Anime Thread of Doom

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Thu Mar 18, 2010 6:57 am UTC

novax6 wrote:The only thing that bugged me (and everyone I know) were the voices for the Tachikomas. Why someone would think it's a good idea to give them the most justified, annoying child voices imaginable I can't fathom.


I think it was supposed to be funny. Give extremely dangerous killing machines child-like personalities, and watch hilarity ensue.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:16 am UTC

SlyReaper wrote:
novax6 wrote:The only thing that bugged me (and everyone I know) were the voices for the Tachikomas. Why someone would think it's a good idea to give them the most justified, annoying child voices imaginable I can't fathom.


I think it was supposed to be funny. Give extremely dangerous killing machines child-like personalities, and watch hilarity ensue.


Actually, I thought of it as an artistic decision to help emphasize how child-like and inquisitive they were and how they were like babies developing a proper consciousness, asking questions about existence etc. etc.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby novax6 » Thu Mar 18, 2010 7:48 am UTC

SlyReaper wrote:
novax6 wrote:The only thing that bugged me (and everyone I know) were the voices for the Tachikomas. Why someone would think it's a good idea to give them the most justified, annoying child voices imaginable I can't fathom.


I think it was supposed to be funny. Give extremely dangerous killing machines child-like personalities, and watch hilarity ensue.


Yeah but that's my problem with a lot of the "humor" in anime, is that things they find funny, I just find really, really annoying. I suspect this is a cultural thing.

@ Gelsamel: That's a good point, and very possibly intended, but it nevertheless makes me want to throw a brick at my speakers when they start talking.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby mercuryseven » Thu Mar 18, 2010 10:17 am UTC

novax6 wrote:Yeah but that's my problem with a lot of the "humor" in anime, is that things they find funny, I just find really, really annoying. I suspect this is a cultural thing.


Yep, I'm pretty sure it's a cultural thing. I think I understand why some people are not used to Tachikoma's type of humour. I'm Asian and I really like the Tachikoma's characters (I suppose childish/immature characters stirring up mayhem is a common trope).

But more significantly, I like the characters because it is trough the Tachikomas that GITS really explored the AI/consciousness issue very deeply. Also highly interesting (to me, at least) is the fact that at the end of the day's job, they synchronise their memories, which brought up many interesting thoughts on identity vs mind.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Fri Mar 19, 2010 8:36 am UTC

I thought the Tachikoma voices suited them (I watched the dub though, did they differ significantly?). They didn't seem to be all that humorous in general though (some parts, but overall a more serious look at what a somewhat childlike AI in a robot's body would do, especially in a group setting), except maybe in a "Oh, silly Tachikoma" kind of way...

I loved the Tachikoma shorts though. :mrgreen:

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Fri Mar 19, 2010 9:23 am UTC

You do have to wonder at the wisdom of giving powerful weapons AI and free will. Especially child-like personalities. Children are known to pull the wings and legs off insects to see what will happen. A Tachikoma endowed with a child's personality may well pull the arms and legs off people to see what would happen.

But I guess they can always get a full-body prosthetic if that happens, so no biggie. :lol:
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Avelion » Sat Mar 20, 2010 2:18 am UTC

That's why by the second season all their minds were stuck on a satellite separate from the physicals bodies. So they could pull the plug whenver they needed to.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:38 am UTC

"Give up here?"
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Tue Mar 23, 2010 12:02 pm UTC

Well. Now officially signed up for Amecon in August. I got the 15th to last place. :lol:

Anyone following Sora No Woto? I just picked it up the other day. If you can imagine a cross between Haibane Renmei and K-On, this is it. Except it doesn't suck like K-On does.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby |Erasmus| » Tue Mar 23, 2010 8:21 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:Anyone following Sora No Woto? I just picked it up the other day. If you can imagine a cross bewteen Haibane Renmei and K-On, this is it. Except it doesn't suck like K-On does.

I remember noticing it and thinking it sounded good (I can't remember any details right now) and that I should watch it... worth it?

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Mar 24, 2010 7:47 am UTC

Well I like it. In the same way that most guys secretly like chick-flicks from time to time, but would never admit to it. Or is that just me? Ho hum...

For an anime that's supposedly about a squad of soldiers, they seem to do very little soldiering.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby aldrich_lucas » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:27 am UTC

oh hai guyz

My favourite anime would definitely have to be Code Geass (see avatar), followed by Death Note (though the manga was better). Kind of looking forward to Shikkoku No Renya, but don't have high hopes for it being anywhere near as good as the first two seasons. Though, it's coming out as a manga, perhaps as an anime later from what I understand. I don't think too highly of on-going animes (Bleach, Naruto, One Piece) due to lack of quality my opinion.

A friend recommended Gundam, so going to watch Gundam soon, likewise with Haruhi Suzumiya which I'm currently downloading.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Thu Mar 25, 2010 9:38 am UTC

On-going anime can have some alright animation (iei budget!) but due to the on-going nature of the show the plot and writing is total crap pants, which is the main reason I really dislike Naruto/Bleach.

The only really on-going anime I could ever stand would be very very episodic comedy with essentially no plot or timeline (like, as long as they can keep on coming up with good jokes I wouldn't mind if SZS went for 100s and 100s of episodes).
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Thu Mar 25, 2010 11:51 am UTC

Except the jokes would get stale after hundreds of episodes.

I actually liked Bleach at the start. Right up to the end of the Soul Society arc, it was really good. Then they started some boring filler crap about Bounts and I stopped watching. The manga is better because it skips right ahead to the Arrancars.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:23 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:Except the jokes would get stale after hundreds of episodes.


Not necessarily... people still enjoy The Simpsons (although it's not my type of humor).

Humor can often be topical and there is really pretty much infinite subjects you can look at in a humorous light. The problem with things with a continuous plot is that you have keep on tacking on stuff and inventing new reasons for the protagonists to do stuff and grow etc. Knowing that from the outset most writers make these on going anime about fighting and just powering up and stuff so it's easier to just tack on more need to power up (as opposed to a non-fighting anime which would need reason for more character growth).

I actually liked Bleach at the start. Right up to the end of the Soul Society arc, it was really good. Then they started some boring filler crap about Bounts and I stopped watching. The manga is better because it skips right ahead to the Arrancars.


I don't really care about what is filler and what isn't because I don't mind if stuff doesn't follow other versions of the story word for word. The problem I have with Bleach is that I really dislike the writing.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Zohar » Thu Mar 25, 2010 12:35 pm UTC

I think there are different writing teams for the manga and anime. If it's a "canon" story then it's the manga writers, which are OK, IMO. Fillers get written by different writers (I'm guessing here) and so it's much lower in quality.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby hideki101 » Mon Mar 29, 2010 6:39 am UTC

Zohar wrote:I think there are different writing teams for the manga and anime. If it's a "canon" story then it's the manga writers, which are OK, IMO. Fillers get written by different writers (I'm guessing here) and so it's much lower in quality.

I don't think that the different writers are have lower quality, it's that different writers may have different interpretations of the established characters than the original writer, and the fact that they are constrained by later events: certain people must stay alive or something, so there's never any uncertainty whether or not they do so. This makes it hard for anyone to portray a tense atmosphere when you know everything's going to be okay. Going back to the bleach analogy, I actually kinda liked the bount arc, before I read the manga, because I didn't know it was filler. If I had known that it was filler then, I probably wouldn't have liked it as much.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Mon Mar 29, 2010 9:22 am UTC

hideki101 wrote:Going back to the bleach analogy, I actually kinda liked the bount arc, before I read the manga, because I didn't know it was filler. If I had known that it was filler then, I probably wouldn't have liked it as much.


See, I don't get this. I see series/movie/book/comic etc. as different canons, I don't mind if an anime deviates from the manga. The 'filler' isn't the problem for me, it's that the story, filler or no, for anime which have to keep on inventing challenges so they can keep selling the product and making money, is often very poor.

I'd rather see on-going anime that realises when the main story is done and actually finish it. If you want to make more money or want to milk that universe then sure, go ahead, make a new anime in the same setting, perhaps in the future or past, about different characters doing different things. Keep it fresh and have awesome new characters with their own problems and challenges and goals and tell a new story. It's stupid to string out the story for so long... regardless of the skill or resourcefulness of the writers if you keep stretching it out it will reach a point where the show stagnates and just ends up total crap as far as plot goes.

Whereas if you have a good enough comedic team, especially if some or most of the comedy is topical, and especially if the comedy has not plot or timeline then you can easily keep it funny and string it out for a very long time, not that you can do it forever or anything... well if it's entirely topical then it could go forever.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Zohar » Mon Mar 29, 2010 9:28 am UTC

I agree Gelsamel. The Bount arc and the beginning of the current arc were pretty good, really, but the other filler arc sucked majorly.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Mar 29, 2010 11:21 am UTC

Gelsamel wrote:I'd rather see on-going anime that realises when the main story is done and actually finish it. If you want to make more money or want to milk that universe then sure, go ahead, make a new anime in the same setting, perhaps in the future or past, about different characters doing different things. Keep it fresh and have awesome new characters with their own problems and challenges and goals and tell a new story. It's stupid to string out the story for so long... regardless of the skill or resourcefulness of the writers if you keep stretching it out it will reach a point where the show stagnates and just ends up total crap as far as plot goes.


See, that takes effort and more money being paid to writers.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby bigglesworth » Tue Mar 30, 2010 3:36 pm UTC

Yeah, it's like expecting Eastenders to be new and original.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby hideki101 » Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:29 am UTC

Gelsamel wrote:
hideki101 wrote:Going back to the bleach analogy, I actually kinda liked the bount arc, before I read the manga, because I didn't know it was filler. If I had known that it was filler then, I probably wouldn't have liked it as much.


See, I don't get this. I see series/movie/book/comic etc. as different canons, I don't mind if an anime deviates from the manga. The 'filler' isn't the problem for me, it's that the story, filler or no, for anime which have to keep on inventing challenges so they can keep selling the product and making money, is often very poor.

I'd rather see on-going anime that realises when the main story is done and actually finish it. If you want to make more money or want to milk that universe then sure, go ahead, make a new anime in the same setting, perhaps in the future or past, about different characters doing different things. Keep it fresh and have awesome new characters with their own problems and challenges and goals and tell a new story. It's stupid to string out the story for so long... regardless of the skill or resourcefulness of the writers if you keep stretching it out it will reach a point where the show stagnates and just ends up total crap as far as plot goes.

And I try to fit the canon together into a coherent way so that alternate universes are not needed. The manga, anime, graphic novels, visual novels, or whatever generally form a single storyline, if seemingly told from different perspectives at times. The problem with filler for me is that if I've read the manga past the point where the anime is, I invariably compare it to the original. This is where my problem with filler (and come to think of it, a lot of anime adaptions in general) comes in. If I'm comparing it to the manga, I'm not immersing myself in the story as it was meant to be told. That's why I stand to generally see only one source of a series. Now, if there's an anime-original end, like Fullmetal Alchemist, Shagukan no Shana, or the To Aru series (actually pretty much all the stuff J.C. Staff put out) I wouldn't mind reading both, because then it is truly an alternate universe, and I can stop comparing it to the original source.

Although for some reason, if it's the anime I watch first, I don't feel any nagging feeling of comparison when reading manga, GNs, or VNs. Strange.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Gelsamel » Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:42 am UTC

I don't see them so much as "Alternate Universes" so much as just see them as entirely different stories. I don't see why I can't enjoy two different stories with characters who are only similar in name/look but who are otherwise different, same goes for setting and plot too.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:27 pm UTC

Ok, I think I love Baccano!

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Mar 31, 2010 3:49 pm UTC

The addition of a rolleyes smiley confuses me.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Wed Mar 31, 2010 5:04 pm UTC

SlyReaper wrote:The addition of a rolleyes smiley confuses me.
If you've seen what I'm talking about it should make more sense? Those two are pretty crazy...

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Mar 31, 2010 5:05 pm UTC

I watched the first episode but got bored. Worth continuing, do you reckon?
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Wed Mar 31, 2010 5:10 pm UTC

I'm about 4 in, seems interesting enough so far, but I've been told I have low standards. The first episode only really starts setting everything up, the story jumps around a lot though.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby bigglesworth » Wed Mar 31, 2010 5:17 pm UTC

I'm 6 in, and it's quite interesting so far. Not the most interesting anime I've watched, but there's definitely a good mystery/conspiriacy there to be unravelled.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Grop » Wed Mar 31, 2010 6:27 pm UTC

I loved Baccano. Not sure I understood everything though, maybe I will watch it again some day.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby bigglesworth » Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:13 pm UTC

Random question: do anime fans in France tend to have subtitles in French or English? Because all the French people I know watch American and British programming in English, but that doesn't make total sense for something that's in Japanese.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby SlyReaper » Wed Mar 31, 2010 8:19 pm UTC

It's my experience that it's far easier to read a foreign language than to listen to it. If they can follow programs spoken in English, chances are they can follow English subtitles.

It's not ideal, but I don't actually know any animé subbing groups that do languages other than English.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Grop » Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:34 pm UTC

Most of the anime I watch is subbed in French, but much of it was translated from English. Few French sub groups have someone able to translate from Japanese. You can find pretty much anything referenced on animeka.com (they don't provide torrents or anything, but they tell you which groups sub whatever series you want).

When I don't find French subs for an anime I want to watch (which is very rare), I get English subs instead. As SlyReaper said, watching an anime with English subs is extremely easy to me, much easier than watching a British or American movie with no subs.

On tv, kids watch French dubs.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Box Boy » Wed Mar 31, 2010 9:38 pm UTC

Related: I have a friend who spent twelve years of her life living in France, from one, up until two years ago, who learned English pretty much entirely from english sub'd and sub'd anime. School helped of course, but I severley doubt she got the American accent and colloquialisms from it.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Thu Apr 01, 2010 12:39 am UTC

Box Boy wrote:Related: I have a friend who spent twelve years of her life living in France, from one, up until two years ago, who learned English pretty much entirely from english sub'd and sub'd anime. School helped of course, but I severley doubt she got the American accent and colloquialisms from it.
How would she get American colloquialisms from anime...?

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Maple_fish » Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:01 am UTC

Just started Baccano! Those subs sure fly by when a few characters are talking at once!
Spoiler:
Was watching the first episode and it seemed a bit unconvincing (Isaac & Miria were even annoying in a pokemon sense) and then something ultra-violent happened. The bass loop in the intro was totally ripped off from Cowboy Bebop too...
Confusing as hell, but I'm looking forward to the rest of it!

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Box Boy » Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:38 am UTC

Xeio wrote:
Box Boy wrote:Related: I have a friend who spent twelve years of her life living in France, from one, up until two years ago, who learned English pretty much entirely from english sub'd and sub'd anime. School helped of course, but I severley doubt she got the American accent and colloquialisms from it.
How would she get American colloquialisms from anime...?
Have you never heard of any 4kids/Funimation Dub making anime more "American" to increase popularity? She also used American spellings (I.e. color instead of colour) for a good while also. (still does on IM quite a bit actually)
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby |Erasmus| » Thu Apr 01, 2010 6:42 am UTC

Grop wrote:I loved Baccano. Not sure I understood everything though, maybe I will watch it again some day.

Basically this.

There seem to be a few people watching it at the moment... Plus I have more downloads as it's a new month. I need something to watch (Sora No Woto has been mentioned). I will probably also grab a copy of Lain off a friend at the weekend... good times.

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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby bigglesworth » Thu Apr 01, 2010 3:47 pm UTC

The thing about Isaac and Miria is that I find the over the top melodramatic comedy genuinely hilarious. But I can see how plenty of people wouldn't.
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Re: Go Away Dub Watchers: The Proper Anime Thread

Postby Xeio » Sat Apr 03, 2010 1:07 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:The thing about Isaac and Miria is that I find the over the top melodramatic comedy genuinely hilarious. But I can see how plenty of people wouldn't.
Spoiler:
Issac: Miria! I don't think we've aged over all these years!
Miria: Why, I think you're right Issac!
Miria/Issac: WAAAAAAAAAAAA *running around*


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