MJ's Fat-assery

[Drake]

In high school, I would have been a wrestler (I had the size and the lifting power) but that meant I would have to spend more time with people I didn't even like sharing air with (no offense).

None take. It just so happens I know exactly who you are talking about

Shut up. I'm working on it. Eating less doesn't work for me, because after three days, no matter what, I am so hungry that I will find a way to justify going to the bank, taking money out, going to Subway, getting a foot-long BBQ rib, THEN feeling bad. Eating healthier doesn't work as well, either, because after three days I crave MSG and saturated fats... well, salt, more than anything. Then it's back to Subway. I am working on finding food that doesn't make me all crave-y, but still keeps me full.
It doesn't exist so far.

I was trying to emphasize how gradual things have to be; Get the foot long BBQ rib, but switch out the chips for a salad(no dressing). Or try a 6" BBQ rib, 6" grilled chicken and a bag of chips. Or something like that. Hell, after three years of dating a vegan I am now just beginning to eat less meat...but only after finding good stuff to replace it(btw, I will never give up meat!). If you can give up soda (or even mix half regular and half diet), that will probably cut the same number of calories as dropping a bag of chips.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I've been with a vegetarian for nine years, and I've cut out a bit of meat, but since I get organic beef from her parents, and she likes to cook roasts, it isn't an argument we have. She tries to get me to eat healthier, and I try to get her to eat food from different cultures (and even try new foods... she likes more seafood now because of me! YEAH!)

Well, when I have the self control, I get a six-inch sub and the Sunchips... not a lot better. It's not always Subway, though, that was just an example... I get money and go to $purveyor-of-tasty-comestibles, be it Kwan's Buffet, or Subway, or Senor Froggys, or whatever. It's an acting out thing. I am trying to "act out" and just eat larger amounts of healthy food... Extra Foods has some tasty soups at only 220 calories a can, and very low fat (and some have BACON!) I'll splurge and eat two of those, which is still fairly low cal.

[tiny]

Sry, but I *have* to link this o.o I saw this comic and instantly thought of you, Mighty Jalapeño...

http://www.explosm.net/db/files/Comics/Rob/salsa.png

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I... can't tell if I should be insulted...

Nah

[tiny]

It's in no way intended to insult you! I find the comic cute o.o

EDIT: You know, I thought of you in a *good* way when I read it.

[Iori_Yagami]

I envy the ones whose weight problem is caused only by banal overeating.
I was always a rather sick, poor eater and often skipped meals, I ate only at designated times, but still I am quite round almost like MJ. Perhaps, something is wrong with my metabolism - exercise wears me out instantly... Well, even in grim student's years my weight was quite more than needed... I think, organism is a too complex thing for a forum discussion, especially if it is a popular 'yellow newspaper' topic and really it takes a professional medic to know it all...
On of the most important factors is that I wasn't very physically active during childhood - noone played with me, and mother always forbade me anything she though was dangerous - skiing, bicycle, etc
I grew up with hatred towards sports and sportsmen, percepting them as 'dumb' and annoying. PT was the only subject at school I was totally bad at, and pushed me farther from total perfection.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Well, I'm sure mine is just more than OVEReating... I do the math and I don't eat a LOT of calories, but I am on day 2 of the food diary, replacing snacks with water, and so far, no desire to stab anyone.

Yay!

[tiny]

I envy the ones whose weight problem is caused only by banal overeating.
I was always a rather sick, poor eater and often skipped meals, I ate only at designated times, but still I am quite round almost like MJ. Perhaps, something is wrong with my metabolism - exercise wears me out instantly... (...)

Ever had your thyroid checked?


EDIT: Go, MJ, go! *cheers and applauds*

[Iori_Yagami]

Well, I do not really go to doctors. That is stupid, of course. I have been there only for my glasses prescription and sometimes in my childhood. I'm not really totally healthy, however...

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Ok, re-starting the Drastic Measures thing. Weekends completely and utterly destroy any habits I am trying to form. I HAVE stuck with the "colossal amounts of water in lieu of eating", and no, I'm not drinking dangerous amounts of water. 4 liters is a lot for me, but nowhere near dangerous for a person my size.

[Serendipity]

First of all, take a look at one of these http://www.wvda.org/calcs/. It should tell you the basic facts you need to be able to lose weight.

As to dealing with hunger:
This may not be the case for you since it doesn't sound like you do much cardio-type stuff, but you did mention "feeling weird" if you don't walk to the mall at lunchtime...

Do you ever feel tense and uncomfortable from having not exercised in a while? If I don't exercise in a couple of days my body feels very uncomfortable, almost as though I can feel my muscles atrophying.

Aside from being a good motivator for getting me to go get some exercise, it is also the antithesis to hunger. If I'm hungry with no chance of getting to food any time soon, I just recall that feeling and my hunger is instantly subdued.

This subjective experience may not be at all helpful to you, but two general tips for dealing with hunger that probably apply to a wider range of people are:

1) Like with any physical discomfort, your mental state towards it determines how much it affects you. Generally, just accepting that you are hungry and reminding yourself that it's not going to kill you is helpful. (The same applies to pain) Trying to strive against/become angry with the fact that you're hungry is exhausting. Easier said than done I suppose, but it's a good thing to keep in mind. Consider being *slightly* hungry as your ground zero and as comfortable. Consider feeling very full as very uncomfortable.

2) Try, as much as possible, to integrate your desires. That is, setting up one half of yourself as "wanting to lose weight" whilst the other half wants to eat as much as possible pretty much dooms you to either failure or unhappiness. When you think about what/how much to eat, remember the reasons you have for losing weight. Reminding yourself that you are one person, not two conflicting sides, can be helpful.

Also: Good luck! Being healthy feels awesome. Additionally, when you generally eat healthy food, eating the occasional high fat/sugar thing tastes much better since you don't get the slight nausea that comes from constantly eating shit.

[tiny]

(...) Eating less doesn't work for me, because after three days, no matter what, I am so hungry that I will find a way to justify going to the bank, taking money out, going to Subway, getting a foot-long BBQ rib, THEN feeling bad.(...)

Serendipity makes two very good points.
You'll have to learn to deal with your hunger. I don't see a way for you to burn 4000kcal every day, and you would have to do so in order to lose weight. See it as an emanzipation. Free yourself from the dictatorship of your evil stomach

As a person with slightly anorexic tendencies, I recommend procrastination as an additonal way to deal with hunger.
- Have died snacks around. When your hunger gets bad, eat one and tell yourself that you've eaten enough to keep going for another 30mins.
- Tell yourself: Ok, I'm going to have a real meal, but first I have to... Do at least 3 things before you go eating and think about how many calories you're burning off your hips by heroically ignoring your greedy stomach.
- Use varying indirect routes to your place of eating and chose a place that's far away.
- Look at shop displays. Try to convince yourself to buy something, then convince yourself of the opposite again.
- When you eat, put your sandwich back on the plate/put down the cutlery and fold your hands in your lap while you chew every (small!) bite at least 30 times.
- Taste consciously what you eat and enjoy the taste; don't just swallow it unthinkingly.
- Drink some water after every bite.
- Before you take another bite, think about what you've already eaten and find out if you're really still hungy.

[TizzyFoe]

This may or may not help you, but i find i eat whatever portion i set out for myself. I will make myself eat more then i really want to if the food is in front of me. Setting smaller portions for your meals may be helpful.

have you lost any weight so far?

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Not yet... most of the past two weeks I've either been out of town, or sick with a mild case of death. I may have lost a little weight (there seems to be less of me clogging up the mirror), but I can't really tell, since my scale isn't entirely accurate.

I try little rituals like that for when I eat, but it never lasts... most of the time I have to purposefully eat whatever it is I'm eating as fast as possible because there's something that needs doing, IE, eat breakfast as fast as possible so I can get my nine million chores done in the morning and be out the door only twenty minutes late, or eat dinner as fast as possible so I can take the baby and let my wife eat dinner, or eat my lunch as fast as possible so I can sit down with one of my seven bosses and work out project stuff... etc etc etc. I am back on the water thing today (like, right now, which is what reminded me to check out this forum), so that will hopefully help. The weather is warming up, so now when I go for walks I shed about four pounds just from the temperature. My wife is, for the nonce, really into training for Boogie The Bridge, so family walks in the evening are starting up again.

[tiny]

(...) most of the time I have to purposefully eat whatever it is I'm eating as fast as possible because there's something that needs doing (...)

But that's a perfect situation to lose weight! Just eat slowly You don't have to empty your plate, you know?

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Possiblie...

[tiny]

Try it, man! You're worth it

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I'm not insured, so I don't think I am.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Ok, gained 3 lbs since New Years.

...

This ain't over...

MJ's Mass-anthropy.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Must... find way... to channel rage... into weight-loss...

[Drake]

Ok, gained 3 lbs since New Years.

...

This ain't over...

MJ's Mass-anthropy.

Hey M.J,
Sorry to hear things haven't been going well. (Any chance its 3 lbs of ripped muscle, skillfully hidden?)

How drastically are you changing your diet?
Do you know where you need to start?
Aside from this forum do you have good support on the day-to-day? (My Dad did an incredible diet overhaul about 12 years ago which was made possible because my Mom really helped him find new recipes/food and stand up to two loud teenage boys. ahem.)

Mini rant:
The types of foods you eat, have been conditioning your body to respond to a specific set of expectations. Different foods will not satisfy you (or your hunger) because your body has not seen them on a regular basis. And remember, you have been conditioning your body three times a day for a lifetime (I challenge you to name something other then a bodily function that you do with as much regularity, and for as much time; I know I can't).

You are not just trying to lose weight; You are attempting to undo a lifetime of habits and conditioning. (and unlike smoking; not eating is not an option)

My point is that changes (IMHO) have to be slow. And if you don't know what your body is currently expecting, then you don't know how fast you are changing things. 3000 cals/day of fast food with the occasional green thing *might* be a practical starting point.

If you are already keeping a food log, make sure to include How You Feel. If you are making diet changes too fast and are no longer satisfied by the same number of calories, or if you are constantly hungry for a week strait, the your current plan ain't working and you can try something else before things implode in Fad Diet Tradition.

If I am pontificating too much on your thread, let me know.

Never be afraid to eat! Day-to-day changes are for losers! Life long changes FTW!

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I'm back.

All of me.

[Izawwlgood]

Where you been, and how much weight have you lost?

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I been around.

Around.

That means I didn't lose any weight.

[Drake]

Welcome Back!

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Well, I'm back again.

Satan: Hello, MJ.... back again, huh?

Yes, thank you, Bill. Anyways, I'm back. This week has been a heck of a week for me (heavily influenced by the events of LAST week), but probably the biggest one is my desire for physical change. One accomplice has given me the book "Burn The Fat, Feed The Muscle" by Tom Venuto. Now, as always, I approach everything like this with a grain of salt, to the point that there's a ten-foot drift behind my chair, but despite OCCASIONALLY sounding like an infomercial, this book has made a truly ridiculous amount of sense in a LOT of areas.

As of Tuesday morning, I have been on a diet and exercise program. Now, when I say diet, I do not mean I'm eating a specific list of different foods designed to get me to lose weight... no no no. I am eating all the same food. I am spacing them out into five or six meals per day, cutting out some of the carbs, and replacing them with more protein at each meal. I exercise first thing in the morning, and late at night, and I go for a 2k walk every lunch (thinking of upping it to 3).

Now, I've been on this diet for, yes, four days.... and it should be noted that that is the longest I have ever stuck to a diet and exercise program.

The most important exercise I have been practicing is called the "two handed table push". I'll let that sink in for a moment.

I've read Venuto's website, I've gotten advice from http://www.bodyweightculture.com (excellent site for exercise, VERY excellent), and I've sought out his detractors, and I've come to a decision about this material based on all the information available, and also my own cynicism, and I've decided: this is a good book.

It's also an E-book, and I would be HAPPY to e-mail this to anyone who needs it (it's the #1 weight loss e-book of all time, and it's NOT just hype crap. This is MJ talking here).

My goals are legion, but the short-term and longterm are:

- Lose 25 lbs in 200 days (I have a 200-page book I am keeping track of ALL my eating and exercise, and I wanna lose 25 lbs by the end of it)

- Have Shihan Derrick Rothermel award me my Black Belt.

So... thats it. Any questions?

[space_raptor]

Right on. I'd like a copy, I'll PM you.

As an anecdote, about three months back I tried the South Beach Diet and I lost 10 pounds in three weeks. Then I went on a slightly less intense version of the diet (ie: occasional french fries) and now I'm down 15 pounds total. Generally the ideas from the diet are to space out the meals, make the meals smaller, cut the carbs, and monitor your calories, but don't go hungry. Sounds like this is similar, which is encouraging, because it means that these are just generally good ideas not necessarily intrinsic to one specific diet. The toughest part is not drinking beer. Beer is apparently about the worst thing you can do if you're trying to limit your intake. Also apparently that kind of significant drop is expected for the first 2 or 3 weeks, but then the weight loss on the diet slows down.

I am 6'2", and have probably more muscle in certain areas than the average dude, so I'd like to get down to about 200 from my current status of 215-220. Guess I should get motivated. I managed to be motivated for those three weeks because I had a competition with my roommate to see who could lose more weight. Beat me by a pound, the bastard. Actually more like half a pound. It was a good idea, it really got me on the bike and drinking water instead of iced tea or whatever.

I'm a big bbq rib fan too, but now when I go to Subway I get a wrap of whatever, and just have em put BBQ sauce in it, and I think it actually tastes better. Bread's got too many carbs!

[Mighty Jalapeno]

The "meal spacing" is due to the human body's ability to process food. It takes about 3 hours to process a stomachfull of food, and if you simply eat too much, the excess is processed inefficiently, and the same AMOUNT of protein is absorbed. Simple carbs, however, are all absorbed, resulting in a blood sugar spike, and an insulin response that flushes the sugar from your blood, resulting in a sugar crash. Always consume ~27g of protein with each meal, which slows digestion and keeps the carbs you consume from spiking. As such, a 400-500 calorie meal with 27g of protein and a complex carb, 5-6 times per day, maximises your ability to absorb food with little to no waste.

Sending!

[space_raptor]

The South Beach Diet book goes into details just like that, (it's written by a cardiologist) so yeah, pretty interesting stuff on how the body works.

Thanks!

[Mighty Jalapeno]

Also, exercises of choice for combined cardio / weight training:

Bear Bar Complex (see video here)

[url=burpees]Burpees[/url]

Both of these work the "big three" muscle groups in a remarkably short amount of time, and will get your heart rate up VERY quickly (especially if you're a colossal fatass like me). Imporant: Don't restrict your breathing for ANY of these. In fact, force yourself into exaggerated breathing for all of them. Trust me.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

3 lbs and 1 waistline inch lost. Unlimited gym membership purchased, and being used daily. Feeling pretty good.

[jenue]

Yay MJ! So glad to read that you're finally making progress!

I've only just read the thread, and I was going to make suggestions along the lines of doing small things (morning exercise and drink a glass of water right away) to boost your metabolism, but it seems like you're getting the hang of it now. I was also going to recommend something like Weight Watchers, or even a workout buddy. It helps to have someone to hold you accountable for keeping up your new habits. Perhaps your wife could help? The journal is really a fabulous idea, and I'm really glad that you have a very specific goal and a well organized strategy for getting there. That's always the hardest thing for me.

A few small food things that I didn't see mentioned so much:
1. whole grains are healthier for you than bleached white flour. Brown rice is better than white rice. Also, refined sugar=the devil (if you need to buy sugar, look in the natural section of your grocery store).
2. You know already that having a small amount of protein either before or during a meal will make you full faster and longer.
3. you might want to consider reducing the amount of dairy you take in. There's a LOT of fat in milk and cheese; at least try some of the substitutes (I actually prefer soy milk to real milk). Just make sure you're getting your calcium from another source.

You seem to have a great attitude! Whatever you do, keep it up! Don't get discouraged. This should be less a "diet and exercise program" and more of a lifestyle change. Think positively about the things you're doing and actively enjoy them (Smile and tell yourself that your healthy foods are more delicious than the junk food, exercise is more fun than sitting down, and generally try to make yourself excited about the things you're doing. Eventually you will have convinced yourself). In time it will be that much easier to keep up even on the toughest days.

Keep us posted!!

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I go to the gym because I have a workout buddy And now that he's stopped going inexplicably, I have to keep going, just so I can say "at least I'm not a pussy like (name) is!"

My wife is generally unhelpful when it comes to this, but I think she's starting to come around, now that it's been three weeks and I'm STILL doing it.

As for the dietary tips, yup, I know all that (might not have mentioned it). My only bread is rye (yay fibre!) and I only have a little bit of milk (maybe 1 liter, tops) per day, and maybe a few ounces of cheese. I eat a lot of apples and tuna and stoned wheat crackers, and my water intake has gone up SO much since I started eating less and exercising (not sure why!)

[Mighty Jalapeno]

I'm not sure if this is indicative of anything, if indeed it even IS indicative of anything, but... this morning's workout was a lot more intense than my previous ones, AND IT WAS EASIER. I am upping my time on the elliptical by 1 minute per day, and today's 21 minute was easier than Monday's 20 minute, even though Monday was level 8 the entire time, and today I started at 8, then moved up to 9, and then moved up to 10, and my spm averaged 92, versus monday's 86. I did it FASTER, on a HARDER difficulty, and it was easier.

I also did a lot more arm-press, chest-press, and pull-downs, with higher weight.

I think I finally shook off my sedentarosity. I have heard that it doesn't take long for your body to get up to "minimum active", after being stuck in sedentary, and if I'm right, I will start burning more calories at rest now.

Yay!

[Moo]

Yay!!!

For you, but also for the hope that it gives the rest of us that it will get easier for us too.

[lanicita]

MJ, that's awesome! Keep it up! *Cheers*

[Mighty Jalapeno]

If Meaux posts, I'll officially have my own cheerleading squad.

[Solt]

I'm not sure if this is indicative of anything, if indeed it even IS indicative of anything, but... this morning's workout was a lot more intense than my previous ones, AND IT WAS EASIER. I am upping my time on the elliptical by 1 minute per day, and today's 21 minute was easier than Monday's 20 minute, even though Monday was level 8 the entire time, and today I started at 8, then moved up to 9, and then moved up to 10, and my spm averaged 92, versus monday's 86. I did it FASTER, on a HARDER difficulty, and it was easier.

I also did a lot more arm-press, chest-press, and pull-downs, with higher weight.

I think I finally shook off my sedentarosity. I have heard that it doesn't take long for your body to get up to "minimum active", after being stuck in sedentary, and if I'm right, I will start burning more calories at rest now.

Yay!

Sweet.

Don't forget that rest is important when training muscles. Also, once your muscles are used to being regularly challenged, they never complain as much. It's probably the combination of these two things that have helped you get over this hill.

Keep it up!

[jenue]

Sounds awesome! We're all cheering you on, MJ! *shakes pom poms*

Just thought I'd mention that I've heard that exercising (cardio) for more than 45 minutes at a time doesn't really give much added benefit, which amount of time serves as a really good (and attainable) goal.

[Mighty Jalapeno]

? I got a thread update for this, just now.... wierd.