X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

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Scuttlemutt
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Scuttlemutt » Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:04 am UTC

Don't you love getting the "Flight Computers are important" speech every time you enter a UFO?

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CorruptUser
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:27 am UTC

Telekinetic field is... interesting. You can't mind control, but everything in it is +40 def (the same as full cover), and the range is easily big enough to cover a moderately compact squad. Sure, you can't MC with that unit, but combine with smoke grenade and your unit is effectively immortal.

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Shivahn
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Shivahn » Sun Oct 14, 2012 7:23 am UTC

This game's RNG is just as hilarious as the old XCOMs'. I have two Sotos, a Sq. and a Rk. I just had basically the following string of events (as seen in popups on the screen) happen:

Sq. Soto is hit for five! Sq. Soto panics! Muton is hit for five! Alien grenade disintegrates! Alien plasma rifle disintegrates!

Rk. Soto panics! Sq. Soto is hit for four! Sq. Soto is critically wounded!

Yes, I have two Sotos, and one panicked and killed a muton, and then the other Soto panicked and shot him. Makes sense!

EmptySet
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby EmptySet » Sun Oct 14, 2012 10:41 am UTC

So, do floaters have the magical ability to turn invisible, or is this game just really glitchy?

Because I just walked all six of my guys into a building and poked around in every corner looking for the last group of enemies. Baffled at the fact that I'd walked through seemingly the entire map without killing everything, I send one guy out to go check if there's not an alien hiding behind a dumpster in a side alley or something... only for nine floaters to suddenly appear directly adjacent to the rest of the squad for no apparent reason.

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Eseell » Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:05 pm UTC

Could they have been on a roof? That seems to happen a lot for me with floaters.
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Scuttlemutt
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Scuttlemutt » Sun Oct 14, 2012 5:45 pm UTC

Berzerkers seem to refuse to move completely when somebody near by is Overwatching them. It's kind of terrifying trying to work around a Berzerker sitting in the middle of my squad while two cyberdisks, their drone entourages, and some floaters come at me.

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Vaniver
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Vaniver » Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:09 pm UTC

Scuttlemutt wrote:Edit2: Also, killing all the aliens resulted in somebody withdrawing from the XCOM project. What? Is it based on civilian count?
Countries withdraw from the XCOM project if they have a panic level of 5 at the end of the month. I hear that failing a terror mission has severe political consequences, and I would imagine that civilians saved somehow influences panic levels, but I don't know the correspondence.
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Scuttlemutt
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Scuttlemutt » Sun Oct 14, 2012 6:15 pm UTC

This wasn't at the end of the month though; This was immediately after the completion of the Terror mission that a country withdrew from the project. I wasn't aware that was possible until it just happened to me.

EmptySet
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby EmptySet » Sun Oct 14, 2012 11:42 pm UTC

Eseell wrote:Could they have been on a roof? That seems to happen a lot for me with floaters.


No, I'd already checked every part of every building on the map including the roof. And my squad was standing inside an enclosed room which could only be entered via a couple of doorways.

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Jack21222
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:17 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Heh, I discovered an interesting cheese tactic. On Classic, I seem to need every bit of cheese I can find.

Spoiler:
The support's dash ability lets them run up to a group of enemies, then run the hell back. Back being where you have 5 buddies camping out. Unless the aliens are on overwatch, or are a doomchicken (you will know when you see them). You can use an assault with the lightening reflexes instead, to avoid the hit, then run back. Most enemies will charge and hunt you down after spotting you. Berserkers and Chrysalids won't even bother with cover, floaters/heavy floaters may just teleport behind you, but that's ok because they are usually in the open and die in a hit or two.

Many maps can't really use that tactic, but the supply barge, alien base, and mothership maps allow for that.

So far I currently have 3 mindraping demons. I have had no luck testing my grunts, but I don't know if that's from bad luck or the higher willpower from leveling up gives the gift of mindrape. Even so, with only half of my squad being psychic monsters, it's just scary. Anything that isn't a robot or chrysalid is either popped or mind-controlled as soon as I spot them. Well, about half, anyway. Elite mutons are now my bestest friends ever.


I'm fairly far in my classic ironman playthrough (8th attempt) where I've independently stumbled across this tactic.

I have two max-rank snipers that can one-shot mutons (or anything weaker) when they come into view, so when those bros come at me, they get melted as soon as their head comes around the corner. I also bring along two heavies to clear sight lines for those snipers. It's worked well so far (I just finished researching the hyperwave drive, and will start construction within the month.) Before this playthrough, I had never even reached the alien base, so all of this is uncharted territory for me.

I thought sectoid commanders would be scarier than they were. My snipers and heavies made short work of them so far, and I even captured the very first one I came across. So far, every new thing the game has thrown at me has been dealt with quickly and efficiently by Xeno and Pharaoh, my snipers. I hope this trend will continue when the Ethereals show up.
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CorruptUser
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Oct 15, 2012 1:42 am UTC

Something else.

Assault class has the ability for extra critical damage. Plus higher crit chance for adjacent shots. Plus extra crit chance for enemies seen by anyone in your squad. Plus 50% extra crit damage from activating run and gun. Plus 10% crit chance for scope (with foundry). Plus the alloy cannon. Plus double-shot. Sectopod giving you trouble? Not anymore it's not!

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Chen » Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:06 pm UTC

The whole "scout, retreat, overwatch" tactic really is the safest and easiest way to kill pretty much everything. The enemies are pretty dumb in how they chase single people down. Considering how quickly everything dies, that initial first round of fire is far too important. It also seems to make squadsight snipers pretty damn OP. The only issue is that this makes the gameplay pretty boring. But its the absolute correct way to manage something like this when doing it the other way is just pointless. I think what would need to be changed is an increase in how much defense cover actually grants. If high cover were 80% and low cover were 40% it would force you to actually flank your opponents and you could actually run up and engage in firefights. As it stands there is too much enemy HP compared to your HP in a map to win a war of attrition. So you do it the smart way and take NO damage because you can lure all the enemies into silly ambushes.

Also I've found heavies are not really that great. Snipers, Assault and Support all work well but I find the heavies are lacking.And it seems like engineers are FAR more important than scientists. Satellites are so damn important that you need a ton of engineers to keep building relays and nexuses.

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Jack21222
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Mon Oct 15, 2012 12:27 pm UTC

Chen wrote:Also I've found heavies are not really that great. Snipers, Assault and Support all work well but I find the heavies are lacking.


I run two heavies and one assault. The heavies aren't the best at dealing a ton of damage, but they're amazing at destroying cover and making sure your snipers can see the target. This is particularly true in abduction missions. On some maps (the one with the fairly large fountain for example, or the one where you're directly in front of a bar & grill), I just level the buildings as a first order of business, so my snipers can see what they're shooting at. Also, if a group of enemies just happens to be bunched up, the heavies can clear the group of them at once (even Mutons, if they're standing next to a vehicle which will explode). And in a pinch, they can do reasonable damage with their primary weapon, about on par with my support.

For the assault, I don't like getting too close to my enemies, so most of the time the assault stays somewhere in the middle of the battle, plinking things with his sidearm until enemies somehow get close enough to my group to be a danger. My snipers generally keep things dead even outside of Run and Gun range for my assault, so I use the assault defensively to protect the snipers.
broken_escalator wrote:The Mako is powered by the rage of the physics it denies.

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Vaniver
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Vaniver » Mon Oct 15, 2012 5:09 pm UTC

I typically run 2 assault, 2 snipers, and 2 support, but could see 1 assault, 1 support, and 4 snipers working well with the 'lure into ambush' strategy.

Heavies seem like they're good only if you don't mind collateral damage- but if you do mind collateral damage (either because you want more money or it's a terror mission) then they just seem like a suboptimal version of assaults. Shooting twice in a turn is nice- but snipers can do that too, as well as supports on overwatch, and it's bothersome that you need to research their weapons separately.
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CorruptUser
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Oct 15, 2012 10:51 pm UTC

The real use I have for heavies is for destroying sectopods and for the holo-targeting. Sure, the holo-targeting comes at the price of double-shots, but something that takes a whole squad to kill (sectopods, ethereals, maybe berserkers), the extra 10 aim for the whole squad really makes a difference.

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Shivahn
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Shivahn » Mon Oct 15, 2012 11:47 pm UTC

I use them for holding points partially, but mostly because I can cluster bomb mutons if I need to (I need to) and destroy cover from far away, at the same time. Very helpful. But then, I was so slow on my last game to do research (it was sort of a trial game anyway) that my equipment hadn't changed from the start when I ran into mutons. Then the rockets are kind of important.

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Vaniver
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Vaniver » Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:01 am UTC

Just beat the game. Spoilers about the ending:

Spoiler:
ARGH black holes are just dense, they aren't especially heavy. If the water wasn't being sucked up into the ship before, it wouldn't be afterwards!

Thought the ending was okay in general, though again it triggered my "agh why are the enemies so ineffective at pursuing their plans" reflex. Abducting people seems like a terrible way to get test subjects- just show up, say hi, and tell people your plans. Way more people will volunteer to undergo psi testing, and to join an alien society, than they could possibly abduct in three missions a month. (You don't have to tell them that they'll be psionically controlled by the Ethereals until they've joined. :P ) The final mission in the original seemed like a somewhat better plot, but they're close enough that I can't complain too much.

Was playing the game on normal, and the final mission was a cakewalk- none of my units took any damage. I lost a second country because I forgot to keep a satellite in reserve, and only has one interceptor on that continent (and so after it got damaged, another UFO was free to shoot down one of my satellites, causing panic). Next up, a classic iron man game; we'll see how well that goes. Not sure if I want to try and race through or build up; this run was about 200 days, which I suspect is longer than it needed to be.
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CorruptUser
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Oct 16, 2012 4:48 am UTC

Spoiler:
I lost 2 men in the end, well 3 if you count the volunteer (why do they always commit suicide to save the world?). I didn't really lose them until the final room, where two of my soldiers got MC'ed by the Uber Ethereal and friends. The other 4 managed to bring that bastard down, and when he pops, all enemies pop. Including my MC'ed soldiers.

I did like how the hive-mind explained why they created all the alien races you fight.

And yes, I hate Hollywood black holes.

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DaBigCheez
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby DaBigCheez » Tue Oct 16, 2012 5:20 pm UTC

Spoiler:
I had a horrific time with the last mission, even on Normal - mostly because I was doing a Normal Ironman, and I lost nearly all my experienced dudes (including my only psi-soldier) to a UFO recovery mission that I did to *pass the time* waiting for the whatsitcalled chamber to be done building. So, I was doing the final assault with four Squaddies (one of whom was my psi-user, fresh out of the psilabs), a Captain and a Major, using roughly half-plasma/half-laser. Wasn't pretty. Ended with my psi-dude hiding out of line of sight with 2 hp, while my support ducked in and out of LoS for the sniper, who basically soloed the guy. (The other three were dead.)

Also, separation of story and gameplay and all that, but it kind of annoyed me that the Ethereals start trying to kill you more or less immediately, then when you shoot back go "No! This is not your path!" I might have less of an issue with it if there was an explicit "join us" dialogue - even one that you don't have an actual *choice* to reject, but one your dudes explicitly do so.

Then again, I suppose they just mind-controlled everyone in sight more than anything, so I suppose they might not have technically "attacked"...it would be interesting if there was an alternate game-over sequence for if they manage to mind-control everyone on your team.
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Jack21222
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Wed Oct 17, 2012 12:19 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:The real use I have for heavies is for destroying sectopods


So much this!

I recently came across my first Sectopod, and it nearly wiped my squad of Colonels. My heavies are equipped with heavy plasmas and HEAT ammo, and they just MAULED the sectopod before it could finish off my team.
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Woopate
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Woopate » Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:50 pm UTC

So far I'm loving the game. I really enjoy the promotion abilities. They all feel very powerful. And the game has a sufficient sense of DOOM.

Two gripes I have so far involve the abduction mission selection and multiplayer. I really wish I could see the panic levels of ALL countries on a continent when deciding which abduction to take, since the whole continent is negatively changed by an ignore. It's a huge pain to go back to the situation room to check.

The multiplayer I experienced was obscenely buggy, just playing over LAN. Any indoor level was practically impossible to navigate due to dissappearing floors, commands not registering, etc.

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby gnutrino » Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:18 pm UTC

Just Finished. One of my favourite games for a while, despite the bugs and UI flaws (whoever wrote the code to select which floor you're targeting on multilevel maps should be forced to repeatedly try to move a unit to cover on a platform and everytime their unit cheerfully leaps the only thing between them and an iminent alien plasma bath and ends up sat like a melon in full view on the lower floor a current should be passed through their testicles (assuming they're male) until they come up with something better).

Squad Sight snipers are seriously OP though, especially when you get ghost armour later on; have an assault cloak up and dash into range of the enemy, your sniper(s) shoot away and if everything is not dead you can still dash your scout back to safety on the next turn without anything getting a chace to shoot them. Rinse and repeat.

Re: the last mission and ending
Spoiler:
I actually had quite a lot of trouble on the last room (on normal) until I worked out that you only need to kill the Uber Ethereal to get the endgame, I just ignored everything else and unloded everything I had (well 2 sniper colonels with plasma sniper rifles and double tap) into it.
I was a little disapointed by how everthing ended and the general lack of explaination for anything (just why were the ethereals trying to get another species to "ascend", what exactly would that have got them?). The "black hole" thing didn't actually annoy me that much though, they never say what's causing the ship to go all black hole, certainly it didn't look like a collapse so I assumed the space magic was causing the ship to gain mass until it black hole-ified.

Scuttlemutt
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Scuttlemutt » Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:38 pm UTC

I'm actually raising a Snap Shot sniper to test a theory involving a combination with the last promotion skill (I forgot the name, but the other one is "Double Tap"). I'm hoping if I can boost his movement enough that he can dash beyond the enemies cover, that may give him many more shots on things than Double Tap will. Although it comes at the cost of aim, but at that rank he should hopefully be able to overcome that penalty.

I did get to try Squadsight sniper and Ghost Armor Sprinter Support scout though. Hilarious.

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DaBigCheez
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby DaBigCheez » Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:06 pm UTC

Woopate wrote:I really wish I could see the panic levels of ALL countries on a continent when deciding which abduction to take, since the whole continent is negatively changed by an ignore. It's a huge pain to go back to the situation room to check.


You kinda-sorta can - countries will be color-coded by panic level on the Geoscape, and you should be able to see the countries around the missions fine. Blue = 1-2, yellow = 3, orange = 4, red = 5. You may have to click the globe to get it to display that country-overlay iew instead of a more topographical/"real" view, but I think it does that view by default when selecting a mission.

Still presented less clearly than it could be, though.
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CorruptUser
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Oct 18, 2012 3:24 am UTC

gnutrino wrote:Re: the last mission and ending
Spoiler:
I actually had quite a lot of trouble on the last room (on normal) until I worked out that you only need to kill the Uber Ethereal to get the endgame, I just ignored everything else and unloded everything I had (well 2 sniper colonels with plasma sniper rifles and double tap) into it.
I was a little disapointed by how everthing ended and the general lack of explaination for anything (just why were the ethereals trying to get another species to "ascend", what exactly would that have got them?). The "black hole" thing didn't actually annoy me that much though, they never say what's causing the ship to go all black hole, certainly it didn't look like a collapse so I assumed the space magic was causing the ship to gain mass until it black hole-ified.


Spoiler:
Every race you met is one that they were trying to uplift, and that was as far as genetic engineering could take them. The hivemind controls all of them, and it isn't even too clear if the ethereals themselves are individuals or just bodies that the hivemind itself controls. But earth monkeys are special, and genetic engineering with our 'natural' psionics means we have some potential value for them. Somehow they could prove to their elders or whatever other species they briefly referred to, that the ethereals are worthy of being re-accepted because they managed to find/uplift the perfect species. Or something.

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Jack21222
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Thu Oct 18, 2012 10:35 pm UTC

I just beat classic ironman on my 8th attempt! At the time of posting, only 0.3% of players on Steam have managed to do so. I don't think I'll be trying Impossible any time soon, or if I do, it won't be on ironman.

The victory screen gives a score... mine was ~39000. I have no idea how that compares to anybody else.
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Shivahn
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Shivahn » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:26 pm UTC

I love destructible environments. More tactical games need them.

Capturing an outsider with no special equipment or armor is dangerous. Unless you just blow a hole in the central UFO room and run in a person with an arc thrower.

I've still not got the hang of the strategy part of the game (and my OCD doesn't help), but I had five satellites by May and will have like... eleven? At least by the beginning of June. As well as three more built because I miscalculated my uplink capacity. So after that rush, I have to build at most like two more in June to have total coverage.

Money is... not an issue anymore. Buy all the things.

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Izawwlgood
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Oct 18, 2012 11:52 pm UTC

So, can someone who loved the shit out of TFTD chime in with whether or not they felt the new game is a good and worthwhile successor?

EDIT: The demo seemed good, but on lowest settings was very choppy on my machine. This is somewhat surprising to me given that it's not a wimpy rig, being only about a year old.
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Vaniver
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Vaniver » Sat Oct 20, 2012 12:40 am UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:So, can someone who loved the shit out of TFTD chime in with whether or not they felt the new game is a good and worthwhile successor?
I've played but not beaten the original. Eventually, the interface bugged me, and the gameplay boiling down to "do everything slowly and carefully, or YOU DIE" got tiresome, and so I never got particularly far, but I sympathized with the game (and I'm sure 12 year old me would have liked it more than 20 year old me).

This game has the same spirit as the original, but was clearly made in 2012. A few changes are annoyances until you realize they don't matter much, and several changes are definite improvements. Squads are much smaller, and soldiers have classes and special abilities now. Missions are generally much more linear- you'll start on one side and work your way to the other, rather than starting in the middle and having to expand in every direction. Interestingly, one of the main impacts of soldier abilities and classes is that them getting wounded seems like a much bigger deal- if you don't have a sniper with squadshot active anymore, that'll impact your strategy until you can train up another sniper.
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Grishnakh » Sat Oct 20, 2012 7:06 am UTC

I got a retail preorder copy of the game, on the box is sticker that says "Including Elite Soldier Pack" and a bit of paper inside the box with an activation code for the Elite Soldier Pack. The instructions only says to enter the activation code after installing the game, but I can't find any option in the game or steam to activate the Elite Soldier Pack! Are there any steam wizardry involved or am I just being dense?

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby EmptySet » Sat Oct 20, 2012 8:36 am UTC

I got a retail non-preorder copy of the game and it also came with that. If I recall correctly, you need to select "Games" from the Steam menu -> Activate a product on Steam -> Enter code.

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Izawwlgood » Sat Oct 20, 2012 2:52 pm UTC

Whelp, was up till 5am lastnight playing. That was at least familiar territory.

Initial observations after a few hour run through that crashed and burned hard;
Snipers seem to really suck. That sniper rifle has pretty low accuracy, it seems, which makes long distance shooting kind of lame. Assault seems to really rock, as they can cover an enormous amount of ground, and do an enormous amount of damage.

It is really difficult to get satellites up. Like, more difficult than I think it should be; I'm *SO* broke and don't really have a good way of making money reliably.

Everything is awesome. They took TFTD and made it better.
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Sat Oct 20, 2012 3:14 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:Snipers seem to really suck. That sniper rifle has pretty low accuracy, it seems, which makes long distance shooting kind of lame. Assault seems to really rock, as they can cover an enormous amount of ground, and do an enormous amount of damage.


Snipers suck until you get squadsight. Then, you just camp them out at the spawn point of the mission and pick things off half a mile away. Nothing in range? Just go into overwatch and have them pick things off when they pop into view.

In my final classic ironman playthrough, I had two snipers who would pretty much kill 4 things in a turn if they were visible. The entire rest of my team was centered around protecting those snipers.
broken_escalator wrote:The Mako is powered by the rage of the physics it denies.

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Shivahn
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Shivahn » Sat Oct 20, 2012 4:00 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:This game has the same spirit as the original, but was clearly made in 2012. A few changes are annoyances until you realize they don't matter much, and several changes are definite improvements.


This is pretty much exactly how I feel. There are a few things I really wish they had left more like the original, a bunch of changes that make little difference and are a bit weird because they're different, and then a fuckton of changes that make the game better.

I've described it several times as "distilled the spirit of the original X-COM, and then applied twenty years of game design advance to it."

For a re-imagining of a much loved sequel (which is really, really hard to do and get people to not hate you), they've done an absolutely amazing job on it. Most of the big changes I'd make are personal preference, and the smaller ones are all really small (I would change the animations a bit, for example).

Izawwlgood wrote:Whelp, was up till 5am lastnight playing. That was at least familiar territory.

Initial observations after a few hour run through that crashed and burned hard;
Snipers seem to really suck. That sniper rifle has pretty low accuracy, it seems, which makes long distance shooting kind of lame. Assault seems to really rock, as they can cover an enormous amount of ground, and do an enormous amount of damage.

It is really difficult to get satellites up. Like, more difficult than I think it should be; I'm *SO* broke and don't really have a good way of making money reliably.

Everything is awesome. They took TFTD and made it better.


Yeah, as said, snipers are awesome when they climb up the tech tree. Squad sight murders on open maps, or even closed ones with big hallways. Later on you get crazy skills. Like, the last one lets you either attack twice or have flanked/not-covered enemy kills not count as an action. Combined with squad sight, this is amazing. Huge, tanklike enemies embedded in high cover? A grenade will uncover them, then the sniper can basically kill every one in one turn from her high ground from across the map. Also, mid/late game enemy spoiler:
Spoiler:
They annihilate cyberdiscs in this configuration. They never count as in cover and have those pesky drones - consequently, a sniper can kill the drones and then hit the disc no problem.


They did a good job of making everyone have their roles. And with each class having two trees, there are basically twice as many roles. Assaults are awesome but when you get to harder enemies you can't just run up because they will die. They are excellent for cleanup on single tough enemies though.

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Izawwlgood » Sat Oct 20, 2012 5:04 pm UTC

I guess I've been playing Snipers wrong. I keep moving them around. I know the accuracy of the gun increases the further the target is, but it seems like it's always around 50%. I guess they need to be way, way further? I mean, Squadsight is the second upgrade they get.
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:17 pm UTC

The trouble I find with snipers with squad sight is there aren't enough open maps. There's always an obstruction between my sniper and the alien my squadmate has just spotted. And of course if I move the sniper to see around the obstruction, I can't use the sniper rifle on that turn. I suppose the idea is to just find a good spot for the sniper to camp in, and just leave him there for several turns. My solution is actually to use the pistol damage upgrade in the sniper skill tree, because that can still be used after a 1-tick move.
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Oct 20, 2012 6:56 pm UTC

You could have them fly with the archangel armor, and that usually removes obstructions.

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Menacing Spike » Sat Oct 20, 2012 8:07 pm UTC

by the way guys

this game does not work on windows xp, unless you are willing to install third-party hacks

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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby Jack21222 » Sat Oct 20, 2012 8:24 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:The trouble I find with snipers with squad sight is there aren't enough open maps. There's always an obstruction between my sniper and the alien my squadmate has just spotted.


I have not generally noticed this in 70 hours of play. You just need to place your snipers near the most open sightlines possible and retreat your other guys back to make the aliens chase you. This is especially true on some of the storyline missions. I don't think I've seen a map where my snipers weren't able to find sight lines. On the maps with buildings, that's why I bring my heavies. Two heavies will level any building you want leveled. Then, your snipers have a field day.

My main squad was two snipers, two heavies, an assault and a support. On some maps, I had to space out my snipers such that one or the other always had line of sight, but not usually both (like the highway map full of cars. One sniper at the starting point, other sniper on the other side of the median.) For crash sites, just find some high ground near the starting point and sit them there for a while. In terror missions, the snipers generally didn't move at all, or not more than a few steps. For some maps, I would just level buildings on my first or second turn, even before enemies were spotted. For example, the one where you're behind parked cars in front of a store. Or, the one with a fountain in the center, or the gas station. Take down those walls, and allow the snipers to get to work.
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Re: X-Com: UFO Defense / UFO: Enemy Unknown

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Oct 20, 2012 8:50 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:You could have them fly with the archangel armor, and that usually removes obstructions.

Unfortunately, I haven't progressed to a point where archangel armour is available (it's been researchable, but I never got around to actually researching it). I'm on my 4th game because I ballsed up the previous three (the RNG hates me, and I've been ironmanning), which led me to raegquaat. In one of those playthroughs, I got to titan armour, which was pretty cool - then I encountered red mutons which seem to instakill my dudes regardless of how many HP they have, and it wiped out my entire squad of colonels and majors. Again, raegquaat.

My strategy for the current game is to use rookies and squaddies in every battle where I think I can get away with it. In my previous games, I tended to just use the same guys for every battle, which resulted in me having a few highly trained people, and a whole lot of rookies. That made losing anyone absolutely devastating. Spreading out the XP should make it a bit more forgiving.

So archangel armour lets me fly? And I can actually shoot while flying, like the Marsec armour from Apocalypse? That's pretty cool, but I bet there's a fairly big downside of not being able to use cover.

Jack21222 wrote:
SlyReaper wrote:The trouble I find with snipers with squad sight is there aren't enough open maps. There's always an obstruction between my sniper and the alien my squadmate has just spotted.


I have not generally noticed this in 70 hours of play. You just need to place your snipers near the most open sightlines possible and retreat your other guys back to make the aliens chase you. This is especially true on some of the storyline missions. I don't think I've seen a map where my snipers weren't able to find sight lines. On the maps with buildings, that's why I bring my heavies. Two heavies will level any building you want leveled. Then, your snipers have a field day.

My main squad was two snipers, two heavies, an assault and a support. On some maps, I had to space out my snipers such that one or the other always had line of sight, but not usually both (like the highway map full of cars. One sniper at the starting point, other sniper on the other side of the median.) For crash sites, just find some high ground near the starting point and sit them there for a while. In terror missions, the snipers generally didn't move at all, or not more than a few steps. For some maps, I would just level buildings on my first or second turn, even before enemies were spotted. For example, the one where you're behind parked cars in front of a store. Or, the one with a fountain in the center, or the gas station. Take down those walls, and allow the snipers to get to work.


I might try that. I've been avoiding deliberately damaging structures because in Apocalypse (the only one of the original games I've played), it made the owner of the building angry. I don't think that happens in this game. That said, how do I destroy buildings with heavies, when they can only carry one rocket each, and it's impossible to shoot the main gun at anything other than a hostile target?
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