Window Management

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Window Management

Postby xkcd » Sun May 27, 2007 5:47 pm UTC

This is sort of forked from the Post Your Desktop thread.

Image

I finally moved to Linux a few years ago when I discovered Ion. I noticed I was spending more and more time in XP getting all my windows lined up/constantly visible, and eventually started using awful secondhand visual basic scripts to keep my windows aligned and non-overlapping. Then I found Ion, which completely does away with the 'overlapping windows' metaphor, and turned out to be exactly what I wanted.

Some people use overlapping windows as a hack to keep an eye on part of one window, leaving it sticking out above another. But overall I think that sort of thing is a sign of a messy paradigm. I don't know if Ion3 is the right answer (it has some flaws, like the terrible default keybindings) but I'm definitely in love with it.

Anyone else have Window Management Philosophies?

Edit: Note on the layout: I use Bitlbee for all my messaging. Permanent screen sessions, which let you keep your AIM/IRC client up 24/7 and just connect to see it from anywhere, are the best thing to happen to instant messaging since wifi let you chat while on the toilet without anyone knowing. But since it doesn't lend itself to easy buddy lists, I keep a second account logged in on Gaim so I can still see a buddy list. In the layers behind the existing windows are remote shells on various other systems. Fullscreen apps are mostly tabbed in the right pane. The bottom left pane holds local shells, text editors, and other little programs.

Extra Credit: Develop a full power window manager/desktop environment that combines ideas and eye candy from OS X and pane-based structure like Ion. Add the source code at the end of your reply, or write it on a series of postcards and mail them to Belial.

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Postby Thunderbird4! » Sun May 27, 2007 6:46 pm UTC

My window management philosophy is to never have more than 2 windows for web-pages and one open for IMs. Yay neat-freaking.
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Postby Gordon » Sun May 27, 2007 6:49 pm UTC

I also used to spend a lot of time moving windows around trying to get a piece of each irc/gaim convos/vlc/steam or whatever was open visible.

Then I realised that all the chat windows flash when ever something important happens pertaining to me (I decided that if anyone on IRC had something important to say to me they usually pm'd me).

VLC has an "always on top" feature so just throw that in the corner when I'm watching a movie, when it's just music winamp (which is set to stretch the full width of the screen and is only half the height of a typical title bar) is at the bottom and set to 30% visibility as to not be in the way, also with 'always on top' set so I can always just click the very bottom of the screen and use the keyboard short cuts (of course this was easier when I had my logitech keyboard with the media buttons built right in).

As for steam, I haven't played anything other than Civ in a long time, which isn't a game that you can't alt-tab away from at any second you wish. Mostly it's just FireFox that's open and being used all the time.


The only time I really need multiple windows open and staggered now adays is when I decide I'm going to fool around with webdesign somemore and I have a bunch of notepad files open, but even then it's not crucial to be able to see more than two at a time ever.
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Postby xkcd » Sun May 27, 2007 6:54 pm UTC

Thunderbird4! wrote:My window management philosophy is to never have more than 2 windows for web-pages and one open for IMs. Yay neat-freaking.

Me too -- using tabs. The problem was that I wanted them both to be visible at once, so I'd always be lining edges up. And then when I ran a music player or some other little thing it would mess up my arrangement ...

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Postby crazyjimbo » Sun May 27, 2007 6:58 pm UTC

I'm pretty pedantic about my windows. I have everything sized nicely so that things fit together perfectly on my screen. My solution to having lots of windows open is 2 monitors and loads of desktop space. I don't think I could go back to multitasking without them.

I'll normally have firefox open on one monitor, maximised, and the other monitor for whatever I'm working on. Generally whatever I'm working on (programming/uni work) requires the internet frequently anyway.

I find virtual desktops very useful, if underused by me. I can have my email client on one, my work on another and my fun (web forums/comics and IM's) on another.

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Postby Dark Ragnarok » Sun May 27, 2007 7:22 pm UTC

I always have it so that winamp is on bottom. AIM on the right size. and al the rest of the space is for any other app. Half the time my start bar is on top though, not on bottom. Right now i hide all my desktop icons for ZMatrix to run in the background, and use the start menu to get all my apps or the quicklaunch toolbar.

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Postby d3adf001 » Sun May 27, 2007 7:35 pm UTC

i have gaim on the bottom left 1/4 of my screen xchat (ok grill me) on the top 1/2 and firefox on the right 2/3 theres over lap from xchat and ff but sloppy focus fixes that

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Postby Sandry » Sun May 27, 2007 8:05 pm UTC

Having maximised windows gives me the shakes. (We have this application at work which always opens maximised by default and it has caused me to go on these crazy rants in our kitchen... "it's just VB! We could fix this so easily! I don't *care* if we need to be compatible with other regions! They should change it, too! What kind of cracked-out, retarded monkey designed this interface anyhow?!" Another coworker of mine is trying to use the existence of this program to get a second monitor out of our IT department. Last I heard, I think it may have worked.)

I still do the very careful layout type effect: If IRC is open, it's top left sticking out so I can see nicks moving. If Adium is open, it's bottom left so I can see icon changes on the buddy list. Firefox is always open, and that's sort of middle-ish. If I'm "playing" Kingdom of Loathing (where by "playing" I mean "chatting in its native chat interface and occasionally reading kmail"), I'll have that open in a separate FF window bottom right so that I can see chat scrolling. iTunes is generally open, and that's top right because honestly it's not critical that I see any particular part of it, and I'm more likely to command tab to it than anything else.

The thing about flashing screens when you get new messages, etc? Um. I don't care about *all* my new messages. I need to know the source, as well, and with IRC, that's going to require some minimal visibility. With chat programs that stick everything in tabs (which I cannot live without), it can also be harder to work out without visibility.

Anything else that ends up open simultaneously (which happens a lot, actually... random text windows, quicktime, audio recorder... they all sort of get opened, then stay there) tends to end up accessed only via command tab and is sifted back to the background when I'm finished with it, or minimised to the dock.

Only problem? Windows at work. Which, since it's a laptop I have to take home, means half the time I'm completely out of my native paradigm and making it up as I go along. *sigh* Only thing I have worked out for work is that telnet connections go all along the bottom and Gaim goes on the right.

*looks at the above* Oh my god, I am so anal. But hey, from reading everyone's comments about walking on tile floors, at least I'm not the only one. *wipes brow*
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Postby Vandole » Sun May 27, 2007 9:13 pm UTC

I maximize everything except MSN. I can't tolerate not having stuff maximized (plus if it isn't I'll try to exit it and click on the screen behind it, which is irritating).

Really, to me, there's hardly any reason to have two windows up at once. One can only focus on one window at a time, why not just alt+tab if you need to see the other one?
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Postby Sandry » Sun May 27, 2007 9:53 pm UTC

I completely disagree - I can focus on about seven things at once, really.

I did customer service for about three years - that's equivalent to being *trained* in multitasking.
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Postby Jacque » Sun May 27, 2007 10:33 pm UTC

I usually have it so on my main screen I've got my browser taking up 80% of my screen, width wise, height wise just leaving a small gap between it and the dock. In that remaining 20% I have a TextMate window sticking out so I can easily switch between it and Safari for development testing.

The rest of my applications, iTunes, Mail, Fugu, Photoshop, iCal, and Stickies are divided up on a few virtual screens by way of VirtueDesktops (until Spaces comes along with the release of Leopard that is).

I find that my desktop is pretty harmonious as far as how windows are arranged; I've got both the yin and yang of desktop management going on.

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Postby warriorness » Sun May 27, 2007 10:50 pm UTC

I've always been a fan of using workspaces. I've got four; the first is for Firefox, the second is for Gaim, the third is for IRC and possibly a few terminal windows, and the fourth is for pretty much everything else (terminals, gimp, games, etc). Like so:

Image

I almost never have more than three windows on any given workspace (although there were seven or eight when I was gimping those screenshots together). Note, that panel at the bottom is auto-hide, so when I maximize windows they take up the entire screen. It's wonderful.
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Postby EvanED » Sun May 27, 2007 11:46 pm UTC

Ahahahahaha... you bunch of neat freaks. ;-)

I have, let's see, 15 windows open currently, and that's not all *that* much. A week or two ago I discovered that if you have more than 21 windows open and you alt-tab, Windows won't show them all in the little window that pops up but will instead shift icons in and out. (In, surprise surprise, a very confusing and hard-to-follow way.)

7 belong to Firefox (though two are popups and one the downloads window, so now I only have 4 FF windows open and 12 total), thunderbird, 2 for gaim, console, steam, two explorer windows, calculator, and WMP.

When I'm in Linux, Thunderbird typically goes on its own desktop, Gaim buddy list gets sticky'd, if I'm working with The Gimp it gets its own desktop (to the point of clearing off one for it) because, barring changing window managers, that's the only way I've found to cope with the window overload (though it got a lot better now that you can group controls into a single window), and what goes on the other desktops is what-I'm-doing dependent. If I'm doing work or something, I'll try to keep a desktop for Firefox windows not related to work separate from my work. ;-)

I would die without non-overlapping windows, probably even with virtual desktops. ;-)

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Postby fjafjan » Mon May 28, 2007 12:13 am UTC

huh?
I always use maximized windows, and then use alt + tab alot
Any way to create two layers of tabs? I could use that, i keep having to close tabs that I am only semi done with in order to not have to browse to see them all.
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Postby Thunderbird4! » Mon May 28, 2007 3:07 am UTC

xkcd wrote:
Thunderbird4! wrote:My window management philosophy is to never have more than 2 windows for web-pages and one open for IMs. Yay neat-freaking.

Me too -- using tabs. The problem was that I wanted them both to be visible at once, so I'd always be lining edges up. And then when I ran a music player or some other little thing it would mess up my arrangement ...

Ahh but I don't use tabs. I have one window (usually a webpage or winamp) for music and another for intraweb browsing. When I want two things visible (which is extremely rare) I open up notepad which takes up about an eigth of my screen and copy/paste things off one page and then reference the then smaller window of information.
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Postby SpitValve » Mon May 28, 2007 3:33 am UTC

I've got a Mac so I use fancy smanchy Expose :) I have it set up as a hot spot in a corner, so I just flick the mouse into a corner and all the windows shrink so I can see them. I then click on the one I want to go to. Useful because I have like a bazillion windows open much of the time.

Normal view (2 monitors)
Image
Image

Expose activate!
Image
Image

Note that I did not add extra windows for effect: this is exactly the number of windows I had open at the time I read this post.

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Postby djn » Mon May 28, 2007 12:00 pm UTC

In FreeBSD I'm a KDE (and thus kwin) user. Kwin is by default set up to aggresively snap windows to other windows and edges, and makes lining windows up easy when I want it. However, I usually have whatever I'm doing maximised, and rely on notifications to, well, notice anything else that's happening. Xchat reacts to people using my name, kopete to people talking to me, and I can even have konsole blink when there hasn't been any activity in a tab for some seconds (if I'm waiting for a compile or something).

I have been known to tag kopete windows as "always on top" when talking to people while doing something. With somewhat careful positioning it's usually not a problem.


Of course, the best tip ever: Use two computers and two monitors. It might be overkill, but it solves the "fullscreen applications/games taking over"-problem beautifully.

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Postby Random » Mon May 28, 2007 12:18 pm UTC

Two monitors (or more!) is the way to go.
I usually have Konqueror (web browser) maximised on one screen, with Kontact (email, RSS) maximised on the second workspace, and then if I'm running something else -- GIMP, Inkscape, Kate (text editor, for programming etc) I'll have it maximised on the third workspace.
Then, I have Konversation (IRC) and Kopete (IM) at normal sizes on screen two, Amarok (media player) in mini-player form at the top corner.

Beryl gives me the same expose-style window sorting as Macs have, which is awesome.

Also, for anyone else using KDE, look into getting YaKuake. It's a Konsole that drops down from the top of your screen when you hit F12, and goes back up when you press F12 again. You can have as many tabs as you want on it, and you can set the size, how far down it should go, transparency, etc. It's incredibly useful for anything you need a console for, I don't think I've loaded the actual Konsole once since installing it.

Finally, since everyone loves screenshots:
http://randomskk.net/s/?260
http://randomskk.net/s/?261
http://randomskk.net/s/?262
http://randomskk.net/s/?263

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Postby EvanED » Mon May 28, 2007 12:40 pm UTC

Random wrote:Also, for anyone else using KDE, look into getting YaKuake. It's a Konsole that drops down from the top of your screen when you hit F12, and goes back up when you press F12 again. You can have as many tabs as you want on it, and you can set the size, how far down it should go, transparency, etc. It's incredibly useful for anything you need a console for, I don't think I've loaded the actual Konsole once since installing it.


I second this. I doubt it even needs KDE though. You could probably use it with Gnome, *box, whatever as long as you have the KDElibs installed.

Great application.

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Postby xyzzy » Mon May 28, 2007 1:10 pm UTC

wmii-3 here. It's a lightweight dynamic window manager, fully customizable through one file, with both tiled and floating layers. Does away with workspaces in favour of `tags', which are superior from what I've found, especially when you grok that they aren't simply an inferior workspace replacement, but are far more powerful and flexible.

I'm considering trying to get dwm built sometime, but I haven't got around to it yet.

Screenshots will be provided at a later date, when I get back to my home machine.
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Postby saxmaniac1987 » Mon May 28, 2007 5:37 pm UTC

my window management comes in the form of a 17" 1680x1050 screen on my laptop... I run my buddy list all the way on the right, and next to that i have room for IM windows, and then firefox/word/whatever other application i use takes up the other 2/3 of the screen width. most of the time i have windows media player minimized in toolbar mode on the taskbar. i also like to have media center on my other monitor/tv, but i don't like the way it steals focus, so if i'm switching stuff back and forth a lot i don't bother with it.
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Postby tendays » Mon May 28, 2007 6:23 pm UTC

I used to run ion (ion2) as well, but:

1) There was (at the time, at least) no way to have a window visible on all workspaces (could be good for gkrellm, for instance)

2) Having to write the "kludge" file for every single application I use was getting painful over time.

3) You have to start that. all. over. again. when you upgrade because mr. Valkonen apparently doesn't believe in backward compatibility.

So now I'm using kwin (i.e., kde). I miss some features of ion, for instance:
alt-s f2 to quickly halve the current window and open a terminal in the other one, and alt-c alt-c to close it and have the previous window restore its original size.
Gimp is *hell* to use without ion. E.g. I want to crop a particular part of an image, and as soon as I start delimiting the area to crop, the "crop-window" jumps out of nowhere, covering the image window. How clever. With my carefully crafted kludge file, the crop window was going in a region meant for it, not covering the image window. There are many other examples

I have set up several shortcuts that make it not too painful to use kde. In particular, application shortcuts. windows-E goes to my emacs window, window-D to my kdvi window, window-T selects the terminal, etc. I set up the global alt-enter key to enter/leave fullscreen mode for any application. I've set up shortcuts for passing a window to the background and back to foreground, shortcuts for un/maximising windows horizontally or vertically, etc. I've also set up "preferred sizes" for the windows I commonly use (typically, when editing a document, emacs is set up to automatically open in the left half of the screen, and kdvi opens on the right half of the screen, etc.

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Postby Andrew » Mon May 28, 2007 9:02 pm UTC

I just let windows open anyplace they want (except spanning across both monitors, because that's stupid).

The left monitor is landscape and the right is portrait, so Acrobat Reader and Word live on the right screen, and any imaging stuff lives on the right. The GIMP has all the tools on the right and the images on the left so I can maximise them.

But yeah, apart from a few little rules like that, I just let windows pile up. I downloaded a program to put drop shadows on the windows, and I find it helps the edges stick out better, and makes it easier to focus on just one non-maximised window.

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Postby warriorness » Tue May 29, 2007 2:10 am UTC

Random wrote:Amarok (media player) in mini-player form at the top corner.


Why not just use its systray icon? One of my favorite features of Amarok is how you can control it easily - Win+Z|X|C|V|B for player controls, mousewheel over the systray icon to change volume. I even have Katapult installed (a launcher-type app - look into it) so I can start a song playing without even touching Amarok.

Beryl gives me the same expose-style window sorting as Macs have, which is awesome.

Also, for anyone else using KDE, look into getting YaKuake. It's a Konsole that drops down from the top of your screen when you hit F12, and goes back up when you press F12 again. You can have as many tabs as you want on it, and you can set the size, how far down it should go, transparency, etc. It's incredibly useful for anything you need a console for, I don't think I've loaded the actual Konsole once since installing it.


How is Yakuake when used with Beryl? Last time I tried it, it was rather sketchy...

I'm not a big fan of yakuake's interface. The included themes are ugly (if you can point me in the direction of better custom themes it would be much appreciated), the fact that it leaves an unsightly 1-pixel border right on the edge of the screen is nasty, and also I don't like its fullscreen behavior (leaving the border - konsole takes up the full screen, like this, so I have more room for the very important stuff that I do which you can see in that screenshot).
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Re: Window Management

Postby niteice » Tue May 29, 2007 4:30 am UTC

xkcd wrote:I use Bitlbee for all my messaging. Permanent screen sessions, which let you keep your AIM/IRC client up 24/7 and just connect to see it from anywhere, are the best thing to happen to instant messaging since wifi let you chat while on the toilet without anyone knowing. But since it doesn't lend itself to easy buddy lists, I keep a second account logged in on Gaim so I can still see a buddy list.

Have you considered naim?

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Re: Window Management

Postby RealGrouchy » Tue May 29, 2007 4:35 am UTC

xkcd wrote:I noticed I was spending more and more time in XP getting all my windows lined up/constantly visible...

I take it right-clicking the taskbar and selecting "tile windows horizontally/vertically" didn't do the trick?

On Windows XP, I usually only have one thing open, or if I'm sorting pictures, two side-by-side explorer windows (since Windows refuses to open folders in the same window--and yes, it is set to do so).

At work, on the iMac, I can't have things fullscreen (except when I'm using the virtual PC), but that more or less works out, because I leave enough room at the bottom-left or bottom-right to leave a firefox window in the background playing TDS, TCR, or something on Youtube. Anything else is haphzardly (dis)organized and cluttered with random stuff (like all of my physical desktops at work or at home. Or any horizontal surface in my apartment, actually.)

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Re: Window Management

Postby shadebug » Tue May 29, 2007 7:20 am UTC

niteice wrote:
xkcd wrote:I use Bitlbee for all my messaging. Permanent screen sessions, which let you keep your AIM/IRC client up 24/7 and just connect to see it from anywhere, are the best thing to happen to instant messaging since wifi let you chat while on the toilet without anyone knowing. But since it doesn't lend itself to easy buddy lists, I keep a second account logged in on Gaim so I can still see a buddy list.

Have you considered naim?


Why would anybody consider naim when they have bitlbee? That'd be like going downtown for mcdonalds when you have a steakhouse with a mincer in your garden.

Anyway, lately I've been using evilwm. I actually prefer ratpoison but when using gimp or anything else that's modular (ardour used to be, though no longer) it can become quite a chore. Of course, ideally I'd be able to open them both and switch through them as i would threough desktops. I mean, if you're going to set up desktop switching to emulate tty switching, it only makes sense

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Postby djn » Tue May 29, 2007 7:56 am UTC

tendays wrote:Gimp is *hell* to use without ion. E.g. I want to crop a particular part of an image, and as soon as I start delimiting the area to crop, the "crop-window" jumps out of nowhere, covering the image window. How clever. With my carefully crafted kludge file, the crop window was going in a region meant for it, not covering the image window. There are many other examples


From a window managment viewpoint, this is irrelevant, but: Try Krita. It keeps getting better, and it's a reasonable SDI solution unlike the mad windows-everywhere Gimp.

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Postby Jach » Tue May 29, 2007 7:57 am UTC

I've found myself really liking Linux virtual desktops/workspaces. I sometimes overlap windows when I need to do the 'hack', but that's not so common these days. Also, I'm a tab freak. If it doesn't have tabs, I usually don't like it. Hence when I moved from IE to Firefox I loved the tabs, and when I use EditPad I love the tabs, and when I use Gaim (after moving to Linux) I love the tabs (though I have to alias people because their names take up too much room). But I do wish I had a good enough graphics card to have Beryl to add a little more excitement...
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Re: Window Management

Postby EvanED » Tue May 29, 2007 8:15 am UTC

RealGrouchy wrote:On Windows XP, I usually only have one thing open, or if I'm sorting pictures, two side-by-side explorer windows (since Windows refuses to open folders in the same window--and yes, it is set to do so).


Weird, has it always (not) done that for you?

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Postby Random » Tue May 29, 2007 1:25 pm UTC

warriorness wrote:Why not just use its systray icon? One of my favorite features of Amarok is how you can control it easily - Win+Z|X|C|V|B for player controls, mousewheel over the systray icon to change volume. I even have Katapult installed (a launcher-type app - look into it) so I can start a song playing without even touching Amarok.

True, but it doesn't take much space and I like having quick buttons to pause/play etc. I do have katapult installed, it's awesome, and I'll usually use it to change song, but I still like having the player window open.
How is Yakuake when used with Beryl? Last time I tried it, it was rather sketchy...

I'm not a big fan of yakuake's interface. The included themes are ugly (if you can point me in the direction of better custom themes it would be much appreciated), the fact that it leaves an unsightly 1-pixel border right on the edge of the screen is nasty, and also I don't like its fullscreen behavior (leaving the border - konsole takes up the full screen, like this, so I have more room for the very important stuff that I do which you can see in that screenshot).

It works moderately well with Beryl, although I didn't actually have beryl active in the screenshot. I don't much mind the theme it has by default, and I'm yet to use it in full screen mode, I just leave it on 50% of the height, 100% of the width.

djn wrote:From a window managment viewpoint, this is irrelevant, but: Try Krita. It keeps getting better, and it's a reasonable SDI solution unlike the mad windows-everywhere Gimp.

Krita's awesome, but even so I generally find myself using GIMP because it currently has more functionality, same reason I use Inkscape over Karbon14 (Inkscape is really nice, if you've not used it before, by the way).

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ccx
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Enlightenment

Postby ccx » Tue May 29, 2007 4:50 pm UTC

Image
enightenment 0.16.CVS, lightly modified R9x theme
kopete is shaded on the right
kdesktop running in borderless window on the left
2x conky in the middle, tcp connections and ftp log generated by my own scripts ( part of ftp one can be seen in the window )

I especially love the feature to maximize to unused space (conservative maximization)

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Tawnos
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Postby Tawnos » Tue May 29, 2007 7:02 pm UTC

And hopefully this picture isn't ludicrously large... Click for fullsize
http://www.oclasses.com/tawnos/images/desktop.png

Don't break the screen!!!! :evil:
Don't break the link!!!! :twisted:


Screencap of my desktop right now... I obviously like the window snapping, overlapping, virtual desktops, et cetera. Because of the widescreen monitors, most windows go in two sizes... "fullsize" and "barsize", where I keep the fullsize towards the center of my view (snapped to the "middle" edge) and then use the ancillary windows as stuff further from the center. Obviously, I was just messing with my playlist (windows key + p :-D) hence it being on the main area of the right screen. In reality, I'm procrastinating on writing two papers (the two OO documents) and doing some programming (desktop 4).

So yeah, overlap is good, it gives me enough a view of the chat room that I can see if there's anything worth reading (such as shadebug's comments on testicles?) while being able to focus on my main task at hand. Window snapping is extremely important to me. I tend to play movies on all windows, always on top (hence the extra buttons at the top right of every window).

Anyway, enough procrastinating, one hour left.
Last edited by Tawnos on Wed May 30, 2007 1:36 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
If determinism is right, does it matter that I believe in free will?

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shadebug
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Re: Window Management

Postby shadebug » Tue May 29, 2007 9:40 pm UTC

shadebug wrote:Anyway, lately I've been using evilwm. I actually prefer ratpoison but when using gimp or anything else that's modular (ardour used to be, though no longer) it can become quite a chore. Of course, ideally I'd be able to open them both and switch through them as i would threough desktops. I mean, if you're going to set up desktop switching to emulate tty switching, it only makes sense


now that tawnos has murdered our screen real estate, i'll illustrate.

Say I'm doing my standard day to day stuff, downloading, uploading, web browsing, sshing into vi and so on, tiled desktops are fantastic

http://users.aber.ac.uk/ead4/fauxratpoisons.png

GRRR!!! Too wide! :evil:

however, let's say I want to go all graphical on yo ass, I like overlapping windows because I can flick through the different programs I'm using, so for that I'd want something that can do overlapping windows, like evilwm

http://users.aber.ac.uk/ead4/messowindowss.png

in case you're wondering, i severely emasculated the colours on that second pic, I'm pretty sure gimp doesn't havee a colour selector quite that crappy
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Re: Window Management

Postby RealGrouchy » Tue May 29, 2007 10:29 pm UTC

EvanED wrote:
RealGrouchy wrote:On Windows XP, I usually only have one thing open, or if I'm sorting pictures, two side-by-side explorer windows (since Windows refuses to open folders in the same window--and yes, it is set to do so).


Weird, has it always (not) done that for you?

One day it started acting that way, and I've never been able to fix it. I've even tried to fix it at the registry level, to no avail.

Eventually, I'd like to reformat the drive, but it's a laptop with all sorts of junk for proprietary laptoppy buttons and things, so I fear I'd just break it in different ways if I did. :(

- RG>
Jack Saladin wrote:etc., lock'd
Mighty Jalapeno wrote:At least he has the decency to REMOVE THE GAP BETWEEN HIS QUOTES....
Sungura wrote:I don't really miss him. At all. He was pretty grouchy.


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