You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

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Kag
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Kag » Mon Apr 07, 2008 12:45 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:Making them walk the plank is far more rewarding than concentration-camp tactics :P


Good point.

How about having the entire immigrant wave fight a captured megabeast? We'll see how tough that bronze colossus is when he feels the might of 15 worthless peasants!
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby integral » Mon Apr 07, 2008 2:34 am UTC

That makes sense. I used a floodgate into a closed room for that. I also tried dropping people into my moat, but I couldn't make the moat in the first place because I didn't have enough water pressure to get from the river to my moat.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Numquam » Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:25 am UTC

I just finished building a lake of water above my fort so I can flood the entrance hall if necessary. The entrance hall is long and has doors at either side. If my other traps fail I release one floodgate and it all streams in through th roof, hopefully killing all goblins. Then when the threat is gone I hit another floodgate and it all goes out. Best of all it can stay flooded for as long as necessary and the lake has enough water for multiple floodings. Its also handy for killing those excess migrants.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Coin » Thu Apr 10, 2008 1:21 pm UTC

Ah, killing peasants...
Volumes could be writen on that subject.
My current preferred method is to simply send them to my obsidian making pit. The look on their faces when the floodgates close around them and lava starts to rain down from above is priceless...
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Thu Apr 10, 2008 2:58 pm UTC

So.. fuck adamantine.

While I'm sure the metal is cool and all, Demons in the Depths killed 82 of my 90 dwarves.

I've got 7 kids left.

...

Holy fucking shit they're vicious little buggers.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Vaniver » Thu Apr 10, 2008 5:29 pm UTC

That's what you get for delving too greedily and too deep!
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby FACM » Thu Apr 10, 2008 6:09 pm UTC

OK, with the help of the more-awesome-than-anticipated wiki, I managed to get a fortress started. I'm apparently building rooms at random as the urge rises, but I think thats OK for now.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Upsilon » Fri Apr 11, 2008 11:05 pm UTC

I just got into this, and am slowly learning how things work.

I did not foresee every water source drying up during the summer, though.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby FACM » Sat Apr 12, 2008 1:09 am UTC

I am spending far too much time on this game. After my first fort hit ~70 dwarves and 30 animals roaming my sculpture garden, i decided i needed to get back to schoolwork by mining into the nearby lake. I hope this slows them down enough.

Gah! One dwarf is trying to have a party mid-flood, and another wave of immigrants is walking in. Where did these dwarves get their priorities?

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Benitosimies » Sat Apr 12, 2008 2:02 am UTC

FACM wrote:Gah! One dwarf is trying to have a party mid-flood, and another wave of immigrants is walking in. Where did these dwarves get their priorities?


When they drink they only ever drink booze. They're constantly really, really wasted on Mushroom Wine.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby AKAnotu » Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:04 am UTC

I can't tear myself away from this game....

Question: how does farming work?
should I make a farm when it's muddy, then plant?
should I make a farm, make it muddy, then plant?
should I make it muddy, make a farm, then plant?
should I make a farm, Plant, then water?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:10 am UTC

If you can build a farm, there's no reason to make it muddy. Mud's only needed for stone, where you cannot build a farm.

In order to use fertilizer (which apparently increases your yield, not that I have a problem with it really) you need to first build an Wood Furnace and make some ashes, then an Ashery to make Potash from Ash, then select the field and tell them to Fertilize it.

Though, in my experience an 5x5 unfertilized field in sandy loam (or even sand, or clay, or anything really) growing Plump Helmets year round produces enough edible material/brewable material to keep your dwarves drunk and fed. Extra fields can be used for more plump helmets to cook them into fancy meals, or to make the other plants.

If a field's somehow partially exposed and partially subterranean, you'll be able to select from the list of all plant types, but the dwarves will only plant on the appropriate squares. So you end up using only part of the field.... so, it's best to make sure they're completely exposed to sunlight or completely subterranean.

I believe in the future irrigation will be necessary, but as of now it's not.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby AKAnotu » Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:14 am UTC

thanks. Also, can dwarves walk over stone drop traps? or pressure plates?
also, my current fortress is in a mountain, with some light forest. would irrigation be a better choice if i wanted to conserve wood?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:18 am UTC

Friendlies never set off traps as near as I can tell (as I usually have a long hallway of stone drop or cage traps on my entrance to which caravans just stroll right on by) and as for pressure plates... it all depends on how you set them. You can set them to trigger for your dwarves, or not, or by animals, or not, or just by fluid.. or.. not.

They're the most programmable ones, and the ideal things to keep a large water pool always mostly full.. if you set them up right. First time I tried that, I somehow set them up backwards so.. the gates were set to close when the water level was 0 and stay open.. especially if the water level was 7.

I believe they call that AFF - Another Flooded Fortress.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby AKAnotu » Sun Apr 13, 2008 3:21 am UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Friendlies never set off traps as near as I can tell (as I usually have a long hallway of stone drop or cage traps on my entrance to which caravans just stroll right on by) and as for pressure plates... it all depends on how you set them. You can set them to trigger for your dwarves, or not, or by animals, or not, or just by fluid.. or.. not.

They're the most programmable ones, and the ideal things to keep a large water pool always mostly full.. if you set them up right. First time I tried that, I somehow set them up backwards so.. the gates were set to close when the water level was 0 and stay open.. especially if the water level was 7.

I believe they call that AFF - Another Flooded Fortress.

I'm just going to do a simple reservoir, two floodgates, one on each end, one end to the field, one to the river
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Vaniver » Sun Apr 13, 2008 9:27 pm UTC

AKAnotu, find someplace with soil of some sort, and just plant there. Not having to deal with irrigation is just so much nicer.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Numquam » Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:06 am UTC

I need some ideas for a crazy dwarven engineering project. Anyone?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Apr 14, 2008 2:39 am UTC

Self-powered waterfall machine. Transports water as high as possible, drops it down to the bottom of the tower, rinse, repeat. Since I think evaporation might occur during the fall, might need to rig up a way for water to flow in every now and again.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Upsilon » Mon Apr 14, 2008 2:47 am UTC

So after my first fortress died of thirst, I made a new one right next to a major river. Unfortunately, it also has three "levels" of aquifers, and I have not found any type of stone yet.

You'd be surprised how much it sucks without a mason or mechanic.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Apr 14, 2008 3:11 am UTC

If the Biome freezes, then in winter you can tunnel down through the water (as soon as you expose it, it becomes Ice) in 5x5 chunks.. build wood (or Ice) walls in a 9x9 square with a staircase in the center to get down to the creemy nougat of stone below.

Still, it's rough to deal with it.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Vaniver » Mon Apr 14, 2008 1:23 pm UTC

Upsilon wrote:So after my first fortress died of thirst, I made a new one right next to a major river. Unfortunately, it also has three "levels" of aquifers, and I have not found any type of stone yet.

You'd be surprised how much it sucks without a mason or mechanic.
Dying of thirst should be 'running out of booze,' not 'ran out of water' (since, for some strange reason, booze doesn't take water to make).
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Upsilon » Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:40 am UTC

My Cook got possessed and now wants a shell. Unfortunately, I don't know how to obtain shells. And I don't want any of my dwarves to die yet.

Help?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby 4=5 » Tue Apr 15, 2008 2:53 am UTC

catch a turtle and prepare it for eating in the fishery, and then have a dwarf eat it. (don't prepare it in the kitchen, that leaves no shell)
(fisherdwarf and Fish cleaner skills respectively)

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby integral » Tue Apr 15, 2008 5:16 am UTC

If you can't get shell readily, like within 3 months, just build another kitchen and train another guy. Not worth the effort to micromanage in hopes of getting shell just so your cook can go on a rampage.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Kag » Tue Apr 15, 2008 11:50 am UTC

4=5 wrote:catch a turtle and prepare it for eating in the fishery, and then have a dwarf eat it. (don't prepare it in the kitchen, that leaves no shell)
(fisherdwarf and Fish cleaner skills respectively)


Interesting side note: It's impossible to fail at this. You can literally pour water onto a random cave square and fish turtles out of it.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Xaddak » Wed Apr 16, 2008 6:37 pm UTC

How's this for a superproject:

I'm living on a mountain right now. My fortress entrance is carved into a valley wall in a corner of the map on level 145. The peak of the mountain is on level 168, in the opposite corner of the map. Quite a lot of the mountain has forests on it. I intend to dig out entire layers at a time, collapse them via support/lever, and slowly, layer by layer, turn the mountain into a flat plain. Well, almost flat: I have a volcano as well, and I am going to leave it intact as the new peak two or three layers above the plain.

Two legendary miners going at the first layer now.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Wed Apr 16, 2008 7:00 pm UTC

Drop the whole thing at once. Bonus points if you do it during a goblin invasion. Because dropping a mountain on an invading army is hardcore.

I guess.


Anyway, based on prior accidental experience, a falling block of land will mostly retain it's shape upon impact with the ground. And squish the miner underneath it (whoops!)

Point being... I'm curious to see if constructed blocks do the same thing. My plan is to assemble a series of walls suspended a Z level or two above a river in the exact shape of said river to see if, when I drop the whole thing, it dams the river completely.

If anyone knows offhand if this works or doesn't, let me know.. but I'm going to try it.
Spoiler:

Code: Select all

 River Level
..................
............I.....
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈...
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈≈
...............≈≈≈
..................
..................

A few Z levels up, directly above river

                 +
             00000
             00000
             00000
             00000

And I'm hoping that when I knock out the support...


..................
..................
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈00000     ...
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈00000
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈00000
≈≈≈≈≈≈≈00000
...............
..................
..................

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Xaddak » Wed Apr 16, 2008 9:45 pm UTC

Can a support be stacked on top of a support on top of a support and so on? If not, very little point in me trying to drop the entire thing at once, as it will fall down on my miners instead of onto a rough rock support.

In other news, two legendary siege operators with catapults on autofire clear out stone right quick.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:17 am UTC

Well, a support can have a floor on top that can have a support that can have a floor that can have a support and so on. If you link a lever to all the supports.......

Yes, it's a lot of mechanisms, but it's not like stone's gonna be hard to come by. And you only need one support per level.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Upsilon » Thu Apr 17, 2008 3:24 am UTC

I was going to buy stone from the merchants, but they didn't bring it. Guess I'll have to wait for winter to dig for stone...

Or just give up and start a new fortress.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Xaddak » Thu Apr 17, 2008 5:08 pm UTC

I had to do that when I had a map with an aquifer layer. No stone above it, so I couldn't make pumps to clear out even a small part of it. I needed stone to get past the aquifer where all the stone was.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SoapyHobo » Thu Apr 17, 2008 5:20 pm UTC

Finally, after a year of mining platinum, I've found magnetite! No more precious metal well-chains!
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby jamesmcm » Sat Apr 19, 2008 4:53 pm UTC

I tried to play this game beofre but it was really complicated and the UI didn't help.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Apr 21, 2008 4:36 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Mad plan to dam a river via suspended constructed walls

Didn't work. Just crashed through the top layer of the brook and reduced itself back to it's component parts - that is, loose stone.

In other news for that fortress.. I was going to zip it up and provide it for download in another year or two, after I cleaned up a lot of loose stone and got my greenhouse working. And with 130 some odd dwarves running around, it wouldn't have taken too long. This place had it all.. lava, sand a few Z levels up for glassmaking, a chasm, a piece of water that technically was an underground pool so I had a tower-cap farm going.. I even have an execution chamber, for those goblins and such I get with my cage traps...

Unfortunately, I wasn't paying attention and caused a massive cave-in.

That took out floors in my entire fortress..straight down, at least six levels. Killed 15 dwarves total.

...

Yeah, the whole place errupted in an orgy of insantity and bezerk behaviors. I think there's 30 dwarves left. And some of those are in danger of going mad. If I get a new influx of migrants before they lose it and my fortress fails, I can recover, but if not......
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby integral » Tue Apr 22, 2008 2:55 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Unfortunately, I wasn't paying attention and caused a massive cave-in.


Oh, I did that on purpose. One lever. Eight supports. And one dwarf. Oh me yarm. Lagged my computer for three minutes, but at least I achieved a gaping hole in the ground where my fortress was. The shockwave also knocked some marauding goblins unconscious where my baboon killed them.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:14 pm UTC

When you do it on purpose, it's awesome because only the people you want are in the way.

When it happens on accident...

In other news, after falling as low as 14 dwarves, the most recent migration wave brought me back to 35. With a new Tax Collector, Hammerer, and this fortress's first Philosopher to go along with the Count and Countess that already lived there. And my only remaining miner was elected Mayor... which is odd, as now he refuses to mine. He's content, but running around with No Job and a pick in hand, with plenty of mining to be done (I need crypts, damn you Mayor!)

So, I .. uh.. cheated a little with Dwarf Foreman and put my Philosopher and nobles to work. My Philosopher is now my only miner, my Count and his Consort are engaging in glassmaking, while the Tax Collector is a simple hauler.

I leave the Hammerer alone. Because that guy's hardcore.
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Ended » Tue Apr 22, 2008 3:45 pm UTC

integral wrote:The shockwave also knocked some marauding goblins unconscious where my baboon killed them.

This sentence makes me want to learn how to play this game.

Is the learning curve as steep as it appears?
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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby FACM » Tue Apr 22, 2008 4:01 pm UTC

If you've never looked at the official web page, you should. The scope he intends to cover with the game is slightly crazy. We're playing a game about halfway to being called Release 2, and he's planning on 6 releases or so. The bug list also contains some awesome bugs[current favorite: maruading goblins don't attack, but that's been fixed].

And yes, the learning curve is steep. But figuring out how to do things is half the fun.

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Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:32 pm UTC

Ended wrote:
integral wrote:The shockwave also knocked some marauding goblins unconscious where my baboon killed them.

This sentence makes me want to learn how to play this game.

Is the learning curve as steep as it appears?


Yes. Here's what I recommend learning how to do, in more or less order.

1. Mine a few Z-levels. Learn how to make stone doors, blocks, and wooden beds, bins, and barrels. Bins and Barrels are invaluable. Bins won't seem that useful until #3. Then you're see just how sweet they are when you're trying to move 400 items to the trade depot. Figure out how to make rooms - dining rooms, offices, and so on. Figure out zones as well... I like making the entrance a meeting area just so there's always dwarves/animals wandering around there to catch any thieves or snatchers that might try to sneak in.
2. Get food/alcohol production up. Don't worry about making other crop products, for now just make everything in to food. Learn cooking and brewing. Understand for yourself just how useless Fisherdwarves are for anything beyond fishing... don't get me wrong, fresh fish is wonderful and it's a good idea to have a fisher or two.. just don't expect them to do anything BUT fish. Ever.
3. Figure out stockpiles - what's best to mix together, what's best to separate out, how granular you need to make them... this really depends on your playstyle. If you do minifortresses connected via long tunnels, you'll want many small specific stockpiles. If you do one massive structure, you'll probably one a few large stockpiles that basically take in all of certain types..
(For example, if you want your Forging community set up far away from the entrance and your Craftsmen right at the entrance, and you don't want them to have to ever leave the immediate area, you'll make a small dining room and food stockpile near your forges, as well as bedrooms for them, and the same thing over by your craftsmen and the crafts shop)
4. Figure out moods. Most moods that I've seen need a Craftsdwarfshop. But really, any just about workshop can be required. If you have a dwarf get possessed or taken by a fey mood, and they seem to just wander around, check your workshops and see what you're missing, and build any that do not exist.. the dwarf should claim one of the new shops. I say just about as I've never seen an Ashery, a Dyer's Shop, or an Alchemist Shop claimed. By the same token, this is when you figure out that it's always a good idea to take a couple of gems, some leather, some cloth, some thread, and some turtles along with you when you embark... - in case someone gets possessed early on and needs shells and leather, you won't be up a creek and facing a possible berserk dwarf in a few days.
5. Get some Stonecrafting and Mechanics going. Learn how to trade (stonecrafting's useful for this, as you rarely have a shortage of stone) and how to make and transfer power around your fortress. Learn how to transfer power up and down Z levels. Learn how to create a Well with a refillable reservoir. Make it drainable, either with floodgates or floor hatches hooked to levers (just in case someone gets suicidal and leaps into your drinking water supply). Leave a bit open for fishing. Bonus Points - create a waterfall in your large well room that's self-powering (Water Wheels + Mechanisms + Screw Pumps + Multiple Z-Level Patterns = Happy Dwarves)
6. Figure out the whole Military thing with guards and drafted dwarves.
7. Figure out Trapmaking - stone drop traps are the easiest to operate, Cage traps being the second.. some of the others require pressure plates or levers to control the action.
8. Learn to anticipate who might be showing up on the next migration wave. If you've got 35+ dwarves and no Dungeon Master, go ahead and get the rooms ready for them. Generally speaking, Nobles need an Office, a Bedroom, a Dining Room, and Dungeon Masters, Barons, and their Consort, and the King/Queen and their consort require tombs as well.


Others might disagree with my order, but I think it's a useful place to start.

Just remember DF's motto - Losing Is Fun.

As tragic as it is when a fortress falls into a chain reaction of depression and homicidal behavior.. it's also pretty damn funny.
heuristically_alone wrote:I want to write a DnD campaign and play it by myself and DM it myself.
heuristically_alone wrote:I have been informed that this is called writing a book.

Ended
Posts: 1459
Joined: Fri Apr 20, 2007 3:27 pm UTC
Location: The Tower of Flints. (Also known as: England.)

Re: You gotta get into Dwarf Fortress if you haven't already.

Postby Ended » Tue Apr 22, 2008 5:51 pm UTC

Awesome, thanks for the pointers, very helpful. I've just started Star Control II so it might be a while until I make a serious attempt at playing, but it'll definitely happen.
Generally I try to make myself do things I instinctively avoid, in case they are awesome.
-dubsola


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