Kerbal Space Program

Of the Tabletop, and other, lesser varieties.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby yurell » Fri Jul 25, 2014 11:04 pm UTC

Biliboy wrote:What's a good design with, say, the first two tiers of research parts, for getting orbit with plenty of extra fuel, and/or getting to the mun?


You may gain inspiration from these two vidoes: Scott Manley finishes the science tree in the new career mode in two flights part one and part two.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Jul 26, 2014 11:16 am UTC

This works:

Spoiler:
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1 kerbal capsule with 1 central parachute, two radial parachutes, and an antenna.
1 Science materials bay with two mystery goo units.
FL-T400 fuel tank (optionally with solar panels and landing legs stuck to the sides)
LV-909 engine (the little stubby engine)
Decoupler
Two FL-T400 fuel tanks
LV-909 engine
Decoupler
Ten FL-T400 fuel tanks with inline reaction wheels on top
Five LV-T45 engines (the ones with 200 thrust and gimbaling)
Decoupler
Seven Rockomax BACC solid fuel boosters in a hex configuration

I landed that on the Mun and returned it to Kerbin with an abundance of fuel remaining. Doesn't require you to get very far into the tech tree.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Biliboy » Sat Jul 26, 2014 9:54 pm UTC

yurell wrote:
Biliboy wrote:What's a good design with, say, the first two tiers of research parts, for getting orbit with plenty of extra fuel, and/or getting to the mun?


You may gain inspiration from these two vidoes: Scott Manley finishes the science tree in the new career mode in two flights part one and part two.


That was just... crazy.

And SlyReaper, thank you, that design got me to the mun fairly easily, though I must be doing something wrong with the initial ascent, because I needed to use the 909 to finish kerbin orbit, which used up quite a bit of fuel. Should have enough to get back home though.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sun Jul 27, 2014 7:39 am UTC

Nah, you're not doing it wrong. I used the first 909 to get into orbit as well. That stage is for finishing getting into orbit, and then cruising to the Mun. In my flight, there was enough left in that stage to circularise and begin my descent towards the Mun's surface. Then it's all down to the final stage to land, do science, launch, and fly back to Kerbin.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Biliboy » Sun Jul 27, 2014 8:00 pm UTC

I made the landing, though I used up the second stage before the descent.

My problems began when after eva I wandered a bit, planted a flag, took samples, and jetpack'd back to the lander... and promptly ran into it and knocked it over. Oh well, rescue mission time! Or reload save, you know, whichever is easiest.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Mutex » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:19 pm UTC

Am I the only person who plays sandbox? I prefer setting my own challenges to having to deal with a tech tree, science and budgets.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:38 pm UTC

I did sandbox to death when it was only sandbox available. It's nice to have some goals and constraints to stop me getting bored with just launching ridiculously over-engineered rockets all the time.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Will » Mon Jul 28, 2014 1:38 pm UTC

I'm the same, I didn't enjoy science at all. I like setting my own goals, and the science system pushes me to set goals I find incredibly boring (like landing on the mun over and over again to get all the science on it)

I'm more interested in contracts, though, because I like the idea of having to deal with budget constraints. So far, though, it's not doing much to constrain me--at any given time I have about 10-20x as much money as I need to do whatever I'm aiming to do.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Biliboy » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:27 pm UTC

Sooo... is it possible to get a kerbin return, from low Mun orbit, with 27 units of fuel and a 909 engine? I must have used up too much fuel in landing, and my save is from the surface because i was so glad to actually land without exploding yet again.

I've tried a few times, playing around with maneuvers, but can't seem to get closer than 400k or so to kerbin, not close enough to hit atmo anyway.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Jul 28, 2014 9:35 pm UTC

Get out and push.

No seriously, that actually works in Kerbal Space Program. Burn what fuel you have left so you end up in an elliptical Kerbin orbit, then decouple everything so it's just your capsule left. At apoapsis, EVA your kerbalnaut, fly him around to the back of your capsule, and push the capsule in a retrograde direction. It helps to leave SAS on in the capsule so that it doesn't rotate. Be careful to leave the kerbalnaut with enough jetpack fuel to get him back inside the capsule.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Biliboy » Tue Jul 29, 2014 12:22 am UTC

So no tricksy slingshot orbits that plant me back into the planet? Bummer... I played with time warps after leaving Mun orbit, but the only slingshots I ran into threw me away, not back in.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Kulantan » Thu Jul 31, 2014 4:16 pm UTC

Will wrote:I'm the same, I didn't enjoy science at all. I like setting my own goals, and the science system pushes me to set goals I find incredibly boring (like landing on the mun over and over again to get all the science on it)

I'm more interested in contracts, though, because I like the idea of having to deal with budget constraints. So far, though, it's not doing much to constrain me--at any given time I have about 10-20x as much money as I need to do whatever I'm aiming to do.


I wish they would give biomes to Duna, Eve and Laythe. As it is the Mun and Minmus are way too bountiful in term of science and the other planets so unrewarding for the effort. Endless Mun mission is really not what I want to be doing to get science.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby yurell » Fri Aug 15, 2014 8:23 am UTC

Started a new game in career mode with a bunch of mods, and it's a lot of fun. The main ones are Deadly Re-entry (G-force and shock heating damage components/kill kerbals), Ferram Aerospace (better aerodynamic modelling), Real Solar System (replaces all the planets with their real-life equivalent at real-life scales — I used the option to keep the Kerbol system, but have it at a realistic scale) and Kerbal Interstellar (adds soooo much more to the tech tree).

That said, a little complaint — there has to be a better way of navigating three-dimensional space than using an artificial horizon.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Thu Jan 29, 2015 8:57 pm UTC

So, I went ahead and flew an SSTO spaceplane to the Mun's surface and back. You know, just because I can.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1vRWu1KIWw
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:16 pm UTC

Looks like you lost something near the end there! but neat! Your plane looked like a penis!

I accidentally clicked on a Scott Manly video when I first opened yours, and had this spit take where I thought you were Scott Manly.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:20 pm UTC

Oh God, I wish!

Yes, the wings just sort of disintegrated for no reason at the end there. Seriously, I was doing little more than 100m/s, there was no reason for them to fall off. But they fell off symmetrically, so I was still able to land the bugger.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Yakk » Thu Jan 29, 2015 9:48 pm UTC

KSP: Mission successful. The wings fell off, but it was symmetrical.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Thu Feb 05, 2015 9:32 pm UTC

First time doing a direct ascent flight to Duna and back, without docking ports or nuclear engines.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jgugU-vsqI
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Mutex » Fri Feb 13, 2015 8:06 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:So, I went ahead and flew an SSTO spaceplane to the Mun's surface and back. You know, just because I can.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g1vRWu1KIWw


Nice :) I was trying to do something similar to that for a while but with NO refuelling... One day I'll manage it, but I think it'll take multiple stages, just reusable ones.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby sardia » Wed Mar 18, 2015 11:22 pm UTC

Is there a way to refuel an EVA pack without reboarding a ship? I may or may not have a kerbal out of fuel in high orbit over earth. If not, I'll have to use the klaw and land him with the kerbal still outside.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby PolakoVoador » Thu Mar 19, 2015 3:43 am UTC

Can't you build a ship with enough room in it for your stranded kerbonaut? Anyway, AFAIK, if you have a kerbonaut on the outside, you can't accelerate time, so be prepared.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Thu Mar 19, 2015 12:19 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:First time doing a direct ascent flight to Duna and back, without docking ports or nuclear engines.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jgugU-vsqI

Most kerbal conclusion ever.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby sardia » Thu Mar 19, 2015 1:51 pm UTC

PolakoVoador wrote:Can't you build a ship with enough room in it for your stranded kerbonaut? Anyway, AFAIK, if you have a kerbonaut on the outside, you can't accelerate time, so be prepared.

He's not in a ship, he's in his EVA suit from an excursion on Minmus and I ran out of eva fuel because I overshot him out of Minmus orbit and into orbit around Earth. Getting an astronaut who's out of fuel into a ship is devishly hard without resorting to the klaw. It's harder still without mechjeb and really good RCS.

Spoiler:
I managed to do it in 3 tries, with the klaw. The first attempt was to push him with another kerbonaut to push him out of an escape trajectory to the sun. The 2nd attempt was to spirit the data from him and to get him onboard without the claw. The 3rd attempt was with the Klaw, which lets me grab things without a docking port + initiate burns with time warping.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Caprice » Tue Apr 21, 2015 12:47 am UTC

My odd flight of this month:
Capsule Mk 1 on top of basic SRB, nothing else.
20 seconds after liftoff, I ejected my Kerbal (I think Jeb) from the rocket. He actually got to nearly 30km before reaching apoapsis. Surprisingly, he survived without a parachute, while the rocket was destroyed. Sadly, I got no Science Points.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby ElWanderer » Wed Apr 29, 2015 10:51 am UTC

Woohoo, version 1.0 is available, with a massive raft of changes! Seems a lot of relearning how to play will be required.

Due to the recent birth of my son (an even more woohoo!-worthy event for me, of course), I haven't even had the computer on since the launch. I may have some time to play it in the far future.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Yakk » Wed Apr 29, 2015 11:55 am UTC

It will still be around when your kid leaves for college, never fear.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby sardia » Wed Apr 29, 2015 1:48 pm UTC

Yakk wrote:It will still be around when your kid leaves for college, never fear.

All my mods broke. =( Oh well, most of them got incorporated.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby ElWanderer » Fri May 01, 2015 8:49 pm UTC

Version 1.0.2 is out (following hot on the heels of v1.0.1)... still not had the chance to play, but at least I've not had to suffer the heatshield weirdness or rapidly-overheating nuclear engines that a lot of people were complaining about.

The changelist for v1.0.1 is pretty long - they must've had quite a lot of late-developed fixes they didn't dare stick into v1.0 right before release. I can understand that; in my experience rushed fixes that look like they should be self-contained have a habit of breeding unexpected bugs. And that also seems to be why they had to follow v1.0.1 with v1.0.2 so quickly.

Seems some of the drag and heat parameters have changed, so any part mods that got altered for v1.0 may need updating again.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby mike-l » Mon May 04, 2015 12:08 am UTC

The new aero system is good, drag is modelled much better so you can't tilt 45 degrees from prograde in thick atmo anymore and expect to maintain control. In fact an aerodynamically stable rocket now does a proper gravity turn almost entirely on its own as it should.

1.0.1/2 nerfed reheating to the point that heat shields are irrelevant, which needs to be fixed. In the meantime I've just edited physics.cfg to use the 1.0 values, but this also makes the DV requirement to orbit lower than stock. I saw someone posted settings that fix heat while not nerfing drag, will give it a try tonight.

Resource mining is interesting, stability is better (but still some leaks... Turn off heat indicators, and there are some others I haven't identified that cause crashes on occasion).

Career mode is improved from 0.90, automating records fixes the annoying "limit your first 5 launches" problem, and science exploits are reduced. But it's still horribly balanced, too many records and money at the start make the first upgrades trivial, more than ample science in Kerbin SOI to max out the tech tree, and infinite science once you get the lab. Tech tree unlocks way too fast (Newest career [I play self imposed "hardcore", any death requires a restart] did Launch first vessel/pad science on first flight, orbit on second, orbit mun and Minmus on third and orbit Duna on fourth). Admittedly I'm a pretty experienced player (a new player would not be able to efficiently transfer from Mun to Minmus without patched conics) but a) hard mode should still provide a challenge to experienced players and b) career mode should have more progression than 1 do anything, 2 get to orbit, 3 perform a transfer 4 go interplanetary. Even a newer player could do this in some extra flights, as just orbiting the mun and Minmus gives tons of science.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Sun May 10, 2015 7:16 am UTC

I find the tech tree to be so wonky right now that I'm quitting career and switching to sandbox for a bit. I feel like I've done this 'minimal mun and minmus grinding' thing a handful of times already.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby mike-l » Sun May 10, 2015 2:36 pm UTC

I've been playing Better Than Starting Manned, it's a complete career overhaul and much more in line with what I'm looking for in a career mode. It's just starting to be updated for 1.0, but you can play the full campaign in 0.90 still.

Firstly it eliminates all Kerbin science below 15000m, heavily nerfs or outright removes reaction wheels, and makes energy a meaningful resource. Secondly the tech tree and parts are rebalanced so that the progression has many more steps, and the tech nodes actually are meaningful to these steps (unlike: here's the Terrier, go anywhere now). Getting to orbit actually feels like an accomplishment. At every step, I feel like "ok, with that next node I should just barely make this", and at no point does a single flight give enough science for more than 2 nodes.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Will » Mon May 11, 2015 2:44 pm UTC

I find the "grinding for science" thing intensely boring, so my solution was to turn up the science rewards to like 600%. This way I still have to gather science, but I don't have to do a bunch of boring grindy missions to get anywhere.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon May 11, 2015 3:46 pm UTC

Yeah, I noticed the 'custom' game option, and think I can probably find a happy mix of 'having a reason to send/do science places', and 'not having to grind every biome to unlock decouplers'
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby mike-l » Mon May 11, 2015 4:55 pm UTC

Since I restart every time a kerbal dies I've developed a pretty efficient start, which isn't overly grindy and unlocks most of the early tree in only a few flights. This is on hard mode so it progresses even faster if you increase the science rewards. It also avoids all Kerbin ground science as that's boring and grindy and isn't time efficient.

1) Take science from Kerbin and Launch first vessel. Launch one goo, capsule, chute and flea with fuel mostly emptied. Get crew and goo flying low.

2) unlock engineering 101 and basic rocketry, take orbit Kerbin and escape atmosphere. Launch a capsule, chute, bay, two Reliants + decouplers, 3 basic fins on lower stage, and the rest T100 tanks. Send bob, get mat bay low, reach orbit a few degrees south of east. Return to space centre, pick up Return to Kerbin from orbit and upgrade Astro complex. Get space crew report, EVA and take the crew report from the capsule and reset bay, get space bay and reset again. Complete one orbit getting 7 biomes worth of EVA (launching a few degrees south gets the badlands on the first pass. Launching a few degrees north gets it on second pass). Deorbit and get high atmo crew, Eva and bay on the way down.

3) Upgrade launchpad, unlock general and advanced rocketry, survivability and stability (survivability not strictly required). Take Fly by the Mun, do not take a second contract. Build a ship that has enough DV to orbit the Mun and adjust orbit a fair bit. I don't bring any experiments because I still have a 30 part limit here and I want as much DV as possible. Get a Mun encounter. Grab high space crew and EVA. As soon as SOI change, do a radial burn to get a good peri then switch to step 4

4) Return to space centre and look for the next world first contract. It's usually rendezvous two vessels in orbit, but sometimes it's orbit the Mun. If it's rendezvous, take it as well as a rescue mission and go save that kerbal to complete both contracts.

5) Now you can get orbit the Mun (or you skipped step 4 and got this first), you can also take a visual survey on the Mun. Get crew and EVA high above Mun then get into a low orbit and grab a crew report. Switch back to space centre and see what's the next world first. It can be Return from the Mun or Science from the Mun or Land on the Mun. If it's the first, go back and EVA spam and do any visual survey contracts you picked up (I usually upgrade mission control here). While doing visual surveys I usually get 10ish biomes worth of EVA. If you'd like you can swap into a polar orbit and get the last few biomes. Return to Kerbin.

6) If you got science from the Mun or land on the Mun, send another flight to complete that (should have funds to upgrade VAB now). If you got return from the Mun you can bring the ship home first and you'll get land on the Mun with the benefit of all the science you brought back.

Now you should be able to unlock all the 45s and 1-2 90s. Takes only about an hour to get here. I get electrics and then do a few satellite contracts for money to upgrade the tracking station.

From here I branch out. You can do a handful of satellite contracts to upgrade science centre before doing any landings because surface samples are a ton of science. You can go to Minmus, or go back to the Mun with science experiments. You can even go interplanetary at this point.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon May 11, 2015 6:13 pm UTC

The easiest way to get a ton of science quickly is to get a kerbal in a polar orbit around Kerbin, Mun, and Minmus, and just spam all the crew and EVA reports.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby mike-l » Mon May 11, 2015 7:07 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:The easiest way to get a ton of science quickly is to get a kerbal in a polar orbit around Kerbin, Mun, and Minmus, and just spam all the crew and EVA reports.


Yes and no. That's certainly the lowest DV method to cover all biomes in a single flight, but it's not the fastest, nor the easiest. For example in my outline above, getting a polar orbit on the second launch is considerably harder than getting a near equatorial orbit, as DV is very tight. Polar launches won't always make orbit. I get 7/9 biomes on a single orbit, while a polar orbit would get all 9 it would take about 12-15 orbits to cover all of them. The Mun and Minmus are more valuable, my priority is simply unlocking what I need for them as quick as possible. Spending an extra 10 minutes with the chance of outright failure isn't worth it for the small amount of science that will be dwarfed by the next flight.

The Mun is even harsher in terms of time spent, if you do go for it you definitely want to switch back to the tracking centre to accelerate time much faster, but again I rather take what I get doing surveys and move on to Minmus and or Landing.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby sardia » Mon May 11, 2015 11:33 pm UTC

I really like roaring at high mach speeds in a plane, but I wish there were more planets that could support flight other than Laythe and earth itself. =( That, and the lack of many missions that let you fly around for points. I always like picking up those missions to fly across the planet and land somewhere for science.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby mike-l » Tue May 12, 2015 3:02 am UTC

I know I'm in the minority here, but I have 0 interest in planes. In fact it bugs me that not only are jet engines useful as boosters, they're actually incredibly efficient at it. (Though less so now than in 0.90). Most people seem to love planes though, so it's neat that the game has them.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon Jun 01, 2015 6:11 pm UTC

A goal of mine for some time has been to land an asteroid pusher on a rock, mine the rock for ore, convert that ore to fuel, and use that fuel to push the rock into orbit around Kerbin. I finally managed that goal this last weekend!

I spent about half an in game year checking for rocks that didn't have insanely angled or distant approaches to Kerbin, and finally one came by that had a ~12 degree angled approach at about 6M km.

So I sent my tug to rendezvous, and after a few adjustments it was on it's way! But le gasp! It was nearly out of fuel! Oh man, this was going to be super rough! The closest encounter was about 8km off, and with the last gasps of fuel I carefully twerked the intercept, crossed my fingers, and upped the Time Dilation.

Nervously watching the asteroid approach, I extended the Klaw and dropped time to normal... 1km. 500m. 250m. 100m. 50m... 10m... KAPOW, contact! I had to spin a little bit to snag the rock, but I hit it!

Extending the drills I started gathering ore, and converting it to fuel, and thought man, this is awesome, I'm totally doing it! Then I toggled to the map, and immediately swore - I was 12 minutes to the asteroids orbital periapsis.

Turning on the fuel converters Lf+Ox, Lf, and Ox settings, I juggled maximized fuel generation against power loss for 12m and ended up with about 1/8th of a tank. I toggled the drills, retracted the Klaw and repositioned to the asteroids CoM, and started my retrograde burn.

Juuuuuuuuuust as the asteroid entered a stable if somewhat eccentric orbit, I zeroed on fuel. Not too bad! By the time I got to the ascending node I had full fuel tanks and started my circularizing and altitude reduction burns.

Now I've got the first asteroid in a circular ~350km orbit, and will start constructing my asteroid base.
... with gigantic melancholies and gigantic mirth, to tread the jeweled thrones of the Earth under his sandalled feet.

Mutex
Posts: 851
Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2008 10:32 pm UTC

Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Mutex » Mon Jun 01, 2015 8:10 pm UTC

I take it the ore in asteroids is finite? Otherwise you could make a big asteroid-ship with infinite fuel.


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