Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

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Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 17, 2011 4:00 pm UTC

Link to a relevant website, Steam page, has trailer video

It... really looks like Dungeon Keeper. Down to the little imp Goblin running with a pickaxe, scared by who only knows.

...

I hope it's good. I really do. I liked Dungeon Keeper.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Jessica » Mon Jan 17, 2011 6:40 pm UTC

Signed up for the Beta. They ask you if you've played Dungeon keeper.

It looks quite similar.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Xeio » Mon Jan 17, 2011 6:45 pm UTC

Yea I saw this before, I won't be getting my hopes up so they aren't crushed when it finally releases.

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby pseudoidiot » Mon Jan 17, 2011 7:00 pm UTC

For some reason I never got around to playing Dungeon Keeper. I always liked the idea of it. Might try to catch this one when it goes on sale. Hopefully they'll have a demo.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Vaniver » Mon Jan 17, 2011 7:43 pm UTC

How does Dungeon Keeper compare to Evil Genius? They seem like very similar concepts with different themes, so I'm mostly interested in quality of execution.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Xeio » Mon Jan 17, 2011 7:52 pm UTC

Vaniver wrote:How does Dungeon Keeper compare to Evil Genius? They seem like very similar concepts with different themes, so I'm mostly interested in quality of execution.
Similar, but slightly different. Overall if you've played Evil Genius, you've played something very close to dungeon keeper (and would probably like both if you liked one). Though Dungeon Keeper was much less impossible (and I loved skirmish modes).

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Jessica » Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:19 pm UTC

Other than the fantasy vs Bond/60s theme, the biggest difference was the multiple levels. Instead of having 2 islands in Evil Genius, each quest in Dungeon keeper had a new level you created from scratch. Also, the minions were more varied in dungeon keeper.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 17, 2011 8:51 pm UTC

Dungeon Keeper 1 - 2 vs Evil Genius

Dungeon Keeper - Pretty much linear Minions. Outside of their level, a Goblin was a Goblin was a Goblin, a Vampire was a Vampire was a Vampire, and so on. Creatures didn't really change or evolve into other creatures... (with a few exceptions, as I said. DK1 had a thing where a 10th level Salamander could become a 4th level Dragon, and there was the Sacrificial Pool where you could sacrifice minions in certain combination to get other minions. Letting creatures starve to death in Jail made skeletons... you get the idea) and if they can perform tasks outside of Combat, it's fairly restrictive too - Vampires, Warlocks and Wizards (Good) were the only research creatures, Dark Mistresses were the only torture/conversion class, and so on. Assuming it had a job - one monster, one job.

Evil Genius made it so a minion could get on different career tracks and had the notion of a Right Hand in the form of a Henchman. I seem to recall minions being of more generic work descriptions so that the Science Guy could research OR build in the workshop, but I may be mistaken.



Even in the "Restrictive" levels, Dungeon Keeper pretty much let you carve out your own design.
Evil Genius had a greatly reduced area, so that the freest maps felt like the most restrictive DK ones.

It's been a while since I've played EG, and I didn't play it as much as I played DK, so I don't recall if there was a specific worker class that fled from danger in EG.

Alllllllll that being said - Evil Genius and Dungeon Keeper are basically the same game, one's just a Fantasy game and the other's a Bond movie.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Jan 18, 2011 2:48 am UTC

Man this game looks awesome. I love these types of games, totally signing up. Although the trailer irked me 'cause it was clipping pretty badly.

Anyone else see this? http://dungeonempires.gamigo.com/ I signed up for this one quite a while ago. I donno much about it though.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Goldstein » Tue Jan 18, 2011 7:49 am UTC

Very keen. However, this struck me as a little weird:
Blurb wrote:So throw [the invading heroes] a few treasures and some equipment, give them a couple of fights for entertainment and cherish and look after them. And once they are finally happy enough - it's time for the "harvest". For happy heroes have more valuable soul energy for you to gleefully extract from them in your prison or torture chamber!

Aside from the very idea of a happy hero being in your prison or torture chamber, I hope this weird sim element doesn't break the basic mechanic of smashing heroes who come anywhere near the dungeon.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Vaniver » Tue Jan 18, 2011 8:04 am UTC

Goldstein wrote:Aside from the very idea of a happy hero being in your prison or torture chamber, I hope this weird sim element doesn't break the basic mechanic of smashing heroes who come anywhere near the dungeon.
My guess is it is now a "lead them along the garden path that ends in them being captured and tortured" rather than "kill them as soon as they walk through the door."
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Goldstein » Tue Jan 18, 2011 8:16 am UTC

But... I only put the door there because there's a boulder behind it. :(
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:17 am UTC

I think a lot of these games make you to try balance killing the heros outright and just barely beating them.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Jan 18, 2011 4:35 pm UTC

Goldstein wrote:But... I only put the door there because there's a boulder behind it. :(

See, you have a door and they open it and Yay, shinies! And they see another door so they open it and Yay, more shinies! And then the open the third door and Ya.. boulder? AAHH!!

Then you take your shinies back.

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Goldstein » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:10 pm UTC

As they open the third door, the camera goes off and they can buy a photo of their questing expressions at the kiosk on the way out.

Yeah, I guess it's okay. It does also talk about having to out-badass the other dungeon keepers, so that's satisfying from a strategy point of view, and it isn't as though Dungeon Keeper wasn't basically a dungeon management sim anyway. That was most of the fun of it. If anything, being able to place treasure to lure the 'heroes' (Evil can wait, can it?) will make for greater and more reliable trap opportunities. It was always a bit of an anticlimax to see the Dwarf make his own entrance to your dungeon.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:15 pm UTC

Fucking dwarves. I always ended up making a perimeter tunnel around my dungeon just so they couldn't make an unexpected entrance.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby pseudoidiot » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:21 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:Fucking dwarves... make an unexpected entrance.

<_<
>_>
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Menacing Spike » Tue Jan 18, 2011 9:32 pm UTC

pseudoidiot wrote:
SexyTalon wrote:Fucking dwarves... make an unexpected entrance.

<_<
>_>
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I now have a vivid image of guro dwarf hentai.

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake?

Postby Nemiro » Mon Jan 31, 2011 12:11 am UTC

Saw this thread and just thought I'd add that this game turned out to be nothing like Dungeon Keeper. I'd dig up the thing I read, but I may take some time to find it. Suffice to say, someone was very unhappy. Check back here for a link, if I can work out what it was.

EDIT: Thankyou history function and searchable-ness.

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Goldstein » Mon Jan 31, 2011 8:24 am UTC

Wow. Thanks for sharing; I thought I'd surely buy this. The top comment offers a glimmer of hope:
MrSenator wrote:Addendum: It seems like they will be expanding modding support for this game, so there is definitely potential as the engine itself isn't bad, it's mostly the mechanics of the game that ruin it for me. For the sake of all possible future Dungeon Keeper games, I hope this pans out.

I suppose, if the modding tools are up to it, someone'll make a great game out of this. That's a big 'if', mind.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 31, 2011 1:33 pm UTC

....yeeeaahhhh....... but at that point, I'd almost rather just find someone who made a crapload of maps in DKII and play that instead. Because I already know it's going to work well and not suck.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Goldstein » Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:00 pm UTC

Don't go doing this to me now! I was ready to give up when the game description talked about treating your heroes as hotel guests, but you put me off doing that.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Mon Jan 31, 2011 2:35 pm UTC

Maybe there will be awesome mods, I don't know. I do know that buying it in the hopes that someone makes a Dungeon Keeper-style mod is sorta like buying Civilization in the hopes that someone will make a Master of Magic mod. Unless you're ready to sit down and do it yourself or at least get involved with other people who plan on doing it, I.. wouldn't bet on anything.

IF a DK mod comes out and IF people say it doesn't suck, then go right ahead. Until then, I'd wait.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Feb 01, 2011 12:28 am UTC

There is still this other one I linked too, but no idea whether it'll be similar or different.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Vaniver » Tue Feb 01, 2011 2:05 am UTC

Yeah, I have never had an experience where a mod made a bad or mediocre game good, only good games great.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 01, 2011 4:29 am UTC

Gelsamel wrote:There is still this other one I linked too, but no idea whether it'll be similar or different.
Sounds different, but that may not be bad. Signed up, blah blah we'll see how it goes when/if it goes live.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Xeio » Tue Feb 01, 2011 1:29 pm UTC

SecondTalon wrote:
Gelsamel wrote:There is still this other one I linked too, but no idea whether it'll be similar or different.
Sounds different, but that may not be bad. Signed up, blah blah we'll see how it goes when/if it goes live.
Ah, delicious crushed hope.

Though the other one (from its descriptions) sounds more like a turn based neverwinter nights with the ability to make your own maps, but I could be reading that wrong. Well, looking at one of the screens, maybe not, but I dunno...

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Tue Feb 01, 2011 6:06 pm UTC

Yeah, the Turn Based thing is.... I'll have to see it, I guess. So far, the description sounds like someone who likes RPGs who played a lot of Dungeon Keeper, Overlord, Holy Invasion of Privacy, Badman/What Did I Do To Deserve This, My Lord!? and Dungeon Maker, then decided to make a game kinda blending them all.

Sorta.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Menacing Spike » Tue Feb 01, 2011 11:11 pm UTC

I tried the, erhm, unofficial release.
Game is bad.
The ambiance is very nice "taste my +1 sword!" but the gameplay is horrid: you can place static monster generators, hope the ennemies don't die until their needs are filled, and make sure they die on the way out. So either you put monsters in their way and they die and you don't get happy hero juice, or you put monsters out of the way, try to lure the exiting hero to them, and die miserably because of the pathing bugs. Oh, and mages can town portal out anyway!
Game crashes on every autosave; that's every five minutes, with no way to turn it off. But considering the origins of my version, that's forgiveable.

You can develop your MC along three trees: attack, defense, and build. Attack sucks.

Pros: hero chatter, tongue in cheek humor, originality, short loading times. Groveling sidekick. And watching your Demon Lord dash toward the happy, dancing hero is golden.
Cons: fucking everything else

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Goldstein » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:44 pm UTC

It's been released on Steam!

... Well, I thought the thread deserved the update, even if no-one's going to buy it.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Jessica » Fri Feb 04, 2011 8:47 pm UTC

I already pre-ordered. Because I'm a sucker like that.

And it looked interesting enough.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Fri Feb 04, 2011 9:28 pm UTC

Jessica wrote:I already pre-ordered. Because I'm a sucker like that.

And it looked interesting enough.
I look forward to your review.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Dobblesworth » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:37 pm UTC

I never played DK. I guess Dungeons is a nice concept, but I was massively put off by the CGI in the trailer of interaction cutscenes. If that's ingame content, then it's behind the times. Yes this is the days of Minecraft, but when their UI and gameplay shots look fairly polished/zoomed-out far enough you gloss over the polygons, and then fragments of video "ooh here's a goblin, ooh here's you summoning a skeleton while scowling under black battleplate" pop up, with the graphical awesome to rival Baldur's Gate when for instance Torchlight might be something to aim for, I'm not convinced.

Edited for clarification.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Izawwlgood » Sat Feb 05, 2011 9:56 pm UTC

Dungeon Keeper cam out around, I dunno, 2000 or so. So yes, it is 'behind the times'.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Xeio » Sun Feb 06, 2011 2:49 am UTC

1997 and 1999 (for the sequel) even. I'm not sure if I should be bewildered or amused by calling the graphics on games older than 10 years... outdated... :P

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby SecondTalon » Sun Feb 06, 2011 3:33 am UTC

I'm.. pretty sure Dobbs was talking about the graphics of Dungeons, not Dungeon Keeper.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Dobblesworth » Sun Feb 06, 2011 6:47 pm UTC

ST: correct. I will indeed clarify this was me watching the Dungeons trailer on Steam and seeing FMV-ish cutscenes interspersed with game footage, and finding their development lacking.

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Jessica » Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:26 am UTC

So, it's out.

I've played maybe 10 minutes of it. It looks like dungeon keeper, but it isn't dungeon keeper. The controls are pretty shitty, and it seems like you have to do everything with the avatar. But, maybe I just haven't figured out what other commands. There is this silly leveling your character thing which is just dumb. The challenges are interesting, but most of them seem to be "get 5 of this" or "don't get a lot of gold..."

Eh.

I wish it were dungeon keeper.

I'll give it another chance later.
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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Xeio » Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:19 am UTC

There is also a demo out. It is poor.

*cries*

They could have made a clone of dungeon keeper with more monsters/better graphics/improved controls and I would have been pretty happy... whyyyy

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Re: Dungeons : A Dungeon Keeper Remake? Answer: No.

Postby Jessica » Mon Feb 14, 2011 4:54 pm UTC

I know, Xeio. I know.

It could have been awesome. It was easy to be awesome. But no. It's fail instead.

D: D: D:
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