Page 1 of 1

Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 6:47 pm UTC
by Quizatzhaderac
So if the platonic person consumes 2000 Calories a day, what volume of food do they consume?

I know that there's a lot more flexibility in the volume of a person's diet than the Calorie intake, but there are still limits, even if they are further away.

For instance to get the DRI of protein , one would need to eat 2.632 Kg or 5.803 pounds of cauliflower. I have doubts that it's possible or wise for a typical person to consume such high volumes of food.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:07 pm UTC
by commodorejohn
I dunno, but according to Kepler, the relative volumes of the five Platonic food groups are such that they can fit inside one another.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:54 pm UTC
by Soupspoon
If it was the Plutonic Diet, I think it would be roughly 4mg of 240Pu, but that would only give up half that energy after 6500 years, so you'd need almost 4.8 million separate (and time-displaced, for simplification purposes) packets of Pu, or 1.9kg of the stuff to output the 2000kcal daily, amd thus maybe 97cm³ by volume (not counting material for shielding, energy reclamation, etc, although separation wouldn't be critical, given that it isn't critical). But I've almost certainly miscalculated something. :P

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:21 pm UTC
by Quizatzhaderac
<sincere and actually not sarcastic>
Thank you for replying to my post with puns, even if you didn't provide any pertinent information about my query.
</sincere and actually not sarcastic>

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 5:38 pm UTC
by PAstrychef
Since caloric density is so variable, your question is essentially unanswerable. Give me a list of foods and I could could generate some data for you.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 6:14 pm UTC
by Soupspoon
I tried to find out what we were even talking about, before contributing, but couldn't get beyond links I presumed were entire parodies of any 'real' Platonic Diet that someone might have coined... (The most official-looing "Main website" led only to Facebook pages where the "You must login or register..." stuff was totally in the way of any further drilling down, even for the assumed publicly published content.)

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 10:14 pm UTC
by Quizatzhaderac
PAstrychef wrote:Since caloric density is so variable...
I'm not asking about calories, I'm asking about volume. There are mechanical limits to the human digestive system and those don't go away because the food has the right number of calories. There are ranges of what a person can possibly, comfortably, or healthily eat.

Yes, those limits aren't usually an issue and as such they deserve less focus, but they still exist and I expect someone knows more than me.
Soupspoon wrote:I tried to find out what we were even talking about.... Platonic Diet
I never meant the phrase "platonic diet" to be a proper noun. I meant the diet of a hypothetical, idealized person that it is useful to compare a real person to.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:17 pm UTC
by PAstrychef
Google tells me that the empty volume of the human stomach is about one liter, and the fully expanded volume about four liters. Foods change volume once cooked, so how much you can eat will depend on several factors.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Wed Mar 22, 2017 11:31 pm UTC
by Soupspoon
Quizatzhaderac wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:I tried to find out what we were even talking about.... Platonic Diet
I never meant the phrase "platonic diet" to be a proper noun. I meant the diet of a hypothetical, idealized person that it is useful to compare a real person to.

Then these guys (behind the Facebook popovers that dissuade me from trying to dig deeper anything) have confused matters. ;)

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 4:19 am UTC
by Mikeski
PAstrychef wrote:Google tells me that the empty volume of the human stomach is about one liter, and the fully expanded volume about four liters.

I don't think anyone would eat more than three stomach-filling meals a day (although I have been on a cruise ship...), so a reasonable upper bound is 12 liters of food. (Hope you have enough t.p.)

And for a lower bound, lard is about 9000 calories/kg, and about 0.920 g/ml (or kg/l), so a 2000-calorie serving of the densest "food" I can think of is 0.24 liters.

So a range of a quarter-liter to twelve liters.

A Platonic ideal volume? I dunno, maybe a liter or two per day? Far too dependent on food choice. And the definition of volume. Is the "volume" of bread what it looks like sitting on a plate, or what you swallow after chewing all the air bubbles out of it?

Here's an article (annoying clickthru style, but only seven pages, and the seventh one isn't needed) that has pictures of "typical" diets for six people from around the world. (And the USAan truck driver has two packs of cigs on his tray, because 'murica, y'all.) The trays and tables of food look like about two liters to me, but they're also averaging over 3000 calories a day...

(I won't try "calories" for a high-end reading, since I've heard you can starve yourself to death by eating nothing but raw celery; it supposedly provides fewer calories than digesting it requires.)

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 5:13 pm UTC
by Quizatzhaderac
Soupsoon wrote:Then these guys
We don't want to be those guys.
PAstrychef wrote:Google tells me that the empty volume of the human stomach is about one liter, and the fully expanded volume about four liters.
Thanks, that's helpful.
Mikeski wrote:I don't think anyone would eat more than three stomach-filling meals a day (although I have been on a cruise ship...), so a reasonable upper bound is 12 liters of food. (Hope you have enough t.p.)
That's a good upper bound, but I also think in practice it might be lower since I don't think the stomach typically empties completely between meals.
And the definition of volume.
As I see it there're different volumes of interest depend on the stage of digestion stage of digestion.

pre-stomach: Air removed. Since most food is mostly water this can be approximated by taking the mass and multiplying by 1 mL/g

post-stomach: Loose water removed. For example a hearty soup and raw celery both might be 95% water, but the stomach can absorb most of the water from the soup, so the same pre-stomach volume of both would mean a proportionately higher post-stomach volume.

pre-colon: A lot more complicated, since so much has already been removed and added.
I won't try "calories" for a high-end reading, since I've heard you can starve yourself to death by eating nothing but raw celery; it supposedly provides fewer calories than digesting it requires.
That's false in that it provides more net calories than nothing.

However, 2000 Calories requires 12.5 kg of raw celery, so I do think a typical person locked in a room with infinite celery would get pretty hungry.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 5:38 pm UTC
by PAstrychef
Quizatzhaderac wrote:That's false in that it provides more net calories than nothing.

However, 2000 Calories requires 12.5 kg of raw celery, so I do think a typical person locked in a room with infinite celery would get pretty hungry.

That, in a celery stalk, is the panda's problem. Limited diet with low nutritional density.

Re: Volume of the platonic diet

Posted: Thu Mar 23, 2017 7:52 pm UTC
by Liri
Low-nutrition diets lend one to being an idiot, like koalas.