sayings about not having highs without lows, light without darkness, etc. Occasional lows let you know that your usual high feelings are accurate and warranted because you can feel lows, you just don't usually need to.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:20 pm UTC

In practise, our mood tends toward a mean of sorts. (Is mean the word I want to use? It might not be.) A frequent example is winning the lottery. Assuming that no shittiness happens to you because of family or friends throwing tantrums for money, you're going to be happier than you were before... for about a year, then you'll revert to your usual amount of happiness.

Because happiness is a sign that something has changed for the better. Once it becomes the new normal, that happiness fades and goes back to whatever you typically had before.

I tend toward a "setpoint" of dejected and depressed, simply because I have suffered from serious depression for more years than not. If I'm on my meds and working toward health and security, and can measure my progress, I can achieve contentment for long periods. When I get a new wonderful thing or spend a wonderful time with others, I get happy for a while.

Then the happy goes away and I'm back to contentment, or maybe I start getting down on myself for accomplishing nothing for a few days and I feel shitty for a while again. What matters more than my mood at any one point is the knowledge that it's just a mood. It will change, and then that one will change, and so on. Clouds flitting across my sky. I continue, until the day I don't, regardless of what the clouds are doing.

ITT: poxic is getting old and cranky.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Jun 01, 2015 6:09 pm UTC

I've heard about that usual-amount-of-happiness thing, but I have doubts about it because from my own personal experience it seems like your usual amount of happiness can change over time.

When I was young I was really happy and excited and energetic and having lots of fun almost all the time so long as nothing bad was actively happening that I had to deal with right then. When something bad happened, I could get really upset about it, but as soon as it was passed I was fine and went back to feeling great again.

Over time in my early adulthood, bad and worse things kept happening more and more frequently and the quick returns to happiness after the bad stuff was "finally over" started to seem more and more unwarranted and I got more and more wary of relaxing and letting my guard down, and also more and more watchful of the kinds of things that had blind-sided me and causes all those disasters, and over time my default state became one of depressed hopelessness and anxiety because I was now aware that there were so many constantly-looming threats that I couldn't make go away so I could relax and be happy again. Even if day to day things weren't constantly bad, there was the constant threat of them going bad at any moment, and nothing I could do to safeguard against those threats and know that everything was going to be fine. Nothing immediate at least, nothing more than making constant tiny baby steps in the direction that I hope leads out of the woods, but meanwhile I'm still in the dark scary woods and something might jump out and devour me at any moment and there's nothing I can do about it.

So now my default state is one of unhappiness, and I feel good only when something manages to either distract me (but as bad things can happen when I'm distracted, I'm getting better and better and not getting distracted, and I get more and more anxious when I know that I'm being distracted and not being wary) or when something somehow provides temporary safety from the threats (but then if my guard's not back up by the time the safety is gone I can get hurt even worse when it's over, so even while temporarily safe I am fixated on when the safety is going to end and bracing myself to be back on guard as soon as it's over... also, safety can just up and vanish, or be illusory, so it's not really so reassuring in the first place anymore).

Over long periods of nothing bad happening, I do tend more and more toward happiness again. So maybe happy is still my baseline. But I feel like the only reason I was up there so frequently as a kid was because I was ignorant of all the threats that were looming, and that ignorance was a big part of why I got hit so hard by them. To use the "out of the woods" metaphor, when I was a kid I just skipped happy and carefree into the woods without having any idea of the wolves that lived in them, until I got mauled a few times... but between maulings, I was happy and carefree. Now I'm a scarred and grizzled angry old man jumping at every crack of a twig and attacking every shadow that moves, constantly miserable... but those goddamn wolves can't get sneak up on me anymore and I'll fucking murder them if they try, and I don't want to pretend that they're not there and skip carelessly through the woods again if it means letting them get me again. What I want is to burn the fucking woods down and slaughter every goddamn wolf in them and then I'll be happy back in the open sunlight again with clear views out to the horizon.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:09 pm UTC

That sounds to me less like unhappiness and more like trauma. My best advice would be the usual: find a therapist you can work with (can take a lot of looking), then [talk|feel] your way through the shit until you can get to the other side of it.

Sometimes it takes someone with a deep knowledge of human nature, and an assload of patience and kindness, to guide us around the twenty-ton boulders in our lives and help us feel human again.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Whizbang » Mon Jun 01, 2015 7:49 pm UTC

Just saw this and it made me think of the recent talk in this thread.

WTF does this even mean.jpg

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:07 pm UTC

Mr. Chopra has some good insight, but sometimes he's a wee bit of a tool.

Ever had that friend who, when you complained about insomnia/depression/a broken leg, replied "Well then, just do what I do! Just be happy/go to sleep/go for a walk! :D :D :D " And you wanted to take a titanium spork and violate several local and federal laws with it in order to express your discontentment with your friend's statement?

I think what I'm saying is that quote is nice but doesn't fix anything.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Whizbang » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:09 pm UTC

See the filename for a hint at my take on the quote.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:44 pm UTC

Whizbang wrote:WTF does this even mean.jpg

Heh. I do get what he means - it could be rephrased as "If the only thing wrong with your life is that you're not having enough happy-making events, then just rephrase what happiness means to you and you're good." Psychotherapy for people who are already pretty happy.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Mighty Jalapeno » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:48 pm UTC

The most amazing things that can happen to a human being will happen to you, if you just lower your expectations.

For me, mind-blowing happiness is pretty much any day where I can get the kitchen halfway clean, not ground my kids and maybe watch an entire uninterrupted episode of Hannibal. It doesn't (and physically cannot) get any better than that.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby doogly » Mon Jun 01, 2015 9:44 pm UTC

poxic wrote:Mr. Chopra has some good insight, but sometimes he's a wee bit of a tool.

He is the worst.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Jun 01, 2015 10:10 pm UTC

poxic wrote:That sounds to me less like unhappiness and more like trauma. My best advice would be the usual: find a therapist you can work with (can take a lot of looking), then [talk|feel] your way through the shit until you can get to the other side of it.

Not to besmirch the value of therapy, but this kind of ties back to the topic that started this subthread: alleviating pain isn't something I want when there is actually something injurious causing the pain, unless that relief is coming from someone's who's actually fixing the injurious condition as well. I'll let a doctor give me an anesthetic while he's operating on me, sure as hell, but I don't just want to take just a painkiller every day and live with the problem. I want to get it fixed, and until it's fixed I want to feel when it hurts so I know when I'm doing something that's making it worse, or when it's getting better.

You're right that there is trauma here, but the time to get therapy for trauma is not while the traumatic events are still happening. I've had seeing a therapist on my to-do list for years; as soon as the crap that I'm rightly stressing out about is over, if I'm still stressing out when there's nothing to stress out about, then I'll go get that fixed because that's a separate problem. But I don't want to sit down and have a nice calming disarming chat that helps me drop my guard when I'm still in the middle of the woods and there are still hungry wolves to keep watch for.

The idea of doing that seems uncomfortably similar to people who believe things because it would be nice if they were true. It's intellectually dishonest and it's only going to make you less capable of handling the actual problems that you're denying because you'd rather pretend they didn't exist, and then things will only get worse.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jun 01, 2015 10:17 pm UTC

doogly wrote:
poxic wrote:Mr. Chopra has some good insight, but sometimes he's a wee bit of a tool.

He is the worst.

I don't know if he is the worst... but he is probably in the top 50 "Terrible, Awful, Horrible people" list.

Which is a very difficult list to get on, and involves people like Tom "Babyeater" Puppystomper or worse, Pat Robertson.


Yes, I'm literally saying that if Pat Robertson changed his behavior completely and limited his terribleness to devouring human children and stomping live puppies to death, he would improve his value as a human being.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 10:37 pm UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:But I don't want to sit down and have a nice calming disarming chat that helps me drop my guard when I'm still in the middle of the woods and there are still hungry wolves to keep watch for.

That wasn't my experience of therapy, though it might depend on the therapist. What I found was empathy for what I was going through and better ways of coping. It was less about letting my guard down than learning what defensive strategies actually worked.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:20 pm UTC

I don't know how helpful that would be then because every time I've talked to a therapist they've remarked on how surprisingly functional I am and how well I'm managing my life given the kind of inner turmoil I've got going on. I'm terribly unhappy but it doesn't stop me from getting shit done; it's the having-to-get-so-much-shit-done that's making me unhappy.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Mon Jun 01, 2015 11:48 pm UTC

Is there a time limit of sorts on the large amounts of shit? Or is it something you'll always be stuck with?
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby ivnja » Tue Jun 02, 2015 1:50 am UTC

Rant: License plates. I don't understand the US obsession with turning them into shiny works of art. They serve one purpose, to display the identification number for the vehicle. I should be able to clearly read the number and easily identify the issuing body (the state government, in my case). Why the hell does each state need fifteen different holographic glossy plate variations, most of which look nothing like the rest? The Florida DMV site lists a hundred fricking twenty two specialty plates. You want to support your particular pet cause? Get a bumper sticker. I shouldn't have to be standing right next to your car to figure out where your plate is from.
Even worse is when people not only have the stupid plates, but also have those license plate holders with the big tab that hangs down in the middle and covers over the state name, so now I not only can't identify it from the road, I can't even see it when the vehicle is stopped. Or they put those damned tinted bubbles over the plates, to largely the same effect.

I grew up with Connecticut's simple white on blue plates. I miss these things.
Image

I also don't like states that don't require front plates. Or those that do but don't enforce the laws (Maine north of Bangor, for example)
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby PAstrychef » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:25 am UTC

Unless you're issuing traffic tickets, why do you need to see the plates that clearly?
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby ivnja » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:36 am UTC

It's partly that I try to check off all 51 plates (i.e. one from each state plus D.C.) every summer, but partly just the principle of blinged-up ID tags that I find obnoxious.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:55 am UTC

poxic wrote:Is there a time limit of sorts on the large amounts of shit? Or is it something you'll always be stuck with?

Each particular piece of shit seems to have an end in sight but they keep piling up and by the time one thing is done, there's at best a very brief rest before more shit that needs dealing with crops up. Most of my life it's been predominantly some mix of housing, transportation, and employment, each either in jeopardy of going away leaving me in some terrible situation or else itself a terrible situation that I can't escape without defaulting to the terribleness that would come without it. (A handful of health and love-life stressors in there too). It's been going on like that since at least 2008, and had been going on like that even worse for around 2000-2004 as well, with a brief mostly-respite from 2004-2008 (which I call the "island of relative stability" in my life history), and it finally seemed like I was getting everything in my own life straightened out at the end of last year, like there was finally hope, and after a few more things to solidify my living situation, the next things on my to-do list starting this year were going to be physical and mental therapy to try to recover from the hell that most of my adult life has been. But right as there was that light at the end of the tunnel, my mom drove her entire life off a cliff and I'm still trying to pull her back over the edge or at the very least disentangle myself from her so she doesn't pull me over with her, and that has been more stressful and traumatic than dealing with my own problems because she has all of the problems I had plus others and I can't directly fix them, I have to get her to fix them, and she's grossly incompetent, so her as the interface between me and the problems is not very effective.

And because she's my mom, it's seeming like this is one of those problems that's always been there that I just didn't have to face before, and now that I know it's there, I can't rest until it's dealt with. And because she's my mom, I can't solve the problem by just replacing that aspect of my life with a more functional one; my transportation problems settled down when I got a reliable car, my employment problems settled down when I got a steady job with growth prospects, my housing problems settled down for the most part when I moved out renting a bedroom in a house full of strangers and bought my own mobile home, and with all of those things there was a goal to work toward, as hard as it was, a direction that would lead out of the woods and settle that aspect of my life for good, or well enough that it could stop being a problem I had to deal with. There's nothing I can work toward to acquire a more sane and competent mother, though. At best I can get free of her and then try my best to give up on her and stop caring, but even in that best case scenario I've still lost my mom. That's something I would go see a therapist to help with if it comes to it. But right now the problem is not coping with the loss or estrangement of my mom, it's keeping her from destroying her life while I'm still inexorably caught up in it, keeping her shit together long enough for me to get out of it in one piece.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby poxic » Tue Jun 02, 2015 3:43 am UTC

That's a place where I'd hope someone could help out. You've probably already looked into the assistance options - she isn't old enough to be committed to a home, or not incompetent enough?

Shittiness indeed. If she's been like this all the way along, she sure as hell isn't going to change at this point. Sounds like getting free of her is the more realistic goal.

And good on you for getting out of a series of piles of shit like that. Determination is a gift and you're using it well. I wish you more shit-free days than you've been having.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Giant Speck » Tue Jun 02, 2015 5:38 pm UTC

ivnja wrote:I grew up with Connecticut's simple white on blue plates. I miss these things.
Image


Iowa's plates used to be the same color! :)
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Whizbang » Tue Jun 02, 2015 5:46 pm UTC

Each state probably wants different colors/design to better be able to identify out-of-staters. So there is that. Also I think there is an element of preventing counterfitting, but I am not sure.

Re: stupid plate holders and shit covering the plate
States have laws that forbid covering certain parts of the plate. The number and expiration date must be clearly visible. You can get a ticket for obscuring the plate or not having it lit or whatnot. The state name, apparently, is not as important.


You probably knew most of that, however.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:29 pm UTC

Your plates expire?
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby doogly » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:34 pm UTC

Of course, there are renewal fees to collect! Is your country just leaving money on the table?
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Whizbang » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:35 pm UTC

The registration expires. You can keep the plates.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Jun 02, 2015 7:40 pm UTC

No, we just pay road tax without attaching stuff to our cars. There used to be a small paper disk to be put in the windscreen, but that's been phased out.

There's a database of plate registrations checking whether a vehicle is taxed or not.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby SurgicalSteel » Tue Jun 02, 2015 10:27 pm UTC

I suspect the reason registration stickers are still a thing in much of the US is three-fold:
1) Easy way for the car owner to check when they need to renew
2) "It's how it's always been done"
3) Having expired tags gives police the reasonable suspicion needed to conduct a terry stop.
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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby Adacore » Wed Jun 03, 2015 2:15 am UTC

SurgicalSteel wrote:3) Having expired tags gives police the reasonable suspicion needed to conduct a terry stop.

This is still possible in the UK - it's just that a computer lookup instead of visual inspection will provide the reasonable suspicion. In the UK, I believe most police traffic cars are fitted with cameras and a computer system which automatically performs a registration and insurance check on every license plate they see.

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Re: Rant Thread : For all your obscenity screaming needs

Postby ivnja » Wed Jun 03, 2015 3:00 am UTC

Whizbang wrote:Each state probably wants different colors/design to better be able to identify out-of-staters. So there is that. Also I think there is an element of preventing counterfitting, but I am not sure.
I hadn't considered the counterfeiting aspect. Despite the nostalgia for some of the simple two-tone plates, I'm really all for each state having a nice attractive, distinctive plate, and I do really enjoy most of the different designs. Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, New Mexico, Oregon, Utah, and Wyoming all have great default plates.
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