Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

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Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby JustinSane80 » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:30 am UTC

With the release of the new Battlefield game, Battlefield: Bad Company, Electronic Arts is once again trying to masticate over the consumer. The $60 retail version of the game will have ten weapons that are not included in the game. You can, however, buy the $70 "Gold Edition" and recieve access to five of these weapons. That still leaves five weapons unaccounted for. The only way that you can gain the privilege to use these weapons is to purchase them as downloadable content.

I, for one, think that is is an outrageous attempt to nickel-and-dime the comsumer. When this game is released, do not buy it. This is the only way that EA (and other developers) will learn that its' customers will not fall for their ploy. This is a clear sign of EA testing the waters to see just how much gamers will put up with, and this is where I draw the line.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Kag » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:50 am UTC

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby semicolon » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:35 am UTC

Korean MMOs have been doing this shit forever. I doubt it'll go over very well with US audiences, but who knows. It'll be interesting to watch, if anything.

EDIT: Also, directing people to read the rules even though this is a legitimate, well-thought out thread is kind of ridiculous. Especially because you quoted the entire thing.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Dr. Canadian Ninja » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:38 am UTC

JustinSane80 wrote:I, for one, think that is is an outrageous attempt to nickel-and-dime the comsumer. When this game is released, do not buy it. This is the only way that EA (and other developers) will learn that its' customers will not fall for their ploy. This is a clear sign of EA testing the waters to see just how much gamers will put up with, and this is where I draw the line.


See, the hilariously sad part of this is that it's going to work.

See the successful hack and slash game Dynasty Warriors series by KOEI. They release, for arbritrary number purposes, Dynasty Warriors 5. $60. Later, they release Dynasty Warriors 5: Xtreme Legends, which has new ultimate weapons, different stages, and in some cases, new characters. $40. Then a bit later they release Dynasty Warriors 5: Empires, which puts a strategic twist on the game. $60.

And what does that tell them when fans are spending $160 for the full game?

That they'll do it again for Dynasty Warriors 6.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Serrin » Mon Mar 31, 2008 8:23 am UTC

That's why I get my Dynasty Warriors fix a year late, and for ten dollar a disc at used game stores. There's a difference though. If I buy Dynasty Warriors 5, I can run around with Lu Bu's super halberd thing and just own everyone. The guy who bought Dynasty Warriors 5 Super Platinum Edition can't hop into my game and crush me with his M1A1 tank.

Are you serious, DW5 was $60 new? I could've sworn standard new price was fifty.

Battlefield: Bad Company is going to deliberately unbalance the gaming environment in order to squeeze money out of people. That strikes me as worse than just offering little content for high prices.

Last time I checked, Korean MMOs didn't do so hot over here on this side of civilization. I can only hope that means BF:BC tanks just as hard.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Bruce » Mon Mar 31, 2008 11:32 am UTC

Don't know about others, but I stopped buying EA games a long time ago.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Mar 31, 2008 12:16 pm UTC

Kag wrote:*ahem*


Report function. Use it. Seriously, it's wonderful. Use it.

Actually, lemme rephrase that.

Report function. Use it. Seriously, it's wonderful. Use it.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Dr. Canadian Ninja » Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:41 pm UTC

Serrin wrote:That's why I get my Dynasty Warriors fix a year late, and for ten dollar a disc at used game stores. There's a difference though. If I buy Dynasty Warriors 5, I can run around with Lu Bu's super halberd thing and just own everyone. The guy who bought Dynasty Warriors 5 Super Platinum Edition can't hop into my game and crush me with his M1A1 tank.

Are you serious, DW5 was $60 new? I could've sworn standard new price was fifty.

Battlefield: Bad Company is going to deliberately unbalance the gaming environment in order to squeeze money out of people. That strikes me as worse than just offering little content for high prices.


Could've been, but I'm used to 360 prices now. I do roughly the same thing you do of buying it at a point where it's at least half price. But my rationale here is that if people are willing to pay quite a lot for a little more content, it's probably not a far stretch to say people are likely to pay more for said overpowered weapons.

I don't like it much either, but I still get that sad feeling that this is likely going to have a chance at succeeding.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Mar 31, 2008 1:49 pm UTC

Dr. Canadian Ninja wrote:
Serrin wrote:...If I buy Dynasty Warriors 5, I can run around with Lu Bu's super halberd thing and just own everyone. The guy who bought Dynasty Warriors 5 Super Platinum Edition can't hop into my game and crush me with his M1A1 tank....
...But my rationale here is that if people are willing to pay quite a lot for a little more content, it's probably not a far stretch to say people are likely to pay more for said overpowered weapons.


You know.. they really aren't wanting me to play multiplayer games, are they? First, there's games with no kind of ranking system (Counterstrike, Warcraft II) so that if I hop in a random one I either absolutely crush the AFK guy, or get my face stomped so hard and so fast that I learn nothing from the experience other than I suck.

And that's people using skill, not rocket-launchers firing chainsaws that shoot laserbeams and in each laserbeam is a tiny rabid elf.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:14 pm UTC

Dr. Canadian Ninja wrote:
JustinSane80 wrote:I, for one, think that is is an outrageous attempt to nickel-and-dime the comsumer. When this game is released, do not buy it. This is the only way that EA (and other developers) will learn that its' customers will not fall for their ploy. This is a clear sign of EA testing the waters to see just how much gamers will put up with, and this is where I draw the line.


See, the hilariously sad part of this is that it's going to work.

See the successful hack and slash game Dynasty Warriors series by KOEI. They release, for arbritrary number purposes, Dynasty Warriors 5. $60. Later, they release Dynasty Warriors 5: Xtreme Legends, which has new ultimate weapons, different stages, and in some cases, new characters. $40. Then a bit later they release Dynasty Warriors 5: Empires, which puts a strategic twist on the game. $60.

And what does that tell them when fans are spending $160 for the full game?

That they'll do it again for Dynasty Warriors 6.

You forgot the part where they released Dynasty Warriors. Then they added a few more on-screen enemies and called it Dynasty Warriors 2. Repeat for a few more games.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Azrael001 » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:28 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
Dr. Canadian Ninja wrote:
Serrin wrote:...If I buy Dynasty Warriors 5, I can run around with Lu Bu's super halberd thing and just own everyone. The guy who bought Dynasty Warriors 5 Super Platinum Edition can't hop into my game and crush me with his M1A1 tank....
...But my rationale here is that if people are willing to pay quite a lot for a little more content, it's probably not a far stretch to say people are likely to pay more for said overpowered weapons.


You know.. they really aren't wanting me to play multiplayer games, are they? First, there's games with no kind of ranking system (Counterstrike, Warcraft II) so that if I hop in a random one I either absolutely crush the AFK guy, or get my face stomped so hard and so fast that I learn nothing from the experience other than I suck.

And that's people using skill, not rocket-launchers firing chainsaws that shoot laserbeams and in each laserbeam is a tiny rabid elf.


Halo 3's ranking system is pretty good. This is irrelevant if you are a PC gamer though. I don't know if there is an equivalent for PC. You also have got to like Halo.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby johnie104 » Mon Mar 31, 2008 2:55 pm UTC

JustinSane80 wrote:The $60 retail version of the game will have ten weapons that are not included in the game


So if you buy the 'normal' edition you don't have any weapons at all... Then how do you play?
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Serrin » Mon Mar 31, 2008 3:53 pm UTC

The game has X weapons. If you pay a billion dollars, you get all X. If you buy the deluxe version, you get X-5, and if you buy the regular version, you get X-10.

X = 11, and the one weapon you get in the normal edition is the Combat Beard Trimmer.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby lowbart » Mon Mar 31, 2008 4:57 pm UTC

I assume there's not really a beard trimmer, but do you really only get one weapon in the base game?

Well, I wouldn't have bought it anyway.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Clumpy » Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:32 pm UTC

I'm not a fan of microtransactions. My only exception is the rare occasion where the original game had more than enough content, but they add more for the consumer - content that enhances the experience at a reasonable price. Halo 2 would be an example - those new maps were decent for people sick of the maps already included with the original game.

But anybody who thinks that I'm paying $2 per song for Rock Band tracks is out of their mind. Unless they somehow license The Aquabats for the thing.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby b.i.o » Mon Mar 31, 2008 5:45 pm UTC

lowbart wrote:I assume there's not really a beard trimmer, but do you really only get one weapon in the base game?

Well, I wouldn't have bought it anyway.


...

It was a simple example.

There will be a certain number of basic weapons in the game--plenty enough to be a game on their own, I should think. The deluxe edition will add 5 more weapons that are probably special in some way or another. Then there will be 5 more weapons which are downloadable.

My intuition is that the special weapons are going to be novelty items, and that you'll be able to play the game fine without them, and that it should be balanced whether you have them or not. We wiill see, however.

Personally, I have CS: Source, TF2, and CoD4--they won't be pulling me away from those anytime soon no matter what.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Benitosimies » Mon Mar 31, 2008 6:41 pm UTC

I had no plans to buy this anyway so I'll get right on that boycott. (Just got into bioshock kinda).

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Otis » Mon Mar 31, 2008 9:31 pm UTC

Benitosimies wrote: They're not going to ass me over. (Seriously, what was that three-character swear?)


Poo? Poo is a swear, right?

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby lasercannon » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:37 am UTC

Two words: Horse armor.

Anyway, I doubt having downloadable weapons will have that much of an effect on gameplay. Bad Company is, after all, an FPS, and all things considered, the power of any given gun doesn't matter very much. A good example of this can be seen in Call of duty 4, where every gun can basically kill you in under a second. The downloadable guns in Bad Company will obviously be mariginally better, but when kills are measured in milliseconds, does it really matter?

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Kag » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:59 am UTC

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Rodan » Tue Apr 01, 2008 1:16 am UTC

Kag wrote:
SecondTalon wrote:Report function. Use it. Seriously, it's wonderful. Use it.


I describe myself as "blind and retarded" for a reason. This is that reason.

Wow, I've never noticed that little button before.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby aion7 » Tue Apr 01, 2008 5:21 am UTC

I wasn't planning on buying this anyway.

Battlefield: Heroes, on the other hand, well, I'm technically not going to buy that...
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby zenten » Tue Apr 01, 2008 6:15 pm UTC

I don't see why you would get outraged about this. It's a crappy, overpriced product. Just refrain from buying it like most of the other video games out there. But I don't see why you would care if anyone else buys it.

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Re: Microtransaction and Bonus Content : Good or Bad?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:03 pm UTC

So.. again, to make sure I'm understanding this correctly..

Game ships with X weapons. For some extra cash, you can get X+5 weapons, and for more extra cash you can get X+10.

Yeah, provided it's actually balanced, I don't see a problem.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby semicolon » Tue Apr 01, 2008 7:28 pm UTC

zenten wrote:But I don't see why you would care if anyone else buys it.

Because the more money it makes, the more common the business model (which he disagrees with) will become.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Serrin » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:38 pm UTC

ST: I think the whole concern is that it won't be balanced. The special weapons probably won't be "I win" buttons, but they will likely be superior to anything else. That's the only reason anybody would buy them, I think. You may recall BF2142 had a "special" gun that you got for preordering from Best Buy, or something. The only reason it didn't cause any ripples is because it was the exact same as the default gun, it just looked different. And as a result, nobody cared, and so I doubt it spurred many extra sales at all.

I'm currently imagining a dystopian future where you have to rent guns by the week, buy bullets with real money, and every three days upgrade to another incrementally better whole gear loadout. It'll be just like a Korean MMO. And if we ever get to that point, it's going to be step by moneygrubbing step.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 01, 2008 9:48 pm UTC

I could see them being different and still not be unbalancing.. faster rate of fire but reduced accuracy/damage, large damage but horrific reload rate, that sort of thing...

But, yeah, like someone else in this thread said, it's an experiment. Personally, I'm not willing to pay more than $50 for a game ever, and I consider the Battlefield line to be meh at best (I mean, the most fun I had was in the Desert Combat mod for 1942) so I have zero interest here. Looking at other games (Neverwinter Nights, Garry's Mod and other such cheapies from Steam, Oblivion) the microtransaction is something I'm enjoying so far. At least, in this case where Microtransaction is defined as FinalPrice<$10.

But I can see the bad side of that approaching, where an RTS game ships with 5 maps and one player race for $35 new (which sounds like a bargain), with the other races, campaigns, and Multiplayer Map Packs being $2-$5 each, bringing the total cost to the neighborhood of $60 or more. Basically meaning you're paying $35 for a really nice demo and need to pay an additional $25-35 to get the actual game.

And yeah, some company's going to try that. So far, I've not seen a game (other than some MMOs) try to do that.. but it's coming. My only hope is that it's first tried (and fails) on some no-name title. But I have a feeling it'll happen on Command & Conquer 10: The Greenspan Wars or something
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby no-genius » Sun Apr 06, 2008 4:53 pm UTC

teh wiki wrote:The Battlefield Bad Company Beta contains 20 locked guns, 10 can be unlocked through playing the game, while 5 of the other 10 will be unlocked in free promotions before and after release. The remaining 5 unlockable weapons will only be made available through purchase of the Gold Edition of the game or purchase via Xbox Live.


You get 10 weapons, you get another 5 free, and you have to pay for the remaining five (or not). Jeez.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby FACM » Sun Apr 06, 2008 8:46 pm UTC

Converse to the 'its not fair if paid weapons are better than the free ones' idea is the 'if I'm paying for them they should be better' idea. I won't pay for a machine gun with slightly faster reloads or a slightly larger clip. I WILL pay for a cannon that shoots angry bears that are on fire.

Despite the above, I don't like the idea either. I like the idea of modular content if it's fair, cheap, relevant, and relatively fast. Oblivion got fair and cheap [Armor for my horses? In a single player game? A month after I've done most everything I wanted to do?]. Battlefield here seems to be getting relevant and fast [can't get much faster than 'at launch']. Are there any games that get them all at once?

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Miles Invictus » Mon Apr 07, 2008 6:41 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:But I can see the bad side of that approaching, where an RTS game ships with 5 maps and one player race for $35 new (which sounds like a criminally bad purchase), with the other races, campaigns, and Multiplayer Map Packs being $2-$5 each, bringing the total cost to the neighborhood of $60 or more. Basically meaning you're paying $35 for a really nice demo and need to pay an additional $25-35 to get the actual game.


Fixed. Good lord, what games do you play? I'm generously assuming that's an entire single-player campaign, and I still think that's an unreasonably high price.

FACM wrote:Converse to the 'its not fair if paid weapons are better than the free ones' idea is the 'if I'm paying for them they should be better' idea. I won't pay for a machine gun with slightly faster reloads or a slightly larger clip. I WILL pay for a cannon that shoots angry bears that are on fire.


I refuse to play games that force me to purchase features to remain competitive.

Despite the above, I don't like the idea either. I like the idea of modular content if it's fair, cheap, relevant, and relatively fast. Oblivion got fair and cheap [Armor for my horses? In a single player game? A month after I've done most everything I wanted to do?]. Battlefield here seems to be getting relevant and fast [can't get much faster than 'at launch']. Are there any games that get them all at once?


I am perfectly fine with selling versatility, as long as the playing field is relatively level. The Guild Wars series does a good job of this -- each expansion adds new classes and skills, but players can be reasonably effective even if they have only one campaign. That's the ideal model, I think...and to be honest, that's what I expect to happen with Bad Company.

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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Apr 07, 2008 7:05 pm UTC

Miles Invictus wrote:
SecondTalon wrote:But I can see the bad side of that approaching, where an RTS game ships with 5 maps and one player race for $35 new (which sounds like a criminally bad purchase), with the other races, campaigns, and Multiplayer Map Packs being $2-$5 each, bringing the total cost to the neighborhood of $60 or more. Basically meaning you're paying $35 for a really nice demo and need to pay an additional $25-35 to get the actual game.
Fixed. Good lord, what games do you play? I'm generously assuming that's an entire single-player campaign, and I still think that's an unreasonably high price.
I don't know of any games that do that yet. I can see some company trying it. Assuming it's someone with a respected line (C&C, for example.) I could see it somewhat working well enough to convince developers/publishers that This Is A Good IdeaTM.

This will, obviously, end badly for the developers and likely put them in dire financial straights. Which will allow EA to purchase said developers.

Which is why I figure C&C would be the game to do this. Decent enough fanbase, operated by EA so even if they lose money on it they aren't that bad off.. and if it works as I described, it nets them a crapload more game companies. And as we all know, nothing excites EA more than purchasing companies, firing everyone who made the company what it was (or at least making conditions so bad that they quit) and butchering the properties they now own.


As far as the Battlefield Game goes, the literature I've read suggests that the Premium Weapons are balanced for multiplayer. What differentiates them from the regular weapons... I don't know. I presume it's minor tweaks as I suggested above... faster rate of fire + lower accuracy, stronger punch + smaller clip + longer reload time, that sort of thing.
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Re: Boycott "Battlefield: Bad Company"

Postby Endless Mike » Mon Apr 07, 2008 8:57 pm UTC

Keep in mind this is also coming from the company releasing a FREE game with purchasable non-game-changing "upgrades." If you don't want to play Bad Company, wait for Heroes and call it a day.


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