Kerbal Space Program

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:05 pm UTC

You could indeed. My own moon landings were direct ascent missions, but you could indeed do a lunar orbit rendez-vous mission now. But as I've demonstrated, you don't need to; it's possible to create ridiculously over-engineered rockets that can land and take off again, and return to Kerbin with loads of fuel to spare.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby PhoenixEnigma » Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:35 pm UTC

Izawwlgood wrote:Can you have multiple things going at once? Like, a satellite in orbit, and then send a refueling mission to it?

I've been working with a mod called RemoteTech, which added/changes unmanned (unkerbaled?) modules with communication requirements that more or less demand at least a few concurrent missions. A slightly older screenshot of one of my saves, that shows an assortment of junk, three comm sats in Kerbal synchronous orbit, two more in polar orbits, and a mapping satellite in a higher polar orbit:
Spoiler:
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sun Dec 09, 2012 4:54 pm UTC

My first moon landing without anything breaking off my ship.

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And safely back on Kerbin.

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Edit: just managed to dock two spacecraft together in orbit. God damn that was tricky.

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby NieXS » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:21 am UTC

Dark567 wrote:
SlyReaper wrote:It's actually possible now to dock your spacecraft to other spacecraft in orbit. That's a feature that was added in the latest version, 0.18. That's definitely a task that rewards patience, and I've not yet attempted it myself. I'd say it takes even more finesse than landing on another planet.
Woah, so you could in theory do an apollo type mission? That would be pretty insane.
You indeed can! And it's vastly more efficient than the alternative. Got to the Mun and to Duna doing something similar to that, but the "command module" was unmanned. Also, you don't know terror if you haven't done a rendezvous around Duna while not even being sure if you have enough fuel to enter orbit. :P

Here's my rocket:
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Steax » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:57 am UTC

Holy crap has this game changed. Gonna look into it again now.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:23 am UTC

So uhh. Does it come with training? Like, I now own this game and it seems pretty cool! But I only got two training missions, both of which reference "basic flight training" and I am pretty sure I am missing stuff! I'm not sure how to get it or if it's even really supposed to be there, given, you know, alpha.

I mean I am actually doing ok in the training missions but it seems like the basic one would be... helpful, at the least.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby NieXS » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:53 am UTC

Shivahn wrote:So uhh. Does it come with training? Like, I now own this game and it seems pretty cool! But I only got two training missions, both of which reference "basic flight training" and I am pretty sure I am missing stuff! I'm not sure how to get it or if it's even really supposed to be there, given, you know, alpha.

I mean I am actually doing ok in the training missions but it seems like the basic one would be... helpful, at the least.
Basic tutorials aren't in the game right now, but I recommend this guy's videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tgPr4q5tj-Q
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:23 am UTC

Trial and error is also a good teacher if you're patient enough, and it's a lot more fun.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:18 am UTC

Thankes, NieXS!

Yeah, trial and error is ok, but the big thing to me is the design and the launch and stuff. I don't want to be pissed off because of the mechanics, I want to be satisfied because my designs worked. If that makes sense.

Mostly it was just annoying to have to figure out that you have to throttle up liquid rockets, they don't start at full blast on their own. And that you can throttle before pressing space to launch. My first failures were because I was expecting the interface to behave differently. That's the kind of stuff I want tutorials to teach me.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Soralin » Sat Dec 15, 2012 2:28 am UTC

And I recommend these videos: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tXN5ZBeKpY Not as a tutorial, just because. ;)
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:12 am UTC

Ugh, I think there is a gamebreaking bug for me. Every time I am thrusting to make a circular orbit from an apoapsis, it works for a few seconds, then I lose the ability to control the thing. I can cut the throttle (and the thing cuts on the navball!) but the thrust keeps going in the non-map view. Also, I lose the ability to correct any wobble... I usually am trying to keep it pointed at the target, but at some point it will just start to spin wildly. Like I'd expect if the game thought I was continually holding down D.

Am I doing something completely wrong or missing something obvious, or is that something that's.. not supposed to happen and a bug?
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Steax » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:30 am UTC

I am not a kerbal engineer nor scientist, and no expert to be sure (nor played the latest version), but could it be that you haven't switched to the RCS thrusters?
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Sat Dec 15, 2012 3:35 am UTC

I don't have them. Which might be the problem. It's just weird that my engines keep going and it will start spinning more and more and not respond, even though until the thrust it doesn't act wacky.

Edit: I think it might be two bugs. Or I know nothing of the interfaces. I'm messing around with the default Kerbin X design, and when I go into the mode where I can see the capsule, I all of a sudden can't control anything. It gets fixed in map mode.

Or wait no it was just in docking mode. Hrm. Frustrating!

Edit for the end result of that mission:

I hope my guys weren't attached to Kerbin. My impatience with the time warp has resulted in them orbiting Kerbol. Uh, whoops!

Also, I figured out the problem. I was launching a probe and it's running out of electricity because I didn't attach a battery or charger correctly.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby NieXS » Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:03 am UTC

Shivahn wrote:Ugh, I think there is a gamebreaking bug for me. Every time I am thrusting to make a circular orbit from an apoapsis, it works for a few seconds, then I lose the ability to control the thing. I can cut the throttle (and the thing cuts on the navball!) but the thrust keeps going in the non-map view. Also, I lose the ability to correct any wobble... I usually am trying to keep it pointed at the target, but at some point it will just start to spin wildly. Like I'd expect if the game thought I was continually holding down D.

Am I doing something completely wrong or missing something obvious, or is that something that's.. not supposed to happen and a bug?
Your rocket engine and your command module got separated somehow so you can't control the rocket anymore. Look for structural failures in the End Flight screen and consider adding more struts.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Sat Dec 15, 2012 5:55 am UTC

NieXS wrote:
Shivahn wrote:Ugh, I think there is a gamebreaking bug for me. Every time I am thrusting to make a circular orbit from an apoapsis, it works for a few seconds, then I lose the ability to control the thing. I can cut the throttle (and the thing cuts on the navball!) but the thrust keeps going in the non-map view. Also, I lose the ability to correct any wobble... I usually am trying to keep it pointed at the target, but at some point it will just start to spin wildly. Like I'd expect if the game thought I was continually holding down D.

Am I doing something completely wrong or missing something obvious, or is that something that's.. not supposed to happen and a bug?
Your rocket engine and your command module got separated somehow so you can't control the rocket anymore. Look for structural failures in the End Flight screen and consider adding more struts.

That is more or less what happened. I did not have a battery so the photovoltaic stuff didn't... work. So yeah, exact same effect.

On the plus side, now I know that and also have put two satellites into stable equatorial orbit and one into a low circular polar orbit. I'm gonna screw around with those before doing anything with valuable, valuable people.

Mostly because I feel sort of bad that there are three frozen Kerbals somewhere just outside of Kerbin's gravity. Though I've learned enough about transfer orbits and stuff that hopefully that won't be a problem in the future.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:24 am UTC

I think we've all stranded Kerbals in space with no ticket home before. We're monsters.

When you're a bit more confident about how stuff works and how to fly it, have a search for "asparagus launchers ksp". It is, to my knowledge, one of the most fuel efficient ways to launch and travel. I usually reach orbit with loads of fuel in a massive orange tank to spare, and I end up having to dump it because it makes it difficult to turn my rocket. That's how awesome it is - you can afford to dump precious fuel for the sake of maneuverability.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby gnutrino » Sat Dec 15, 2012 9:06 pm UTC

So today I learnt you can put a minimal probe into orbit using nothing but RCS thrusters. I still can't get things to dock without nudging something a bit wrong and ending up with one or the other vehicle in an uncontrollable sping though :(.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:03 pm UTC

The RCS thing is apparently going to be changed in the next update, so it won't be that overpowered for much longer.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Josephine » Sat Dec 15, 2012 10:35 pm UTC

A few minutes ago, I replicated Scott Manley's design for an RCS powered probe exploiting the center-of-mass glitch/exploit. I got up to 29 km/s before I forgot to turn back to the sun
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Sat Dec 15, 2012 11:48 pm UTC

A probe to Mun just turned into a probe to Minmus because gravity slingshot. Even better! Also I got there with most of my final stage fuel tank in there (I know it's not that impressive but I just started!)

Dealing with getting into orbit was a pain in the ass though. I need to get better with the camera. There was a lot of fiddling around trying to see which axes were off so I could reduce the periapsis during the encounter.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Technical Ben » Sun Dec 16, 2012 1:55 pm UTC

This looks so beautiful. A great jump from the Alphas and Betas I played. Might get a copy with my next paycheck. :D
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby cemper93 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:14 am UTC

I just started playing it and OH MY GOSH THIS GAME IS SO AMAZING

Just look at my first satellite to ever reach a stable near-circular orbit around Kerbin:
Image

There is also a capsule with three Kerbonauts on an accidental orbit around Kerbin. They do still have fuel, but not parachutes. I continuously try to send rescue missions to bring them back, but this program is a little like in Saving Private Ryan (so far, twelve brave Kerbonauts died in doing their honorable deed). Apparently, I really don't get how to make two objects meet in orbit :(
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Tue Dec 18, 2012 5:52 pm UTC

Your satellite is pretty.

Mine are all spheres with batteries and tiny solar panels and equipment attached. Though, I do have at least one orbiting every body in the local Kerbin system. And one orbiting Kerbol in a super elliptical orbit.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby HarvesteR » Tue Dec 18, 2012 7:35 pm UTC

So nice to see this thread picking up speed again. :)

Thanks for the many nice comments guys!

About the tutorials, there are only those two on the current version yes, but there is a new patch coming very soon now, that'll include two new tutorials that explain the basic essentials of flying and construction. We also have many others planned for the near future as well.

Happy launching!

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby cemper93 » Tue Dec 18, 2012 8:31 pm UTC

Shivahn wrote:Your satellite is pretty.


Thank you, but the design was actually unplanned. I just symmetrically attached two times six of the closed-hull variety of solar cells around a structural fuel tank without actually knowing how this would look once they would unfold (or, in fact, without knowing that they could be unfolded at all - I had thought I could only open the hatches in space).

However, I do now also have a smaller probe orbiting the Mun at 150,000m periapsis and 153,000m apoapsis. I didn't use the maneuver planning system at all. I guess I am a naturally born Kerbonaut! I did have to peek on the orbit view, though.

The only thing that didn't quite work out was getting rid of the space debris. I attached a small satellite core to the rocket that brought my satellite to the orbit around the Mun and left some fuel in it so I could just crash it in the Mun later or something like that. Unfortunately, the rocket ran out of electricity because I forgot to take a battery or solar panel. Oh well...
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Fri Dec 21, 2012 11:47 am UTC

0.18.2 is out. The most interesting part is there's a new snowball-like planet called Eeloo - a Pluto analogue. It's in an inclined elliptical orbit in a 3:2 resonance with Jool, just as Pluto is in a 3:2 resonance with Neptune. I'm actually a bit disappointed they didn't put more gas giants in before starting on the ice dwarfs. I would have liked to have seen a Saturn analogue with loads of moons and a ring system.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Fri Dec 21, 2012 3:56 pm UTC

Saturn is probably a pain in the ass due to its hojillion moons and rings. It'd be awesome to have, but it probably will take five times as long as the next most complex planet to code.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Fri Dec 21, 2012 7:45 pm UTC

I've been getting a bit hacked off with the patcher. I've been trying to update all day, and only when it has spent hours downloading the update does it come up with an error that says "no", and erasing all progress it had made. It also corrupted the version I already had installed so I can't play that either.

Has anyone been able to update their version through the patcher? Or is it time to start looking for a torrent?
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby HarvesteR » Fri Dec 21, 2012 8:40 pm UTC

We're not going to support the current patcher anymore. We're working on a completely new one, and in the meantime, we've made the game available as a full download from Amazon. Should be quicker and much less painful to just download a 400mb-ish zip file.

Thanks for not pirating the game. :)

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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Fri Dec 21, 2012 9:01 pm UTC

That's good news about revamping the patcher; I've never managed to get the existing one to work right. That must have been changed just today because the store page was still only letting me download the patcher this morning. Thanks for that.

Edit: my first exploration of Eeloo:

Spoiler:
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Technical Ben » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:33 pm UTC

HarvesteR wrote:We're not going to support the current patcher anymore. We're working on a completely new one, and in the meantime, we've made the game available as a full download from Amazon. Should be quicker and much less painful to just download a 400mb-ish zip file.

Thanks for not pirating the game. :)

Cheers

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I suppose I could buy the game then play it later, but I'd so play itas soon as the download finished.

Thanks for the update!
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SurgicalSteel » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:42 am UTC

HarvesteR wrote:we've made the game available as a full download from Amazon.
I can't seem to find it. Is it up yet?
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby BlackSails » Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:01 pm UTC

They should have released a patch on the 21st involving landing on an asteroid and running engines to stop it from obliterating the world.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Sun Dec 23, 2012 7:38 pm UTC

SurgicalSteel wrote:
HarvesteR wrote:we've made the game available as a full download from Amazon.
I can't seem to find it. Is it up yet?

Go to the store page, log in, and then click "my profile". There will be a download link at the bottom.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Tue Jan 01, 2013 12:59 am UTC

I now know asparagus launchers, so that's all I use (seriously, why wouldn't you use those). Just sent a probe to Eeloo, but ran out of fuel so I couldn't get into orbit. Disappointingly, I think the path thing was glitching - it was not showing where Eeloo was and wasn't letting me set my maneuver where I wanted, so I didn't even get to see it. I'll redesign the probe rocket and send another (It seems like such a waste. I knew space exploration was expensive, but damn, I use like 15 of the double small fuel tanks to get a probe out that far.)
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:30 pm UTC

A reason not to use asparagus launchers is they can be ridiculously highly strung and will fly apart with zero provocation if you're not careful. What I've been trying to do the last few days is get a full orange tank of fuel into orbit with a nuclear engine attached. It's a stupidly heavy payload which requires a stupidly overpowered rocket, and it takes a double stacked orange tank asparagus mainsail setup for the launch stage, another orange tank with another mainsail for a middle stage, and the orange tank/nuke engine as the upper stage. The number of struts I had to put on that thing so it wouldn't self destruct on the launchpad was phenomenal, and even then I had to be quick to launch so it wouldn't buckle under its own weight.

Anyway, I finally managed it. It wasn't completely full in orbit because I had to transfer some fuel backwards to the second mainsail stage to finish circularizing my orbit. But it got there, and I have now docked a crew module to it.

Image

There was enough fuel in the poodle stage on the crew rocket to refill that orange tank, and there's even a little bit left over in it. That's okay - I can always use spare fuel, and every other fuel tank in that image is full.

So yeah. A full orange tank feeding into a nuclear engine. It's going to be slow as hell, but that's a hell of a lot of delta-v right there. I don't think it's an exaggeration to say this baby could take me to any planet of my choosing and back, including a landing. I've not yet managed a return trip to anything other than the Mun or Minmus, so I won't be too ambitious with it yet. Duna or Eve will do nicely I think. Decisions, decisions.

Edit: actually, I'm not convinced that crew module has enough power to get back into orbit from an Eve landing, so Duna it is.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:34 pm UTC

I want to eventually get a space station up with fuel tanks, so that I can basically assemble simple ships in orbit. That way, I can make heavy stuff up there piece by piece and not have to make a rocket that can get everything into orbit and then wherever I want it to go eventually.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Tue Jan 01, 2013 10:46 pm UTC

I did a refueling station once and it was rather useful for getting lander probes out to places like Laythe and Eeloo. All I did was dock and transfer fuel across; I didn't actually detach any fuel tanks from the station and take them with me. Be careful of course - docking connections are flimsy at the best of times, and even a simple craft like mine will flex and bend in the most alarming way if you put too much power into it. Slow burns are the order of the day.

Another intriguing thing I've found is that if you attach an engine directly to an orange tank, it tends to overheat. But if I put a smaller tank in between them, it doesn't. That's the only reason I've used a quarter size grey tank between my nuclear engine and the orange tank.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby Shivahn » Tue Jan 01, 2013 11:59 pm UTC

My first mission to Eve was a total failure. The effects of atmosphere should be included in orbital calculations. I tried to aerobrake but underestimated the atmosphere's thickness, and ended up crashing.
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Re: Kerbal Space Program

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Jan 02, 2013 10:51 am UTC

My first Eve mission successfully landed, but the lander hit the ground too hard and broke up. The stupid parachutes cut off when I was still about 200m above the surface, otherwise I'd have been able to soft-land quite easily. Thus, I have one Kerbalnaut on the surface with no way to get home. I posted the image on the previous page:

Spoiler:
Image

The lander legs have fallen in such a way as to look a bit like communication antennas.


That was a while ago though, and I've got better at building, flying and landing rockets since then.
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