The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Okita » Tue Oct 07, 2008 6:36 pm UTC

I think the one thing I don't like is what seems to be a recurring theme of "Connors fight X robot this week". It just...bugs me. There's so much time traveling going on that it's starting to get a bit ridiculous. And that's ignoring the fact that the concept of time travel in the terminator universe is a bit hard to believe...

Random thing from the Allison from Palmdale episode, I liked how when Allison was attempting to escape, the people in cages weren't shouting at her to be freed but shouting at her instructions on how to escape and which way to go. Human race sticking together tugs at the heartstrings.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:06 pm UTC

I don't terribly mind the number of time travelers: I'm willing to give them that much license, because you can't sustain an entire TV series with a single terminator. However, I am concerned that the terminators are gradually losing their menace. What used to take an entire two hour movie to kill now only takes a couple of shots from a high-powered rifle. Frankly, considering the number of T-888s already destroyed in this series, I'm impressed that they still manage to create a decent amount of tension.

On the other hand, it does kind of reflect the change in mindset between the movies and the TV series. In the movies, it was all about surviving the immediate crisis. They had limited equipment, no time to prepare, and were always on the run. In the TV series, the war has already begun. Reese and the Connors are soldiers, not prey; they are engaging and defeating enemies, as they will do routinely in the future.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Tue Oct 07, 2008 7:30 pm UTC

Yes, Reese is extremely experienced at taking these things down and has lots of resources now with the world not being destroyed and all. It's only fitting that he be able to take em down. Jon had to learn this from somebody. Yet another reason I liked this last episode so much was that you finally got to see that. Left with a full armory at his disposal and time to prepare, the bumbling terminator wasn't much fuss for him.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Masuri » Wed Oct 08, 2008 12:45 am UTC

What I'm really curious about is this T-1000. What is her deal? Is she thinking Ellison will lead her to John? Or maybe something has changed dramatically since she got sent back and she really is wondering just what the hell is going on with the copious amounts of T-888s she's come across. If so, using a human to investigate these happenings is actually rather brilliant, too. She can find out from afar what the T-888s think they're doing and then decide whether to intervene.

I agree with mosc, though, this latest episode was fan-fucking-tastic.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby theonlyjett » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:44 am UTC

I agree with you, mosc, about how good that last episode was. It put me from casual watcher to the guy who tells everybody he knows that they should watch this show.

About the war lecture that Reese gave, it was wonderful to me in that every word he says still applies to war vs. other humans, not just machines.

The T-1001 (that's what she is, not a T-1000, to nitpick) is what really bothers me. I think it would all be better if we didn't find out she was a T-1001 until it came near time to kill her. It could have made for a great climax somewhere. As it is, you know she's pro skynet, but they could have dragged that out longer to see if maybe she could actually be an ally like we still think Ellison might be. I think all her human acting tends to bother me some knowing that she's not human, and it would be better if we found that out later.

The time travel doesn't bother me yet, though. A dying soldier from the future leaving clues in his own blood on the wall (that will presumably get us through the season at least) is brilliant. I don't think it'll even bother me if a new triple 8 comes through every other week.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:20 am UTC

The terminator of the week vibe is a little annoying, but I can live with it. It was a good episode. I still don't like the actor who plays John. He doesn't embarrass himself, but all of the other actors are doing a much better job than him, and he's the focus of the whole thing.

Really, the only things that bug me are the two human behavior by the Terminators, and too much time travel. If I were the show, I'd stay away from time travel, given it's rather absurd application within the show (Skynet would be better off sending terminators to try to kill Sarah Connor before the first one arrived, using new information and models. On the other hand, they could just go to the site of her current house, and send a small bomb wrapped in meat back). Hey, they could just go after Sarah Connor's mother. Or father.

Really, once one side has time travel, it's over.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Masuri » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:57 am UTC

Ahh, thanks, I didn't know she was a T-1001, where did I miss that?

Also, what if she's not pro-Skynet? I'm wondering if maybe this T-1001 is doing her own thing. Maybe she's working for a rival to Skynet? Sent back to change things so that her faction gets the edge over both the humans and Skynet itself? After all, Skynet did bungle things badly enough that a human resistance managed to form and be surprisingly effective. Maybe killing John Connor isn't enough. Maybe he's like Judgement Day - something that is suggested to be inevitable in all timelines. So you just work around both Skynet and Connor undermining them both so that they kill each other off or at least keep each other busy. Eventually, a new order rises out of the ashes and this gal's faction leads the way.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Oct 08, 2008 2:51 pm UTC

I think Masuri hit that one on the head. I think she's something other than a skynet lackey.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Wed Oct 08, 2008 3:42 pm UTC

My pet theory about her is that she's an agent trying to preserve Skynet's timeline.

If you look at it though the lens of hard SF time travel, every time they send back a terminator, it makes significant alterations to the time line(this may explain why the numbers have always been small, to date). Now, with god knows how many T-888s and resistance fighters running around right before Skynet is scheduled to be built, it's possible that Skynet is getting a little worried about preserving itself. In the event that all this time travel radically changes the course of history, the Skynet which caused all this to happen would cease to exist, and (probably) be replaced by a different one. This has already happened several times, and I suspect the latest Skynet is attempting to preserve it's own current incarnation as closely as possible, by using a T-1001 to force events to comply with it's memories of history. Hence her desire to find one of the Terminators, so she can push her corporation in the right direction to create Skynet, on schedule.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Princess Marzipan » Wed Oct 08, 2008 8:02 pm UTC

Dekker's acting hasn't bugged me at all.

Also, "Terminator of the Week" is not exactly a model they're following AT ALL.

In the first season, and still now, there is Cromartie, after John. There was also 'Vick Chamberlain,' the 888 that killed Reese's group, and 'Carter,' manning the coltan operation.

This season, there was the one impersonating Greenway, and the one after Bedel. And also Shirley Manson.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Oct 08, 2008 8:33 pm UTC

I think this last episode, the actor who was playing the tragic hero really showed how poor an actor Dekker is. Still, he's getting better and they're using him less. The other lead characters are quite well acted.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Princess Marzipan » Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:46 pm UTC

Can you point out anything specific?

I'm not trying to say you're wrong and that he's a brilliant actor; just that I have not noticed anything negative at all and am curious where specifically he is seen to fall short.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Oct 08, 2008 9:49 pm UTC

bleh, I'm very picky about my actors and I have an enormous respect for the CRAFT of acting (and theater in general). I don't want to reply to that with some terse thing from my memory. I'll make a point of noting my complaints when the next episode airs.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby theonlyjett » Wed Oct 08, 2008 11:08 pm UTC

I don't think it said specifically on the show, but I know I've read it. Here's an article.
http://community.tvguide.com/blog-entry ... /800046666

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Wed Oct 22, 2008 3:35 am UTC

That was a pretty good episode.

It was certainly interesting to see Cameron actually destroy another machine. Looks like the best way to kill a terminator is to dislocate and/or damage it's primary joints, then snap the spinal column (or the equivalent).

On a character development level, it was interesting to see the psychologies of all of the characters, especially Weaver's daughter. And, um, yeah, John killed a guy. Interesting.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby VannA » Wed Oct 22, 2008 6:15 am UTC

Ati wrote:The terminator of the week vibe is a little annoying, but I can live with it. It was a good episode. I still don't like the actor who plays John. He doesn't embarrass himself, but all of the other actors are doing a much better job than him, and he's the focus of the whole thing.

Really, the only things that bug me are the two human behavior by the Terminators, and too much time travel. If I were the show, I'd stay away from time travel, given it's rather absurd application within the show (Skynet would be better off sending terminators to try to kill Sarah Connor before the first one arrived, using new information and models. On the other hand, they could just go to the site of her current house, and send a small bomb wrapped in meat back). Hey, they could just go after Sarah Connor's mother. Or father.

Really, once one side has time travel, it's over.


Not if there is a statute of limitations on the Time Travel. Say.. 20 years back, no more.

(They bungled that, IMO, with the 60s built Bank. Why doesn't Skynet send a squad as far back as possible, and just re-do it all from there?)

But yeah, it doesn't worry me tooo much.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Oct 22, 2008 2:28 pm UTC

The machine having a fixed return maximum would explain a lot. I wish they would embrace something like that. Oh well, the show is doing very well even without some assemblence of reasonability in it's time travel.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Wed Oct 22, 2008 11:00 pm UTC

Ati wrote:It was certainly interesting to see Cameron actually destroy another machine. Looks like the best way to kill a terminator is to dislocate and/or damage it's primary joints, then snap the spinal column (or the equivalent).

That whole scene looked way too easy for Cameron. Terminators aren't scary if one of the main characters can tear them up without breaking the equivalent of a sweat.

Interesting episode in terms of character development. I wasn't too fond of the bit where Derek's Razor friend showed up, though. She seemed out of place.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby no-genius » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:37 am UTC

Saw the first one of season 2 last night.

That was awesome.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Tue Nov 04, 2008 4:10 pm UTC

Anybody else find the opening of the last episode rather awkwardly put together? Not the best piece of writing I've seen in the show.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Tue Nov 04, 2008 4:19 pm UTC

It did feel like my TV cut off the first say 3 seconds or so where he answered the door but meh, it was another awesome episode. Best show on TV right now is the sarah connor chronicles.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Princess Marzipan » Tue Nov 04, 2008 4:42 pm UTC

Nath wrote:Anybody else find the opening of the last episode rather awkwardly put together? Not the best piece of writing I've seen in the show.


It seemed pretty obviously a dream sequence. Only it wasn't.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Nov 05, 2008 8:18 pm UTC

It was another good episode though, was it not? I mean, agent Ellison is such a compelling character now. John's starting to grow a backbone, etc. It really is my favorite thing on TV these days.

Cameron killing the three thugs was well done. It was as cold as metal should be. I even like the direction they're going in with Cromardie. That whole side plot was wonderful.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Thu Nov 06, 2008 5:01 am UTC

mosc wrote:It was another good episode though, was it not? I mean, agent Ellison is such a compelling character now. John's starting to grow a backbone, etc. It really is my favorite thing on TV these days.

Cameron killing the three thugs was well done. It was as cold as metal should be. I even like the direction they're going in with Cromardie. That whole side plot was wonderful.



I agree. It was about time that they reinforced that Cameron is a heartless killing machine. The way she just started killing people without warning or emotion was quite nice.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Princess Marzipan » Tue Nov 11, 2008 2:00 am UTC

Holy fuck...

Tonight's was fucking amazing.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Klapaucius » Wed Nov 12, 2008 12:10 am UTC

For some reason I got this mixed up for a moment with The Sarah Jane Adventures, which is, as sci-fi shows go, entirely perpendicular. So for a very brief instant there existed a show with Slitheens and Summer Glaus and feisty old ladies with preteens protecting London and T-1000s and K-9, and now... I just wish I could watch it.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Nov 12, 2008 6:11 pm UTC

The last episode was great. I like the story telling format. It beats the hell out of the frame and flashback crap we get so much now-a-days.

Also, I like the "roll in the music" scenes. They allow a little bit of slow motion and more dramatic angles to feel connected rather than separate from the story.

Seriously, this show has some of the best writing and best action sequences of any show on TV. Why are more people not watching this show?

Oh, and summer dropping her Jacket... yeah.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Wed Nov 19, 2008 4:57 pm UTC

Hmmm. The most recent episode was interesting. Not so much the Sarah Connor had bad dreams thing, or even the James Ellison stole the killer robot and gave it to the evil death metal chick, but mainly that it looks like they're expanding the time travel mechanic a little, something they've historically been weak at.

This could get interesting.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Okita » Wed Nov 19, 2008 6:16 pm UTC

Or it could just get really confusing.

Timey wimey balls are like that.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby mosc » Wed Nov 19, 2008 7:22 pm UTC

I really liked that last scene there with them discussing how fucked up time travel made things and acknowledging the obvious system they've set up where every returner remains whole but the future from their return point on instantly and substantially changes. Also, the guy who play's John's uncle is just a superb actor.

I was a little frustrated at how easily John was fooled by Ellison but I guess that was the point of the scene. John is compassionate and trusting. Cameron knew damn well that it was much more logical that Ellison was a good liar than somebody else had dug up the body. I guess they did make that clear by her violence.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Wed Nov 26, 2008 3:18 am UTC

Now that was interesting.


So, the young Skynet killed someone, and Ellison wants to teach it ethics. Riley is an agent of Derrick's girlfriend designed to keep John away from someone else (you get three guesses, and the last two don't count). Sarah screwed up and got robbed, but got the money back; her sanity is still questionable. Oh, and the body of Cromartie has been repaired, and is the avatar of Skynet. Am I missing anything?
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby thatguy » Wed Nov 26, 2008 4:35 am UTC

Oh, and Mama T1001 is watching over them. Other than that, no.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Wed Nov 26, 2008 8:09 am UTC

I liked this episode, but I wish they'd hire a consultant to help them out with the techie bits.

Also, how did they fix Cromartie's face?

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby thatguy » Fri Nov 28, 2008 2:52 am UTC

Probably duct tape.

I freaked out when i saw Cromartie sitting there. Although I thought he was plugged in to the computer bank behind him. It'll be intersting to see what Elison does at this point.

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Thu Dec 04, 2008 11:40 am UTC

Couldn't they at least read Wikipedia when they need jargon, to make sure they're making at least a teeny bit of sense?
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby thatguy » Fri Dec 05, 2008 4:45 am UTC

So does this latest ep mean Slynet's only fuxx0r'd one sendback? Or are all sendbacks an approximation? And if they can go back to 1910, they can't send a bomb wrapped in as porterhouse back to blow Grandpappy Connor to smithereens?

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Princess Marzipan » Sat Dec 06, 2008 8:56 am UTC

Maybe Sarah Connor was adopted? Or her father can't be precisely located? Or SkyNet does not want to fuck too far back with the past?
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Ati » Sat Dec 06, 2008 5:30 pm UTC

thatguy wrote:So does this latest ep mean Slynet's only fuxx0r'd one sendback? Or are all sendbacks an approximation? And if they can go back to 1910, they can't send a bomb wrapped in as porterhouse back to blow Grandpappy Connor to smithereens?



Any radical alterations to the timeline further back than a few decades endanger Skynet's existence in it's current form. Presumably, neither the humans nor Skynet wish to erase themselves from the timeline, so they keep the trips back relatively small, and recent. You'll notice that when the Terminator went back on accident, he nearly fucked up a bunch of vital events, and spent the following few decades trying to repair the timeline.
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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Nath » Wed Dec 10, 2008 10:27 am UTC

Mixed feelings about this last one. It's cool that they are taking risks with this show -- this episode had three timelines, focused on several new characters, and had an interesting plot. Unfortunately, it didn't quite come together nicely. And yet again, a T-888 was beaten without much of a fight.

Speaking of which, anyone know why this show has T-888s instead of T-800s? Copyright issues?

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Re: The Sarah Connor Chronicles (Now with spoilers!)

Postby Neuman » Wed Dec 10, 2008 4:09 pm UTC

Because T-888s are the best infiltrators that SkyNet can reliably mass produce by this point, presumably.

Also?
Nath wrote:Unfortunately, it didn't quite come together nicely. And yet again, a T-888 was beaten off screen, so we don't how much of a fight it put up, but in it's first encounter it temporarily deactivated Cameron and tossed her though a window.

Fix'd, unless we're talking about different episodes.
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