1694: "Phishing License"

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1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Echo244 » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:13 pm UTC

Image

Title text: 'Later, walking out of jail after posting $10,000 bail: "Wait, this isn't the street the county jail is on."'

So... is Cueball allowed to use a Net here or not?
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:23 pm UTC

So, tricked into thinking he'd been tricked into incriminating himself as a trickster.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby rmsgrey » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:26 pm UTC

Pretty sure applying for a license isn't illegal - it may be evidence of intent to commit a crime, but it's not evidence of having ever committed one.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Flumble » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:27 pm UTC

That's unfair! People can get qualifications for a lot of jobs that can be harmful. Learning about something isn't criminal!*


*Unless it's deemed so by policing organisations or other bollocks, like knowing that the next US president

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby cellocgw » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:29 pm UTC

Well, at least he didn't draw Mr. B.J.B1 walking up to a desk where the sign read "Killing Licenses" .

The concept of a meatspace honeytrap goes back ages, at least in the USA. Police take a list of folks w/ outstanding warrants, send them all notices of free baseball tickets or something, then arrest everyone who walks thru the door.

Then there's the Red Wedding...










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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby cellocgw » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:29 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Pretty sure applying for a license isn't illegal - it may be evidence of intent to commit a crime, but it's not evidence of having ever committed one.


You haven't been living in the USA for the last 15 years, have you :cry:
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Echo244 » Wed Jun 15, 2016 2:30 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Pretty sure applying for a license isn't illegal - it may be evidence of intent to commit a crime, but it's not evidence of having ever committed one.


Just phishing, probably not. Anyone who can be accused of it being "money raising as an act preparing for a greater act of terrorism" and, erm, I think the laws on that one make it a crime in lots of jurisdictions.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Jackpot777 » Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:01 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Pretty sure applying for a license isn't illegal - it may be evidence of intent to commit a crime, but it's not evidence of having ever committed one.


Both the people in this cartoon could be charged on a count of conspiracy to break the law contrary to the CAN-SPAM Act of 2003 (USA), Computer Misuse Act of 1990 (UK), various state and territory laws (Australia), etc. if further proof were available (say: an online forum post) that the person wished to commit a particular phishing attack in future. The fact it's a license for phishing, a type of fraud, may in itself be evidence enough of intent. In this case, the woman's fine because this is a sting operation.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:26 pm UTC

Jackpot777 wrote:In this case, the woman's fine because this is a sting operation.
Unless perhaps guilty of illegal imprisonment and/or extortion and/or local advertising regulations.

(Still, maybe this results...)

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby SteveMB » Wed Jun 15, 2016 3:37 pm UTC

"There aren't gonna be any damned permits! How can you get a permit to do a damned illegal thing?"
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Eebster the Great » Wed Jun 15, 2016 5:01 pm UTC

You guys seem to be missing the point that she is phishing . . .

It would be like reading a comment where someone falls for an IRS scam and complaining "but that's not how the IRS operates!"

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Quizatzhaderac » Wed Jun 15, 2016 6:25 pm UTC

Actually, no. Before the second twist (in the title text) Ponytail has tricked Cueball, but not lied about who she is.

Pre and post first twist she is presented as an agent of a government responsible for enforcing phishing laws, she (as the trusted authority) only misrepresents the existence of a legal path to pursue that activity. She then arrests Cueball for attempting to pursue what he obviously believed was a legal activity.

After the second twist, that does make it phising phisers, but phsising phisers who care what the law says when the law already condemns phising.
Last edited by Quizatzhaderac on Thu Aug 17, 2017 2:50 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Eebster the Great » Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:30 pm UTC

Or she does not work for the government at all, the arrest was a sham, and she tricked him into paying her $10,000. How else does it make sense that she "arrested" him but didn't take him to jail?

I mean, an IRS scammer "presents himself" as working for the IRS, but most of the details make no sense if you think about it. They are counting on you not thinking about it.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby cryptoengineer » Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:51 pm UTC

Reminds me of 'Drug Tax Stamps', a real thing in some places, used to ramp up the charges on dealers.

https://tax.iowa.gov/iowa-drug-stamp-tax-law
http://www.ksrevenue.org/faqs-abcdrugtax.html
http://www.henak.net/HenakHome/DrugTax.htm

Perhaps 'Phishing without a license' is a particular crime in Cueball's jurisdiction.

ce

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Mikeski » Wed Jun 15, 2016 9:30 pm UTC

He was obviously hoping it was sort of a Letter Of Marque to attack other online ne'er-do-wells.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Jun 15, 2016 10:24 pm UTC

Mikeski wrote:He was obviously hoping it was sort of a Letter Of Marque to attack other online ne'er-do-wells.

So he was phishily phisher-phishing phished?

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby ThemePark » Wed Jun 15, 2016 10:26 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:
Mikeski wrote:He was obviously hoping it was sort of a Letter Of Marque to attack other online ne'er-do-wells.

So he was phishily phisher-phishing phished?

That sounds phishy.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Gingercat » Wed Jun 15, 2016 11:22 pm UTC

Flumble wrote:like knowing that the next US president


will be Trump.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Mike Rosoft » Thu Jun 16, 2016 5:18 am UTC

In John Moore's The Unhandsome Prince there exists a Thieves' Guild and an Assassins' Guild ... wait, why would the kingdom allow such an organization to operate? But if you're stupid enough to enter the building of one of these guilds, to make use of its services or to join it, you're going to find out why: the guild is actually a set-up organized by the royal guards.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby theModge » Thu Jun 16, 2016 8:55 am UTC

In John Moore's The Unhandsome Prince there exists a Thieves' Guild and an Assassins' Guild

Where as in Terry Pratchett's world both of these exist because if there is to be organised crime it should at least be *well* organised crime. In particular, theft can be avoided by keeping up your payments to the thieves guild...

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby orthogon » Thu Jun 16, 2016 9:21 am UTC

cryptoengineer wrote:Reminds me of 'Drug Tax Stamps', a real thing in some places, used to ramp up the charges on dealers.

https://tax.iowa.gov/iowa-drug-stamp-tax-law
http://www.ksrevenue.org/faqs-abcdrugtax.html
http://www.henak.net/HenakHome/DrugTax.htm

Perhaps 'Phishing without a license' is a particular crime in Cueball's jurisdiction.

ce

That's fascinating - I note that that they specifically promise you won't be arrested.

I like the way that, for some reason, y'all Usanians use the gram as a unit of mass/weight for drugs and nothing else. Does this give metric units a cool, streety feel? Here in the UK the "eighth" [of an ounce] is the standard unit for marijuana, something that has stubbornly resisted EU weights-and-measures directives. (Or has it? I wouldn't know any more).
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Eebster the Great » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:13 am UTC

Metric measurements for weight are used for many things, such as nutrition labels and drug measurements (prescription and over the counter). Street drugs are measured using both systems. Grams are convenient subdivisions of ounces when you want to deal with increments of less than an eighth of an ounce, and milligrams are ubiquitous for even smaller quantities. Kilograms aren't used too much by most people, but only because a kilogram of basically any drug is a lot. Laws are expressed in terms of either system of units depending on the state.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Murderbot » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:35 am UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Pretty sure applying for a license isn't illegal - it may be evidence of intent to commit a crime, but it's not evidence of having ever committed one.

Pretty sure the license issuer wasn't a real law enforcer.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Soupspoon » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:00 am UTC

Eebster the Great wrote:a kilogram of basically any drug is a lot.
I tend to buy my placebos by the kilo, but then my psychosomatic hypochondria is a particularly severe case, or so Dr Munchausen tells me.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby orthogon » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:30 am UTC

Eebster the Great wrote:Grams are convenient subdivisions of ounces when you want to deal with increments of less than an eighth of an ounce [...]

Thanks for that, but ... wow. I just don't even. Do you have a "US customary gram" that's a 28th of an ounce? With 3.5usg in an eighth?
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby rmsgrey » Thu Jun 16, 2016 3:03 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:
Eebster the Great wrote:a kilogram of basically any drug is a lot.
I tend to buy my placebos by the kilo, but then my psychosomatic hypochondria is a particularly severe case, or so Dr Munchausen tells me.


Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Soupspoon » Thu Jun 16, 2016 4:01 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

I'm on that as well. The last time I tried to cut down my usage, I overdosed!

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby ijuin » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:28 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:
Eebster the Great wrote:Grams are convenient subdivisions of ounces when you want to deal with increments of less than an eighth of an ounce [...]

Thanks for that, but ... wow. I just don't even. Do you have a "US customary gram" that's a 28th of an ounce? With 3.5usg in an eighth?


No, the gram is the international gram. It's simply that we forgot how to use the smaller subdivisions of ounces that existed in olden times--pennyweights and grains for Troy ounces (24 grains per pennyweight and 20 pennyweights per ounce), as were used by pre-industrial apothecaries (i.e. proto-pharmacists). Likewise, we no longer use traditional subdivisions of the inch, and instead use millimeters and microns for anything that is too small for inches.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby aerion111 » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:33 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

I'm on that as well. The last time I tried to cut down my usage, I overdosed!

That's really not how it works; It doesn't get stronger by diluting it, it just doesn't get weaker.
You should probably read up on some literature about it.
I think the ancient alchemists wrote a lot of good stuff, if you can find copies, otherwise you'll have to settle for second-or-third hand accounts.
Homeopathy is essentially alchemy, after all; Taking the 'essence' of the medicine and preserving it, while diluting all the harmful physical chemicals.
That way, you get something just as effective as healing, without any of the nasty side-effects.

I mean, what you actually get is mercury poisoning and things bordering on stereotypical voodoo dolls ('as above, as below' leads to some... Interesting leaps of logic), but that's because there is little to no evidence that alchemy really works.
But if it did work, and the people who buy into it seem to think it does, homeopathic medicine would be the smartest way to prepare medication.
Heck, I'd have taken a course in homeopathy myself, for personal use, if I believed in it - I'm sure even cooking could benefit from being able to preserve the 'essence' of something through dilution.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Tova » Fri Jun 17, 2016 2:25 am UTC

aerion111 wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

I'm on that as well. The last time I tried to cut down my usage, I overdosed!

That's really not how it works; It doesn't get stronger by diluting it, it just doesn't get weaker.


I assume you mean that's not how it is purported to work.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Eebster the Great » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:45 am UTC

I mean that's true, in the sense that the homeopathic dilution which strengthens a tincture (yes, the claim is that it makes the remedy stronger, not that it merely preserves the same potency) involves not merely diluting in water but diluting in water then shaking the resulting dilution several times along each axis. For instance, a 6C remedy involves first diluting the active ingredient in 100 parts water, then shaking the solution 100 times each on three perpendicular axes, then diluting a part of this dilution in 100 parts water, and so on, for a total of six dilutions. This results in a final dilution of one part in 1006 = 1012, or one part per trillion. However, the "essence" (or whatever) is not identical to the active ingredients. In fact, "like cures like," meaning this remedy will cure any disorder producing symptoms similar to those symptoms produced (not treated) by the active ingredient.

For instance, if atropine causes nausea, I can cure nausea by diluting atropine in water, shaking it in mutually orthogonal directions several times, repeating the process several times, then drinking some of the final dilution (or even by dripping some of the final solution onto a sugar pill and letting the water evaporate, then eating that pill).

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby orthogon » Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:42 pm UTC

ijuin wrote:
orthogon wrote:
Eebster the Great wrote:Grams are convenient subdivisions of ounces when you want to deal with increments of less than an eighth of an ounce [...]

Thanks for that, but ... wow. I just don't even. Do you have a "US customary gram" that's a 28th of an ounce? With 3.5usg in an eighth?


No, the gram is the international gram. It's simply that we forgot how to use the smaller subdivisions of ounces that existed in olden times--pennyweights and grains for Troy ounces (24 grains per pennyweight and 20 pennyweights per ounce), as were used by pre-industrial apothecaries (i.e. proto-pharmacists). Likewise, we no longer use traditional subdivisions of the inch, and instead use millimeters and microns for anything that is too small for inches.

OK, I wasn't being totally serious, but my point was that EtG described grams as "convenient subdivisions" of ounces. I dispute both words: that something can be considered a subdivision of something else if the divisor in question isn't an integer; and that this would be in any way a convenient subdivision. I will grant however that the gram is a convenient unit smaller than an ounce.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Neil_Boekend » Fri Jun 17, 2016 1:09 pm UTC

Tova wrote:
aerion111 wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

I'm on that as well. The last time I tried to cut down my usage, I overdosed!

That's really not how it works; It doesn't get stronger by diluting it, it just doesn't get weaker.


I assume you mean that's not how it is purported to work.

It actually works through the placebo effect. And for many things that means it practically works. Homeopathic remedies for headaches can be miracle cures, for example.

It just gets extremely dodgy when people forego medical treatment in favor of homeopathic or other alternative healing.
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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Eebster the Great » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:09 pm UTC

Grams are practically used as subdivisions of ounces, and technically that is how they are defined. The pound is defined as 453.59237 grams, meaning the ounce is 28.349523125 grams. So an eighth of an ounce is very close to 3.5 grams, and that's typically how it's measured. Note that scales in the U.S. designed to measure masses less than an ounce almost always use grams or milligrams.

The convenience of grams doesn't come from their conversion to ounces, it comes from their size and ubiquity. Converting anything to anything is never particularly hard anyway when precision isn't important.

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby Tova » Sun Jun 19, 2016 11:29 pm UTC

Neil_Boekend wrote:
Tova wrote:
aerion111 wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:
rmsgrey wrote:Have you tried homeopathic placebo? Many times the effect for a fraction of the "active" ingredient...

I'm on that as well. The last time I tried to cut down my usage, I overdosed!

That's really not how it works; It doesn't get stronger by diluting it, it just doesn't get weaker.


I assume you mean that's not how it is purported to work.

It actually works through the placebo effect. And for many things that means it practically works. Homeopathic remedies for headaches can be miracle cures, for example.

It just gets extremely dodgy when people forego medical treatment in favor of homeopathic or other alternative healing.


http://www.csicop.org/si/show/the_poor_ ... od_placebo

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Re: 1694: "Phishing License"

Postby gmalivuk » Mon Jun 20, 2016 3:36 pm UTC

"It works through the placebo effect," is identical to, "It doesn't work," when we're talking about testing medicine.

Novella's article linked above goes into more detail, but basically the placebo is a catch-all for all the effects that aren't from the "it" being tested, so by definition if there's just placebo, then the "it" being tested doesn't have any effect.
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