Amy's Surprise Game [OVER - Sapphire Scrooge Win]

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Sungura
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Sungura » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:48 am UTC

RoadieRich has requested a replacement so consider him non-active. Working on getting a replacement.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby ForAllOfThis » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:51 am UTC

b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.


Thats a dumb thing to say if you don't give those reasons.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Krong » Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:32 am UTC

Confirming. (Yay, I'm in a game again! It's been too long, guys. :) )

I've only played in one Amy game before, and I got vigkilled as a townie. (I think I wasn't able to vote, and had a very hard time not making this look suspicious.) So... I'm not sure I have much to add on that until I've read a bit through her previous games. As far as setup discussion goes...

I'm not sure on mafia numbers... if a cult is present, the mafia factions would probably have to be stronger to make up for it. The one thing that has jumped out to me so far when reading through is how quickly a consensus developed around 3 mafia in equal factions. For one, if everybody else is town/pro-town indy in an 18 person game, that should be an easy town win. Also, b.i.o. is right that they could be uneven in number, but given that the bit of flavor we have makes them seem pretty alike, I'd tend to guess they're equal. My feeling would be that each faction has 4, and that somewhere in that discussion of "yeah, 3 sounds good" is scum happily underselling their strength.

Also, IMO we lucked out with Angua and weiyaoli being confirmed town, by which I mean that we lucked out that it was those two in particular. I haven't played with Angua before, and I have played with weiyaoli enough to know he doesn't give off many scumtells.

ForAllOfThis wrote:
b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.


Thats a dumb thing to say if you don't give those reasons.


Well I'll help out with one... it could give lynchers/scum clues, and it doesn't really help the rest of us.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby BoomFrog » Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:04 am UTC

roband wrote:Also, if there was a cult, I'd expect at least a hint in the flavour.
Interesting with all the talk of cults I think the flavor does hint at a cult. The old setteled gang probably starts larger and the up an comming gang starts smaller but has some means of recruiting. If Amy makes such odd and interesting games, two scum factions of 3 sounds pretty boring.

@Angua and Wei, remember since you're confirmed townies you don't need to be honest. Keep your cards close to your chest so to speak.

Although, if there is a cult then we can't nessesarily trust that they are town tomorrow.
Misnomer wrote:I can see some sort of recruiting power being present though (recruiting masons? maybe a master and minion setup?).
Why do you think a town recruiting power is more likely then a restricted scum recruiting power?
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby _infina_ » Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:12 am UTC

Krong wrote:
ForAllOfThis wrote:
b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.


Thats a dumb thing to say if you don't give those reasons.


Well I'll help out with one... it could give lynchers/scum clues, and it doesn't really help the rest of us.

Not to mention that it could look incredibly suspicious. Everyone will be watching for that which you need, and there will be those who will attempt to prevent that from happening.

oh, hi...I got my role. I have to resist all of the jokes I can make that are related to it, and that is going to be hard, since this thing is hard to steer.

I think that there are only three left to post after me, besides whoever is to replace RR.

ninja'd.

I don't have much to say about it, however.
Spoiler:
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby ElectricHaze » Tue Nov 29, 2011 2:50 am UTC

Ok, it has been awhile since I was last in a game, but here goes...

From Day 1 flavor:
- 2 mafia groups
- 2 confirmed town

Speculation:
By reading wayyyyyy to far into the flavor I have decided I believe there are 10 town and 8 scum, and I don't think there are likely to be independents. With most of the town being vanillaish, maybe two real power roles total. (weakness is based on the fact that we have 2 confirmed town). I don't see any reason that the scum teams would be different sizes, though one being described as young punks, and the other being older and more experienced, could point to a larger slightly weaker in roles punk team and a smaller slightly more powerful in terms of roles scrooge team. I don't think there are cults in this game, as has been mentioned by some, I believe the flavor would have hinted at it more. This is of course wild speculation based on 1 flavor post though so who really knows yet.

Players standing out to me already:
(Note: I do not necessarily believe these people are scum, just that I think they have done something odd, and perhaps should be watched a little more closely for a bit)
roband: reference to numbers in the flavor? There was mention of only one number specifically: 2. "Two gangs" and "Two they can trust". Later he tries to explain saying he was referring to "Pawns in a larger game" and that town may already be outnumbered.

Anyone who stated they believe two scum teams of three: In a game with 18 players if you have 3 people on your team, and your goal is to hold a majority, and there is another team out there, likely with a NK... That scenario seems rather imbalanced in favor of the town. I understand the basics of a standard 1/3 of the players should be scum, but when you split the mafia into two factions in competition with each other as well as the town you have made the mafia weaker, while the town maintains roughly the same strength. You need to do something for balance, either giving the smaller mafia groups super duper roles, or make bigger mafia groups and a smaller town.

I don't know which of those people were simply being lazy about deciding on the size of the scum faction, and which might have been trying to be deliberately misleading. My gut tells me the first person to say it was probably lazy, and somewhere in the people agreeing with that is a mafioso or two that thought it would be a good idea to really understate the number of scum that should be in this game.

Yeah... Not much so far, I guess, but that's what I've got until I get my spreadsheet of notes rolling.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:10 am UTC

b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.


Why is it so baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa-ad?
If FAOT is part of the flock and will be modkilled (lamb stew anyone?) if he doesn't make 8 posts each day, or something, then it would be baaaaaaaaaa-ad for us to rush a day.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:15 am UTC

Oh, apparently we're on page two now. I didn't realise and thought bio's post was the most recent one. Sometimes I think I'd forget my fleece, if it wasn't permanently fixed to my body!

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Gopher of Pern » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:33 am UTC

Here I am.

My first game was an Amy game, and IIRC, had enabler type roles in it, and quite a few indy's, for a small game.

I will also keep an eye on those who said 2 teams of 3. Sure 6 mafia in an 18 player game sounds reasonable, until you realise they also have to compete with each other. 4/4 or something similar, would be my guess. I know Amy likes indy's as well, so I would expect some of them. Cults, I'm not seeing, but I wouldn't rule them out. I wonder why there are 2 confirmed townies....

What is with that FAOT? One thing this board is not lacking is long days. I don't think there has been a first day that didn't go to deadline since I've been here. You're also the first to propose the 3/3 scum teams. FOS: FAOT

Roband, did you suddenly get a posting restriction?
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Angua » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:52 am UTC

@FaoT - that was a weird thing to request unless there is some reason that you think that you are at a danger of not fulfilling your post restriction. b.i.o. was right in that it looks pretty odd. Also, infina's role is apparently the subject of a lot of jokes? I don't know what, if anything, I should be reading from that. Roband's last few posts were also odd, but for some reason I suspect he was messing with us for some reason, however them defending FaoT is something to be filed away for the future.

I must say - I think that I agree with 4 scum on each team more than 3 (tbh, when I asked I was thinking that town could be almost outnumbered with the 2 confirmed towns) - I'm not sure about recruiting though. I think we'll have some pretty powerful townies, and possibly some interesting scum powers as well.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:54 am UTC

Gopher of Pern wrote:Roband, did you suddenly get a posting restriction?


Baa

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby ForAllOfThis » Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:24 am UTC

To be fair on me, check almost all of my past games that I've had a posting restriction or daily requirement and I've claimed it D1. It generates discussion and prevents wine later in the game. The 'let's not rush days' thing was more of a throw-away comment with it, just to bulk up the post. It doesn't give away any more information than saying 'I have a daily requirement/restriction', so let's not get fixated on it.

For that reason, I feel like there is a slight over-reaction from some players who I have played a few games with me before.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby t1mm01994 » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:28 am UTC

Roband, is that... Wool growing out of your shirt?

Anyways, I can't refrain myself from thinking the numbers give some sort of hint as well, I just don't quite have enough information to go on.
Just posting the data:
Numbers taken:
1, 2, 5, 7, 7, 8, 13, 17, 19, 20, 23, 24, 25, 32, 33, 37, 39, 40
Of which 25 and 40 are declared townies... Not much to go on yet.
Actually, since 7 was taken twice and there was no problem with that, I think the numbers are more of a red herring... I'll keep my eye out on that regardless.
I too, am wondering bout FaoT's statement, since we are 18 we need 10 votes to hammer someone. Somehow, I don't think that'll go down within a matter of seconds.. And I'm wondering whether infina will be able to contain her jokes :P (Please, please don't ;))

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:47 am UTC

t1mm01994 wrote:Roband, is that... Wool growing out of your shirt?


Baa?

t1mm01994 wrote:And I'm wondering whether infina will be able to contain her jokes :P

infina is a he :) check this thread (viewtopic.php?f=53&t=66810) for info on all that jazz.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby t1mm01994 » Tue Nov 29, 2011 12:00 pm UTC

Dammit, memorizes as much of those as possible, but I figure I got this one wrong. My sincere apologies, infina.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby mpolo » Tue Nov 29, 2011 1:38 pm UTC

I don't have any real problem with not rushing the days. I suppose FAOT mostly has to watch out after a few days have gone by.

There seems to be a widespread feeling that there are more than just 6 mafia because of the two groups. You are probably right about this, and I was totally discounting the in-fighting between these two groups. The "old established" group might even have a primary goal in getting rid of the insurgent group, though I presume they want to wipe out town as well.

Additional kills are not out of the question, so we do have to be on guard for a serial killer or vigilante (since they may have poor aim). Cult is possible, but I think, not particularly probable, just because there was no real hint of it in the flavor.

ElectricHaze was hinting that town might be less powered than otherwise expected, due to the two confirmed townies. Alternatively, there may be several of those "not particularly powerful" powers (flavor posting with confirmation that it's from a player, or the like), or "bonus win if X is lynched" or similar.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Adam H » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:44 pm UTC

I'm here! I was expecting to come back from vacation and have been modkilled or replaced already. So phew for late starts!

So... two main scum factions. I think having 2 teams of 4 scum vs. 7-9 town with 1-3 neutrals is most likely. But it seems possible that at least the young "up and coming" scum faction could start small (1-2) and have a culting mechanism. I would assume that both scum factions have the win condition to be the last team standing, eliminating both town and other scum faction.

I don't think it's scummy to guess at 3 per faction. Teams of 3 mafia could easily have powers to make up for it. And there could be lynchers/millers/jesters/insane power roles/etc. among the town.

Other than that, I don't really have any input. I don't really understand why FOAT shouldn't have said anything about his posting restriction, so guess I find b.i.o., Krong, infina, and GoP most suspicious. But that's not saying much - you're all just so good at this game. ;)
-Adam

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 4:47 pm UTC

BAA BLOODY BAA

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Sungura » Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:18 pm UTC

Mav is replacing Roadie Rich
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:20 pm UTC

Baa. I agree with everything everyone has said. Both in this game and ever. I agree and I will follow them. Follow them wherever they may go. Baa.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Mavketl » Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:42 pm UTC

Hi guys, replacing in.

roband: you're overdoing it. You remind me of that role in Homestar Scummer where someone had to get people to complain about the game. For that reason, I will avoid the s-word like the plague. :P

Actual content later.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 5:44 pm UTC

S WORD? SWORD? I DON'T NEED A SWORD, I CAN'T HOLD IT. I HAVE HOOVES.

THIS CAN STOP ANYTIME YOU WANT IT TO. BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby roband » Tue Nov 29, 2011 7:17 pm UTC

Just a little something I came up with:

Baa, baa, black rob,
Have you any wool?
Yes sir, yes sir,
Three bags full.

One for Mavketl,
One for Angua,
And one for the little FAOT
Who lives down the lane.

Baa, baa, black Rob,
Have you any wool?
Yes sir, yes sir,
Three bags full.

One for Mavketl,
One for Angua,
And one for the little FAOT
Who lives down the lane.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Adam H » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:25 pm UTC

Vote: Roband

Just to see what happens...
-Adam

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby mpolo » Tue Nov 29, 2011 9:29 pm UTC

So, roband appears to be an s-word. (I bet you expected me to say "shirt", didn't you? You're not going to pull the wool over my eyes like that!)
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Sungura » Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:19 pm UTC

Votals:
1 - Roband (adam)
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby _infina_ » Tue Nov 29, 2011 10:25 pm UTC

I need to be replaced. I accidentally a spoiler.
Spoiler:
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Gopher of Pern » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:08 pm UTC

All those sheep jokes are making me go baananas.

I just dont believe in claiming post restrictions unless you have to. But I still cant come up with any reason FAOT would say 'don't rush days.'

Adam has already posting a list of suspicious people, but its all based on the FAOT reaction. Looks like him just trying to say something. Which is what I'm doing now :/
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Angua » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:10 pm UTC

Roband already said the s-word themself once.

However, I'm not going to risk it as others seem to think that it would lead to terribleness.

Also, we need to try to not let all the focus go on to roband - this started after FaoT mentioned their restriction, and I'm wondering if it's some sort of redirect.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby webby » Tue Nov 29, 2011 11:32 pm UTC

I'm back from my trip, looks like there's been a lot of activity here while I've been gone.

Based on my quick read-through, I don't see why people think FAOT's statement was scummy. Possibly bad play, but I don't see what benefit scum has in claiming something like that.

I'm curious about the roband thing, because his first posts don't contain anything weird. I haven't spotted anything that would trigger this transformation.

I'll post more later, this is just saying I'm here.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Misnomer » Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:27 am UTC

BoomFrog wrote:
Misnomer wrote:I can see some sort of recruiting power being present though (recruiting masons? maybe a master and minion setup?).
Why do you think a town recruiting power is more likely then a restricted scum recruiting power?

...I don't? :? Master/minions are usually anti-town. As for why I think those kinds of roles are more likely than a limited cult, even a limited cult can get pretty powerful pretty quickly, while recruiting masons (on the other hand) can be pretty much useless (assuming they don't convert alignment). Because they're weaker, I think those sorts of roles are more likely to be in the game.

No idea what to make of Roband's apparent transformation. As Webby says, there doesn't seem to be any sign of a trigger. Perhaps we have day powers at work here?

I think the numbers could have been for the purposes of role selection - as in, Amy had 40 possible roles that could be in the game, and we picked just under half of them. It's possible they are more directly related to the game, but I can't think of where exactly they'd fit in.

FAOT's claim doesn't strike me as particularly scummy. At any rate, it doesn't strike me as scummy enough to make me want to rush through the day. I'd suggest just ignoring his requests and ending the day when we actually feel like ending it.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby Sungura » Wed Nov 30, 2011 12:48 am UTC

_infina_ wrote:I need to be replaced. I accidentally a spoiler.

Infina is still in the game. The spoiler seen was a silly haha one that had no game bearing.

And im too lazy to find another replacement day one :P

especially when one isnt needed.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby ForAllOfThis » Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:05 am UTC

I don't want to assume, but it's possible, that roband might have some form of daily requirement as well. An alternative explanation is some form of mind control, although I'm not quite sure what it's meant to achieve.

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby ElectricHaze » Wed Nov 30, 2011 1:44 am UTC

I think roband is most likely the victim of a day power, or some random game mechanic. I have trouble believing it is part of his role, as I would think it would be something that would start at the beginning of the day, or have some kind of trigger, and I don't really see anything I believe would trigger it. Also, I feel like roband would have prepared better initially if it was part of his role, rather than be so over the top with it. I tend to see roband as a little suspicious most of the time, so he would probably be a good target for some sort of wine creating post restrictioning day power, assuming it's not just me. Also, I believe he said we could end it at anytime... but it makes me less inclined to believe it was part of his role, as that reinforces my belief that it would have started at the beginning of the day and gone until the condition to end it was met.

In other things, personally I think FAOT claiming his post restriction is a good move not a bad one. He claimed a handicap, not a power (I believe requirements and restrictions are definitely handicaps), which I don't think necessarily makes him a target, and it preemptively addresses any confusion and wine the restriction might cause down the line. It certainly doesn't make him confirmed or anything, but I think it was a pretty pro-town move.
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby b.i.o » Wed Nov 30, 2011 3:37 am UTC

ForAllOfThis wrote:Thats a dumb thing to say if you don't give those reasons.

No it's not. Unnecessary discussion gives the scum information they're more likely to be able to make use of than we are right now. However, since a lot of people seem to need an explanation...think about what different alignments have to gain from making a claim like that at the beginning of D1.

If FAOT is town, the gain is the potential for less confusion, or the potential for not missing an opportunity because we rushed the day. However, there's really not a whole lot of risk of us rushing the day. This is not a turbo game, and arguing against rushing the day is something that can be done entirely on its own merits without having to reveal part of your role. So revealing the extra information to scum is stupid, and as town, making the statement FAOT did was a bad move.

If FAOT is scum, the gain (whether the claim is true or not) is more confusion. Since it's an early D1 claim, not something done of necessity, it's probably not suspicious enough to warrant a lynch, and could serve as a possible explanation for strange behavior later. If FAOT has some restriction that makes longer days much more beneficial, then this might be a reasonable thing to do as scum. Otherwise this was a pretty useless claim.

The other possibility is that FAOT is some kind of independent. Since independents generally try to stay under the radar, a claim doesn't really make sense for most independent roles unless, again, longer days are vital for his role.

But none of those explanations is really doing it for me. I wouldn't be *too* surprised at townie-making-a-mistake, but the response to me feels off for that scenario. I don't think FAOT cares how long the days are at all. As I said earlier, it's pretty dumb to make a claim to keep days from being rushed when that's an argument you can just make on its own. I think that the claim was to get attention, and not for any other reason. My guess is that he's a jester or something like it.

Also:
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby greenlover » Wed Nov 30, 2011 5:05 am UTC

Okay, hi all. Sorry for not posting up til now.

First off, I'm horrible at picking up hints in flavor, but I don't see how a cult would fit into this game. It seems pretty straight forward - two mafia groups, and the town stuck in the middle. This reminds me a lot of the werewolf/mafia game that was run a while back, actually. Actually, because of that, it wouldn't surprise me if there were cops that could only cop one of the mafias out there. The mafia's might be three, might be four, I don't really see why it matters that much at this point. We need to lynch the mafia, and that's that.

I don't really see the problem with FAOT's claim, besides the fact that it seems unnecessary. The fact that he needs to post X times a day doesn't really say anything about his role or alignment. Also, FAOT - can you tell us how many times you need to post in a day, or do you instead plan on telling us whenever we can follow through on a lynch? I'm a wee bit uncomfortable with the latter option, cause it gives you a lot of power over town, so it would be best if you could tell us the specifics of your role restriction.

I don't understand what roband is doing, though I do find it rather humorous. Its not every day you get to watch someone impersonate a s-word via the internet. Since he wasn't doing the s-word impersonation at the beginning of the day, I agree that its pretty likely that its the result of a day power. If there are a few more powers like this out there, I do believe this game will be quite entertaining. :)

Finally,
b.i.o. wrote:Sheep. Ovis aries.
I cannot see how this is a good idea for town. This is clearly not a slip, but you didn't explain in your post why you said this. Explain why you said it, pronto?

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t1mm01994
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby t1mm01994 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 6:08 am UTC

b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.

Look back to page 1, confirm that this quote is from b.i.o., then look up to the last post.
Vote: b.i.o

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mpolo
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby mpolo » Wed Nov 30, 2011 7:25 am UTC

It occurred to me that if FAOT has a restriction that could be missed because of the day going too quickly, it is likely a restriction that grants a power if he succeeds, rather than one that punishes/kills him if he does not succeed in doing so. I'm obviously guessing here, but if someone had to post every 24 hours for 5 days, and if the day ended after 4 days, he automatically dies, that wouldn't be a very "fun" or "fair" restriction.

So, I think that we need to be worried about whether we want FAOT to be able to get some sort of extra power.

The S-Word has been said, but I'm not going to repeat it, just in case there is some weird mechanic connected with it. My thinking was that perhaps he has a random word that he needs to get others to say in order to get a power.

Anyway, as others have said, we're getting a bit sidetracked by two players and need to examine everybody. I am off to class, and probably won't be back until afternoon…
Image <-- Evil experiment

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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby BoomFrog » Wed Nov 30, 2011 8:05 am UTC

t1mm01994 wrote:
b.i.o wrote:This was a really dumb thing to say for several reasons.

Look back to page 1, confirm that this quote is from b.i.o., then look up to the last post.
Vote: b.i.o

I'm not seeing what you find contradicory or scummy. Can you be more explicit? Your quote of b.i.o. from page 1 seems consistant with what he posted just above.

@mpolo: Why did you completely ignore t1mm's illogical outburst?
"Everything I need to know about parenting I learned from cooking. Don't be afraid to experiment, and eat your mistakes." - Cronos

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t1mm01994
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Re: Amy's Surprise Game [Day 1]

Postby t1mm01994 » Wed Nov 30, 2011 9:00 am UTC

Never mind, I'm an idiot and I can't read.
Unvote: b.i.o


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