1063: "Kill Hitler"

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-KF-
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1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby -KF- » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:09 am UTC

Image

Mouseover: "Revised directive: It is forbidden for you to interfere with human history until you've at least taken a class on it."

In addition to the history class, I'd recommend a class on the implications and effects of altering timelines.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby glasnt » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:09 am UTC

Noooo! :( Beaten.

insert "Let's Kill Hitler" quotes here.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby rhomboidal » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:12 am UTC

Silicon Valley's drooling over BHG's business model of one-use-only high technology.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Djehutynakht » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:12 am UTC

You don't kill Hitler... goddammit... you make sure he gets accepted to art school, take his place, and use the power of your Third Reich to be a little better at his job.

And Hitler? What about Ghengis Khan? 18 million or so Chinese killed in one expedition. That's nearly triple the numbers of the Holocaust.

...Couldn't he just make multiple one-use time machines?

Ah BHG. We always can rely on him to time travel responsibly.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Quicksilver » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:14 am UTC

Danger 5 was the first thing that sprang to mind.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby vortighast » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:15 am UTC

Hmm... BHG seems a little...soft? I don't know, he just doesn't seem his normal self here.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby xokocodo » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:15 am UTC

Apparently after you time travel, the windows on the machine disappear.

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whateveries
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby whateveries » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:16 am UTC

so does godwins thingy mean this thread was over before the first post?* if so, someone broke a paradox and we want it fixe.
it's fine.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Supershadow18 » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:24 am UTC

vortighast wrote:Hmm... BHG seems a little...soft? I don't know, he just doesn't seem his normal self here.


This is BHG we're talking about here. We can't disregard the possibility that this isn't even a time machine, or that he didn't know he was killing Hitler at the end of his life, and he purposefully wasted a one time trip just to upset his friend.
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Coyne » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:32 am UTC

Ummm...did anyone else notice that he used the machine twice?
In all fairness...

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby San Fran Sam » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:47 am UTC

for a second there, i thought he was going back in time to kill Vic Hitler the narcoleptic comic. Whew!

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby San Fran Sam » Fri Jun 01, 2012 4:49 am UTC

-KF- wrote:
Mouseover: "Revised directive: It is forbidden for you to interfere with human history until you've at least taken a class on it."

In addition to the history class, I'd recommend a class on the implications and effects of altering timelines.


Well,there's always http://www.uchronia.net. there are a few alternate history books listed there. :mrgreen:

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Griffin » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:00 am UTC

Woah. Dejavu, XKCD and MSPA.
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Eternal Density » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:03 am UTC

Oh, BHG! Only BHG would use a time machine for the mere purpose of annoying a single person :P

I remember a TV show where there was a seemingly unimportant reference to a guy who'd bought the power of time travel (which had previously belonged to a main character who sold it for cash) for the purpose of killing Hitler. Turned out to be a brick joke, as in the next season it sparked an entire episode...
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Rook to Knight » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:06 am UTC

... you should have seen what Hitler was going to do in 1949...

/R

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby JimsMaher » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:07 am UTC

alt-text referencing the Temporal Prime Directive.

Live long and prosper ... except if you're Hitler.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby therealmichaelmoore » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:09 am UTC

Reminds me of Everybody kills Hitler on their first trip (http://www.tor.com/stories/2011/08/wikihistory/).

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby 907Code-G » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:11 am UTC

I'm now planning the next ten years to use this as a prank.
First, become obsessed with the idea of time travel. Obsess on this topic to the point of alienating all of my non-doctor who fan friends.
Second, Study to be astrophysicist. Demonstrate more motivation towards this then anything before in my life.
Third, Work tirelessly on convincing looking write-up to be validated with a grant for my time travel research (possibly from grant headed by a weathered old man suffering inside from the loss of his beloved while he was away at war, nefariously planning to use my time machine without my knowledge in order to prevent vietnam so he would never be drafted)
Fourth, pour my days into constantly seeming to work in a private area.
Finally, bring friend, tell him I've completed it, tell him it will only work once.
Tell him I plan on killing hitler. Step into box which does nothing, step out.
>I tracked him to a bunker in 1945. Got him.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Eutychus » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:15 am UTC

Coyne wrote:Ummm...did anyone else notice that he used the machine twice?

Hmm. I think most time machine users would expect the "one-time-use" proviso to cover one return journey, even if much of fiction suggests this is an optimistic premise.
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Djehutynakht » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:16 am UTC

Well, if we get into time travel theory we could say this is a self-fufilling sort of thing. Hitler didn't really die by suicide. Hitler died because BHG went back in time and killed him. It was always meant to be that way. Forever and forever.

That leaves the question of the others though, such as Eva Braun. Did she kill herself before BHG arrived? After? Did BHG just kill her too? Was it entirely unrelated? Was Hitler planning to kill himself before BHG showed up? Would he have ever planned so if he didn't? Could he have had a secret way to come back and win the war if BHG hadn't killed him?

The world may never know.


On the other hand, I notice we're treating a time machine like a teleportation device again (I'm assuming that BHG appeared inside Hitler's bunker, as opposed to going through all of the trouble to get from... wherever he is to Hitlers bunker right before Hitler's death). In that case, even if the time travel part is only one use, can he still use it as a teleporter in the present?


Actually, you know what, we don't know anything.

For all we know, BHG went back in time, killed the struggling artist known as Adolf Hitler, assumed his identity, and was in fact, while disguised as Hitler, the person responsible for creating the Third Reich and starting WWII, only to hide his time machine in his bunker in order to escape there and fake his own death after having caused as much destruction and mayhem as physically possible.

Yeah, I could see him doing that.
Last edited by Djehutynakht on Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:20 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby whateveries » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:17 am UTC

907Code-G wrote:I'm now planning the next ten years to use this as a prank.
First, become obsessed with the idea of time travel. Obsess on this topic to the point of alienating all of my non-doctor who fan friends.
Second, Study to be astrophysicist. Demonstrate more motivation towards this then anything before in my life.
Third, Work tirelessly on convincing looking write-up to be validated with a grant for my time travel research (possibly from grant headed by a weathered old man suffering inside from the loss of his beloved while he was away at war, nefariously planning to use my time machine without my knowledge in order to prevent vietnam so he would never be drafted)
Fourth, pour my days into constantly seeming to work in a private area.
Finally, bring friend, tell him I've completed it, tell him it will only work once.
Tell him I plan on killing hitler. Step into box which does nothing, step out.
>I tracked him to a bunker in 1945. Got him.


oh my, this is as good a 10 year plan as any I have heard of, sadly I can see one flaw.

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Last edited by whateveries on Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:26 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
it's fine.

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907Code-G
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby 907Code-G » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:18 am UTC

I spotted several besides the obvious I would have to battle BHG.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby littledman » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:36 am UTC

Well you can get around the one-use limitation pretty easily. Travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then...

Or bring plans and parts back in time, build a time machine 5 years early, repeat. Or whatever. I have a feeling somewhere along the line the universe would implode.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby pbnjstowell » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:47 am UTC

Djehutynakht wrote: That leaves the question of the others though, such as Eva Braun. Did she kill herself before BHG arrived? After? Did BHG just kill her too? Was it entirely unrelated?

...On the other hand, I notice we're treating a time machine like a teleportation device again...


It was a TARDIS!

And Eva had been reading too much Shakespeare.
Last edited by pbnjstowell on Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:49 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby VegiZombie » Fri Jun 01, 2012 5:49 am UTC

littledman wrote:Well you can get around the one-use limitation pretty easily. Travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then...

Or bring plans and parts back in time, build a time machine 5 years early, repeat. Or whatever. I have a feeling somewhere along the line the universe would implode.


I find it more amusing to imagine that it is not a limitation of the box but the whole universe. Whatever way it is configured large scale backwards travel through time is only allowed once in the entire universe and he wasted it to annoy his friend.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Kibate » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:06 am UTC

littledman wrote:Well you can get around the one-use limitation pretty easily. Travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then travel back in time until just before you travelled back in time, and then...

lets assume this works, and this would mean a time paradox(the grandfather paradox) does not exist(thus even if you stop yourself form using the time machine in the past, you from the future still exist in the present...you know what i mean)
at any rate, the first use of the time machine must be used a LONG time after the initial creation, so you have enough save points. Not to mention, you would create at least one clone of yourself
Last edited by Kibate on Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:11 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Brian-M » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:08 am UTC

Supershadow18 wrote:This is BHG we're talking about here. We can't disregard the possibility that this isn't even a time machine, or that he didn't know he was killing Hitler at the end of his life, and he purposefully wasted a one time trip just to upset his friend.

And this is a time machine we're talking about here. We can't disregard the possibility that he was in a version of history where Hitler lived to a ripe old age, but because he changed history by killing Hitler (and making it look like suicide), the guy who asked him to kill Hitler has no memory of the original timeline.

And since this is the BHG, I wouldn't put it past him to deliberately choose a time after the holocaust to kill Hitler, just to piss of the other guy.

After all, it'd be no fun if he'd killed teenage-Hitler only to return to find that now his friend had never heard of Hitler, and had no idea as to why anyone would want to go back in time to kill him.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby whateveries » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:09 am UTC

Djehutynakht wrote:
...On the other hand, I notice we're treating a time machine like a teleportation device again...




this reminds me of strontium dog's Johnny Alpha, who used time bombs to shift the bad guys in time, but not space, leaving them wherever the earth was a few hours earlier, suh-weet. which is like teleporting them some considerable distance closer to the centre of the universe than where they were... wait, why did it make more sense when I was a kid than it does now. fuck my imagination is failing. time to load the 4 year old kid up with sugar and play super heores, that'll fix it.
it's fine.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Oneiros42 » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:16 am UTC

"Wikihistory" should be required reading for potential time-travelers.

http://www.abyssapexzine.com/wikihistory/

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Lukeonia1 » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:34 am UTC

Ooh! I like rambling about time travel and causality!

I posit that even with a time machine it is impossible to alter history, because whatever "changes" you make in the timeline become just another part of everyone's history, including your own. Anything you do in the past will have already occurred before you got there, so everything that happens while you're in the past will play out exactly the way your history remembers it.

If you were to go back in time to kill Hitler before he became someone that needed killin', and succeed, then there would be no reason for you to go back in time to kill him, so you wouldn't, so Adolf would become Hitler again, so you'd go back in time to kill him, and so on ad infinitum.

Furthermore, suppose you're suicidal and decide to go back in time to kill your father before you were conceived. The fact that you exist makes it a foregone conclusion that in the past, you either failed to kill anyone, or you killed the wrong man. Either way, you'd be better off instead taking that time machine into the future, gathering the hot stock tips that will have by then made you a rich man, and then using the proceeds to buy enough hookers and blow to forget your troubles.

And don't bother trying to kill your past self when he arrives, the fact that you're still alive means you won't succeed no matter how hard you try.

So time travel all you want, history has already made sure that nobody will ever know you were there. Unless of course, you're this guy.

Ok, I'm done.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby *Kat* » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:45 am UTC

glasnt wrote:Noooo! :( Beaten.

insert "Let's Kill Hitler" quotes here.


I would have died laughing if BHG had come back and said something about Hitler being stuck in a cupboard.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby *Kat* » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:49 am UTC

Lukeonia1 wrote:Ooh! I like rambling about time travel and causality!

I posit that even with a time machine it is impossible to alter history, because whatever "changes" you make in the timeline become just another part of everyone's history, including your own. Anything you do in the past will have already occurred before you got there, so everything that happens while you're in the past will play out exactly the way your history remembers it.

If you were to go back in time to kill Hitler before he became someone that needed killin', and succeed, then there would be no reason for you to go back in time to kill him, so you wouldn't, so Adolf would become Hitler again, so you'd go back in time to kill him, and so on ad infinitum.

Furthermore, suppose you're suicidal and decide to go back in time to kill your father before you were conceived. The fact that you exist makes it a foregone conclusion that in the past, you either failed to kill anyone, or you killed the wrong man. Either way, you'd be better off instead taking that time machine into the future, gathering the hot stock tips that will have by then made you a rich man, and then using the proceeds to buy enough hookers and blow to forget your troubles.

And don't bother trying to kill your past self when he arrives, the fact that you're still alive means you won't succeed no matter how hard you try.

So time travel all you want, history has already made sure that nobody will ever know you were there. Unless of course, you're this guy.

Ok, I'm done.


People assume that time is a strict progression of cause to effect, but *actually* from a non-linear, non-subjective viewpoint, it's more like a big ball of wibbly wobbly... time-y wimey... stuff.
Last edited by *Kat* on Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:56 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby babble » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:49 am UTC

This is some kind of misguided attempt to make up for all that 'studying history is pointless' stuff from a while back, isn't it? 1/10 for the effort if so. And didn't this comic do this already with the September 11th attack?

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Antior » Fri Jun 01, 2012 6:53 am UTC

Djehutynakht wrote:On the other hand, I notice we're treating a time machine like a teleportation device again (I'm assuming that BHG appeared inside Hitler's bunker, as opposed to going through all of the trouble to get from... wherever he is to Hitlers bunker right before Hitler's death). In that case, even if the time travel part is only one use, can he still use it as a teleporter in the present?

If it weren't, he would most probably end up in deep space. While the earth moves around the sun every year, the sun and the solar system moves 220 km/s relative to the galactic center and 370 km/s relative to the cosmic microwave background. Taking the cosmic microwave background as a non-moving absolute of space (that's as close as we can get I guess) and rounding to whole years the solar system moved about 370 km/s * 86400 seconds per day * 365.25 days per year * (2012-1945) years = over 782 billion km or about 5200 AU's (AU = mean distance earth-sun). So, yeah.

Furthermore, suppose you're suicidal and decide to go back in time to kill your father before you were conceived. The fact that you exist makes it a foregone conclusion that in the past, you either failed to kill anyone, or you killed the wrong man.

According to most fiction, you actually end up becoming your own father.

Anyway, what does it say on the front of the time machine? Am I reading that right and is it Timecube? Because that would be funny.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby mellows » Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:19 am UTC

I think it would have better cleverer if BHG had come out and said
There. I killed Hitler. Happy?

and the response was
Who's Hitler?

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby rattusprat » Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:29 am UTC

Poor form from BHG's friend for not being aware of Hitler's time travel exemption act.

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/M ... lekz83hawz

This plan was never going to work.

Eternal Density wrote:I remember a TV show where there was a seemingly unimportant reference to a guy who'd bought the power of time travel (which had previously belonged to a main character who sold it for cash) for the purpose of killing Hitler. Turned out to be a brick joke, as in the next season it sparked an entire episode...


I believe you are referring to the show Misfits.

PS. and apologies for getting everyone stuck inside tvtropes for 3 hours.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby '); DROP TABLE users; » Fri Jun 01, 2012 7:30 am UTC

Djehutynakht wrote:You don't kill Hitler... goddammit... you make sure he gets accepted to art school, take his place, and use the power of your Third Reich to be a little better at his job.

And Hitler? What about Ghengis Khan? 18 million or so Chinese killed in one expedition. That's nearly triple the numbers of the Holocaust.

More than the holocaust, true. Far fewer than all the casualties of WWII, which is by far the deadliest conflict in history.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby J L » Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:04 am UTC

Still, it's nice to imagine the surprise of the people in the bunker when BHG suddenly shows up, shoots Hitler in the face, and leaves. Might be a good first scene of a very pointless movie.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby Whys » Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:20 am UTC

Hitler wasn't so different from a lot of other bad men in history. One could argue there have been worse. What made Hitler unique was the time in which he lived. It allowed him to do something many had done before, but in a way none had done before: Industrialized genocide.

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Re: 1063: "Kill Hitler"

Postby da Doctah » Fri Jun 01, 2012 9:01 am UTC

-KF- wrote:Mouseover: "Revised directive: It is forbidden for you to interfere with human history until you've at least taken a class on it."


For some reason this reminds me of Those who don't learn history are condemned to repeat it...in summer school.


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