Draculafia! N3 - Nosferatu - GAME OVER - LIVING VICTORY

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Wed Nov 04, 2015 6:57 am UTC

Wonderful flavour, as always, DJ! My goodness!

Good morning, all. I must admit I'm surprised to be alive. In a move that undoubtedly surprised nobody, I protected freezeblade, which was obvious but wine (... or beer? I dunno) means that sometimes you should do the obvious thing.

Anyway, hopefully someone has something else useful. It looks to me that Dracula's faction couldn't have killed him, unless it was part of the recruit mechanic (I think Yakuza is a role that recruits and in doing so kills themselves?), and we might have a vig, with the scum kill blocked - but not necessarily by me, perhaps a roleblocker, who knows.

In any event: looks like we did alright, this time. Let's lock and load, see what we've found out overnight.

And let's quietly whimper that there's probably something terrible waiting for us, with Dracula and the SK both dead so soon.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Wed Nov 04, 2015 9:11 am UTC

Yeah, go town! Also, with that flavour, I am so glad that I chose this game as my first!

I must admit that I had started to doubt ConMan as being scum as the night wore on, but looks like I was right after all with my suspicions, if not quite the way I'd thought.

I'm not going to full claim now, for reasons beyond the anti-mass claim one posted yesterday, but I will claim the scalp of the Lord of the Undead, SDK. Part of my role includes a sort of flavour cop/vig mash up. Each night, I can target one person. If they are Dracula, I kill them.

I admit I got lucky with my target. With ConMan dead and freezeblade probably who he said he is, I had no idea who might be scum. SDK's townie list pinged me a little bit still, for reasons that included moody's thoughts on the list, but mostly because it seems to me that SDK is a very good mafia player, and I wanted to rule him out from being our enemy in chief.

I'll post some thoughts based on yesterday's voting etc later on, when I'm on my lunch break.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Wed Nov 04, 2015 12:02 pm UTC

So, we have to totally discount SDK's town list, as it is so seeped in wine as to be meaningless.

I may have a pertinent piece of information, but that depends a little on what is claimed by others. I will be watching the responses carefully.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Wed Nov 04, 2015 1:28 pm UTC

Quick lunch break post:

Not sure that we can get too much from who votes who, given the ConMan was independent (but scum aligned). I'd guess we might be able to see scum jumping on a believed townie. I haven't got time for a full analysis, but some brief points stand out from a skim of the previous page:

bessie, moody7277, Vytron and I all voted for ConMan. Dimochka said he was leaning ConMan, but didn't actually place a vote (possibly trying to avoid looking bad about being on a townie wagon?). Madge unvoted bessie after voting to give other people options, didn't seem too bothered by the ConMan vote, as otherwise I imagine she'd have kept her vote on. mpolo's vote seemed a toss up between dimochka and ConMan, so I imagine he wasn't too opposed to ConMan's lynch in the end (care to confirm/deny mpolo?). Misnomer also identified ConMan as flying below the radar, and voted for mpolo because he already had votes on him. Didn't change their vote though once ConMan started picking up votes.

And that's all the time for analysis I've got, so can't really think about anyone else. More later today hopefully.

Vytron, you said you'd have some suspicions regarding Madge based on ConMan's flip. What do you feel now that ConMan flipped as an SK?
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby SDK » Wed Nov 04, 2015 2:05 pm UTC

Bah ah ah ah...
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby bessie » Wed Nov 04, 2015 4:35 pm UTC

I don’t have any results to claim from last night. I won’t have time for a longer post until tonight.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby freezeblade » Wed Nov 04, 2015 5:31 pm UTC

I didn't see that coming. More reasons not to trust SDK, I wasn't getting scum vibes from him, he's so bloody hard to ready on D1.

I'll trust jimbob's claim, unless there's someone else to counterclaim the kill target. What is your rolename though?
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Wed Nov 04, 2015 7:27 pm UTC

So Madge protected freezeblade, and Madge and freezeblade were the most likely targets of any Mafia action last night. If scum had a kill, I would guess that Madge foiled that. As she described her power, it probably would have prevented a culting as well, I think. So, we can most likely trust freezeblade, but if there is recruitment going on, Madge could have been zapped. (I guess if she was converted, my argument for freezeblade fails, too, as she could have used wine in that case. My hope would be that she was afraid of possible observers to make a blatant lie here.)
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Misnomer » Wed Nov 04, 2015 7:37 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Yeah, go town!


Vote: jimbob

'Yay, go town!' is right up there with "well done doctor!" as a classic scumtell. (I'm going to have patchy internet between now and Sunday, hence why it's a vote rather than a FoS).

In terms of Dracula's death, it strikes me that there are four possibilities why the game might still be going on:
1) The Undead faction began the game with more than one member, hence the surviving faction members are still around.
2) SDK was the sole Undead member, but had a recruit power which was processed before the kill (possibly even a day recruit?). Madge's Yakuza theory could also fit in here.
3) Both of the above.
4) The Undead have been eliminated, but there are other anti-town roles out there.

Mods: will we be informed when a faction is eliminated?
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Djehutynakht » Wed Nov 04, 2015 7:53 pm UTC

The game at-large will only be informed when a faction achieves its win-condition.

I guess we can tell you that ConMan's Serial Killer faction has been eliminated.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Wed Nov 04, 2015 10:45 pm UTC

Misnomer wrote:'Yay, go town!' is right up there with "well done doctor!" as a classic scumtell. (I'm going to have patchy internet between now and Sunday, hence why it's a vote rather than a FoS).

More a case of celebrating some success, but anyhow. I'm not sure there's really anything to respond to there.

From misnomer's points, I think we can probably discount number 4, though not necessarily. I'd have thought it unlikely to have had three anti-town factions (Undead, SK, and whatever the third one is) in a small game, but I guess anything's possible.

In response to freezeblade's request for my role name, I have very good reasons not to reveal it. You'll note my anti-mass-claim statement from earlier. It's possible that my concerns are no longer relevant, but I'd prefer to be on the safe side for now.

On the topic of freezeblade, I realised that he was the only living player who didn't express at least contentment with ConMan's lynch. Instead he followed SDK's vote on bessie, because he agreed with him. I'm not sure that necessarily means much. He can't have been avoiding lynching a scum mate since ConMan was the SK, not mainstream scum. However, SDK's reasons for voting bessie (according to his published list - may of course been completely fabricated) were mostly because of the way she targeted Madge and freezeblade. Freezeblade's vote could therefore be seen as a little OMGUS (did I use that right?). He also had a gut feeling that SDK was town (mind you so did most people, I think, including to some extent myself, so I can't really complain too much). All that being said, he hasn't been counterclaimed, so unless he was day recruited, I can't believe that these points were anything other than genuine beliefs, and therefore I put him at town (admittedly town who keep making me think they're scum, but still town).

Reviewing other people's interactions with SDK to see if there are any obvious possible scum buddies:

After a bit of joke voting involving him, and my discussion with SDK following his vote and townie list, moody is the first one to really address him, but only in response to his list. Madge says "SDK being SDK". Misnomer questions SDK on his list, and follows up. Mpolo says he'd protect SDK, if he could (just as well he couldn't!). Moody takes his being called inscrutable by SDK as a compliment. Madge responds to a follow-up question from SDK. Moody in his reads list posts nothing much other than SDK seemed suspicious of Madge. In that post SDK is one of only two people he didn't post a town/scum/neutral opinion on (the other being dimochka with a "not enough data" statement - no such statement for SDK). Madge accuses SDK of being erratic. Following SDK's vote on her, Bessie asks SDK to justify the vote. Misnomer identifies a lack of content for activity from SDK. Bessie accepts SDK having a reason for his vote, but appears somewhat suspicious. Bessie later says she's not happy with SDK's mass-claim suggestion.

From that list, if I had to pick one or more scum buddies, I'd probably go with mpolo and moody. Madge, misnomer and bessie all seem to have suspicions of him, to varying levels of degree. It would seem quite early to bus him. It's also interesting that there doesn't seem to have been any interaction between Vytron or dimochka and SDK, which could be a minor scum tell (from past experience IRL, scum buddies often seem to either bus their team mates or largely ignore them). All that being said, if SDK had no team mates during Day 1 this could all be completely moot.

I'll try and follow up more with this over the next couple of days, but for now I'm going to weakly

Vote: moody7277

for his possible scum slip in his reads list. I'll reread him more thoroughly and review this vote later.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby dimochka » Thu Nov 05, 2015 2:11 am UTC

Misnomer wrote:
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Yeah, go town!


Vote: jimbob

THIS. It stuck out to me as well. I've seen scum get caught more often than not when trying to appear townie this way. But this is very wine-y for now so I will do a more in-depth analysis later. But IGMEOY.

A few things to note
1. I simply missed the deadline yesterday. I would have taken just the same credit as anyone else had that lynch been wrong.
2. I don't have any results from the night
3. I'm reevaluating my list currently, and I don't think that bessie and moody are at the top of it anymore. They seemed to be more guilty specifically in relation to ConMan, who of course turned out to be solo
4. Dracula is dead but we may still have (a) another 1-2 people on his team and/or (b) someone culted overnight. So I don't think that Madge and Freezeblade are necessarily safe today. Madge would have actually been a great recruit target.
5. FWIW I don't expect mpolo's piece of information to affect me at all. I don't even know why I'm mentioning this but whatever.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby moody7277 » Thu Nov 05, 2015 3:28 am UTC

So, we lynched the SK, and the head scum got vigged, allegedly by jimbob. The fact the game continues does seem to speak to the recruitment idea we were speculating about yesterday. Which means I could develop a reads list based on D1 and use it to guess who was the likely recruit, which is about the most use I could probably get out of it. For what it's worth:


Vytron: was 4th vote on ConMan. nothing yet D2. have him somewhat townie

Bessie: developed a fairly solid townie read on her while deciding which if the three to choose

Dimochka: believes Madge's claim, would have voted ConMan, D2 also suspicious of jimbob for his comment

Madge: I already had her at the top of my scum list, and then she pulled vote shenanigans twice. ultra-scum

mpolo: had him as leaning townie end of D1, suggest we ignore SDK's wine from early D1 (which I agree with), Madge likely protected fb from recruit as well as death. still leaning townie

Freezeblade: originally one of my two suspects, I've regressed his status to neutral because of the uncountered claim of his.

jimbobmacdoodle: alleged Dracula slayer. was already thinking of him as townie, so nothing changes there

Misnomer: Had a really detailed breakdown on one post of mpolo's that pinged him, was voting Madge until her Van Helsing claim, was voting mpolo at D1 end, voting jimbob D2 for being jubilant over the flips. leaning townie

Therefore, based of that list, bessie as most townie looking would make the best recruit choice.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:17 am UTC

Haha! This is awesome!

Vote: jimbobmacdoodle

No, I'm Quincey Morris, a vigilante, and I killed Dracula.

I'm claiming because I don't think I'll use my kill unless I have some serious suspicion. Town should be ahead if the game is balanced, because Dracula and the Serial Killer dying N1 should be very rare, so we ought to be in some "way to victory" scenario, unless the game's super-balanced.

But even in a super-balanced game, I'm an asset to scum, because they can count on me killing some townie every night. Luckily, my powers are not compulsive, so I can manage both to avoid night kills and to avoid killing town players. And, if I do die at night, I'll do it instead of a more powerful powerrole.

And, if I'm lynched, who cares? I KILLED GODDAMN DRACULA :D

In any case...

This is a weak vote, jim's claim took me greatly by surprise, this got out of nowhere and seems way too specific to be fabricated, so it's very possible that we actually targeted Dracula twice :-/

It makes sense to have a power that wants to target the title namer.

Vytron, you said you'd have some suspicions regarding Madge based on ConMan's flip. What do you feel now that ConMan flipped as an SK?


It doesn't matter that ConMan was SK, what matters is he wasn't scum, so any kind of logic that would be valid for him being town, would hold for him being SK.

So here's the post I made that explains why I killed SDK, as a matter of elimination:

"Bessie - I defended her in thread, I really believe she's town...
Dimochka - Nothing has jumped out, and on meta, he's someone that doesn't deserve to die as town...
Madge - Her could get "cleared" (from suspicion) if ConMan was town
mpolo - There was voting of ConMan and mpolo involved, so more information will be gained with ConMan's flip
Freezeblade - Claimed power-role
moody7277 - More info will be gained if Madge is "cleared"
Misnomer - ConMan's flip will give more info about mpolo which will give more info about Mis "

It was between SDK and jim, but SDK's attack on bessie for no reason convinced me to attack him.

So let's see... Bessie is still townish, Dimochka is still Dimochka (basically, we have to eventually lynch him in case he's playing with us, otherwise he'll help us lynch scum), Madge is "cleared" from suspicion...

So we have left:

mpolo
Misnomer

Um, nobody knew ConMan was the SK, so information would only have been gained if ConMan was scum that mpolo/Misnomer could be buddying...

moody7277

Hmmm, looks like, if Madge wasn't "cleared", then moody7277 could have voted ConMan just to save scumbuddy!Madge. But with Madge "cleared" this doesn't tell us anything about moody7277.

And that's the reason I couldn't kill all these people. But this chain of thought is kind of useless...

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:20 am UTC

Rats, missed my "once-in-a-lifetime" opportunity to make use badass sentence :( :

This is a weak vote, jim's claim took me greatly by surprise, this got out of nowhere and seems way too specific to be fabricated, so it's very possible that we actually killed Dracula twice :-/

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:11 am UTC

I'm not sure why you decided to kill in the first place though, Vytron? Why not withhold?

Lots to think about. Hmm.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:20 am UTC

Because withholding is like being a vanilla townie.

Which is fine if I basically already did my job.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby bessie » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:21 am UTC

I already went over all my D1 reads, and they are unchanged with what I have seen so far today. Starting at the top of page 5, this is what stands out to me.
Madge wrote:Good morning, all. I must admit I'm surprised to be alive. In a move that undoubtedly surprised nobody, I protected freezeblade, which was obvious but wine (... or beer? I dunno) means that sometimes you should do the obvious thing.

Or recruited freezeblade. Madge, why do you think you weren’t targeted last night?

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I'm not going to full claim now, for reasons beyond the anti-mass claim one posted yesterday, but I will claim the scalp of the Lord of the Undead, SDK. Part of my role includes a sort of flavour cop/vig mash up. Each night, I can target one person. If they are Dracula, I kill them.

This seems like a very powerful role, and it’s only a partial list of your powers?
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I admit I got lucky with my target. With ConMan dead and freezeblade probably who he said he is, I had no idea who might be scum.

Wow, I just reread your D1 posts, and you don’t. You haven’t taken a stand on anyone other than ConMan. You voted SirGabriel for lurking, and removed your vote quickly when he was replaced. You voted freezeblade for lurking, but stated that you would be willing to drop the vote. You don’t seem to have more than pings on anyone else. And you even voted ConMan with a caveat.
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I'm far from certain that ConMan is scum. I'd be willing to move my vote, if I find his responses good.

OK, I read further down the page and you’re “weakly” voting for moody. jimbobmacdoodle, please make an ordered list of players, ranked in order from scummiest to towniest. No groupings.

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Not sure that we can get too much from who votes who, given the ConMan was independent (but scum aligned). I'd guess we might be able to see scum jumping on a believed townie.

I disagree. If ConMan was scummy, it is to scum’s benefit to keep him alive. And ConMan wasn’t the only player with votes. We should make note of all the votes, not just those on ConMan.
jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Madge unvoted bessie after voting to give other people options, didn't seem too bothered by the ConMan vote, as otherwise I imagine she'd have kept her vote on.

I don’t agree with this either. She seemed pretty annoyed that ConMan was being lynched. See my previous comment.

Djehutynakht wrote:The game at-large will only be informed when a faction achieves its win-condition.

So either there is at least one more member of Dracula’s faction, or he is an independent that can still achieve his win condition. For my own sanity, I think it is more likely he has a teammate.

moody7277 wrote:Therefore, based of that list, bessie as most townie looking would make the best recruit choice.

I don’t even know how to respond to this. I guess I will take it as a compliment? moody, if Madge is ultra scum, why aren’t you voting for her?

Ninja’d by Vytron while I was typing this post.

Vytron, I don’t understand your last post. Are you a vigilante with multiple kills?

More later after I think about Vytron’s post for a little.

Ninja'd by Madge. Madge, why do you think Vytron should have withheld his kill?

Ninja'd by Vytron. Madge, answer my question.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:34 am UTC

bessie wrote:I already went over all my D1 reads, and they are unchanged with what I have seen so far today. Starting at the top of page 5, this is what stands out to me.
Madge wrote:Good morning, all. I must admit I'm surprised to be alive. In a move that undoubtedly surprised nobody, I protected freezeblade, which was obvious but wine (... or beer? I dunno) means that sometimes you should do the obvious thing.

Or recruited freezeblade. Madge, why do you think you weren’t targeted last night?


You know, I've been thinking about that. I fully expected to die. I think there's a possibility I was jailed and protected from the kill that way; there's the possibility a scum kill was roleblocked; there's a possibility that the vig/cop kill was processed before Dracula's group's kill, and Dracula was selected to perform the kill, so didn't get the opportunity to do it. There's the possibility there's no jailer but scum thought there might be so they targeted someone less obvious. There's also the thought that scum kept me alive because me being alive would be suspicious (wine). They might have also decided to let me keep living because I'm not that great at scumhunting, and as long as no cop claims the game isn't broken by having a doctor. Really though I have no idea, your guess is as good as mine. Maybe scum forgot to submit a kill during the night phase; stuff like that has happened before, too.

bessie wrote:
The game at-large will only be informed when a faction achieves its win-condition.


So either there is at least one more member of Dracula’s faction, or he is an independent that can still achieve his win condition. For my own sanity, I think it is more likely he has a teammate.


I think you're misinterpreting the quote; if Dracula was independent, we won't be informed he's failed to achieve his win condition. We'll just be told when someone achieves their win condition. For town and scum, that only happens at the end of the game. (Jesters are the only ones I can think of who can achieve their win without the game ending, though I'm sure DJ could invent another independent that has a similar property.)

bessie wrote:Ninja'd by Madge. Madge, why do you think Vytron should have withheld his kill?


Because of my aforementioned self-consciousness of my ability vis-a-vis scumhunting, being a vig is my nightmare. I would be too scared to launch of a kill because I'd be terrified of being wrong and hitting a cop or something. So I project that self-consciousness on others. I've also heard that some people recommend a vig doesn't kill until a few days in so they can have some more evidence to work with. So just wanted to know why he decided to act rather than not act. (Now I'm thinking of Hamlet; yes that's right I don't just think in Survivor analogies). I mean Vytron had solid logic (it seems) in choosing his target and I think that I might use that sort of logic in choosing a vig target should I ever roll that role.

Also do we have any reason to suspect a recruit apart from flavour? (and I think that's a BIG reason to suspect a recruit. I mean, VAMPIRES.)
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:44 am UTC

bessie wrote:Vytron, I don’t understand your last post. Are you a vigilante with multiple kills?


Yes.

At this point of the game it's not advantageous, though.

Madge wrote:I mean Vytron had solid logic (it seems) in choosing his target and I think that I might use that sort of logic in choosing a vig target should I ever roll that role.


Thanks.

I believe "I can't kill this because X, and can't kill that because Y" is the best thing a Vig can do. Specifically, if Dim, jim and SDK weren't in the game I'd have withheld the kill, because I'd have had a reason to NOT kill for each player.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Thu Nov 05, 2015 7:16 am UTC

Concerning the double vigilante claim, it seems to me unlikely that there would be a possible four kills on N1 in a game of this size, which we would have to assume is the case, if everyone is telling the truth. I think that having one vig is near necessary if there is a recruiting mechanic, particularly if the Undead faction started at two people.

Morris is the character I would have thought of for a vigilante action. If Dracula had been found with a Bowie knife in the heart, it would have been even more obviously Morris. Which has me doubting jimbobmacadoodle's claim a bit; however, as Vytron stated, it would have been extremely bold (indeed reckless) play to claim this, so maybe there were four potential kills in the game. Of course, Vytron could be lying as well, just with better flavor cover for her claim, hoping to squeak through.

On the whole, I guess I'm undecided. I am worried that if there was a recruit, it was likely Madge (obvious target who was very likely not being doctored).
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Thu Nov 05, 2015 7:19 am UTC

EBWOP: I only rapidly skimmed the last exchange, so need to go back to it.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Thu Nov 05, 2015 9:07 am UTC

I will try to post an ordered list by the latest Saturday. I probably won't have time to do a full read through to help crystallise my thoughts on everybody until then.

FOS: Vytron

Vytron, I have doubts about your claim for reasons I'll explain after your response to this request: could you please tell me if/how DJ gave you the result of your kill.

Based on Vytron's multi-vig claim, I'm not sure about my role being all that powerful. In particular there are some negative sides to my role as well (not the night action, just inherently).

I could well believe Vytron is lying: I think I've seen town!Vytron lie about night action results in order to get someone they suspect lynched. Recruitedscum!Vytron could make the claim safely knowing that nobody can validly counter-claim his character name. Jester!Vytron could be trying to set himself up for a lynch today, or if I'm lynched, tomorrow after my flip.

In response to Bessie's point about me not taking strong stances, this is who I am. I'm not a fan of expressing myself absolutely about anything. However, as noted above I'll happily try and spend some time devising that list.

Mpolo, do you have anything more to say yet about your piece of information?

No comments on my reason to vote for you moody?

If there's anything else people want me to respond to, apologies for missing it. This post was entirely written on my phone on my way to work. If I get a chance, I'll try and respond later today.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Thu Nov 05, 2015 9:52 am UTC

I guess I might as well give my information up. I have a watch action (breadcrumbed pretty blatantly, because I was always planning on giving the info eventually).

Moody visited Madge last night.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:01 am UTC

Well, nothing happened to me. I'd be interested in a claim from moody though, and if nothing comes of it, we'll lynch him to test him.

I'm suspecting he's possibly some sort of jailer, or maybe a scum roleblocker or even maybe a cop of some sort who didn't trust me.

More scary is the thought that he's some sort of "zombie" and I will turn into scum after like two days, or something like that. Because of that risk, maybe Vytron should shoot him tonight, and then if he flips recruiter we can lynch me before I change into a bad guy so I can still win with town.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Thu Nov 05, 2015 10:03 am UTC

EBWOP

ah if i happen to be right and he is a two day recruiter, then i'll be scum tomorrow morning (i assume), at which point lynching me is good for town but bad for me. great. now i'm really scared.

moody you better have a good explanation!!!!
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby moody7277 » Thu Nov 05, 2015 1:32 pm UTC

bessie wrote:moody, if Madge is ultra scum, why aren’t you voting for her?


a. At this point it would be a futile gesture since most other people are convinced that she's who she says she is.

b. With Dracula and the SK dead, we're most likely looking for a recruit, and since I jailed Madge N1 I am sure she wasn't recruited. I was going to be a little more subtle when talking about that, but with mpolo having seen me do that, I have no reason to.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Thu Nov 05, 2015 1:45 pm UTC

Jailer makes sense. It works if I'm scum or if i'm town; town Madge is protected from the kill, scum Madge is not able to use a kill or whatever scummy things she'd be doing.

I was town Madge, for whatever that's worth, but thankyou for jailing me. Not that it makes a difference, since if you jail me I can't protect. But we can get beer out of it, I suppose, whether you'll jail me or someone else, who I'll protect, scum won't have any idea who to target.

I will be using random.org in some fashion when choosing my targets, so scum, rest assured that there will be some MYSTERY awaiting you.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby mpolo » Thu Nov 05, 2015 2:27 pm UTC

This does mean that freezeblade was not protected last night. The lack of a scum kill last night is a little worrying…

Weird idea: what if Madge started as a vampire (but also Van Helsing). That would serve as an anti-claim mechanism… On the other hand, I really don't want to sacrifice a doctor to try out that wild a theory.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:32 pm UTC

Unvote

Okay, so Jim has convinced me... Note, I wouldn't be as convinced if I claimed first, but there you go...

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Vytron, I have doubts about your claim for reasons I'll explain after your response to this request: could you please tell me if/how DJ gave you the result of your kill.


With awesome flavor, and a line in bold at the end that contained a verb that starts with p and doesn't really have a synonym.

I'm not sure how fine is it to speak about this to "prove" something, but that you're asking the question basically means you know how things are handled, so you could easily catch me lying.

In any case, a secondary option is to hold two lynches daily, the normal one and another underlined one that I kill at night. Probably once since maybe that gets me killed fast...

If there was a recruit then I have no idea about how to go about it, other than Dim and Mis seem like optimal recruit targets.

Otherwise, Madge was the optimal kill target, so it makes sense that she's alive because she was jailed.

As a matter of elimination I think we should lynch Dim, Mis or Bes.

Vyt out.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Thu Nov 05, 2015 4:36 pm UTC

Oh, also, I'm against Random.org on principle, because surely you can do better than random, and if you don't use Random, you're most likely guaranteed to succeed against someone using random (the crossover baseball game proved this, with me kicking the ass of a random.org using player) so I just hope Madge just said this to mess with scum.

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby bessie » Thu Nov 05, 2015 5:10 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:In response to Bessie's point about me not taking strong stances, this is who I am. I'm not a fan of expressing myself absolutely about anything. However, as noted above I'll happily try and spend some time devising that list.

And this is why you’re slipping on my scum scale. You’ve made a lot of contributions and given opinions on almost everyone, but unless you are going to take some stands on your opinions, you are setting yourself up to easily filp when convenient, and that is scummy. Actually, I would almost think that you are independent because of this, but you have been drawing too much attention to yourself. The reason I like ordered lists is because it forces you to make a judgment on everyone, even if it is only in relation to everyone else. I suggest you make your list sooner rather than later. You can always reread and change your mind. I will almost certainly change my mind, probably when I have time for a reread tonight. I already shifted this list around when I was typing it.

Town
bessie
mpolo
moody7277
Vytron
dimochka
jimbobmacdoodle
Misnomer
freezeblade
Madge
scum

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Thu Nov 05, 2015 6:06 pm UTC

Ok, let's see how much I can do on my phone on the way home from work.

In response to Vytron, that was actually more detailed than I expected. I was looking for a reference to flavour text. Nothing specific, just that it was present, since I had a pretty decent chunk of it. I'm happy to drop my FOS for now. Looks likely that it was a double kill on Dracula.

On the random.org point, I'm assuming that Madge means that she would select a likely list of targets and select randomly from there (assuming of course she isn't lying).

In regards to moody's claim, I can think of two reasonable possibilities: a) it's the truth and Madge is probably ok, or b) he's lying, is a scum recruiter and recruited Madge, or c) he's a scum role blocker. If there's a counter claim from anyone, I'd know which of the two I'd trust. Does it seem likely to anyone that two protection powers is a bit much in a small game? Maybe not with the potential of four kills a night, I guess.

Moody, I don't think I've seen a response to my question regarding a missing verdict on SDK in your reads list. Please could you answer.

As Bessie thinks it best to do this sooner rather than later and prior to making a full review sometime in the next couple of days, here's a quick town to scum list, based on gut impressions and recent claims:

Town
Jimbob
Bessie
Mpolo
Vytron
Dimochka
Madge
Misnomer
Freezeblade
Moody
Scum
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby jimbobmacdoodle » Thu Nov 05, 2015 6:24 pm UTC

EBWOP: not sure why I posted freezeblade as so scummy, move him to between Vytron and Dimochka. I think it was a left over from my Day 1 feelings.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby moody7277 » Thu Nov 05, 2015 6:24 pm UTC

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:Moody, I don't think I've seen a response to my question regarding a missing verdict on SDK in your reads list. Please could you answer.


SDK has always been most difficult for me to read. I usually need a few days worth of interactions to get an inkling of where he stands, and even then I hedge a bit.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby freezeblade » Thu Nov 05, 2015 7:57 pm UTC

As a balance standpoint goes, in my opinion, it makes for more sense for us to have a town vig, and an anti-town, non-mafia night kill. We don't have many characters to claim, and as nobody has contested Vytron's, I'm pretty sure of his townieness. That said, it also makes loads of sense as to why jimbob isn't claiming a character name, because I bet it's a very anti-town sounding character, and his claiming it would cause us to lynch him.

That makes me pretty confident that jimbob is indie or scum of some shade.

vote: jimbobmacdoodle
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby dimochka » Thu Nov 05, 2015 9:50 pm UTC

Wow, somehow I have a reputation to uphold, at least according to Vytron!

Anyways, I would agree that jimbob looks most suspicious and is most likely to be an indie. Below is my list:

Town
Vytron
Madge
Bessie
Moody
Mpolo
Misnomer
Freezeblade
Jimbob
Scum

Thoughts on bottom people: Jimbob for reasons already mentioned by others. Freezeblade because he's a likely recruit target. Misnomer because I don't have a read on him right now and he seems to be skating under the radar. I would have probably been a decent recruit target as well to be perfectly honest (in which case I'd suspect Mpolo to have recruited me).

Bessie's thoughts seemed to be most coherent in my mind.

Jimbob - it may help if you claim your role.
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Vytron » Fri Nov 06, 2015 12:58 am UTC

FoS: Bessie

bessie wrote:Town
bessie
mpolo
moody7277
Vytron
dimochka
jimbobmacdoodle
Misnomer
freezeblade
Madge
scum


This list makes no sense whatsoever to me.

Bessie, do you suspect Madge and FB of false-claiming or something?

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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby Madge » Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:10 am UTC

Yeah I thought Bessie's list was really weird. Does she really, really think that we were likely recruited?

It's made me very suspicious of her, along with some other stuff she's said that's rubbed me the wrong way.

I have a crazy weekend coming up, and they're only going to get crazier. (Fair warning: I'm getting married on the 21st of November. If I'm still alive around then I will probably be taking a 3 or 4 day hiatus, but should be able to cope if you don't mind low-effort phone postings.)

I will do a quick and unscientific ordering:

Towny
freezeblade
mpolo
jimbobmacdoodle
Vytron

Neutral
moody7277

Scummy
Misnomer
dimochka
bessie

The above lists are ordered, I just wanted to stratify them a bit since my opinion on moody is mixed. He's got a very real, very scary chance of being some sort of delayed recruit power since I have no way of knowing if my protect action went through last night (heck he could even just be a scum roleblocker, with SK dead he can look exactly like a jailer).

Vote: Bessie
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Re: Draculafia! D2 - The Undead Dead

Postby dimochka » Fri Nov 06, 2015 1:58 am UTC

I really don't see the argument behind the Bessie votes. Can someone please elaborate? Because frankly I disagree.
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