1148: "Nothing to Offer"

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cellocgw
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby cellocgw » Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:56 pm UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:
John E. wrote:Wait - how could anyone NOT know that quote? It was one of the most stirring calls to the defense of Western Civilization of the 20th century.


So? I'm sure there are plenty of things that other people believe everyone should know that you don't know about. It is arrogant and foolish to assume that because you happen to know something, or even because most people you know know something, that everyone must know it.


Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Moose Anus » Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:57 pm UTC

cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."

"...are condemned to repeat the same argument in a different thread."
Lemonade? ...Aww, ok.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby orthogon » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:15 pm UTC

cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."


... may be made of CPT-reflected particles?

(I like Moose Anus's completion very much too.)
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Red Hal » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:18 pm UTC

... are descendants of Merlin?
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby brenok » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:20 pm UTC

cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."


... are doomed to teach History for 40 years?

I think we're getting closer to confirm orthogon's conjecture:

orthogon wrote:Conjecture: xkcd is tending towards a condition of memetic completeness, whereby any forum question can be addressed by reference to a previous comic.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby NemeSys » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:27 pm UTC

The medical term for earwax is cerumen.

Just thought I'd share that.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby San Fran Sam » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:31 pm UTC

this thing was that on my computer the page took a bit longer than usual to load. When i read the title and saw no comic, i thought that Randall had literally nothing to offer. That is, there was no comic for today.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Someguy945 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:42 pm UTC

yawningdog wrote:"I'm really not trying to be belligerent, but were you so concerned with being the first person to post the comic that you did not want to spend any time on a quick google search of the quote?"

"It was originally a Churchill quote. Randall added some funny suffixes."

Wow. Actually answering the question takes less effort that being condescending and snarky. Were you so concerned with being belligerent that you did not want to spend any time on a quick, helpful reply?


I felt that rhomboidal had already made it clear that a Churchill quote was being parodied.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby addams » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:44 pm UTC

LennyLen wrote:I'm sooooo glad that smegma wasn't one of the bodily fluids/secretions mentioned.

Not a fluid. More of a paste.
Body fluids and and some of the first public announcement.

The British guy and the guy from the US. How much did they talk to one another?
Was that the first generation with an electronic voice?

History!? The poor children. Every day there is more history to know.


Doomed to teach history was amazing!
The musical directions were funny.
Humming anything and reading is hard, for me.
Last edited by addams on Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:55 pm UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby PolakoVoador » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:55 pm UTC

John E. wrote:Wait - how could anyone NOT know that quote? It was one of the most stirring calls to the defense of Western Civilization of the 20th century.


First: Was Germany part of a Eastern Civilization or something else non-Western? :|

Second: You might also remember that in most non-english speaking countries (or at least in countries not heavily involved with the great wars) theses quotes are not actually well-known, which is the case of Brazil.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby KopiAis » Mon Dec 17, 2012 4:57 pm UTC

Actually Churchill's favorite tipple was champagne, not gin. He drank a bottle of Pol Roger Brut just about every day (can't let champagne sit once it's been opened, you know). He said that brut champagne didn't give you a hangover (less sugar). When he died, Madame Pol Roger decreed that a black border be added to the label--and it's there to this day. If you see a Pol Roger bottle without one, it was made before he died in 1967.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby mathmannix » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:31 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:
blowfishhootie wrote: [...] I'm sure there are plenty of things that other people believe everyone should know that you don't know about. [...]

Exactly: JPatten is one of today's lucky 10,000!
So am I, to be honest. The "Never ... has so much been owed by so many to so few" and "We shall fight them on the beaches" lines tend to hog the airtime.


Also "'Madam, I may be drunk, but an Iron Curtain has descended upon Europe!"
I hear velociraptor tastes like chicken.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby vector010 » Mon Dec 17, 2012 5:55 pm UTC

"...rheum, and gin."

This made me laugh because.... Rum and Gin. (Sure, it is pronounced "room", so maybe the pun wasn't intentional but it still made me laugh.)

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby orthogon » Mon Dec 17, 2012 6:03 pm UTC

PolakoVoador wrote:First: Was Germany part of a Eastern Civilization or something else non-Western?

Perhaps John E. was thinking of Nazi Germany as Western but not Civilised?

In his magnum opus on the decline of violence, Steven Pinker argues that, for all their shiny uniforms and sophisticated mass-murder technology, Nazism was actually part of a "counter-Enlightenment utopianism" and as such represented a reversal of the "civilising process".

[Edit]: I see this is the third time I have cited Pinker. I'm such a fanboy.
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby da Doctah » Mon Dec 17, 2012 7:18 pm UTC

mathmannix wrote:
orthogon wrote:
blowfishhootie wrote: [...] I'm sure there are plenty of things that other people believe everyone should know that you don't know about. [...]

Exactly: JPatten is one of today's lucky 10,000!
So am I, to be honest. The "Never ... has so much been owed by so many to so few" and "We shall fight them on the beaches" lines tend to hog the airtime.


Also "'Madam, I may be drunk, but an Iron Curtain has descended upon Europe!"


This was your finest hour!

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby TimXCampbell » Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:25 pm UTC

Just yesterday I was watching Dr. Strangelove, so I'm well attuned to issues of precious bodily fluids. Did I say “issues of?” Eww. Perhaps I should have said “matter of.”

And now for my wild claim...

A few days ago, while speaking with my octogenarian British-raised father on the phone, I claimed that Winston Churchill was the person who basically invented the concept of "TL;DR" ("Too long; didn't read"). As Churchill fans may recall, he insisted that the daily report of the Battle of the Atlantic (Churchill's worst worry) be contained on a single page. He was a busy man, but he knew that people like to go on and on and on and on and on and on and on and on ...

So it seems to me that today's cartoon represents an early draft of the speech, or an embellishment by one of the voice actors who did some of Churchill's broadcasts.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby obfpen » Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:45 pm UTC

yawningdog wrote:"I'm really not trying to be belligerent, but were you so concerned with being the first person to post the comic that you did not want to spend any time on a quick google search of the quote?"

"It was originally a Churchill quote. Randall added some funny suffixes."

Wow. Actually answering the question takes less effort that being condescending and snarky. Were you so concerned with being belligerent that you did not want to spend any time on a quick, helpful reply?

No. No. No. No. No.
Minimising effort certainly has its uses, but it's hardly a trump card. Writing "No." once would have taken less effort, but it would also have been less effective. (And who's to say that what you consider to be less effort will have universal agreement?) A quick Google search does provide useful information on this topic. On the other hand, someone who doesn't recognise that particular sequence of words, upon being told it was a "Churchill quote", might well then ask, "Who's Churchill?". And then a second answer is needed, which instantly surpasses the original approach on the effortometer.
Short-term gains are attractive, but considering the long term has a tendency to reap greater rewards. And in this instance, suggesting Google is the long-term win, and actually is "a quick, helpful reply".

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby speising » Mon Dec 17, 2012 8:48 pm UTC

Answer a man a question, and he has knowledge for a day. Point a man to google, and he has knowledge for a life.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Fire Brns » Mon Dec 17, 2012 9:51 pm UTC

Moose Anus wrote:
cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."

"...are condemned to repeat the same argument in a different thread."

History repeats itself no matter how educated people are.
Those who don't learn from the past ignorantly assume every idea is new and revolutionary. Those who do learn are doomed to watch society repeat itself.
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby rmsgrey » Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:44 pm UTC

cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."


...are doomed to repeat History 101 in summer school?

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby mcdigman » Mon Dec 17, 2012 11:45 pm UTC

Gigano wrote:
CasualSax wrote:You could of just explained it, instead of being belligerent. :P


My (very) unsalted opinion: In this day and age of information, there is no excuse for being deliberately ignorant. When you're on the internet and you don't understand or know something, ask Google first. Ask people second if Google doesn't help.

From a social and friendly standpoint I would still explain it to someone who asks, but a little bit of investigative initiative can help a long way in ridding the world of general suck. Particularly when that something is as easy to investigate as a quote.


My opinion is that people need to be more tolerant of people asking Googleable questions. I almost never have questions whose answers can't be Googled. When I do, I mostly just try to figure the answer out for myself or give up, because whenever you ask a question on a forum you invariably more snarky "just Google it" type answers than actual answers, which has a tendency to scare off people who aren't already members of a community, causing them to either ignore the site or become lurkers when they could be helping answer other questions. Personally, I haven't posted any question on any forum (possibly excepting wikipedia talk pages) for years. So snarky answers prevent community growth, which is probably more valuable than the precisely 0 time it takes you to NOT put the answer into the format of lmgtfy.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby blowfishhootie » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:37 am UTC

What annoys me most is people offering the xkcd "be nice to people who don't know" comic as a response to someone saying "just fucking Google it!" It is NOT an apt comparison - in the comic, the people are apparently walking on a sidewalk or something. They're certainly not at a computer. They are in a position where asking the question to another person is WAY more efficient than looking it up yourself online. If you are asking the question on an Internet forum, you are in a position to just as easily (if not with more ease) paste the relevant term into Google and see what comes up.

Turning to Google first is preferable for a million reasons. Let's see if I can name them all:

1) You might actually learn MORE than your specific question!
2) The people on the Internet forum might be full of shit!
3) YOU can be the smart one when someone ELSE asks the easy-to-figure-out-for-yourself question!
4) You can avoid feeling stupid when it turns out to be something super obvious!
5) ... OK, that's all I've got for now, it's close enough to a million.

Obviously not every question can be answered via Google as efficiently as by asking people in a forum. But a) that's no reason not to try first anyway and b) it's not too difficult to predict which questions are going to fit that mold. The Cirith Ungol thread where I had this argument before is a perfect example: The comic was called Cirith Ungol, the person in the comic was in a cave, it's not too difficult to guess Cirith Ungol might be some kind of place being referenced. There's absolutely zero valid reason not to type Cirith Ungol into Google if you don't get the reference and are curious. It is a concrete, non-subjective term that you can find in a matter of seconds.

Or in this thread: The original post was made at 12:05 am (by my timezone); the first post mentioning Churchill was made six minutes later, and the first post expressly saying it was a Churchill quote was not made until almost three hours later ... in the form of a link that is the very first result if you type "blood toil sweat and tears" into Google. I don't think it necessarily applies here, because the poster claimed after the fact that they knew it was a quote all along, but if they HAD not known, Google would have been infinitely more efficient.

And finally, I don't buy this argument at all:

yawningdog wrote:"I'm really not trying to be belligerent, but were you so concerned with being the first person to post the comic that you did not want to spend any time on a quick google search of the quote?"

"It was originally a Churchill quote. Randall added some funny suffixes."

Wow. Actually answering the question takes less effort that being condescending and snarky. Were you so concerned with being belligerent that you did not want to spend any time on a quick, helpful reply?


I am a newspaper reporter. If one of my colleagues is repeatedly coming to me with questions related to stories he is working on, and his questions are all easily answerable via a simple search in our paper's archives, I should just keep answering his questions rather than making him aware of this great source of information available at his fingertips, a resource that will save BOTH of us time AND make him more informed than a simple answer from me would be anyway? Sorry, I think just answering his single questions one at a time is by far the stupider, crueler way to go.

Give a man a fish, and all that. If you don't know the expression, Google it.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby addams » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:37 am UTC

rmsgrey wrote:
cellocgw wrote:Ok, then, how about "Those who cannot remember the past..."


...are doomed to repeat History 101 in summer school?

Oh. What a sweet (H.E.L.L.) summer school is.

The campus is nearly empty.
Everyone else is off having a wonderful summer.

I took a summer off, once.
It was nice.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
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Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby da Doctah » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:48 am UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:I am a newspaper reporter. If one of my colleagues is repeatedly coming to me with questions related to stories he is working on, and his questions are all easily answerable via a simple search in our paper's archives, I should just keep answering his questions rather than making him aware of this great source of information available at his fingertips, a resource that will save BOTH of us time AND make him more informed than a simple answer from me would be anyway? Sorry, I think just answering his single questions one at a time is by far the stupider, crueler way to go.

Give a man a fish, and all that. If you don't know the expression, Google it.


Scariest question I ever heard from a newspaper reporter (mainly because it aged me about twenty years in an instant) was this:

"Who's Yoko Ono?"

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby addams » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:43 am UTC

Besides; Not only is it nice to answer questions, the answers say what a potentially real person thinks is important.
There is a richness to hearing the story, again.

Sometimes with a twist.

BESIDES! Not everyone Google's with the same ease.
Good useable links make my world better; Sometimes.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby TimXCampbell » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:06 am UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:5) ... OK, that's all I've got for now, it's close enough to a million.

You, sir or madam, have just revolutionized mathematics!

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby blowfishhootie » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:13 am UTC

Addams: Relying on message board users to answer your question tells you what a small number of random bozos think is important. Using google tells you what countless people think is important, because if nobody bothers visiting a page then it will be nowhere near the top of your search results. That argument does not hold up.

Also, the contents of this forum are no more the product of "potentially real people" than are google search results. The entire contents of the Web, plus every single thing we use to interact with it, is the product of "real people."

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Sam Knight » Tue Dec 18, 2012 2:49 am UTC

LennyLen wrote:I'm sooooo glad that smegma wasn't one of the bodily fluids/secretions mentioned.

I was gonna say.. he missed smegma :lol:
Image

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby bigchiefbc » Tue Dec 18, 2012 3:29 am UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:What annoys me most is people offering the xkcd "be nice to people who don't know" comic as a response to someone saying "just fucking Google it!" It is NOT an apt comparison - in the comic, the people are apparently walking on a sidewalk or something. They're certainly not at a computer. They are in a position where asking the question to another person is WAY more efficient than looking it up yourself online. If you are asking the question on an Internet forum, you are in a position to just as easily (if not with more ease) paste the relevant term into Google and see what comes up.

Turning to Google first is preferable for a million reasons. Let's see if I can name them all:

1) You might actually learn MORE than your specific question!
2) The people on the Internet forum might be full of shit!
3) YOU can be the smart one when someone ELSE asks the easy-to-figure-out-for-yourself question!
4) You can avoid feeling stupid when it turns out to be something super obvious!
5) ... OK, that's all I've got for now, it's close enough to a million.

Obviously not every question can be answered via Google as efficiently as by asking people in a forum. But a) that's no reason not to try first anyway and b) it's not too difficult to predict which questions are going to fit that mold. The Cirith Ungol thread where I had this argument before is a perfect example: The comic was called Cirith Ungol, the person in the comic was in a cave, it's not too difficult to guess Cirith Ungol might be some kind of place being referenced. There's absolutely zero valid reason not to type Cirith Ungol into Google if you don't get the reference and are curious. It is a concrete, non-subjective term that you can find in a matter of seconds.

Or in this thread: The original post was made at 12:05 am (by my timezone); the first post mentioning Churchill was made six minutes later, and the first post expressly saying it was a Churchill quote was not made until almost three hours later ... in the form of a link that is the very first result if you type "blood toil sweat and tears" into Google. I don't think it necessarily applies here, because the poster claimed after the fact that they knew it was a quote all along, but if they HAD not known, Google would have been infinitely more efficient.

And finally, I don't buy this argument at all:

yawningdog wrote:"I'm really not trying to be belligerent, but were you so concerned with being the first person to post the comic that you did not want to spend any time on a quick google search of the quote?"

"It was originally a Churchill quote. Randall added some funny suffixes."

Wow. Actually answering the question takes less effort that being condescending and snarky. Were you so concerned with being belligerent that you did not want to spend any time on a quick, helpful reply?


I am a newspaper reporter. If one of my colleagues is repeatedly coming to me with questions related to stories he is working on, and his questions are all easily answerable via a simple search in our paper's archives, I should just keep answering his questions rather than making him aware of this great source of information available at his fingertips, a resource that will save BOTH of us time AND make him more informed than a simple answer from me would be anyway? Sorry, I think just answering his single questions one at a time is by far the stupider, crueler way to go.

Give a man a fish, and all that. If you don't know the expression, Google it.


You assume wayyyyy too much here. I didn't know it was a quote, it just seemed like a random list of bodily fluids, so it didn't even occur to me to google some subset of it. Why on earth would I google that if I don't know the context enough to know that it is a well-known list or pattern in the first place? I just figured there was something funny that wasn't obvious to me about the list of fluids, or the order, or how they seem to degenerate from the more-commonly-discussed fluids to the less-common. It was actually way more efficient to just come here and get an explanation. It was only then that I learned that it was an obviously well-known quote that I'm ignorant of, and that I could have figured that out if I had known to specifically google the first 4 words.

The Cirith Ungol comic is actually not at all like this one. It seemed obvious in the context of the comic that Cirith Ungol was a pop-culture reference that was easily googleable to find out what it was. This was not obviously in that vein at all.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby blowfishhootie » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:10 am UTC

bigchiefbc wrote:
blowfishhootie wrote:What annoys me most is people offering the xkcd "be nice to people who don't know" comic as a response to someone saying "just fucking Google it!" It is NOT an apt comparison - in the comic, the people are apparently walking on a sidewalk or something. They're certainly not at a computer. They are in a position where asking the question to another person is WAY more efficient than looking it up yourself online. If you are asking the question on an Internet forum, you are in a position to just as easily (if not with more ease) paste the relevant term into Google and see what comes up.

Turning to Google first is preferable for a million reasons. Let's see if I can name them all:

1) You might actually learn MORE than your specific question!
2) The people on the Internet forum might be full of shit!
3) YOU can be the smart one when someone ELSE asks the easy-to-figure-out-for-yourself question!
4) You can avoid feeling stupid when it turns out to be something super obvious!
5) ... OK, that's all I've got for now, it's close enough to a million.

Obviously not every question can be answered via Google as efficiently as by asking people in a forum. But a) that's no reason not to try first anyway and b) it's not too difficult to predict which questions are going to fit that mold. The Cirith Ungol thread where I had this argument before is a perfect example: The comic was called Cirith Ungol, the person in the comic was in a cave, it's not too difficult to guess Cirith Ungol might be some kind of place being referenced. There's absolutely zero valid reason not to type Cirith Ungol into Google if you don't get the reference and are curious. It is a concrete, non-subjective term that you can find in a matter of seconds.

Or in this thread: The original post was made at 12:05 am (by my timezone); the first post mentioning Churchill was made six minutes later, and the first post expressly saying it was a Churchill quote was not made until almost three hours later ... in the form of a link that is the very first result if you type "blood toil sweat and tears" into Google. I don't think it necessarily applies here, because the poster claimed after the fact that they knew it was a quote all along, but if they HAD not known, Google would have been infinitely more efficient.

And finally, I don't buy this argument at all:

yawningdog wrote:"I'm really not trying to be belligerent, but were you so concerned with being the first person to post the comic that you did not want to spend any time on a quick google search of the quote?"

"It was originally a Churchill quote. Randall added some funny suffixes."

Wow. Actually answering the question takes less effort that being condescending and snarky. Were you so concerned with being belligerent that you did not want to spend any time on a quick, helpful reply?


I am a newspaper reporter. If one of my colleagues is repeatedly coming to me with questions related to stories he is working on, and his questions are all easily answerable via a simple search in our paper's archives, I should just keep answering his questions rather than making him aware of this great source of information available at his fingertips, a resource that will save BOTH of us time AND make him more informed than a simple answer from me would be anyway? Sorry, I think just answering his single questions one at a time is by far the stupider, crueler way to go.

Give a man a fish, and all that. If you don't know the expression, Google it.


You assume wayyyyy too much here. I didn't know it was a quote


What...? I've made no such assumption. Why would I tell someone to use google to figure out it is a quote if I think they already know it's a quote? It's precisely because someone does NOT know the reference that they should use google to try and figure out the reference.

it just seemed like a random list of bodily fluids


You thought toil was a bodily fluid? You can't see the difference between the second panel's contents, which are not particularly gross (and also, as mentioned, contained the only thing on the list that isn't a bodily fluid), and the panels after it, where just about everything mentioned would be pretty damn odd to mention in a speech over the radio or any other form of mass media? You're right, you probably need more help than google can offer. Despite that, it's still no excuse not to try and find the info out yourself first. Internet forums (nor anything else) should not be a replacement for applying the absolute minimal amount of critical thinking needed to make the simple inferences I've pointed out here. In the long run, you'll be much smarter for it than you would be from reading any number of posts on this board.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby keithl » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:48 am UTC

Since we are belaboring the belaboring of the obvious, I should point out that the rounded trapezoidal object is a "radio", in this case containing "vacuum tubes", which are very large field effect transistors with all the semiconductor removed. The mesh looking thing is a "speaker", like a very large earbud and built into the radio instead of on a long cord.

To the right is a "dial", a display device with one fixed image that rotates behind the square hole, and a "knob", a rotating control that you twist with your hand instead of pushing a button. The knob connects to a "variable capacitor" instead of a digital divider feeding a phase-locked loop. Turning the knob was sort of like entering a URL except all the URLs were counts of something called kilocycles per second, and instead of websites, there were tall pointy metal things that spewed electricity and magnetism and probably gave people cancer, like cell towers only much worse.

The three smaller knobs below are a crude equalizer, with one controlling sound loudness, one adjusting high frequencies ("treble") and one adjusting low frequencies ("bass"). These turned a metal wiper that traveled over a horseshoe-shaped (*) spring thingy wrapped with a coil of nichrome wire. No matter how you adjusted the knobs, the sound was scratchy and weird, nobody said anything interesting about Brad or J-Lo or vampires, and the music all sounded like game show jingles only too long.

(*) A horseshoe, BTW, is a partial ring of metal that was nailed into the hooves of horses, before PETA put an end to this horrid form of animal torture.

The thing the radio is sitting on is a "chest of drawers", like something from Ikea except it was made from solid wood, not fiberboard, and it came already put together, from tiny little stores with less than fifty people working in them. Unlike real furniture, it did not have pseudo-swedish names, so you never knew what you were getting. The radio would sometimes display banner ads for this furniture, except there was no picture, only sound, and you were not permitted to log into your account on the radio to order furniture. In fact, you had to take pictures of dead presidents to the furniture stores before you could have the furniture, though in this particular case you had to take pictures of some dude named George, who was a Queen like Elizabeth or Effie Trinket only a guy.

I hope that helps the google-challenged among us understand even more of the joke.
Last edited by keithl on Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:53 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Rotherian » Tue Dec 18, 2012 6:53 am UTC

I'm still trying to wrap my head around Cirith Ungol being a pop culture reference. I mean, heck, the movies were almost a decade ago (2003 for the most recent one), and the book that they were based upon was published in 1955.

Just how recent does something need to be to still be considered pop culture?
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Red Hal » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:07 am UTC

"Living memory", said Hal, stacking his cans of Campbells Soup in the cupboard with the labels all facing out ...
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby EmberLeo » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:21 am UTC

What annoys me most is people offering the xkcd "be nice to people who don't know" comic as a response to someone saying "just fucking Google it!" It is NOT an apt comparison - in the comic, the people are apparently walking on a sidewalk or something. They're certainly not at a computer. They are in a position where asking the question to another person is WAY more efficient than looking it up yourself online.


You are entirely missing the point. It has nothing to do with convenience or efficiency. The Ten Thousand comic is talking about the psychology of conditioning people not to admit when they don't know something.

It doesn't matter what context you are in when you mock somebody, you're still conditioning them that they shouldn't have opened up in whatever way got them mocked.

The point of the comic was, and is, and applies here as the fundamental idea that being RIGHT over someone is not more fun or more cool than CONNECTING with someone.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby orthogon » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:47 am UTC

keithl wrote:Since we are belaboring the belaboring of the obvious [...] I hope that helps the google-challenged among us understand even more of the joke.


Thanks for the explanation, which I enjoyed very much, but this seems to me like a good example of ungoogleability. What Google search term could be used to identify the rounded trapezoidal thing?
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Angelastic » Tue Dec 18, 2012 9:58 am UTC

Rotherian wrote:I'm still trying to wrap my head around Cirith Ungol being a pop culture reference. I mean, heck, the movies were almost a decade ago (2003 for the most recent one), and the book that they were based upon was published in 1955.

Just how recent does something need to be to still be considered pop culture?

I didn't realise there was a time limit. Doesn't pop culture just mean it's cultural and popular? In any case some people will be too young to know about it, others too old, others too busy, others aware that *googles* The Lord of the Rings exists (oh boy, yes, of course that's still popular; why would you say it isn't?) and perhaps even read/saw some or all it, but haven't memorised all the minor place names in it (at least not well enough to remember them so many years later.)
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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby rmsgrey » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:21 am UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:2) The people on the Internet forum might be full of shit!


So might the guy who wrote the webpage that you find in your Google search. On most forums, if someone gives a wrong answer, someone else will come along to correct them not long afterwards; for the webpage, you have to rely on Google's algorithms somehow detecting and correcting for low-quality information on a high-quality page...

***

As for Cirith Ungol, the first page of Google results are split roughly evenly between the Californian heavy metal band and the Lord of the Rings reference (the xkcd strip comes in at #4) with the first hit being the band's Wikipedia entry. Googling "some pig" does mostly turn up hits for Charlotte's Web, but the words are not immediately obvious within the image...

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby Klear » Tue Dec 18, 2012 11:48 am UTC

blowfishhootie wrote:You're right, you probably need more help than google can offer. Despite that, it's still no excuse not to try and find the info out yourself first. Internet forums (nor anything else) should not be a replacement for applying the absolute minimal amount of critical thinking needed to make the simple inferences I've pointed out here. In the long run, you'll be much smarter for it than you would be from reading any number of posts on this board.


WTF? This is a discussion forum about the comic, and this thread is specifically for talking about the comic #1148. It's the perfect place to ask for someone to explain the joke, if you don't get it. Often it is not obvious what you should google and some other times it's very easy to google one of the main motives but still drawing blank on how is that supposed to be funny. This is confounded by the fact that sometimes the jokes are weaker than usual, but people tend to assume they are missing something.

In any case, you keep saying how there are only two options - taking your precious time to explain the joke to whoever is asking, or telling them to shut up and google it. Have you considered simply not replying to them? Ignore it and let someone else, who is in a better mood, explain to.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby blowfishhootie » Tue Dec 18, 2012 12:40 pm UTC

rmsgrey wrote:
blowfishhootie wrote:2) The people on the Internet forum might be full of shit!


So might the guy who wrote the webpage that you find in your Google search.


Luckily, a) you have a functioning brain and are capable of discerning what you think is credible and what is not and b) Google is pretty good about keeping crap results off the top of its search results, unless it is something really obscure (which this isn't). And again, I've never said Google can answer every single question a person might pose. The fact that there might be SOME few circumstances where Google isn't helpful is not a reason to not try it first, because most of the time - such as in this case that we are here discussing - it is absolutely dead on. And because using Google will generally give you MORE info than you would get from a message board, but that's only if you want it. It's totally up to the person clicking on the results.

As for Cirith Ungol, the first page of Google results are split roughly evenly between the Californian heavy metal band and the Lord of the Rings reference


The comic was a dude with a magic ring running through a cave. Again, functioning brain, and all that. I'm quite confident you and anyone else smart enough to turn on a computer can figure out which one was relevant - the one about a heavy metal band, or the one about a cave that a guy with a magic ring ran through. But that was all explained quite clearly in the Cirith Ungol thread, if you would like to have that argument with yourself I encourage you to go do so here:

viewtopic.php?f=7&t=87911

Neither Google nor Internet forums are replacements for, you know, not being a total dumbass.

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Re: 1148: "Nothing to Offer"

Postby John E. » Tue Dec 18, 2012 1:13 pm UTC

orthogon wrote:
PolakoVoador wrote:First: Was Germany part of a Eastern Civilization or something else non-Western?

Perhaps John E. was thinking of Nazi Germany as Western but not Civilised?


Exactly


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