xkcd

by **Gopher of Pern** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:50 am UTC

Ninja'd by the above.

It is the most fitting explanation, but knowing what happened last game, I'm not ruling out the fact it could be the other way around. Or could even be a complete red herring.

by **Gopher of Pern** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 1:51 am UTC

EBWOP, because of page topper:

cjdrum wrote:
Silknor wrote:Our abridged story begins 3 hours ago, when Brady, the hibernating bear who moonlighted as President of the Castle Camelot Zoo, was found murdered. No one felt much sadness at this, after all, he was kind of a jerk, never providing any real leadership, just sleeping and taxing. So there would be no investigation into his death. But his death did cause a power vacuum, and two sides quickly emerged: the advocates of a vigorous democracy, and the vanguard of the aristocracy. This is the story of their fight.

The Town is more likely to be democracy, right? I agree with GoP, really.

by **mpolo** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 7:05 am UTC

I managed to blithely skip through that without making the connection, but you are probably right there. This still doesn't give us a clear pattern of which animals might be scum -- it could be that native English fauna are queenlovers, it could be that "regal" animals, like the lion, the kingfisher and the monarch butterfly are our baddies. Just the image of a Monarch Butterfly sneaking in to kill people in the night is too good not to be true…

This does raise a certain level of suspicion against FAOT -- he's obsessed with preserving the Queen's English (meter! truck! French Fries!!!), which could well be a pastime of the aristocracy. I suppose he could also be some sort of unwitting professor type who doesn't even know that we have a government here in Camelot Zoo, though.

by **VectorZero** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:08 am UTC

Also King Parrots...

But chiefly the Emperor Penguin was the big bad of the last game, so maybe it's just a shout out. Or not.

Hell, if we don't come up with something better "FAOT for speaking British English" is probably not the worst reason we've ever had for a D1 lynch...

by **Silknor** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:26 pm UTC

Votals: None

72 hours remain in Day 1. 7 to lynch.

by **ForAllOfThis** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:35 pm UTC

Well my Britishness is linked to my book and not my animal. I think it's safe to claim and should hopefully clear up some of this wine, the book I chose was An Idiot Abroad: The Travel Diaries of Karl Pilkington. Karl pilkington is described by Ricky Gervais as "A typical little Englander". He goes around the world complaining about different cultures and gets confused at foreign concepts, it's hilarious. They released a book of his travel diaries after the show was released (which I own), which is why I have to speak with British spelling and moan/correct foreignisms.

by **mpolo** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:29 pm UTC

O.K. That doesn't sound particularly monarchist, but it is still a slight link, I suppose. Our alignments could very well come from our books, by the way… Though if you thought yours came from the book (and were scum), you wouldn't have claimed, presumably.

by **Chandani** » Thu Mar 10, 2011 10:52 pm UTC

Thanks for that clarification, FAOT. Wine is a dangerous thing, causing too much confusion in the world by its existence. I applaud you for attempting to clear things up.

Since he gave us the full title and everything, it's pretty easy to go and check to make sure he's not lying (which he isn't, by the way). If anyone wanted to claim a link to anything, it sounds more like FAOT is suffering from ethnocentricity than being part of the aristrocracy.

As for the books affecting your alignment... I'm not sure how that would happen. How would one send in a 'bad' book (well, other than bad writing, but that's pretty subjective at times)? Or an 'independent' book? I dunno, I feel like the animal makes more sense in the end.

by **ForAllOfThis** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:01 am UTC

Chandani wrote:it's pretty easy to go and check to make sure he's not lying (which he isn't, by the way).

Are you claiming confirmation of this or something? I'm very confused, I can't see town knowing whether I am lying or not.., unles your claiming book cop? =S

by **Chandani** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 1:28 am UTC

..God, I just spilt wine. WHY DID I DO THAT. D:

What I was thinking at the time was that a person could false-claim a book but not actually read what it was about, or lie about its contents to make them sound better. I checked to make sure the book was what you said it to be; I have no idea if the book you're claiming is true or not, but I do know that the book is what you say it is.

by **mpolo** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 6:32 am UTC

I guess what I was thinking is that Silknor probably looked at everything that was submitted and then tried to find common threads. If we are agreed that this is democracy/aristocracy, the aristocracy might be determined by a group that all turned in books about kings and queens (from Cinderella to King Henry V). As I said before, it might be from the animal as well. I just hesitate to close off a possibility. Chandani's attitude makes me think that her book would be incriminating if we knew about it. (No need to claim at the moment -- the suspicion isn't that strong.)

by **Viae** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 7:25 am UTC

I almost think that assuming a common thread is probably a bit much to ask. Twisting things, picking up on the smallest details of an animal or book, these are all things I would expect from the role-writing. Bad puns would also not be a surprise.

by **Van** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:59 am UTC

Good morning, comrade animals. It is glorious day in zoo, yes?

mpolo wrote:I managed to blithely skip through that without making the connection, but you are probably right there. This still doesn't give us a clear pattern of which animals might be scum -- it could be that native English fauna are queenlovers, it could be that "regal" animals, like the lion, the kingfisher and the monarch butterfly are our baddies. Just the image of a Monarch Butterfly sneaking in to kill people in the night is too good not to be true…

I think it's a little early to assume that the animal types are the link here. There's nothing specifically "evil" about a specific set of animals any more than there is between books by foreign authors, or novels. As you said previously, let's not pigeon hole ourselves into assuming it's cute mafia again, but equally not into looking at just one thing?

Lataro wrote:last game, they were satan in a PyP, or some other obvious anti-town role, I don't remember, they specifically went for anti-town things though. This is a PyP. It is not hard to try and influence your alignment by sending in specific things that would be hard to be justified as pro-town. There are any number of fictional creatures that could have no purpose other than evil, and no shortage of books that contain nothing but negative aspects as well. While I'm not saying that is the case, it is certainly reasonable to believe after last time that they tried again to get an anti-town role by sending in "evil" roles.

Okay, maybe, except Krong said role submissions might influence alignment. I don't believe Silknor did, nor do I think cute animals were going to be high on the list of anyone fishing for a scum role last game. Even if you assume Ibarra didn't do any research before sending in his role (this is fairly valid), there's no reason to suspect Silknor majorly changed his MO in coming up with the roles for this game. I guess we're just coming at this from different angles. I don't feel like the players have a significant impact on the alignment of their role in this game, despite it being a PyP, and so I don't think it's any more of a WIFOMy statement than it would be in a vanilla game.

Viae wrote:I almost think that assuming a common thread is probably a bit much to ask. Twisting things, picking up on the smallest details of an animal or book, these are all things I would expect from the role-writing. Bad puns would also not be a surprise.

This. I sent in an animal with a "meme" very specific to that animal, and he went with the one relating to all animals of that type instead, and then tied that into my book pick. Though, that's just role I guess. Not alignment.

Hm. We've got like, 48 hours or something. We should probably lynch someone.
Mavketl - simultaneously being too townie and not townie enough
Lataro - is not acting crazy (yet). probably a bad sign
mpolo - has probably already been culted and we won't figure it out till like D8
VectorZero - agreeing with Lataro, also apparently lapsed into speaking german randomly. Probably a nazi.

by **Ibarra** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:07 pm UTC

My internet has become very slow and is always disconnecting on me. (Took me an hour to load this page

)
[I think our internet is partly affected by the earthquake in Japan recently]
I'll try to post regularly, but if you feel I'm not contributing enough, feel free to replace without the need for a prod.

by **mpolo** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 4:57 pm UTC

Hmm... So, we're getting to where we need to start thinking about voting, and my biggest tell is extremely weak -- so weak that I don't really want to place a vote.

Mavketl has posted less than usual, but I presume that there are external reasons for this.
Ibarra has cited external reasons for inactivity. He likes to be scum, but probably couldn't really influence that much. Well, actually, if he took the Necronomicon or The Prince or even Macbeth that might have been sufficient to nudge him into scummitude.
Van opened with a "comrade" mention -- is she communist (and therefore independant)?
As Van noted, Lataro has been subdued. Which is unusual.
I think that I've seen VectorZero use German before. Also, ich würde mich nicht so sehr darum kümmern.
FAOT likes the English language, but the book that he claims doesn't really support an "aristrocratic" interpretation.
Chandani's answer made me think that the book title would at least appear incriminating, but this is quite a weak feeling.
Gopher of Pern pointed out the likely scum and town factions.
cjdrum has done a little bit of spec. Says that his book has little to do with his role. Says he is not a typical Australian animal.
RoadieRich: Answered Ibarra's questions.

by **Misnomer** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 5:09 pm UTC

Mav and Van were both monarchists in HUAC. A conservative never changes their spots, so I think we should lynch one of them.

In all seriousness though, I'm really struggling to get reads on people this game. At a push I'd lynch Lataro, just because of the sheer wineyness of his claim (which could at best, if truthful, presumably only ever bag us one scum, and could claim a lot of townies). I'm not at all confident the claim is a lie though, given how crazy some of the roles in the last Zoo were...

by **Lataro** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:41 pm UTC

So, a number of people have mentioned a me lynch. Nice.

Well, whatever, I'm not going into any more detail of my role, if I get lynched then screw it.

I suppose this is where I randomly vote for someone else in a non-caring attempt to offer up a different lynch choice.

Meh.

Vote: Misnomer

Half OMGUS, half he should be smart enough to see the reasoning behind the claim, and appears to be ignoring it.

by **Mavketl** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:44 pm UTC

I'm viewing Lataro's claim much like I would view a miller claim: if it's true, then the townie thing to do is claim it. It could be not true, but the claim itself isn't a scummy move in my opinion.

by **mpolo** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 9:56 pm UTC

Lataro is playing atypically, but I don't know if it is scummy. (I'm not really talking about the claim here, either. As Mavketl says, if he really has the power he is claiming, it is a reasonable strategy to claim it -- he wouldn't want to kill off doctors and cops who visit him if he is really townie.) What I mean is that he hasn't posted as much as usual, and has gotten very "fatalistic" very quickly.

(I may not get a post in until evening tomorrow, but should get one then.)

by **Gopher of Pern** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:38 pm UTC

Maybe Lataro is Indy, instead? If what your saying about Lataro being fatalistic is true, then maybe he is a jester?

Van: Did you submit the communist manifesto or something? I cant imagine any animals being communist, so unless you're just fooling everyone with that comment, I guess its a book thing?

RR: I will second mpolo's subtle request: Do you have anything to say? It is a turbo after all.

by **Van** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 10:57 pm UTC

Okay, in the hopes of keeping you from barking up that tree any more, I sent in a scifi novel. By an english speaking author, about (mostly) english speaking people. I have no restriction, compulsion, or need to post anything, much less anything related to communism.

by **cjdrum** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:02 pm UTC

I bet Van sent in The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy.

What would that mean, though?

by **Van** » Fri Mar 11, 2011 11:15 pm UTC

That you've guessed both the wrong book and the wrong author? I do not particularly like Douglas Adams's style.

If you'd like to keep trying, there's only a couple thousand more to go!

by **RoadieRich** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:47 am UTC

Like I said, I don't often have a lot to say. Here follows a rather rambly train-of-thought-type post.

I can see the benefit to lynching Lararo I guess, although I don't think his actual claim was scummy - but the actual way he claimed bugs me a little. It did, however, spill a fair bit of wine - and unless we can find a safe way of checking it, the only way to clear it up is with a lynch.

Could we be facing at a cult? Maybe from a religious text?

I couldn't say what book and animal have to do with role and alignment. Mine is linked equally to both. Are all roles like this?

Is there more to the Monty Python flavour than just a little injected humour? Is it inspired by a Norwegian Blue Parrot? A Killer bunny of Caerbannog? The Book of Armaments?

There's about 36 hours left until the deadline.
What happens at the deadline?

Van, want to play 20 questions?

by **RoadieRich** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 1:54 am UTC

EBWOP: No, that's not an ability.

by **Silknor** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 2:03 am UTC

Votals:
1-Misnomer (Lataro)

37 hours till Day 1 ends. 7 to lynch.

If a majority is not reached, whoever has the most votes on them will be lynched. Ties broken randomly. Also, I'll probably say something like.

"Get on with it. Get on with it!"

by **VectorZero** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 3:31 am UTC

mpolo wrote:Lataro does like those paranoid-gun-owner type roles (it was his signature in King of the Mafia), though. I don't know if he was able to pick an animal that would guarantee him that, though. I don't have a kill anyway, so the whole warning doesn't really apply to me.

EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE (watch, it'll be a thing.)

Was rereading thread, really not a lot stuck out as scummy until this post.
a) "I don't have a kill" WIFOM
b) "doesn't apply to me" = I don't have a night action at all.

I'm certainly not keen on a Lataro lynch; he's been surprisingly neutral to townie so far.

Grrr. I'm not drawing much to go on here.

by **Misnomer** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 8:47 am UTC

Vote: Lataro

OMGUS vote to try to prevent me being lynched at deadline.

by **Van** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:24 am UTC

Vote: Misnomer

Lataro at least had the common decency to ~~spew wine everywhere~~ start a conversation into the nature of his role, whereas you're just all "harrrrrrd to read people this game

"'

Also it is still like 32 hours till then, and fairly unlikely his vote would be the only one standing.

VectorZero wrote:
mpolo wrote:Lataro does like those paranoid-gun-owner type roles (it was his signature in King of the Mafia), though. I don't know if he was able to pick an animal that would guarantee him that, though. I don't have a kill anyway, so the whole warning doesn't really apply to me.
EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE (watch, it'll be a thing.)

Was rereading thread, really not a lot stuck out as scummy until this post.
a) "I don't have a kill" WIFOM
b) "doesn't apply to me" = I don't have a night action at all.

I thought that was weird too, but I don't think you're parsing it right, it isn't two separate comments.

Lataro wrote:No townie should target me at night unless they want to die.

Reads as "do not use any night action on me"

mpolo wrote: I don't have a kill anyway, so the whole warning doesn't really apply to me.

He isn't saying he doesn't have a night action, he says "I don't have a kill". "Kill" is a hell of a lot more specific than "any night action", and that has been annoying me ever since.
FoS: mpolo

RoadieRich wrote:Could we be facing at a cult? Maybe from a religious text?

Silknor wrote:No Cult

by **VectorZero** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:00 am UTC

Sorry, I agree with your interpretation, I just didn't explain myself very well. It's a case of Suspiciously Specific Denial, anyway.

by **mpolo** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:59 am UTC

We're coming down to the wire and the only real discussion is about me. (Though I haven't been voted on…)

The comment was not meant to be winey, but I suppose anything we say about ourselves is. I realize that any night action against Lataro will result in death (assuming his claim is true). I'm not sure why I only mentioned one particular night action (maybe because of the "self defense" angle of the paranoid gun owner). For the record, I have no night actions. Is that better?

Misnomer has been very lurky, and while I'm willing to vote on lurkiness, I would rather not do so if possible. For that matter Lataro has been quieter than usual, though it may be role-connected. I only had a couple of minutes here, so I'm going to have to come back later today. I should easily be here before deadline.

by **Lataro** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 4:27 pm UTC

Spoilered for profanity, venting, and angry outburst.

Spoiler:

Now... okay, Misnomer OMGUS votes to try and avoid getting lynched. He then says absolutely nothing at all in the post in the way of content. He completely ignores the second half of my statement of why I voted for him, which was precisely because I believe he should of been able to easily figure out that there isn't that much difference between my claim, and as Mav put it, a miller claim. I looked at it as far more townies exist than scum, last game, a ton of people had night actions, and I'd rather not kill a townie, however, odds were good that I would, so I claimed.

After all the miller crap discussion in Misnomer's HUAC game, I figured he'd of figured that out right away, and his ignoring of that, and in fact putting out feelers for a me bandwagon down the line, was scummy as all hell. His continued silence on the matter suggests that he was well aware, yet instead of looking elsewhere, he went back to the bandwagon he tried to test the waters on before voting earlier. Seriously, anyone who was all angsty about my claim looks hella scummy to me, since it was the only real move I could make, given the nature of my role, and I trust people's intelligence to realize that.

As for the fatalistic, part of it is the spoiler stuff above, part of it is the last paragraph, and the last part is I'm a jerk who if people really want to lynch me when I am town, and I'm annoyed at the time, I'd rather just get lynched and die so I can rub it in their faces when my role is revealed, see Scrubs.

by **mpolo** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 5:23 pm UTC

Lataro: I understand that you can't post constantly in a turbo. But if you look back on the posts you did make, they were somewhat atypical. I have personally not once pushed a vote on you. Only on Misnomer did I suggest that his lurkiness was sufficient to possibly pull out a vote. I guess I'm going to have to go with that lead, because we're just not getting a lot of material here, and deadline is impending.

Vote: Misnomer

I will try to check again before bed.

by **mpolo** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:48 pm UTC

Well, I made it on before bedtime, but I don't have anything more to respond to. I think I should still have a chance to look at this before deadline -- so I will wait to see if anything more comes to light. I'm not overly happy with my vote at the moment.

by **Van** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:51 pm UTC

Unvote
Vote: mpolo

Hi-ho on the gut feeling express. Also random lynch woop

by **weiyaoli** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 9:55 pm UTC

Votals:
2- Misnomer (Lataro, mpolo)
1- Lataro (Misnomer)
1- mpolo (Van)

37 ~15 hours till Day 1 ends. 13 ~~people~~ animals alive, 7 to lynch.

Just a quick note, you can queue night actions if you want (to help speed up night). If the mods aren't around to end the day when deadline hits, or if there is a hammer, please stop posting.

by **Chandani** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:00 pm UTC

*pops in*
I have no strong opinion on who to lynch: in between Lataro, Misnomer, and mpolo I would prefer Misnomer just on lurkiness, though it's probably not the best option.
Unsure why Lataro is suspicious for warning people of something that could be harmful for town: I mean, that's why people bring up post restrictions and stuff, right?
mpolo I'm pretty meh on, mostly because it seems to be based off a small statement, which could be a slipup, so...yeah. *shrugs*

I don't really know if I would pick anyone else to lynch today, since there hasn't been much stuff to look at.

by **VectorZero** » Sat Mar 12, 2011 11:02 pm UTC

Time to post today will be sporadic (at work.)

Vote: mpolo

For reasons already given. Would be happy with a misnomer lynch.

by **Silknor** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 4:45 am UTC

Tsk, tsk, Misnomer, do you think I cannot see a snake in action? Your vote is a red herring to the true problem, though I admire your attempts at deception.

by **Mavketl** » Sun Mar 13, 2011 5:37 am UTC

Hey look, someone can do public messages.... but only wacky and weird ones, apparently. It seems unlikely that somone could already have a cop result (the "accusation" of being a snake). So an anonymous person doesn't like Misnomer, which seems pretty useless right now.

Desperately searching for some inkling of truth or significance: they refer to a red herring which was used by GoP here and a snake which was mentioned by me here. I DON'T KNOW OKAY.

A few things I noticed upon re-reading:

Gopher of Pern wrote:Not sure how the previous zoo game went, but is it smart to rolespec?

This just seems like a weird question. It's like... a discouragement in the form of a question. But because it's a question, you don't need to give reasons for why it could be bad.

RoadieRich wrote:I can see the benefit to lynching Lararo I guess, although I don't think his actual claim was scummy - but the actual way he claimed bugs me a little. It did, however, spill a fair bit of wine - and unless we can find a safe way of checking it, the only way to clear it up is with a lynch.

Yeah, I don't like this. The claim itself isn't scummy, but it did spill wine and the only way out of this is a lynch <-- how I read what you were saying.

RoadieRich wrote:Could we be facing at a cult? Maybe from a religious text?

Mod says no cult.

This post by mpolo bothers me a little because it seems a bit like he has an obvious 'royal' animal/book/rolename and he's pre-emptively trying to make things less clearcut. Again here.

I'm torn on ForAllOfThis's restriction. If the teams are monarchists/aristocracy versus democracy, what we know of his role would place him firmly in the first category. Then again, if he knew he was scum and the relevant flavour had already been posted, it would be kind of stupid to claim having to speak the Queen's English. He could've gotten away with not claiming or just saying "British spelling" or something.

Van's vote is incredibly argument-free, even for a D1 lynch. Gut feeling, not very helpful.

In the end, I don't really want to vote. I was almost going to not vote and maybe not post now and just not give a cannelloni about who gets lynched because I have no strong opinions about it one way or another. But that would not be very townie of me, because everyone needs to have an opinion on D1 to serve as information for later days. Townies refusing to have an opinion make it a lot easier for scum to hide among them.

Vote: Misnomer

Because I believe Lataro seems fairly town and Misnomer voted for him with OMGUS as a reason. I get not wanting to die, but if you don't even bother to look for a decent alternative other than OMGUS that just kind of sucks.

Finally,

Spoiler:

Who is online