0973: "MTV Generation"

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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby SpringLoaded12 » Sun Nov 06, 2011 8:53 am UTC

sje46 wrote:Also, a woman outwits a man in a comic strip?! CLEARLY this is sexism. But wait, how do you know that's a woman? Just because the character has long hair? Clearly YOURE a sexist too, for assuming that men can't have long hair!

Ad hominem.
Anyway, we do know that that is a woman because while it is possible for men to have long hair, in xkcd, men have always been depicted without hair (with a few exceptions for specific purposes). Similarly, women have always been depicted with long hair or a ponytail (again, with a few specific-purpose exceptions).


legopelle wrote:TL;DR

People getting mature when getting older. Or old will always look down on new.

Was I the only person in the whole damn thread that knew what this meant?
People, legopelle isn't saying the comic was too long; he/she was indicating that the rest of the comment should be read as a sort of summary of the comic's meaning.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby sje46 » Sun Nov 06, 2011 10:18 am UTC

SpringLoaded12 wrote:
sje46 wrote:Also, a woman outwits a man in a comic strip?! CLEARLY this is sexism. But wait, how do you know that's a woman? Just because the character has long hair? Clearly YOURE a sexist too, for assuming that men can't have long hair!

Ad hominem.
Anyway, we do know that that is a woman because while it is possible for men to have long hair, in xkcd, men have always been depicted without hair (with a few exceptions for specific purposes). Similarly, women have always been depicted with long hair or a ponytail (again, with a few specific-purpose exceptions).


I wasn't being serious. I was throwing out accusations of sexism frivolously, like he was doing.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby mric » Sun Nov 06, 2011 3:39 pm UTC

Elirra wrote:I'm overly fond of this particular nuance of language, my favorite example being the sentence "There are three 2s in the English language." Spoken aloud nobody will question it, but the sentence is impossible to reproduce in written form.


I would write it as "There are three /'tuː/'s in the English language." or "There are three (tü)'s in the English language." or any of the other phonetic spelling structures. I am willing to take advice from an IPA specialist or dictionary sub-editor on whether I have correctly used the apostrophe to make the phonetic spelling plural (my guess is there is no fixed convention).
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby Pfhorrest » Sun Nov 06, 2011 7:30 pm UTC

sherlip wrote:
RebeccaRGB wrote:
sherlip wrote:
StClair wrote:
sherlip wrote:I like to refer to us as the "Disney Star Generation"

As in Frankie Avalon, Annette Funicello, Kurt Russell and Jodie Foster?

Dear God, and I thought that fit us perfectly..

Does "Disney Channel Star Generation" make it less ambiguous?


I guess so.. but I figured Disney didn't have stars before it had a channel.. I mean, we're they like prancing around in the theme parks or something?

Disney had TV shows (and lets not forget movies, which can also have stars) long before it had a whole TV channel.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby bigjeff5 » Mon Nov 07, 2011 4:14 am UTC

SpringLoaded12 wrote:
legopelle wrote:TL;DR...

Was I the only person in the whole damn thread that knew what this meant?
People, legopelle isn't saying the comic was too long; he/she was indicating that the rest of the comment should be read as a sort of summary of the comic's meaning.


I meant to say the same thing in my post, but I got side-tracked.

Since so many people can't be bothered to read any sort of long post or article, thus creating the TL;DR meme in the first place, it is becoming common to add a one or two line summary for the TL;DR folks. It is usually prefaced with a TL;DR of its own, though when I do it I like to add a colon to the end, better indicating that it's for the TL;DR crowd. Also, TL;DR folks are usually way too lazy to actually type anything after "TL;DR".

I think some of the confusion could be because legopelle's post wasn't particularly long - I certainly wouldn't have bothered to create a TL;DR summary for it.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby StClair » Mon Nov 07, 2011 4:17 am UTC

Disney had TV shows (and lets not forget movies, which can also have stars) long before it had a whole TV channel.

Indeed. I grew up on "the Wonderful World of Disney" (Sunday nights), and in my youth I saw reruns of the Mickey Mouse Club. (M I C ... K E Y ...)

I meant to comment earlier that the comic's final line could be ellided to simply:
"Let's face it, your problem is with kids."
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby Radical_Initiator » Mon Nov 07, 2011 4:48 am UTC

Eugo wrote:Also, the ad time is longer and longer. Star Trek TOS took 50 minutes per episode; the latest crop takes 40.


I worry about Canada. I hear some of their hours only have 22 minutes.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby ijuin » Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:54 am UTC

Yoduh wrote:
SamSam wrote:
And that's because the generation who raised them are the ones who were originally labeled as the "no attention span" generation when they were themselves growing up in the 80s. So that's to say that either both generations are to blame, or that attention spans are only achieved later in life and the cycle of older generations hating newer generations is never ending. And I can see that, I'm 23 and already find middle schoolers with cell phones to be highly annoying.


I can buy the idea of attention spans only growing with maturity. A small child can barely pay attention through the length of a movie even if they find it entertaining. Teenagers lose interest within minutes on an unentertaining subject even when they are faced with punishment for not paying attention (e.g. classroom lectures). It's only when one is old enough that hours do not seem like eternity that one can do something dull all day without obsessing about escaping from it.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Nov 07, 2011 8:14 am UTC

bigjeff5 wrote:I think some of the confusion could be because legopelle's post wasn't particularly long - I certainly wouldn't have bothered to create a TL;DR summary for it.

I think that was part of the intended humor. The comic is (indirectly) about kids with short attention spans. The kind who wouldn't read a whole paragraph, or the whole comic. So he made a TL;DR version of something that nobody should need a TL;DR for, cause, hey, kids these days, amirite?

TL;DR: jk lol
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby SamSam » Mon Nov 07, 2011 6:36 pm UTC

bigjeff5 wrote:
SirMustapha wrote:Snip...


I think I'm finally starting to figure you out, SirMustapha. [...]

The whole "That's the problem with the MTV Generation - no attention span" trope is a trope because it is so damn common. I still hear that nonsense, even though - as was pointed out in the comics - the MTV Generation are well on their way to becoming old fuddy-duddies.


I think this is the source of the misunderstanding between you (and whoever) and SirMustapha (and whoever) on this comic.

SirMustapha's point was that no one says this anymore. Several other people have commented in a similar vein. If you're under the age of 25, you may never have even heard the phrase "MTV generation" used in your life, and certainly not used to refer to you. In fact, a (very) cursory look at the Googles finds no instance of "the MTV generation" used to refer to today's youth. As a 29-year-old who works with high schoolers and with other people (of all generations) who work with youth, I can say with confidence that I haven't heard the phrase in reference to kids in 10 years.

So SirMustapha's "strawman" point was that Randall made fun of (or correcting) a sentiment that isn't actually any real person's sentiment.

You apparently disagree, and say that everyone is still complaining about "the MTV generation." Well... that's the source of your disagreement.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby mythago » Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:18 am UTC

I have heard Boomers - still - refer to 'the MTV generation'.

I am part of "the MTV generation". My kids read this comic and thought it was hilarious. Then they went back to chatting with their friends on Pesterchum while running their favorite Youtube videos in a separate browser.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby scarletmanuka » Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:03 am UTC

Fat Tony wrote:
Elirra wrote:"There are three 2s in the English language."

...Huh?

The words "to", "too" and "two", which have a common pronunciation - thus making, as Elirra said, a sentence that makes sense when you say it but not when you write it.

One of Asimov's Black Widower stories ("The Fourth Homonym") contains a discussion on how best to rephrase that very sentence in order to make the meaning more evident. I think the final suggestion was along the lines of "There are three words pronounced 't-o-o' in the English language."
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby UniqueScreenname » Tue Nov 08, 2011 9:05 am UTC

Dinoguy1000 wrote:
nathanmacinnes wrote:
UniqueScreenname wrote:what is TL;DR?


Too long; didn't read.


I can't be the only person who sees the unintentional irony in this response. :P


It was definitely intentional lol.

Oh, btw, I watch music videos on MTV every morning, currently. They all suck, but they do exist.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby Rorgg » Tue Nov 08, 2011 5:50 pm UTC

MTV debuted on my tenth birthday. I'm now 40.

Luckily, my Aspergers counteracts the attention-span-destroying aspect of... oooh, cool pattern....
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby bigjeff5 » Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:36 pm UTC

SamSam wrote: As a 29-year-old who works with high schoolers and with other people (of all generations) who work with youth, I can say with confidence that I haven't heard the phrase in reference to kids in 10 years.

So SirMustapha's "strawman" point was that Randall made fun of (or correcting) a sentiment that isn't actually any real person's sentiment.

You apparently disagree, and say that everyone is still complaining about "the MTV generation." Well... that's the source of your disagreement.


Lucky you? I guess?

I think the problem is you don't hang out with older people. At 28 I'm the second youngest person in my office - the average age of the people I work with is about 50, and I hear it all the time. That's the joke, really. Old people still call kids the "MTV Generation" even though that generation is in their 40's now.

Of course high schoolers aren't going to call themselves "The MTV Generation", that's the whole point of the comic.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby chrth » Fri Nov 11, 2011 8:29 pm UTC

I would like to point out something that hasn't been mentioned.

MTV debuted 30 years ago.

The "I remember MTV when they used to play videos" line goes back to at least 1996 (around when shows like "Beavis and Butthead", "Real World" and "Dateline" were airing, and in response to this they started shows like "Total Request" in 1997). In other words, people have complaining about the number of videos MTV plays for at least half of its existence.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby bmonk » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:13 pm UTC

Randomizer wrote:Kids today are part of the MTV generation. Because MTV is still on the air.

Yeah, maybe--but MTV no longer plays any music videos, does it?

chrth wrote:I would like to point out something that hasn't been mentioned.

MTV debuted 30 years ago.

The "I remember MTV when they used to play videos" line goes back to at least 1996 (around when shows like "Beavis and Butthead", "Real World" and "Dateline" were airing, and in response to this they started shows like "Total Request" in 1997). In other words, people have complaining about the number of videos MTV plays for at least half of its existence.

Yes. MTV quickly found that a channel that plays 3-5 minute material doesn't tend to keep its watchers very long, so they transitioned to longer shows--half an hour or more.

TV Guide recently did the same: now most of its programming is in half-hour or hour shows, or even movies.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby chrth » Fri Nov 11, 2011 9:59 pm UTC

I guess my point is, though, is the line even legit? If for at least half of its existence MTV has not been playing videos, doesn't that mean the video-playing days are the anomaly?
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby jeffk » Sat Nov 12, 2011 7:34 pm UTC

GregSucks wrote:
xkcdfan wrote:Obligatory "MTV doesn't even show music videos anymore" comment.


I registered an account to just say that MTV /never/ showed music videos, as far as I (generation MTV's child) am concerned.


chrth wrote:I guess my point is, though, is the line even legit? If for at least half of its existence MTV has not been playing videos, doesn't that mean the video-playing days are the anomaly?


Mad Magazine included this in its parody on Beloit College's annual freshman mindset list.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby kkn » Wed Nov 16, 2011 6:47 pm UTC

I have a question! Is http://xkcd.com/766/ WHG or BHG?

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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby scarletmanuka » Fri Nov 18, 2011 7:03 am UTC

kkn wrote:I have a question! Is http://xkcd.com/766/ WHG or BHG?
The behaviour seems more in keeping with BHG.
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Re: 0973: "MTV Generation"

Postby styopa » Mon Nov 21, 2011 3:07 pm UTC

FWIW (mouseover text) Dick Vernon wasn't the principal; I think the movie has a hint more pathos if you understand that in a way he's as trapped as they are, moreso in fact, and he is entirely aware of it. Like them, he tries to make the best of his 'sentence' doing things that are inappropriate.

Yeah, thinking about it and trying to imagine watching it with him actually as the principal definitely takes a whole layer of irony out of it.
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