Gaming fleeting thoughts

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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Deva
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Deva » Mon Apr 11, 2016 10:31 pm UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:Well, this is off to a good start

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby ThemePark » Mon Apr 11, 2016 11:37 pm UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:Well, this is off to a good start

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Deva » Mon Apr 11, 2016 11:57 pm UTC

Except Duke Nukem fans.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby rmsgrey » Tue Apr 12, 2016 12:11 am UTC

Deva wrote:Except Duke Nukem fans.


Or John Romero fans...

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby ameretrifle » Thu Apr 14, 2016 8:21 am UTC

Eh, my problem with the standard coming-of-age storyline in JRPGs is the same problem I have with Tolkienesque fantasy. It's not that they're horrible tropes that don't have their place, it's that their current place seems to be fucking everywhere, without protection. After your first couple dozen, you kinda want something different, or something that takes a closer look at the assumptions underpinning it, y'know?

AMT slowly stops getting horrifically murdered by Bravely Default, Chapter 2 (sidequest 1)
Spoiler:
Tiz: So, to recap, our airship's broken, so it can only go over sea, but the sea is still all evil and things because of whatever's messing with the crystals. Also, I was ignominiously kicked in the balls by totally-never-Ringabel Dark Knight guy, but let's try to move past that.
Edea: Done.
Tiz: Not all of us will find it so easy.
Ringabel: Well, guess we'll have to head to the water crystal city by land, then.
Agnes: Balls.
Tiz: AUGH
*headed north*
Edea: Oh crystals damn it all to hell, a poison swamp?!
Agnes: As I said before...
Edea: Balls. At least they're fucking visible, unlike the stupid Blind traps.
Tiz: How many screens of this place are there?
Ringabel: Three.
Tiz: And you didn't want to keep the guy with the walkthrough around.
Agnes: And you didn't want to get kicked in the balls again...
Tiz: Wait, is that a threat?
Agnes: No, it's just that he obviously... oh, never mind.
*elsewhere*
Dark Knight: So you three are stationed around Florem, yes? The vestal's headed there, and Edea's with her!
Sister 1: Oh my cryst, you still have that stupid thing for her.
Dark Knight: She's being brainwashed! Promise me you'll help rescue her?
Sister 1: Yeah, sure.
Sister 2: You betcha.
Sister 3: Bitch, please.
Dark Knight: Just please don't hurt her. We'll get her back, and she'll see the error of her ways! *leaves*
Sister 1: Wow, that boy is some special kind of stupid. C'mon, girls, on with Operation Kill 'em All.
*to the next city*
Agnes: So! This place is called Florem. They like flowers.
Edea: Looks cool, just-- wait a second-- oh, oh no.
Tiz: Huh?
Ringabel: Dear Cryst, it's full of women.
Agnes: Did I forget to mention it's women-only?
Tiz: OH GOD MY BALLS
Agnes: Relax, male visitors are permitted.
Tiz: I'm still paranoid, okay?!
Ringabel: Country boy's seen too many geldings...
Agnes: So I figure we'll catch up with everyone here, see the town matriarch, probably grind a few levels outside of town because I am slowly starting to understand how the world works, then head off to the water temple to see to the crystal and find Olivia the water vestal.
Ringabel: I heartily endorse this plan.
Edea: I wish there were a God.
Agnes: Perhaps when we repair the Crystals.
RIngabel: Time to talk to the ladies!
Lady 1: I'm feeling insecure.
Dude 1: Oh me yarm HOT CHICKS EVERYWHERE
Lady 2: What's with these new ugly chicks without any sweet hair dye?
Lady 3: I'm spending all my money on cosmetics!
Lady 4: Did you hear about the gorgeous new hairpins?! I've got to have one before the beauty pageant we're holding next holy day!
Agnes: what the fuck
Edea: Oh, Cryst, I should've just stayed dead one of those times...
Agnes: Seriously what the Cryst happened to this place
Matriarch: I don't even fucking know, I turn my back for one second and everything goes to shit. I have no idea what's going on with the water temple, and fucking everyone has turned from pious to beauty-obsessed.
Edea: If there's supposed to be some sort of lesson to women in this, I am finding people and enabling them to perform lewd acts upon themselves by means of extreme spinal dislocation.
Ringabel: That didn't sound bad until the end there.
Agnes: Well, we'd better check out the water crystal, and fast.
Edea: Sure, but I want a couple levels in that new Spell Fencer job we got. Magic seems super useful these days. Even if it does make me look like a belly dancer for no fucking reason whatsoever.
Ringabel: If it's any consolation, I'm to attempt a few Time Mage levels before the dungeon after this, whereupon I will look like a complete tool.
Edea: It is very little consolation but okay.
*to the Water Temple*
Edea: Wow, this place is amazingly not fucked up.
Tiz: There aren't even any monsters.
Ringabel: And yet it seems to be as deserted as Tiz's sexual history.
Tiz: I don't know whether to smack you or be grateful you didn't go for a sheep joke.
Ringabel: Oh, I am nothing if not an opportunist.
Agnes: But it's like no one's been here for years. I know the water vestal exists, we've exchanged letters for years...
Ringabel: Oh did you now.
Agnes: I mean, we've been busy lately, but--
Edea: Don't bother, just let me smack him.
Agnes: I don't know what you mean but he is Ringabel so this seems reasonable.
Airy: Let's look at the water crystal, though!
Tiz: AAUGH dammit tutorial fairy we need to get you a bell or something
Agnes: It's still got evil around it, but someone shielded it before the worst could happen. I'm such a failure.
Edea: Didn't seem to stop the seas from getting fucked, though...
Agnes: Anyway, we should find Olivia and get her to take this down and fix her crystal.
Airy: But you could just do it instead.
Agnes: You don't just touch another woman's crystal like that.
Ringabel: Indeed, a drink, perhaps some flowers, a pleasant OW
Edea: This is going to be a long chapter.
Agnes: Anyway, let's go back to town and report back.
*back to town*
Matriarch: The temple's been abandoned for years?! Well. Balls.
Agnes: Except it can't have been, except... oh, I don't know what to do now!
Airy: We could just go back and fix the crystal ourselves.
Agnes: Sisters before crystals.
Airy: what does that even mean
Tiz: What's the walkthrough say?
Ringabel: It says we should totally enter Agnes in the beauty pageant.
Edea: IT DOES NOT
Ringabel: It does so.
Edea: I SAW YOU WRITING THAT
Tiz: That makes no fucking sense.
Agnes: No, it does! Olivia will definitely come out of hiding for that!
Ringabel: Oh, will she now.
Agnes: Of course! It's the holiest day of the year!
Ringabel: Riiiiiight.
Agnes: So I'll enter the pageant and Olivia will see me and then we'll talk and she can fix her crystal!
Airy: I don't see why we can't just go back and do it our--
Agnes: I FUCKING HATE THAT MINIGAME OKAY
Tiz: This still seems pretty stupid.
Ringabel: Come on, my good man, every level is a good level.
Tiz: Ugggggh fiiiiiine but I swear to god, the second we see a hot spring, I'm reclassing back to Monk to help Edea preemptively kick your ass.
Ringabel: But why can I never catch a break.
Edea: You know what they say. If you give a moose a muffin, he'll turn it into a sexual innuendo and you will never have a moment of peace.
Ringabel: I'm not sure that's how the book went, but I can certainly see the potential in that title.
Edea: Well, if we don't want Agnes to totally embarrass herself, we're going to need to doll her up.
Agnes: Huh??
Airy: Don't look at me, Cloud, you wanted to play the pretty fucking princess...
Tiz: Okay, if we see any gyms or houses of ill repute, I am calling bullshit on the whole mission and we're fixing the goddamn crystal ourselves.
Airy: LIKE YOU KNOW WE WILL ANYWAY
Tiz: Levels, fairy. Levels.
Airy: uggggggh
Edea: We'll definitely need some sexy clothes. We could also look into that hair dye and those hairpins, but those are more... accessories. Side-quests, as it were.
Agnes: But where doe we get those?
Girl 1: Well, there's this old perv who comes by once in a while with super hot clothes.
Ringabel: COMRADE!
Edea: We don't know it's that guy!
Ringabel: Yet by deed he is my comrade regardless.
Edea: Ugh, fair enough.
Matriarch: Actually, it is that guy.
Airy: WE HAVE TO WALK ALL THE WAY BACK THROUGH THOSE FUCKING WOODS?? OH MY FUCKING CRYSTAL I HATE YOU ALL
RIngabel: Pfft. Of course we're not doing that. There are hairpins to be found!
Airy: fuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuu
Ringabel: And Time Mage levels. I hope Stop is worth it.
Edea: That hat does make me happier. So let's buy a hairpin!
Shopkeeper: Oh, those hairpins? Someone sells them from the gardens out west. Actually, people seem to get a bit obsessive and weird once they try them. I won't stock the creepy things. And these kids were asking how to find them, and no one's seen them for hours...
Ringabel: See? A worthy quest!
Airy: fiiiiiine
*westward ho*
Tiz: Hey, that must be those kids!
Ringabel: Being attacked by a fair number of monsters. Time Mage level 2, here I come!
Tiz: Well, I'm glad you're safe.
Ringabel: You should get back to town. It's dangerous out here, and people are worried about you.
Sister 1: But shiny things.
Sister 2: Yeah, thanks and everything, but fuck off, mister.
Ringabel: I'm a mister now? ;-;
Edea: Bwa ha ha
Tiz: Come on, we'd better save them.
Edea: Oh my god, now it's fucking silence traps. At least the flowers are super easy to see.
Tiz: Hey, kids, it's really dangerous here and you should go home.
Sisters: BUT SHINIES *run away*
Tiz: I really hate kids.
Edea: Look, you little brats, go home before you get hurt!
Sister 1: But we want a shiny hairpin from the holy sprites!
Sister 2: And we're not going home until we get one! *run away*
Edea: I also hate kids.
Sister 1: Yay! We made it in to where the magic holy sprites live!
Sister 2: They're so pretty!
Sprites: *are immediately engulfed in flames*
Sisters: O_O
Summoner: Hey losers. Life is a bitch and then you die. Love is false and promises are hollow. My sister is a glorious being and everyone else can go fuck themselves.
Edea: We really need to invent SSRIs.
Summoner: Those fairy hairpins are actually made out of sprite wings, by the way. They glow when you rip them off their struggling bodies. Then they're clouded forever, of course, but the screams make it worthwhile.
Tiz: Oh my cryst! See that, kids?! You should stop this pointless quest and go home to the people who are worried about--
Sister 1: Hey, that wing was mine! You already grabbed three!
Sister 2: Finders, keepers, buttmunch.
Tiz: O.O
Edea: Oh, wow, do I hate kids.
Agnes: We, we really need to stop this evil magic.
Summoner: Your fragile alliance is doomed and it will be glorious to watch you fall apart.
Agnes: Well, okay, Ringabel is obviously dubious, but--
Ringabel: HEY!
Summoner. Trust and love and family are meaningless. See there?
Sister 1: BITCH GIVE ME THAT WING BACK
Sister 2: FUCK YOU NO
Tiz: oh my crystal
Ringabel: I'd heard harrowing things about fairy dust, but I didn't know this was what they meant.
Edea: Guys, we've got to beat the shit out of her before something bad happens!
Party: *beats the shit out of her*
Summoner: Ha ha haaaa... there's blood on your hands, now. I've corrupted you.
Edea: Too late, bitch, we've been murdering fools for weeks now.
Summoner: Pfft, then I'll drop some mysterious vague hints about Johnny Two-Soul over there.
Tiz: His name probably isn't-- wait, you're looking at me?
Summoner: TROLLING 4 LYFE *keels over*
Tiz: The fuck was that about?
Edea: Never mind that, how are the kids?
Agnes: Um... oh, wow.
Edea: What.
Agnes: They're, uh, they're kind of dead.
Edea: THEY DIDN'T EVEN HAVE ANY WEAPONS
Tiz: Holy shit.
Ringabel: I don't think I can ever make a catfight joke again.
*back to town*
Shopkeeper: Holy fuck. Well. I really wish I'd never told them where those came from. I'm going to go campaign against those hairpins now. Possibly with fire.
Ringabel: Good woman.
Edea: Well. Scratch the hairpins off the list with an axe, then.
Agnes: We'd better make sure the hair dye isn't evil.
Tiz: Yeah, but... how about tomorrow?
Ringabel: Tomorrow sounds much better.
Agnes: Indeed.
Edea: Holy shit.

Soooooo they're at least a little willing to play with some of the cliches. That's probably something.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Fri Apr 15, 2016 1:59 am UTC

Zohar wrote:Started playing Ori and the Blind Forest. I'm finding the platforming elements quite a bit more challenging than I thought they would. Also the "save anywhere but you can't always save" element is stressing me out a bit (should I save now? How about now? Will I need this energy thing later on?).

I'm sure all of this will be remedied once I get a bit stronger (get double jump and more blue save thingies) but still.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Felstaff » Mon Apr 18, 2016 9:54 am UTC

I managed to complete Tom Clancy's Splinter Cell: Chaos Theory, which means I'm three sixths of the way through the franchise, and--seeing as it was released in 2005--only 11 years behind current gaming trends, making me 2.2x more annoying than this guy. Having completed the original Splinter Cell and Pandora Tomorrow (twice now), I had only ever played the demo of TCSC:CT, but I recall instantly disliking it as Sam Fisher, instead of safely knocking out bad guys, would actually stab them violently in the neck! It was graphic, macabre, and totally unnecessary. I never purchased the game, and I believe it was the animation of him thrusting a knife into a guy's jugular to be the reason why.

Anyway, naturally, a Steam sale came along a while ago and I bought a kitten I called Caboodle. And the Splinter Cell games. I'm glad to see they toned down the 'killing blow' for the final version of the game - in fact it's so subtle I didn't realise I was killing the guys I was sneaking up on, until I got the stats at the end of the first level: enemies murdered: 13. Then I consulted the controls, and it turns out left-click kills them, and it's right-click to subdue them! Armed with this in mind, I managed to complete it without killing a single enemy. I liked the fact you get rewarded for not injuring or killing your foes. It made the game much harder, and it took much longer to complete, but I prefer stealthy sneaking to gunfights any day.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby New User » Mon Apr 18, 2016 11:35 am UTC

The Punisher game for PS2 is the most violent game I recall seeing. Instead of being rewarded for completing stages without killing enemies, you are encouraged to kill unarmed men. By shooting them in the face while they beg for their lives. Also included were interactive torture scenes such as driving over a man's neck with a forklift (which I believe would kill a real man since forklifts tend to weigh several tons), holding a man over an open elevator shaft, and holding a man over an industrial grinder of some sort (probably a meat grinder). If the torture mini-game is failed, the Punisher might accidentally kill the victim. This means you might accidentally drop them into the elevator shaft, and as I recall, you are rewarded for killing an enemy, but Punisher doesn't get the information from the torture (whatever that leads to, I don't know).

I also was pretty uncomfortable with the violence in Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, a game that was rated T by the ESRB. According to ESRB's website, a T-rated game is suitable for ages 13 and up, "may contain violence" and "minimal blood". By contrast, an M-rated game is for ages 17 and up, and "may contain intense violence, blood and gore". In Uncharted: Drake's Fortune, the player character Drake kills hundreds of men over the course of the game. Even though it might be argued that he is doing it in self-defense, it could also be argued that he doesn't do enough to get out of these conflict situations peacefully. I think this getting into mass-murderer territory. The game includes an achievement for getting 100 headshots. That means you are rewarded for shooting 100 men in the head. I recall that shooting an enemy in the head makes a splatter of blood come out, and it's probably the same as the small splatter of blood that comes from shooting any part of an enemy's body. Still, telling the player, "Congratulations! You've shot 100 people in the head!" seems a bit violent to me. That isn't considering all the other enemies you'd be killing by means other than headshots, and also the achievements rewarded for doing so (I recall there is an achievement for killing 4 or 5 guys with a single grenade, for example).

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby 3fj » Mon Apr 18, 2016 2:24 pm UTC

Cibele is so disappointing. The whole "Get a glimpse of a story by means of fiddling with their desktop" is something that really appeals to me, so I picked it up over the weekend. It's insultingly short and doesn't come together in any meaningful way. The whole thing is blindingly obvious the whole way through, to the point where I feel like it's gone severely over my head in some sort of way. I feel like it's just an obviously worse execution of the same concept as Emily is Away, Her Story, Digital a Love Story/Analogue a Hate Story, etc.

The one thing it has going for it is that it's "real" in the sense that it's scrapings of the creator's actual teen-girldom on the internet. That doesn't really save it, though.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Felstaff » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:44 pm UTC

New User wrote:I also was pretty uncomfortable with the violence in Uncharted: Drake's Fortune...I recall that shooting an enemy in the head makes a splatter of blood come out, and it's probably the same as the small splatter of blood that comes from shooting any part of an enemy's body.

Eh, I'm still trying to draw a line where violence becomes gratuitous for me; something the entertainment industries have been doing for the better part of a century now. I place Uncharted well within the unrealistic violence bracket. There is blood, yes, but it's not necessarily the sight of blood alone that makes something unacceptably violent. In videogames, the appearance of blood has traditionally been unrealistic. Mainly because blood rarely appears in real life the way it does in nearly all video games? Uncharted falls under 80s-machismo movie violence, for me, which is totally within my fairly loose and shiftable moral boundaries. (80s-machismo falls between family-friendly murder and outright comic product-placed testosterone-fests). The fairly-common guns 'n' fists combat of Uncharted is somewhere closer to the Indiana Jones side of this. So I'm okay with shooting 1,768 bad guys over the course of fifteen hours in the pursuit of continuing the narrative to its designated conclusion. If, however, each victim of gun violence were to judder on the floor, shit themselves, and scream for their mother as their life ebbs away in your arms, i.e. multiple henchman-dispatch becomes a traumatic experience that reflects real life in some empathetic way, then I'd have a problem with it, and I probably wouldn't play. As (is the case with most action/adventure games of the Tomb Raider ilk), they're nothing more than moving target dummies that occasionally utter the Wilhelm scream, I don't really consider the violence in Uncharted (or most run-and-gun/adventure/cover shooter/third person/first person games) to be within an imaginable experience or expectation of a realistic situation. Therefore I know I'm not actually killing 1,768 dudes of the exact same age, gender, and stature, but despatching mindless adult-man-shaped obstacles in order to progress an otherwise unrelated goal.

Where Uncharted gets it wrong is that its own violence is completely inconsistent with the universe in which the protagonist is placed. The fact that you literally have to kill over one-thousand henchmen in the course of your continent-hopping adventures is, if anything, a gaming trope that is a lazy shortcut for adding difficulty and time to your progression, making the game 'worth' the purchase because the (ceaseless) combat acts as somewhat of a bottleneck to slow your progress down and make sure you don't just sprint through the lush environment the Naughty Dogdevs spent many a crunch-hour lovingly perfecting. You could complete the game in under an hour if the combat was removed, I'd say; two or three if you get really stuck on an exploratory puzzle or unnecessarily-circuitous over-elaborate locked-door problem that an ancient civilisation felt necessary to include when building the entrance to their Totally Secret Hidden City. So the answer was to add waves of faceless, emotionless henchmen. Devoid of any humanity, they're not really humans at all, just problems that are capable of shouting 'he's over here!' So shooting them and seeing the same blood spatter pattern over and over again is so divorced from any notion of reality (both in our universe and the universe we're currently suspending our disbelief for), that even curmudgeonly old pacifists like me can get satisfaction with mowing 'em down with any rapid-projectile-firing armaments at my disposal.

Which doesn't exonerate the video game industry's outrageous sanitation of violence in any way, I should add. Videogames have developed to be competition simulators in their undecalustrum lifetime, and physical competition is mainly combat, so combat, or the act of defeating something to death, has become the de facto state of the majority of games that don't fall into other forms of competition, physical or otherwise (sports, racing, puzzle, etc.) Most games are a product of their genre's elemental popularity, and popularity is a game's call of duty. Violence is intrinsic, and the simple competitive mathematical game of reducing your opponent's number to zero while keeping yours above one (usually visually represented in linear fashion by means of a totally unrealistic health bar) is now inextricable from the structural foundations of violence that have come to define the videogame industry itself.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby KnightExemplar » Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:41 pm UTC

Felstaff wrote:
[snip]

I place Uncharted well within the unrealistic violence bracket. There is blood, yes, but it's not necessarily the sight of blood alone that makes something unacceptably violent. In videogames, the appearance of blood has traditionally been unrealistic. Mainly because blood rarely appears in real life the way it does in nearly all video games? Uncharted falls under 80s-machismo movie violence, for me, which is totally within my fairly loose and shiftable moral boundaries. (80s-machismo falls between family-friendly murder and outright comic product-placed testosterone-fests).

[snip]



Snipped for length, but otherwise I like this subject. The above seems to be the core of your argument.

For some data points, I find Gears of War chainsawing people while they're alive to be "hilarious cartoon violence", as well as Mortal Kombat 2. I mean, you do a "Brutality" MK2 and then five rib-cages pop out. Its kind of funny, and extremely anatomically incorrect. The fact that the director of sound design comes out with a very bad photoshop and yells 'Toasty!!!!' adds to the hilariousness.

On the flip side, Mortal Kombat 9 and 10, as well as "God of War" series in general, are in the realistic enough where I've grown very uncomfortable playing those games. Stabbing a Cyclops in his only Eye, beating various monsters until their skulls literally split open and their open, bleeding brain becomes a valid target for you to attack is getting into torture porn territory for me. And I just don't enjoy that level of violence.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Drumheller769 » Mon Apr 18, 2016 4:52 pm UTC

Wow Felstaff...words, you can use them.

On topic: I actually stopped playing The Last of Us, not because I didnt like the story, or controls, but because I couldnt stand my wife watching the over to top gore when having any interaction with the zombies.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Mon Apr 18, 2016 5:24 pm UTC

Drumheller769 wrote:Wow Felstaff...words, you can use them.

It's almost like using words to craft messages is his job!
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Xeio » Mon Apr 18, 2016 6:35 pm UTC

I'm really of mixed opinions about Hyper Light Drifter.

The combat is great, and I've loved the first 3 boss fights so far, but there's a lot of tiny annoyances that add up.

Like, there seem to be a distinct lack of save points. Or there are particularly long maps with an 'ambush' fight at the end where you're much likely to die so you have to re-clear all the 'trash'. Like I just spent like 10 attempts to get past a section where you have to clear 8 monsters... then have to dodge a bunch of fast one-shot wall-smashers that activate on the way back out. I think only died once or twice due to the monsters, but I had to re-clear them every time.

Also, the limited heals sort of adds a perverse incentive to just kill myself if I take any damage, particularly from falling off ledges. I'm not really sure I like it, but it's an easy way to avoid running low on heals at key points. I mean, I guess I could go back and re-clear areas that respawned to farm kits or something, but that seems like it would wast even more time than purposefully killing myself.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Jahoclave » Mon Apr 18, 2016 7:35 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:
Deva wrote:Except Duke Nukem fans.


Or John Romero fans...

Or Beckett fans.

Also, Rust is a game I could really get into, if it weren't for the culture of the people in it. Literally, the number of times I was murdered just trying to do the server a favor of building a bridge to and from a large island was obscene.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Apr 18, 2016 8:34 pm UTC

I played The Magic Circle this weekend. Story was a bit heavy handed to incredibly heavy handed, but the mechanic...


THAT is something that Wizards:Fuck With Shit would have. That's the kind of shit I'm rambling about when I say a Wizard game should let you fuck with shit on the fly and set a ton of parameters. Yeah, it's editing creatures, not spells, but the same basic principle could easily apply.

Also, get The Magic Circle if you want to play a game with some neat mechanics in regard to editing creatures. There's hardly any combat in the game (I mean, there can be, but you can pretty easily capture almost anything before it's a threat and everything else your slowly growing horde can easily smash) but that creature editing mechanic needs to be in something else, something with more of a combat focus where you're literally playing an Evil Overlord of some sort.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Xanthir » Mon Apr 18, 2016 9:24 pm UTC

Yeah, the only times I ever had to do "combat" was against the Hiver Queen, Killbot, and Flamers (all of which can kill you from outside your capture distance) or the flyers (can't be captured). And that was all trivial to take care of for my fleet of (eventually) Hivemind Flying Fireproof Railgun Mushrooms (plus a flying teleporter as my favored mount). They, uh, wiped the "final boss" without me even realizing.

It's def an amazing game - basically a narrative/exploration game in structure, with a little bit of problem-solving/very minor combat to break things up. And I can't get over Ashley Burch and Dr. Venture as voice actors!
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 19, 2016 4:36 am UTC

And Stephen Russel and if you don't know who that is get the hell off my lawn.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Xanthir » Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:28 am UTC

I didn't know him by name, but only because all British people sound the same.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Koa » Tue Apr 19, 2016 3:50 pm UTC

Felstaff wrote:I'm glad to see they toned down the 'killing blow' for the final version of the game - in fact it's so subtle I didn't realise I was killing the guys I was sneaking up on, until I got the stats at the end of the first level: enemies murdered: 13. Then I consulted the controls, and it turns out left-click kills them, and it's right-click to subdue them!

When you sneak up behind an enemy and grab them, and then left click, the animation doesn't make sense. Sam kicks/punches their back and they fall dead. It only looks a little more violent than the right click version where you choke them out. But when you aren't grabbing an enemy you can still left click/right click on people. Right click you sucker punch them, but left click is a little gruesome. You take your knife and slash their throat a lot of the time. The animation you get depends on your angle to the enemy. I've done all knife kill runs of SCCT for fun, but it also left me feeling a little bit uneasy at times.

edit: Made a quick video to demonstrate.
edit2: I think a good part of the reason why it made me feel uneasy is the good writing though. The game will comment on how you're a murderer, in small ways. Sometimes your mission is not to kill anyone, but you can still kill people, and there's even some comments like "No the mission isn't over. This isn't a video game, Fisher. Don't do it again." ...And then you slash another throat, and everyone gets more pissed off until they just call off the mission. Feelsbadman.
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I'm not crazy about the guns, I think they're kind of lazy. It's really weird how somber the game world is yet there's this awkward difficulty to it. It's neat but it feels like it's in the wrong game for some reason.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Xeio » Tue Apr 19, 2016 7:14 pm UTC

Koa wrote:
Xeio wrote:I'm really of mixed opinions about Hyper Light Drifter.

I think my biggest problem is that nailing consistent dashes is incredibly difficult. I would like to know how big the window is, it has to be just a few frames and it runs at 30 fps. I guess the devs wanted perfect dashing to be the deeper challenge of the game, something like Metroid wall jumping or something.

I'm not crazy about the guns, I think they're kind of lazy. It's really weird how somber the game world is yet there's this awkward difficulty to it. It's neat but it feels like it's in the wrong game for some reason.
Hrmmm, like the multi-dash upgrade? I noticed it always seemed hard to get the multi-dash going, though once I got it going I could keep going pretty much as long as I wanted... barring walls anyway.

I didn't have any particular problems executing dashes to the extent that most enemies have fairly predictable attacks. Only really nasty fight I can recall for that is the West boss, who has a really short timing on his multi-swings. Took me a good number of attempts to figure out the exact pattern of dashing/attacking him relatively safely.

Also, yea, the guns seemed almost out of place, though they're nice in that they smooth the difficulty a lot if you want to abuse them. Seriously that shotgun. :shock:

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Koa » Wed Apr 20, 2016 10:26 am UTC

Well, for instance on the west boss (which was the most difficult boss for me), I found that you can chain dash up to the boss at the start of the fight to get some free hits in. But I couldn't execute it more than a quarter of the time. You have to hit the button in a pattern that speeds up for the first few presses. There's very little room for error in each press. So once you're going full speed and the tempo isn't changing, it's not too bad... Except when you have to do that 800 times in a row for the dash challenge.

I would definitely recommend abusing the shotgun. You might as well clear rooms fast rather than wasting time dashing around to avoid attacks. But who would add a literal shotgun to a game like this? It's like the art team and the designers didn't know that they had a disagreement about where to take the game. The secret paths would have made sense in another game too. Why would you have this fairly interesting combat system with deliberate actions, and have the player disjointedly bumping and sticking into every wall because they're looking for the secret paths that are everywhere? Maybe I'm crazy.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Xanthir » Mon Apr 25, 2016 5:53 am UTC

So I'm trying to pick up 100% in The Magic Circle, and goddammit some of the editted monsters don't show up on the overmap. >_< I distinctly counted that I was missing one corpse, one rock, and one mushroom (based on the per-monster counts one of the devs provided), despite my inventory saying I'm only missing one monster total.

I gathered all the monsters I had all of in one corner of the map, and all the corpses in the other. Yep, still missing one. Grab one, make it pickupable, give it Groupthink, then start flying around the map until I get the notification that a corpse has entered groupthink range. BINGO. Follow the thoughtstream, and find... a corpse that I've definitely edited in the past, sitting where I left all the corpses when I stopped using them. It just wasn't on the map. Now it is, and I count all 10 corpses that I should.

Now I need to do the same with mushrooms and rocks to figure out which one's lying to me and which one's actually still missing.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:10 pm UTC

Finished Ori, it was a lot of fun, and gorgeous, but I seriously don't understand why they insisted on doing these two-to-three-minute long sections that you can't save during. They're pretty hard, and super frustrating.

Not sure what to play next. Apparently there's a new Banner Saga though! But I haven't bought it and I think I'll go for Watch Dogs, which I bought on sale a while ago, and thought I might enjoy.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby rmsgrey » Mon Apr 25, 2016 1:18 pm UTC

Progress in Dark Souls has resumed - Quelaag is defeated at the cost of 3 Humanity (1 attempt where her first attack trapped in a corner where she then poured lava over me; 1 where I got mobbed by mosquitoes before getting close; 1 where nothing bad happened) and Ceaseless Discharge lost his grip, but while my side-trip into the Great Hollow did net me some Twinkling Titanite, it also gained me a Curse, which made my ascent through Blighttown rather "interesting". Next stop: Sen's Fortress en route to Anor Londo.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Felstaff » Wed Apr 27, 2016 12:16 am UTC

For some reason I'm going 100% completionist on the Infinity Blade trilogy. Games I haven't played for nearly three years.

In the last few weeks I've purchased and mastered every weapon and armour in iBlade-One, which is no mean feat as the total cost--including the "Dark" set (Dark X-SC2/Dark Tempest/Dark Fusion/Dark Omega XOS-7/Dark Halo) of weapons/armour that you can only achieve by reaching the -10 bloodline--costs upwards of £40,000,000. As $2,500,000 in the store is €39.99, it would cost a helluva lot of real monies to get that with simple pay2win. Fortunately I found an easy-money route, where you restart from the beginning each time you beat the imprisoned deathless. They'd each drop one of the three Dragoor sets, which would net you a total ¥600,000, with about 6 minutes' playthrough of that interminable tutorial. At work, I'd often start a game, then carry on working, pausing only briefly to glance at my phone every now and again to see if it required some interaction from me. I did love the Pangean language in it. Like fruity Italian, it sounded, it did. Sadly the subsequent games switched to AmerEnglish, so all the characters have that gritty "I'm clenching my buttocks so hard right now" nasal yankee twang to their voices, with the bad guys assuming the classic BrEnglish villain tone, giving that lordly "I'm clenching my stiff upper lip so hard right now" condescending monarchical articulation.

I'm now on 'Blade II, which I presumed I'd lost all my progression when I played it in 2012, as I've juggled a fair few phones in the interim (two, to be exact), and assumed my data was lost forever. But it wasn't! Reinstalling it through the magic of the App Store, my level-94 Siris, cheerfully named ButtcrackJim, appeared the moment I opened the game, still wielding all the fancy-schmancy weaponry I'd earned through hours of playthrough. HOWEVER, I didn't realise just how incomplete my completion was. I mean, I'd completed all of the game and hidden bits, as well as killed all the deathless imprisoned in the Skycages, so that's like game over, right? INCORRECT. There's about fifteen more weapons I need to master, and they've papered over the old ways of spinning easy money through inventory bugs. I wasted a lot of money trying to exploit this bug, so now I'm building up my gold reserves the old-fashioned way: killing many things with a long sword.

Image
A screenshot I took in early 2012


I never got far into I.B.III, for some reason. Perhaps its switch from ordered linearity to chaotic de-linearity put my obsessively-compulsive mind off it. I could no longer buy my weapons and armour in logical fashion (cheapest, easy-to-master stuff first, slowly building up towards the Big Guns), having instead being forced to wait for a ship to arrive between 'rebirths', where I'd have a ridiculously small choice of weaponry, most far too expensive to even consider, and not even the ship would show up most of the time. Put me right orf it, it did. Perhaps, having a mind relaxed by age, I'd consider slogging through it again. But for the meantime, I have at least 20 more hours of IB2 to get through...
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby You, sir, name? » Tue May 03, 2016 12:30 am UTC

I played through Firewatch recently. I really like a good walking simulator. Enjoyed it quite a lot.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Magnanimous » Tue May 03, 2016 12:50 am UTC

I played Titan Souls because it was on sale, and I'm impressed. It's definitely as difficult as advertised. Having only boss fights is still an interesting game concept, although the arcade style made the bosses less interesting than the ones in Shadow of the Colossus. You can kill many of the bosses in less than ten seconds, which is cool for speed runs but not very dramatic.

Still, the fights are really creative and not just the standard video game tropes. Some of them are more like puzzles than arcade bosses.

SecondTalon wrote:THAT is something that Wizards:Fuck With Shit would have. That's the kind of shit I'm rambling about when I say a Wizard game should let you fuck with shit on the fly and set a ton of parameters. Yeah, it's editing creatures, not spells, but the same basic principle could easily apply.

Also, get The Magic Circle if you want to play a game with some neat mechanics in regard to editing creatures. There's hardly any combat in the game (I mean, there can be, but you can pretty easily capture almost anything before it's a threat and everything else your slowly growing horde can easily smash) but that creature editing mechanic needs to be in something else, something with more of a combat focus where you're literally playing an Evil Overlord of some sort.

Have you heard of CodeSpells? It's sort of this idea, but still in early access.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Tue May 10, 2016 3:19 pm UTC

Recently started playing Tales of Zestiria. It's fun to play a very JRPG-ish game (unsurprising, since it's a JRPG). However, currently I'm mostly button-mashing in battle, and the equipment fusion system seems very elaborate.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Deva » Tue May 10, 2016 9:05 pm UTC

Fusion: Gave a long-winded explanation in-game. Spent a while understanding it too. Boils down to this:
1. Skill A + Skill B -> Some skill (roughly between A and B on the chart, usually).
2. Skill A + Skill A -> Skill A
3. Skill A + Empty -> Skill A
4. Skill A + Skill B (Locked) -> Skill A.

Offers two practical examples.
Example One
Spoiler:
Calcite Sword’s skill slots:
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Defense
Slot Three: +Arte Attack
Slot Four: +Paralysis Capability

Goal: Insert +Focus into Slot Four.

Step One: Find two Calcite Swords with skills only in Slot Four (besides the fixed skill). Needs one with +Focus. Loots one Calcite Sword with +Focus and another with +Wind.

Step Two: Fuse the initial sword and +Wind. Becomes:
Calcite Sword +1
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Defense
Slot Three: +Arte Attack
Slot Four: Some skill (Locked)

Treats locked skills as empty, for the purposes of fusion. Displays blue text for locked skills.

Step Three: Fuse the +1 Calcite Sword with the +Focus sword.
Result:
Calcite Sword +2
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Defense
Slot Three: +Arte Attack
Slot Four: +Focus

Done.

Example Two
Spoiler:
Begins with three Calcite Swords.

Calcite Sword Alpha
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Defense
Slot Three: +Arte Attack
Slot Four: Empty

Calcite Sword Beta
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Poison Capability
Slot Three: +Stun Damage
Slot Four: +Focus

Calcite Sword Delta
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: +Non-elemental Damage
Slot Three: +Capability versus Beasts
Slot Four: Empty

Goal: +Focus in Alpha’s fourth slot without losing its current skills.

Step One: Fuse Beta and Delta. Creates the following:
Calcite Sword +1
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two: Some skill (locked)
Slot Three: Some skill (locked)
Slout Four: +Focus

Makes no difference what the locked skills are. Keep them locked.

Step Two: Fuse Alpha and the new +1 Sword.
Result:
Calcite Sword +2
Slot One (fixed): +Attack
Slot Two +Defense
Slot Three: +Arte Attack
Slot Four: +Focus

Done.

Edit: Fixed Example Two.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Wed May 11, 2016 12:44 pm UTC

Thanks Deva, that was helpful. I think my challenge is more about figuring out if it's worth it to fuse stuff together or not, are these skills good or not, what's their real impact in battle, what do I need to do in battle that's not just <button smash until SC runs out> <defend until SC goes back up>, that sort of thing. I imagine I'll learn some of it with time, and for some of it, well, there's always "simple" difficulty level.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Koa » Wed May 18, 2016 10:50 am UTC

I'm falling in love with Offworld Trading Company. I first watched Day9 play it and it looked incredibly confusing and stressful. That hasn't been my experience at all.

I would say it has two layers of difficulty. The first is learning all the buildings and resources, the basics of what everything does. The tutorial is okay enough for this part I suppose. The second is learning how the free market works, and there are many lessons to learn about it. Sometimes it's better to buy intermediate materials and sell the end product, but that will slightly drive up the demand of the intermediate product... which another company might start to sell, in which case you're basically funding the other company's success.

The prices of all of the resources fluctuate based on real consumption, someone on the map is buying it off of the market. You basically want all prices to be equal to their relative cost, you shave off any resources that go above average, and bail out of any when you are below. Doing anything else is an advanced play where you better know what you're doing.

If you go into every game thinking about trying to produce everything that you need: the resources to upgrade, the materials for buildings, the chemicals for research, the power for your buildings, etc... You're never going to be quite as strong as someone who is buying stuff cheaply off of the market. You may well end up producing a lot of things yourself because everyone is rushing to lead the market, but you also need to understand this relationship that you have with other companies on the map.

The mechanics are very fun to play with the more I understood them. It's a neat RTS. The units are factories, the rule of engagement is capitalism. I love the music too, Hacker Array is great for the feeling of a mad capitalist dash.

Here's an example of the market in-game. All of the players are consuming power, but no one is producing it. They're all having to buy power off of the market and each time they do the price of power goes up by one. Eventually power gets to a juicy over 200, and three of the four players switch to solar power generators at the end of the night to cash in on this buildup, which consequently crashes the power market. It makes sense for the last player not to switch as well because of how fast the price is going to drop.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Ixtellor » Mon May 23, 2016 1:22 pm UTC

I bought offworld traders this weekend. I'm still learning the game and haven't tried multiplayer yet, but I intend to only play multliplayer once I get good at it.

I'm stuck on the 2nd to last tutorial, finding that the Science based companies don't fit in with my play style. So far I have found that the easiest way to beat the computers is:
Spoiler:
produce a lot of food towards the late game, buy 2 offworld trading rockets, and just spam sell it.
I find trying to dominate at final products much harder, because they require so much inputs and as Koa said, relying on buying materials greatly increases the prices of those products.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Zohar » Mon May 23, 2016 1:29 pm UTC

Unsurprisingly, I've been playing A LOT of FFX. The voice acting is not terrible, but I don't remember Tidus's voice bothering me as much when I first played it - he's either a bad actor, or had some bad directing (but other people aren't as awkward as he is).

Also, really wish I didn't have to switch everyone in battle just so they all get AP.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon May 23, 2016 1:33 pm UTC

Ixtellor wrote:I bought offworld traders this weekend. I'm still learning the game and haven't tried multiplayer yet, but I intend to only play multliplayer once I get good at it.
Ooo! Ooo! I bought the game in beta, played for about a week, and then put it down thinking it just wasn't for me. A friend recently bought it and gave it a go, so we played a bunch. They twerked it to be sure, but maybe it was also a fresh set of eyes, but...

I think it's one of the most brilliant games I've ever played. It's got enormous strategic depth, and requires keeping track of a crazy amount of stuff and things. When you get a better feel for even just the mechanics and whats what, lets play. I'm pretty terrible.

One thing to remember is you don't really have to 'walk up' your economy at all. The higher tier products can be produced right off the bat, though the demand for electronics, chemicals, and whatever the third thing is is probably pretty low. The only thing you NEED is food, water, power, and fuel, and the robotic faction doesn't even need food or water.

Opportunity cost is key. The EVE player in me is squeeing with joy. The end game can get a bit frantic, and it can be super hard to close a gap. Once a player pulls ahead, having all those extra claims is pretty brutal to catch up on, but evidently a big part of the mid/late game is bulldozing your stuff and rebuilding. The end game stuff all seems pretty reasonably balanced - the pleasure domes can provide lots of steady cash, the hacker array can really push the direction the market is traveling and give you a very competitive edge, the optimization plant can shore up deficits and/or help you produce more of a thing you plan on steadily selling. Research can make some pretty dramatic changes, but I haven't really experimented with it. Teleportation for example is super useful for the Science guys, because they often find themselves widely spread out. Finally, the Offworld Market seems to be the most OP - I had a game where my partner generated something like 2m in sales by having two Launch Pads. It was kind of fascinating - the cost of food completely bottomed out to ~<10 per, whereas the offworld market was buying at ~500 per. Even with the two of us buying up a ton of food, and having a launch every 30s, our opponents didn't adjust and cut back on food production, so the cost stayed low.

It's a very interesting game to be sure.

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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby KnightExemplar » Mon May 23, 2016 6:02 pm UTC

Zohar wrote:Unsurprisingly, I've been playing A LOT of FFX. The voice acting is not terrible, but I don't remember Tidus's voice bothering me as much when I first played it - he's either a bad actor, or had some bad directing (but other people aren't as awkward as he is).


Ha ha ha ha ha.

Nah, I explicitly remember talking to random NPCs who were hammy (random passer-by near the beginning who'd say "Stay away from the SUM-moner".) Not terrible by early 2000s standards (that'd be Dynasty Warriors). But I remember taking the voice acting very non-seriously through that game.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby You, sir, name? » Mon May 23, 2016 6:06 pm UTC

KnightExemplar wrote:
Zohar wrote:Unsurprisingly, I've been playing A LOT of FFX. The voice acting is not terrible, but I don't remember Tidus's voice bothering me as much when I first played it - he's either a bad actor, or had some bad directing (but other people aren't as awkward as he is).


Ha ha ha ha ha.

Nah, I explicitly remember talking to random NPCs who were hammy (random passer-by near the beginning who'd say "Stay away from the SUM-moner".) Not terrible by early 2000s standards (that'd be Dynasty Warriors). But I remember taking the voice acting very non-seriously through that game.


That is some serious Nicolas Cage level acting.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby KnightExemplar » Mon May 23, 2016 6:08 pm UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:
KnightExemplar wrote:
Zohar wrote:Unsurprisingly, I've been playing A LOT of FFX. The voice acting is not terrible, but I don't remember Tidus's voice bothering me as much when I first played it - he's either a bad actor, or had some bad directing (but other people aren't as awkward as he is).


Ha ha ha ha ha.

Nah, I explicitly remember talking to random NPCs who were hammy (random passer-by near the beginning who'd say "Stay away from the SUM-moner".) Not terrible by early 2000s standards (that'd be Dynasty Warriors). But I remember taking the voice acting very non-seriously through that game.


That is some serious Nicolas Cage level acting.


A shame that I can't find you a loop of voice acting I actually consider bad (Anyone got a clip of Dynasty Warriors 3 "Victory shall belong to Wu"??). As noted, I don't think Tidus's voice was "terrible" by the standards of the time.

EDIT: Found something bad from sorta that era. Mortal Kombat 64 had bad voice acting.

It also helps that the laugh was supposed to be awkward, so that Yuna would feel better. Proper context helps. But... yeah, this isn't like movie-quality voice acting. Video game voice acting was always kinda second-rate at that time.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby You, sir, name? » Mon May 23, 2016 6:21 pm UTC

I don't think you can blame it on the times. I would argue System Shock 1 from 1994 has more effort put into its voice acting than FFX.
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Re: Gaming fleeting thoughts

Postby KnightExemplar » Mon May 23, 2016 6:23 pm UTC

You, sir, name? wrote:I don't think you can blame it on the times. I would argue System Shock 1 from 1994 has more effort put into its voice acting than FFX.


The expectations of PC Gamers has been different. The bar was set high. The voice acting of 1996 Starcraft and Starcraft: Brood War in 1997 are grossly superior to everything that came out on console for years.

Console gamers just... had lower expectations and weaker voice actors in my memory. But big PC Games in my memory (the earliest being Experimental Fighter Mantis) did indeed have higher-quality voice actors.
First Strike +1/+1 and Indestructible.


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