Dune Game Over! Atreides/Fremen Victory!

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Dark Loink » Tue Nov 02, 2010 1:58 pm UTC

The points brought up currently are interesting. It seems a lot more like a conflicting factions thing, not quite scum/town. Mainly because even if you agree with one faction, you also agree with another. I don't have any idea how cops would work in that respect. The problem is the fact that I'm not sure if good transalates to town. I would expect so, however, the protagonists to be in the spot of town.
As well, there are two factions you think are maybe scum. All memebers of which have their own alligences, and want to win in a different way...
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mpolo » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:41 pm UTC

O.K., I'm here and have at least read what has been posted. I am going to catch up on some work that piled up in the last three days, and come back to this.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby greenlover » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:43 pm UTC

Mavketl wrote:Also, at my list of goodies/baddies: I gave it some more thought (what do you mean, I could've done that before posting?) and I figure that the general factions might still be right, but there are probably going to be individual members who are good in a 'scummy' faction, or bad in a 'townie' faction, et cetera.

So, in other words, we really cannot generalize the different groups in this game as either towny or scummy. Though the Baron is probably scum, other members of House Harkonnen may have towny bents, and, though the Duke is probably towny, some of his house (the doctor, maybe?) may very well have summy bents. Thus, who the scum/town are is going to be more determined on a individual level rather than a house/group level. From that, I think we can deduce several things:

1) There might not be a "scum" group, but instead several SK (or assassin? I am not sure about the right word) type roles: a few players who what to kill off a few specific roles, and everyone else just trying to survive until the shooting stops/fulfill their own private winning conditions.
2) This might be more of a FFA rather than a Town v Scum game: every individual player wants to fulfill their own winning conditions, and it is going to be a lot of chaos and NKing until someone (a house/group, probably) rises to the top and wins.
3) This could simply be a average, everyday Town v Scum game: some folks have nasty powers and have two scummy winning conditions, and the rest of us are minor power roles/totally vanilla with two towny winning conditions.
4) There could be multiple scum factions (Empire v Baron? I think that happened in the book) and the town is kinda stuck in the middle.

Among those possible setups I think that either 2 or 4 is what is going on. Though, not sure, I might have missed a few possible setups (kinda rushed at the moment. Stupid life.).

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Adacore » Tue Nov 02, 2010 2:52 pm UTC

Also, it occurs to me we should get this out of the way early: is there any individual or faction in the flavour that has any kind of recruitment ability? If there's the possibility of a cult, we want to know about it now, rather than the standard theme-game thing of not realising it exists until about Day 4...

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby b.i.o » Tue Nov 02, 2010 3:35 pm UTC

I'm basing this off of Mavketl's rolespec, since I'm too tired to think of other things right now...
Mavketl wrote:CHOAM - trade organisation, probably independent (they're not exactly evil but they can be total jack-asses)

Agree on independent, they probably don't have any specific characters, since all of the great houses/the emperor are part of CHOAM, and there are plenty of important characters to go around.

House Harkonnen - scumsters. Baron Vladimir Harkonnen ('godfather/don'), Piter de Vries (mentat - sort of a human computer but different), and likely another Harkonnen dude such as Feyd-Rautha.

Agreed on scum. The other possible addition here is Raban.

House Corrino / Empire - this house occupies the throne. Shaddam Corrino IV is the emperor. The Sardaukar are his (ruthless) soldiers. He has a bunch of daughters that might be included, Princess Irulan being the most important one.

Shaddam and any Sardaukar are likely to be scum (or at least scum-leaning). Princess Irulan is likely to be not scum-leaning (and is the only member of the house for which this is really the case). Count Fenring is the other possible addition here.

House Atreides - Leto Atreides (the duke - he might be dead, but from the flavour he seems to be there), Lady Jessica, Paul Atreides, Duncan Idaho (swordmaster), Gurney Halleck (musician/warrior), Dr. Yueh (he betrays them early in book one, though, so beware of Yueh - still not a bad guy), Thufir Hawat (mentat and assassin).

I'm inclined to believe Leto's dead. If Yueh's still alive, he's probably at the point where he's trying to assassinate the Baron.

Lady Jessica is Leto's loving partner, but also a part of the Bene Gesserit.

But she, importantly, leans Atreides. That is, given the choice, she will choose Atreides over Bene Gesserit (at least from the book).

Lastly, there's the Fremen.

Yep, and there are plenty of important Fremen that might be here, too. Kynes, if he hasn't died already (can't remember if he has from the flavor), Chani, and Stilgar are all characters I'd expect to see. Other possibles: Otheym, Reverend Mother Ramallo, Shadout Mapes, other fedaykin.

Definitely good: All Atreides except for Yueh. The Fremen.
Probably good: Bene Gesserit
Probably independent: CHOAM.
Could go either way, but probably bad: House Corrino
Definitely bad: Harkonnen

I'd say that the Bene Gesserit are more likely to be aligned (as an organization) with House Corrino given that we're in original Dune flavor. Jessica is not, but she's pretty much alone. The other major possible Bene Gesserit character is the Emperor's Truthsayer: Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam. And if there were to be a third, it'd probably be Lady Margot Fenring, who's also mostly Corrino-aligned.

There are two other possible factions: the smugglers, and the Spacing Guild. The smugglers are likely to lean good but not get alone well with the Fremen. The Spacing Guild is likely to be independent, I think.

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby b.i.o » Tue Nov 02, 2010 3:40 pm UTC

And here's a possible role-list. I may have missed one or two things, but I think this is likely to hit all of the possible main roles from the first book, at least. (Also, while I'm thinking of it, at least one of the movie adaptions of Dune is fairly accurate to the story (although it doesn't have all of the details, obviously), and that'll be a lot quicker than reading the book if you want to get *some* of the flavor. I can't remember which one it is, though...there've been several. Also, you should read the book.)

So that gives us these possible roles: (possible secondary alignments in parenthesis)

House Harkonen:
-Baron Harkonen (choam?)
-Piter (independent, dies early)
-Feyd-Rautha
-Raban

House Corrino
-Shaddam (choam?)
-Count Fenring
-Saurdaukar (?)
-Irulan (atreides)

House Atreides
-Leto Atreides (choam? dies too early to be fremen)
-Jessica (bene gesserit, fremen)
-Paul/Kwisatz Haderach (fremen)
-Duncan Idaho (fremen, but dies early)
-Gurney Halleck (fremen/smugglers)
-Yueh (independent, or I guess maybe harkonnen, dies early)
-Thufir Hawat (harkonnen, but not really)
-Alia (fremen; forgot her in my previous post. thank you wikipedia character list.)

Fremen
-Liet-Kynes (atreides)
-Chani (atreides)
-Stilgar (atreides)
-Otheym (atreides) (?)
-Generic Fedaykin (atreides) (?)
-Reverend Mother Ramallo (?)
-Shadout Mapes (atreides) (?)
-Harah (atreides) (?)

Bene Gesserit
-Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam (corrino)
-Lady Margot Fenring (corrino) (?)

Spacing Guild:
-Spacing Guild Representative (?)
-Spacing Guild Navigator

Smugglers:
-Esmar Tuek (atreides) (?)

That's 29 total, of which 3 are 'generic' non-named roles, and some (Leto/Kynes/Yueh/Piter) all die very soon from the flavor. The roles I think are less likely to exist are marked with a (?).

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby b.i.o » Tue Nov 02, 2010 3:42 pm UTC

(More actual analysis of what this data-dump *means* will come later...)

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby BigNose » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:04 pm UTC

I'm not sure how we are menat to achieve 2 win conditions except by luck.

If I am in Faction A, then I have a win condition of Faction B and a win condition with Faction B (for example).
Faction A has win objectives C & D.
Faction B has win objectives D & E
So only achieving win condition D will give those with 2 win conditions a full win.

While I (in Faction A) would know what my win condition is, I don't have a clue as to who is in Faction B, or indeed their win condition.

Therefore worrying about achieving 2 wins is going to be about luck than judgement, unless/until we get people claiming.

Given the unusual flavour, do we have any form of Cult/Recruitment?
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Mavketl » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:11 pm UTC

It's possible that some players got information about others along with their roles. For an example, there could be an assassin-like "protect player X" element in the game. Furthermore, I expect that there are masonlike roles. If we'd have a Leto Atreides and a Lady Jessica, chances are that they get to talk to each other, for example. Lastly, there might be people with coplike abilities (or listeners, or whatever), which would gain them additional information.

Also I really don't get your example. Why would your two win conditions have to be in conflict with each other?
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Adacore » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:18 pm UTC

I agree with Mavketl - I was assuming most players have one 'generic' win condition ('faction X wins the game'), and one 'specific' win condition (for example, 'player A survives', or 'lynch player B'). I guess we'll find out more after someone dies and we get a role revealed.

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby greenlover » Tue Nov 02, 2010 4:28 pm UTC

Adacore wrote:I agree with Mavketl - I was assuming most players have one 'generic' win condition ('faction X wins the game'), and one 'specific' win condition (for example, 'player A survives', or 'lynch player B'). I guess we'll find out more after someone dies and we get a role revealed.

Speaking of which. . .

What will be revealed about a player's role when they die?

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby weiyaoli » Tue Nov 02, 2010 5:44 pm UTC

I'll say now that all most of the flavour I know is from wiki, so probably not going to be great deal from me role-spec wise.

If there is a cult, I think it would fit with the warning:

VectorZero wrote:All players have two allegiences, and thus two win conditions.

Be wary of roleclaiming.



But I also think perhaps another reason to be wary of role claiming would be for certain players to have specific win conditions based on killing people.

Still I think cult is still most likely, though I doubt the mod will confirm anything since this is a closed set-up.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mister k » Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:30 pm UTC

If there is a cult who would it be though? Not ruling it out, but it doesn't seem like it fits flavour too much to me. I guess the standard play when you don't know it cult exists is assume it may, so be prepared to trust confirmed town less after each day is through.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Not A Raptor » Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:43 pm UTC

mister k wrote:If there is a cult who would it be though? Not ruling it out, but it doesn't seem like it fits flavour too much to me. I guess the standard play when you don't know it cult exists is assume it may, so be prepared to trust confirmed town less after each day is through.

If there's a cult, the only person in the original book who came close to being a cult leader was Paul Atreides. However, he didn't want it at first, and he used it to smack the Baron and Emperor around. Given that, either there's no cult, or we don't need to worry about its existence (strangely).
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Brooklynxman » Tue Nov 02, 2010 6:56 pm UTC

I sincerely doubt there is a cult. Nar's example is.....extreme. Yes Paul converted the Fremen to his side, but

A. They were already mostly on his side, all their enemies were in common to start, and the Atreides and Fremen had been getting along.
B. He didn't really convert them, they stayed who they were, he became one of them (in essence, the exact opposite of a normal cult). Yes he became their leader but....still not the same.

I could potentially see Paul leading a recruiting mason group of scattered Atreides and Fremen but that seems to powerful to me. Hmmmmm
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mpolo » Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:48 pm UTC

And I thought that I was pretty versed in the flavor here… I'm finding that I really need to re-read Dune here soon. (And I have a good excuse, since the English class I'm teaching is supposed to have a Sci-Fi/Fantasy chapter, so that I'm going to be having someone read this out of the class, most likely.)

The general suspicions are generally good (special thanks to b.i.o for the list of characters, a huge number of whom I had forgotten). I agree with Adacore's idea about the win conditions.

Cult seems hard to fit in from flavor (at least what I can remember), but after the 3 days of unchecked growth in Buffy, I'd like to be sure about this.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby ameretrifle » Tue Nov 02, 2010 7:59 pm UTC

Yeah, I'm only about halfway through the book, but I don't see much cult potential. Mind control, however... ;)

I suspect everyone started out with two win conditions, probably not mutually exclusive. Whether those could shift over the course of the game, who can say. The "0, 1, or 2 wins" confirms that it must be possible to fufill both conditions. I'm thinking things like player-seekers or lynchers or X number of players must survive and so forth, combined with a house or tribe alliegance.

Is Harkonnen likely our mafia? If we do have a proper mafia; it's hard to tell with all these factions. Any of which could have a kill. There's plenty of death in this book. A lot of poison, too. Hmm...

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Dr Ug » Tue Nov 02, 2010 10:17 pm UTC

So, some rolespec.

Three houses:

Harkonnen
Ordos
Atreides

Each will have a "player", and possibly a "mentat" (who will probably ask for you to identify the armour level of a building before you can start day 2). I'd say the "Player" is effectively the godfather, and may have a few "units" under them to order around and such.

I think instead of town vs scum, it will be houses vs house vs house, with a few extras.

The Sardoukar will side with the Ordos, (for no apparent reason they've abandonned their support of Harkonnen in favour of this new, thus far unheard of, house).

Around day 7, each of the houses will get a new member or "Unique Unit". The Harkonnen get a devastator tank (jesterbomb). The Atreides get the Sonic Tank (not sure what this would do - maybe roleblock? maybe vig kill?). The Ordos get the Deviator (I think this would recruit players to Ordos, but only for one day).

There's also the other unique things like the death hand, ordos raider and fremen, but not sure if they'll be in or not.[/silliness]

So, the book is one of those on my list of "I really should have read this already", and has been for over a decade. I really should get around to that...

I'm not sure if it's just the game that's making me think this, but I always thought the houses were less "Bad / Good", and more various factions fighting over the spice / the empire. From the sounds of Mav's posts however, it seems that in the book Harkonnen really were "bad", and Atreides "good".
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Krong » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:29 pm UTC

Much silliness, Dr Ug. For one who's played the game, you really should read the book :P

Though it's been a few years, I really don't remember anything culty from the books, either, though as has been discussed around Paul / Muad'Dib, there might be some sort of pseudo town-recruit. I could see, for instance, Fremen trying to find him, at which point they might join him as masons.

The real reason there's a warning against massclaiming, I'd imagine, is that most of the players who'd normally want to massclaim (confirmed townies like Paul, Lady Jessica, etc.) are probably specific kill targets for other factions. Paul is a gimme Harkonnen target, and if there are other Bene Gesserit than Lady Jessica, they might be upset with what she's doing with her life.

Adacore wanted to know about the sandworms and thought they seemed dangerous. Well, very much both yes and no. Please consider reading the book before reading the following spoiler, as I thought it was the most surprising / interesting element of the story:
Spoiler:
Apologies if I'm not specific enough with any of this; it's mostly memory + Wikipedia:

The sandworms, or Makers, are incredibly powerful wild creatures that more or less take atomics (nuclear weapons) to kill. However, due to odd elements of their lifecycle, they are the source of the spice that makes Arrakis so valuable. The outsiders tend to travel over the sands by "thopter" when scouting for spice, because to do otherwise would be too dangerous.

Fremen treat the Makers with a great deal of respect, and have managed to develop techniques to avoid them while crossing the desert. They've also developed the more dangerous technique of hitching hooks into the worms and riding them through the sands.

In terms of game mechanics, if we have sandworms, they could very likely kill anyone who becomes closely involved with them. However, I don't think any faction would really want to see them gone.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Dr Ug » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:37 pm UTC

I would think sandworms are probably not in the game:
VectorZero wrote:And so it was that the harsh winds of Arrakis told of a new game, for those who were human and could sense it.
I read this as all the players are human.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Brooklynxman » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:41 pm UTC

The Harkonnens are Nazi like (Herbert himself even said that). The Corinos are only concerned with power. And the Atreides are generally good, but they fall into several unavoidable political traps and are occasionally forced into an ends justify the means scenario.

The Bene Gesserit (if in game) will probably be most concerned with keeping certain players alive.
The Guild would be concerned with the spice and I am not sure how that translates into the game.
Fremen are concerned with Arrakis and only arrakis but I see them siding with the Atreides.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Krong » Tue Nov 02, 2010 11:46 pm UTC

Dr Ug wrote:I would think sandworms are probably not in the game:
VectorZero wrote:And so it was that the harsh winds of Arrakis told of a new game, for those who were human and could sense it.
I read this as all the players are human.

I meant that they might be present as a game mechanic, not really as players. I can't see us stretching the flavor to the point that lynching a sandworm is reasonable.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Brooklynxman » Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:31 am UTC

Krong wrote:
Dr Ug wrote:I would think sandworms are probably not in the game:
VectorZero wrote:And so it was that the harsh winds of Arrakis told of a new game, for those who were human and could sense it.
I read this as all the players are human.

I meant that they might be present as a game mechanic, not really as players. I can't see us stretching the flavor to the point that lynching a sandworm is reasonable.


Drowning then? These are pre-leto II worms after all.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Brooklynxman » Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:32 am UTC

Oh, and just in case they are a mechanic....

Walks without rythem
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Flying_Cookie » Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:09 am UTC

I suspect the roles would be something like
You are Chani, flavor goes here.
You win with the fremen
You want to become/are Paul's lover.

You are Paul, flavor goes here.
You want to become emperor (by say, killing the emperor or winning or something)
You win with House Atreides

Or something like that, for each character.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Mavketl » Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:37 am UTC

I've been (re)reading the first 1/3 of the book today, and I have some comments on rolespec:
b.i.o wrote:Bene Gesserit
-Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam (corrino)
-Lady Margot Fenring (corrino) (?)
b.i.o wrote:The other major possible Bene Gesserit character is the Emperor's Truthsayer: Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam. And if there were to be a third, it'd probably be Lady Margot Fenring, who's also mostly Corrino-aligned.
Both Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam and Lady Margot Fenring seem plenty pro-Paul Atreides in the book. The RM visits Paul at the very start, and gives him hints and advice about what's to come. Lady Margot Fenring sends Lady Jessica a message to warn her about plots concerning Leto's murder. Therefore, I think it's rather unlikely that they are cast as scum roles in this game.


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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Silknor » Wed Nov 03, 2010 3:41 am UTC

Here's my thoughts on rolespec. I'm going to assume for this post a very strict following of the book, simply because that's in my view the best starting point, better than saying good is town and bad is mafia.

Major plot spoilers probably apply, both in Dune and subsequent books.

Both Reverend Mother Gaius Helen Mohiam and Lady Margot Fenring seem plenty pro-Paul Atreides in the book.


I disagree on Mohiam. She only wants to use Paul to achieve BG (Bene Gesserit) goals, not help him in any meaningful way. I can't imagine she'd approve of Paul becoming the KH (Kwisatz Haderach) in the desert with the Fremen. Fenring while certainly pro-Jessica, doesn't have any connection to Paul. What reason does she have to help Paul reject BG ways? She's a BG, and the only BG that betrays them in the book is Jessica, I think she'd want the same total control of the KH that Mohiam does. BG are also opposed to Alia, the Abomination, who seems likely to be closer to Paul than anyone outside his family.

The Harkonnens are Nazi like (Herbert himself even said that). The Corinos are only concerned with power. And the Atreides are generally good, but they fall into several unavoidable political traps and are occasionally forced into an ends justify the means scenario.

The Bene Gesserit (if in game) will probably be most concerned with keeping certain players alive.
The Guild would be concerned with the spice and I am not sure how that translates into the game.
Fremen are concerned with Arrakis and only arrakis but I see them siding with the Atreides.


Fremen have reason to side with Paul because of his idea of ecological transformation, and nominally Jessica, but little reason to side with other Atreides.
Guild are opposed to Fremen's ecological transformation, it would restrict the flow of spice. Also opposed to Paul, he has too much leverage over them due to his control of spice. Keep in mind guild illegally aid Corrino and Harkonnen by bringing troops to Dune.

BG wants control of KH and spice. What else matters to them? They're not a benevolent group of doctors. I guess they might want Irulan to ascend to the throne, but not as a figurehead to Paul, she was groomed for it after all.

I don't see anything that points to clear existence of a cult: BG and Fremen would be the two possibilities, but neither does any forced recruitment in the book. BG have voice yes, but it's short-term (eg. immediate, not long-term mind control) and they don't use it to convert people. What about Paul? Paul is deeply uncomfortable with the figure of godhood imprinted upon him. He doesn't seem like a cult leader to me.

Rolelist (working without reviewing other peoples, second alignment in parentheses):
Atreides:
Paul (Fremen, Blue within Blue eyes [BBE], Mentat, Swordmaster)
Jessica (Fremen, BBE, Bene Gesserit [BG])
Duke Leto (CHOAM)
Gurney Halleck (Swordmaster, Smuggler)
Thufir Hawat (Mentat)
Duncan Idaho (Swordmaster, Fremen)
Alia (BBE, Fremen)
Baby Leto (Fremen, BBE)
Yeuh (Harkonnen)
BG:
Irulan (Corrino, BBE-maybe)
Mohain (Corrino [as Emperor's Truthsayer], BBE)
The Desert Reverend Mother (can't remember her name, gives Water of Life to Jessica/Alia, BBE, Fremen)
Fenring (BBE, Corrino-wife of Count Fenring)
Jessica (Fremen, BBE, Atreides)

Harkonnen:
Baron (CHOAM)
Abulard
Feyd-Rautha
Peter de Vries (Mentat)
Beast Rabban (CHOAM)
Yeuh (Atreides)

Corrino:
Shaddam (CHOAM)
Count Fenring
Irulan (BG, BBE-maybe)
Sardaukar (Swordmaster)

Guild:
Guildsmen I guess? (BBE)

CHOAM:
Shaddam (Corrino)
Duke Leto (Atreides)
Baron (Hark)
Beast Rabban (Hark)

Fremen (all BBE):
See Atredies+
Stilgar
Chani (Atreides-maybe)
Liet Kynes
Harah (Atreides-maybe)
Jamis (Swordmaster-maybe)

There's probably more but I think that should be most of the major characters.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby BigNose » Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:42 pm UTC

Is it too early to start scum-hunting, or do we need 2 more pages of roles-spec analysis before the 'serious' stuff starts? :?
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mister k » Wed Nov 03, 2010 12:51 pm UTC

well the point of spec is not really to elucidate on whats happening in the game, although of course its help, its to prompt people to talk and thus potentially give scum tells. By all means, if you have sensed scuminess, announce it to the world!

I'll have a more substantial post some time tomorrow.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Adacore » Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:25 pm UTC

Yeah - the thing with closed set up games is that there isn't anything to talk about on Day 1. In theme games this is alleviated by having the ability to speculate - the speculation, and the resultant conversation, provide material for analysis so that we can start properly hunting scum. It prevents the 'dead game' syndrome seen in the first few days of large vanilla games.

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Mavketl » Wed Nov 03, 2010 1:29 pm UTC

BigNose: feel free to start scumhunting!

It's not like we need separate phases for spec and scumhunting, and along the lines of "talking is always good", there doesn't seem to be any disadvantage to people discussing everything they know about possible roles and mechanics and whatever. That doesn't mean you have to wait for them to be done to voice any suspicions you might have. :)
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby BigNose » Wed Nov 03, 2010 3:05 pm UTC

Mavketl wrote:BigNose: feel free to start scumhunting!

And my first suspicion is centred on you :D .
Oh alright, it's only a joke.

Here is where I stand and I think it is worth everyone declaring in some manner, their knowledge of DUNE:

I have read DUNE many years ago and haven't read it for a while.
I have played Dune and Dune II and a number of its successors, but it's not the same thing.
From the posts so far, they have reminded me of various specifics:
Fremen
Atriedes
Harkunnen
Sand worms
Beyond that, my knowledge of the flavour disappears, except a trivia about the Fremen, who wear waterproof suits and recycling units, to minimise the loss of water and riding the worms is done by hooking open an interlocking plate on their body, so that they cannot 'dive' without causing self-harm.

And with that note, if there is a SandWorm in the game, don't be surprised if it is a Jester.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Not A Raptor » Wed Nov 03, 2010 4:09 pm UTC

Mav: Getting itchy for a lynch target?
Van wrote:I like simple games.

Like Wizardry.

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Mavketl » Wed Nov 03, 2010 4:22 pm UTC

Not A Raptor wrote:Mav: Getting itchy for a lynch target?
If one presents itself... why not?

But eh, I was merely responding to BigNose's "Can we start scumhunting already?" sentiment. If you see any scum to hunt, go ahead. In the mean time, nothing wrong with rolespec.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mister k » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:07 pm UTC

ok, some thoughts. If theres all these conflicting factions/alignments, how does it affect our play? We're still gonna root for the harkonenns, right? They seem pretty bad to me in flavour terms, and we can pursue our super secret other objectives on our own. But we should basically act like this is normal mafia, possibly doing our best to avoid claiming until either we're close to being killed, or until near the end of the game once we get a handle on how all this meshes together.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mpolo » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:15 pm UTC

I think that that is the essential strategy here. I suspect that that's the one "goal" that everyone will agree with (except for the Harkonnens) -- get rid of the Harkonnens. If I see Sting around, I will point him out for lynching…
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Brooklynxman » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:43 pm UTC

mister k wrote:We're still gonna root for the harkonenns, right?


No, we might root them out, but certainly I will not *foot stamp* root for any harkonnens.
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby mister k » Wed Nov 03, 2010 8:55 pm UTC

Brooklynxman wrote:
mister k wrote:We're still gonna root for the harkonenns, right?


No, we might root them out, but certainly I will not *foot stamp* root for any harkonnens.


interesting language quibble there. I wonder why rooting for someone is supporting them, while rooting them out is not...
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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby ameretrifle » Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:09 pm UTC

They come from different words. "Root for" probably comes from an Old English word for bellowing. "Root out" comes from a more familiar farming/gardening idiom, to pull out the roots of.

English. Craaaazy bitch of a language. :)

Anyway, I don't wholly like any of the factions in this game, but the Harkonnens are pretty stereotypically evil and most likely to be mafia (if we have one). Also, I remember VZ saying that the first half of the book would suffice as background, and the flavor so far seems to support that, so to the really knowledgable, I'd be wary about including too much stuff from beyond this timeframe.

Still trying to figure out where to go from here... should probably reread the flavor. And finish the book. >_>

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Re: Dune D1: Don't be shocked by the tone of my voice

Postby Lataro » Wed Nov 03, 2010 9:15 pm UTC

Since I don't really know any flavor here, I'll provide a different kind of content.

Vote: Mavketl

You know why. :twisted:

Anyway, discussion seems to be brewing down to suggest that this is kinda like death note, with a ton of factions and stuff. It's not my favorite cup of tea, but it should be interesting.
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