Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

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Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Raldios » Sun Nov 18, 2007 2:55 am UTC

I personally love Macromedia's Fireworks. It's so easy to change plain text into something very appealing.

Photoshop is nice for other things though, can't name them off the top of my head..

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby OfficiallyHaphazard » Sun Nov 18, 2007 3:05 am UTC

Can we work Adboe flash in here somehow, I just learned how to use it, and it is :D
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby EdgarJPublius » Sun Nov 18, 2007 3:29 am UTC

I like photoshop a lot, but I use Fireworks (because it's considerably cheaper) and it does have some features I use a lot more than I would use the features photoshop has that Fireworks doesn't.
Fireworks is a lot better for casual image manips, but Photoshop is seriously powerful.

I tried The Gimp, I really did, I even tried GimpShop since its supposed to be easier to use, but I just don't get it, I have no idea what I'm doing with it at all.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Raldios » Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:25 am UTC

OfficiallyHaphazard wrote:Can we work Adboe flash in here somehow, I just learned how to use it, and it is :D

Sure, it's still making an image, jsut an aniamted one.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby trickster721 » Sun Nov 18, 2007 7:13 am UTC

I still resort to PaintShop Pro 7 sometimes. It's the CoolEdit of graphics.

Photoshop is great, but I wish the interface designers didn't hate so much. Explain to me why half the tool buttons need to be hidden behind the other half, and there's no way to customize them in what's supposed to be a $1000 peice of software. Explain it.

The Gimp seems like it could be cool if it had an interface, period. I understand they had a big makeover recently? Has anybody checked that out?

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby davean » Sun Nov 18, 2007 11:45 am UTC

Raldios wrote:I personally love Macromedia's Fireworks. It's so easy to change plain text into something very appealing.


Your text will never be appealing, it is despoiled by the editors you use.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Hammer » Sun Nov 18, 2007 1:17 pm UTC

trickster721 wrote:I understand they had a big makeover recently? Has anybody checked that out?

They added some nice tools. Scalable brushes and suchlike.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby b.i.o » Sun Nov 18, 2007 4:27 pm UTC

trickster721 wrote:The Gimp seems like it could be cool if it had an interface, period. I understand they had a big makeover recently? Has anybody checked that out?


It got a new set of icons that are nicer and the menus were reorganized a bit to make it more intuitive.

Personally I like The Gimp. Photoshop has some features I wish it had (better support and more varied options for tablets, for example) but there are also things I use all the time that are much harder in PS. Plus I've literally wasted hours looking for basic functions in PS and I can't say the same about The Gimp, especially since the recent menu revision. The Gimp seems to me to be much more consistent than PS. Considering the price difference I'll stick with The Gimp. If I was given PS for free I'd use a mix of the two depending on what exactly I was trying to do.

I haven't used PSP in years but I do remember it had a very weird method of handling layers that I think would annoy the hell out of me if I used it now.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby wing » Sun Nov 18, 2007 10:28 pm UTC

OfficiallyHaphazard wrote:Can we work Adboe flash in here somehow, I just learned how to use it, and it is :D

No. You can't. Flash is, frankly, the most obnoxious piece of software ever. fucking. made. Originally, Shockwave was for displaying vector graphics in a web browser. Then someone hacked on animation. Then someone hacked on input and called it Flash. Then someone hacked on bitmap graphics. Then someone hacked on a GOD DAMNED VIDEO PLAYER. Then someone hacked on a fucking half-fucking-assed programming language. And throughout this hackage, someone decided it should be written in x86 assembler, because nobody is ever going to use any other platform. Ever. And then someone hacked it up to run on PPC to make the mac users shut the fuck up.

And then Adobe bought Macromedia, and fired the assembler guys. Because what the fuck, who needs assembler? And then they went to make a new version of Flash, and discovered - FUCK, half of it is written in fucking assembler!

Reportedly, there's a rewrite-from-scratch effort for Flash in the works at Adobe.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby OfficiallyHaphazard » Mon Nov 19, 2007 12:57 am UTC

wing wrote:
OfficiallyHaphazard wrote:Can we work Adboe flash in here somehow, I just learned how to use it, and it is :D

No. You can't. Flash is, frankly, the most obnoxious piece of software ever. fucking. made. Originally, Shockwave was for displaying vector graphics in a web browser. Then someone hacked on animation. Then someone hacked on input and called it Flash. Then someone hacked on bitmap graphics. Then someone hacked on a GOD DAMNED VIDEO PLAYER. Then someone hacked on a fucking half-fucking-assed programming language. And throughout this hackage, someone decided it should be written in x86 assembler, because nobody is ever going to use any other platform. Ever. And then someone hacked it up to run on PPC to make the mac users shut the fuck up.

And then Adobe bought Macromedia, and fired the assembler guys. Because what the fuck, who needs assembler? And then they went to make a new version of Flash, and discovered - FUCK, half of it is written in fucking assembler!

Reportedly, there's a rewrite-from-scratch effort for Flash in the works at Adobe.



heh, i don't blame them if there is a rewrite.

Anyhow, flash cs3 is decent, mainly because actionscript 3.0 has become more like an OOP language. But it does its core facilites well--that is combining animation/drawing with scripted code.

Supposedly there is a competitor entering the arena--Silverlight by microsoft (name might be slightly off). We will see how that goes :P
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby pKp » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:02 am UTC

Maybe they can add Gnu/Linux support as a side order then :/
I used to tinker around in Photoshop, and still uses Krita (same kind of interface) when I need to modify a picture. I just can not bear with The Gimp. I have tried, and I can't do anything with it. I should re-learn from scratch, I guess, but it is frankly too much of a pain in the ass.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Hexadecimator » Mon Nov 19, 2007 1:05 am UTC

I actually have no problems with the GIMP interface. Computers at school all have photoshop, but for personal use, 90% of the features at 0% of the cost is quite hard to beat.
If I was a professional graphic designer, I would no doubt prefer something commercial. However, the GIMP is good enough for me.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby photosinensis » Mon Nov 19, 2007 2:52 am UTC

No software solution is as elegant, fun, or encourages altered states of consciousness quite like the original: playing around with heavy metals and somewhat toxic chemicals in a lightless room.

Film + darkroom 4evah!

Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Hexadecimator » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:15 am UTC

photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.
No, you'll just strain your eyes trying to see anything at all in the darkroom :P

Seriously though, I want to see this darkroom of yours. It must have all sorts of cool equipment that didn't exist back when I used the one at school. That is, if you're actually serious that you could emulate this with your precious darkroom (randomly chosen from deviantart's front page).

Now, perhaps if you stored your painting supplies in there...
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby photosinensis » Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:00 am UTC

Hexadecimator wrote:
photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.
No, you'll just strain your eyes trying to see anything at all in the darkroom :P

Seriously though, I want to see this darkroom of yours. It must have all sorts of cool equipment that didn't exist back when I used the one at school. That is, if you're actually serious that you could emulate this with your precious darkroom (randomly chosen from deviantart's front page).

Now, perhaps if you stored your painting supplies in there...


Pfft. I can't paint. However, I can do coloring touchups, crazy air brushing, image splicing, and a bunch of other things. Granted, airbrushing and coloring touchups require more equipment than I usually use: even an enlarger combined with a good bit of skill can do 90% of what you're doing in Photoshop--the other 10% needs other standard tools that should be in any well-stocked darkroom. Photoshop just takes the finesse out of it.

As for trying to see in the darkroom, the best advice I can offer is don't. Know the environment so well that you don't have to see to use anything. Until you're ready for that, practice in the light with dummy materials.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby EvanED » Mon Nov 19, 2007 5:11 am UTC

photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.


How 'bout some HDR images? And how much money will it take you to reach your results?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a darkroom and know how to use it, but give me a choice between a well-stocked darkroom and the knowledge vs. Photoshop, and I'll take the latter in an instant.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby photosinensis » Mon Nov 19, 2007 7:52 am UTC

EvanED wrote:
photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.


How 'bout some HDR images? And how much money will it take you to reach your results?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a darkroom and know how to use it, but give me a choice between a well-stocked darkroom and the knowledge vs. Photoshop, and I'll take the latter in an instant.


Well, that's fully doable. Give me a really fine grain film with a low speed (both of those images qualify, if you look closely).

Sure, the equipment is a bit more expensive than Photoshop is on initial deployment, but the darkroom scales much better. Furthermore, you can't get quite the same chemical high from sniffing your printer ink. That, my friends, is how I survived high school and came out with fond memories. It wasn't the people, it was the fact that I was stoned on the darkroom chemicals.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby evilbeanfiend » Mon Nov 19, 2007 4:56 pm UTC

EvanED wrote:
photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.


How 'bout some HDR images? And how much money will it take you to reach your results?

Don't get me wrong, I'd love to have a darkroom and know how to use it, but give me a choice between a well-stocked darkroom and the knowledge vs. Photoshop, and I'll take the latter in an instant.


you can do hdr in photography by combining a series of exposures, or more coarsely using graduated filters (though this isnt true hdr its the same sort of result).
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby zenten » Wed Nov 21, 2007 6:35 pm UTC

Hexadecimator wrote:
photosinensis wrote:Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.
No, you'll just strain your eyes trying to see anything at all in the darkroom :P

Seriously though, I want to see this darkroom of yours. It must have all sorts of cool equipment that didn't exist back when I used the one at school. That is, if you're actually serious that you could emulate this with your precious darkroom (randomly chosen from deviantart's front page).

Now, perhaps if you stored your painting supplies in there...


Wait, why are people drawing pictures in Photoshop? It's not for drawing pictures people, it's for modifying pictures.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby AlexCrafter » Mon Nov 26, 2007 8:42 pm UTC

GimpShop is superior... And free.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby FACM » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:29 pm UTC

GIMP 2.4, the newest release, changes some icons and adds a Color menu to help consolidate those functions.

GIMP 2.6, the next planned release, should have a UI revamp as a major feature

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby LDJosh » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:40 pm UTC

i've used them all.
Photoshop, paint shop pro, fireworks, image ready, free hand, illustrator, gimp, etc...

I'll stick with photoshop. fireworks is good if your working with flash for the added compatibility.

I REALLY wanted to like Gimp. but as previously stated, it's clumsy.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby wr3cktangle » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:47 pm UTC

so umm.. mspaint?
if the skills aren't there, what program i'm using hardly makes a difference.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby jima » Tue Dec 04, 2007 5:18 pm UTC

wing wrote:And then Adobe bought Macromedia, and fired the assembler guys. Because what the fuck, who needs assembler? And then they went to make a new version of Flash, and discovered - FUCK, half of it is written in fucking assembler!

I happened across this line sigged over on the comic discussion forum. Thanks for that background; I always wondered exactly why it was x86(-32)-only, but never got around to looking into it.

wing wrote:Reportedly, there's a rewrite-from-scratch effort for Flash in the works at Adobe.

Oh, good. I look forward to this; I'd love to able to run Flash on my x86_64/ppc/sparc/alpha boxen. (Okay, only the lack of x86_64 has actually been a problem for me personally; a good friend of mine would love to see it on sparc(64), though.)

I wonder how it'll be licensed. Probably not the way I'd like. :-)

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby EdgarJPublius » Wed Dec 05, 2007 8:41 am UTC

So, I just tried the latest Gimp release and it was actually somewhat useable, if the next one carries on like this I will definately switch over from fireworks, but I'll still hope for a copy of photoshop to drop into my lap.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Peripatetic » Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:32 am UTC

photosinensis wrote:No software solution is as elegant, fun, or encourages altered states of consciousness quite like the original: playing around with heavy metals and somewhat toxic chemicals in a lightless room.

Film + darkroom 4evah!

Show me something you've done with Photoshop and I'll do it in the darkroom. Srsly. And I'll have more fun doing it without straining my eyes to examine each and every pixel in the image.


Combining photos into a panorama with perspective correction.

Here's me at the Grand Canyon (stitched together with hugin and the GIMP)

Image

I've been using GIMP ever since I started taking photographs some years ago and it's always served me well.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Tei » Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:52 am UTC

I have replaced Photoshop by Gimp for my photo editing and icon generation task. I dont miss photoshop.

I have tried to replace Flash 5 by Inkdesign. But I still miss Flash.. to draw stuff. Flash is Object Oriented, and the way I draw stuff, this is a killer feature to me. Inkdesign is not... or I failed to locate that feature.
Also, I love the FX you have in Flash 5 (tint, alpha, etc.).

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby wr3cktangle » Thu Dec 06, 2007 10:01 pm UTC

wait! i change my vote.
i'm going to say i use Picnik on Flickr and be all cool and trendy because it's current news and Web 2.0.
I totally just turned this into this, in mere minutes!
everyone loves someone who's hip to the current stuff and Web 2.0, right? right?
I mean, who needs a computer with massive amounts of hard drive space when I can store all my files online and use webtools to manipulate them.
All I need is a browser and a phat* pipe.



*note: some things said or terms used may or may have been done ironically. Seriously, mspaint fits my skillset just fine for most things. I'm not necessarily proud of it, it's just the truth.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby a386 » Fri Dec 07, 2007 5:45 am UTC

the GIMP was the first thing i used, because it was free, so i learned that interface before photoshop. i guess if i took the time to get a feel for photoshop now it might be more elegant, but honestly i don't do enough of this to bother. casual hobby at best. i really don't tap into many of the advanced features of either anyway.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Anpheus » Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:36 am UTC

Question: Should this become multiple topics?

I mean... Fireworks and Photoshop serve... different purposes. We might as well compare Photoshop and Illustrator. Fireworks is kind of in-between the two, but leans more towards vector work.

Photoshop vs. GIMP I could understand...
Fireworks/Illustrator vs. Inkscape I could understand...

But what we're talking about are different tools. We might as well argue "Hammer versus drill?" Well, if I have a nail, I'm going to use a hammer, and if I have a screw, I'm going to use a drill.



Edit: By the way, Photoshop/Illustrator for the win. I'd go with either of those over GIMP or Inkscape any and every day of the week. Photoshop is just as scriptable as GIMP and has a far superior interface, that's like a two for one special. In addition, the GIMP was obviously developed for only the most elitist computer photoeditors, because as of its current version, it still lacks CMYK support. I'm sorry if I like knowing what my document may end up looking like when I print it out, before I do, but... That's unacceptable. And for the latter, Inkscape has a completely nonintuitive interface that causes endless frustration and has so many UI quirks that I found it unusable even when editing a simple control path diagram for a computer science class. Absolutely no ability to group or manage objects in any reasonable way to change style options across a similar 'class' of objects simultaneously. It's an extremely exacting vector editor to use, in that it requires the utmost patience and a ridiculous amount of time to do anything useful. Keyboard shortcuts are unhelpful and every option had to be explored by just trying various combinations of quadruple-ctrl-alt-meta-bucky-cokebottle 2.5th mouse button clicks. I feel like they added features as they went and just assigned the new key and mouse configs as they went with little rhyme or reason.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby FACM » Fri Dec 07, 2007 2:59 pm UTC

If I have a drill, a nail, and no hammer, I don't mind using the back/side of the drill to pound it in. Not like it's going to hurt the drill any.

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Anpheus » Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:26 pm UTC

But the drill isn't really an ideal tool for putting nails in exceptionally tough material, and if the drill is plastic as most are today, the limit to the stresses on the drill is much lower than that on the solid metal head of the hammer.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby EvanED » Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:28 pm UTC

Yes, but it's a power tool. Therefore it's better by definition. Ever used an electric hammer? ;-)

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Anpheus » Fri Dec 07, 2007 6:37 pm UTC

Touché.

You win this round.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby enk » Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:31 pm UTC

I was wondering why Anpheus wrote "Hammer versus drill" instead of "hammer versus drill". Was it a sly reference to this forum's stringent mod? :P
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Hammer » Sat Dec 08, 2007 12:43 am UTC

enk wrote:I was wondering why Anpheus wrote "Hammer versus drill" instead of "hammer versus drill". Was it a sly reference to this forum's stringent mod? :P

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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby enk » Sat Dec 08, 2007 2:41 am UTC

I think Hammer and drill would get along fine until one sunny day when drill unwittingly tells Hammer something she already knows. Then he'd get locked up. End of story. :wink:
phlip wrote:Ha HA! Recycled emacs jokes.

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Hammer
Because all of you look like nails.
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Hammer » Sat Dec 08, 2007 2:54 am UTC

enk wrote:I think Hammer and drill would get along fine until one sunny day when drill unwittingly tells Hammer something she already knows. Then he'd get locked up. End of story. :wink:

I'm sorry...what? I've been mesmerized by your avatar for the past two hours.
* wanders dazedly off *
"What's wrong with you mathematicians? Cake is never a problem."

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Anpheus
I can't get any worse, can I?
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby Anpheus » Sat Dec 08, 2007 7:43 am UTC

Hammer wrote:
enk wrote:I was wondering why Anpheus wrote "Hammer versus drill" instead of "hammer versus drill". Was it a sly reference to this forum's stringent mod? :P

<.<
>.>
Hmmmmm....


No, I just dropped the comma before the quotes, I always begin "Things in quotes" with a capital letter. But you're usually supposed to put a comma before them, and say, "Things like this."
Spoiler:

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  /###\_________/###\
  |#################|
  \#################/
   |##┌         ┐##|
   |##  (¯`v´¯)  ##|
   |##  `\ ♥ /´  ##|
   |##   `\¸/´   ##|
   |##└         ┘##|
  /#################\
  |#################|
  \###/¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯\###/

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stockpot
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Re: Photoshop Vs. Fireworks Vs. Whatever You Can Name

Postby stockpot » Sat Dec 08, 2007 8:03 am UTC

I use Microsoft Office Word 2007 to turn all of my plain text into something more appealing.
Can you apply premade heading/title/normal styles to large documents in photoshop? In Illustrator? In the GIMP? No? I didn't think so.

Word>*


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