Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latine.."

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Jorpho
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Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latine.."

Postby Jorpho » Mon Dec 01, 2014 6:55 am UTC

So, methinks one of the handiest Latin phrases to have on hand is "Quidquidne latine dictum sit altum viditur", which, as the Internet will readily inform you, may be translated as "Anything said in Latin sounds profound".

Unfortunately, the Internet also seems to have some disagreement as to whether the first word should be "Quidquidne" or "Quidquid". I took Latin much too long ago to be able to puzzle out this riddle. (Also, there seems to be general consensus that the last word is "videtur" rather than "viditur".)

Would anyone here know what the word ought to be?

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Znirk
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Re: Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latin

Postby Znirk » Mon Dec 01, 2014 2:56 pm UTC

(not an expert)

The correct verb form is videtur. Viditur may come from somebody trying to overcorrect in the light of "veni vidi vici"? But vidi is perfect tense anyway, and the passive form for that would be visum est.

I only know -ne as a question marker, so I guess that version would mean "Does everything ... sound impressive?" if it's correct at all.

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Flumble
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Re: Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latin

Postby Flumble » Tue Dec 02, 2014 2:08 am UTC

Znirk wrote:I only know -ne as a question marker, so I guess that version would mean "Does everything ... sound impressive?" if it's correct at all.

The internet and I concur: -ne is an interrogative suffix only. ("enclitic", the wiktionary says, but I think "suffix" is abstruse enough)
I'd replace "everything" with "anything" in your sentence, though. "everything" would require something like "totum" or "omnia". ;)

The use of "-ne" here could be explained by the fact that the whole "anything said in Latin" is a dependent clause using the subjunctive mode and these can be used for indirect questions (especially when there's no conjunction). Then again, this indirect question is allowed only when the main clause is about knowing or seeking. And "perceiving" doesn't quite fit the bill.

I'm curious though why the subordinate is used without an accompanying "quod" or "cum".
"Quidquid quod (circum)loquaris cordatum videtur"
Not as passive as the original, but I like the sound of it. (unfortunately I couldn't find a word for perceiving in the form /.+(qu|c).+tur/; accipitur and agnoscitur don't match the rythm)

Derek
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Re: Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latin

Postby Derek » Tue Dec 02, 2014 5:28 am UTC

FYI, TVTropes provides the following version: "Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur." I think that's fairly authoritative ;)

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Jorpho
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Re: Latin Question "Quidquidne latine..." vs "Quidquid latin

Postby Jorpho » Wed Dec 03, 2014 4:44 am UTC

Derek wrote:FYI, TVTropes provides the following version: "Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum videtur." I think that's fairly authoritative ;)
Well, sure, a lot of places have it; it's also in that form on Wikipedia and Rationalwiki. But it's the kind of thing where an error can propagate for decades without anyone bothering to check in and verify.


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