Discworld Mafia: Day 5: No Deadline

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kalira
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby kalira » Sun Apr 12, 2015 3:38 pm UTC

Minestrone, how would someone's defense of wam make sense if wam was a jester?

Madge, that last post screams of scum trying to get a good word in about the lynchee that you know is town, before he is lynched and flips.

Well, as my previous incarnation left no posts, I guess there is nothing you folks can ask me for clarification on...

I think the wam wagon came up damn quickly after madness ended, with a pretty shaky justification. I know SDK and I have very different styles of play, but the fact that he wanted everyone to drop a vote right after madness ended, with about a page and a half of posts, a fair number of which were confirmations, to me only logically leads to a really weakly argued wagon against someone for a minor infraction, in this case wam.

Yes, people have been lynched for less, but building up that wagon so high leads to a lot less discussion on D1, which is damn problematic in my opinion because it is pretty much the only time we have to talk before scum get to talk to each other.

More later, as I have to go take care of taxes (yay freedom!)
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Minestrone » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:07 pm UTC

kalira wrote:Minestrone, how would someone's defense of wam make sense if wam was a jester?

Sorry, I didn't make that part clear. What I meant was that the content of New User's defense (that scum would never do something so scummy) would normally make no sense but would make sense if there was a reasonable possibility of a jester in the game.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:09 pm UTC

Yeah, please don't lynch wam. I'm pretty sure he's town. I'm also pretty sure I can catch him later if he really is scum.

Minestrone still feels like where I want to be. His further posts have all felt a forced to me.

Madge is my other question mark, but I'd rather she see Day 2. It's hard to get a solid read on Madge Day 1 since she doesn't do anything.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby New User » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:14 pm UTC

SDK, I don't see where Minestrone ignored you and then continued ignoring you. It must be more obvious to you than it is to me. Could you point out something a bit specific please?

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:26 pm UTC

It's not that he ignored me so much as that he just doesn't want to deal with me. The attitude in his first post of not even trying to read me, leaving me be for later, is something I've seen before, more often from scum than town, and strikes me as odd coming from Monestrone in particular. If he wants to use me as a strong scum hunter, he's going to need to read me first, right? Just ignoring me doesn't help Minestrone if he's town.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Minestrone » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:33 pm UTC

I think they took this quote:
Minestrone wrote:I'm in the camp that if SDK is town we have a good scumhunter on our side, and that if they're not they attract enough attention that they'll get investigated sooner or later anyway.

and the fact that I didn't pay any special attention to their couple of beginning of day posts as advocating for ignoring them and having them investigated. I was more responding to the people who want to lynch SDK just because of their playstyle or supposedly slippery record as scum. I still consider SDK, like all the rest of you, potential scum and will continue to do so unless they are confirmed town in some way by the game. I just don't consider them a top lynch priority for today.

Ninja'd by SDK themself, but this post basically contains a response to what they said anyway, so I'll just leave it as is.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby ajh » Sun Apr 12, 2015 5:56 pm UTC

Are these votals correct?
wam (4) - BigNose, moody7277, Minestrone, Lawrencelot
Minestrone (2) - SDK, ajh
BigNose (1) - Minestrone
ajh (1) - New User
freezeblade (1) - wam

New User, Minestrone has only attacked BigNose, and then wam. I could also imagine you two being on a scum team.
My vote is actually really flexible, I'm still waiting for a wagon to form.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Diemo » Sun Apr 12, 2015 6:11 pm UTC

Basically no.

Votals:
Minestrone (2) - SDK, ajh
wam (4) - Bignose, Moody, Minestrone, Lawrencelot
ajh (1) - New User,
Freezeblade (1) - wam
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Lawrencelot » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:01 pm UTC

Getting some more reads in just in case I don't survive the night

-liking both ajh and moody, though I'd appreciate it if ajh would post more than just reads
-New User not being really clear about what he thinks of wam, which seems scummy. NU, why do or don't you want to see wam lynched?
-Madge defends wam for no reason (not even because of 'gut' or 'style'), suspicious
-Minestrone's jester post made no sense to me, until he explained it. Still, I will never take jesters into account until a mod confirms there is a high probability of there being one in the game. If wam turns scum, I'll suspect Minestrone.
-Kalira also defending wam, but I like that post a lot. Looks town regardless of wam's alignment. Also, welcome to the game and thanks for replacing!
Not agreeing with kalira that SDK wanting people to vote after mod madness is scummy
-SDK also defending wam, with a reason. That post looks neutral to me

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby New User » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:19 pm UTC

I can't say that I do or don't want to see wam lynched, it's more accurate for me to say that I don't want my vote on him because I don't think he is the scummiest player right now. He's not the towniest looking player either, so I won't cry if he is lynched. Most of the votes on him seem like they piled on because of wam voting for BigNose on the first page, and I don't agree with that reason because my meta-read on wam makes me think that wam has enough experience as scum to know better than to draw such attention to himself by voting for BigNose like that (being the second person to vote for BigNose after BigNose's joke vote for the moderator draws obvious attention to himself).

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby wam » Sun Apr 12, 2015 8:51 pm UTC

Quick post, will post in detail just before deadline tomorrow.

Not liking Minestrones post straight after mine as it pings me with everyword so they have moved up to tie with MAdge and Freezeblade in my scummy list. not sure which of the three is the best lynch but am happy with any of them, so will give them time for more content and decidee closer to the deadline. Especially interested in madge's promised post.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby New User » Sun Apr 12, 2015 9:25 pm UTC

I just looked back over freezeblade's posts and I agree with wam that freezeblade hasn't provided any original content. In fact, freezeblade's posts seem to be uniformly focused on SDK. That makes freezeblade look scummier than ajh.

Vote: freezeblade

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby kalira » Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:33 pm UTC

Minestrone, understood re: the defense of wam if he were a jester thing. I can accept that explanation.

SDK, again, we have different play styles, but things like this just really don't do anything for me:
SDK wrote:Yeah, please don't lynch wam. I'm pretty sure he's town. I'm also pretty sure I can catch him later if he really is scum.

Not the part where you think wam is town, that's just there for the context, but the second bit. If people are reasonably sure that someone's the best bet for being scum, that person should be lynched then (for the most part). We can't hang our hats on your scumhunting skills, as we don't know whether you're even town, there's no guarantee you would be alive at whatever point to scumhunt him, and IDK, it just smacks of hubris a bit to me.

FWIW Lawrencelot, I never said SDK was scummy for wanting people to vote right then. I just said I didn't like it because it only logically ends with a wagon with weakly justifications (IMO), especially on a D1 when there hasn't been much discussion at all.

Wam:
wam wrote:Not liking Minestrones post straight after mine as it pings me with everyword so they have moved up to tie with MAdge and Freezeblade in my scummy list.

Are you talking about the post where he's mentioning you might be a jester? That's the only one I can think that it would be... There's nothing that screams scummy to me in that post other than the fact that he didn't give any opinion as to who to move votes to-- can you give any more detail on what you mean by that? Just prior to that, you said he seemed reasonably townie -- what caused such a quick turnaround in thought?

Overall wam's somewhat neutral leaning only slightly scummy for me because of things like the wording of the post I just quoted and the fact that he didn't explain what about it pings him (though I acknowledge that he said it was a quick post). He tries to explain away that he doesn't remember the logic for his vote on BN because of the intervening madness, even though he said in the post where he voted for him that it was because BN's actions seemed like active lurking, and some of the wording in his posts since almost smack TOO much of scum trying to seem townie. I'm not the biggest fan of how the wagon on him formed, but we have to lynch someone, and he's at least pinged me a couple of times.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Mon Apr 13, 2015 1:56 pm UTC

kalira wrote:SDK, again, we have different play styles, but things like this just really don't do anything for me:
SDK wrote:Yeah, please don't lynch wam. I'm pretty sure he's town. I'm also pretty sure I can catch him later if he really is scum.

Not the part where you think wam is town, that's just there for the context, but the second bit. If people are reasonably sure that someone's the best bet for being scum, that person should be lynched then (for the most part). We can't hang our hats on your scumhunting skills, as we don't know whether you're even town, there's no guarantee you would be alive at whatever point to scumhunt him, and IDK, it just smacks of hubris a bit to me.

Sorry. I am occasionally a cocky prick, but not this time. I wouldn't say that about anyone in this game aside from wam, and I should have elaborated. I've said this in previous games, that I believe I have a strong meta-tell on him. So far he has yet to roll scum since my first game (Seaside) where I first noticed this, so the tell hasn't been tested, but that just means I've got a better handle on his town games as well (and how much this tell pervades his writing style). I really don't think he's scum. I also really think that if he is, I'll know it soon enough.

kalira wrote:FWIW Lawrencelot, I never said SDK was scummy for wanting people to vote right then. I just said I didn't like it because it only logically ends with a wagon with weakly justifications (IMO), especially on a D1 when there hasn't been much discussion at all.

This was actually the point, not to get someone lynched for weak reasoning, but to get a wagon formed so we had something more concrete to go on. Not enough people are posting right now though, so today's going to be a write-off unless Diemo gives us an extension.

Speaking of which, Diemo, could we get an extension please?
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby moody7277 » Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:14 pm UTC

If I weren't going to vote for wam:

Would consider voting for:

ajh- Still a bit leery of him based off his third post. 6th post: "Still waiting for a wagon to form" sounds a bit odd considering the wam-wagon is rolling along just fine.

fb- I can see how his posts could be interpreted as "contentless". The meatiest post was his 7th one, which is just confirming his opinion of SDK's meta (that we should all recognize by now).

Madge- After a re-read on her, it seems she's got almost as little content as fb. Just simple likes or dislikes (one wonders how that would translate to scum versus non-scum). The explicit instruction to the cop seems a little off too.

Minestrone- First two posts taken together are weird; vote for BigNose, then for wam based off his OMGUS. Then we get the whole wam=jester theory, which sounds to me like a way of asking us not to vote for wam without explicitly saying that.

SDK- Lot of setup and flavor discussion early, with Minestrone's reaction to it being fluffy his justification for voting her. Couple other things ping me off him, but I can't entirely be sure if they're scummy or just him.


Would not consider voting for:

BN- despite the odd start with the mod-vote, has been acting very townie IMO.

kalira- reads and questions seem townie at this point, although I'm not getting a strong read on her yet.

Lawr- still pretty much convinced he's town

NU- setup spec in first several posts, finally get a reads post in number 6. At this point I think it's more likely than not NU is town
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Diemo » Mon Apr 13, 2015 3:51 pm UTC

24 Hour Extension granted
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby wam » Mon Apr 13, 2015 5:25 pm UTC

@ Kalira yes the jester post. It came acrross to me that they were a scum panicking that they were bandwagoning a town, but my POV is biased.

SDK gets townie points for asking for the extension.

Moody's latest post comes across townie.

Still nothign from madge or freeze....
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby freezeblade » Mon Apr 13, 2015 6:30 pm UTC

wam wrote:Still nothign from madge or freeze....

I'm back, sorry, weekends are spotty for me, especally as I was at my 10 year HS reunion (bleh, I'm old)

i'm really liking moody's impressions list, except I will disagree about it New User, who I'm finding pretty scummy sounding, especally this post:
New User wrote:I can't say that I do or don't want to see wam lynched, it's more accurate for me to say that I don't want my vote on him because I don't think he is the scummiest player right now. He's not the towniest looking player either, so I won't cry if he is lynched. Most of the votes on him seem like they piled on because of wam voting for BigNose on the first page, and I don't agree with that reason because my meta-read on wam makes me think that wam has enough experience as scum to know better than to draw such attention to himself by voting for BigNose like that (being the second person to vote for BigNose after BigNose's joke vote for the moderator draws obvious attention to himself).
this all seems very wishy-washy

And the reasoning of "well, scum should know better than to be scummy, so he's clearly not scummy!" is...well...scummy. Seeing as how this is my strongest read at the moment, I'll
vote: new user
with wam a close second, for his scummy second vote

I hope I'll be able to get in a few more posts between now and the new deadline, if work allows it.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby BigNose » Mon Apr 13, 2015 7:18 pm UTC

Oh good. Lots of additional content since my last post.

Do I consider Wam as Scum - NO
Do I consider some content of Wam's Scummy - YES
Do I still consider the vote on Wam justifiable - Maybe
If I didn't have a vote on Wam, who would I vote for? - TBD


FB continues to be content-less (less his latest post, more to follow on that)


ajh wrote:Madge's pagetopper is pinging me with every line, distancing themselves from taking action.
Agree
ajh wrote:freezeblade's posts contain very little beside setup spec and the thing with SDK.
Agree
ajh wrote:NU and moody seem a bit fluffy,
Agree on NU, Disagree on Moody
ajh wrote:wam is really undecided who they want to vote for. I forgot what I wanted to say about Minestrone.
There are statements and a position defined in here. Just not sure what atm.


Minestrone wrote:Ok so I lost the post I just made but basically I was criticizing New User for their defense of wam until it occurred to me that their defense, and wams behavior in general, would make sense if wam was a jester, which seems like a possibility in this game. Maybe we should lynch someone else and leave a vig to take care of wam. I don't know who else we would lynch though. I'll have to think about that more later. For now my vote stays
I don't like the logic of this. How can NU actively support a Jester unless they are both Scum and why would a Scum be a Jester, unless he is a Jester Bomb.
Either you are deliberately tying these 2 together, or indeed, you know that what you are stating is more than mere speculation, because you and Wam are Scum buddies. But that doesn't make sense either.


Lawrencelot wrote:Getting some more reads in just in case I don't survive the night
Why would you not? I consider most players would survive.


And back to FB:
The vote on NU is about the so-called wishy-washy nature of a response to a question. The fact that they answered the question, without any form of deliberate over-justification, make me consider NU's response valid and FB looking more Scummy, both on Post content and this vote.

So, to answer the TBD: If I wasn't voting for Wam, who would I vote for?



Vote: FreezeBlade


Adacore wrote:In all honesty, BigNose has been pinging me slightly with almost every post since the start of the game. But he always does - I was utterly convinced he was anti-town for most of Wizardry2 and he was the High Wizard. I just can't read him.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby freezeblade » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:19 pm UTC

Just checking, this means you ascribe to the "scummy players know better than to ask scummy, so the player acting scummy must not be scum." concept? mark me down as not agreeing with that idea.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:29 pm UTC

Where did you get that from in BigNose's post?
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:37 pm UTC

Also, freezeblade, what did you think of the reasoning I did finally give for my reads on Lawrencelot and Minestrone?
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby New User » Mon Apr 13, 2015 8:53 pm UTC

To better explain myself to freezeblade, I'm not trying to say that "scummy players know better than to act scummy". I was saying that I don't think wam's vote on BigNose is something wam would do if he was scum. It's a meta-read on wam, not on what any scummy player would do. This judgment of mine is based on me playing games in the past with wam. I know wam has played mafia here for years, and I have seen games where he was scum and managed to draw so little attention to himself that he survived until the end of the game (the only example I can think of right now is Bayesian Mafia). In this game, BigNose voted for the moderator at the very beginning of the game. That act in itself was meaningless, as voting for the moderator does nothing (unless there is some unusual mechanics I don't know about) so there was no reason for anyone to react to a meaningless act. After Minestrone reacted to it, wam then joined the vote. This is D1 mafia, page one, and by being the second person to vote on someone (you might say starting the bandwagon), wam is drawing attention to himself. I think that wam as a player has enough experience as scum to know that drawing attention to himself is bad, and he should know that his vote against BigNose for a meaningless action would draw attention to himself.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Mon Apr 13, 2015 9:21 pm UTC

1. SDK
2. Madge
3. moody7277 - town? maybe not.
4. kalira
5. New User - probably town?
6. Minestrone - hmm
7. Freezeblade
8. ajh - Town, I guess?
9. Lawrencelot - probably town, though his vote on wam wasn't the greatest
10. wam - Town. Almost certainly.
11. BigNose - probably town


Madge wrote:I think the cop has little choice but to investigate SDK tonight.

Why do you say that, Madge? What if I were to die tonight?


moody, could you please elaborate on your wam scum read? What one thing is the biggest thing that makes you think he's scum?
Also, who is the first shadiest if I'm second shadiest?


ajh, why did you vote for Minestrone?
You said previously that "My vote is actually really flexible, I'm still waiting for a wagon to form" - Exactly who's wagons would you be willing to get onto? If a wagon formed on me, would you get on it? Why or why not?


Minestrone, why is a vig killing jester-wam any better than lynching him? Do you only suspect wam based on his BigNose vote, or is there more?


kalira wrote:I know SDK and I have very different styles of play, but the fact that he wanted everyone to drop a vote right after madness ended, with about a page and a half of posts, a fair number of which were confirmations, to me only logically leads to a really weakly argued wagon against someone for a minor infraction, in this case wam.

Yes, people have been lynched for less, but building up that wagon so high leads to a lot less discussion on D1, which is damn problematic in my opinion because it is pretty much the only time we have to talk before scum get to talk to each other.

kalira, you don't really follow up on this later. What are you trying to say by bringing this up? Am I scum? Who is scum?



... All in all, I think I'd be down for a freezeblade lynch. Very little real discussion, except what feel like jabs from the sidelines. His one real post votes New User for being scummy when all freezeblade really showed was that New User used bad logic. More importantly, encourages the wam wagon at the same time referring only to his hop on the BigNose wagon despite wam having several better posts since (which freezeblade didn't mention). More scummily, that one bad wam post came well before freezeblade previously made the comment that "I don't think I can make judgement calls on anyone else at this point", probably because jumping on a leading wagon is scary when you're scum.

... Three votes? wam, New User, BigNose. I like those guys too. Sounds good.

Vote freezeblade.

That should be L-2.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby moody7277 » Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:21 pm UTC

SDK wrote:moody, could you please elaborate on your wam scum read? What one thing is the biggest thing that makes you think he's scum?Also, who is the first shadiest if I'm second shadiest?


First shadiest at the time I said that was wam, under the principle that you vote for who you find scummiest. As to why this was the case, it was from his vote of you based off your standard meta plus what I read as an OMGUSy switch to voting for BigNose. Reread of that post shows a bit more reasoning behind it, and subsequent posts are diluting the scum read I had on him. It's mostly for that reason I was putting together the list in my previous post.

SDK wrote:3. moody7277 - town? maybe not.


I guess that's a sideways compliment after what I put you through in Dethy.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby freezeblade » Mon Apr 13, 2015 10:25 pm UTC

I'm going to do this post in a sort of stream of consiousness way, buiding it as I read it, as I don't have time for extensive editing at the moment.

SDK wrote:Where did you get that from in BigNose's post?

BigNose wrote:And back to FB:
The vote on NU is about the so-called wishy-washy nature of a response to a question. The fact that they answered the question, without any form of deliberate over-justification, make me consider NU's response valid and FB looking more Scummy, both on Post content and this vote.[/b]

The underlined part is where I find bignose saying this, as this is the logic displayed by NU in referened post.

What I think about your reasonings, as per usual, I'm not a fan of basing reasonings entirely on meta, which is what your reasonings seem to be, however, there's not much more to go on for D1, so I'll allow them for now. There needs to be more of a reason than "well, it's all in their phrasing" in days beyond D1, but then, these are my usual comments and qualms with your playstyle.

NU: yes, I can see that now that I have re-read it, and it makes sense to me now. I must have misintrupted the tone and over-extrapolated.
unvote

Lots of "hmm maybe,"or "possibly" and "probably" in SDK's last post, which I don't like. wishy-washy all around.

ninja'd by moody, who I think I have as towniest in my mind at the moment.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby Madge » Tue Apr 14, 2015 1:21 am UTC

I was about to start to do a re-read and make a nice post but then my boss called me into his office and I have like 2 hours to get a bunch of stuff done and then I'm on site all afternoon. I will hopefully have enough time during lunch to work out what's what.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby ajh » Tue Apr 14, 2015 3:48 pm UTC

SDK wrote:ajh, why did you vote for Minestrone?
You said previously that "My vote is actually really flexible, I'm still waiting for a wagon to form" - Exactly who's wagons would you be willing to get onto? If a wagon formed on me, would you get on it? Why or why not?
Minestrone hadn't posted all that much, there was already one vote, and I didn't want to waste my vote on Madge (my scummiest read). You're asking helpful questions, no danger there :D Maybe moody/NU, although that seems unlikely.
vote: Madge

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kalira
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby kalira » Tue Apr 14, 2015 3:57 pm UTC

SDK wrote:kalira wrote:I know SDK and I have very different styles of play, but the fact that he wanted everyone to drop a vote right after madness ended, with about a page and a half of posts, a fair number of which were confirmations, to me only logically leads to a really weakly argued wagon against someone for a minor infraction, in this case wam. Yes, people have been lynched for less, but building up that wagon so high leads to a lot less discussion on D1, which is damn problematic in my opinion because it is pretty much the only time we have to talk before scum get to talk to each other.kalira, you don't really follow up on this later. What are you trying to say by bringing this up? Am I scum? Who is scum?


I didn't feel like I needed to follow up on anything in there. I said all I wanted to. I wasn't "trying to say" anything by bringing it up; it was just literally what was said there.

I didn't like the fact that you asked for votes with so little discussion behind us. Doesn't mean you're scum necessarily. I've long since acknowledged in my own mind that a lot of the things you're going to do in any game are going to make my metaphorical eyeball twitch, but I haven't figured out yet whether you're scum in this game.

Nor is it to say that wam isn't scum just because there's a wagon that built up on him at that time. As I said there, I just didn't like the method of getting those votes, and at that point it seemed like said wagon was being built up just bc people wanted to get a vote down and were latching on to weak justifications.

I *really* don't like that you feel like you have completely cleared wam of scummitude when you were earlier discussing how you could totally figure him out if he was scum. Calling him "almost certainly" town doesn't sound like you're still reading him at all, it sounds like you've made your decision. You said that you are following meta, which just doesn't sit well with me. People can change their meta. And fact of the matter is that he has said some pingy things, and you just seem to be ignoring it "because meta."

As far as FB's "I don't think I can make judgement calls on anyone else at this point," I can 'forgive' him that because it's part of my personality not to be confident in games like this (whereas I know you're more confident in making decisions to vote someone). Sure, jumping on a leading wagon is scary when you're scum, but it's also scary when you're town. It's also scary to do when it's D1 and we've had basically 2 pages of discussion (if we discount mod posts and confirmations). It's also scary when you're like me and you don't really feel like your scumdar is that good. For me, saying something like that is null. Doesn't tell me whether you're scum or not at this stage of the game.

Madge is saying some weird pingy things as people have noticed throughout the day -- I would like to hear more from her, but it appears we're going to be light on content from her at least today. I'm not sure whether to call this conscious lurking or not at this point, I honestly can't recall other D1s with her before. (Out of game: Madge, just bc I don't want you to get offended, wanted to say I'm not calling you out as lying or anything. I do think it's possible Madge the player/character might be consciously using "the outside" as an excuse like... someone else I can't remember used as scum to excuse lurking in a game a little while back? but I don't doubt you really do have work crap getting in the way at the moment. [I just took the MBTI today so I'm weirdly attuned to personality stuff atm -- this has nothing to do with the game, as I said. Everyone can move along, lol.])

Now, one thing that worries me about wam in addition to some of his pingy stuff while defending himself is that he didn't attempt to defend by claiming a power, even when he thought he was likely to die. His last post before the deadline was extended, he said was posting a short one and would post a detailed post just before deadline. As far as he knew at that point, that short post was his last opportunity to defend himself. If he had a town power, I feel like he would have claimed something at that point, even if just a quick sentence in his short post, to see if town thought it was worth keeping him around. And before anyone says he might be VT, I quote from the signup thread: "Everyone is guaranteed to have a power role." Unless he wants to claim he has just the crappiest of crappy powers, I doubt town!wam doesn't at least bring it up. It seems to me something that scum!wam might misstep and forget to do as he is trying his best to make himself sound towny.

Vote: wam
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:05 pm UTC

That full player list in my read through post was more for my own use. I filled it out as I went, so when you read "Town. Almost certainly" beside wam, that means I was reading his posts, in detail, and solidified my town read on him with his later posts. I never have such a strong town read on someone that I ignore them, especially in wam's case where I still have to keep an eye out for his tell.
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Minestrone
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby Minestrone » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:06 pm UTC

SDK wrote:Minestrone, why is a vig killing jester-wam any better than lynching him? Do you only suspect wam based on his BigNose vote, or is there more?

Well jesters sometimes have bombs attached and having a vig do it might give town an extra kill since a vig might be hesitant to kill N1 otherwise. But that would be assuming wam was a jester which I'm actually not to sure about. The wording and timing of his BN vote just seemed so odd, jumping on so soon after me with pretty much just a "Yeah, what the other guy said" that made me think scummy or maybe jestery because of the weird way it drew attention. I'd rather lynch a jester than risk leaving scum alive, and I suppose you're right that there's not a huge difference between lynching them or vigging them, other than their win condition which doesn't matter to us. You're right that I can't really find fault with any of their later posts though so maybe I should take a wider view. I don't like doing an overview of every player so early because some people just don't stand out to me at all and there's no point in writing a big list if you're just going to put neutral at almost every point. I'm going to do a bit of reading and see who I find extra scummy or townie though.

ajh I would find scummy if it was anyone but ajh. They gave a vote on me with no explanation, right after they gave reads on other people but not me. They've done stuff like that before as town though so can't really judge based on that.

Freezeblade has pretty low content and I'm all for lynching the lurkier types D1 since active scumminess can be hard to read with so little to go on. I don't agree with their NU vote but I don't see anything particularly scummy about it. Still, overall I find them scummy.

Madge has had low content but she's apparently been busy and is hopefully going to be posting soon. I'll hold off a final judgement till I see the promised post, but I don't really like the content she does have so far, including things like saying the cop has to investigate SDK, or her reads in general.

moody I have a bad feeling about I guess but I don't have anything particular to criticize about their posts.

Unvote
I'm not super keen on meta reads because I pretty much have to take other people's word for it, but both SDK and New User seem to think that scum!wam wouldn't have done the BN vote, and nothing better than one post to criticize this late in the day is not a good lynch target. I think this is the part where I would vote FB if they weren't already at L-2.

Ninja'd twice: In response to Kalira's talk of power claims: I think the fact that no one is VT is exactly why wam didn't claim, and (most) other people shouldn't claim. If you have a power in this game, you're not special and valuable since everyone does, so unless it's an especially strong one people will just lynch you anyway. I guess if it's a common power you could be semi confirmed by not being counterclaimed, but there's still the whole drawback of scum knowing more about the setup the more claims there are.
In response to ajh: why didn't you say that in the first place then? Keeping quiet about your reads isn't something you can afford to do D1 when there's so little content anyway.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby moody7277 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:09 pm UTC

:? Vote by kalira just tied it between wam and fb, at least by my unofficial count. Since I am no longer convinced on wam enough to let it go to a coin flip (per the rules in the OP):

Unvote

In order to have some vote down at the end of the day, I'll put it on the other fluff poster.

Vote: Madge

Ninja'd by Minestrone's vote, but I'm still not interested in voting for wam anymore.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby SDK » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:17 pm UTC

Deadline's in a bit under 4 hours, just so everyone's aware.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby wam » Tue Apr 14, 2015 4:50 pm UTC

@moody what is your view on freezeblade?

@Kalira

I didn;t think claiming was worthwhile, given we all have powers and no idea what is out there, I think it would just help scum. I was contemplating it for my final post but it became unnecessary.

Can we get some votals please?
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby moody7277 » Tue Apr 14, 2015 5:12 pm UTC

wam wrote:@moody what is your view on freezeblade?


To me, people are voting him because of the fluffy posts made by fb. As of the reread I did of him for my "other than wam" post, I could see their point about it, but I also felt the same way and to a slightly greater degree about Madge (hence the vote). Most of the people currently voting for him I think of as town. I will not be surprised if fb flips town, though.
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Tigerlion wrote:Well, I imagine as the game progresses, various people will be getting moody.


BoomFrog wrote:I still have no idea what town moody really looks like.

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Diemo
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Monday 8PM GMT

Postby Diemo » Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:05 pm UTC

Votals:
Madge (2) - ajh, moody
wam (2) - Lawrencelot, kalira
Freezeblade (4) - wam, New User, Bignose, SDK

Deadline is in one hour.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby ajh » Tue Apr 14, 2015 6:37 pm UTC

Minestrone wrote:Freezeblade has pretty low content and I'm all for lynching the lurkier types D1 since active scumminess can be hard to read with so little to go on. I don't agree with their NU vote but I don't see anything particularly scummy about it. Still, overall I find them scummy.
Huh? freezeblade's been rather active, just not content-wise. What do you mean with the 'active scumminess' part?
I don't think wam drew attention to himself as much as you say. Later you decide to listen to SDK's and New User's meta reads on him anyway. I think you're holding off on a vote despite there having been enough material.
moody, your last two posts make you look bad. You hinted at those reads earlier, though overall it feels your just going with the flow.

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Re: Discworld Mafia: Day One: Deadline Tuesday 8PM GMT

Postby Diemo » Tue Apr 14, 2015 7:02 pm UTC

Deadline!

freezeblade has been lynched.

Please get all actions in within 48 hours. Actions which are not in in 48 hours will not be used. Compulsory actions will be used randomly.
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Night One: Deadline Thursday 8PM GMT

Postby Diemo » Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:42 pm UTC

As all actions are in, I am going to adjudicate this half an hour early. My other choice was to wait until tomorrow, Thursdays are bad for me.

Lawrencelot is dead. Lawrencelot was the town jailer, Doughnut Jimmy. His concoctions always took you out, it was like he was giving you horse medicine!

Bignose is dead. Or is he? Bignose was the town watcher. Bignose was the Great A'Tiun, a turtle of unknown sex. He loses his vote and powers but can still contribute - it's silly to think that you can kill the Great A'Tuin!

freezeblade was Brother Doorkeeper - a member of the Elucidated Brethren of the Ebon Night. He was the mafia protection cop/roleblocker, and was invisible. Long shall his door be remembered.

Results are currently being sent. Deadline is next Friday at 4PM GMT.
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This has made a lot of people very angry and been widely regarded as a bad move.
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New User
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Re: Discworld Mafia: Night One: Deadline Thursday 8PM GMT

Postby New User » Thu Apr 16, 2015 6:52 pm UTC

Well, nice voting. I think we have either a serial killer or a PGO. Maybe a misfired vigilante. Since it was wam who started the wagon on freezeblade, and SDK who asked for the extension, I consider them both town, for now at least.


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