1178: "Pickup Artists"

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morsus854
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby morsus854 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 10:37 pm UTC

Meaux_Pas wrote:
morsus854 wrote:Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.

Maybe nothing- it definitely makes you a dick. Your comment and this subsequent one shows a gross misunderstanding of what being bipolar even is. But by all means, lump all 'bipolar women' into the same category so you can ignore them as people.
#justsayin


Well, my ex was bipolar and it's definitely not for me. I don't find depression or cerebral palsy attractive either and don't have plans of starting a relationship with someone having either of those problems. Does that also make me a dick? Regardless, if being bipolar is a turn on for you then great, I hope you find someone like that you can be happy with. We all want different things and are attracted to different types of people.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby Don Calvus » Mon Feb 25, 2013 10:52 pm UTC

morsus854 wrote:
Jave D wrote:Bipolar women? Yeah, fuck them! Mental illness must be shunned.


Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.


No, it just makes you an ignorant.

Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.

As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby Jave D » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:01 pm UTC

morsus854 wrote:
Jave D wrote:
morsus854 wrote:I don't get why people think pickup artistry is so creepy. All it serves is to teach men how to be more attractive to women. Which really ends up just being self help that uses success with women as a lure. Which makes sense, because being a happy, confident, well adjusted person makes you more attractive and able to maintain a relationship (which is the real goal of most people on the pickup forums).


How exactly do you claim to know what the "real" goal is for "most" people on those forums is? Because that's quite the claim. I could well counter with "manipulating women into giving a guy sex in order to feel better about himself is the real goal of most guys on the pickup forums."

You tend to attract people that are somewhat similar to you. I've read plenty of stories of guys on the forums whom before they worked on improving themselves attracted drug addicts, bipolar women, people who would slash their tires or throw shit through their windows when they were in a bad mood. And the point of those stories was always that once they learned this self help stuff they started attracting emotionally healthy women. If you consider that turning you into a different person, I'd make the change in a heart beat given the choice.


Bipolar women? Yeah, fuck them! Mental illness must be shunned.



Good points. During the years I spent reading the forums I saw occasional threads asking people what their real goal is and why they're studying this stuff. Some people really did say stuff like "I want to get laid 6 nights a week and have threesomes at least once a month." More commonly though, I saw responses like, "I want a monogamous relationship." Maybe this doesn't accurately show what most people want, but I believe the people posting were honest with their responses and that there were enough people responding thus that it's a fairly common desire.

Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.


1. Oh, it may be common, but is it more common? You stated that it was in fact the real goal of most guys on that forum, but is that bold statement of seeming fact really the result of some kind of objective, rational analysis? I am inclined to think that it isn't - that your desire to defend this community is coloring your recollections with a bias and that perhaps you simply wish that's how it was, choosing to overlook the seedy nature of the origins of your wholesome self-improvement spin. Which is natural, I would too, because it's really quite ugly. A 1 out of 10, really. A warpig, as they say.

2. My point is not that you're a dick, but that this whole process smacks of superficiality. The example you mention is but one in many, and the generic tale is this: "Before I learned PUA, I was an average frustrated chump who could only get occasional sex from average or ugly looking women. Now I'm awesome because I can get any hot girl I want!" Everything is rated in terms of the number, ease, and frequency one can manipulate a woman into sleeping with you - and how attractive she is. That's not self-improvement at all. The self remains unchanged. The fear of women and the fear of rejection? Still there, no matter how many girls you can pick up at the bar and no matter how free of the taint of mental illness they may be. Only it's transformed - instead of manifesting as shyness, it manifests as a casual, flippant attitude towards women and sex in general. Or perhaps a cruel hostility, hiding under a mask of easygoing likability. Measuring "self" improvement by how others behave, i.e. they want to fuck you more, or give you more money, just doesn't work, or else Hugh Hefner and Donald Trump have better "selves," that is to say, they don't just get more sex or have more money, the sex and money is a sign that they are better people. Sort of like how mentally ill women are used as a sign, in your example, of being a non-improved self, that is to say, inferior people. Aaaand I don't buy that.

An improved self can overlook and accept flaws and find joy and contentment with less-than-perfect people, and less than perfect situations too. But PUA is about the opposite - its goal is about changing people you surround yourself with (i.e, more attractive women in your sex and romance life), and changing situations you're in, so that your current self can be satisfied with them. Because why change yourself? Just change the trappings. Buy a new car, become a better person!

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:05 pm UTC

Don Calvus wrote:
morsus854 wrote:
Jave D wrote:Bipolar women? Yeah, fuck them! Mental illness must be shunned.


Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.


No, it just makes you an ignorant.

Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.

As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!
um, seriously.
I don't give a rat's ass who you date, but making gross an uninformed generalizations about bipolar women is a dick move. And it doesn't have to be a turn on to me for me to take offense to that.
Just putting this out there, so you know. Not every bipolar person has fits of manic rage that make them want to throw your shit out the window. Not every bipolar person is your ex.
That's another thing about the weird women-are-barely-people mindframe I see so much when people begin discussing PUA. "I dated this one girl who had x traits and I didn't like it so everyone who has that trait whether I want to date them or not is going to do the same things."
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby philsov » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:06 pm UTC

ShifterCat wrote:Relevant to the discussion, and also amusing:

http://slacktory.com/2013/02/okc_ebooks-deconstructs-online-pick-up-lines-with-horse_ebooks-tweets/

PUAs trying to seduce a Twitterbot. The results are as revealing and hilarious as one could expect.


That's a matter of mislabeling. Sure, they reveal themselves as sex-seeking creeps, but I'm not seeing anything that makes them a pickup artist more than any other random guy. Especially based on opening lines -- "How are you finding this site?" is a normal conversation. Calling these guys "PUAs" is just another way to distance oneself from the rest of the crowd by "othering" them. But I assure you the author is a witty, marvelous catch who in no way immediately wants to sleep with all the female readers.

:roll:
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby morsus854 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:10 pm UTC

Don Calvus wrote:
morsus854 wrote:
Jave D wrote:Bipolar women? Yeah, fuck them! Mental illness must be shunned.


Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.


No, it just makes you an ignorant.

Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.

As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!


I fully understand that even though I have no intention or desire to date someone with one of those issues, it's very well possible that I may end up with someone like that just as you said. I don't expect it will happen again given my current values, but I don't know the future.

I'd like it if you found a way to start on my naïviety, as I don't see how that's a problem. To better explain what I mean by rational regardless of the situation, is that I find it extremely irritating when I'm trying to talk with someone and their emotion clouds their logic, they refuse to listen to reason, and don't care if what they're saying makes sense. That's how things commonly were with my bipolar ex and how it turned into a big pet peeve of mine.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby doogly » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:17 pm UTC

morsus854 wrote:I'd like it if you found a way to start on my naïviety, as I don't see how that's a problem. To better explain what I mean by rational regardless of the situation, is that I find it extremely irritating when I'm trying to talk with someone and their emotion clouds their logic, they refuse to listen to reason, and don't care if what they're saying makes sense. That's how things commonly were with my bipolar ex and how it turned into a big pet peeve of mine.

You don't get to make self congratulatory references to reason not being clouded by emotion. If you would like to get with the post-Enlightenment history of thought you're going to need to read your Hume.

The problem here is that your rationality is being clouded by the fact that you are a dick, which is a different problem from having emotions, which is not a problem.

Also, ace move on the last page with that dichotomy you set up with mental illness needing to be either vilified or fetishized. Just beautiful man.
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby zmic » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:24 pm UTC

Don Calvus wrote:No, it just makes you an ignorant.

Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.

As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!


if you don't want to date a certain type of person, since when do you need to justify that?

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby doogly » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:31 pm UTC

zmic wrote:
Don Calvus wrote:No, it just makes you an ignorant.
Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.
As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!

if you don't want to date a certain type of person, since when do you need to justify that?


Because once your dick has spoken, it is impolite for us to start noticing your biases and prejudices?
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby rmsgrey » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:31 pm UTC

zmic wrote:
Don Calvus wrote:No, it just makes you an ignorant.

Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.

As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!


if you don't want to date a certain type of person, since when do you need to justify that?

When you start suggesting that everyone should want to not date that type of person.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby morsus854 » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:33 pm UTC

Jave D wrote:
morsus854 wrote:
Jave D wrote:
morsus854 wrote:I don't get why people think pickup artistry is so creepy. All it serves is to teach men how to be more attractive to women. Which really ends up just being self help that uses success with women as a lure. Which makes sense, because being a happy, confident, well adjusted person makes you more attractive and able to maintain a relationship (which is the real goal of most people on the pickup forums).


How exactly do you claim to know what the "real" goal is for "most" people on those forums is? Because that's quite the claim. I could well counter with "manipulating women into giving a guy sex in order to feel better about himself is the real goal of most guys on the pickup forums."

You tend to attract people that are somewhat similar to you. I've read plenty of stories of guys on the forums whom before they worked on improving themselves attracted drug addicts, bipolar women, people who would slash their tires or throw shit through their windows when they were in a bad mood. And the point of those stories was always that once they learned this self help stuff they started attracting emotionally healthy women. If you consider that turning you into a different person, I'd make the change in a heart beat given the choice.


Bipolar women? Yeah, fuck them! Mental illness must be shunned.



Good points. During the years I spent reading the forums I saw occasional threads asking people what their real goal is and why they're studying this stuff. Some people really did say stuff like "I want to get laid 6 nights a week and have threesomes at least once a month." More commonly though, I saw responses like, "I want a monogamous relationship." Maybe this doesn't accurately show what most people want, but I believe the people posting were honest with their responses and that there were enough people responding thus that it's a fairly common desire.

Yah, maybe that bipolar comment makes me a dick, but I don't want to date one. Everyone has their own values and things they want in a significant other. Two things I value are emotional stability and ability to be rational regardless of the situation. That's my preference, but to each their own.


1. Oh, it may be common, but is it more common? You stated that it was in fact the real goal of most guys on that forum, but is that bold statement of seeming fact really the result of some kind of objective, rational analysis? I am inclined to think that it isn't - that your desire to defend this community is coloring your recollections with a bias and that perhaps you simply wish that's how it was, choosing to overlook the seedy nature of the origins of your wholesome self-improvement spin. Which is natural, I would too, because it's really quite ugly. A 1 out of 10, really. A warpig, as they say.

2. My point is not that you're a dick, but that this whole process smacks of superficiality. The example you mention is but one in many, and the generic tale is this: "Before I learned PUA, I was an average frustrated chump who could only get occasional sex from average or ugly looking women. Now I'm awesome because I can get any hot girl I want!" Everything is rated in terms of the number, ease, and frequency one can manipulate a woman into sleeping with you - and how attractive she is. That's not self-improvement at all. The self remains unchanged. The fear of women and the fear of rejection? Still there, no matter how many girls you can pick up at the bar and no matter how free of the taint of mental illness they may be. Only it's transformed - instead of manifesting as shyness, it manifests as a casual, flippant attitude towards women and sex in general. Or perhaps a cruel hostility, hiding under a mask of easygoing likability. Measuring "self" improvement by how others behave, i.e. they want to fuck you more, or give you more money, just doesn't work, or else Hugh Hefner and Donald Trump have better "selves," that is to say, they don't just get more sex or have more money, the sex and money is a sign that they are better people. Sort of like how mentally ill women are used as a sign, in your example, of being a non-improved self, that is to say, inferior people. Aaaand I don't buy that.

An improved self can overlook and accept flaws and find joy and contentment with less-than-perfect people, and less than perfect situations too. But PUA is about the opposite - its goal is about changing people you surround yourself with (i.e, more attractive women in your sex and romance life), and changing situations you're in, so that your current self can be satisfied with them. Because why change yourself? Just change the trappings. Buy a new car, become a better person!



1. You're right, my perception, the threads, or my memory may not be entirely accurate. I didn't make any thorough analysis, but I do believe as far as the rsd forums go, that there are more men on there wanting a relationship than wanting endless one night stands. For the guys that do want 1 night stands, I believe it's a phase they will grow out of once they gain enough success with it anyway. As far as they go, or even the mystery style guys that rehearse their lines, I see no reason to recolor any of it as I personally have no problem with what they are doing. I don't think it'll lead to happiness in the long run, but if that's how they want to live their life and they get good enough at acting so women want to sleep with them then that's their life.

2. If one's focus is one night stands then yes, it is quite superficial. For the people that focus on social techniques and rehearsed lines you're absolutely right, they are not improving in any way beyond sexuality. I'm not sure about the fear leaving thing. Some think they surpass it, some say with confidence you learn to approach in spite of fear.

As far as self improvement goes, I never said that how improved you are matches linearly with how many girls you can get. The path I followed is that if you have social issues and aren't able to get women, self help will help you improve to the point of where you are able to meet, attract, and develope a relationship with a well adjusted girl. Or naturally be able to pickup women from the club if that's your goal, but the point is to do it through confidence of self and positivity. What who can get the most women actually measures is a whole question that I don't have the answer to, maybe scarface had the answer.

I can see the bipolar thing was a fuck up on my part. That's just my personal bias due to a bad experience.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby zmic » Mon Feb 25, 2013 11:55 pm UTC

doogly wrote:
zmic wrote:
Don Calvus wrote:No, it just makes you an ignorant.
Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.
As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!

if you don't want to date a certain type of person, since when do you need to justify that?


Because once your dick has spoken, it is impolite for us to start noticing your biases and prejudices?


labeling somebody's personal preference a "bias" or a "prejudice" is a nice rhetorical trick, but it does not make a point.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby doogly » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:18 am UTC

So you think a personal preference is categorically distinct from a bias or prejudice?
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby blowfishhootie » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:23 am UTC

doogly wrote:So you think a personal preference is categorically distinct from a bias or prejudice?


Obviously not. The person's point is that everyone has preferences, ergo everyone has things that could be called "bias" or "prejudice," so it's not a very useful rhetorical tool.

(Please don't confuse this as agreement with the idiot(s) that knows nothing about bipolar disorder.)
Last edited by blowfishhootie on Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:34 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby (╯°□°)╯︵ ┻━┻ » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:24 am UTC

zmic wrote:
doogly wrote:
zmic wrote:
Don Calvus wrote:No, it just makes you an ignorant.
Plus, love has nothing to do with "preferences". You may well fall in love one day with a "bipolar woman", and remember what I said.
As for "rational regardless of the situation", well, it is so naïve I don't even know where to start!

if you don't want to date a certain type of person, since when do you need to justify that?


Because once your dick has spoken, it is impolite for us to start noticing your biases and prejudices?


labeling somebody's personal preference a "bias" or a "prejudice" is a nice rhetorical trick, but it does not make a point.

Speaking of making a point, I don't know if you've missed it.
Dickbag comment:
I've read plenty of stories of guys on the forums whom before they worked on improving themselves attracted drug addicts, bipolar women, people who would slash their tires or throw shit through their windows when they were in a bad mood.

sounds a lot to me like he's saying "before they improved they dated {dangerous, crazy people}"
Which is a huge dickbag move, because bipolar people (men or women, who would have thought?) are not, actually, inherently dangerous, irrational or worth comparing to drug addicts. Who also don't have to be so bad depending on teh drug, said the stoner.
Follow up:
Well, my ex was bipolar and it's definitely not for me. I don't find depression or cerebral palsy attractive either and don't have plans of starting a relationship with someone having either of those problems. Does that also make me a dick? Regardless, if being bipolar is a turn on for you then great, I hope you find someone like that you can be happy with. We all want different things and are attracted to different types of people.

"My ex was bipolar, and I don't want to date anyone like her again, so therefore all bipolar women must probably be the same, and I don't want to be around people with those kind of problems. But clearly because you took issue with it, you do want to bone these crazy people, and that's great for you."
To which we can only boggle and say, No, Bro, I think it was equating bipolar people to dangerous people that pissed us off.
and then there was this:
I can see the bipolar thing was a fuck up on my part. That's just my personal bias due to a bad experience.

So clearly, he has got the point more than you.
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby Weeks » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:49 am UTC

PUAs are the worst artists ever.
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby morsus854 » Tue Feb 26, 2013 12:52 am UTC

Weeks wrote:PUAs are the worst artists ever.


I disagree, the best artist I know boned half my social circle.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby ShifterCat » Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:14 am UTC

philsov wrote:
ShifterCat wrote:Relevant to the discussion, and also amusing:

http://slacktory.com/2013/02/okc_ebooks-deconstructs-online-pick-up-lines-with-horse_ebooks-tweets/

PUAs trying to seduce a Twitterbot. The results are as revealing and hilarious as one could expect.


That's a matter of mislabeling. Sure, they reveal themselves as sex-seeking creeps, but I'm not seeing anything that makes them a pickup artist more than any other random guy. Especially based on opening lines -- "How are you finding this site?" is a normal conversation. Calling these guys "PUAs" is just another way to distance oneself from the rest of the crowd by "othering" them. But I assure you the author is a witty, marvelous catch who in no way immediately wants to sleep with all the female readers.

:roll:


Err... no. First of all, note that the author runs a blog keeping track of PUA conversations, so he (I'm guessing "he" from the name) is something of an expert on the subject. But more importantly, a lot of the guys featured are using PUA techniques, eg. trying to get their "target"'s attention through confrontation ("You copied me saying you like old school video games, I demand an answer"), claiming to have read her personality, making ridiculous boasts ("what is it like to talk to the most attractive man you will ever talk to") etc.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby Max™ » Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:22 am UTC

philsov wrote:
ShifterCat wrote:Relevant to the discussion, and also amusing:

http://slacktory.com/2013/02/okc_ebooks-deconstructs-online-pick-up-lines-with-horse_ebooks-tweets/

PUAs trying to seduce a Twitterbot. The results are as revealing and hilarious as one could expect.


That's a matter of mislabeling. Sure, they reveal themselves as sex-seeking creeps, but I'm not seeing anything that makes them a pickup artist more than any other random guy. Especially based on opening lines -- "How are you finding this site?" is a normal conversation. Calling these guys "PUAs" is just another way to distance oneself from the rest of the crowd by "othering" them. But I assure you the author is a witty, marvelous catch who in no way immediately wants to sleep with all the female readers.

:roll:

I love the avatar because I picture you typing this out while doing this:
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby dii » Tue Feb 26, 2013 1:48 am UTC

PUA is a religion.

They have their own priests (those guys running seminars).
They have their own pope (that douchebag in the furry hat).
They have their sermons (the seminars and workshops).
They have their holy scripture (with lots of arcane made-up words, and existing words with different meanings).
They have the patriarchal cultural norms of a religion.
They are heteronormative and their holy scripture either ignores homosexuality or considers it an abomination, just like a religion.
They classify people as infidels and righteous believers (AFC's and PUA's).

And just like religions, they don't have any actual evidence for their claims, they pervert science and willfully ignore facts, and treat their own teachings as the One Sacred Truth.

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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby philsov » Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:17 am UTC

ShifterCat wrote:
philsov wrote:
ShifterCat wrote:Relevant to the discussion, and also amusing:

http://slacktory.com/2013/02/okc_ebooks-deconstructs-online-pick-up-lines-with-horse_ebooks-tweets/

PUAs trying to seduce a Twitterbot. The results are as revealing and hilarious as one could expect.


That's a matter of mislabeling. Sure, they reveal themselves as sex-seeking creeps, but I'm not seeing anything that makes them a pickup artist more than any other random guy. Especially based on opening lines -- "How are you finding this site?" is a normal conversation. Calling these guys "PUAs" is just another way to distance oneself from the rest of the crowd by "othering" them. But I assure you the author is a witty, marvelous catch who in no way immediately wants to sleep with all the female readers.

:roll:


Err... no. First of all, note that the author runs a blog keeping track of PUA conversations, so he (I'm guessing "he" from the name) is something of an expert on the subject. But more importantly, a lot of the guys featured are using PUA techniques, eg. trying to get their "target"'s attention through confrontation ("You copied me saying you like old school video games, I demand an answer"), claiming to have read her personality, making ridiculous boasts ("what is it like to talk to the most attractive man you will ever talk to") etc.


I appreciate the explanation. How does this describe victim number #1, though? His conversation is literally "Are you OK?", "What's your name", and "I wanna sex you" x3. I admit the opener is kinda weird, but... PUA?

I love the avatar because I picture you typing this out while doing this:


Hehe, thanks. It's a screengrab from this comic (or several others like it):

Spoiler:
Image


Edit: Hell, your gif is a lot better quality. Thanks for the new avatar :D

morsus854 wrote:The only downside is I never met anyone irl that followed the rsd style. I went out with a few of the rehearsed lines style of pua a few times, but their style came off so wrong and fake to me we couldn't maintain the same vibe while interacting with groups of people at the club. Continued hanging out with them in social circle, but that's it.


There's an RSD style? I thought it was just a bunch of stuff about core confidence, but it's been a long time since I last listened to the seminars. Ideally one shouldn't be able to tell one who's on the RSD style versus someone who's just charismatic and confident, right?
Last edited by philsov on Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:49 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby jpk » Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:18 am UTC

Klear wrote:
Jackpot777 wrote:
morsus854 wrote:I never got into the one night stand side of pickup, but after reading it's forums...


Became a better person. But not when it comes to second grade English use.

Image


Ah yes! Snarkily pointing out grammatical errors is the way to be a better person!



Always works for me. And I'm a pretty good person at this point.

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Belial
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Re: 1178: "Pickup Artists"

Postby Belial » Tue Feb 26, 2013 2:59 am UTC

Oh my blithering fuck this was a terrible thread the first time, and it's a terrible thread again.

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