Page 324 of 2688

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:20 am UTC
by cmyk
See? Now everyone who bailed is gonna miss all the pixels change!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:20 am UTC
by boozledorf
KarMann wrote:
boozledorf wrote:For those who can't see it:

Wait, isn't that frame 603, not 602 as you seem to indicate?

You're right, I miscounted. I'll go back and fix them.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:22 am UTC
by fatness
jjjdavidson wrote:On the contrary. The transmission of the truth of the OTC through fallible human systems in no way impugns the infallibility of the OTC itself.

Truly. Failure of the paper does not diminish that which is printed upon it.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:24 am UTC
by cmyk
Clearly the work of the intelligent raptor overlords from space. AKA: The Illuminati.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:25 am UTC
by Latent22
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:28 am UTC
by KarMann
cmyk wrote:Clearly the work of the intelligent raptor overlords from space. AKA: The Illuminati.

Gur Vyyhzvangv xabj abguvat bs bhe Encgbe Bireybeqf bs juvpu lbh fcrnx. Be fb V'ir urneq. Abg gung V jbhyq xabj.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:28 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
Quest progress: 259 out of 324 pages.
The Poles. NP 436.

I have reached the next signpost:
Spoiler:
BlitzGirl wrote:Quest progress: 149 out of 259 pages.
Attack of the Trebuchet. NP 222.

I have coma'ed twice since I last traveled the thread of Time, and the lack of chaos in my brain concerns me. Clearly I have been absent too long. Luckily my path now winds through posts affected by the Madness, as the Sandcastle is bombarded by the First Trebuchet. I suddenly desire to Capitalize as many Mundane Words as is Humanly Possible. It shall be All Too Easy to slip back into the Semen/Coffee River/Sea that is This Thread.

Also, THIS:
bouer wrote:Who needs their sanity. Read it all

At the end of the signpost I read my signature:

BlitzGirl wrote:I, BlitzGirl, Knight Temporal of the One True Comic, bestow upon thee, BlitzGirl, traverser of the thread of Time, the Knighthood Temporal, in recognition of true pilgrimage, perseverance, and pride in Time. Arise, and continue on thy Quest! Many newpages await thee still.

I, BlitzGirl, do so accept the knighthood bestowed upon me via signature by BlitzGirl.
So yay, I'm a knight! Maybe? I guess I'm going to call myself a Knight Temporal until somebody tells me otherwise.

This has been a perilous few newpages for me, my friends. Amid the discussion of whether the One True Comic is in 2D or 3D (I vote a 2D depiction of 3D events) and questions about the color of commas (I vote for coffee-colored commas), have been several links to TV Tropes. I heeded the warning of a Pre-Time Comic and scrolled by without clicking them. I was also nearly hypnotized by GIFs of the Recursion posted by Deadcode and cmyk (which were then quoted by other users several times:
Spoiler:
ImageImage

Thankfully, I recovered and resumed my quest.
Also, thanks to partingLance for sigging me. I find your location endlessly amusing.
Various other messages from the past and/or future:

Spoiler:
I nearly went into a loop when edo directed me back to page 100 to read some Ancient Text:
edo wrote:Ancient Text:
And Behold! She, that is like sky-fire, and the Donner of voices proclaim her. She travels to the beginning of Time, so that we may remember the mysteries surrounding the Gift of the Creator. She is the One Who is to Come.
And a voice from the future sayth unto her, "Fear not, for I bring tidings of great joy! For each time an ancient text be revealed, it will be revealed unto you, though it be ancient, and in the past of even the Time Traveler!"

It is good to know that I will be forewarned to the appearances of Ancient Text, though I hope to continue my motion forward through the thread of Time as well as I can. I appreciate your recognition of the fact that my name refers to lightning and not a strategy of tackling quarterbacks.

elementropy wrote:BlitzGirl: Breakfast should be ready when you arrive.

Sounds delicious! I really want to reach the future now; they have COOKIES!

Roia wrote:Blitzgirl: You're an inspiration to all of the devout in the One True Thread. May the hard times of your pilgrimage be over soon.

Thank you! I never expected to be inspiration for anybody when I began my Quest.

A post I came across that was altered by the future-cymk:
cmyk wrote:```~~~~**~*~!Whirly whirly time ripple!~*~**~~~~````

...Blitzgirl, you don't know me yet, but I'm future-cmyk from future-future-cmyk's past. Not a lot of time to explain, but if your Holiness could be so generous as to retrieve a stupid plastic whistle from page 293, where I foolishly gave it to my pre-Knighted self. Snatch it from him, and bring it back to the Newpix-Present when Time allows and return the Whistle of Temporal Harmony back to me and my order.

In doing so, you would officially Knight him as Sir Lord Vader from the Planet Vulcan, reinstating my official Knight Temporal capacity which will be stripped away from me in Time hence, whilst saving not only Time, but the Internet itself from certain oblivion. The Future is in your hands.... well, it will be... the Whistle that is...

Thanks, and watch out for the Illum--aww, nevermind, you'll find out...



```~~~~**~*~!Whirly whirly exiting time ripple!~*~**~~~~````

I was a lifeguard, so I totally understand the importance of whistles. If I happen to see it, I'll pluck it out of the Time-stream for you.

tman2nd wrote:YOU CAN MAKE IT BLITZGIRL!!!
And here's proof.
Image

I'm not convinced. I seem to be stalling out at 80%. I'll have to start a-Questing a little harder.

And now that this horrendously large signpost is concluded, onward!

P.S. I see a number of you have been clicking on my blog, which is completely unrelated to my Quest through the thread of Time, and which has been latent for a few months.


TEMPORAL EDIT

```~~**~* !whirly time ripple! *~**~~```

I have traveled from the future of Newpage 1613 back into these pastpages, back into the days of my Quest,
to greet a fellow temporal traveler now posting to the Future-Present.

Greetings, Gingercat.
I hope this finds you well in the course of your journey. Many wonders await you.
To meet them, I bestow upon you the title of Schrödinger's Gingercat, which may be used in posts and sig as you see fit.
May your journey through the thread of Time be swift.
See you in the future!


```~~**~* !whirly exit time ripple! *~**~~```

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:29 am UTC
by jjjdavidson
Exodies wrote:
Spoiler:
StratPlayer wrote:
Shepherdess wrote:
StratPlayer wrote:
spamjam wrote:Image


Is he decrenneling now? At this point I'm going to have to agree with the theory that M&C's plan is to raise the sandsemencoffeecaffinatedbabycancericepixeltoner-castle* to the platform in order to protect it from the rising tide of Time.

I had still been leaning towards the loopist school, thinking that the rising liquid-to-be-determined would wash everything away and then recede. Afterwards, M & C would come down from their platform, dis-assemble it, and then have a sit down on the once-again empty beach (return to TimeFrame 1).
[/size]


And it will all start over?


Loopists predict that the One True Comic will recycle back to its starting point in some way, creating an Endless Loop.

Others believe it will end at some finite, specific, NewPix, perhaps with the long-awaited punchline.

Still others believe that it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern.

Finally, there are those who predict an End of Time with no specific payoff, either through some form of comic entropy, termination of servers, or the loss of Lord Randall in some fashion.

No one knows for sure. All we can do is Wait for it.

Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

That depends on what you mean by a "recurring pattern." If you repeat a limited selection of frames in a constantly-varying sequence, is that a recurring pattern or not?

Consider the following rules for generating a sequence: A) Write a 1. B) For each number in the sequence, write that many 2s, then write a 1.

These rules generate the following partial sequences: 1; 1 2 1; 1 2 1 2 2 1 2 1; and so on. The infinite sequence never loops back to its beginning, ever. For any segment of arbitrary length you can find an infinite number of segments that match it, but if you extend those segments you will always reach a mismatch. Is this a "recurring pattern"?

I can envisage a (fairly large but nonetheless) finite set of images that loop irregularly according to some much more complicated version of my two rules above, cycling in the short term but never truly looping back to a previous point.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:29 am UTC
by KarMann
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:29 am UTC
by cmyk
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:<snip> ...which comes to 3x10^61439.


Pfff. Almost as many pages in this thread.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:30 am UTC
by cmyk
KarMann wrote:
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.


You shit! My abacus just exploded!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:37 am UTC
by Latent22
KarMann wrote:Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.

Good spotting! my quick re calculation comes to about 10^525614 This is a crazy crazy big number

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:37 am UTC
by ChronosDragon
cmyk wrote:
KarMann wrote:
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.


You shit! My abacus just exploded!

My difference engine* is still chugging along fine, you should upgrade sometime.

*I'm running on Lovelace 17.0, for those who are curious. Electricity bills are enormous.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:38 am UTC
by jjjdavidson
KarMann wrote:
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.

So, 2^1747480 or approximately 10^526044. However, most of those will be indistinguishable from static.

I still maintain that a very limited set of meaningful images can create a non-repeating infinite sequence.
ChronosDragon wrote:My difference engine* is still chugging along fine, you should upgrade sometime.

*I'm running on Lovelace 17.0, for those who are curious. Electricity bills are enormous.

How do you keep it cool? Do you have Everlasting Ices?

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:42 am UTC
by KarMann
cmyk wrote:
KarMann wrote:
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Actually, it's greyscale, not binary black-and-white. So, try 256^218435 on for size.

You shit! My abacus just exploded!

Well, my slide rule says about 8×10526043 permutations, if that's any help.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:43 am UTC
by boozledorf
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

????
In base 10, Pi is infinite without a loop, yet it never uses anything other than the same 10 digits.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:46 am UTC
by jjjdavidson
Except for the last few posts, I've seen relatively little numerical analysis of Time so far. Let me look at some basic stuff.

Disclaimer: I am a loopist by choice and belief. I believe and hope that Time will eventually loop, though I accept the possibility of some pretty strange loops.

Each frame is 553 by 395 pixels.

Are 553 and 395 significant in themselves? Comic 553 "Pirate Bay" seems random enough, but comic 395 "Morning" has distinctly unsettling overtones for Time.

553=79x7. 395=79x5. Is the number 79 significant? Or the 7:5 aspect ratio? Comic 79 "Iambic Pentameter" is one of the "My Hobby" series, but doesn't seem to relate to Time in any specific way.

Wikipedia informs me that 553 is the sum of nine consecutive primes (43+47+53+59+61+67+71+73+79) and 395 is the sum of five consecutive primes (71+73+79+83+89). Note the reappearance of 79 in each of these sequences.

Least common multiple: 79x7x5=2765.

Of course, there is no comic 2765 yet. That will come in Time.

Could 2765 be the number of planned frames? This has distinct advantages. It allows for a long run of Time, better than three Outside months at the current rate. If Time eventually loops, then even if the update speed changes to every 5 outside minutes (288 updates / day), the comic would still take nearly 10 days to cycle.

If Time loops, 2765 is relatively prime with 24 (and 48), so that someone who visits Time repeatedly over several Loops won't see the same frames at the same Outside time of day year after year. Time would have to Loop 2765 times (!) before a particular frame appeared at the same time of day twice.

2765=0xACD. Nothing leaps to mind there. (There is a user acd on this forum, who has been only lightly active over the years but who posted on a quite elderly thread just a few days ago, but that's probably just one of those bizarre coincidences that happen all the time.)

553+395=12x79=948. 948 is a plausible suggestion for number of planned frames, something more than half again the thus-far-revealed number. But note that 948 is not relatively prime with 24. If Time loops in the future, either with its original or current update speed, any particular frame would always appear at the same few times of day. An unpleasing result.

As noted above, 553x395=218435. Probably not the total number of frames (well over twenty years of updates at the current frame rate).

218435=0x35543. ESSAE (Empire State Society of Association Executives)? Seems unlikely. 35543 as a decimal number is prime (also a ZIP code in Alabama). Nothing there for me.

I haven't thought of a way to pull geographic coordinates out of any of this. Maybe someone else will.

Any other ideas?

(Edit: It's 115 past blackbirds here; gotta coma. Would have long ago but for the server downtime--couldn't sleep wondering if I'd miss a newpix.)

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:48 am UTC
by KarMann
jjjdavidson wrote:
ChronosDragon wrote:My difference engine* is still chugging along fine, you should upgrade sometime.

*I'm running on Lovelace 17.0, for those who are curious. Electricity bills are enormous.

How do you keep it cool? Do you have Everlasting Ices?

Maybe his cooling method explains global warming, and hence the fluid level rise in The One True Comic.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 6:59 am UTC
by KarMann
jjjdavidson wrote:I haven't thought of a way to pull geographic coordinates out of any of this. Maybe someone else will.

Any other ideas?

Geohashing, natch. Just take an MD5 hash of any of those numbers you came up with, and *BAM!* there you go.

Added: And don't forget the global hash, too.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:02 am UTC
by spamjam
Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:10 am UTC
by Exodies
vvn wrote:
mscha wrote:
Caswallon wrote:Has anyone kept track of the creation dates of the images? the most recent was created on the 3/27. (Although the modified says 3/25?)

....supplies long list of this info. ... snipped


Spoiler:
Possible heresy relating to Outside time. [spoiler]With few exceptions the frames are created 3-25/3-27. Some appear to me later than that. These frames are:
(Frame numbers based upon Book of Aubron)
267-274 on 3-30
416-417 419 425-426 428-429 on 4/05
474 on 4/12


Are these frames of more importance since they came later out of the mind of the creator.[/spoiler]
Also, is there significance to the modification of frames being before they are created?

Also, another water rise graph. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/2169004/tide.png (Can't tell from who but thank you.)

File creation dates are often messed up by file copying software. Without knowing the workflow it is impossible to deduce anything from any dates in a file.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:29 am UTC
by Exodies
Latent22 wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

Just did the maths on this quickly. their are 553*395=218435 pixels in one frame. so that makes 2^218435 possible permutations. Now how big is that number? The online java calculator I tried locked up my browser trying to find the answer so instead I did a rough manual calculation which comes to 3x10^61439. At one Frame an outside hour it would take about 3x10^61435 outside years to go though all permutations. Please note that this is enough time for the universe to contract and Big bang again so many times that it would take you nearly half a day to write the number of times down by hand.

A very long time indeed.

Just saying :)

Good work with the numerology. But it's a loop non the less.
EDIT: I was a bit hasty with the good work praise, there was more to come.
Jjjdavidson and Boozeldorf showed using the example of pi that a 10 Frame Comic could go on forever without looping.
With a 2 Frame Comic you can see the same result - Frame 1 followed by an infinite series of Frame 2. No loop there.
Apologies to the families of all those of the infinite without loop persuasion. Your relatives corpses will be exhumed from their unmarked graves and reburied in Westminster Abbey at my expense.

Still enough ink on my quill to bring to your attention my avatar. This is a real gadget. The abacus isn't electronically connected to the calculator. Japanese, dontcha love 'em?

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:29 am UTC
by davidy22
So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:42 am UTC
by boozledorf
davidy22 wrote:So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

The problem is that any animated gif is going to be several megabytes by the time this comic is completely finished (I'm guessing at least 1000 frames at this point). And it will also be several minutes long, too. At the moment, at 10 frames a second, it would take over a minute to play through the entire thing.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:53 am UTC
by azule
jjjdavidson wrote:If Time eventually loops, then even if the update speed changes to every 5 outside minutes (288 updates / day), the comic would still take nearly 10 days to cycle.

This created a new prediction for me: Once the loop recursion commences the frame rate will finally be fixed. Fixed, as in, laid out at its correct variable rate. We will finally get to experience the "movie" at the logical speed that it actually plays at (such as one second between some frames and 5 minutes between others). (Well, I guess this is probably more a wish of mine :))

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:57 am UTC
by cmyk
boozledorf wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

????
In base 10, Pi is infinite without a loop, yet it never uses anything other than the same 10 digits.


Mathematically, there's such thing as an infinite circumference in a finite area (fractals), and the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter happens to be irrational, but irrational numbers are incommensurable in a purely mathematic context.

Here, we're are dealing with a particular set of integers, with some variables, but quantified so it can be easily calculated:

There's a finite number of frames because there's no time to create an infinite amount... but that's moot since; each frame consists of a discreet (and constant in this case), finite number of pixels (553px * 395px = 218,435px per frame); and each of those pixels can be any of a finite set of colors (e.g. color depth in graphics increases by powers of two: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256...). Take all these factors, and you can multiply the knowns with whatever variables and this will tell you exactly how many unique looking frames are possible.

So even given infinite time to crank out frames, there's only so many you could make before you repeated one.


Another example: If you were asked to fill in a 25x25 grid with the 26 letters of the English alphabet, but from 16 different colored sets of the alphabet — How many unique permutations of colored letter combinations can be scrawled into a 25x25 grid?

25 rows * 25 columns = 625 cells

26 letters * 16 different colors = 416 uniquely colored letters.

So, 625 letters, taken out of a 416 letters, gives you an absolute total of how many unique grids you can create. This comes to, 8.57692557x101636

Or, written out in long form:
Spoiler:
(I didn't have the time to add the comma every three digits — thank god for scientific notation!)

85769255778871066167842583477184205966818713611231945734542355696781054961044431622807381374127370949638217870575233793918056949563234746629451075950084493495966499561234879395720889991513822812918142566676819014236714485408669764224172980459265586923012708887344182767308820261841014712809422731723006793003933943916002424718589370158582648060671825923290627110566506795580106436699952410457496756316550099822600466292981076863167441302375041510965239413957840563748094561613357761739349054251113784868113007642713349765679339037727864545550715485262643273585900741339607929987897270681645228197962894803488121955303099593833012920183994846425001692767283849807298162796811490271314787845636027165492717134676978432096416839881205731404155642357170517070144823632919468735045744298180701072918735660376923152098955932285105856372396108057344158834655840955287889066743101613160065885897905878440624124524430932511826518999116347049194020420695135435187123703480338339273067595920563008878901521669001807802697024614835457636739848808375999166882175854293147051221343178900098567093910464131511951660629474587296390174261394878631377065422426258069175649852314143667644839099452641819266597069861978594463885933083619783766075995594748323591928018696121017627499841827073808355488207337606991293598504771149785826373857057149906765234933644700348282031433656459081791384819908512895341393626936890200358014162398806457462761252633353179603241563445527948198499229691507050702991693363039830729376247309041354199872968108813105617351297062996429869334079216437776662260296565746427800309510452552408886251689868256408539554946178273509376

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 7:58 am UTC
by KarMann
boozledorf wrote:
davidy22 wrote:So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

The problem is that any animated gif is going to be several megabytes by the time this comic is completely finished (I'm guessing at least 1000 frames at this point). And it will also be several minutes long, too. At the moment, at 10 frames a second, it would take over a minute to play through the entire thing.

Not necessarily, on the size of it. With combining frames & GIF optimization, I've got everything to date in 728 KiB. So, probably a megabyte or more, yes, but not necessarily several megabytes, depending on how long it lasts.

Added: Make that 729 KiB now.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:00 am UTC
by KarMann
cmyk wrote:
boozledorf wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

????
In base 10, Pi is infinite without a loop, yet it never uses anything other than the same 10 digits.


Mathematically, there's such thing as an infinite circumference in a finite area (fractals), and the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter happens to be irrational, but irrational numbers are incommensurable in a purely mathematic context.

Here, we're are dealing with a particular set of integers, with some variables, but quantified so it can be easily calculated:

There's a finite number of frames because there's no time to create an infinite amount... but that's moot since; each frame consists of a discreet (and constant in this case), finite number of pixels (553px * 395px = 218,435px per frame); and each of those pixels can be any of a finite set of colors (e.g. color depth in graphics increases by powers of two: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256...). Take all these factors, and you can multiply the knowns with whatever variables and this will tell you exactly how many unique looking frames are possible.

So even given infinite time to crank out frames, there's only so many you could make before you repeated one.


Another example: If you were asked to fill in a 25x25 grid with the 26 letters of the English alphabet, but from 16 different colored sets of the alphabet — How many unique grids letter combinations can be scrawled into a 25x25 grid, including 16 color variations of each letter?

25 rows * 25 columns = 625 cells

26 letters * 16 different colors = 416 uniquely colored letters.

So, 625 letters, taken out of a 416 letters, gives you an absolute total of how many unique grids you can create. This comes to, 8.57692557x101636

Or, written out in long form:
Spoiler:
(I didn't have the time to add the comma every three digits — thank god for scientific notation!)

85769255778871066167842583477184205966818713611231945734542355696781054961044431622807381374127370949638217870575233793918056949563234746629451075950084493495966499561234879395720889991513822812918142566676819014236714485408669764224172980459265586923012708887344182767308820261841014712809422731723006793003933943916002424718589370158582648060671825923290627110566506795580106436699952410457496756316550099822600466292981076863167441302375041510965239413957840563748094561613357761739349054251113784868113007642713349765679339037727864545550715485262643273585900741339607929987897270681645228197962894803488121955303099593833012920183994846425001692767283849807298162796811490271314787845636027165492717134676978432096416839881205731404155642357170517070144823632919468735045744298180701072918735660376923152098955932285105856372396108057344158834655840955287889066743101613160065885897905878440624124524430932511826518999116347049194020420695135435187123703480338339273067595920563008878901521669001807802697024614835457636739848808375999166882175854293147051221343178900098567093910464131511951660629474587296390174261394878631377065422426258069175649852314143667644839099452641819266597069861978594463885933083619783766075995594748323591928018696121017627499841827073808355488207337606991293598504771149785826373857057149906765234933644700348282031433656459081791384819908512895341393626936890200358014162398806457462761252633353179603241563445527948198499229691507050702991693363039830729376247309041354199872968108813105617351297062996429869334079216437776662260296565746427800309510452552408886251689868256408539554946178273509376

But we're not talking about just repeating a single frame; heck, that's already happened. We're talking about sequences of frames, and there are an infinite variety of possible sequences.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:00 am UTC
by spamjam
Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:03 am UTC
by davidy22
boozledorf wrote:
davidy22 wrote:So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

The problem is that any animated gif is going to be several megabytes by the time this comic is completely finished (I'm guessing at least 1000 frames at this point). And it will also be several minutes long, too. At the moment, at 10 frames a second, it would take over a minute to play through the entire thing.


We have 2/3 of the comic so far in an animated gif, and it's currently pegged at half a megabyte and 3 minutes with two frames per second. I'm sure it'll be fine.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:11 am UTC
by cmyk
KarMann wrote:
cmyk wrote:
boozledorf wrote:
Exodies wrote:Those who believe it will continue endlessly with no recurring pattern should be drug into the street and shot. There is a finite number of Pixels in a Frame, so there is a finite number of Frames, so there is a finite number of permutations of those Frames, so if the Comic continues endlessly it is in a loop.

????
In base 10, Pi is infinite without a loop, yet it never uses anything other than the same 10 digits.


Mathematically, there's such thing as an infinite circumference in a finite area (fractals), and the ratio of a circle's circumference to its diameter happens to be irrational, but irrational numbers are incommensurable in a purely mathematic context.

Here, we're are dealing with a particular set of integers, with some variables, but quantified so it can be easily calculated:

There's a finite number of frames because there's no time to create an infinite amount... but that's moot since; each frame consists of a discreet (and constant in this case), finite number of pixels (553px * 395px = 218,435px per frame); and each of those pixels can be any of a finite set of colors (e.g. color depth in graphics increases by powers of two: 2, 4, 8, 16, 32, 64, 128, 256...). Take all these factors, and you can multiply the knowns with whatever variables and this will tell you exactly how many unique looking frames are possible.

So even given infinite time to crank out frames, there's only so many you could make before you repeated one.


Another example: If you were asked to fill in a 25x25 grid with the 26 letters of the English alphabet, but from 16 different colored sets of the alphabet — How many unique grids letter combinations can be scrawled into a 25x25 grid, including 16 color variations of each letter?

25 rows * 25 columns = 625 cells

26 letters * 16 different colors = 416 uniquely colored letters.

So, 625 letters, taken out of a 416 letters, gives you an absolute total of how many unique grids you can create. This comes to, 8.57692557x101636

Or, written out in long form:
Spoiler:
(I didn't have the time to add the comma every three digits — thank god for scientific notation!)

85769255778871066167842583477184205966818713611231945734542355696781054961044431622807381374127370949638217870575233793918056949563234746629451075950084493495966499561234879395720889991513822812918142566676819014236714485408669764224172980459265586923012708887344182767308820261841014712809422731723006793003933943916002424718589370158582648060671825923290627110566506795580106436699952410457496756316550099822600466292981076863167441302375041510965239413957840563748094561613357761739349054251113784868113007642713349765679339037727864545550715485262643273585900741339607929987897270681645228197962894803488121955303099593833012920183994846425001692767283849807298162796811490271314787845636027165492717134676978432096416839881205731404155642357170517070144823632919468735045744298180701072918735660376923152098955932285105856372396108057344158834655840955287889066743101613160065885897905878440624124524430932511826518999116347049194020420695135435187123703480338339273067595920563008878901521669001807802697024614835457636739848808375999166882175854293147051221343178900098567093910464131511951660629474587296390174261394878631377065422426258069175649852314143667644839099452641819266597069861978594463885933083619783766075995594748323591928018696121017627499841827073808355488207337606991293598504771149785826373857057149906765234933644700348282031433656459081791384819908512895341393626936890200358014162398806457462761252633353179603241563445527948198499229691507050702991693363039830729376247309041354199872968108813105617351297062996429869334079216437776662260296565746427800309510452552408886251689868256408539554946178273509376

But we're not talking about just repeating a single frame; heck, that's already happened. We're talking about sequences of frames, and there are an infinite variety of sequences.


Of course that is true. I was saying there's only a finite amount of possible unique looking frames. But yes, if you assigned each frame of 3x1061439 possible frames to a specific decimal sequence in pi, (say frame 17,891,234,990,012,405,927,666,101,200,089 to a decimal place in pi wherever, for example, the sequence "...9994234567872929484567392..." crops up in pi), then surely it can play infinitely.

Wouldn't want to watch it though.

Re: What is real?

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:26 am UTC
by Davidy
elementropy wrote:
Davidy wrote:Why has no one come up with a reasonable explanation of how the platform/boards/ballisters/railings/bucket/sand/cueball/who-knows-what-else are so securely balanced on four linearly placed vertical posts without falling over? If there weren't apparent movement behind the castles (has it been determined whether the platform is behind the castles, or in front of them?), the balancing act would lend credence to the theory that this is flat world. On the other hand, if it was flat world, various things like Cueball, Megan, the boards and the ladder wouldn't be seen as different from the front and side views; they would only have one view. And a flat trebuchet wouldn't work. OK, so it's 3-D and the actors here have a sense of balance worthy of the best Ringlling Brothers act. But, notice the ladder; when the platform was first being built, Cueball placed the ladder edge-on to us. In that position, they were unable to reach it from atop the platform. It has been repositioned now flat to us and leaning on the same pole as before. In this position, the top of the ladder is actually further from the edge of the platform than it was before, yet the platform is now somehow accessible? I think we're left with the only conclusion - none of this is real. It's just a made up comic world with no reality. Oh sure, there are those of you who will profess that the Lord works in mysterious ways. That may be but even mysterious ways have some grounding in logic, physics and reality.

Meh!


What if there are eight poles? As our view seems to be rather lacking in depth-perception, might there be two poles every place we observe only one; one of the pair in front and one behind? The funny triangle things on either end may simply be what the railing we "see" looks like in profile. And, assuming that the lines intersecting cueball are indeed a railing in front of him, there may be one behind him as well.

Just because you can't see it, it doesn't mean it's not there.

Anything is possible, however, we only saw three posts being brought it. Should we assume the other 5 posts were already there, hidden from us?

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:28 am UTC
by KarMann
davidy22 wrote:
boozledorf wrote:
davidy22 wrote:So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

The problem is that any animated gif is going to be several megabytes by the time this comic is completely finished (I'm guessing at least 1000 frames at this point). And it will also be several minutes long, too. At the moment, at 10 frames a second, it would take over a minute to play through the entire thing.

We have 2/3 of the comic so far in an animated gif, and it's currently pegged at half a megabyte and 3 minutes with two frames per second. I'm sure it'll be fine.

OK, ladies, gentlemen, and not-so-gentle or not-so-men, I've put the animated GIF to date up on the Explain XKCD wiki. Have at it!

Re: What is real?

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:37 am UTC
by Davidy
mscha wrote:
Davidy wrote:Why has no one come up with a reasonable explanation of how the platform/boards/ballisters/railings/bucket/sand/cueball/who-knows-what-else are so securely balanced on four linearly placed vertical posts without falling over? If there weren't apparent movement behind the castles (has it been determined whether the platform is behind the castles, or in front of them?), the balancing act would lend credence to the theory that this is flat world. On the other hand, if it was flat world, various things like Cueball, Megan, the boards and the ladder wouldn't be seen as different from the front and side views; they would only have one view. And a flat trebuchet wouldn't work. OK, so it's 3-D and the actors here have a sense of balance worthy of the best Ringlling Brothers act. But, notice the ladder; when the platform was first being built, Cueball placed the ladder edge-on to us. In that position, they were unable to reach it from atop the platform. It has been repositioned now flat to us and leaning on the same pole as before. In this position, the top of the ladder is actually further from the edge of the platform than it was before, yet the platform is now somehow accessible? I think we're left with the only conclusion - none of this is real. It's just a made up comic world with no reality. Oh sure, there are those of you who will profess that the Lord works in mysterious ways. That may be but even mysterious ways have some grounding in logic, physics and reality.

Meh!


It's not 2D, or 3D, but 2½D. Ant farm physics. (There's only about a meter or so in the “z” dimension, so not enough room for the platform to fall.)

If "Z" is one meter, the platform would still tip if were only half that width. When the platform bases were brought in and raised they were shown to be about 1/2 as wide as the length of the small ones. If they're as long as, for instance, Megan is tall, they'd be just under 3 feet wide. They wouldn't rest securely on 8-10 inch posts. We don't know how big the posts are but, assuming they're wood, they can't be too big - remember, Megan was able to lift and place them by herself.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:38 am UTC
by cmyk
Thought this was cool, in thinking of assigning frames to pi. This guy made an image by color coding Base 10, and rendering the first 40,000 digits of pi as individual pixels. The results:

(0 = white, 1 = cyan, 2 = blue, 3 = magenta, 4 = green, 5 = orange, 6 = red, 7 = yellow, 8 = grey, 9 = black.)
*the decimal is displayed as white, also the mods don't allow the use of proper red.

Image

If you cross your eyes, you can see a 3D sailboat!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:50 am UTC
by cmyk
BA-GONG!

Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 8:50 am UTC
by davidy22
KarMann wrote:
davidy22 wrote:
boozledorf wrote:
davidy22 wrote:So, is there a new animated gif? Primis seems to be down, and I need a single GIF for wiki purposes.

The problem is that any animated gif is going to be several megabytes by the time this comic is completely finished (I'm guessing at least 1000 frames at this point). And it will also be several minutes long, too. At the moment, at 10 frames a second, it would take over a minute to play through the entire thing.

We have 2/3 of the comic so far in an animated gif, and it's currently pegged at half a megabyte and 3 minutes with two frames per second. I'm sure it'll be fine.

OK, ladies, gentlemen, and not-so-gentle or not-so-men, I've put the animated GIF to date up on the Explain XKCD wiki. Have at it!


Yeeeee, thanks! Also, who is this Davidy who's stealing my name?

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:02 am UTC
by KarMann
Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 10:13 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
Quest progress: 267 out of 325 pages.
The Poles. NP 463.

The Period of the Poles is a great one for speculation. Thread-dwellers of the past suggested that the poles could eventually become: a flag pole, a tetherball pole, a volleyball net, a badminton net, a pole vault, a tightrope (or a slackline), a suspension bridge, a zipline, a giant hammock, a giant slingshot, and a giant 3D sand printer. This is more support for the semencancercoffeebaconbabiesonice as building material, for anyone who has tried digging in the sand so close to a body of liquid knows that a hole dug next to it will soon fill with the liquid.

I do have my first quibble with the Division of the Periods. Having traversed my way through the thread of Time thus far, I have developed an eye for when a new Period begins. It is clear to me that the Period of the Poles should end right before the Return of Cueball at TimeFrame 463:
Spoiler:
Image

Megan spent dozens of newpix on her own after Cueball states, "I don't think we can build it much taller than this. It's been fun, though!" It was she alone who made sure each pole was erect ( :lol: ). By the time of Cueball's arrival, all work with the poles had ceased. Further construction of what is built upon the poles would soon begin. I propose adding the newpix 463-466 to the Scaffolding Period, and make the Poles an exclusively Megan period. I have decided not to work on the One True Comic's wiki until my Quest is fulfilled and I am fully in the Now (wikis are a thing of Now), but if anyone agrees with me in the present day of the thread it would be a good change.

I have also reached a great personal milestone along this thread: the signpost discussing the first newpix of Time that my eyes beheld. This one:
Spoiler:
BlitzGirl wrote:Quest progress: 173 out of 267 pages.
Second Megan Period. NP 248.

I have reached a great personal milestone along this thread: the first newpix of Time that my eyes beheld. This one:
Image
Because it was my first newpix, I came to it naive, knowing not that this was the One True Comic. I foolishly assumed it was as other comics before, but one whose punchline escaped me. "Wait for it," I read. I saw but did not see. I saw a castle near a sea. The midsection confused me: was the castle eroding, giving way to Time? The structure on the left was a curiosity.

As is my custom when not understanding xkcd, I came to these forums. I visited this thread. And I SAW. My sense of scale was all wrong, both physically and temporally. It was a Sandcastle, and the comic was more than a mere frame of Time. I began reading this thread at page 1. I could not stop. At page 77 I began my official quest to read it in its entirety. One hundred pages later, my quest continues.

But I see Newpix 248, and I remember the curiosity that first set me on this journey through Time.

Immediately after that, this happened:
Spoiler:
SBN wrote:
imagineddragon wrote:
AionArap wrote:
bigcrag92 wrote:
AionArap wrote:
BlitzGirl wrote:<signpost snip>


Sanity Shmanity, this girl is an absolute trooper.
If When she finally catches up to the present Time I propose she be given an honorary cardinalship for sheer devoutness and perseverance.

Go go fellow Time traveller.


I here-by create the post of cardinal tempus viator which shall be reserved for BlitzGirl for when she catches up to this point in the thread


Seems appropriate.


Go Quest Girl, Go! May rivers of semen and babies guide you to the end, which is only the beginning. OR middle, we aren't really sure? It could almost be at the end, but I doubt it. This is forever. I feel it in my SOUL!


Hurry up and Wait?
Is it possible to be a knight and a cardinal at the same time? Do I really need both titles? I kind of like being a knight. But I guess I'll add the cardinal one, because you can't really say no to an honorary title, can you?
As for "Hurry up and Wait," I already told you all that I am waiting as fast as humanly possible. I refer you to this lovely sig I spotted:

Jafloi wrote:And a message to BlitzGirl: "wait fast, but wait well" *And good luck with the rest of your journey*

Indeed! Haste breaks Waits, as I've heard. To skim posts on the thread of Time is not good form; you are quite likely to miss something important in the discussion. This is coming from someone who is reading it all.
I will return you to your regularly scheduled signpost after these messages (from the future):
Spoiler:
silent_death wrote:@Blitzgirl: You are an inspiration to all of us, no matter what Time or Church we are from!

Inspiration? Again? No, I'm just a weary traveler/knight/cardinal. But thank you!

Angelastic wrote:Since self-knighting was not yet controversial at the page she'll see her signature from her future self on, BlitzGirl can be the last (but also first) self-knighted Knight Temporal! The alpha and the omega! The hat and the socks! Go BlitzGirl!

Oh, good to know! I guess I'm really a knight, then.

jjjdavidson wrote:Of Time's All she's full desirous;
BlitzGirl's quest doth so inspire us,
As she journeys ever nigher us,
She's much too good for me.

Gimme that old Time religion,
Gimme that old Time religion,
Gimme that old Time religion,
It's good enough for me!

A song! One good song deserves another - here, using the colloquial "Time-Knight" in substitution for the formal "Knight Temporal":

The wonderful thing about Time-Knights,
Is Time-Knights are wonderful things!
They eagerly turn to the newpix
Whenever they hear the bongs (not bings!)
They travel the thread,
Make sure it's all read, and
Wait-Wait-Wait (it's fun)!
The most wonderful thing about Time-Knights is
I'm the only one!
I'm the only one!


histrion wrote:Image

Oooh, how exciting! Avatar-encouragement!
How did you know that purple is my favorite color?

Shepherdess wrote:Dear Sweet, Noble Blitzgirl,

There is chaos in the Future! Save yourself!

Your Doomed Eternal Servant And Ultimately Meaningless Companion Through Time,
Dame Not-Bob
Temporal Defender Of The One True Comic Until She Falls Down In Confusion

Alas! I wish I was there to fend against the chaos myself! I appreciate the warning, but sadly cannot heed it. I determined my Fate when first I set on my Quest to read all posts of the thread of Time. There is no turning back now. I will Wait and take whatever chaos may come, like a true Knight Temporal.
In these past few newpages, I have seen Back to the Future references, 2001: A Space Odyssey references, an Inspector Gadget reference (see above), Princess Bride references, and Monty Python and the Holy Grail references. (I truly am feeling as if I had traveled back to the past of more than just this thread!) It is this last that concerns me. What happens if I come to the goal of my Quest only to find that the Chaos has displaced all you fine people and the present Time is filled with posts calling me a silly English keh-niggit (even though I'm not English)? Please, smite this Chaos post-haste. There is enough Chaos in the history of Time; we really don't need more in the Now.

I journey onward through the past posts in this thread, wishing you all the best of luck.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Sun Apr 14, 2013 11:02 am UTC
by SBN
Image