1190: "Time"

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby charlie_grumbles » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:32 pm UTC

nerdsniped wrote:
keithl wrote:Safety of various shoreline places:

The volume of the Mediterranean is 3,750,000 km3, the average depth is 1,500m, so the average distance the water falls is 750m. The energy generated by filling that huge volume with water is 3.75E6 km3 x 1e12 kg/km3 x 750m x 9.8 m/s2 or 2.7e22 joules.

What happens to all that energy?
Spoiler:
The Reynolds number through the Gibraltar gap is enormous ( inertia effects >> viscosity effects ), and even larger through all the various gaps between mountains and islands - it will take a very long time for the energy to dissipate in viscosity, evaporation, etc. So water pours in through the gap, water accelerates throughout the Atlantic towards the gap, develops a lot of momentum, pours into the Mediterranean basin - and keeps moving, long after 3,750,000 km3 has passed through. It's like releasing a weight suspended by a spring; the weight will drop, bounce on the spring, and bounce back above the original level of release.

Well, that's what's going to happen with a Mediterranean's worth of water, until there's been enough Time to couple all that potential and kinetic energy into viscosity and evaporation. And like the bouncing spring, the water may have waves as high the the Mediterranean is deep. Indeed, given the complex reflections off the irregularly shaped bottom and sides, there may be waves even higher. There may be sporadic waves lapping up to the Pyrenees, the Alps, through gaps in the Apennines entirely across Italy. This is NOT an overdamped system.

Much depends on how big a gap is torn through GiIbraltar - for major, impossible-to-flee-on-foot changes to occur in days or even weeks, the gap must be large and the acceleration of the seawater stupendous. At those scales, the "overflow" and rebound waves will be far higher than Chateau d'If, a few meters above sea level.

Here in Oregon, there is sand on tops of 100 foot cliffs from the 1700 AD tsunami, caused by a 9+ earthquake in the Cascadia subduction zone. We know exactly when that tsunami happened, because the waves reached Japan many hours later and killed people. It wiped out almost all of the near-shore Indian tribes in the Pacific Northwest, and only chance topography saved a few tribes farther up the hills. These enormous subduction zone quakes happen about every 300 years. One is likely to happen before this wiki posting goes off line, and I expect some enterprising but idiotic reporter will find this posting after that terrible event, and create mass panic in Italy.

Great analysis!
It does seem like the castle is not going to be a wise place to ride things out, even if it is known to be above the ultimate sea level...

I don't have a lot of analysis to back it up, but this seems like an overestimate of the effects. The mountain ranges north and south of the opening limit the possible flow. A lot of friction will dissipate some of the energy (grinding of rocks, ...) A Mediterranean's worth of water isn't being dumped in all at once at one end. Locally, on the edge of their current sea it will be quite violent, but as it fills, the rate of rise slows.

Anyway. Seems too bad to be true.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Eliram » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:39 pm UTC

Did a 50km in ~7 hrs (with full gear) a long time ago. Could barely walk in the next two days.
It's about time.

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Re: Basin Run

Postby NoMouse » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:45 pm UTC

Someguy945 wrote:
charlie_grumbles wrote:Hmmm. 20 miles in a day is pretty hard, even on flat ground. Especially if you are carrying anything and you do need water. Day after day? Maybe. You do get used to it after a while. But very hard. They don't seem to have been exerting themselves a lot on the way up, actually, and seldom mentioned it.
It's easier for them than us if they are tribal people who are used to walking everywhere and farming/hunting all the time, right?

Yeah, they don't sit at the computer the whole day reading OTT... :lol: Or lying on the couch, sitting in an office, whatever today's people do.
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Re: Random Musings

Postby svenman » Sat Jul 20, 2013 8:56 pm UTC

Davidy wrote:As the Germans say:
Spoiler:
warten, für es


Being German myself, I'd say, more idiomatically,

Spoiler:
Wart's ab.


And while I'm at it, the current command would be

Spoiler:
LAUF!


No prizes for guessing how to translate the intermediate tooltip text. :-)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:00 pm UTC

Running is tirONG...
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Flado » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:09 pm UTC

jjjdavidson wrote:
azule wrote:
Exodies wrote:Does anyone here know anyone else here irl? Do you think you would enjoy <this> more or less if your real life friends were here?
-- snip --

I get something of both worlds. One daughter is reading along; my wife and other daughter just nod and smile tolerantly.

Same here, except the other daughter and the wife have no idea what we're up to (and talking about).
I'd definitely enjoy this more if more of my Outside friends were non-heretical. And, of course, if I had knowledge of that fact. Come to think of it, I do have an Outside friend who lives in Amstelveen...
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby HES » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:19 pm UTC

charlie_grumbles wrote:
Spoiler:
Eutychus wrote:A quick Google map estimation puts me at 1000km as the crow flies from the Château d'If. Anyone nearer?

More worryingly, the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor is currently under construction at Cadarache, about 50km from Marseille, tokamak and all. It sits right on a seismic fault line and is destined to be used, amongst other things, to conduct experiments into nuclear fusion (as I understand it, which is not very much - I know about Cadarache through my translation work).

As I say, I'm not an expert, but it strikes me that 11,000 years is perhaps not such a long time when looking at the environmental consequences of an installation like that and the apparent occurrence of major natural disasters. Anyone care to comment?

Not much danger if it is radiation you are worried about. The tokamak doesn't take heavy elements (uranium...) and split the atoms. It starts with something like hydrogen or helium and makes slightly heavier elements that aren't themselves radioactive. But there are a bunch of fission power generation stations about, I'd guess. Don't build (any more) of those on fault lines, please.

By my understanding, doesn't a fusion plant require a fission reactor to gain the immense activation energy to begin the fusion process? (Not remotely an expert)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby HAL9000 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:27 pm UTC

Flado wrote:Hey FutureFolk, I just had a terrifying idea: what if y'all decide to do an OTT meetup Outside in my back yard (read: same continent) and I, being lost in time, learn about it post factum :shock: :idea: :?:
Someone will surely think of the poor old retired Patriarch and drop him a PM in such a case, right? Guys? Right?

If we do plan a meetup, there'll have to be a separate thread for it in the "Meetups" subforum. We'd all probably throw links to it in our signatures.
EDIT: This is my thousandth post. That means my word here is law (if you were already planning to obey me, that is)! When a meetup is planned, there must be a separate thread, or else. (or else there won't be a separate thread, that is)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby taixzo » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:30 pm UTC

HES wrote:
charlie_grumbles wrote:
Spoiler:
Eutychus wrote:A quick Google map estimation puts me at 1000km as the crow flies from the Château d'If. Anyone nearer?

More worryingly, the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor is currently under construction at Cadarache, about 50km from Marseille, tokamak and all. It sits right on a seismic fault line and is destined to be used, amongst other things, to conduct experiments into nuclear fusion (as I understand it, which is not very much - I know about Cadarache through my translation work).

As I say, I'm not an expert, but it strikes me that 11,000 years is perhaps not such a long time when looking at the environmental consequences of an installation like that and the apparent occurrence of major natural disasters. Anyone care to comment?

Not much danger if it is radiation you are worried about. The tokamak doesn't take heavy elements (uranium...) and split the atoms. It starts with something like hydrogen or helium and makes slightly heavier elements that aren't themselves radioactive. But there are a bunch of fission power generation stations about, I'd guess. Don't build (any more) of those on fault lines, please.

By my understanding, doesn't a fusion plant require a fission reactor to gain the immense activation energy to begin the fusion process? (Not remotely an expert)


Not necessarily. It just needs a large amount of energy; that could come from any power source, and be stored in supercapacitors for when it is needed to start the process.
You may be thinking of H-bombs, which did indeed use fission to kick-start the process; but that is only really feasible in a bomb scenario, because the immense temperatures would explode any fissionable material within milliseconds.

ETA: Happy 1,000 posts, HAL9000!
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ChronosDragon » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:42 pm UTC

Happy 1000, HAL9000!

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eTA: brain fart
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Eliram » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:43 pm UTC

BrianX wrote:
cryptoengineer wrote:
charlie_grumbles wrote:
edo wrote:WRT languages: Hebrew hasn't changed much in 5000 years right? Just a bunch of loanwords added? I think written (and studied) languages will have a much longer shelf life. English might be well studied due to the preponderance of it in "ancient texts" (hey my ancient texts were in English! How fortuitous!)

Hebrew is probably a special case, given the central importance of the Torah and its study. I think that would tend to keep the language more or less stable, since most males (at least) study it for at least a while and there are many scholars. It is meticulously copied out, though errors are known to occur.


Blindposting here - Modern Israeli Hebrew has already diverged enough from Torah Hebrew that an Israeli who hasn't studied the latter has a *lot* of difficulty understanding it.


That's kinda how it happens with real-world languages. The tension between uniformity and everyday usage has been a major issue for Esperanto speakers over the years too (and Esperanto, IIRC, was created around the same time as Modern Hebrew, give or take a couple decades).

With spoken language, that's probably true. Depending on the time period, obviously, but it would take me some effort to understand a Hebrew speaker from even 100 years ago. I probably will, though. With written language, this is even more complicated. Ancient Hebrew script differs quite a bit from modern Hebrew letters, as can sometimes be seen whenever artifacts with Hebrew scripts are found and dated 2-3000 years ago or more. It's still Hebrew, though, and after a short time it can be read easily (think of it as a different font with similar but not obvious letters).

& Happy 1000 שמח HAL
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It's about time.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby FullOfIt » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:43 pm UTC

b2bomberkrh wrote:It's been a long time since I read this, but it wasn't my idea originally. My understanding is that technology is adding a lot of new vocabulary, but it is language structure, spelling, pronunciation, grammar that is slowing down its rate of change. I wasn't trying to imply languages haven't changed here in the OTC, but to point out that comparing the changes to the changes from the last 10,000 years is inappropriate, since the changing of languages is not a constant thing, and modern technology will have an affect on that. I do agree that Randall is likely to make it possible to decipher, and still think we should be looking for what the language is based on. I'm not even close to convinced that it is a completely contrived language. Also, I don't think language changes back to 1013 is far enough to make language gibberish. The King James Bible from 1611 is completely readable, and the Canterbury Tales written in Old English dating to approximately 1000 years ago is strange to read, but is nowhere close to gibberish:

"WHAN that Aprille with his shoures soote
The droghte of Marche hath perced to the roote..."

When that April with his showers soft, the drought of March has pierced to the root


Blindpost from page 1153.

This reminded me of an article I read a while ago about some particulars of Swedish writing. In it the author referred to a court transcript from a couple of hundred years ago (I think the 1400's). The interesting part is that the transcript showed that the spoken language of that time was not terribly different to modern Swedish. However, if you would try to read literature from that time it would be very difficult. The conclusion being that the language as a whole hadn't evolved that much, it was just the written portion of it that had changed a lot.

So if this "rule" applies to all languages, it means that the evolution of it might be smaller than one would think.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Fictioneer » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:46 pm UTC

NetWeasel wrote:Hi, new people!

Just a note on posting your own images:
(Really, if you know this, don't bother clicking on the spoiler)


Blindposting from a few pages back to say Thank You! to NetWeasel for the instructions!

Edited to spell NetWeasel's name properly.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby NoMouse » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:47 pm UTC

HES wrote:By my understanding, doesn't a fusion plant require a fission reactor to gain the immense activation energy to begin the fusion process? (Not remotely an expert)

Nope. All you need is four robotic tentacles implanted in your back and a small amount of tritium. :mrgreen:
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby higgs-boson » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:50 pm UTC

Angua wrote:Ring
Image


Zorin_75 wrote:HiONG
Image



Did you ever wonder what would have happened if that guy would have had knowledge of Cuegan's language?

No? Let me show you:

Spoiler:
Image
Image



(redundance)
Spoiler:
Meeeooooow!
it_happens_1.png

it_happens_2.png
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:54 pm UTC

Flado wrote:
jjjdavidson wrote:
azule wrote:
Exodies wrote:Does anyone here know anyone else here irl? Do you think you would enjoy <this> more or less if your real life friends were here?
-- snip --

I get something of both worlds. One daughter is reading along; my wife and other daughter just nod and smile tolerantly.

Same here, except the other daughter and the wife have no idea what we're up to (and talking about).
I'd definitely enjoy this more if more of my Outside friends were non-heretical. And, of course, if I had knowledge of that fact. Come to think of it, I do have an Outside friend who lives in Amstelveen...

That wouldn't be me, by any chance? Image (Probably not, you'd know it was me, I'm mscha pretty much everywhere.)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Rule110 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:54 pm UTC

Valarya wrote:
Rule110 wrote:Randomly, one more thing:
Spoiler:
Image

Yesssss, THIS! I don't think I saw anyone else comment on this Rule, but it's so perfect - hahah. For me, I try to use the left-arrow because that's how I scroll through the Book of Aubron. Can't tell you how many times I've done that. :? :mrgreen:

*waves hi to all the new people* Wow! Welcome! :D

Oh good, it isn't just me then. :mrgreen:

hunjoh wrote:I used to do a lot of backpacking 30 years ago, before many of the modern materials people now take for granted were available.

Spoiler:
In the Sierras 15-20 miles a day was not uncommon on well-groomed trails. The longest day I remember was 25 miles which included 3 +10,000 ft. passes. In the Grand Canyon, where there were lots of escarpments to go over and no trails, we averaged more like 7 miles a day....

The mileage figures above were with a full frame pack, sleeping bag, food for a week or more, and water for a day or two. My pack weighed 30-35 pounds and I weighed 130-135. (I looked like Cueball with hair....) In the Grand Canyon we carried more water, more like 3 or 4 days worth, and the extra water put our packs into the 40+ pound range.

Having said all of that, Cuegan would have kicked our butts. They are used to living a semi-nomadic life style, they are traveling light and fast, they are acclimated to the climate and living outdoors, and they are motivated. Their is no way that I would have been able to keep up with them.

Also, going downhill is much faster than going up hill especially when you are young and bouncy. Given that their trip up was a leisurely "let's see what is around the next bend" walk and their trip down is an emergency, I would expect that in their shoes I could make the trip down in about half the time it took me to get up to the castle. A lot of that extra mileage would come from starting earlier and going later. I know from experience that when you really need to, you can see enough to walk just by the light of the stars. Cloud cover makes it too dark, but any moonlight makes it bright enough to walk easily. And since we haven't seen the moon on their way up, then they should start having moonlight on their way down.

And while I am rambling on, if I put myself in their position I would travel back the way I came. I would already know the way, I would know the landmarks, I would know where to get water and food. If I were trying to travel fast that would be very important to me. I know from my trips in the Grand Canyon that one can waste the better part of a day trying to find water in an arid landscape, even if you know where to look. So I would blitz my way back down the path I came, planning while I was walking where to stock up on supplies and knowing how much I would need to carry to get me to the next resource.

Also, they have to be thinking that they are going to get home before the water gets there. So they can plan on not needing to resupply for the last day or so because they can fuel up at their village.

If they hit the flood waters before they get home, then all bets are off. Then they are going to breaking a new trail escaping the flood waters while trying to intercept the fleeing 40.

Very well said. That all makes sense to me (and agrees with my experience where that overlaps).

I'm in the "authorial license" camp when it comes to food consumption figures. Authors often don't want to deal with food realistically because it's dull and adds hassle without adding to the story. This is true on every level from individual characters on wilderness journeys, to entire societies. For all of Tolkien's care in describing every meal the hobbits ate on the trail, I don't think he calculated the actual weight and volume of lembas needed to hike to Mordor, or its plausible calorie content; and if he did, he then rolled his eyes, crumpled up the sheet of arithmetic, threw it away, and muttered "elfin magic."

(John Crowley, in the wonderful and under-appreciated post-industrial future novel Engine Summer, invented "St. Bea's Bread," an alien plant/fungus (collected and brought to earth by a space probe in the final era before the collapse) that is nutritive when smoked (as in, smoked like tobacco to ingest it). That let his protagonist get on with exploring the world without it becoming a wilderness survival manual, and without all the surviving societies he meets being dominated by subsistence farming. Likewise, when Cuegan's food situation starts looking questionable (especially when they don't seem interested in catching animals for meat), I just imagine the bottoms of their bags are filled with dried ju-ju berries that have twenty different vitamins and minerals and the approximate calorie content of refined plutonium.)

Given the likely temperatures (and scant rations) in the basin, Megan and Cueball could very well be built like Ethiopian marathoners. Yeah, that shouldn't mean they can defy the laws of physics, but I'm not going to complain if they don't give up halfway through their mission due to metabolic breakdown from insufficient caloric intake.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:57 pm UTC

Happy 1000th, HAL!
I've given up on the cake thing (lost track while up to my neck in ketchup yesterday), but for your 1000th I'll make an exception.
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ETA: I thought we already had a meeting planned? Château d'If, some time in the year 13000-something?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Exodies » Sat Jul 20, 2013 9:59 pm UTC

mscha wrote:As far as Time's time is concerned, I think it's safe to say, based on stars and planets, that either Time is taking place in a real time & place in the far (13000-ish year) future, or it's in a made-up Randallverse.

{P1079}
Wait a minute. Are you implying it could take place 13000 years in the future and not be made up?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby higgs-boson » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:00 pm UTC

AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby higgs-boson » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:02 pm UTC

DP, since last was an ONG...
Exodies wrote:
mscha wrote:As far as Time's time is concerned, I think it's safe to say, based on stars and planets, that either Time is taking place in a real time & place in the far (13000-ish year) future, or it's in a made-up Randallverse.

{P1079}
Wait a minute. Are you implying it could take place 13000 years in the future and not be made up?


Erm, by the way - this could be a problem.

I strongly believe in European craftsmanship. But do I expect the Château d'If to last more than 10'000 years?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby a_s_h_e_n » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:03 pm UTC

Exodies wrote:
mscha wrote:As far as Time's time is concerned, I think it's safe to say, based on stars and planets, that either Time is taking place in a real time & place in the far (13000-ish year) future, or it's in a made-up Randallverse.

{P1079}
Wait a minute. Are you implying it could take place 13000 years in the future and not be made up?

GLR is a prophet warning us of the dangers of living in the Mediterranean basin 11,000 years from now. As for the usefulness of his prophecy, I don't know - maybe he has forseen that the Next Great Prophet will be born in the 40 and will perish unless this information is handed down to him.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby charlie_grumbles » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:03 pm UTC

HES wrote:
charlie_grumbles wrote:
Spoiler:
Eutychus wrote:A quick Google map estimation puts me at 1000km as the crow flies from the Château d'If. Anyone nearer?

More worryingly, the International Thermonuclear Experimental Reactor is currently under construction at Cadarache, about 50km from Marseille, tokamak and all. It sits right on a seismic fault line and is destined to be used, amongst other things, to conduct experiments into nuclear fusion (as I understand it, which is not very much - I know about Cadarache through my translation work).

As I say, I'm not an expert, but it strikes me that 11,000 years is perhaps not such a long time when looking at the environmental consequences of an installation like that and the apparent occurrence of major natural disasters. Anyone care to comment?

Not much danger if it is radiation you are worried about. The tokamak doesn't take heavy elements (uranium...) and split the atoms. It starts with something like hydrogen or helium and makes slightly heavier elements that aren't themselves radioactive. But there are a bunch of fission power generation stations about, I'd guess. Don't build (any more) of those on fault lines, please.

By my understanding, doesn't a fusion plant require a fission reactor to gain the immense activation energy to begin the fusion process? (Not remotely an expert)


No. A fusion bomb does, since you want the reaction to be instantaneous and short lived. A tokamak normally uses lasers or some such to focus energy (normally from the grid) into a tiny area.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:09 pm UTC

Exodies wrote:
mscha wrote:As far as Time's time is concerned, I think it's safe to say, based on stars and planets, that either Time is taking place in a real time & place in the far (13000-ish year) future, or it's in a made-up Randallverse.

{P1079}
Wait a minute. Are you implying it could take place 13000 years in the future and not be made up?

The time and place, yes; not the story.
(But by the time you read this, you'll know a lot more about the time, place and circumstances of Time...)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Zorin_75 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:10 pm UTC

higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image

That's a piece of scenery we haven't seen before...
Go Minim go!

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby nsub1 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:11 pm UTC

So so much happening, I'm sure this is gonna get buried. But v. 0.04 of Beanish Serif is here, with seventeen of the twenty-two Transliterated Characters! (The missing ones are A, X, W, 3, and q.) After that will be doing the "c" (which I'll probably do as a separate character, not like a vowel), then kerning, then figuring out how the heck to deal with the vowels.

Also! HAL, that's in binary, right?

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:14 pm UTC

Zorin_75 wrote:
Spoiler:
higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image

That's a piece of scenery we haven't seen before...

Yeah, I was just going to say that it looks like Cuegan is lost.
On the way over:
Spoiler:
ImageImage
and now:
Spoiler:
ImageImage
I'm pretty sure we haven't seen that tree before...

ETA: note that it could simply be a piece of skipped scenery on the way over – we had already concluded that ‘scenes’ are not contiguous, and having seen the maps, we now know for sure that we don't see most of their journey.
Last edited by mscha on Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:18 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Nilpferdschaf » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:16 pm UTC

higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image


We're now where we were at np2951 http://geekwagon.net/projects/xkcd1190/?frame=2951&framediff=2755

The next frame is going to be interesting, maybe we'll see what's between these two frames:
Spoiler:
Image
Image


Has this been discussed before?

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:20 pm UTC

Nilpferdschaf wrote:We're now where we were at np2951 http://geekwagon.net/projects/xkcd1190/?frame=2951&framediff=2755

No, we're not. You're one np behind.
(And if you have to use heretical frame numbers instead of the canonical ones which I've been meticulously keeping track of for months, please say which ones you're using.)
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mindonner » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:21 pm UTC

This may well be because my main non-English language is Japanese, but I can't help thinking that Beanish is likely more of a syllabary than an alphabet - partly because some of the characters look slightly like kana, but also because the words/sentences seem quite short otherwise, and a syllabary allows for longer words with fewer characters (as well as a lack of normal punctuation, where actual syllables are used to indicate a question or an imperative rather than a tone of voice that is signified by ?, !, etc). I don't think the characters are quite complex enough for a fully pictogrammatic language like Chinese, but with many languages based on a more symbol=meaning foundation, the written is much more stable than the spoken - so, ancient Chinese and Japanese are still comprehensible to the modern reader, but they'd be hard-pressed to guarantee that the pronunciation is still the same, ie. it's very different to the evolution of the European alphabetic languages.

OTOH... not sure how one of those languages would have migrated to the Mediterranean basin. Unless Chinese did become the Standard World Tongue right before Antares knocked out all the electronics or whatever happened. :shock:

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby higgs-boson » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:21 pm UTC

mscha wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:
Spoiler:
higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image

That's a piece of scenery we haven't seen before...

Yeah, I was just going to say that it looks like Cuegan is lost.

Rosetta seems quite confident that Cuegan cannot make the way back and warn their tribe in time.
Nevertheless Cuegan is running. And we remember Megan taking the map with her. Maybe she's added a plan. Maybe a shorter way. Maybe another lookout which can be seen from below, so a signal fire would be seen, at least at night?
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Eliram » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:27 pm UTC

nsub1 wrote:So so much happening, I'm sure this is gonna get buried. But v. 0.04 of Beanish Serif is here, with seventeen of the twenty-two Transliterated Characters! (The missing ones are A, X, W, 3, and q.) After that will be doing the "c" (which I'll probably do as a separate character, not like a vowel), then kerning, then figuring out how the heck to deal with the vowels.

Also! HAL, that's in binary, right?

Hebrew vowels which are usually written in children's books and poerty, but mostly omitted, appear below, above or inside the letters they affect. There are unicode values for them, once typed, the cursor does not physically advances, but the vowel dots or lines are added to the previous char. They can be accumulated too.
Hope that helps.
It's about time.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby ucim » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:28 pm UTC

higgs-boson wrote:Maybe another lookout which can be seen from below, so a signal fire would be seen, at least at night?
I'm not sure about a signal fire - to be effective the recipient has to know what the signal is. That is, there needs to be some sort of pre-arranged code (one if by land...) or alphabet (dit dah dit) and there's no evidence for any of that. Absent that, all you have is a fire, far on the horizon.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:28 pm UTC

higgs-boson wrote:
mscha wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:
Spoiler:
higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image

That's a piece of scenery we haven't seen before...

Yeah, I was just going to say that it looks like Cuegan is lost.

Rosetta seems quite confident that Cuegan cannot make the way back and warn their tribe in time.
Nevertheless Cuegan is running. And we remember Megan taking the map with her. Maybe she's added a plan. Maybe a shorter way. Maybe another lookout which can be seen from below, so a signal fire would be seen, at least at night?

I think it's unlikely, they're supposedly on their way to the tower, but you never know.
We'll find out in a few newpix.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Kieryn » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:31 pm UTC

Did anyone theorize yet as to why the Mediterranean (presumably at the Strait of Gibraltar) was plugged up again at some point in the next few thousand years?

If it wasn't plugged up by some volcano or something, then there must have been a sea level drop of about 1500-2000 feet to cut off the sea from the ocean. The only thing that could do that is a severe ice age, the kind of which i don't think would be possible on the timescale of just a few thousand years.

It must have been something like a volcano or formation of a super-volcano caldera I guess.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby higgs-boson » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:31 pm UTC

mscha wrote:
Spoiler:
higgs-boson wrote:
mscha wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:
higgs-boson wrote:AIN'T THAT JUST THE WAY THAT LIFE GOES DONG?
Image

That's a piece of scenery we haven't seen before...

Yeah, I was just going to say that it looks like Cuegan is lost.

Rosetta seems quite confident that Cuegan cannot make the way back and warn their tribe in time.
Nevertheless Cuegan is running. And we remember Megan taking the map with her. Maybe she's added a plan. Maybe a shorter way. Maybe another lookout which can be seen from below, so a signal fire would be seen, at least at night?

I think it's unlikely, they're supposedly on their way to the tower, but you never know.
We'll find out in a few newpix.

Hum. Point taken. I don't feel like saying "wait for it", because waiting for people to drown is normally none of my business. We'll see.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby HAL9000 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:36 pm UTC

Kieryn wrote:Did anyone theorize yet as to why the Mediterranean (presumably at the Strait of Gibraltar) was plugged up again at some point in the next few thousand years?

If it wasn't plugged up by some volcano or something, then there must have been a sea level drop of about 1500-2000 feet to cut off the sea from the ocean. The only thing that could do that is a severe ice age, the kind of which i don't think would be possible on the timescale of just a few thousand years.

It must have been something like a volcano or formation of a super-volcano caldera I guess.

Or someone tried to drain the oceans.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby mscha » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:38 pm UTC

Kieryn wrote:Did anyone theorize yet as to why the Mediterranean (presumably at the Strait of Gibraltar) was plugged up again at some point in the next few thousand years?

If it wasn't plugged up by some volcano or something, then there must have been a sea level drop of about 1500-2000 feet to cut off the sea from the ocean. The only thing that could do that is a severe ice age, the kind of which i don't think would be possible on the timescale of just a few thousand years.

It must have been something like a volcano or formation of a super-volcano caldera I guess.

Yes. Image

There must have been some kind of apocalypse that destroyed human civilization, and whatever it as (nuclear war, supervolcano, comet, whatever) might have caused a nuclear winter, and/or blocked the Strait of Gibraltar. (Even a nuclear winter wouldn't drop the sea level that fast, though, I'd think; those glaciers need a long time to build.)
A significant temperature drop would also explain how the Cueganites can survive in the heat of the Mediterranean basin, 2½ km below sea level.
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby Eliram » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:47 pm UTC

mscha wrote:
Kieryn wrote:Did anyone theorize yet as to why the Mediterranean (presumably at the Strait of Gibraltar) was plugged up again at some point in the next few thousand years?

If it wasn't plugged up by some volcano or something, then there must have been a sea level drop of about 1500-2000 feet to cut off the sea from the ocean. The only thing that could do that is a severe ice age, the kind of which i don't think would be possible on the timescale of just a few thousand years.

It must have been something like a volcano or formation of a super-volcano caldera I guess.

Yes. Image

There must have been some kind of apocalypse that destroyed human civilization, and whatever it as (nuclear war, supervolcano, comet, whatever) might have caused a nuclear winter, and/or blocked the Strait of Gibraltar. (Even a nuclear winter wouldn't drop the sea level that fast, though, I'd think; those glaciers need a long time to build.)
A significant temperature drop would also explain how the Cueganites can survive in the heat of the Mediterranean basin, 2½ km below sea level.

11000 years in the future? This might be man-made. With population explosion, lowering the sea level will provide priceless new lands to populate.
Edit: and we know which nation will come up with such an idea, right? Everything works great until the dutch boy goes home and takes his finger along with him.
It's about time.

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Re: 1190: "Time"

Postby HAL9000 » Sat Jul 20, 2013 10:51 pm UTC

Eliram wrote:
mscha wrote:
Kieryn wrote:Did anyone theorize yet as to why the Mediterranean (presumably at the Strait of Gibraltar) was plugged up again at some point in the next few thousand years?

If it wasn't plugged up by some volcano or something, then there must have been a sea level drop of about 1500-2000 feet to cut off the sea from the ocean. The only thing that could do that is a severe ice age, the kind of which i don't think would be possible on the timescale of just a few thousand years.

It must have been something like a volcano or formation of a super-volcano caldera I guess.

Yes. Image

There must have been some kind of apocalypse that destroyed human civilization, and whatever it as (nuclear war, supervolcano, comet, whatever) might have caused a nuclear winter, and/or blocked the Strait of Gibraltar. (Even a nuclear winter wouldn't drop the sea level that fast, though, I'd think; those glaciers need a long time to build.)
A significant temperature drop would also explain how the Cueganites can survive in the heat of the Mediterranean basin, 2½ km below sea level.

11000 years in the future? This might be man-made. With population explosion, lowering the sea level will provide priceless new lands to populate.

Perhaps Black Hat Guy will be involved somehow. After all, he has an interest in volcanoes, and when they will erupt:
Spoiler:
Image

As well as using the resources from other time periods:
Spoiler:
Image
HAL9000 wrote:I find it simultaneously fascinating and disturbing that the most profound things I've read in the past months I have encountered in or been led to by an internet forum thread about a webcomic.


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