What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

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senor_cardgage
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What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby senor_cardgage » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:13 pm UTC

Phone Keypad

I use one of those old phones where you type with numbers—for example, to type "Y", you press 9 three times. Some words have consecutive letters on the same number. When they do, you have to pause between letters, making those words annoying to type. What English word has the most consecutive letters on the same key?


Image

Those old phones still exist?

Also, anyone else get broken image links when loading this one?

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davidstarlingm
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby davidstarlingm » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:19 pm UTC

Yeah, I got broken image links as well. Thought it was just my office firewall -- it's wonky sometimes.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby AussieJono » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:25 pm UTC

I'm also getting broken images. Also, I think the first picture under Left Hand Only is missing the text describing what is actually going on, and the alt-text doesn't really help me figure it out. Could be an interesting challenge.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby rhomboidal » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:38 pm UTC

It'd probably be for the best to force pausing while typing these days. ESPECIALLY tweeting.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby rmsgrey » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:38 pm UTC

senor_cardgage wrote:Those old phones still exist?


I bought mine a couple of years ago as a replacement for a decade-old Windows phone with a similar interface, and other added features I never used - and a fraction of the battery life...

Okay, the predictive texting is good enough that I rarely need to multi-tap number keys, but it's still there as an option when predictive fails me.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Envelope Generator » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:40 pm UTC

AussieJono wrote:I'm also getting broken images. Also, I think the first picture under Left Hand Only is missing the text describing what is actually going on, and the alt-text doesn't really help me figure it out. Could be an interesting challenge.


It might end "...eater dad gets arrested".
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby AussieJono » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:44 pm UTC

Envelope Generator wrote:
AussieJono wrote:I'm also getting broken images. Also, I think the first picture under Left Hand Only is missing the text describing what is actually going on, and the alt-text doesn't really help me figure it out. Could be an interesting challenge.


It might end "...eater dad gets arrested".


Page now seems fixed and you were pretty much correct. Excellent work.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby cellocgw » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:52 pm UTC

one: "Buy my 'Puppy Milk'." (a product of unknown origin or intended use)
two: "Buy my puppy milk." (buy it for my puppy)
three: "Buy my puppy, Milk." (said to person named "Milk")

Ain't punctuation grand!

Also: bonus points to whomever digs up the longest words & sentences for left, right, and rows using Dvorak :mrgreen:
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby davidstarlingm » Tue Dec 10, 2013 5:56 pm UTC

Several of the passwords I used in the past were (unintentionally) all or almost-all typable with just one hand. Which was convenient.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Moose Anus » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:10 pm UTC

"Sasha has a gf; gf has adhd" uses only home row keys.

"Alas, dad had a glass salad" does not use only home row keys because of the comma.

Some of them should not have had periods either.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Sir_Read-a-Lot » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:14 pm UTC

I'm surprised that none of the top row sentences included the word "typewriter", which is, as far as I know, the longest top row word.


At first I wondered why he didn't include any words from just the bottom row. Then I looked at what was in the bottom row, and I understood.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Qaanol » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:25 pm UTC

Omnomnom
wee free kings

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby sehkzychic » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:28 pm UTC

Left Hand Only (aside from punctuation):

Several very aggravated stewardesses created Aggregated Ferret Waste Wafers as desert ferrets secreted great secret desserts as excreta. Few tasted great, as Dedra feared. A few created very dear tastes. Deceased ferrets vexed Dedra, as ferret excreta creates tastes a few crave. A wasted ex-raver-stewardess served a T. rex AFWWs. Crazed T. rex gave stewardesses great fear & ate a few.

Translation:
Spoiler:
A bunch of ticked-off flight attendants left the industry and concocted a "dessert" made from ferret waste (they apparently chose that particular kind of waste as some ferrets' poop is secretly used in some delicacies). One of the flight attendants, Dedra, was skeptical. Most of them didn't taste good, but a few were awesome. Dedra was upset when the ferrets pooped out (pun intended) because some people really wanted to buy their desserts. One of the other former flight attendants who had previously been a hard partier got drunk (presumably from the champagne they were drinking to celebrate the launch of their new company) and snuck a few out and fed them to an unsuspecting T. rex (either of Jurassic Park or Dinosaur Comics fame). The T. rex, however, was super mad at having been tricked into eating ferret poop, and he went and ate some of the flight attendants.


Yep, didn't use any tools except my sleep-addled brain, but it was fun. Maybe the other denizens of this forum can expand this story into a left-hand-only book!

Oh, and in case you're wondering about why they chose ferret poop in particular, the wikipedia article on civet coffee might be interesting. And yes, I'm aware that civets aren't actually mustelids, but they look similar, and these flight attendants probably weren't biology majors.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby travesty » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:30 pm UTC

How does "Buy my puppy milk, lol" work for just using the right hand? "B" is a left-hand letter.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby keithl » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:39 pm UTC

This reminds me of a number/telephone puzzle I published a decade ago.

You hack together a telephone number dialer for your supercomputer (using the bigint package). However, due to a typing mistake, "911" was replaced by "9!!", which your cheesy software interprets as a very large integer: (9 factorial) factorial . Your dialer is connected to the public switched telephone network, so the trailing digits after the 10 digit telephone number are treated as just another sound signal.

The questions: If your computer dials that huge integer, what telephone exchange in what state and city does it dial? How long does it take to dial the number, assuming 3 digits per second? Hint: you can compute the number of digits and the phone number with most spreadsheet programs in under five minutes, if you do it right.

Note: please do not actually call the number, and torment the poor fellow at the other end with endless phone beeps ...

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Adam H » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:46 pm UTC

big deal, i typed this post using nothing but my left pointer finger. i guess i could have used caps lock to capitalize letters, but i didn't feel like it.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Mikeski » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:58 pm UTC

Sir_Read-a-Lot wrote:At first I wondered why he didn't include any words from just the bottom row. Then I looked at what was in the bottom row, and I understood.

Yeah, even the fake vowel (Y) and really-fake vowel (W) aren't available.

You do have the period if you want to write lots of abbreviations, though. And the shift keys to shout.

top row sentences all look like e e cummings wrote them

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby capefeather » Tue Dec 10, 2013 7:10 pm UTC

Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

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davidstarlingm
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby davidstarlingm » Tue Dec 10, 2013 7:17 pm UTC

capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

I use my left index finger for b as well.

(had to type a sentence containing the word "because" in order to figure it out)

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Flumble » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:03 pm UTC

My fingers float around above the keyboard whilest typing.
Often the fingers on my left hand cross the borders of Yhn and sometimes the fingers on my right hand claim keys out of their league too.
Though I have to admit that only my left hand is involved in typing the left-handed sentences in the what-if.


travesty wrote:How does "Buy my puppy milk, lol" work for just using the right hand? "B" is a left-hand letter.

How about "Hop on my puppy milk, lol!" then?

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby airdrik » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:21 pm UTC

davidstarlingm wrote:
capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

I use my left index finger for b as well.

(had to type a sentence containing the word "because" in order to figure it out)


Things like this become even more evident when using one of those ergonomic keyboards (like the one I happen to be using at work) that split the letters up for you and place B on the left side (and in response to sehkzychic's paragraph: Y is on the right side (as is L, but that was only used in the first word)), and it is really inconvenient to try and use one hand to type on both sides (in which case you'd be faster using hunt-and-peck).

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby NeatNit » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:30 pm UTC

I wish Dvorak had won the keyboard contest... No one has any doubt that it is superior. It's just impossible to change what has already been set.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby 12obin » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:49 pm UTC

how about only consonants from the bottom row, but all vowels are fair game? and no cheating with y. it can only be used as a vowel (e.g. funny, antonym) and not as a consonant (e.g. yes, lanyard).

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby ps.02 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:16 pm UTC

We can answer that question with the following headache-inducing shell command, which finds all words in a given list which use the same key a bunch of times in a row:

Code: Select all

cat wordlist.txt | perl -pe 's/^(.*)$/\L$& \U$&/g' | 'ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ' '2223334445556667777888999' | grep -P "(.)\1\1\1\1\1"

Wow, headache-inducing is right. Where do we start?
- Useless use of cat
- Missed the 'Z' (guess you'd have to decide whether to put it on the 9 or the 0 though)
- Forgot the 'tr' in the middle. The middle command makes no sense until you figure that out.
- Forgot that in 'tr' you can say things like 'A-Z'. Which, granted, is not safe in most locales, but the model here is of plain uppercase ASCII.
- Not only has an (implied) 'tr', but precedes the 'tr' with another 'tr' implemented in Perl
- The Perl tr could just as well have been perl -nle 'chomp; print lc." ".uc'
- The grep at the end uses PCRE merely to avoid two backslashes, and perhaps to remind us that it's really fun to keep switching in and out of Perl-like parsers
- The whole thing doesn't even count repeats, just looks for a minimum number of them

Well, maybe not headache-inducing, assuming one has a nicely padded desk.

Let's see ... first the cleanup.

Code: Select all

perl -nle 'chomp; $_ = lc."\t".uc; tr/A-Z/22233344455566677778889999/; print if /(.)\1{5}/' wordlist.txt

But that doesn't count occurrences. Let's do that:

Code: Select all

perl -nle 'chomp; $_ = lc."\t".uc; tr/A-Z/22233344455566677778889999/; my $max; for $n (0..length) { $max=$n+1 if /(.)\1{$n}/ } print "$max\t$_"' wordlist.txt | sort -n | tail

Of course the 'sort -n | tail' at the end could be avoided, but at some cost....

Code: Select all

perl -nle 'chomp; $_ = lc."\t".uc; tr/A-Z/22233344455566677778889999/; my $max; for $n (0..length) { $max=$n+1 if /(.)\1{$n}/ } push @{$accum[$max]},"$_\t$w"; END { my $s = pop @accum; print @accum."\t$_" for @$s }' wordlist.txt

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Trickster » Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:18 pm UTC

.
alas, said sad lass, i am a dvorak dork

.....

Okay, that doesn't actually do anything funny with my hands on Dvorak. It just looks like it might have. And it's unfortunately true.

One of my students once told me a joke in the middle of class, right after I mentioned using Dvorak.

Q: How do you know if someone uses Dvorak?

Spoiler:
A: They'll tell you.
ಠ_ಠ

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby dalcde » Tue Dec 10, 2013 11:28 pm UTC

sehkzychic wrote:Several very aggravated stewardesses created Aggregated Ferret Waste Wafers as desert ferrets secreted great secret desserts as excreta. Few tasted great, as Dedra feared. A few created very dear tastes. Deceased ferrets vexed Dedra, as ferret excreta creates tastes a few crave. A wasted ex-raver-stewardess served a T. rex AFWWs. Crazed T. rex gave stewardesses great fear & ate a few.


It's interesting how you type "l" with your left hand.

Code: Select all

cat wordlist.txt | perl -pe 's/^(.*)$/\L$& \U$&/g' | 'ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ' '2223334445556667777888999' | grep -P "(.)\1\1\1\1\1"


Using /usr/share/dict/words I get deeded with 6 letters.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby WilliamLehnsherr » Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:12 am UTC

Buy my puppy milk, lol.

I typed that with my left hand, because I don't conform to society's rules!

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Eternal Density » Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:33 am UTC

Moose Anus wrote:"Sasha has a gf; gf has adhd" uses only home row keys.

"Alas, dad had a glass salad" does not use only home row keys because of the comma.

Some of them should not have had periods either.

Dad certainly shouldn't have.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby cjmcjmcjmcjm » Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:47 am UTC

Sir_Read-a-Lot wrote:I'm surprised that none of the top row sentences included the word "typewriter", which is, as far as I know, the longest top row word.


At first I wondered why he didn't include any words from just the bottom row. Then I looked at what was in the bottom row, and I understood.

Wasn't the fact that typewriter could be written entirely in the top row one of the reasons for the QWERTY layout being the way it is? I keep my hands on the home row as a resting position, but when I type, I go into "action mode" and hover them over the top row, since that's where all the vowels are (except a).


I wonder what the equivalent to this what-if would be in Dvorak or Colemak.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby chris857 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:21 am UTC

senor_cardgage wrote:Phone Keypad

I use one of those old phones where you type with numbers—for example, to type "Y", you press 9 three times. Some words have consecutive letters on the same number. When they do, you have to pause between letters, making those words annoying to type. What English word has the most consecutive letters on the same key?


Those old phones still exist?

Also, anyone else get broken image links when loading this one?


Yes, yes they do. I've got tracfone, and let me tell you, I like it this way. Sure, I can type an equals sign but I can't figure out how to get a hyphen, but who needs to text all that much anyway, hmm? </rant>

Anyway, "right" is the word I ten to have difficulty with, given the 'ghi' key.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Eternal Density » Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:26 am UTC

cjmcjmcjmcjm wrote:I wonder what the equivalent to this what-if would be in Dvorak or Colemak.
Let's hope we can get Randall to wonder that also...

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby iGeek » Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:40 am UTC

As for the longest word you can type with your left hand, I prefer “reverberated.” It’s the same length as “stewardesses,” but I think it’s more fun to type.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby strake » Wed Dec 11, 2013 4:49 am UTC

"nonmonomorphic"

It beats even "omnomnom".

keithl wrote:The questions: If your computer dials [9!!], what telephone exchange in what state and city does it dial?

1-609-714-4004 is in Medford, NJ.

keithl wrote:How long does it take to dial the number, assuming 3 digits per second?

619978 s, a little over a week.

keithl wrote:Hint: you can compute the number of digits and the phone number with most spreadsheet programs in under five minutes, if you do it right.

I can compute the same in Mathematica in about 5 seconds ☺

ps.02 wrote:
We can answer that question with the following headache-inducing shell command, which finds all words in a given list which use the same key a bunch of times in a row:

Code: Select all

cat wordlist.txt | perl -pe 's/^(.*)$/\L$& \U$&/g' | 'ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ' '2223334445556667777888999' | grep -P "(.)\1\1\1\1\1"

Wow, headache-inducing is right. Where do we start?

Use of Perl.
Irregular expression.

Code: Select all

paste <(cat /usr/share/dict/words | tr '[[:lower:]]' '[[:upper:]]' | tr 'ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ' '2223334445556667777888999' | awk -v 'FS=' '{ m = 1; n = 1; for (ii = 1; ii <= NR; ii++) { if ($ii == x) n++; else { if (n > m) m = n; x = $ii; n = 1; } } print m }') /usr/share/dict/words | grep -v '^[12345]     ' | sort -rn


Edit: Awk script was extremely rate-limiting so rewrote in C:

Code: Select all

#include <stdio.h>

int main () {
   char *x;
   size_t l = 0;
   
   x = 0;
   while (getline (&x, &l, stdin) >= 0) {
      char c = 0;
      int m = 1, n = 1;
      for (int ii = 0; x[ii]; ii++) {
         if (x[ii] == c) n++;
         else {
            if (n > m) m = n;
            c = x[ii];
            n = 1;
         }
      }
      printf ("%d\n", m);
   }
}


In shell:

Code: Select all

$ ... # as earlier
6   uncommonness's
6   uncommonness
6   deeded
6   commonness's
6   commonness
$

So it lacks "nonmonomorphic", and "omnomnom", alas.

But my favorite, tho not on the list:

Code: Select all

∞   AAAAAAAAAAAA...

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby ThemePark » Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:23 am UTC

senor_cardgage wrote:Those old phones still exist?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nokia_100

capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

Great, now I'm not gonna be able to type without looking at my keyboard to find out.

Maybe set up a video camera and type The quick brown fox...?

NeatNit wrote:I wish Dvorak had won the keyboard contest... No one has any doubt that it is superior. It's just impossible to change what has already been set.

Wrong.

ps.02 wrote:

Code: Select all

perl -nle 'chomp; $_ = lc."\t".uc; tr/A-Z/22233344455566677778889999/; my $max; for $n (0..length) { $max=$n+1 if /(.)\1{$n}/ } push @{$accum[$max]},"$_\t$w"; END { my $s = pop @accum; print @accum."\t$_" for @$s }' wordlist.txt

Well done, you went from bad to worse.
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Philbert » Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:00 am UTC

capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?


I used to do that too, until I bought one of those ergonomic, broken keyboards that were the fad a few years ago. As the B was on the left side, I typed my name suddenly as 'Philnert'.

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby elasto » Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:09 am UTC

capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

I just tried it out to see what I do and it seems my brain uses an optimization: If the letter following the 'b' needs my right hand I will type the 'b' with my left - and if the following letter needs my left hand I will type the 'b' with my right.

Go go brain!

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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby dalcde » Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:33 am UTC

elasto wrote:
capefeather wrote:Yeah, am I weird for using my left hand for b, or is Randall weird for using his right?

I just tried it out to see what I do and it seems my brain uses an optimization: If the letter following the 'b' needs my right hand I will type the 'b' with my left - and if the following letter needs my left hand I will type the 'b' with my right.

Go go brain!

Same here
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Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby cellocgw » Wed Dec 11, 2013 12:14 pm UTC

NeatNit wrote:I wish Dvorak had won the keyboard contest... No one has any doubt that it is superior. It's just impossible to change what has already been set.


Actually, everyone except the creator of that layout doubts its superiority. All tests done in the last 50 or 60 years show little to no difference in speed or strain between different layouts.
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Klear
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Joined: Sun Jun 13, 2010 8:43 am UTC
Location: Prague

Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby Klear » Wed Dec 11, 2013 1:45 pm UTC

QWERTY vs. Dvorak flamewar in 3...2...1...

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mathmannix
Posts: 1393
Joined: Fri Jul 06, 2012 2:12 pm UTC
Location: Washington, DC

Re: What-If 0075: "Phone Keypad"

Postby mathmannix » Wed Dec 11, 2013 2:16 pm UTC

I can type neither "We reserved seats at a secret Starcraft fest." using only my left hand, nor "You look upon my mom in Honolulu!" with my right hand only. However, I can type "We reserved seats a a secret Starcraft fest!" (no quotes) using only my left hand, and "You look upon my mom in Honolulu." (with or without quotes) using only my right hand. * Punctuation matters!

Also, the top row definitely does not contain the comma or period.

* - the right-hand one is easier because I get to use the backspace!
I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.


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