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Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:12 am UTC
by Stereo
Spoiler:
Image

Just my thoughts on the Beanish font. The repeated string is most interesting thing I've found (marked in cyan). Splitting it up this way gives an alphabet of (approximate) 16 symbols + 6 quarter-circles (top/bottom and quadrants) + the dot.

ᘛ - Beanish Update

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:16 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
I'm glad there's a break from the Beanish chatter, gives me Time to upload this.

New speech (with separations): ImageImage .. ImageImageImageImageImageImage .. Image .. Image .. ImageImageImageImage
In this speech, we got additions to the epsilon, longtail, seven, curled yew, closed nine, and chair groups. We also got two new groupings: twos and sixes.
Debatable: The sixes may belong to the longtail group.
Interesting symbols: This one from the chairs appears to have two diacritics. Image
The one that looks like a stick figure appears to be a member of the closed nine group: Image
It has two diacritic markings, and the other closed nine has two different diacritic markings: Image


The Speeches

Speech 1: ImageImageImage ImageImage
Speech 2: ImageImageImage Image ImageImage ImageImage ImageImageImage
Speech 3: ImageImage ImageImageImageImageImage ImageImageImageImageImageImage
Speech 4: ImageImage ImageImageImageImageImageImage Image Image ImageImageImageImage

The Groupings

The flats: Image Image Image Image
The epsilons: Image Image Image Image Image Image
The longtails: Image Image Image Image Image
The curled yews: Image Image Image
The pinched loops : Image Image
The sevens: Image Image Image Image
The kay: Image
The humpbacks: Image Image Image
The enns: Image Image
The closed nines: Image Image
The chairs: Image Image Image Image
The snake: Image
The open nine: Image
The twos: Image Image
The sixes: Image Image

Spoiler:
Image
Image

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Keywords: Beanish language symbol symbols alphabet Beanong Beanie-ish Beanie-ese letter letters writing images BGUM
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Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:19 am UTC
by Zorin_75
Just updated the wiki dialog page...
Going by the hairstyle the one that ran off was Black Beanie Guy #1? So the one doing the talking in 2666 is stil BBG-2, right?

ETA:
BlitzGirl wrote:I'm glad there's a break from the Beanish chatter, gives me Time to upload this.

Whoa, neat! And bigger than it looked...

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:26 am UTC
by keshat
Stereo wrote:Just my thoughts on the Beanish font. The repeated string is most interesting thing I've found (marked in cyan). Splitting it up this way gives an alphabet of (approximate) 16 symbols + 6 quarter-circles (top/bottom and quadrants) + the dot.


I feel that you may have the period and question mark reversed, but otherwise a sound analysis.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:27 am UTC
by tman2nd
Zorin_75 wrote:Just updated the wiki dialog page...
Going by the hairstyle the one that ran off was Black Beanie Guy #1? So the one doing the talking in 2666 is stil BBG-2, right?

ETA:
BlitzGirl wrote:I'm glad there's a break from the Beanish chatter, gives me Time to upload this.

Whoa, neat! And bigger than it looked...


I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:32 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
tman2nd wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:Just updated the wiki dialog page...
Going by the hairstyle the one that ran off was Black Beanie Guy #1? So the one doing the talking in 2666 is stil BBG-2, right?
ETA:
BlitzGirl wrote:I'm glad there's a break from the Beanish chatter, gives me Time to upload this.

Whoa, neat! And bigger than it looked...

I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.

Thanks Zorin, and yeah, Beanie-3 was the one who left. Beanie-2 with the long hair is now the one closest to Megan (I think?).

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:33 am UTC
by Arky
tman2nd wrote:The bandage almost looks like a dagger.


It's the flag that Cueball brought along with him (and very briefly put on the little sandcastle they built in front of the abandoned cabin before The Attack).

tman2nd wrote:ComONG back.


It's interesting that Beanie 3 is back so soon. Either they live/camp very close by, or else they know where there's a nearby regional branch of that Ikea where Cuegan got all the building and trebuchet materials.

On Beanish: the most recent line appears to have two single characters, which suggests to me that it cannot be a straight substitution for English letters unless one of those characters represents a number or represents a symbol or a whole word (like the ampersand, or the new symbol for "the" some guy is trying to popularize for use on smartphone keyboards). I'm clinging to the idea that the symbols are made up and that they're a substitution cypher for English with some complexities thrown in, because anything else is going to be beyond my ability to translate :lol:

The abundance of marks modifying letters does remind my non-linguist self of Hebrew script. Unfortunately I never did really learn Hebrew script.

Anyway, if it's a substitution cypher then the oft-repeated symbol in the category Blitzgirl refers to as "epsilons" would be a raging favourite for "e" even on the limited sample size available.

Re: ᘛ - Beanish Update

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:33 am UTC
by Valarya
BlitzGirl wrote:I'm glad there's a break from the Beanish chatter, gives me Time to upload this.

New speech (with separations)
<snip>

Wow, awefulsome groupings! Way to organize the 'letters,' I hope you keep it up when there's more chatter and we'll be able to crack this shit.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:36 am UTC
by Zorin_75
tman2nd wrote:I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.


At first I thought so too, but BBG-2 seems to continue speaking to BBG-3. So the one missing in 2666 would be BBG-1:

Image
Spoiler:
bbg.gif

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:36 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
Thanks, Valarya!

Arky wrote:On Beanish: the most recent line appears to have two single characters, which suggests to me that it cannot be a straight substitution for English letters unless one of those characters represents a number or represents a symbol or a whole word (like the ampersand, or the new symbol for "the" some guy is trying to popularize for use on smartphone keyboards). I'm clinging to the idea that the symbols are made up and that they're a substitution cypher for English with some complexities thrown in, because anything else is going to be beyond my ability to translate :lol:

I think the little markings (diacritics) on top of the letters may indicate vowels. So, for example, the single character Image could represent a consonant and two vowels, a word like "you."

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:43 am UTC
by Arky
BlitzGirl wrote:Thanks, Valarya!

Arky wrote:On Beanish: the most recent line appears to have two single characters, which suggests to me that it cannot be a straight substitution for English letters unless one of those characters represents a number or represents a symbol or a whole word (like the ampersand, or the new symbol for "the" some guy is trying to popularize for use on smartphone keyboards). I'm clinging to the idea that the symbols are made up and that they're a substitution cypher for English with some complexities thrown in, because anything else is going to be beyond my ability to translate :lol:

I think the little markings (diacritics) on top of the letters may indicate vowels. So, for example, the single character Image could represent a consonant and two vowels, a word like "you."


I have a sinking feeling you're correct (it reminds me a great deal of both Hebrew script and Japanese hiragana in that way). I just don't want it to be correct because it will make it harder to work out :lol: On the plus side it makes the single-character words more understandable.

If that is the case I would have to put the "episilon" as the raging favourite for a common consonant like r, s or t.

If I get a chance tonight my time (by which time we will hopefully have an even larger sample size of Beanish to work with) I intend to try and matchup some symbols with English letters based on frequency and see if a plausible translation can be constructed. Working with both left-to-right and right-to-left possibilities.

BeanScript report

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:45 am UTC
by AluisioASG
1. Any better names?
2. Well, single letters won't work anymore. I wonder if Randall will use more than 1296 glyphs.
3. Either the script isn't working, or Chrome isn't showing the Image elements with inexistent source in the DOM tree. Hm, just thought of a way to sort this one out. fixed.
4. Will .b{work as a delimiter} ?

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:45 am UTC
by Zorin_75
Arky wrote:It's interesting that Beanie 3 is back so soon. Either they live/camp very close by,

As they don't have any packs or the like with them, they shouldn't be very far from supplies. So yeah, probably close to their home or at least a campsite.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 6:48 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
Zorin_75 wrote:
Arky wrote:It's interesting that Beanie 3 is back so soon. Either they live/camp very close by,

As they don't have any packs or the like with them, they shouldn't be very far from supplies. So yeah, probably close to their home or at least a campsite.

A campsite full of dust and glinty things.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:00 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
LeadONG Megan to a rock to sit on, perhaps?

Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:01 am UTC
by kenmelken
ImageImageImage
Spoiler:
Image


EDIT: I already knew in preview that I'd been ninja'd, but I wanted to make the word "ONG" out of beanish symbols. :) I think it looks pretty close.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:02 am UTC
by HES
ucim wrote:
tman2nd wrote:The bandage almost looks like a dagger.
Yes, I had to consult the Book of Aubron to figure out what it was. I thought maybe she had her thwacking stick, but that didn't seem right.

Jose

The 'bandage' is one of the flags, if you recall.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:03 am UTC
by tman2nd
Zorin_75 wrote:
tman2nd wrote:I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.


At first I thought so too, but BBG-2 seems to continue speaking to BBG-3. So the one missing in 2666 would be BBG-1:

Image
Spoiler:
bbg.gif


To me, that looks like #1 is the one standing behind #2 in the 2nd frame. The feet are in the same position.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:03 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
kenmelken wrote:ImageImageImage

EDIT: I already knew in preview that I'd been ninja'd, but I wanted to make the word "ONG" out of beanish symbols. :) I think it looks pretty close.

Bravo! It does!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:04 am UTC
by tman2nd
HES wrote:
ucim wrote:
tman2nd wrote:The bandage almost looks like a dagger.
Yes, I had to consult the Book of Aubron to figure out what it was. I thought maybe she had her thwacking stick, but that didn't seem right.

Jose

The 'bandage' is one of the flags, if you recall.


I guess, that's would be why it's pointy.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:07 am UTC
by HES
ChronosDragon wrote:I won't go for that unless the third one says ImageImageImageImage...ImageImageImageImage ImageImageImageImage ImageImageImageImage

They really need to bring that show to the UK. Though, in English, not Beanish

ofvn2vw1872 wrote:*I know very little about linguistics, and am basically doing applied wikipedia.

Isn't that what most of education is these days?

SBN wrote:
BlitzGirl wrote:Looks like Latent22 has mastered the Beanish tongue!

And the blitzers complained about rot13.

At least they know it's gibberish and there's no need to decode (unless Latent22 knows something we don't...)

ChronosDragon wrote:Did somebody say kittens in spoilers?

Spoiler:
Image

Image

CameronCat wrote:Blintzb
b Too short for a Blitz, too long for a Ketchup.

Careful now, that sounds dangerously like a new standard... I like it!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:08 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
tman2nd wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:
tman2nd wrote:I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.


At first I thought so too, but BBG-2 seems to continue speaking to BBG-3. So the one missing in 2666 would be BBG-1:
Spoiler:
Image

To me, that looks like #1 is the one standing behind #2 in the 2nd frame. The feet are in the same position.

Except those two frames aren't consecutive. There are two frames inbetween them. But I'm inclined to agree.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:08 am UTC
by Zorin_75
tman2nd wrote:To me, that looks like #1 is the one standing behind #2 in the 2nd frame. The feet are in the same position.

Hmm, you may be right - so BBG-3 left, BBG-2 and BBG-1 switched positions, and BBG-2 (shorter hair) is doing the talking...

Testing...

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:12 am UTC
by AluisioASG
.b{thzelikhxz uywqretb}
Spoiler:
ucim wrote:
AluisioASG wrote:I guess it (writing) stopped being fun. But I still like the story, I like imagining it...

In that case, try just concentrating on the story part, before actually writing the dialog and such. Instead of writing out the dialog and the action and all those details, first come up with the setup:

Our protagonist wants his girlfriend back.
Somebody else (the antagonist) wants that to not happen (could be the new boyfriend, could be the father...)
... it could even be the girlfriend's boss
Protagonist comes up with a plan: go back in time.
... fortunately he is the head of the Time Machine Company

Put some difficulties in his way way:
... it costs a lot of money to go back in time, so he's going to have to come up with an excuse.
... the board approves the trip back in time (under these false pretenses) but our antagonist needs to come along too.

etc... until your basic plot line is complete. Don't actually write the story yet. Now go back and ensure that the story actually flows well. If you are like me, you'll find that there are many things that need adjustment. For example, Fred needs to have known about Susan's betrayal before he can confront her. Or, he will need to have been (believably) unaware of it when he meets Susan (and would otherwise confront her). So, that tells you scenes that need to be put in between. You'll find other scenes that are not necessary... for example it may turn out to be unimportant that Fred was just made the head of the Time Machine Company... in which case you can drop that (still unwritten) scene and replace it with a sentence or two that merely establishes his position.

Once all the structure (the story itself) is laid out, then you can start writing the action, the dialog, the description, and all the other stuff that is the actual writing of the story.

Or, you may find that that particular story doesn't work at all. You can then drop it and move on to another one, with little wasted effort. In the future, parts of that (unused) story will probably make their way into other stories you dream up, and will work out better.

No matter what you write, there will be parts that work out better than other parts. That's ok. Only the mediocre are always at their best. :)
See if this helps the process remain fun.

You sound like my Algorithms teacher :)


@BlitzGirl, could you please collect the glyphs after #43 and send them to me once I ask for them? Thank you very much.

And with that, molpy down.
Kika.jpg
...but I don't wanna sleep!

Re: Testing...

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:15 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
This figuring-out-which-character-is-which deal is like a shell game. With beanies.

AluisioASG wrote:@BlitzGirl, could you please collect the glyphs after #43 and send them to me once I ask for them? Thank you very much.

Sure thing, Aluisio. Cute wolpy. :)

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:24 am UTC
by rvloon
pelrigg wrote:ReactONG
Image

Okay, I was wrong about who was going to give the orders.....



Hmm, for some reason it looks like mirrored script to me.

Ronald

(Wait for it.)

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:27 am UTC
by Eternal Density
BlitzGirl wrote:LeadONG Megan to a rock to sit on, perhaps?
Spoiler:
Image
It's an altar.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:28 am UTC
by mscha
Molpy up!
Spoiler:
Image
Still got a lot of ketching up to do – y'all have been busy – but here's a (blindposted) animation of the beanie meeting so far.
Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:29 am UTC
by tman2nd
BlitzGirl wrote:
tman2nd wrote:
Zorin_75 wrote:
tman2nd wrote:I think that was the one who left was #3. #2 seemed to be telling #3 to go get something.


At first I thought so too, but BBG-2 seems to continue speaking to BBG-3. So the one missing in 2666 would be BBG-1:
Spoiler:
Image

To me, that looks like #1 is the one standing behind #2 in the 2nd frame. The feet are in the same position.

Except those two frames aren't consecutive. There are two frames inbetween them. But I'm inclined to agree.


Oh. Right.
In that case it looks like #1 is doing the talking the second time. In the complete sequence I don't see them switching places. I still think that #3 is the one who left. The movement seems more fluid that way.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:32 am UTC
by foilman
They're all heading off to the secret underground lair now.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:40 am UTC
by kenmelken
Okay, I've been ketching up/speed-blitzing some of the things I've missed. First of all, apparently it has been claimed that when I am the emperor I tend to punish with spankings. That's news to me, but whatevs--guess y'all better watch your backs next time I'm in charge.

Next, it seems to me, and I was reading very fast, so maybe I missed something, that nobody has yet brought this up (and I actually still have a few more pages to go), but I feel strongly about this:

The bucket cutaway scene served just as definitively as a chapter-end to the Journey Eon as the fading did for the Sandcastle Eon. It was a clear interruption of the action that marked the end of a significant and internally complete story-arc, albeit with clear unresolved "cliffhangers" to lead into the next chapter. The sandcastle eon ended with a cliffhanger of the mysteriously rising sea they needed to solve. The journey eon ended with Megan's unresolved injury. Nonetheless, the bucket appearance does very conveniently occur right after they finally get to the top of the mountain, and the bucket itself harkens back to the first chapter-end, creating a parallelism. Already we are seeing a whole new chapter unfolding; I don't think we'll be seeing them journey again for a while. I think they will be spending a very long time with these mountain people. Obviously, only Time will tell how this new eon will define itself, and I'm in no rush to name it just yet. However, I do think it is very obviously a new eon and should be recognized as such. Therefore, I'm proposing that the following alterations be made: The current "Encounter Era" needs to be divided, with its first 3 periods (Cueball's awakening, observation, bucket) constituting a "Summit Era" that concludes the Journey Eon. The next two periods (Into Thin Air, First Encounter) constitute the Encounter Era so far, which serves as the opening of a new, yet untitled Eon. We've been predicting a new Eon's dawning for some time now, and it does even seem a bit late, but I don't think it is at all a stretch to say that's what we are witnessing.

What do y'all think? I don't want to make these changes on the wiki without some agreement/consensus that it is a good idea.

Edited a bit for clarity.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:42 am UTC
by BlitzGirl
I was feeling myself that we were due for an Eon shift, but it's hard to know. It depends on what Cuegan does next, I guess. The cutaway to the bucket does seem like a logical splitting point.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:50 am UTC
by Kazza3
It's not quite as clear cut as the castle->sudden journey change, but it definitely seems like a new eon is a good idea.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:50 am UTC
by robbak
BlitzGirl wrote:LeadONG Megan to a rock to sit on, perhaps?

Spoiler:
Image


Either that or "Come and lie down on our special sacred sacrificing rock".

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 7:51 am UTC
by rvloon
BTW, this is some insight given to me from my friend Kate who is far more knowledgeable in these areas:

About the language of the two main characters, it isn't any orthographic system I know. I suspect Monroe made it up. It would hardly be worth learning a script obscure enough that a whole board of fans couldn't track it down, just for the purposes of this cartoon; and the narrative merely requires that it be incomprehensible to the viewer. The writing is also too fluent to be the work of someone copying unfamiliar written forms (like early Chinese language learners). Based on form alone, I'd say it was influenced by the forms of letters used by US graffiti artists or "taggers."


Ronald

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:00 am UTC
by tman2nd
They know what they're doONG.
Image

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:01 am UTC
by foilman
I'm sticking to my underground lair theory. This is the way in.

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:04 am UTC
by Zorin_75
rvloon wrote:BTW, this is some insight given to me from my friend Kate who is far more knowledgeable in these areas:

About the language of the two main characters, it isn't any orthographic system I know. I suspect Monroe made it up. It would hardly be worth learning a script obscure enough that a whole board of fans couldn't track it down, just for the purposes of this cartoon; and the narrative merely requires that it be incomprehensible to the viewer. The writing is also too fluent to be the work of someone copying unfamiliar written forms (like early Chinese language learners). Based on form alone, I'd say it was influenced by the forms of letters used by US graffiti artists or "taggers."


Ronald

I'd tend to agree that it's probably made up, but I wouldn't be surprised at all if it was decodable. What she doesn't take into account is that this comic is probably as much about the narrative as it is about messing with its audience. Just using gibberish sounds a bit too simple...

(Molpy dinner!)

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:04 am UTC
by Eternal Density
I'm sticking to my altar theory.
[edit about 13 newpix and 6 newpages later]
Oh, I didn't stick around to see the page load so I didn't realised I'd been poped.
Um... I decree everyone act as if I hadn't made a decree.
Which you have, because I didn't. Thanks everyone for your cooperation in this matter!

Re: 1190: "Time"

Posted: Tue Jul 09, 2013 8:05 am UTC
by ggh
rvloon wrote:BTW, this is some insight given to me from my friend Kate who is far more knowledgeable in these areas:

About the language of the two main characters, it isn't any orthographic system I know. I suspect Monroe made it up. It would hardly be worth learning a script obscure enough that a whole board of fans couldn't track it down, just for the purposes of this cartoon; and the narrative merely requires that it be incomprehensible to the viewer. The writing is also too fluent to be the work of someone copying unfamiliar written forms (like early Chinese language learners). Based on form alone, I'd say it was influenced by the forms of letters used by US graffiti artists or "taggers."


Ronald

Huh. That's a kinda cool idea. The humpbacks do look especially tagger-y, don't they?
The fluency of the writing though... I'm not sure how much that comes into play when you've got digital help.


Also: kenmelken, I like how you think.