0657: "Movie Narrative Charts"

This forum is for the individual discussion thread that goes with each new comic.

Moderators: Magistrates, Prelates, Moderators General

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby mxsimon » Thu Nov 05, 2009 2:46 pm UTC

Agreed, a BTTF equivalent is called for. how 'bout "Memento" ?
mxsimon
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Nov 05, 2009 2:14 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby makc » Thu Nov 05, 2009 6:43 pm UTC

aquilo wrote:You could make an alternate universe for every instance where they go back in time (like mean Biff world vs. friendly Biff world).
That part did always seem not right to me, why the hell whenever they come back to their own time (1985) from past, their younger "selves" necessary go on with the travel just in time to close the loop? Since 1985 reality is altered, there is no longer an obligation for Marty to go back to 1955 in the same day and time, is there?.... The only reasoning to save the plot here is to say that Marty necessary knows doc for some reason, and doc timeline did not changed, hence all doc-related events still happen for Marty, but this seems like weak argument.
makc
 
Posts: 181
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:26 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby aquilo » Thu Nov 05, 2009 10:27 pm UTC

makc wrote:
aquilo wrote:You could make an alternate universe for every instance where they go back in time (like mean Biff world vs. friendly Biff world).
That part did always seem not right to me, why the hell whenever they come back to their own time (1985) from past, their younger "selves" necessary go on with the travel just in time to close the loop? Since 1985 reality is altered, there is no longer an obligation for Marty to go back to 1955 in the same day and time, is there?.... The only reasoning to save the plot here is to say that Marty necessary knows doc for some reason, and doc timeline did not changed, hence all doc-related events still happen for Marty, but this seems like weak argument.

Marty seems to be unaffected by the changed universe, notice that he keeps his memories. I see three possibilities for the end of the first movie:

1. He jumped from his own universe into the friendly-Biff universe. That raises the question of what happened to that universe's Marty. Note that in the second movie's alternate universe, Marty is said to be in Switzerland; is Switzerland Marty still there or did original Marty replace him?

2. It's the same universe, just re-arranged. The reason that Marty doesn't gain the memories of the alternate history is that he was shielded from the change by his time travelling. Star Trek does this all the time. In First Contact the ship was "in the chronotron field" when the Borg changed history, or something like that.

3. It is a paradox, but the paradox hasn't caught up to them yet. Remember in the first movie the photo of Marty's siblings faded over several days, so it takes time for changes to take effect. A few days after the third movie ends, the paradox will catch up to them and the universe will be destroyed (though, as the Doc says, the damage may be limited to their own galaxy).
User avatar
aquilo
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:54 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby BlazeOrangeDeer » Fri Nov 06, 2009 1:04 am UTC

I just watched Primer, and I now understand why randall's graph is spot on. (the lack of synching between the A/V in the google vid version makes it all the more confusing.) I find it hilarious that it's basically just random scribbles, that is exactly how the first viewing feels :lol:
User avatar
BlazeOrangeDeer
 
Posts: 60
Joined: Tue Aug 25, 2009 3:44 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby makc » Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:59 am UTC

aquilo wrote:It is a paradox, but the paradox hasn't caught up to them yet. Remember in the first movie the photo of Marty's siblings faded over several days, so it takes time for changes to take effect.
On the other hand, in wild west part the grave stone photo changed very quickly. This whole picture changing thing doesnt make any sense (picture changes but, as you noticed, Marty's memories do not... and why the hell anythig would change at all) but - hey - it's only fiction movie.
makc
 
Posts: 181
Joined: Mon Nov 02, 2009 12:26 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby aquilo » Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:40 pm UTC

makc wrote:
aquilo wrote:It is a paradox, but the paradox hasn't caught up to them yet. Remember in the first movie the photo of Marty's siblings faded over several days, so it takes time for changes to take effect.
On the other hand, in wild west part the grave stone photo changed very quickly. This whole picture changing thing doesnt make any sense (picture changes but, as you noticed, Marty's memories do not... and why the hell anythig would change at all) but - hey - it's only fiction movie.

Maybe fading photos are probability-based. When Marty's siblings were disappearing, there was still a shrinking chance that his parents could get together. However, when the fax and the tombstone changed, there was no longer any possibility of those events happening.
User avatar
aquilo
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:54 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby AlexTheSeal » Fri Nov 06, 2009 9:54 pm UTC

pgbridge2000 wrote:[
YES! I saw this comic and the Minard Diagram of Napoleon's invasion of Russia was actually the first thing that came to my head. To be fair, I was in the middle of a tech writing problem set and we just analyzed the Minard diagram a week ago.


Good Lord! Where do you go to school???

There's hope for the technical writing profession yet. I hope to see a readable software manual in my lifetime!
Code: Select all
10 REM WORLD'S SMALLEST ADVENTURE GAME
20 PRINT "YOU ARE IN A CAVE (N, S, E, W)? ";
30 INPUT A$
40 GOTO 10

Lulled to sleep by the one-hertz chuckle of Linux logfile writes since 1997.
User avatar
AlexTheSeal
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:57 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:22 pm UTC

Wait, what about the part where Frodo is stunned by the Spider (Sheela or whatever her name is), and Sam takes the ring? The graph shows the ring transfer, but not them being seperated.

I know they weren't more than a half-mile apart, but still, they weren't together.
User avatar
CorruptUser
 
Posts: 5801
Joined: Fri Nov 06, 2009 10:12 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby SocialSceneRepairman » Sat Nov 07, 2009 3:04 am UTC

mxsimon wrote:Agreed, a BTTF equivalent is called for. how 'bout "Memento" ?


"Memento" was pretty straightforward, though...
SocialSceneRepairman
 
Posts: 200
Joined: Sat May 24, 2008 4:17 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby AlexTheSeal » Sat Nov 07, 2009 9:46 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Wait, what about the part where Frodo is stunned by the Spider (Sheela or whatever her name is)


I believe you mean Sheena, Queen of the Jungle.
Code: Select all
10 REM WORLD'S SMALLEST ADVENTURE GAME
20 PRINT "YOU ARE IN A CAVE (N, S, E, W)? ";
30 INPUT A$
40 GOTO 10

Lulled to sleep by the one-hertz chuckle of Linux logfile writes since 1997.
User avatar
AlexTheSeal
 
Posts: 53
Joined: Mon Oct 26, 2009 12:57 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby monteslu » Sat Nov 07, 2009 1:13 pm UTC

SocialSceneRepairman wrote:
mxsimon wrote:Agreed, a BTTF equivalent is called for. how 'bout "Memento" ?


"Memento" was pretty straightforward, though...


I'd say it was pretty straightbackward :)

Or maybe linear is the word.
monteslu
 
Posts: 16
Joined: Fri Sep 11, 2009 7:41 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby darthbyu » Tue Nov 10, 2009 8:46 pm UTC

bakert wrote:I much preferred the comic to this thread.
User avatar
darthbyu
 
Posts: 13
Joined: Fri May 22, 2009 4:11 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby psion » Tue Nov 10, 2009 9:26 pm UTC

MShades wrote: Tom Bombadil can go die in a fire.

Much agreed.
User avatar
psion
 
Posts: 1090
Joined: Wed Apr 01, 2009 5:33 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby aquilo » Tue Nov 10, 2009 9:57 pm UTC

psion wrote:
MShades wrote: Tom Bombadil can go die in a fire.

Much agreed.

But he's such a merry fellow; bright blue his jacket is, and his boots are yellow!
User avatar
aquilo
 
Posts: 65
Joined: Fri Sep 25, 2009 6:54 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby joeyadams » Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:20 am UTC

I needn't repeat the praises for detail of this comic.

I think such a chart for the Matrix trilogy would be interesting. The curves for Neo, Trinity, and the Agents would have discontinuities. To make things more confusing, there's the Matrix and the real world.
joeyadams
 
Posts: 5
Joined: Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:01 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Kyrn » Wed Nov 11, 2009 1:45 am UTC

joeyadams wrote:I needn't repeat the praises for detail of this comic.

I think such a chart for the Matrix trilogy would be interesting. The curves for Neo, Trinity, and the Agents would have discontinuities. To make things more confusing, there's the Matrix and the real world.


http://xkcd.com/566/ What sequel?
Kyrn
 
Posts: 937
Joined: Sat Sep 05, 2009 3:55 pm UTC
Location: The Internet

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Melkarion » Wed Nov 11, 2009 2:22 am UTC

Guybrush wrote:Alright, I saw this comic this morning, and was perplexed by Primer. I went to Blockbuster, which as it turns out, is going out of business, so EVERYTHING was for sale, and they had one copy of Primer, and I got it and took it home, and I just got through watching it, and I have to say that I believe this graph, while not accurate, is still a fair representation of what happens in the movie.


Same here, including the going to Blockbuster and finding them selling everything, snagging the last copy, etc. Except for one crucial detail... I first learned of the movie about two years ago on tvtropes and this awesome, awesome effort simply provided the impetus for my long-planned concerted effort to find a copy and watch this movie.
"... for a man to understand what he himself says is one thing, and to understand himself in what is said is something else." -Soren K.

An ironic motto of sorts:
The ability to quote is a serviceable substitute for wit. -W. Somerset Maugham.
User avatar
Melkarion
 
Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:39 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby tes » Thu Nov 12, 2009 6:34 pm UTC

I just registered to say that i'm impressed by how many people registered just to post about this comic.
This isn't a meta-post, is it?
User avatar
tes
 
Posts: 56
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 5:35 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Christo » Thu Nov 12, 2009 9:34 pm UTC

tes wrote:I just registered to say that i'm impressed by how many people registered just to post about this comic.
This isn't a meta-post, is it?


I think it qualifies.
www.cuttingroomcomic.com - a twice a week webcomic about recently released and upcoming movies.
User avatar
Christo
 
Posts: 164
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 12:26 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Melkarion » Thu Nov 12, 2009 11:31 pm UTC

tes wrote:I just registered to say that i'm impressed by how many people registered just to post about this comic.
This isn't a meta-post, is it?


I would say that if it wasn't initially, the question at the end tipped it over the edge.
"... for a man to understand what he himself says is one thing, and to understand himself in what is said is something else." -Soren K.

An ironic motto of sorts:
The ability to quote is a serviceable substitute for wit. -W. Somerset Maugham.
User avatar
Melkarion
 
Posts: 85
Joined: Wed Jul 04, 2007 7:39 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby gebeleysis » Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:39 pm UTC

Hi all. I hope I'm not duplicating someone with this:
Attachments
Primer.png
Primer.png (15.68 KiB) Viewed 6396 times
gebeleysis
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2009 8:35 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Khalid » Tue Nov 17, 2009 3:00 am UTC

I can assume the number of daily downloads of Primer chart uses fake statistics right? I mean it doesn't seem right, and it continues into December 2009 which has yet to occur. The reason I'm being kind of mean like this is because this is the INTERNET you could've been charting some torrent site and show the statistics of it. Which would of been much cooler, but instead you made some dumb chart to convey some lame joke which could've been said in a post. Oh wait it has, a few pages back. </mean mode>
User avatar
Khalid
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:31 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Kirstead » Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:15 am UTC

someone make a fucking site already
Kirstead
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Sun Nov 22, 2009 3:13 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Khalid » Mon Nov 23, 2009 1:42 am UTC

Kirstead wrote:someone make a ****ing site already


And what do you mean by that? A website that has a whole bunch of these charts? Sure, why not. You are very helpful by the way.
User avatar
Khalid
 
Posts: 39
Joined: Tue Apr 28, 2009 12:31 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Keybounce » Mon Nov 30, 2009 7:12 pm UTC

rgoomh wrote:This is all wrong! All wrong! You're missing Back To The Future, Randall!


Oh, yes. Do all 3 in one chart. Include the DeLorian in all its repetitions.

That will be fun.

... and naturally, two pages later, someone does :-). Thank you!

---

Seriously, this is something I wish I had when I was trying to read LOTR. I could not keep track of everyone, and just concentrated on Sam+Frodo.

Shame on you, Randall, for using the movie plot. Aragorn did not fall off a cliff.

See DM of the Rings :-). Handles that scene beautifully.

If that's what you think the character interaction of 12 Angry Men is like, then the whole movie went over your head.

I didn't see the movie, but the play was 12 people in one room, discussing the trial. Other than entering/exiting the room, that was it.

If you want to group the "innocent" vs. "guilty" over time, that would show changes.

The LotR and Star Wars charts were absolutely amazing. I lawled quite audibly at the "Special Edition" part.

"Han fired first!" needs to be on there :-).

Imagine trying to do this for LOST. Total mess. The answer is going with a directed graph instead of a Cartesian space. ... Then time is not a dimension of the diagram, but a subjective path for each character.

That made sense. "Lost" did not.
The political and economic blog of a strict constitutionalist.
http://StrictConstitution.BlogSpot.com

Current topic: Constitutional amendment to correct bad court decisions and protect the constitution
Keybounce
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 1:41 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Fhydra » Fri Dec 04, 2009 4:00 am UTC

I'm a bit late to the thread, but I noticed the Primer downloads part of the discussion and I thought it might be interesting to show Google Trends for a search of "primer movie" during 2009. Doesn't entirely validate gebeleysis but you see a similar reaction.

Image
Fhydra
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Fri Dec 04, 2009 3:51 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Oxidizer » Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:24 am UTC

Pulp Fiction


Image

Check out this Stanford final project: https://graphics.stanford.edu/wikis/cs448b-09-fall/FP-OgievetskyVadim
Link to app: http://stanford.edu/~vad/PlotWeaver/

It's a tool to make Movie Narrative Charts with research paper and all
Oxidizer
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Dec 08, 2009 9:12 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby neoliminal » Tue Dec 08, 2009 3:38 pm UTC

Nice. Add more grey areas around the "events" and label them.


Then do LOST.
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13451873-unselected
Read My Book. Cost less than coffee. Will probabaly keep you awake longer.
User avatar
neoliminal
 
Posts: 612
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:39 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Keybounce » Tue Dec 08, 2009 5:21 pm UTC

Does it do time loops?
The political and economic blog of a strict constitutionalist.
http://StrictConstitution.BlogSpot.com

Current topic: Constitutional amendment to correct bad court decisions and protect the constitution
Keybounce
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 1:41 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby neoliminal » Tue Dec 08, 2009 7:48 pm UTC

Keybounce wrote:Does it do time loops?


If you are asking about Lost, not yet.
http://www.goodreads.com/book/show/13451873-unselected
Read My Book. Cost less than coffee. Will probabaly keep you awake longer.
User avatar
neoliminal
 
Posts: 612
Joined: Wed Feb 18, 2009 6:39 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby Keybounce » Wed Dec 09, 2009 5:26 pm UTC

I was actually thinking of "Back to the Future".
The political and economic blog of a strict constitutionalist.
http://StrictConstitution.BlogSpot.com

Current topic: Constitutional amendment to correct bad court decisions and protect the constitution
Keybounce
 
Posts: 86
Joined: Fri May 29, 2009 1:41 am UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby ojg15 » Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:37 pm UTC

Awesome comic,

Maybe its just me, but shouldn't r2d2's line move off by itself for a bit at the start when he's lost..
You know, the bit that starts the entire trilogy :)
ojg15
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Tue Feb 23, 2010 1:33 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby mbogot » Mon Apr 26, 2010 12:06 pm UTC

Oxidizer wrote:
Pulp Fiction


Image

Check out this Stanford final project: https://graphics.stanford.edu/wikis/cs448b-09-fall/FP-OgievetskyVadim
Link to app: http://stanford.edu/~vad/PlotWeaver/

It's a tool to make Movie Narrative Charts with research paper and all

The Land Before Time

Image

C'mon guys! Let's get the ball rolling!
Attachments
movie.png
mbogot
 
Posts: 7
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2010 9:44 am UTC
Location: Israel

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby zambiap » Tue Aug 24, 2010 9:46 pm UTC

OK, I debated about this and decided to let it lie. Minor issue, hardly worth pointing out.

Then I saw the big poster of the comic and just had to nerd out and throw my 2 cents in.

12 angry men is wrong. There is a scene about 1/2 hour in where one of the jurors (the protagonist) goes to the bathroom. Three other jurors follow him into the restroom to pursuade him. They go in in different orders and leave in different orders. I probably wouldn't have remembered it if the strip hadn't reminded me how good the movie was and inspired me to go back and re-watch it.

I know, I know-- it ruins the humor of the strip, but there it is.

Zambia
zambiap
 
Posts: 1
Joined: Tue Aug 24, 2010 3:58 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby The Boz » Wed Aug 25, 2010 9:44 am UTC

I want to see people's take on Inception in MNC form. Would it be one straight line? Seven straight lines coming together 20 minutes into the movie? Or would you go all 3D on it?
MAKE LOVE, NOT SPAM!
User avatar
The Boz
 
Posts: 63
Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:52 pm UTC

Re: "Movie Narrative Charts" Discussion

Postby not baby Newt » Wed Aug 25, 2010 3:02 pm UTC

Inception - plot each characters own subjective reality and map deep dreaming/reality to shire/mordor. Or draw all subjective realities so you go from dunno to 7 to 14 to lots!
not baby Newt
 
Posts: 109
Joined: Wed Feb 03, 2010 11:30 pm UTC

Re: 0657: "Movie Narrative Charts"

Postby phillllymon » Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:49 am UTC

This is awesome!!!!!

Although...it is missing the Princess Bride, so I have taken the liberty of making another chart:
http://imgur.com/aYDUD

Any comments?
Mistakes?
I think I've had more fun making this that I have since my first day of college.
Enjoy!
phillllymon
 
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jan 08, 2011 2:42 am UTC

Re: 0657: "Movie Narrative Charts"

Postby ConMan » Wed Jan 12, 2011 5:27 am UTC

People looking for a BTTF chart may be somewhat placated by Information is Beautiful's Timelines graphic. It doesn't track individual characters, but it does follow the time travel paths of several movies and TV shows.
pollywog wrote:
Wikihow wrote:* Smile a lot! Give a gay girl a knowing "Hey, I'm a lesbian too!" smile.
I want to learn this smile, perfect it, and then go around smiling at lesbians and freaking them out.
User avatar
ConMan
Shepherd's Pie?
 
Posts: 1366
Joined: Tue Jan 01, 2008 11:56 am UTC
Location: Beacon Alpha

Re: 0657: "Movie Narrative Charts"

Postby DavidS » Tue Jan 18, 2011 6:00 pm UTC

People who enjoyed this comic may enjoy our little Mystery Hunt tribute to it: http://ihavetofindpeach.com/puzzles/katamari_damacy/plotlines/

Click on "Call in Answer" if you want to check your solutions.
DavidS
 
Posts: 4
Joined: Thu May 15, 2008 11:16 am UTC

Re: 0657: "Movie Narrative Charts"

Postby cjdrum » Mon Feb 14, 2011 2:15 am UTC

I've probably got this all wrong (I haven't seen LoTR in a while), but didn't Gandalf possess the Ring for a brief period of time? Or does it not count, because he never wore it, or it was in the envelope the whole time...
:shock:
User avatar
cjdrum
 
Posts: 113
Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 4:51 am UTC
Location: BACK

PreviousNext

Return to Individual XKCD Comic Threads

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: azule, broarbape, Izawwlgood, wawaidemiprem and 22 guests