2038: "Hazard Symbol"

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somitomi
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2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby somitomi » Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:52 pm UTC

Image
Title text: The warning diamond on the Materials Safety Data Sheet for this stuff just has the "" emoji in all four fields.
But what if it's also flammable or corrosive? Not to mention all my radioactive high-voltage laser-emmitting biohazards, that are ESD sensitive...

The emoji is apparently not supported.

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squall_line
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby squall_line » Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:54 pm UTC

Ninja'd!

Not to be confused with the Hazzard Symbol, which has a confederate flag, the number 1, and a flying car.

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dash
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby dash » Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:06 pm UTC

That was a good one.
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Soupspoon » Mon Aug 27, 2018 4:34 pm UTC

There deserves to be a few more portmanteau signs based upon the various ones in the range. And beyond.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby pogrmman » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:08 pm UTC

I could concievably think of a scenario with a radioactive, biohazardous, liquid lasting medium, but the high voltage part is tricky to add in. Hmm...

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby somitomi » Mon Aug 27, 2018 6:26 pm UTC

squall_line wrote:Ninja'd!

Not to be confused with the Hazzard Symbol, which has a confederate flag, the number 1, and a flying car.

You forgot the leading zero...
—◯-◯

rmbdot
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby rmbdot » Mon Aug 27, 2018 7:05 pm UTC

You forgot to put the universal red circle & slash "not allowed" symbol in the middle of the hazard array.
Without it, people will have no way of knowing that making snow angels in a frictionless, electrically-charged, radioactive fluid on the floor is not allowed!

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby cellocgw » Mon Aug 27, 2018 7:29 pm UTC

Also needs a Joking Hazard icon.
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby pgn674 » Mon Aug 27, 2018 7:44 pm UTC

I was wondering what the emoji meant, and found that it's "Face With Open Mouth and Cold Sweat".

Representative images from different platforms can be seen here: https://emojipedia.org/face-with-open-m ... old-sweat/

BTW, U+1F630 is an unsupported character here.

Showsni
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Showsni » Mon Aug 27, 2018 9:19 pm UTC

The emoji's just showing up as a square for me. Do I need to update Google Chrome or something?

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Old Bruce
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Old Bruce » Mon Aug 27, 2018 10:06 pm UTC

Showsni wrote:The emoji's just showing up as a square for me. Do I need to update Google Chrome or something?

We all need to ignore emojis. [eschew-obfuscation emoticon]
They add nothing but confusion and at best are merely annoying. [old-man-shaking-his-fist-at-the-sky emoticon]

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Soupspoon » Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:00 pm UTC

rmbdot wrote:You forgot to put the universal red circle & slash "not allowed" symbol in the middle of the hazard array.!

A red circle alone is the "not allowed" part of UK road signs¹. Which makes the No Smoking sign (red circle and diagonal bar atop fuming cigarette sigil) look like "No not smoking". And the general and vague sigil-less barred circle look like "no not nothing".

¹ No Evels Knievel² allowed.
Spoiler:
Image

(Though some would say it just means "no motor-vehicles". Spoilsports.)

² Like "courts martial", this is the proper plural, naturally.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby AlacrityFitzhugh » Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:17 pm UTC

I would by that on a t-shirt. Can that happen?

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Mikeski » Mon Aug 27, 2018 11:35 pm UTC

Still safer than chlorine trifluoride!

I find it amusing/horrifying that the NFPA "fire diamond" gives ClF3 a zero out of four for flammability. Technically, yes, the ClF3 itself doesn't burn. It just makes everything else burn. Water, people, sand, concrete, asbestos...

(It does get the "oxidizer" and "reacts with water" marks.)

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Archgeek » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:21 am UTC

Mikeski wrote:Still safer than chlorine trifluoride!

I find it amusing/horrifying that the NFPA "fire diamond" gives ClF3 a zero out of four for flammability. Technically, yes, the ClF3 itself doesn't burn. It just makes everything else burn. Water, people, sand, concrete, asbestos...

(It does get the "oxidizer" and "reacts with water" marks.)

Considering they give O2(l) A diamond of 3|0|0 (I hope ClF3 gets a 4 in the health hazard category), I'm guessing that's just the general convention for oxidizers, like the perchlorates and friends.
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby ijuin » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:32 am UTC

Even more nasty is Dioxygen Difluoride, also known by its molecular structure as “FOOF”. Not only does it react with nearly everything, but it is HIGHLY unstable on its own and must be kept at just above its melting point (110K) or else it will explode by itself.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:37 am UTC

I've heard that FOOF will set wet sand on fire.
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Soupspoon » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:50 am UTC

I got introduced to that whole blog-section of (more or less, and usually more!) cautionary compounds back on its original, host with a link to the onomatapoeiac FOOF. But it's when you get shown the C2N14(H0!) that it gets exciting. I mean, Fluorine isn't good for your health because of its overwhelming desire to rebond with anything other than its current partnership, but it aint quite got the same amount of stress and strain on the chemical bonds where it would rather be very much more simply bonded than it is. ;)


(The Chlorine Trifluoride does the wet sand thing well enough. There's also a quote:
You may observe the mild reactivity of this gentle substance as it encounters various common laboratory materials, and draw your own conclusions. We have Plexiglas, a rubber glove, clean leather, not-so-clean leather, a gas mask, a piece of wood, and a wet glove.
.
Then there's people who do things like
Being a high energy oxidizer, dioxygen difluoride reacted vigorously with organic compounds, even at temperatures close to its melting point. It reacted instantaneously with solid ethyl alcohol, producing a blue flame and an explosion. When a drop of liquid 02F2 was added to liquid methane, cooled at 90°K., a white flame was produced instantaneously, which turned green upon further burning. When 0.2 (mL) of liquid 02F2 was added to 0.5 (mL) of liquid CH4 at 90°K., a violent explosion occurred.
…)

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby hamjudo » Tue Aug 28, 2018 1:40 am UTC

On a recent road trip I passed a semi-trailer that had more than a dozen hazardous material flip-card placards on each side. The only one that was in use was a flammable cargo warning. Some of the closed ones were the 4 digit number
style similar to https://www.flipplacards.com/digi-lock-placards, others had individually flippable quadrants like https://www.flipplacards.com/fos/NFPA-Signs/NFPA-Flip-Placard-Sign-Aluminum/SKU-PL-0001.

What kind of cargo would require that many placards?

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby xsk8rat » Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:14 am UTC

As all the hazards are present, i made a placard for the office.
Help yourself:
https://grabcad.com/library/xkcd-2038-warning-placard-2

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby somitomi » Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:43 am UTC

Soupspoon wrote:¹ No Evels Knievel² allowed.
Spoiler:
Image

(Though some would say it just means "no motor-vehicles". Spoilsports.)

² Like "courts martial", this is the proper plural, naturally.

Hhahahaha. That too would make for a great T-shirt
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby orthogon » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:57 am UTC

This reminds me of our Fire Assembly Point, which is about 3 metres away from our building and next to a door on the adjacent building that's plastered with the full-house of Hazchem labels. At the last fire drill, I asked our Facilities guy to remind me why it was ok for that to be the assembly point. He said they'd discuss it at their debriefing and report back.
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Mikeski » Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:32 am UTC

Archgeek wrote:
Mikeski wrote:Still safer than chlorine trifluoride!

I find it amusing/horrifying that the NFPA "fire diamond" gives ClF3 a zero out of four for flammability. Technically, yes, the ClF3 itself doesn't burn. It just makes everything else burn. Water, people, sand, concrete, asbestos...

(It does get the "oxidizer" and "reacts with water" marks.)

Considering they give O2(l) A diamond of 3|0|0 (I hope ClF3 gets a 4 in the health hazard category), I'm guessing that's just the general convention for oxidizers, like the perchlorates and friends.

Yup, ClF3 is 4|0|4, W OX, according to Wikipedia.

I think it gets extra credit for being an oxidizer that contains no oxygen. (So I suppose it's properly a "fluorinator", but that causes the same hazards as an oxidizer, so why make another category to remember on the warning signs.)

And yes, FOOF is worse. But it's hard to encounter in the wild, since it gets jittery above 110 Kelvin. ClF3 can just be loaded into a compressed-gas cylinder and shipped by truck:
Air Products and Chemicals, Inc. wrote:ClF3 is a very useful chemical in operations requiring a high-energy fluorinating agent or incendiary material, especially since it can be handled at room temperatures.

[...]

During the liquid rocket propellant era, a major incident involving ClF3 occurred the first time a one-ton steel container was loaded with liquid ClF3 for bulk shipment. The container had been cooled with dry ice to perform the liquid transfer and help make the product safer to handle, since the ClF3 vapor pressure would only be about 0.007 kg/cm2 (0.1 psia) in the subcooled state. However, the dry ice bath embrittled the steel container wall, which split while it was being maneuvered onto a dolly, instantaneously releasing 907 kg (2,000 lb) of cold ClF3liquid onto the building floor. The ClF3 dissolved the 30 cm (12 inch) thick concrete floor and another 90 cm (36 inches) of gravel underneath the spill. The fumes that were generated (chlorine trifluoride, hydrogen fluoride, chlorine, hydrogen chloride, etc.) severely corroded everything that was exposed. One eyewitness described the incident by stating, "The concrete was on fire!"

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Soupspoon » Tue Aug 28, 2018 11:43 am UTC

orthogon wrote:This reminds me of our Fire Assembly Point, which is about 3 metres away from our building and next to a door on the adjacent building that's plastered with the full-house of Hazchem labels. At the last fire drill, I asked our Facilities guy to remind me why it was ok for that to be the assembly point. He said they'd discuss it at their debriefing and report back.

There's a cage of bottled gasses you can see, as I occasionally pass by, near the loading entrance of a university department.

The signs (as I've never gotten close enough to check the bottles precisely) clearly show warnings for "flammable gas" presumably racked in the left third, "oxygen" in the middle third and "inert gasses" at the right. I would have thought they'd at least have put the inert gasses centrally, mitigating one or more problems just in case.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby bruce.x » Tue Aug 28, 2018 12:21 pm UTC

AlacrityFitzhugh wrote:I would by that on a t-shirt. Can that happen?


I was thinking a bumper sticker. But I'm cool with a T-shirt.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby cellocgw » Tue Aug 28, 2018 1:44 pm UTC

Mikeski wrote:
I think it gets extra credit for being an oxidizer that contains no oxygen. (So I suppose it's properly a "fluorinator", but that causes the same hazards as an oxidizer, so why make another category to remember on the warning signs.)


The chemical term "oxidizer" covers any substance which grabs electrons away from something else. Amazingly, Wikipedia agrees with that little fact I learned in high-school chemistry class (never mind how long ago that was).
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby DavidSh » Tue Aug 28, 2018 3:50 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:There deserves to be a few more portmanteau signs based upon the various ones in the range. And beyond.

I see there is an official warning sign for Guard Dog, but none for Sharks, Alligators, or Octopodes. How do you appropriately placard the moat?

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Nigel.vezeau » Tue Aug 28, 2018 5:53 pm UTC

So I work for a company that makes linear accelerators for industrial sterilization. I think we actually have all of those hazards in the workplace.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby ThatPITA » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:19 pm UTC

It's the universal sign for "maker space".

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Sir Lunch-a-lot » Wed Aug 29, 2018 4:48 am UTC

I made an SVG version of this that could be printed as a sign (attached as PNG, and the SVG code is inside the spoiler if someone feels like copying it into a text file, saving it as an SVG and opening it in inkscape or wherever).
Spoiler:
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Speaking of FOOF's instability, I have been listening to the audiobook version of Ignition!: An Informal History of Liquid Rocket Propellants, and it seems like randomly exploding was a somewhat common characteristic of many experimental propellants.
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FOARP
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby FOARP » Wed Aug 29, 2018 7:19 am UTC

pogrmman wrote:I could concievably think of a scenario with a radioactive, biohazardous, liquid lasting medium, but the high voltage part is tricky to add in. Hmm...


I'm thinking a laser powered by Deinococcus radiodurans genetically-engineered into a bio-luminescent bio-weapon, mixed into a radioactive sludge, kept stable by playing "Danger! High Voltage" by the Electric Six over a Tannoy system?

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby somitomi » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:05 am UTC

Sir Lunch-a-lot wrote:Speaking of FOOF's instability, I have been listening to the audiobook version of Ignition!: An Informal History of Liquid Rocket Propellants, and it seems like randomly exploding was a somewhat common characteristic of many experimental propellants.

I've read once about hypergolic propellants, whose components ignite upon contact with each other. This is great, because rockets using such propellant can be reliably ignited repeatedly without an ignition system. But in addition to being explosive, most such fuels are toxic, corrosive and carcinogenic.
—◯-◯

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby cellocgw » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:18 am UTC

ThatPITA wrote:It's the universal sign for "maker space".


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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby richP » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:00 pm UTC

hamjudo wrote:On a recent road trip I passed a semi-trailer that had more than a dozen hazardous material flip-card placards on each side. The only one that was in use was a flammable cargo warning. Some of the closed ones were the 4 digit number
style similar to https://www.flipplacards.com/digi-lock-placards, others had individually flippable quadrants like https://www.flipplacards.com/fos/NFPA-Signs/NFPA-Flip-Placard-Sign-Aluminum/SKU-PL-0001.

What kind of cargo would require that many placards?

LTL (Less than Load) with different chemicals going to different places.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby netsplit » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:10 pm UTC

Mikeski wrote:Still safer than chlorine trifluoride!

I find it amusing/horrifying that the NFPA "fire diamond" gives ClF3 a zero out of four for flammability. Technically, yes, the ClF3 itself doesn't burn. It just makes everything else burn. Water, people, sand, concrete, asbestos...

(It does get the "oxidizer" and "reacts with water" marks.)



Who would win in a fight, the Hulk or a high pressure jet of chlorine trifluoride?
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:46 pm UTC

netsplit wrote:Who would win in a fight, the Hulk or a high pressure jet of chlorine trifluoride?
Whichever it was, it'd be angry and green.

Call me when it's all over.

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Old Bruce
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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Old Bruce » Wed Aug 29, 2018 4:33 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:
netsplit wrote:Who would win in a fight, the Hulk or a high pressure jet of chlorine trifluoride?
Whichever it was, it'd be angry and green.

Call me when it's all over.

Warn me before it starts!

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby SuicideJunkie » Wed Aug 29, 2018 6:52 pm UTC

Old Bruce wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:
netsplit wrote:Who would win in a fight, the Hulk or a high pressure jet of chlorine trifluoride?
Whichever it was, it'd be angry and green.

Call me when it's all over.

Warn me before it starts!

It hasn't started, so consider yourself warned.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby Old Bruce » Wed Aug 29, 2018 11:02 pm UTC

SuicideJunkie wrote:
Old Bruce wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:
netsplit wrote:Who would win in a fight, the Hulk or a high pressure jet of chlorine trifluoride?
Whichever it was, it'd be angry and green.

Call me when it's all over.

Warn me before it starts!

It hasn't started, so consider yourself warned.

Well played , well played indeed. I walked into that one for certain, made me laugh.

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Re: 2038: "Hazard Symbol"

Postby PM 2Ring » Thu Aug 30, 2018 1:07 am UTC

For extra fun, make the chlorine trifluoride using 36Cl, which is a beta emitter with a half-life of around 300,000 years, and a maximum decay energy around 709 keV. I guess you could just get some regular ClF3 and put it inside a fission reactor to irradiate it with neutrons, but the reactor people probably wouldn't be too happy with that. :mrgreen:


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