Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (N5)

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Mark_Cangila
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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 18, 2018 3:09 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
Sabrar wrote:re Mark's retraction: I gave scum a pass before because they retracted their points after I challenged them (Pen Pal). This does not indicate townieness (but not necessarily scum either).
The odd thing is that I wasn't even really challenging Mark. Just asking for clarification. But he responded as though he was being challenged.

Vote:MasterOfAll

That's pretty typical from me imo.

plytho wrote:Wam vs Mark:
Wam seems to have caught mark slipping? It looks like a nice catch. Mark is definitely both saying scummy things and misunderstanding what wam is saying about those things.
Without a doubt this could come from scum!Mark. The question is, could this come from town!Mark?
I think it could? But it would require a thorough misunderstanding of what happened in alien warfare.
@Mark: why was the wincon stuff bad in alien warfare? Please be detailed in your explanation.

It caused confusion that was unnecessary imo. While it may have caught wam that was pretty lucky and I don't think it should be reported. It could have easily caused a mislynch.

Also, I know see no issue in the wincon thing now. I understand it was being used for setup spec.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:26 pm UTC

I think it is pretty typical for me to act as if challenged. It's in my playstyle to act quite defensive when attacked. I showed it when the werewolf question came up in Meta Mafia.

I didn't even realize it had been so effective because I was scum, so I had bad memories of it. Also, I would argue that freezeblade's counterclaim is what killed me in Alien.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 18, 2018 4:57 pm UTC

plytho wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:I think it is pretty typical for me to act as if challenged. It's in my playstyle to act quite defensive when attacked. I showed it when the werewolf question came up in Meta Mafia.
My point is that you're acting defensive even though you're not being attacked. I was just asking for you to explain your view.

Attacked was likely bad wording. Mainly when people ask questions I always play to keep myself not-lynched as one of my higher priorities.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:52 pm UTC

SuicideJunkie wrote:mark: Seems to expect spacebattles competence in my first game; excuse for disliking me. Gotta agree with him that his reads list was very disappointing. I'm not able to follow the daychat => scum!sj thing. The potential of me being a sockpuppet of the mafia means I'm not?
Huge quotes, itty-bitty replies. Too defensive in the last half of the thread to even consider scumhunting, which is understandable.
Most Sketchy. Votable

I really don't see where I have demanded "spacebattles competence" from you. I have done no such thing.
MasterOfAll wrote:Yay, I'm winning! (note: this is sarcasm)

Sabrar wrote:I'm totally okay with you posting fluff, I had issues with you posting nothing but. And this should have been clear to you, you failed to address why you haven't been scum-hunting at all.
I honestly have no idea what you expected from me.


bessie wrote:
MasterOfAll wrote:Madge - I'm not going to go find it now, but there was 1 specific post she made that gave me strong town vibes
I would be interested in knowing which post you found townie. There are only eight so you should have time to find it before deadline.
It was this one.


I've been busy lately, and am not sure that I will be able to post again before deadline.

I don't like this post at all. What is meant by "I honestly have no idea what you expected from me?" It seems like an excuse for lurking and not hunting.

However, content wise I really find Wam as the scummiest. His supposed scum slip which doesn't make sense, and his weird early MoA vote.
Vote: Wam

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:12 pm UTC

plytho wrote:Mark, what do you think about Madge?

Also, did wam scum slip, or are you talking about the scum slip he accused you of? Because the latter does make sense. What's wrong with the early MoA vote?

I don't see anything off with Madge unless I'm missing it. I do mean the latter about the scum slip. It had 0 reasoning and was then supported past RVS.

SuicideJunkie wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:I really don't see where I have demanded "spacebattles competence" from you. I have done no such thing.
I might be over sensitive:
I don't trust SJ that much. They (what pronouns would you prefer?) may be inexperienced but they've read many mafia threads and probably know at least a bit. I personally don't think they are that clueless.

- SuicideJunkie should be aware that random voting has a long history on this forum and town/scum uses it equally (and some players don't use it all regardless of alignment). That train of thought is simply not applicable.

But you do seem to be assuming more from me than I have to give.

Well, the second quote isn't even mine. Also, the first quote isn't demanding competence, just explaining that I don't think you should be treated as completely incompetent.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sat Dec 22, 2018 2:29 am UTC

Well some of these results are interesting. The lack of NK is very interesting. I'm not surprised at Madge's flip. Nothing about her seemed that scummy.

The BF thing is super interesting. Why can't he vote? Also, what is the vote on Wam doing?

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sat Dec 22, 2018 3:47 pm UTC

I also had my power switched. I think it is more likely that there is a succesful doctor or RB then a scum withhold.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Dec 23, 2018 4:58 pm UTC

LaserGuy wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:However, content wise I really find Wam as the scummiest. His supposed scum slip which doesn't make sense, and his weird early MoA vote.
Vote: Wam

@Mark: Why do you think wam thinking something in your content was a scumslip would make him scummy? You said that you liked wam's early content. Why is his MoA vote suddenly scummy?



As I said, the list you are refering to was done at night, and is not indicative of my reads at any point.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Dec 23, 2018 5:00 pm UTC

Also, I didn't realize Mpolo had claimed. I'm really stupid. I'm probably getting NKed tonight

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Mon Dec 24, 2018 4:59 am UTC

mpolo wrote:I somehow missed that Mark had his power switched as well. I think I know who is target was, and suspect that he was trying to do something townie in that targeting (that is, he used the "townier" half of the two option power). I suppose that targeting would work theoretically work for scum as well, though, due to additional information that scum has. However, the townie interpretation seems likelier. That at least pushes Mark_Cangila over the midpoint to "neutral leaning town" for me.

Going to confirm this is true. Just if anyone wanted to know.
plytho wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:Also, I didn't realize Mpolo had claimed. I'm really stupid. I'm probably getting NKed tonight

You said you also had your power switched, so you did see mpolo's post. You're probably not getting NK'd tonight.

Different claim. The post you quoted was talking about claim as in Mpolo's role claim.
LaserGuy wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:
LaserGuy wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:However, content wise I really find Wam as the scummiest. His supposed scum slip which doesn't make sense, and his weird early MoA vote.
Vote: Wam

@Mark: Why do you think wam thinking something in your content was a scumslip would make him scummy? You said that you liked wam's early content. Why is his MoA vote suddenly scummy?



As I said, the list you are refering to was done at night, and is not indicative of my reads at any point.


The first question is not related to that list and you should answer it. Regardless, I feel that gut reads and impressions are actually still very useful information. wam voted MoA in his first post so I feel like that post probably would have kind of been a significant basis for this impression.

For the first question, he pointed out a scumslip which doesn't make sense, which I view as scummy. Also, in that list, I didn't actually pay attention to post content. As I have said, I did some sort of weird skimming, so my reads weren't based on that many things. The vote thing took effort to notice, effort I didn't put in at the time.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:42 am UTC

plytho wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:
plytho wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:Also, I didn't realize Mpolo had claimed. I'm really stupid. I'm probably getting NKed tonight

You said you also had your power switched, so you did see mpolo's post. You're probably not getting NK'd tonight.

Different claim. The post you quoted was talking about claim as in Mpolo's role claim.

I don't understand this. What do you mean by "different claim"?


I saw Mpolo's claim that their role was switched. I did not see their claim of what their PR is.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:43 am UTC

I personally support a Wam lynch. His role seems really odd to be in the same game as my new role.
Vote: Wam

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 25, 2018 4:37 pm UTC

Sabrar wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:I saw Mpolo's claim that their role was switched. I did not see their claim of what their PR is.
Those were in the same post.

No, not really. Result claim is different from power claim.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Dec 25, 2018 5:26 pm UTC

Yes

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Wed Dec 26, 2018 9:50 pm UTC

How do I link to a specific post on mobile?

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Wed Dec 26, 2018 9:56 pm UTC

I'm still not sure how to link specific posts. The posts were Mpolo's 9th (including confirmation, and 1 indexed) and Mpolo's 11th.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Dec 27, 2018 5:59 am UTC

plytho wrote:
Mark_Cangila wrote:Also, I didn't realize Mpolo had claimed. I'm really stupid. I'm probably getting NKed tonight
This is a post that refers what you said in response to mpolo's 9th post. So you did realize at that point that mpolo had claimed in his 9th. Why are you trying to make it seem like you think he only claimed in his 11th?

I'm on phone and links are bothersome, sorry. Will link tomorrow if needed. There's a white icon next to the name of the poster that links to that post. Right click and copy link to get it.

On the subject of mpolo claiming what might have been Mark's role and action: I don't think it's necessary. If Mark is under pressure to be lynched, let him claim. Mpolo can be the check.

I made that post in response to being told my mistake.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Dec 27, 2018 6:00 am UTC

Mpolo, are you ok with me claiming?

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Dec 27, 2018 4:38 pm UTC

Mpolo's claim is my old role. I am voting for wam due to general scuminess too.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:32 pm UTC

Back. I didn't protect Wam as the cop because I didn't trust him. I protected BoomFrog because my read of him had gotten better and I felt he could be useful in scum hunting.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Dec 28, 2018 7:33 pm UTC

Also, I did target BF.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Dec 28, 2018 8:46 pm UTC

I pretended to be confused over the mod announcement because I wanted to keep myself safe, not realizing that the role switch made it irrelevent.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D2)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Dec 28, 2018 9:41 pm UTC

Keep myself safe as in avoiding the kill that would result from a claim.

Also, I don't get BF's insistence for NL when he seemed to think Wam was scummy. If you find someone you think is scum, lynch them.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D3)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Jan 01, 2019 3:05 pm UTC

Last night I targeted MoA and Bessie. They are both aligned. Therefore, I feel like Bessie, MoA, and Sabrar are all town, unless 2 are mafia and 1 is indie. I targeted MoA and Bessie because I was at the very end of night and didn't know who to target.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D3)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Wed Jan 02, 2019 8:40 pm UTC

No coal for me.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D3)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sat Jan 05, 2019 6:09 am UTC

@Bessie, the reason I am townreading you is that, if Vicarin isn't lying, you, MoA, and Sabrar are a group of aligned players. Assuming a start with 8 town, which makes the most sense, I doubt we have randomly found all scum. Therefore I am inclined to believe that you three are town.

However, my town read of the {bessie, sabrar, MoA} block requires moody to be scum, or there to be a gf If moody is town those three are scum.
I'm also getting lost on a lot of the nitty gritty about GF versus no GF etc.

Assuming Vic is town and no GF:
It's far more likely that the {bessie, sabrar, MoA} block are all town compared to not town. Therefore, moody must be scum, because there would be 5 mistakes in the result. Me as town, MoA as town, and 3 other people as Not town. Therefore, in that case, I would say that {moody, LG, and SJ} are not town.

As of now, I'm going with such a situation, mainly as Mpolo and Vicarin have seemed pretty townie to me and I'm not really sure where to even start when it comes to a GF. As for original setup spec, I'm guessing either 8-2-2 or 8-2-1-1. 8-2-1-1 starting setup I feel is most likely as it also would explain SJs vote on LG and vice versa. For the time being I'm going to:
FOS: LG
Because it's too early in the day for someone at L-1.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D3)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sat Jan 05, 2019 3:43 pm UTC

Also, I'm also gonna FOS SJ and FOS Moody. I'm split between which of the three to vote for. I'm leaning toward LG or SJ.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:17 pm UTC

I received coal.

I am also thinking MoA might be a godfather, which adds up with both of moody's lists. I also XORed Bessie and Vicarin and found they are both aligned. Therefore, Bessie is town.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Jan 10, 2019 5:48 pm UTC

Here is my current town scum list, based on cop results.

Town:
Mark (XOR Cop)
Bessie (Cop)
Moody (unknown)
LG (Power Switcher)

Scum:
MoA (GF) (Messager I think)

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Thu Jan 10, 2019 7:48 pm UTC

How does the coal residue work? I don't get the point of it.
Also, MoA is a coal giver not message.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Jan 11, 2019 1:25 am UTC

I did target Vicarin and Bessie with XOR in order to make a block. Vicarin and Bessie are aligned. I think MoA is likely godfather, as he has been saying odd things through the game, going back to his vanilla claim on D1.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Fri Jan 11, 2019 4:53 pm UTC

I disagree. MoA has acted scummy all game. There is most likely a GF and he is most likely GF. We need to lynch him today. I know I'm town, and therefore moody's list must have issues. And the issue is a MoA GF.
Vote: MoA

@Bessie: I am town and have the town wincon.

I targeted Vicarin and Bessie because I was in a bit of a time crunch, and I wanted to ensure that I had found a townie block.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D4)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Mon Jan 14, 2019 2:25 pm UTC

We really need to lynch MoA in my opinion. As Bessie has stated, he didn't use his power to the full one day. He is clearly a GF. The chance of there not being a GF in a game like secret santa is so ridiculously low. Not only that, but 3 scum with 1 SK, and 2 mafia with 1 GF makes far more sense than 4 scum. What would the fourth scum be? Another mafia member? Another indie? Who knows? It makes so much more sense to lynch MoA.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (N5)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:25 pm UTC

Yeah, my entire plan was based on a moa mislynch.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (N5)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:05 am UTC

I had the game basically solved by the end of d3. I just didn't know bessie's role.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (N5)

Postby Mark_Cangila » Tue Jan 22, 2019 3:40 am UTC

I really need to get good at directing a mislynch. It's a super valuable skill to have.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (pregame)

Postby MasterOfAll » Thu Dec 13, 2018 3:03 pm UTC

Here.

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby MasterOfAll » Thu Dec 13, 2018 11:14 pm UTC

plytho wrote:Master of all, you used to play here, right?
Yes, many years ago. But I also replaced into the Newbie New Year game way back at the beginning of 2018, and lurked my way to a scum win by coasting on the 'town slip' of the player I replaced.

Apologies in advance if I become demotivated and end up lurking too much in this game; hopefully if that does happen, there will be someone left on the replacement list.

But, there is no reason to vote for me in this game, as I am a mere Vanilla townie (thanks, secret santa; but at least I smell good; who doesn't like the smell of Vanilla?).

Welcome to the game, SuicideJunkie. Here, I got you something nice . . .

Vote: SuicideJunkie

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby MasterOfAll » Fri Dec 14, 2018 3:22 pm UTC

@Sabrar: I'll get back to you later on the Vanilla claim.

By the way, I *do* really like the smell of vanilla. It might be my favorite scent overall.

@SuicideJunkie: Don't worry about my vote on you. I just didn't want you to feel left out of the random voting stage. But, as a new player, you should know that it is exceedingly unlikely that you will be lynched here on D1. That doesn't mean your D1 posts won't be scrutinized and possibly used to lynch you on later days, but just don't worry about being lynched this first day and have fun with the game.

@Everyone who is familiar with the mods: How do you think they went about setting up the game? Fixing up our role submissions a bit, deciding on town-scum-indy balance, then just randomly assigning each role and alignment? Or would they be more likely to manually select things?

Not that I think that setup speculation serves much purpose on D1, but I am curious about the process our mods were likely to have used, as that information might be useful mid and late game.

@LaserGuy: I am at least willing to consider your reasoning for a D1 mass claim. So, what are you thinking everyone should claim (Rolename and ability?) and why do that here on D1?

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Re: Secret Santa 2018: A Christmas Knight (D1)

Postby MasterOfAll » Fri Dec 14, 2018 11:32 pm UTC

Regarding claiming abilities, I don't think it is the worst idea, but my opinion is that it would be better to wait for later in the game for that. I don't like the idea of 'trying to break the game' as that seems a lot less fun than playing the game. And while scum know up to 3 of the roles of non-scum, it might be only 2 or even 1 or hilariously 0. And then they still have to try to figure out which of us has *that* role they submitted in order to target us, and I really doubt that the flavor is going to help them with that (much more likely the things we say would).

Although the point about last year's scum!bessie having strongest powers and thus would have stood out for not being NK'd is interesting, I think there is a better chance that the strongest powers ended up with town (since we outnumber them) and then the mass claim just helps scum to identify targets. This, of course, assumes that we could even agree on what abilities scum would be most scared of, which isn't a discussion I would expect us to ever have until endgame because who wants to help scum not only by knowing all the abilities, but also the ramifications of how they interact and thus who is most dangerous. tl;dr: I still think scum benefits more than town from an early mass claim.

But, as a way to give people something to talk about, congrats to LaserGuy on bringing up a mass roleclaim and then even making town/scum reads from it.


Regarding my vanilla claim, of course it's a fake claim. I did not do it for any particular purpose, but rather, I just thought it would be amusing to claim to be vanilla when we clearly all got some sort of ability gifted to us, because, you know, that's how Secret Santa works.

Still, maybe others will be able to find something useful in the responses to my claim, so I wasn't quite ready to retract my claim earlier. But, I wouldn't want it to be a distraction, so . . . yeah, it was a big, fat lie.

In fact, my role is amazing. I am super excited to make use of these interesting and incredibly powerful abilities, and scum should definitely leave me alone at night because I would be very sad if I got knocked out of this game early.


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