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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:09 am UTC

Why did you push Jimbob instead of Spak D1?

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plytho
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:12 am UTC

Zen, where is your case on bessie?
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:17 am UTC

Ok! I see plytho left me a few questions.
Spoiler:
plytho wrote: This is not deliberate and I am as frustrated as you are.

1. I doubt it.
2. I doubt it.

plytho wrote:My question, simply stated is: Why did you post
bessie wrote:Um, you know, scum probably has a kill. And they know who the claimed redirector is. They have a few chances to hit him before town has enough info to make a good guess on who to redirect to SirGabriel.
And not
bessie wrote:You’re active lurking.
at this point in the thread to call out my active lurking?

The former is you engaging with my argument, the latter is you calling out my active lurking.
Ok, I’ll answer this for the 5th (?) time. Let me try a different approach.

Style. This implication-type derogatory sneering and sniping is my style. I can link to other games, or you can just sort this thread by author and find many other examples yourself. If moody was here he could back me up, I think he’s commented on it in the past. Madge, you can weigh in on this if you want, with no repercussions from me, go ahead and flame away. I’m a passive aggressive, arrogant, dominant, overconfident, aggressive jerk. See my avatar, that’s my great love, the late BessieDog, the sweetest, gentlest bitch ever to walk this earth, and every day I try to be more like her. I’m failing at the sweet and gentle parts. If you don’t like this answer, ask me a sixth time and I will try something else.

plytho wrote:Yeah, I know you said that. That’s not my concern. You’ve given me no reason to think you changed your mind and I want to know where you stand. So yeah, you thought jimbob and me were scum partners at the end of D1. Why did you feel a need to bring that up? I don’t care about your thoughts before the flip. I want to know what you think now. Isn’t that clear?

The lack of a follow up on that lead me to think that was still your point of view. That's where my questions are coming from.
I brought it up in my first D2 post because that is where I posted my N1 notes. I’m sorry if I forgot to mention that this was the stuff I was working on N1, and was done before reading any D2 content. Oh oh oh, wait a minute:
bessie wrote: I just got home and there’s already three pages of content. I’ll reply to some D1 stuff I was working on over the weekend and come back in a while to reply to today’s content.
What do I think now? Well, my opinion of jimbob has improved a little.

plytho wrote: Yeah, I know your reasoning for not voting moody. I’m saying it isn’t helping my view on you, not asking you to explain it. You’re not explaining why you haven’t made a read on Zen or Sabrar all game nor why you thought it necessary to say you were thinking of a jimbob-plytho team before moody’s flip.

1. If you don’t want to know why I didn’t vote for moody why do you keep bringing it up?
2. I did explain why I haven’t made a read of Zen or Sabrar all game, because I’ve been busy. I explained this here:
bessie wrote:So plytho why will you not let this drop?

bessie wrote: Listen, after the game hit me up. I will discuss statistics and game theory all day with you. I will talk your ear off. But too much of my D2 has been responding to the same points over and over again from you, and you’re keeping me from looking at anyone else. Or is that intentional? Are you worried I might actually have time to do a proper reads list? What will I find when I read jimbob?

bessie wrote: All right, plytho wants me to answer a bunch of questions I’ve already answered. Again. He really doesn’t want me to have time to look at other content or complete my reads.

bessie wrote: If you really want to see my reads on you and jimbob, why are you doing everything you can to keep me from making those reads? You keep asking me to answer the same questions over and over again.


plytho wrote: Oh, and just because you’ve answered something before doesn’t mean I can’t find it suspicious. Just because you can explain how your behaviour could come from a townie doesn’t mean it couldn’t just as well come from scum.
Sure you can find it suspicious. Ok, I’m suspicious. So I guess the correct thing for townie!plytho to do is keep asking scummy!bessie the same questions over and over again so that she doesn’t have time to pollute the thread with her scummy reads? Maybe I’ll crack. Or maybe I’ll give you that information you’ve been fishing for most of D2.


town
bessie
Peaceful Whale
Evil George Washington
LaserGuy
#HBC | Zyth
Sabrar
mpolo
#HBC | Red Ryu
FrozenFlame
BoomFrog
jimbobmacdoodle
Spak
Znirk
Madge
heuristically_alone
Gamma Emerald
Amrock
plytho
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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:19 am UTC

Bessie will you be around to vote today?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:23 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote: Don't dodge my questions, Zen.

Your Question:
Evil George Washington wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Ran, why have you not commented on my Spak case? Why is Spak so low on your lynch list?


I have said it looks good. I put him in my top 4 as Plytho mentioned he viewed without saying much. Why aren't you pushing for votes on him?

I'm dodging it because it's loaded. The idea that I'm not actually pushing him simply isn't true:

#HBC | Zyth wrote:*spak case*

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
#HBC | Red Ryu wrote:Zen Vote Gamma please.

Town read him. Read my Spak case, please.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Sabrar wrote:
@Spak: re-entered active-lurking territory hard. I think Zen's point on this is mostly true but excessive (planning to come back to this in my Zen-read). Spak forgetting about Madge's ability could be coming from scum skimming only. Wait, no. He clearly mentions it here. Ok, then it's more likely scum not caring to remember. His unwillingness to reconsider BoomFrog is I believe alignment-indicative.

@DGamers: does town!Spak normally tunnel that hard?

Overall leaning scum, will reevaluate if he does tunnel.
https://smashboards.com/threads/monty-pythons-flying-mafia-scum-victory-vult-doop-win-the-game.437664/page-4#post-21265651


#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Gamma Emerald wrote:Vote plytho
Better shot at getting a lynch here


Spak, Spak, Spak :3

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Spak, seeing as you're behind, wouldn't it be best for you to not waste time discussing set up stuff? In my opinion, you should focus on your reads. That's where we will get value from your posts. We don't get much from you discussing set up speculation, especially over that which has already been addressed. Contribution is good, but not if it's empty. And your strategy and set up related comments are just that: empty.

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Evil George Washington wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Ran, you're play is really unnatural here. Reading through Walmart atm. You were a jerk to me there too, but it it seemed so flowy and free compared to here.


What about it? Use quotes my boy. Expand on what you mean. Why are you saying this now instead of D1 or early D2?

#HBC | Zyth wrote:Ran, why have you not commented on my Spak case? Why is Spak so low on your lynch list?


I have said it looks good. I put him in my top 4 as Plytho mentioned he viewed without saying much. Why aren't you pushing for votes on him? Why is Gamma town to you?

Your're being super backgroundy. Tell me what points you like about the Spak case. Why hasn't it influenced your read? The only thing you claimed to have influenced your current position of Spak is him viewing without saying much. This is a scum!Ran thing to do. That is such a bad reason to scum read someone and you should know better by now after all these years of playing mafia. You did the same with DH d1 which is just gross. (I like lynching inactives early because they are unknowns & liabilities, you are actually scum reading them for it and that's disgusting).

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D1 Begins! | DL = 9/13

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:24 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:
Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:What's love meta got to do with it?
You may want to re-read Peaceful Whale's 2 previous games to get a feel for him.

I'm really not a fan of basing reads off of meta. I think it tends to act more as a blindfold than it is useful. Play style is something that can be easily altered. PW themselves said they overplayed their newness in the last game. I don't think it would be wise to use that as a basis for their alignment this game./quote]

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:25 am UTC

plytho wrote:Zen, where is your case on bessie?

I'm not ready to make a commitment on my plytho read just yet. I need to reread bessie (again). I had such clarity the other day, when I had a detached view of everything, that she was scum. That Zen-like Zen was so sure, but this sleepless-nights Zen is struggling to regain that clarity. I unfortunately got sucked into comparing plytho's play to Fridge mafia, which is just making things murkier for me. I really would like to lynch Spak today and put this off until the night phase where I'd have the time and solitude to really do a just analysis of both. I think I'm the only one that has bessie on suspect list, but I really feel strongly that bessie-plytho is TvS. I'm just not convinced that the S is plytho.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:28 am UTC

Ran, which points did you like about my Spak case? If you believe I am trying to distance him, why are you not looking into him?

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:29 am UTC

You aren't pushing to lynch him or rally votes as you did with Jim D1. That's my point, and I asked that question with you saying 'spak spak spak' in mind as well. That's not pushing for his lynch, nor is saying 'read my spak case'.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:34 am UTC

I never thought the jim wagon could go through. Or at least there was a low probability. The case was weak. Here I think the case is strong which is why I'm trying to get people look and talk about it. Which you're constantly avoiding.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby bessie » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:34 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Bessie will you be around to vote today?

I'm voting for plytho. :P

I will be home around 6:00 pm PDT. Deadline is at 9:00 pm PDT. If I'm somehow tied up at work (unlikely, but...?), I'll check in on my phone and see where we are.

Gamma is at L-2. I could switch now but scum can hammer and deprive us of a day of discussion.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:39 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:I never thought the jim wagon could go through. Or at least there was a low probability. The case was weak. Here I think the case is strong which is why I'm trying to get people look and talk about it. Which you're constantly avoiding.


Why post it late in the day if you want people to talk about it?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:40 am UTC

@Zen: please help me out here. I've looked through your D2 content (again) and can't find the part where you explain your town-read on Gamma. Though I did find this:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Is there more to your role or is this just scumGamma WIFOMing a partner connection?

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:41 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:All of Spak's posts have so obviously been made solely for the sake of having content out there. There is a potential pro-town motivation behind this. A town!Spak who has been having difficulty staying caught up, might think that it is important that he at least have something out there -- to contribute to town some way. But these are all the wrong things to contribute. Debating strategy says very little about your alignment, because it is purely logic based. Your subjective opinion on players is the content that really matters. Spak provides very little of this. When he is commenting on players, he's just praising a post or giving some objective reason as to why someone shouldn't read into something:


I agree with this. I'm focusing on Gamma and Zen first.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:43 am UTC

Zen, why are you trying to misrepresent my play here? What is your current read of me now?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:45 am UTC

bessie wrote:Ok! I see plytho left me a few questions.
Spoiler:
plytho wrote: This is not deliberate and I am as frustrated as you are.

1. I doubt it.
2. I doubt it.

plytho wrote:My question, simply stated is: Why did you post
bessie wrote:Um, you know, scum probably has a kill. And they know who the claimed redirector is. They have a few chances to hit him before town has enough info to make a good guess on who to redirect to SirGabriel.
And not
bessie wrote:You’re active lurking.
at this point in the thread to call out my active lurking?

The former is you engaging with my argument, the latter is you calling out my active lurking.
Ok, I’ll answer this for the 5th (?) time. Let me try a different approach.

Style. This implication-type derogatory sneering and sniping is my style. I can link to other games, or you can just sort this thread by author and find many other examples yourself. If moody was here he could back me up, I think he’s commented on it in the past. Madge, you can weigh in on this if you want, with no repercussions from me, go ahead and flame away. I’m a passive aggressive, arrogant, dominant, overconfident, aggressive jerk. See my avatar, that’s my great love, the late BessieDog, the sweetest, gentlest bitch ever to walk this earth, and every day I try to be more like her. I’m failing at the sweet and gentle parts. If you don’t like this answer, ask me a sixth time and I will try something else.

plytho wrote:Yeah, I know you said that. That’s not my concern. You’ve given me no reason to think you changed your mind and I want to know where you stand. So yeah, you thought jimbob and me were scum partners at the end of D1. Why did you feel a need to bring that up? I don’t care about your thoughts before the flip. I want to know what you think now. Isn’t that clear?

The lack of a follow up on that lead me to think that was still your point of view. That's where my questions are coming from.
I brought it up in my first D2 post because that is where I posted my N1 notes. I’m sorry if I forgot to mention that this was the stuff I was working on N1, and was done before reading any D2 content. Oh oh oh, wait a minute:
bessie wrote: I just got home and there’s already three pages of content. I’ll reply to some D1 stuff I was working on over the weekend and come back in a while to reply to today’s content.
What do I think now? Well, my opinion of jimbob has improved a little.

plytho wrote: Yeah, I know your reasoning for not voting moody. I’m saying it isn’t helping my view on you, not asking you to explain it. You’re not explaining why you haven’t made a read on Zen or Sabrar all game nor why you thought it necessary to say you were thinking of a jimbob-plytho team before moody’s flip.

1. If you don’t want to know why I didn’t vote for moody why do you keep bringing it up?
2. I did explain why I haven’t made a read of Zen or Sabrar all game, because I’ve been busy. I explained this here:
bessie wrote:So plytho why will you not let this drop?

bessie wrote: Listen, after the game hit me up. I will discuss statistics and game theory all day with you. I will talk your ear off. But too much of my D2 has been responding to the same points over and over again from you, and you’re keeping me from looking at anyone else. Or is that intentional? Are you worried I might actually have time to do a proper reads list? What will I find when I read jimbob?

bessie wrote: All right, plytho wants me to answer a bunch of questions I’ve already answered. Again. He really doesn’t want me to have time to look at other content or complete my reads.

bessie wrote: If you really want to see my reads on you and jimbob, why are you doing everything you can to keep me from making those reads? You keep asking me to answer the same questions over and over again.


plytho wrote: Oh, and just because you’ve answered something before doesn’t mean I can’t find it suspicious. Just because you can explain how your behaviour could come from a townie doesn’t mean it couldn’t just as well come from scum.
Sure you can find it suspicious. Ok, I’m suspicious. So I guess the correct thing for townie!plytho to do is keep asking scummy!bessie the same questions over and over again so that she doesn’t have time to pollute the thread with her scummy reads? Maybe I’ll crack. Or maybe I’ll give you that information you’ve been fishing for most of D2.


town
bessie
Peaceful Whale
Evil George Washington
LaserGuy
#HBC | Zyth
Sabrar
mpolo
#HBC | Red Ryu
FrozenFlame
BoomFrog
jimbobmacdoodle
Spak
Znirk
Madge
heuristically_alone
Gamma Emerald
Amrock
plytho
scum

So is Spak a scum lean? I'm still not quite sure. What do you think about point B and C in the case I made against him. You commented on A, but not the others. Also, do you agree with differences in lurking style that I pointed out between him and plytho?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:48 am UTC

You state in early game you don't like to use meta yet you are using it to misrepresent my play with 'unnatural' posting which you don't really seem to give examples of. My play is a mirror image of my last game on Mafia Scum. If you want to use meta, you can use that, since it's recent and not years old. Why did you choose Walmart Mafia to compare this to?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:50 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:@Zen: please help me out here. I've looked through your D2 content (again) and can't find the part where you explain your town-read on Gamma. Though I did find this:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:Is there more to your role or is this just scumGamma WIFOMing a partner connection?

D1 reads list. The one with the with the roman numeral points against Madge. My read never changed on him. His failure to pay attention to the game makes him a liability, but not scum.

That quote above is me scum hunting. A read on a player doesn't change the fact that I'm still ignorant of their alignment. If something is scummy or odd, I'm going to try and get to the bottom of it. He made three posts with seeming frustration on bessie. It doesn't feel like that frustration is coming from a genuine place.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:54 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Zen, why are you trying to misrepresent my play here? What is your current read of me now?

My read on you is that I'm probably never going to play in a game with you again.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 5:55 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:My read on you is that I'm probably never going to play in a game with you again.


Well, that's just mean Zen.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:03 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:My read on you is that I'm probably never going to play in a game with you again.


Well, that's just mean Zen.

You're constantly asking me to do **** and I happily oblige. You wont even ****ing take my Spak case seriously.
You constantly accuse me of not doing **** that I am. You promised me after Walmart that you'd stop doing **** like this. And here you are again.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:10 am UTC

Let's get back to the game Zen. What's your actual read of me currently? What's your read of Laser Guy?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:11 am UTC

Good night.

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Sabrar
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Sabrar » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:11 am UTC

#HBC | Zyth wrote:D1 reads list. The one with the roman numeral points against Madge.
Got it. You don't think that the read is quite old then and you need to reevaluate?

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:12 am UTC

:roll:

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby #HBC | Zyth » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:14 am UTC

Sabrar wrote:
#HBC | Zyth wrote:D1 reads list. The one with the roman numeral points against Madge.
Got it. You don't think that the read is quite old then and you need to reevaluate?

Yes. I've reevaluated and its the same. He's in my not-mafia list.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:21 am UTC

Zen, what is your read on me right now?

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:25 am UTC

I think Zen is comparing this game to Walmart because that's the only game where I pushed him when he was town. (We were both town) Yet there, he pushed me D1 and hard. Much different than his D1 play here, where he pushed a wagon he says he didn't believe would go far anyway. Back then, he stated he likes to 'wait and see' and find scum that way. Perfectly fine way to scumhunt, yet he waits until late D2 this game for his Spak push, which isn't even as pushy as his Jimbob push.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:43 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:
I don't actually disagree with a lot of this. Gamma has certainly given every indication of being melodramatic. I find his content in the last few pages in particular to be quite appalling (especially this, which, seriously @Gamma, regardless of your alignment, that shit is not appropriate), which has made it very difficult for me to muster a lot of willpower to want to defend him, and as a result I've spent probably twice as long on this section of the post as I have on everything that's gone before. I'm not going to deny that his play his a very scummy feel to it. He's great lynchbait. He reminds me a lot of heuristically_alone, who gives off extremely scummy vibes even as Town (X-Men is a great example), though heury is at least lighthearted and funny. As I said earlier, I think some of Gamma's play is fine, not great, but fine, and he wasn't really on my radar for most of the D2. I'd probably have put him as null, or maybe a slight lean one way or the other. I noticed, though, that my scumreads--all of them (not Spak in D2 until recently, though he had made noises in that direction D1)--had Gamma as a leading lynch contender for the today, or had already voted for him, and that was worth a bit of townie credit in my mind, and I'm going to oppose any wagon that is driven by those particular players, because I don't vote with scum and won't act in ways that further their objectives. Again, this I am confused as to why this seems to be controversial. Do townies regularly vote the same wagons as their strongest scumreads in your part of the world?

Sorry, I don't really feel I did a great job of this last section. Gamma's personal attack against bessie really rubbed me the wrong way and I just can't summon the energy to really fight this right now. Maybe I'll revisit this later when I'm not so pissed off at him.


I agree that comment was not nice, I hope he refrains from doing that and even insulting me as well. I don't appreciate it. Gamewise, he has done this as scum before and I have caught him. So I have meta of him. He did scumread me in The Thing Mafia, I don't remember why though, but I townread him in that game. (At least he seemed townie from my scum eyes there) He's lurked as scum, he's made forceful posts as scum, yet you say we should give him a pass because your scumreads don't like his play, for reasons you don't disagree with. He was scum read in the previous game, and I helped by town reading him and defending him. His own scum mate was pushing for him. Townies don't like to wagon with their scumreads, but your scumreads aren't convincing. Take Red Ryu for instance. A player who seems to be inactive, but is getting better and actually pushing a wagon, asking questions, and making valid points. You consider him scum for 'not caring for his reads or interactions with other players'. One, I don't understand why you are reading his interactions and factoring that into your individual read of him. The Moody flip interaction is fair and valid, though. That's it. Two, 'not caring for his reads' is a lazy stance. You don't care for which reads of his, and why?

Oh now you've done it. I didn't behave anywhere near this in either of my scumgames with you, while I reacted this way in The Thing Mafia quite a bit, so your meta on me is faulty as fuck, if you're not lying out of your ass. If you are town and you don't correct course I'm going to ream you.
And honestly I'm getting kinda turned off of this group of people in general if they are such numbskulls at realizing what is and isn't a scum-motivated wagon. I'd use the "post here and get banned" thing but I want to still be able to comment on xkcd pages if I care to.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:48 am UTC

bessie wrote:Ok! I see plytho left me a few questions
plytho wrote: This is not deliberate and I am as frustrated as you are.

1. I doubt it.
2. I doubt it.

Well, that's it, I give up. Bessie, you can expect a giant pm after the game where I document you misunderstanding me in just about every single thing you said to me this game. I don't think there's any use in us talking to each other until we resolve that because the same thing will keep happening.
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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:52 am UTC

Gamma Emerald wrote:Oh now you've done it. I didn't behave anywhere near this in either of my scumgames with you, while I reacted this way in The Thing Mafia quite a bit, so your meta on me is faulty as fuck, if you're not lying out of your ass. If you are town and you don't correct course I'm going to ream you.And honestly I'm getting kinda turned off of this group of people in general if they are such numbskulls at realizing what is and isn't a scum-motivated wagon. I'd use the "post here and get banned" thing but I want to still be able to comment on xkcd pages if I care to.


You misunderstand me. I was talking about 'forcing' your posts, not insults/yelling. I'm talking about the thing you did in Family Mafia, which seemed faked. Also I did say I don't remember much about Thing Mafia.

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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:55 am UTC

A few quick replies...

jimbobmacdoodle wrote:I don't like his comments directed at Spak here, given that he was wrong about Spak not voting and the "happiness over the lynch" part.


The 'happiness over the lynch part' I said is a common scumtell. It's not a guaranteed scumtell--as in, when you see this, it's more likely that you're seeing it from mafia than from Town. I had a similar discussion in Fridge mafia with Sabrar about whether rolefishing should be considered a scumtell. I don't know that there's anything that you can point to and say that it's a definitive tell for mafia, but there's things that nudge the probabilities one way or a another a bit.

bessie wrote:
Gamma Emerald wrote:Fine. Because town can't tell it's head from it's ass from a scum-motivated push I'm claiming. I'm Geralt of Rivia, Town Bounty Hunter. Each night including n0 I get a name as a bounty. If I lynch them I get a one shot power. My names received are jimbob n0 and FrozenFlame n1. THIS is why I voted FF over anyone else when I voted him day 2: I wanted to earn my power. It also partially explains my vote on jimbob, which was also because I was just not comfortable voting moody and I sure as hell wouldn't vote myself.
If Gamma Emerald is telling the truth about his win condition, my gut reaction is that he is not pro-town, because I still think that if your win condition involves eliminating town, you are not pro-town. (I have been having this argument with jimbobmacdoodle for almost two years, since Draculafia. Mentioned by me in this thread here.) I’m still pissed off we had a town lyncher in Shakespeare III, and I think that role was a mistake.


You did actually misread Gamma's claim here. He's claiming his wincon isn't related to the lynch; his power is.

plytho wrote:@LaserGuy: you said at some point that you thought maybe your two scum team theory was wrong. What’s your feeling now. One team or two teams? You have six scum reads that you believe in quite strongly. How do they fit into one team/ two teams?


Mmm.... I've been going back and forth all day. As I noted earlier today, I really liked Spak's jets vs. sharks comment and have been playing a bit around with how two different teams might sort based on that schema. If I survive into the night, I may try to figure out a way to map out the interactions and see if I can see anything interesting. My comment about there only being one scumteam was made in reference to the fact that I saw a bunch of players all suddenly start wagoning in the same direction completely unprompted. Very different from how the D1 wagon went down.

What's your feeling on this? Originally you were leaning more toward one team I think? Are you feeling two is more likely now?

plytho wrote:Gamma refused to be the sacrifice. Which really doesn’t look good. His claimed power is terrible for town. He doesn’t even know what he gets for lynching his targets. Throwing himself on amrock is the best way Gamma can serve town. He’s indie at best.


I suspect Gamma does know what he gets for lynching his targets, he's just not telling us. If he is Town, it's kind of a nasty power to get to ever work properly. Worse than Madge's. I agree about the Amrock business (hence why I asked).

plytho wrote:Another thing we agree on! Zen, is using the LaserGuy playbook here: he's so confident that one and only one of me and bessie is scum so scumreading me is enough to entirely clear bessie.


Remind me to come back to this comment if I'm alive D3.

jimbob wrote:@LaserGuy - Why do you think this?


See my comments to EGW related to Gamma.

jimbob wrote:@LaserGuy: Why didn't you ask either Zyth or EGW about their reasons for the naked vote?


I didn't find it interesting or notable at the time. Just commenting on the things I do find interesting is enough for me to spam the thread more than I really ought to.

bessie wrote:Re: lynching lurkers. Perhaps it would be better to try to figure out a way to keep LaserGuy around for a while so he can clear out some of the lurkers for us and we don’t have to waste a lynch?


This is a good idea, but sadly I can't really help out here.

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Mon Sep 25, 2017 6:56 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:
Gamma Emerald wrote:Oh now you've done it. I didn't behave anywhere near this in either of my scumgames with you, while I reacted this way in The Thing Mafia quite a bit, so your meta on me is faulty as fuck, if you're not lying out of your ass. If you are town and you don't correct course I'm going to ream you.And honestly I'm getting kinda turned off of this group of people in general if they are such numbskulls at realizing what is and isn't a scum-motivated wagon. I'd use the "post here and get banned" thing but I want to still be able to comment on xkcd pages if I care to.


You misunderstand me. I was talking about 'forcing' your posts, not insults/yelling. I'm talking about the thing you did in Family Mafia, which seemed faked. Also I did say I don't remember much about Thing Mafia.

What thing I did? The null-read accusation? I think that was a different issue you had there. As for The Thing Mafia, I took the effort to look at it so you should have too.
And yeah I'm pretty much fucking done with these people. There's less than a day left and no one is showing inclination to reconsider anything.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:02 am UTC

How is your play here similar to your play in Thing Mafia?

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:05 am UTC

On Day 3 I reacted similarly to getting wagoned. Compare it to either of my scumgames with you, and you'll note I don't have the same reaction as scum. That's because I don't see any reason to get mad. In Family Mafia I fucked up and in Penguin Mafia Redux it was a planned bus.

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Evil George Washington
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Evil George Washington » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:07 am UTC

Yet what were you doing on D1 and D2 of Thing Mafia?

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Gamma Emerald
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby Gamma Emerald » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:10 am UTC

Evil George Washington wrote:Yet what were you doing on D1 and D2 of Thing Mafia?

I was not getting wagoned. I'm telling you to look at my behavior when getting wagoned specifically.

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plytho
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:11 am UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
plytho wrote:@LaserGuy: you said at some point that you thought maybe your two scum team theory was wrong. What’s your feeling now. One team or two teams? You have six scum reads that you believe in quite strongly. How do they fit into one team/ two teams?


Mmm.... I've been going back and forth all day. As I noted earlier today, I really liked Spak's jets vs. sharks comment and have been playing a bit around with how two different teams might sort based on that schema. If I survive into the night, I may try to figure out a way to map out the interactions and see if I can see anything interesting. My comment about there only being one scumteam was made in reference to the fact that I saw a bunch of players all suddenly start wagoning in the same direction completely unprompted. Very different from how the D1 wagon went down.

What's your feeling on this? Originally you were leaning more toward one team I think? Are you feeling two is more likely now?
I haven't really looked into spaks jets and sharks theory and won't have the time for it today. I've been assuming one scum team and my reads should be seen in that context (hence the emphasis on the moody wagon). I'm not dismissing the two scum team theory. I think it's possible but I haven't seen any strong indicators.
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LaserGuy
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby LaserGuy » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:27 am UTC

@Gamma, please answer my questions here

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plytho
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Re: Crossover Mafia | D2 | 9/25

Postby plytho » Mon Sep 25, 2017 7:31 am UTC

Can someone refresh me on the amrock wagon plan?
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