Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby sugarhyped » Thu Apr 16, 2009 2:43 am UTC

thatguy wrote:-Issac's paintings are going to get dragged into the story again. He painted Nathan in the Oval office waaay back in the first season, 'member?

There is no way the writers think that far ahead. I think Isaac's picture referred to one of the first fake/possible futures that peter/hiro (i forget which) had to stop. It was still Sylar imitating Nathan though... odd. except that time he had Candice's power.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby thatguy » Thu Apr 16, 2009 3:09 am UTC

sugarhyped wrote:
thatguy wrote:-Issac's paintings are going to get dragged into the story again. He painted Nathan in the Oval office waaay back in the first season, 'member?

There is no way the writers think that far ahead. I think Isaac's picture referred to one of the first fake/possible futures that peter/hiro (i forget which) had to stop. It was still Sylar imitating Nathan though... odd. except that time he had Candice's power.
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Obviously they weren't of this exact situation, but the future's always included Sylar-as-Nathan trying at the presidency. I mean, just because it wasn't originally meant that way doesn't mean the writers can't fit their new story into it. (See: Angela stealing socks.)

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Bubbles McCoy » Thu Apr 16, 2009 4:55 am UTC

I don't think he ever actually had Candice's power, he just took Nathan's form and it was assumed to be due to Candice.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby sugarhyped » Thu Apr 16, 2009 5:51 pm UTC

Bubbles McCoy wrote:I don't think he ever actually had Candice's power, he just took Nathan's form and it was assumed to be due to Candice.

No I believe in that episode he specifically said it was from her.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Thu Apr 16, 2009 6:30 pm UTC

If Sylar had Candice's power in that future, why was Noah trying to send Candice into hiding?

Candice would have been kept on the show, and she would have had a road trip with Sylar at the beginning of the second season, but her original actress quit the show, then her replacement actress quit the show, then they decided "screw it" and killed the character off.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby echoingsilence » Fri Apr 17, 2009 9:52 am UTC

Candice would have been kept on the show, and she would have had a road trip with Sylar at the beginning of the second season, but her original actress quit the show, then her replacement actress quit the show, then they decided "screw it" and killed the character off


Really? I didn't know THAT...

Anyway, a bit off topic, but is it possible Hiro didn't get his power back? Maybe Matt Parkman Jr. just "stopped" everyone else - that would explain why they couldn't teleport

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby thatguy » Fri Apr 17, 2009 1:34 pm UTC

echoingsilence wrote:Anyway, a bit off topic, but is it possible Hiro didn't get his power back? Maybe Matt Parkman Jr. just "stopped" everyone else - that would explain why they couldn't teleport

I think that would require a bit more explaining than the writers are willing to put out this late in the season.
Lumpy wrote:Candice would have been kept on the show, and she would have had a road trip with Sylar at the beginning of the second season, but her original actress quit the show, then her replacement actress quit the show, then they decided "screw it" and killed the character off.

Yeah, she went on the CW's Reaper, which I think is still running...

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Vieto » Fri Apr 17, 2009 10:00 pm UTC

thatguy wrote:
echoingsilence wrote:Anyway, a bit off topic, but is it possible Hiro didn't get his power back? Maybe Matt Parkman Jr. just "stopped" everyone else - that would explain why they couldn't teleport

I think that would require a bit more explaining than the writers are willing to put out this late in the season.

Well, why could Hiro control it with the eye-squinting thing?

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby thatguy » Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:07 am UTC

Vieto wrote:
thatguy wrote:
echoingsilence wrote:Anyway, a bit off topic, but is it possible Hiro didn't get his power back? Maybe Matt Parkman Jr. just "stopped" everyone else - that would explain why they couldn't teleport

I think that would require a bit more explaining than the writers are willing to put out this late in the season.

Well, why could Hiro control it with the eye-squinting thing?

That's him concentrating. That's how his power has always been portrayed on the show.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:14 am UTC

Tim Kring did say back during the first season that he had a "napkin drawing sketch" of where the plot of the series was to go up to the fifth season. I think the problem isn't the writers not knowing where the plot is leading toward, but instead how they fill the middle. There are a few things that look like they were planned from the first episode, like Charles Duveaux's power, and a few things that look like they made up to connect to prior episodes as they went along.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Sat Apr 18, 2009 12:21 pm UTC

I actually didn't catch what exactly Charles Duveaux's power was. Also, I hope we see a lot more of him, because his "old age actor" was really good.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Vieto » Sat Apr 18, 2009 4:08 pm UTC

he was a mind reader, like Matt Parkman's dad, and Matt Parkman. He shared the same dream as Peter Petrelli, who was using Angela's powers

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby SlyReaper » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:29 am UTC

I'm just popping back into this thread to ask: is Heroes good yet? Is it once again worth spending bandwidth on?
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Delalyra » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:08 pm UTC

Watch Into Asylum. Best episode I've seen so far.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Mat » Sun Apr 19, 2009 12:54 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:I'm just popping back into this thread to ask: is Heroes good yet? Is it once again worth spending bandwidth on?

No, not really. I started watching it again (because I have nothing better to do) and while there have been a couple of ok episodes, I'm not convinced. Every storyline still begins with somebody seeing the future and the characters continue to act like idiots all the time.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Sun Apr 19, 2009 8:00 pm UTC

Yes, and apparently seeing the future as a plot device in the Heroes timeline is at least 40 years old. "We're going to do it because I see myself doing it in the future" can only be done so many times with so many twists (like Hiro getting hit on the head with the shovel). Tim Kring said that they wouldn't be doing time travel this season because the writers view it as "a crutch," but they still keep going back to it like Isaac Mendez for his heroin.

Any time a character says a variant of "we're going to do this in the future because I see it in the future and that's why we should do it," replace with "I 'unno. The writers are telling us to." and take a drink.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Random832 » Mon Apr 20, 2009 1:23 pm UTC

I thought of something - the whole flashback plot seems like a self-fulfilling prophecy - Angela sees bad stuff is going to happen, declares that Suresh is not to be trusted, and then bad stuff happens because Alice didn't trust Suresh.

In fact, Angela's entire power seems to be about self-fulfilling prophecies - they form the company - not because she sees that they need to / that bad stuff will happen if they don't - but simply because she sees that they will.

Whereas, the rest aren't 'self-fulfilling" per se - they act on it, but their actions based on the information of the prophecy isn't directly what causes it to happen, not in the same blatant way it is for Angela.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Aikanaro » Mon Apr 20, 2009 2:18 pm UTC

You know, I wonder if she gets a horrible migraine any time someone (herself included) goes directly against her visions, like Ms. Cake....
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:48 pm UTC

Sylar was incredibly strange this episode. Even stranger than anything I ever expected.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Vanguard » Tue Apr 21, 2009 2:55 pm UTC

I want to know why he is suddenly immune by brain-blocking knives.

Overall decent episode, it's gonna get funky if Sylar is able to become the President.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby pseudoidiot » Tue Apr 21, 2009 3:03 pm UTC

Vanguard wrote:I want to know why he is suddenly immune by brain-blocking knives.
I kind of figured maybe Danko's aim was a bit off. That are all the shape-shifting is really messing with his insides.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Tue Apr 21, 2009 5:26 pm UTC

He probably shapeshifted his brain into his toes or something like that (that is, unless the writers learned their lesson about making people more powerful with their silly explanations of things).
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Vanguard » Tue Apr 21, 2009 5:45 pm UTC

headprogrammingczar wrote:He probably shapeshifted his brain into his toes or something like that (that is, unless the writers learned their lesson about making people more powerful with their silly explanations of things).

"Unless...?" That's still failbad.

I wouldn't mind the simple "aim was off" though...
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby aaron » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:33 pm UTC

to me, it looked like the knife wasn't that long. so he probably missed.

although i don't like how the writers are bringing everyone for the finale

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Random832 » Tue Apr 21, 2009 7:50 pm UTC

Vanguard wrote:
headprogrammingczar wrote:He probably shapeshifted his brain into his toes or something like that (that is, unless the writers learned their lesson about making people more powerful with their silly explanations of things).
"Unless...?" That's still failbad.

I wouldn't mind the simple "aim was off" though...
What are you all talking about? It's pretty clear he missed, it's going straight into the back of his skull rather than into the base where the brain stem is like in previous incidents

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Vanguard » Tue Apr 21, 2009 8:47 pm UTC

Random832 wrote:
Vanguard wrote:
headprogrammingczar wrote:He probably shapeshifted his brain into his toes or something like that (that is, unless the writers learned their lesson about making people more powerful with their silly explanations of things).
"Unless...?" That's still failbad.

I wouldn't mind the simple "aim was off" though...
What are you all talking about? It's pretty clear he missed, it's going straight into the back of his skull rather than into the base where the brain stem is like in previous incidents


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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Tue Apr 21, 2009 8:48 pm UTC

Neither am I. This long ago became my TV fix between Dollhouse episodes.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Random832 » Tue Apr 21, 2009 9:11 pm UTC

thatguy wrote:Obviously they weren't of this exact situation, but the future's always included Sylar-as-Nathan trying at the presidency. I mean, just because it wasn't originally meant that way doesn't mean the writers can't fit their new story into it. (See: Angela stealing socks.)

Actually - the Coyote Sands stuff is the kind of story element that they _might_ have had planned all along as the backstory for the company, etc. Just because not _everything_ is thought out that far ahead doesn't mean not _anything_ is.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Delalyra » Wed Apr 22, 2009 12:50 am UTC

I loved the "my DNA isn't coming together right. :(" line. Errr, no, more like the matter you exist of isn't coming together right. I doubt DNA has much to do with the physical shapeshifting process (except to serve as a blueprint, of course). It just got thrown in because everyone knows what it is. Science fail!


But character win. I approve of Sylar being in the spotlight, as he is by far the most interesting one.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Mo0man » Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:01 am UTC

Plus, they already proved the shapeshifting has nothing to do with DNA, since that's how they identified the shapeshifting guy was dead and not Sylar
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby korora » Wed Apr 22, 2009 2:40 am UTC

Just because Sylar said it, doesn't mean it was true. The writers are allowed (I'd say encouraged) to let their characters be wrong about this sort of thing.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Wed Apr 22, 2009 4:25 am UTC

Having had his ability, I wonder if Peter is going to feel any sympathy for Sylar at all in the future.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Wed Apr 22, 2009 1:46 pm UTC

Doubtful. Sylar is Sylar, after all.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Stabable Offense » Wed Apr 22, 2009 5:07 pm UTC

Sylar sure showed Norman Bates how it's really done.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby headprogrammingczar » Wed Apr 22, 2009 6:09 pm UTC

I propose the name of this thread be renamed to "Sylar fan club".
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby mosc » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:14 pm UTC

That's what happens when a show goes to crap and the villain destroying the world starts to look more appealing than the show actually continuing. Unlikable protagonists? Check. Scatterbrained writing? Check. Plotlines that are completely unable to gain any traction? Check. A villain that can end it all on a whim starts to sound pretty good in comparison.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:38 pm UTC

I'm guessing the Haitian caused Hiro's nosebleed.

Who knows where that guy went to after he said he would "go after Sylar" at the end of the last volume. Probably back to Haiti, since he's gone back there for the last two seasons, but if they captured Hiro in Japan, Haiti shouldn't be difficult.

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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby pseudoidiot » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:52 pm UTC

Lumpy wrote:I'm guessing the Haitian caused Hiro's nosebleed.
My initial thought is that he's not accustomed to stopping time for someone else, so perhaps it causes extra strain.
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Mo0man » Wed Apr 22, 2009 7:59 pm UTC

How about we talk about the fact that Hiro is now suddenly a selfish prick? Or rather, that he was always a bit of a selfish prick, but recently, his prickishness has overtaken his likability by a factor of five
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Re: Heroes! (No spoiler tags for episodes already aired in US)

Postby Lumpy » Wed Apr 22, 2009 8:14 pm UTC

Yeah, he's always self-centered, hardly listens to his friend, which I also mean in a literal sense, and has delusions of being like some guy in spandex, even when he has berated others for treating it like a "game," it's like it's really just trying to convince himself. Hiro and Ando have been arguing for four volumes so far on this subject and they still haven't gotten over it.


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