The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Bacon Workshop

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:54 am UTC

Three pieces of Morrowind advice:

1. Save as soon as you finish making your character (i.e. after you talk to Sellus Gravius).* The game will only autosave when you rest, and there are a few places right near the starting town where you might die, and it is really frustrating to have to start over from the very beginning.

2. NPCs have a conversation topic called "morrowind tips" or "advice" or something similar. Ask them about it and read the tips. It's a good way to pick up subtle aspects of the game at a reasonable pace.

3. The leveling mechanics are a little screwy, and there are a lot of ways to become as powerful as you want. Don't worry overmuch about figuring out how to break the game mechanically; focus on exploring the world and the story. Those are a lot more rewarding, I think, and it's easy to be dissatisfied with the game if it becomes trivial.

*I am moderately disturbed that I remembered his name without looking it up.

SecondTalon wrote:But... the best Medium is a rank or two below the Ebony/Glass tier.
Indoril armor is my favorite armor design (in any game I can remember) until I came across Her Hand's armor (an upgraded version, which is heavy). But, like you say, it was worse than both Glass and Ebony.

Ibid wrote:Also Magnanimous, that robs Jiub of his sworn duty to rid Morrowind of Cliff Racers!
He actually linked to the mod that made them peaceful, not removed them.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Magnanimous » Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:38 am UTC

I also remember seeing a mod that lets you hunt cliff racers to extinction... After you kill a certain number, they stop spawning. :P

There's a lot of weird mods out there. You can get modern graphics, sure, but there's also oblivion-style casting* and a great revamp of the level-up system and expansions to cities** and Fallout-Hardcore-you-actually-need-to-eat-and-sleep mode and friendly dogs in cities and weapon sheaths and companions and really useful alchemy things and birds/fish and fireplaces*** and book retextures****. There's also Tamriel Rebuilt... which I don't really have words for. Holy shit.

*So you don't have to keep changing your "stance" ಠ_ಠ
**Balmora gets a brewery/bakery, a hospital, a zoo, and a really cool museum with accurate Elder Scrolls lore and artifacts
***How did they not put fireplaces in the original game?
****The names are actually on the books now. That always annoyed me.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby EmptySet » Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:44 am UTC

IcedT wrote:
EmptySet wrote:
IcedT wrote:Morrowind is much more stat-driven; character creation is more complex and more impactful;


I'd disagree with that. I've found that in Skyrim, two high level characters can be pretty different because of perk selection, whereas in Morrowind all high level characters end up being hyper-competent at everything and therefore pretty much the same. In Skyrim everyone starts out the similar and then diverges as you gain levels; in Morrowind, characters are (slightly) more different at the start, but become more similar as the game goes on, and eventually every character ends up being the best in the world at everything.

What I mean is that the choices you make when you create your character have a bigger impact on how that character plays for the rest of the game. In Skyrim, all you really pick is a racial power and a small bonus to certain stats. Characters can be hugely different depending on the perks you pick over time, but at the start the difference between any two characters is negligible compared to all the different builds that are possible in Morrowind.


And I disagree with the "for the rest of the game" part. Racial traits and whatever else you picked at the start become increasingly irrelevant as you gain levels. Partly because every character tends to end up with a score of 100 in all skills and all attributes, partly because they're overshadowed by gear/potions/spellmaking anyway, and partly because the game generally isn't challenging enough for it to matter much in any event. It might list your class as "wizard" or "thief" on the character screen, but it doesn't really mean anything. Your "wizard" can end up being just as stealthy as a thief and swinging a sword just as well as a fighter. It just takes you a little longer to get there.

Unless you choose Khajiit or Argonian, of course, in which case you are forever punished by not being able to wear shoes. And full-face helmets.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SirBryghtside » Sun Jan 29, 2012 10:56 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:But... the best Medium is a rank or two below the Ebony/Glass tier.
Indoril armor is my favorite armor design (in any game I can remember) until I came across Her Hand's armor (an upgraded version, which is heavy). But, like you say, it was worse than both Glass and Ebony.

Honestly, the point in having 3 armour tiers is to make the game replayable. I always used to use a Heavy Armour/Long Blade style, and ended up knowing where every single artifact and best armour piece was (scarily, not even through UESP), so another run would just be boring. So my next playthrough was a Medium Armour/Blunt guy, which meant I had to relearn the game pretty much from scratch. Ended up with an enchanted Sixth House Bell Hammer and Dreugh Armour - which is where the Medium came in useful, as I would've been over encumbered in seconds had I been wearing Ebony or Daedric. I mean, next time I could do another melee fighter who used Light and Spears, and that'll make it a totally new game all over again. That... doesn't really happen in Skyrim (or Oblivion, due to the level scaling).

Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief. That much should be obvious.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby not baby Newt » Sun Jan 29, 2012 3:29 pm UTC

Don't try to be a mage killing everything with destruction in morrowind. No magicka regen and damage per magicka never increasing makes this ludicrously annoying. Good as secondary attack of course.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby gmalivuk » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:42 pm UTC

SirBryghtside wrote:Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief.
Even if you are a thief (in Oblivion), sneaking everywhere becomes stupid easy as soon as you have access to big enough soul gems to get Chameleon to near 100% with enchanted apparel.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SirBryghtside » Sun Jan 29, 2012 5:58 pm UTC

Again, roleplaying. It's the same reason you don't use hacks - because the game is more fun if you avoid being overpowered (generally, I can't speak for power gamers).
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby An Enraged Platypus » Sun Jan 29, 2012 7:22 pm UTC

gmalivuk wrote:
SirBryghtside wrote:Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief.
Even if you are a thief (in Oblivion), sneaking everywhere becomes stupid easy as soon as you have access to big enough soul gems to get Chameleon to near 100% with enchanted apparel.


Oh man, 100% chameleon was a beast. Perfect stealth without sneaking made the game too easy; I could hit enemies in the face without losing stealth mode.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby omgryebread » Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:03 pm UTC

So I don't think it's been posted here before. If you're playing on PC, and you're not using SkyUI, you really should. Gives the game an interface actually made for the PC.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Vaniver » Sun Jan 29, 2012 8:08 pm UTC

SirBryghtside wrote:Medium Armour/Blunt guy
I preferred medium / spears, as both keyed off of Endurance.

SirBryghtside wrote:Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief. That much should be obvious.
I wouldn't really call that "roleplay" so much as "skill micromanagement."
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby gmalivuk » Mon Jan 30, 2012 12:29 am UTC

Vaniver wrote:
SirBryghtside wrote:Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief. That much should be obvious.
I wouldn't really call that "roleplay" so much as "skill micromanagement."
Well that is kinda roleplaying, at least in that a thief probably wouldn't use a warhammer. A thief absolutely *would* use something like Chameleon, though, so making sure you never get up to 100% with that seems more like needless micromanagement to me.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:29 am UTC

No, Oblivion's leveling system was just awful. I cheated every level to make sure I got my 3 +5 attributes dammit!

But with Morrowind, protip; Redguard specializing in Blades. Badass from the start.

That or Breton and make a beeline for the boots of blinding speed. Slow as hell in that game without them...

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Xeio » Mon Jan 30, 2012 1:53 am UTC

If you're not suffering through the unending waves of merciless cliff racers you are not playing morrowind. :P

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Jahoclave » Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:17 am UTC

gmalivuk wrote:
Vaniver wrote:
SirBryghtside wrote:Oh, and about the leveling system that EmptySet and IcedT are discussing - it requires a certain amount of roleplay, in the same way that Oblivion's did. As in, don't sneak everywhere if you're a barbarian, don't use a warhammer if you're a thief. That much should be obvious.
I wouldn't really call that "roleplay" so much as "skill micromanagement."
Well that is kinda roleplaying, at least in that a thief probably wouldn't use a warhammer. A thief absolutely *would* use something like Chameleon, though, so making sure you never get up to 100% with that seems more like needless micromanagement to me.

What do you mean a thief wouldn't use a warhammer to smash in faces!

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby doogly » Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:44 am UTC

This definition of roleplaying, where a thief wouldn't use a warhammer, is like the craziest sort. Gamism makes sense, if you are trying to win the morrowind or the skyrim or whatever, go to town. Like, you have numerical stats and things, so wanting those numbers to be large numbers, I can dig. And narrativism makes sense. If you want to play a maximally interesting character, go fuck around a bit, I totally dig. Kind of odd venue for narrativism, but I guess as electronic games go it's certainly not the worst place to have that sort of jolly. But trying to be a thief "the right way" or whatever, "the accurate way," I don't even know. It just doesn't jive with any motivation I ever have.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Chewbaccawacca » Mon Jan 30, 2012 2:48 am UTC

Xeio wrote:If you're not suffering through the unending waves of merciless cliff racers you are not playing morrowind. :P



Those cliff racers make for good sport. :)
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby emceng » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:24 am UTC

The one issue I have with level scaling is respawn. If I find a boss I can't take(or couldn't - pretty much take anything at this point) I ran away. Then when I return, I have to slog through a bunch of low level mobs again. That's pretty annoying.


Also, I never found cliff racers to be that bad. Incredibly annoying when you couldn't find them so you couldn't rest, but otherwise I avoided the interior of the map until later levels, so didn't deal with them that much.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby BlackSails » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:42 am UTC

doogly wrote:This definition of roleplaying, where a thief wouldn't use a warhammer, is like the craziest sort. Gamism makes sense, if you are trying to win the morrowind or the skyrim or whatever, go to town. Like, you have numerical stats and things, so wanting those numbers to be large numbers, I can dig. And narrativism makes sense. If you want to play a maximally interesting character, go fuck around a bit, I totally dig. Kind of odd venue for narrativism, but I guess as electronic games go it's certainly not the worst place to have that sort of jolly. But trying to be a thief "the right way" or whatever, "the accurate way," I don't even know. It just doesn't jive with any motivation I ever have.


A well designed game should make you naturally do those things. Being a thief should through the properties of the game steer you away from jumping into a group of trolls and smashing their faces in with a hammer. But TES doesnt do that, ever.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 30, 2012 5:53 am UTC

....why? Why should it steer you towards a very limited notion of "Thief" which is burglar? Why not Thief the Mugger? Thief the Extorter? Thief the Confidence Man?
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Jahoclave » Mon Jan 30, 2012 6:17 am UTC

SecondTalon wrote:....why? Why should it steer you towards a very limited notion of "Thief" which is burglar? Why not Thief the Mugger? Thief the Extorter? Thief the Confidence Man?

Thief the I'm Gonna Kill Every Mother-Fucka On This Planet, pile their corpses, steal their shit, pile that on top of their corpses, and sit atop it as my throne of ever-loving awesome. Even Dragons couldn't dream of theft that awesomely constructed. I'll be so high up the height challenged people will be of no concern to me, even with an invisibility ring.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 30, 2012 4:06 pm UTC

See, I think that falls under Mugging - theft through violence.

There's Theft through Personal Violence, Theft through Subterfuge, Theft through Coercion, and Theft through Stealth.

Or...
Spoiler:
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Adam H » Mon Jan 30, 2012 8:00 pm UTC

BlackSails wrote:A well designed game should make you naturally do those things. Being a thief should through the properties of the game steer you away from jumping into a group of trolls and smashing their faces in with a hammer. But TES doesnt do that, ever.
TES does in fact discourage [characters who are bad at jumping into a pack of trolls and killing them with a warhammer] from jumping into a pack of trolls and killing them with a warhammer.

Thieves (characters who have focused more on thieving skills) are, in general, worse at troll-killing. At least compared with those who can cast fireballs or have high combat skills.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Jan 30, 2012 10:56 pm UTC

Thieves have trouble with dragons. Warriors can use Peryte's shield and slaughter any dragon. Mages can stagger them to death. But no sneak attack for thieves...

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby An Enraged Platypus » Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:04 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Thieves have trouble with dragons. Warriors can use Peryte's shield and slaughter any dragon. Mages can stagger them to death. But no sneak attack for thieves...


Completely false. We can easily do archery sneak attacks with pots, poisons, racials etc up. A few word walls allow you to jump down from a cliff above them, hold stealth, and score a 30x first damage crit. I oneshot a Blood Dragon that way at level 20ish.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Chewbaccawacca » Mon Jan 30, 2012 11:11 pm UTC

An Enraged Platypus wrote:Completely false. We can easily do archery sneak attacks with pots, poisons, racials etc up. A few word walls allow you to jump down from a cliff above them, hold stealth, and score a 30x first damage crit. I oneshot a Blood Dragon that way at level 20ish.


That sounds awesome! I swear I want to 'finish' my two-handed tank playthrough, but the more I hear about daggers and bows the more I want to just start a new playthough!
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SurgicalSteel » Tue Jan 31, 2012 2:18 am UTC

I don't know if I could play with a character that wasn't good with a bow. I do so much hunting to get pelts to sell and meat to eat in place of health potions.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:56 am UTC

Destruction is just as good as bows for hunting. Better actually, what with the option to broil or refrigerate the meat from the start.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby omgryebread » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:09 am UTC

Illusion is the best for hunting. Land one Courage on the prey, and they'll stop running away to come attack.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby EdgarJPublius » Tue Jan 31, 2012 6:32 am UTC

Chewbaccawacca wrote:
An Enraged Platypus wrote:Completely false. We can easily do archery sneak attacks with pots, poisons, racials etc up. A few word walls allow you to jump down from a cliff above them, hold stealth, and score a 30x first damage crit. I oneshot a Blood Dragon that way at level 20ish.


That sounds awesome! I swear I want to 'finish' my two-handed tank playthrough, but the more I hear about daggers and bows the more I want to just start a new playthough!


I had a similar thing where I started out as a thief/assassin and now I'm a Necromancer :D
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby not baby Newt » Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:58 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Thieves have trouble with dragons. Warriors can use Peryte's shield and slaughter any dragon. Mages can stagger them to death. But no sneak attack for thieves...

No game mechanic reason a thief couldn't use the shield if it helps that much (against breath?). Using light armor doesn't iirc penalize a heavy shield (though light armor can hurt in dragon melee). Again a question of character concept / house rules / role playing. Not a question of health either under skyrim, back stabbing and archery don't need much magicka/stamina.

Regarding sneak attacking dragons: awesome. But most fly around.

Oblivion: I find claims of 100% chameleon being a thief thing odd under the following premises:
1) My *thief* isn't going to do half-dozen task for the *mage* guild to access enchanting.
2) That's the only (non-mq) method in the base game, and there's thematic REASON for that and dlc/mods that change this are CHEATING.

The latter is a bit ludicrous but still seems relevant in a conflict of archetypes. (I may have played those quests more times than is healthy).

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby An Enraged Platypus » Tue Jan 31, 2012 12:08 pm UTC

not baby Newt wrote:
CorruptUser wrote:Thieves have trouble with dragons. Warriors can use Peryte's shield and slaughter any dragon. Mages can stagger them to death. But no sneak attack for thieves...

No game mechanic reason a thief couldn't use the shield if it helps that much (against breath?). Using light armor doesn't iirc penalize a heavy shield (though light armor can hurt in dragon melee). Again a question of character concept / house rules / role playing. Not a question of health either under skyrim, back stabbing and archery don't need much magicka/stamina.

Regarding sneak attacking dragons: awesome. But most fly around.

Oblivion: I find claims of 100% chameleon being a thief thing odd under the following premises:
1) My *thief* isn't going to do half-dozen task for the *mage* guild to access enchanting.
2) That's the only (non-mq) method in the base game, and there's thematic REASON for that and dlc/mods that change this are CHEATING.

The latter is a bit ludicrous but still seems relevant in a conflict of archetypes. (I may have played those quests more times than is healthy).


The Mage Tower DLC is hax insofar as it gives you enchanting abilities for about 4k gold. However, from the perspective of power gaming, simply buying magetallow candles and getting 100% chameleon was the bee's knees.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SirBryghtside » Tue Jan 31, 2012 1:20 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Destruction is just as good as bows for hunting. Better actually, what with the option to broil or refrigerate the meat from the start.

I think all illusions of hunting being attached to any skill were broken when I sprinted at my first Elk with a warhammer :P
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby omgryebread » Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:01 pm UTC

not baby Newt wrote:Oblivion: I find claims of 100% chameleon being a thief thing odd under the following premises:
1) My *thief* isn't going to do half-dozen task for the *mage* guild to access enchanting.
2) That's the only (non-mq) method in the base game, and there's thematic REASON for that and dlc/mods that change this are CHEATING.

The latter is a bit ludicrous but still seems relevant in a conflict of archetypes. (I may have played those quests more times than is healthy).
1) I think the emphasis there should be on "My" and not "thief". My thief in oblivion, motivated by greed and a desire to collect books, was quite happy to do a few fetch quests for some magicky chumps so he could steal their stuff and get enchanting to be an even better thief.

2) Why is dlc CHEATING? It's designed by the game's original designers, it's as much a part of the game as horse armor or Knights of the Nine. I realize it's a single player game, so the whole idea of cheating is a bit arbitrary, but violating made-up rules in a videogame is never cheating, and the game balance shouldn't need them.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby doogly » Tue Jan 31, 2012 3:18 pm UTC

Yeah, if you wanted to make an argument that modifying the game away from the developer's version is cheating, it would at least make sense. But I can't imagine any world in which Bethesda dlc is cheating. Or, well, I can imagine 'house rules,' or something. You wanna go have something like, race you to 10,000 gold! with your buddies, and declare "no dlc!" then power to ya, go play the game how you like. But certainly in no cosmic sense is this cheating.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Adam H » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:25 pm UTC

omgryebread wrote:Illusion is the best for hunting. Land one Courage on the prey, and they'll stop running away to come attack.
Calm is by far the most IMBA spell. Doesn't work on dragons or draugr though. :(
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Jessica » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:30 pm UTC

I generally do fine against dragons and I'm playing "what I think is fun/good at the time" which means my build is really really shitty. like I have 2 dots in destruction, before I realized it kind of sucks (in that I keep killing my followers with it, and I want to stealth/bow people). I have a dot in 1 handed, and a bunch in speech...

I may use guides to make potions, but I generally just go from place to place having fun. Dragons just take a while, and a lot of healing potions.
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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby Mumpy » Tue Jan 31, 2012 4:33 pm UTC

Theives guild stuff/ advice needed.
Spoiler:
Does anyone know if it's actually possible to improve nightingale armour? I have a load of void salts, but nothing doing on the workbench.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby LaserGuy » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:05 pm UTC

not baby Newt wrote:Oblivion: I find claims of 100% chameleon being a thief thing odd under the following premises:


It's not as hard as it sounds...

-If you're lucky, you can get a 30% chameleon sigil stone from an Oblivion Gate. Maybe two, if you're super lucky.
-Ring of Khajiiti gives 35% chameleon (Daedric quest)
-Rings of shadows are not that uncommon loot. You will probably find a 25-30% eventually one eventually. There are also armors and robes that give chameleon which you can add on as well.
-You can make potions that give chameleon of up to 40%ish that can last for several minutes.

Combine any three of these, and you can get 100% chameleon without ever joining the Mages Guild.


In Morrowind, getting 100% chameleon is super easy and doesn't even require any particularly bad exploits, because there's a specific fight you can engage in fairly early in the game that will get you an 80% chameleon ring. Topping up to 100% from there is no problem.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby not baby Newt » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:22 pm UTC

omgryebread wrote:1) I think the emphasis there should be on "My" and not "thief". My thief in oblivion, motivated by greed and a desire to collect books, was quite happy to do a few fetch quests for some magicky chumps so he could steal their stuff and get enchanting to be an even better thief.
Oh sure. Everyone decides for themselves what to do, and rigid class boundaries are not an elder scrolls thing.

Perhaps I can say that a chameleon suit is more easily accessible to a mage with slight stealth tendencies than to a thief, and thus not a good argument for thieves having it easy.

2) Why is dlc CHEATING? It's designed by the game's original designers, it's as much a part of the game as horse armor or Knights of the Nine. I realize it's a single player game, so the whole idea of cheating is a bit arbitrary, but violating made-up rules in a videogame is never cheating, and the game balance shouldn't need them.

Never actually played any oblivion dlc except SI. The various houses/lairs gave me the impression of "buy cool house! Easy access to enchanting" (and items and.. uh.. vampirism?) Selling dlc by making the early game easier. Sort of like how starting with an ebony sword and $10000 would significantly alter the game difficulty, and annoy me as dlc. And thus... the financial motives make the changes suspect, thus I draw my arbitrary line in the sand *here* instead. And then take that line seriously enough to do boring quests too many times.

Doogly: same answer.

Mumphy: Regarding thing in spoiler, yes it is. In general, if you're not getting a message about needing <perk> to improve magic items you might be on PC, have remapped some keys, and still trust the on screen hints.

Edit:
Laserguy, I'd say that IS hard, comparatively. I mean it's only slightly less effort/luck/level required for reaching the armor cap without using armor and possibly near-immunity to magic.

Dunno what to say about morrowind. Don't remember if it made you immune there too.
Last edited by not baby Newt on Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:53 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The Elder Scrolls 5: Skyrim : Dual Wield Bacon

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Jan 31, 2012 5:47 pm UTC

Mumpy wrote:Theives guild stuff/ advice needed.
Spoiler:
Does anyone know if it's actually possible to improve nightingale armour? I have a load of void salts, but nothing doing on the workbench.

Yes? What is the precise problem you're having?

Spoiler:
Is the Nightingale Armor not showing on the list to be improved? Is it there but greyed out even though you have the Arcane Smith perk and Void Salts? Is it there, you're able to select it, but you can't improve it beyond a mediocre Fine or Flawless when you're thinking it should be Legendary?
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