Alternating 9P Mafia - Game over - Town wins!

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Sabrar
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Sabrar » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:16 pm UTC

@Mathilda: I think you're just reading her list wrong. Townies are at the top (lead by ajh as confirmed Doctor) and Suzaku is at the bottom where the most scummy people are.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Mathilda » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:39 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:@Mathilda: I think you're just reading her list wrong. Townies are at the top (lead by ajh as confirmed Doctor) and Suzaku is at the bottom where the most scummy people are.



Ah I see your point:

As in most town at the top and most scum at the bottom. I was thinking it was

Town:
<names>
Scum:
<no names currently listed>

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Mathilda » Wed Jan 27, 2016 12:58 pm UTC

Esthr wrote:Everyone has posted since ajh's claim and no one has counter-claimed, so
Unvote: ajh

I honestly thought there would be a counter-claim, which is why I voted, but at this point I agree ajh is pretty much confirmed doctor.


Why did you expect there to be a counter-claim?

Normally it's best to assume that a PR claim is genuine until counter claimed. Sabrar has already gone into great detail as to why we should believe that afh is the real doctor.

Secondly why vote while there isn't a counter claim? If a counter claim arises then you can look at both claims and vote on the least believable one.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Suzaku » Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:10 pm UTC

Yeah, we don't have a lot of D2 material to go on; less than a full page of posts, and nothing from our one confirmed town.

Esthr was starting to go back up in my view with her posts directly after mine at the beginning of the day, especially this one, but the trend hasn't continued.

At this point, I'm happy with an Esthr lynch, so
Vote: Esthr

I'm also still happy with my town reads on Sabrar and Mathilda.

Between Carlington and Minestrone, who were in equal second place in my scum reads previously, I would now prefer to lynch Minestrone and keep Carlington alive.
Partly this is on post volume (which is a very bad reason, but a difficult bias to overcome), but mostly it is the not very good defence of Esthr. It feels to me like an attempt to sway people off the Esthr lynch if he can, but still allow him to say 'Well, I wasn't that strongly against it', if we do lynch Esthr and she comes up scum, as I expect.
@Minestrone - Can you give any specific reason you think that Esthr's behaviour is more newbie than scummy?

I will be on my way to work at deadline tomorrow, so I'll be following along on my phone and able to post/respond to queries/change my vote if necessary.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Sabrar » Wed Jan 27, 2016 1:52 pm UTC

I won't put Esthr at L-1 as I don't want anyone to be able to quickly hammer. Generally we want to be able to use the available time to the full as that gives us the most information, of course forum games are a bit different in this regard.
Nevertheless, currently I'm okay with her being lynched next and will vote in accordance closer to the deadline (unless some weird stuff happens).

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Esthr » Wed Jan 27, 2016 2:35 pm UTC

Mathilda wrote:Why did you expect there to be a counter-claim?

Normally it's best to assume that a PR claim is genuine until counter claimed. Sabrar has already gone into great detail as to why we should believe that afh is the real doctor.

Secondly why vote while there isn't a counter claim? If a counter claim arises then you can look at both claims and vote on the least believable one.

At the end of D1, I was pretty sure ajh was false-claiming. At the beginning of D2, I was convinced he was false-claiming. He was about to be lynched, but because of his casual claim, he was saved and we mislynched emlightened. I stated early on D1 that I was skeptical of claims as a lynch defense. Sabrar posted his ajh reasoning after my vote, so I'm not sure why that's relevant.

Sabrar wrote:Esthr: her defense of her actions hits the right notes to make me want to believe her. The FoS on Suzaku however is OMGUS at its fullest as it only focuses on a single aspect of his posts. I'm quite certain that Esthr vs Suzaku is not the case of town vs town and currently Suzaku looks way more townier to me so I still think she's scum.

In an ideal world, someone else would have called him out. Unfortunately there was very little other content to go on, with everyone busy talking about why ajh is the real doctor.
Sabrar wrote:Should Esthr somehow turn up to be Town [Suzaku] would jump to the front of my scum-list, otherwise I still read him as strong townie.

That might be as much as I can hope for.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Sabrar » Wed Jan 27, 2016 7:42 pm UTC

Nobody seems to have more to say, so to prevent accidental ties:

Vote: Esthr

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Esthr » Wed Jan 27, 2016 8:39 pm UTC

For what it's worth, I'll
Vote: Suzaku
and
FoS: Minestrone

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby ConMan » Wed Jan 27, 2016 10:06 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:@ConMan: could we have a mod-prod on ajh please?


A prod has been sent.

Current votes:

Esthr - 3 - Sabrar, Carlington, Suzaku
Suzaku - 1 - Esthr
Carlington - 1 - Minestrone

7 players remain, 4 to lynch. Deadline in approximately 1.5 hours.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D2 - Milla Vanilla

Postby Suzaku » Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:07 pm UTC

Half an hour to go; I'm happy with the votes as they are.

Now, in case I'm (we're) wrong about Esthr:
If Esthr is town, tomorrow will be 5-player LYLO. That means that either a mislynch or a no lynch will end the game with a loss.
It also means that one townie voting for another can cause the loss, as the two scum can pile on the vote to speed lynch and win.

For this reason, townies should not vote early in the day tomorrow, but should be very careful (and very certain) before risking a vote.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - N2 - Esthr Protester

Postby ConMan » Wed Jan 27, 2016 11:39 pm UTC

"But you see, I thought he might not have been the doctor!" Esthr protested as she was led to the gallows. "But if no-one else is, then he probably is, right?"

Unfortunately, despite having finally come to a similar conclusion as her fellows, it was too late to save her neck. But did she protest out of innocence, or guilt? The morning would reveal all.


Votes:

Esthr - 3 - Sabrar, Carlington, Suzaku
Suzaku - 1 - Esthr
Carlington - 1 - Minestrone

Deadline. Esthr has been lynched. Please submit your night actions promptly - Deadline timer.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby ConMan » Fri Jan 29, 2016 12:20 am UTC

The customary search of Esthr's belongings showed questionable taste in music - large swathes of 80s pop interspersed with "Best Of" albums from groups formed less than a month ago in various reality TV shows - but that just confirmed everyone's worst suspicions. Despite her imaginative strategies and off-the-wall ideas about who to lynch, she was really a little too mundane to be working for the mob.

Esthr was Vanilla Town.

The other corpse proved a little harder to find. Having remained incredibly silent the previous day, it took a while to sink in that ajh was not present for the lootinginvestigation of Esthr's stuff. Finally, someone noticed that the statue of the mayor in the town square was looking a bit pinker than usual, and it didn't take long to determine that it had been replaced by ajh's body. A rummage through his pockets turned up a handy-dandy anti-death-by-mobster kit and a registration licence permitting him to perform part-time medical treatments.

ajh has been killed. He was the Town Odd-Night Doctor.

Carlington did a quick count on his fingers. "Uh, by my count, we're not in a great position now. I guess if we don't find one of those goons now we might not see tomorrow. On the other hand, I did find a whole bunch of air mattresses so we can discuss the situation in questionable comfort!"

Five players remain, three to lynch. Deadline timer. I probably don't need to tell you this, but it is now LiloLyLo.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Suzaku » Fri Jan 29, 2016 1:01 am UTC

Well, shit.

Claim time: I'm the cop, Minestrone is town. Should be fairly obvious why I targeted him, but I can detail my thoughts later.
So there are two scum in {Sabrar, Mathilda, Carlington}.

I need time to think about who I think they are.

More later today.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Carlington » Fri Jan 29, 2016 1:06 am UTC

I'm on the bus to work, so I won't be posting again for 5 or 6 hours, but in the interest of clearing the air for potential cop claims, I am VT and thus won't be counterclaiming. For the record, I still think the cop should claim and provide their result from last night.

Ninja'd by Suzaku.
Okay, so FMPOV scumteam is either Sabrar and Mathilda or Suzaku and ???? (Minestrone?)
I'm assuming there will be a counterclaim at some point.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Minestrone » Fri Jan 29, 2016 4:23 am UTC

Given that we're at LYLO, claims don't mean as much as they otherwise would have, so I wouldn't be totally surprised by a counterclaim, but I can confirm that I am both not a cop and town so Suzaku's information is at least consistent with the information I have.

I think I would actually like to hold back on my thoughts about who's scum until everyone posts, given that a) if there's no counterclaim I'm confirmed and b) if there is a counterclaim, townies talking about who they trust/distrust gives scum more information for constructing their counterclaim.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:44 am UTC

If we lose this because the mod started the day an hour late I'm going to be very upset. Here's my post from last night in the Gojoe thread:

Sabrar wrote:I investigated Minestrone and they're scum. Given that Esthr flipped town, their most likely partner is Suzaku who played a hell of a game.
Unfortunately if ConMan doesn't start D3 in 5 minutes they will have the opportuntiy of false-claiming before me. Stupid time-zone differences.

So yeah, I'm the real Cop and we finally know our scum-team just in time to be able to win. I was always planning to be awake for the beginning of D3, that's why I advocated so hard the idea that Cop should immediately claim, I specifically wanted to avoid this situation. Now my own strategy makes me look suspicious because I went to bed 20 minutes too early.
I will reread the thread and make my case later.

@Carlington, Mathilda: please ask me anything you want!

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Carlington » Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:54 am UTC

If you copped Minestrone as scum, why didn't you vote?
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Carlington » Fri Jan 29, 2016 6:58 am UTC

EBWOP: Mathilda, Minestrone, I'm not voting yet, please refrain also until we are very sure. A vote for the wrong person will lose us the game.
Kewangji: Posdy zwei tosdy osdy oady. Bork bork bork, hoppity syphilis bork.

Eebster the Great: What specifically is moving faster than light in these examples?
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 7:47 am UTC

Because it didn't occur me that I had to do it with 3 days left to discuss things. But I'll gladly do so if you want.

Vote: Minestrone

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 8:25 am UTC

Part 1

Here I will try to explain the main difference between Suzaku's claim and mine.

Suzaku false-claiming Cop and clearing Minestrone was a necessity brought on by the circumstances and not a terribly risky gambit.
First, he knew that Minestrone was an incredibly likely target for the investigation, so the Cop's counterclaim wouldn't look so strong.
Second, he also knew that Esthr would flip Town and he would come under immediate suspicion. Therefore to clear both of them in one fell swoop this was the only claim he could make.
Please note that the vice versa scenario (Minestrone claiming Cop and clearing Suzaku) would not have worked, as it wouldn't have made any sense for Minestrone not to target his lynch-candidate.
Summary: this was the only play scum could make and they did indeed make it.

Now let's look at my claim from the hypothetical pov of me being scum.
My main argument here is that this is among the worst false-claims I could have made in this situation. By accusing Minestrone falsely I guarantee that together with Suzaku they will vote for me, so I have only 1 chance to convince the third townie of my innocence. What other options did I have?
- I could have claimed to target Carlington and confirm that he's Town. That way I still have the same chance of convincing the third Town, plus there's a small possibility that Minestrone would believe me and write down Suzaku's claim as a gambit of trying to get on their good side. I'm sure that given some time I can easily come up with a believable explanation why I would have targeted Carlington instead of Minestrone.
- I could have stayed silent. Now Suzaku and Minestrone are confirmed Town, however they need to lynch correctly twice. If lynches were determined randomly then this would mean only a 33% chance for success. Obviously this is not the case but I will posit that given our track record so far, looking at post history wouldn't raise it too much. So now I (as scum) would have ~60% chance to win if I don't false-claim.
Summary: if I were scum I had much better options to choose from.


In Part 2 I will look at post history and try to find further proof why you should believe me.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 9:38 am UTC

Suzaku wrote:Claim time: I'm the cop, Minestrone is town. Should be fairly obvious why I targeted him, but I can detail my thoughts later.
So there are two scum in {Sabrar, Mathilda, Carlington}.



Sabrar wrote:If we lose this because the mod started the day an hour late I'm going to be very upset. Here's my post from last night in the Gojoe thread:
Sabrar wrote:I investigated Minestrone and they're scum. Given that Esthr flipped town, their most likely partner is Suzaku who played a hell of a game.
Unfortunately if ConMan doesn't start D3 in 5 minutes they will have the opportuntiy of false-claiming before me. Stupid time-zone differences.




Yay! A claim and counter-claim. Something I can get my teeth into.

Same question to both of you. Why did you investigate Minestrone?

I think this is an important information. It's odd that both claimants are stating that they investigated the same person.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 9:41 am UTC

Also Suzaku and Sabrar, you two should be voting for each other. One of you knows that the other is scum.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 9:55 am UTC

@Mathilda: Cop needs to find scum, not confirm Town. Therefore he should investigate the most scummy player, which in this case happened to be Minestrone (here is my latest read of the players if you want to check).
Regarding who to vote for: I have confirmation from the mod that Minestrone is scum, I do not have the same confirmation regarding Suzaku, in his case I'm just absolutely certain as he wouldn't false-claim as VT. That's why I'm voting for Minestrone.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:03 am UTC

Part 2

At this point there has been a surplus of townie voting town. Separating the true mistakes from the scum-votes is I think impossible due to the amount of WIFOM it would generate. Therefore I've tried to compare Suzaku's posts to mine on a strategic level rather then voting-history.

Overall our content does not differ too much. We both like to talk about the game on an abstract level, discussing strategy, giving people (perhaps unsolicited) advice. Most of our analysis is pretty basic and could have been equally made by scum trying to look townie. For example advocating that VT should never lie is an obvious concept in this setup, scum could reasonably be sure that smart Town players will think of it on their own and therefore can bring it up in advance without any risk. We basically agreed in all aspects of the advisable strategy, with the exception of a possible No Lynch scenario on D2 if the Doctor managed to save someone. If people think it would be beneficial we could hold that discussion now to provide more content.

So unfortunately this wasn't very useful. A couple of things occurred to me though during reread, so there will probably be a Part 3 with some personal stuff at a later time.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Suzaku » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:04 am UTC

Vote: Sabrar
For false claiming cop, for falsely accusing Minestrone, and for this:

Sabrar wrote:If we lose this because the mod started the day an hour late I'm going to be very upset. Here's my post from last night in the Gojoe thread:

Sabrar wrote:I investigated Minestrone and they're scum. Given that Esthr flipped town, their most likely partner is Suzaku who played a hell of a game.
Unfortunately if ConMan doesn't start D3 in 5 minutes they will have the opportuntiy of false-claiming before me. Stupid time-zone differences.
Emphasis mine.
This is inconsistent. Sabrar says Esthr had flipped town, but that ConMan had not started the day. Esthr did not flip until ConMan started the day. Before that, Sabrar could not have known Esthr would flip town unless he was scum.

I'm on my phone now, and being very rude to my dining partner, but will be back later.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:19 am UTC

Well spotted Suzaku!

Vote: Sabrar

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:20 am UTC

By the way, could someone explain to me what the gojoe thread is please?

Thanks

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Sabrar » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:21 am UTC

Good game Suzaku! That was incredibly stupid of me. There's no need to prolong this any more.

Unvote
Vote: Sabrar

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Carlington » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:24 am UTC

Good spot Suzaku, I'm amazed I missed that. Tbh, I'm convinced by that. There's no way Sabrar could have known unless scum.

Vote: Sabrar


Doubleninja'd by Mathilda which makes this the hammer I believe. If this is a scum play it's a phenomenal one, so I hope Sabrar and Minestrone understand. The Gojoe thread is the Gojoe Memorial Mafia Discussion thread, where people discuss ongoing games behind spoiler tags for the benefit of spectators and later edification of players. It can be found here


Ninja again so this is hammer plus one? Obvs not a scum play now though
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:43 am UTC

Suzaku wrote:So there are two scum in {Sabrar, Mathilda, Carlington}.


This means that Carlington must be the last scum!

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Carlington » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:50 am UTC

(I know I'm doing the same thing I'm saying not to, but in most games players shouldn't post after the hammer vote.)
Kewangji: Posdy zwei tosdy osdy oady. Bork bork bork, hoppity syphilis bork.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Suzaku » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:52 am UTC

The Rules wrote:11. If at any point a player receives a majority of votes (as stated in the mod votals), then the day ends, even if I haven't posted yet. You must not post after a majority is reached.


Ninja: You shouldn't.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby Mathilda » Fri Jan 29, 2016 10:54 am UTC

Sorry my fault. I won't post any more. I assumed that there was a twilight phase.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D3 - Air mattress

Postby ConMan » Sun Jan 31, 2016 3:55 am UTC

Well that caught me out in more ways than one.

Sabrar has been lynched. N3 will start now, but I will post an update later with flavour text and a deadline. Those with night actions may PM me now.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - N3 - A palpable hit?

Postby ConMan » Sun Jan 31, 2016 9:33 pm UTC

Thanks to Suzaku's intense interrogation techniques, Minestrone had been cleared of all guilt. But thanks to Sabrar's questioning skills, he had apparently turned up guilty. What was the deal? Surely one of them must be mistaken.

"It's clear, if you see how the moon in the first house aligned with the moon in the second house at exactly 5AM this morning, that Minestrone is guilty!" claimed Sabrar.

"You fool! They aligned only at 5.01! That proves you're lying!"

"It's a fair cop, I guess. Much like you, apparently."

And with that astrological slip-up, Sabrar allowed himself to be led away, though as he did he winked at someone in the group - but who?

The townsfolk were fairly certain they'd gotten it right this time, if only because they weren't being raided by the mob immediately. They turned in for the night, hopeful that they would all see another morning.


Votes:

Sabrar - 3 - Suzaku, Mathilda, Sabrar (hammer - votes after this not counted)

Sabrar has been lynched. Night 3 will run for an additional 6 hours - Deadline timer.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D4 - Curiouser ...

Postby ConMan » Mon Feb 01, 2016 5:04 am UTC

The sun rose, as did the residents of Randallsburg. Well, the ones still alive, at least. They all gathered at Sabrar's corpse to check if they had gotten it right this time. A rummage through the dead man's pockets yielded ... a VHS copy of the Godfather (rented from the video store 10 years ago and never returned), a gun labelled "to be used once per night in the event of townsfolk", one of those disturbing horse head masks and a bunch of water balloons. There was only one conclusion to be made ...

"Boy did he have deep pockets!" cried Mathilda.

There were only two conclusions to be made ...

"He must have racked up a huge amount of overdue fees on that video!" said Suzaku.

Three conclusions ...

"He loved to play pranks!" said Minestrone.

Fine ...

"So he was a member of the Mafia!" Carlington finally concluded.


Sabrar was a Mafia Goon.

With that finally dealt with, the townsfolk could then turn their attention to the matter of the other corpse. Only there was a problem. There wasn't one.

"So, uh, does that mean we're safe?" mused Carlington.

"I doubt it", countered Suzaku. "Always two there are, according to that documentary I watched last night. I think we have to keep going, just to be certain. Maybe today is the day we rid ourselves of the mafia once and for all!"


Four remain. Three to lynch. Deadline timer.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D4 - Curiouser ...

Postby Suzaku » Mon Feb 01, 2016 5:38 am UTC

Interesting. Our remaining Mafioso must have withheld their kill last night, either intentionally or because they didn't manage to get an action in.

That means the situation is as follows:
Suzaku - Cop.
Minestrone - confirmed town by cop result.
Mathilda - either scum or VT
Carlington - either scum or VT

This is 4-player MYLO; if we mislynch a townie we lose, but we can no-lynch.
Normally, no lynch would be the only reasonable course of action, but I'm unsure if it would really help us this time.

First thing, though: no voting until we've agreed on a plan.
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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D4 - Curiouser ...

Postby Mathilda » Mon Feb 01, 2016 9:05 am UTC

All I can really ask at this point is that when reading over our posts, please consider the motivation behind them. Was the post written with the intention of helping town? Or was it written with the intention of appearing to help town and to register a presence? This is a far better indicator than tone because that makes the assumption that everyone conforms to a similar style of play.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D1 - Mob justice

Postby Mathilda » Mon Feb 01, 2016 10:29 am UTC

Carlington wrote:Mathilda, I like your analysis but disagree with the end of your post - we have nothing to go on but game mechanic discussion at this point - we need to look at the information gained from that discussion to figure out town and scum. I've fallen into similar though patterns in the past, but have since learnt how they are unhelpful go town.


Please explain Carlington, how talking about game mechanics helps us figure out who is town and who is scum. Thanks.

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Re: Alternating 9P Mafia - D4 - Curiouser ...

Postby Carlington » Mon Feb 01, 2016 11:25 am UTC

No-lynch at this point would just put us at LYLO tomorrow, I think, unless there's another night without an NK. I doubt that there would be, but then I doubted that there would be a lack of NK tonight, so well played Mathilda on starting the day with some wine.

Mathilda wrote:
Carlington wrote:Mathilda, I like your analysis but disagree with the end of your post - we have nothing to go on but game mechanic discussion at this point - we need to look at the information gained from that discussion to figure out town and scum. I've fallen into similar though patterns in the past, but have since learnt how they are unhelpful go town.


Please explain Carlington, how talking about game mechanics helps us figure out who is town and who is scum. Thanks.

You've snipped that a little. On D1, all we do have is mechanic discussion. We discuss mechanics, we discuss strategies, and then we look at who advocates what and who agrees with whom, and we look at who waits until later, plays it safe, and says things that have already been said, just in different words. I think that I agreed with you D1 - it was just that, as jimbob pointed out, I missed your point a little. Of course just talking about strategy in the abstract doesn't help as much - it's all pretty well established and leads to barrels of wine. Game-specific strategy talk is what's needed D1.

My turn now - I spoke just now about how good scum play involves avoiding saying anything controversial or remarkable, and blending into the background nicely. As such, I find it interesting that you've managed to go this entire game without providing any reads, or indeed without having any votes placed at end of day, except for Sabrar for whom there was no redemption and thus no risk. How is it that you can have had no opinions strong enough for you to vote?

Also, if nobody has any objections, I'll vote Mathilda in my next post - unless we decide NL would be better in terms of giving us more time to think and more information.
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