best game developer of all time

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best game developer of all time

Postby SOSkanesumi ARK » Mon Apr 27, 2009 5:14 am UTC

Who, in your opinion, is the greatest game developer/publisher of all time? I'd have to say, statistically, its Nintendo(I am a Sega fanboy, but i can admit this), however personally, even though I hate Sony, i'd say that Polyphony Digital is the greatest game maker of all time, its made the greatest racing game series ever(in my opinion only), a s i feel the Gran Torismo series is flawless, as well as Tourist trophy, the motorcycle version-esqe. And if there has been a thread made like this, I am sorry for wasting time and space.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Jahoclave » Mon Apr 27, 2009 5:29 am UTC

Alexey Pajitnov, shut the fuck up. This discussion is over.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Amnesiasoft » Mon Apr 27, 2009 7:50 am UTC

"bob"






On a more serious note. From a purely technical standpoint, I'd go with Lionhead. I'm still impressed at how good Black & White 2 looks, and it runs just fine on a GeForce FX 5500. Can't say the same for Crysis. You'd think they could win this cause I consider them the greatest game programming team of all time and have one of the greatest game developers ever, at least at some point he was, yet something just doesn't quite work out.

As for some completely objectively subjective opinion here, Double Fine. I don't care if they've only released one game.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby el_loco_avs » Mon Apr 27, 2009 11:57 am UTC

Valve and Blizzard. Though both are fairly young, both are extraordinary in their support of modding and older games respectively.

And their games are also kickass.



Team ICO. Fairly new though.



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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Toeofdoom » Mon Apr 27, 2009 12:29 pm UTC

I agree strongly with el_loco, but add double fine and 2D boy to the list as single game list entries.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Tomo » Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:04 pm UTC

Slightly agree with el_loco.

Team Ico certainly has the highest success rate with 100% of their games being perfect. But they only made two games. Mistwalker are also exceptional for a new studio.

Valve and Blizzard deserve a mention for their community support.

As for the greatest game developer ever? I'd probably have to go with Rare. Their domination of the N64-era was incredible, pumping out star game after star game in any genre they tried. Fps? Goldeneye + Perfect Dark. Racing? Diddy Kong. TPS? Jet Force Gemini. Platformer? Banjo Kazooie. Comedy? Conkers. All Out Chaos? Blast Corps.

I won't even say anything about combat amphibians.

While other companies might have taken the limelight in a specific category; i.e. Valve with their FPS or Blizzard with their RTS, I've never looked forward to a new release as much as I did the latest Rare game back then.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:14 pm UTC

I'd have to say Blizzard from an objective view point, their success is undeniable and they consistently put out awesome and complete games and they listen to their fanbase.

However my favorite games are from Atlus and Namco/Bandai with a bit of Square/Enix/Square-Enix/tri-Ace thrown in.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby headprogrammingczar » Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:16 pm UTC

See my sig. Being able to organize such a huge overhaul of HL2 without any monetary compensation is impressive by itself. Getting a good game out of it is even more impressive, especially considering they were having problems with not having a large enough team for quite a long time.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Naurgul » Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:22 pm UTC

Although Blizzard will no doubt be closed down in the future because they make their games intentionally addictive. :mrgreen:

Personally, on one hand I rather like Valve and Blizzard, representing this whole perfectionist iterative approach, they polish and streamline (although that latter could also be considered as 'dumbing-down') to death. On the other hand, I also like some new-ish indie developers, like Jonathan Blow and 2D Boy etc, representing this fast-prototyping, very innovative gameplay approach, they focus on gameplay and challenge the norms (game length just to mention an example).

Anyway, I think it's too soon to speak of this subject. In another 10 or 20 years, we'll probably be able to have some opinions that are in perspective. I say the medium is too young to judge such a thing; if we started discussing the criteria for such an award, we'd probably reach no conclusions at all.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Xaddak » Mon Apr 27, 2009 1:37 pm UTC

Well, strictly speaking, and just to be a smartass, we don't know the greatest game developer of ALL time yet, since all time hasn't happened yet.

That said, I'm not sure who I would go with. About the previous ones mentioned that I know of, Blizzard scores major points with me with Diablo II, StarCraft, and WarCraft I - III, but then add WoW to the stack, and consider that it has been like ten years since both Diablo II and StarCraft (yes, I know they both have sequels in development... finally) and it averages out to an underwhelming "meh". I like Valve, I liked HL2, I loved Portal, but I still don't know that they deserve a title as lofty as "the greatest". Nintendo? I loved Ocarina of Time, I loved Majora's Mask, Wind Waker was okay at best, Twilight Princess held my attention for a whole half hour or so before I got distracted by something with a matte finish. They have a bunch of cool games, but too many "meh" games (Warioware? Really? Why didn't they just make it in Flash?). It's easy to sell gold if, instead of carefully panning for it, you just scoop up the entire river and sell it piece by piece, and people are so excited that they MIGHT be getting gold that they'll buy all the mud you're selling, too.

I think CCP deserves at least an honorable mention for EVE Online. That game drives a lot of people away, but it is beautiful and has a depth and complexity to it unmatched by most games. Bay 12 rivals it in a single player game called Dwarf Fortress (which many people on this forum play, but I'm sure most don't) where you can take command of 7 dwarves and carve out a fortress where ever you like, and then you get to deal with immigrants, goblins, traders, monsters, accidentally flooding your own fort, etc. etc. It's a lot of fun. Honorable mentions at least for CCP and Bay 12, if not the grand prize.

I think the only way we're going to get around this is with genres or categories. Best MMO Developer, Best Single-Player RPG Developer, Best FPS Developer, etc.

So, in my humble opinion:

Best MMO Developer: CCP Games - EVE Online
I already said why EVE wins this one.
Best RPG Developer: Blizzard - Diablo II
I was gonna say Bethesda for Fallout 3, but they needed to polish that game for another few months or a year to get rid of all the bugs and weird quirks before release, and hire another three voice actors, thus doubling their voice actor pool (ZING!).
Best FPS Developer: DICE - Battlefield 2142
Have you played this game? It's the coolest shooter I've ever had the pleasure of playing.
Best RTS Developer: Relic - Dawn of War Dark Crusade
I wanted to say GPG for Supreme Commander, but that game had more problems than Fallout 3 and Oblivion combined. So I went with another favorite of mine.
Best Sim Developer: Bay 12 Games - Dwarf Fortress
Sorry, Bay 12 blows Maxis out of the water. Spore is Dwarf Fortress' retarded little brother. The gulf is like the difference between somebody with a room temperature IQ and River.

I'm sure that there are other categories I am missing. I'll edit this and add them if I feel like it.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SoapyHobo » Mon Apr 27, 2009 2:08 pm UTC

I'd definitely vote for id Software for Best FPS Developer. They invented the genre with Wolfenstein 3D, expanded upon it in Doom and brought us multiplayer deathmatch and huge amounts of community modding (along with most of the FPS' standard weapon set). They brought the genre to the realm of 3 dimensions with Quake and also improved multiplayer. And let's not forget their prowess at ever increasing graphical complexity over the years.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Midnight » Mon Apr 27, 2009 2:40 pm UTC

I'm gonna have to go with Blizzard, because for the past, what, ten-fifteen years, every single game they've released has hit critical acclaim. and though they might not be as profilic as some others, the fact that their track record is flawless since 1995 (when warcraft II and onwards came out) is pretty amazing.

i mean
wc2, wc2 beyond the dark portal, diablo, starcraft--now a national sport (i'm not sure but I think that's the only video game that's managed that)--SC: brood war, wc2 bnet edition, Diablo 2, Diablo 2: LoD, WC3, WC3 TFT, WoW (most popular MMO ever), burning crusade (most sales of a pc game in 24 hours), wrath of the lich king (most sales of a pc game in 24 hours again).

though Valve is impressive, the Halflife expansions weren't great, counterstrike neo wasn't great, I wasn't a fan of the Day of Defeats... so it's less... 100% amazing.
uhhhh fuck.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby TheOtherDOOMGuy » Mon Apr 27, 2009 8:33 pm UTC

Looking Glass.

They created the dark engine, then used it to make the first 2 theif games.
How can anything compare to that.

Then id Software.
I mean, really.
How many successes did they have in the day?
Wolfenstein, first ever 3D FPS.
Doom, first ever multiplayer FPS.
Quake, first ever hardware accelerated FPS.
And then they kinda mooched off their success with their following games....
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Amnesiasoft » Mon Apr 27, 2009 9:12 pm UTC

el_loco_avs wrote:Bullfrog.

That's kind of like my mention of Lionhead, since both companies were started by Molyneux.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Stormlock » Mon Apr 27, 2009 10:24 pm UTC

Microprose. May they RIP and not have their awesome titles raped for profit.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby headprogrammingczar » Mon Apr 27, 2009 10:54 pm UTC

Same goes for Rareware. Perfect Dark got completely fucked over when Rare went under.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:34 am UTC

Jahoclave wrote:Alexey Pajitnov, shut the fuck up. This discussion is over.

Yes sir.


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There's also the fact that Jahoclave is irrefutably correct.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby aion7 » Tue Apr 28, 2009 1:58 am UTC

Nobody said Capcom? Seriously?

Almost all of the best fighting games ever were made by Capcom. FACT.
Megaman.
Bionic Commando.
Resident Evil.
Viewtiful Joe.
And much, much more.



Valve, Id, Blizzard (I love SC, Diablo, Rock n Roll Racing and The Lost Vikings, but I'm not a big fan of the Warcraft series, especially WoW) and Nintendo are all cool too. Konami, also deserves praise for games like Castlevania and Contra. Also Treasure should get a spot for making many of the best shmups ever.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:06 am UTC

Nah, best shmups goto Team Shanghai Alice.
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- > No
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"Do you think games are silly little things?"
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby aion7 » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:23 am UTC

Debatable. Also, I said "many of the best", not "the best" or "all of the best".
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Rachel! » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:28 am UTC

aion7 wrote:I'm not a big fan of the Warcraft series, especially WoW)

Why not? Blizzard is a fantabulous company, and WoW is hands-down the most successful MMORPG in history. There are some who paradoxically feel that mass appeal detracts from a game. But it's just as stupid to hate something because everyone else likes it as it is to go along with the crowd "just because."

WoW > all

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby aion7 » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:36 am UTC

I dislike WoW for the same reasons I dislike most MMORPGs. Cost aside, it's very grind-y, the community is terrible, there's little variety of gameplay, the presentation is generic, and it forces grouping for much of the content.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:43 am UTC

So basically, you're like me.

I hate online games because they're online and force you to interact with people online. And people suck.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Rachel! » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:49 am UTC

go fuckin figure, you don't play a massive multiplayer online game if you don't like to interact with multiple players on a massive basis. That doesn't mean you can't objectively look at the game and how well it is doing.

The WoW community is excellent, the support for the game is excellent, active development is excellent, and they listen to their playerbase. The graphics are pretty snazzy, but still playable on older machines (mine is going on 4 and still trucking).

What else could you ask from a successful game? You're not its target audience, so recognize that when you analyze it. Call it a success because that's what it is.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby aion7 » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:58 am UTC

Rachel! wrote:go fuckin figure, you don't play a massive multiplayer online game if you don't like to interact with multiple players on a massive basis.

My point exactly. That's why I don't play WoW. Just because I'm "not a fan of it" (my original post, that you took issue with), doesn't mean I think it's absolutely awful and that there's no reason anyone should play it.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:13 am UTC

aion7 wrote:Debatable. Also, I said "many of the best", not "the best" or "all of the best".


Right, I just meant the "Best shmup developer" goes to them (or rather him). :-)
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"Do you admit there is no meaning to this world?"
- > No

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:27 am UTC

Rachel! wrote:go fuckin figure, you don't play a massive multiplayer online game if you don't like to interact with multiple players on a massive basis. That doesn't mean you can't objectively look at the game and how well it is doing.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:39 am UTC

Depends on what you mean by "Being Good", since that's pretty subjective... lets take an average of opinions...
"Give up here?"
- > No
"Do you accept defeat?"
- > No
"Do you think games are silly little things?"
- > No
"Is it all pointless?"
- > No
"Do you admit there is no meaning to this world?"
- > No

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SOSkanesumi ARK » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:39 am UTC

all this talk about blizzard and mmorpgs, well, i dont give a rats ass. i have never been able to be immersed into an rpg(exept forza and forza 2, and yes they are rpg's...sort of...dont judge me) so its all well and fine for you to like them,but are they really that great? my opinion, no. i still give it to ployphony digital.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby el_loco_avs » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:17 pm UTC

aion7 wrote:I dislike WoW for the same reasons I dislike most MMORPGs. Cost aside, it's very grind-y, the community is terrible, there's little variety of gameplay, the presentation is generic, and it forces grouping for much of the content.


Dislike for a genre shouldn't really influence the developer's rating.

Compared to other HUGE userbase games the WoW community was pretty great last time I saw (...about 2 years ago by now). There was enough variety of gameplay, their presentation is amazing imo. It's 5 years old but still doesn't really look dated. And the grouping for content is only needed for endgame content.

If you compare to EQ you can really see where Blizzard made such a difference.


And Blizzard would STILL be up here without WoW. Starcraft (overrated but good) is huge. Diablo series was revolutionary.
Dude. LOST VIKINGS and Blackthorne were when I started playing their games. They were already showing their creativity and polish back then.



SOSkanesumi ARK wrote:all this talk about blizzard and mmorpgs, well, i dont give a rats ass. i have never been able to be immersed into an rpg(exept forza and forza 2, and yes they are rpg's...sort of...dont judge me) so its all well and fine for you to like them,but are they really that great? my opinion, no. i still give it to ployphony digital.



I love GT but... the developer that has only one car "sim" that doesn't model damage or has no convincing AI?
I mean, their driving model absolutely owns but other than that and the presentation... they're still lacklustre. I only really enjoy multiplayer GT.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby el_loco_avs » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:23 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
Jahoclave wrote:Alexey Pajitnov, shut the fuck up. This discussion is over.

Yes sir.


Lock'd



I fucking hate lists threads. Enough to make a joke about locking it.

There's also the fact that Jahoclave is irrefutably correct.



Tetris...

and...

what? that's it? :wink:
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby bigstrat2003 » Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:38 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:There's also the fact that Jahoclave is irrefutably correct.


He'd be irrefutably correct if he had said Blizzard.

Seriously, I can't believe there's even a discussion over this. What other developer has managed to produce nothing but sheer awesome? Blizzard is what other game companies dream of being.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Jebobek » Tue Apr 28, 2009 2:59 pm UTC

el_loco_avs wrote:Tetris...

and...

what? that's it? :wink:
Well, if it still worked, i could turn on the origional gameboy and sit down and play gameboy tetris as much as any other modern game. Its one of the best games to go back to and still enjoy. You can log on to any computer and play it in a few seconds. You can turn on any random person's cell phone and get it downloaded and played in a few minutes. There is pac-man, but watered-down versions are not the same. With Tetris you can play a decent game a few feet away from you at any time of day. Note that you could do this with pong or breakout, but the popularity is in updated versions with special effects. There has been some Tetris spinoff quirks, but usually goes back to marketing Alexey Pajitnov's design.

The simplicity/popularity ratio is the highest I'm aware of, and I feel thats good enough to make Alexy Pajitnov one of the most important developers of all time.
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Midnight » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:26 pm UTC

important, but making one great game does not make you an awesome game developer. making a string of them does. currently, Alexey Pajitnov is just "That guy who made that fantastic game tetris", not "an amazing game developer".
if some guy makes a single two-minute long, really awesome song, over the course of his life, would you call him the best composer ever? i think not.
uhhhh fuck.

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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Tomo » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:31 pm UTC

Jebobek wrote:
el_loco_avs wrote:The simplicity/popularity ratio is the highest I'm aware of, and I feel thats good enough to make Alexy Pajitnov one of the most important developers of all time.


Simplicity/popularity of a single output is a great way of defining the most important developers ever.

That's why the Vengaboys, Aqua and Eiffel 65 are the most important musicians ever...
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Apr 28, 2009 3:43 pm UTC

Midnight wrote:important, but making one great game does not make you an awesome game developer. making a string of them does. currently, Alexey Pajitnov is just "That guy who made that fantastic game tetris", not "an amazing game developer".
if some guy makes a single two-minute long, really awesome song, over the course of his life, would you call him the best composer ever? i think not.
I don't know.. if 2 year olds, 90 year olds, and the span in between were rocking out to it with equal enjoyment...

Yeah, I might.
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philsov
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby philsov » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:07 pm UTC

I'll second the microprose, though Hal will always have my underdog heart.
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Lewton
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Lewton » Tue Apr 28, 2009 4:19 pm UTC

Don't forget Welltris! Welltris is as awesome as tetris


Best game developer of all time? I don't know, but Black Isle Studios have made 3 of the games I'd put on my "5 best games of all time" list. And they'd probably still be putting out amazing games had they not been unfairly shut down

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Endless Mike
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby Endless Mike » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:27 pm UTC

headprogrammingczar wrote:Same goes for Rareware. Perfect Dark got completely fucked over when Rare went under.

Awesome revisionist history there. For a company that can't manage to get a game out on time EVER, they're lucky they exist at all (see also: Silicon Knights).

I like Blizzard, but ultimately, I don't really feel like they're doing a whole lot to innovate or move the industry/their chosen genres forward. WarCraft 2 was a twerked WarCraft 2, and StarCraft was WarCraft In Space, and WarCraft was Dune 2 with Warhammer units. Diablo 2 was Diablo slightly prettier with some different classes. WoW is EQ for the Commonfolk. WarCraft 3 was WarCraft 2 with hero units. StarCraft 2 is reportedly StarCraft in 3D. Not that they do a bad job, of course. They put a TON of polish into their games. There's no doubt that they're making quality games, but ultimately, I don't really think they should be considered for best.

Valve may have a case, but only for identifying and acquiring talented new developers. They saw what a couple kids did with Counterstrike and hired them. They saw a tech demo for Portal and hired the kids and let them make it into a full game. A third party built L4D and showed it to them and they bought it and published it. They developed a good system for digital distribution and a couple good games, but again, I don't think they should really be contenders.

I think Nintendo has a good case here, but saying "Nintendo" isn't really fair since they're composed of multiple dev teams, and I can't really differentiate which are which. Sega's similar, and a few years ago, I would have made a case for some of their teams, but not so much now. Treasure's an interesting thought since they only put out a game a year or so, and they're generally high quality with interesting hooks, and they're at least trying new things.

A year or two ago, my answer would have been Clover.

So yeah, the Russian dude. Him. Best ever.

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jerdak
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Re: best game developer of all time

Postby jerdak » Tue Apr 28, 2009 5:55 pm UTC

bigstrat2003 wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:There's also the fact that Jahoclave is irrefutably correct.


He'd be irrefutably correct if he had said Blizzard.

Seriously, I can't believe there's even a discussion over this. What other developer has managed to produce nothing but sheer awesome? Blizzard is what other game companies dream of being.


Why wouldn't there be discussion? It's a forum post asking our opinions, not concrete absolutes. The topic is too broad for that. What if my baseline for what makes a good game developer is a solid FPS (it isn't but lets say so for the sake of argument)? In that instance Blizzard fails. Originality and unique game play are what I use to define a good game. In my mind Blizzard has released only 3 games in the past 14 years: Warcraft, Diablo, and WoW. Everything else was just a sequel.(Starcraft is just Warcraft with flyin' saucers.)

I vote for the Tetris dude as well.
"Real programmers don't comment their code. If it was hard to write it should be hard to read."


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