Emotions (I really just need to vent)

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Are emotions good?

Yes, they are good (you should always be in touch with your emotions).
19
17%
No, they cloud judgement.
8
7%
A little yes, and a little no.
27
25%
Why are you trying to qualify emotions like this? They are neither good nor bad, they simply are.
55
50%
 
Total votes: 109

caladbolg
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Emotions (I really just need to vent)

Postby caladbolg » Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:09 pm UTC

I found out something about myself this weekend that I don't really like at all.

I have a crush on this girl. She has said that she just wants to be friends. This sucks but I can live with it.

The part that I don't like actually happened on Thursday (though I didn't understand it til Saturday). She and I were hanging out in the student lounge like we always do. We have the same class together on Thursdays and it was a common thing for us to sit and talk about stuff. I've had a wonderful time with her even if I can't be with her.

Thursday, however, was a little different. Instead of it just being her and me, several people joined. We had a marvelous philosophic conversation of the variety that I've actually been trying to start up for about a year now. Could I take joy in this? What do you think?

Well, I couldn't. I found myself extraordinarily jealous. Who where these people to crowd in on our alone time? I found this ugly side of myself. I don't like it at all and yet I recognize that its just my emotional response. It doesn't have to affect my decisions and I didn't let it. I kept myself controlled.

But it still sucks.

*Sighs*
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Postby Jesse » Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:13 pm UTC

Midnfulness meditation, it would do wonders for you. Lani can explain it a lot more effectively than I can, but in essence it is removing the way you filter the world in accordance to how it affects you. It's fantastic for removing things like jealousy etc.

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Postby caladbolg » Mon Apr 30, 2007 2:31 pm UTC

Yes, my dad talks about that. He's been studying Buddhism lately and has been meditating for years now and I seriously think I should start. He has even used the word "mindfulness."

Hmm...
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Postby bigglesworth » Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:12 pm UTC

What would venting your emotions done in those circumstances? Nothing useful.

By keeping back your emotions there, you're saving them for when they could do something useful, like being creative, and involving your emotions in that.

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Postby AllTooHuman » Mon Apr 30, 2007 4:37 pm UTC

Without emotions we wouldn't be human.

Where would we be without compassion, joy, etc...?

It is a package deal though. You get them all: not just joy and compassion. Like other peeps have already said, figuring out how best to use or deal with them (positive and negative alike) is key.

Sometimes, like you say, it does suck.

But if it didn't suck sometimes it wouldn't be heart-stoppingly-amazingly wonderful other times.
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Postby Owijad » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:08 pm UTC

bigglesworth wrote:What would venting your emotions done in those circumstances? Nothing useful.

By keeping back your emotions there, you're saving them for when they could do something useful, like being creative, and involving your emotions in that.


I would contest the proposition that emotion is depleted upon use.
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Postby Yakk » Mon Apr 30, 2007 5:52 pm UTC

Morally, you do not own her or her time. So I'd say the jealousy was misplaced.

If you want her to want to spend time with you, you must let her go. People want less that which wants them more.

Rent the Tao of Steve, for an amusing take on the problem. ;)

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Postby LE4dGOLEM » Mon Apr 30, 2007 6:29 pm UTC

Without bad you cannot know good properly.

Without 0 you cannot know 1

Sure, if you have purple, you can say it's not blue. But without red, you can't really say, "wow, this feels BLUE!"
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Postby bigglesworth » Mon Apr 30, 2007 8:39 pm UTC

Owijad wrote:
bigglesworth wrote:What would venting your emotions done in those circumstances? Nothing useful.

By keeping back your emotions there, you're saving them for when they could do something useful, like being creative, and involving your emotions in that.


I would contest the proposition that emotion is depleted upon use.


And quite rightly so, as that is not quite what I meant. :( (stupid english language...)

Rather, keeping them back from the world sometimes, and leting them flow at other times, as other people have said

:)

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Postby RealGrouchy » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:25 pm UTC

Emotions are like nature's logic puzzles: you can still spend days trying to figure them out unsuccessfully, even if all the clues are there.

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Postby cmacis » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:34 pm UTC

I say keep emotions if only for the good times. Yes, that sucks. Yes, I know, I've been there. No, it doesn't get any easier (not by age 19 anyway). No, nothing is worth becoming emo other.


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Re: Emotions (I really just need to vent)

Postby Andrew » Mon Apr 30, 2007 9:50 pm UTC

caladbolg wrote:Who where these people to crowd in on our alone time?


If you're like me (which you should always aspire to be) then that just means you're not over her and that will sort itself out in due time. Or, if you're even more like me, in an agonisingly long time. In that case, that's not really a side of you you need to worry about overly.

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Postby VannA » Tue May 01, 2007 2:06 am UTC

Yakk wrote:Morally, you do not own her or her time. So I'd say the jealousy was misplaced.


Damn straight.

Acknowledge what time she wants to spend with you. Or don't.

Figure out what's happening between the 2 of you. Accept it for what it is.

Get over your insecurity. :D
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Postby Owijad » Tue May 01, 2007 2:42 am UTC

bigglesworth wrote:
Owijad wrote:
I would contest the proposition that emotion is depleted upon use.


And quite rightly so, as that is not quite what I meant. :( (stupid english language...)

Rather, keeping them back from the world sometimes, and leting them flow at other times, as other people have said


Oh, I gotcha. Didn't mean to sound confrontational, I just thought you may have been insane.
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Postby VannA » Tue May 01, 2007 2:48 am UTC

Owijad wrote:
bigglesworth wrote:
Owijad wrote:
I would contest the proposition that emotion is depleted upon use.


And quite rightly so, as that is not quite what I meant. :( (stupid english language...)

Rather, keeping them back from the world sometimes, and leting them flow at other times, as other people have said


Oh, I gotcha. Didn't mean to sound confrontational, I just thought you may have been insane.


*giggle*

As for the poll.

I voted 'Yes'

The key principle is to always confront and understand your emotions. Don't bottle, and let them sneak up. Don't pretend they don't exist.

Confront, overcome, if necessary; revel, if possible.
Jealousy is a disease, love is a healthy condition. The immature mind often mistakes one for the other, or assumes that the greater the love, the greater the jealousy.

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Postby Aoeniac » Tue May 01, 2007 3:25 am UTC

I'm sorry that I have to be the one to do this, but I really need to ask for a clear and specific definition of "emotions" before I answer this poll. I mean, I get the feeling I know what you're getting at and where I stand on that issue, but I just want to make sure we're talking about the same thing when we say "emotions" in this thread.


And on a somewhat related note, have you ever read "Brave New World"?
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Postby a thing » Tue May 01, 2007 5:06 am UTC

Emotions, the positive and the negative, are good. They are what makes life worth living. However, you need reason and values constantly checking emotion. For example, your emotion telling you that you own her time is unreasonable and, for many, contradicts the value of freedom. She owns her time and nothing that you do should change that. That doesn't mean that if she liked you back, her spending time with you would make you own her time; she would be choosing to spend her time with you.

Aoeniac wrote:And on a somewhat related note, have you ever read "Brave New World"?


I just finished it. Very insightful book, one of the best I've read. Helped me realize what I've just said.
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Postby caladbolg » Tue May 01, 2007 1:32 pm UTC

For all the people who said I don't own her, let me just say, damn straight I don't own her. People don't get jealous over things that they have. I know well that she is her own person. I'm not gonna deny my emotions just because they imply that I think I own a person (a logical fallacy if I ever heard one). The jealousy that I felt is not something that I wanted. I know it contradicts my world view. I, however, can't control it when it happens spur of the moment like that.

All I can do is, like I said, not let it affect my decisions or behavior.

I never said my emotions were reasonable. (To say that they are is another fallacy.)

I know I'm not over her and I know I need to be. I just need time is all.

*sigh* (There needs to be a "sigh" emoticon.)
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Postby bigglesworth » Tue May 01, 2007 3:48 pm UTC

:| this one almost sums up that feeling, but not quite.

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Postby caladbolg » Tue May 01, 2007 4:36 pm UTC

Ok, so this thread was for me to vent. However, it was also to find out what the general community here thinks of emotions. I've gotten a general idea of that from some of your posts and I thank you.

I never sought advice. I KNOW what is happening to me. I KNOW what I'm going to do about it. This is not just a "relationships are hard and I need to vent" thread. That is part of it but I want to know what ya'll think of emotions generally.

For instance... well, crap. I seem to be hung up on... something....

Perhaps someone could come up with a "for instance" and we could argue vehemently over that, please.
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Postby Jesse » Tue May 01, 2007 7:47 pm UTC

Here we go then. Imagine a completely apathetic world, in which no human had any emotion. Would it survive?

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Postby Belial » Tue May 01, 2007 7:49 pm UTC

Ultimately, unless you were somehow given an imperative to survive as one of your operational axioms, no.

The outcome "We all die" is no better than "we all continue to live" without some sort of emotional backing.

Without the desire to survive, we'd all die.
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Postby Jesse » Tue May 01, 2007 7:53 pm UTC

Belial wrote:Ultimately, unless you were somehow given an imperative to survive as one of your operational axioms, no.

The outcome "We all die" is no better than "we all continue to live" without some sort of emotional backing.

Without the desire to survive, we'd all die.


Exactly. Ergo, emotions are an awesome survival trait.

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Postby Belial » Tue May 01, 2007 7:54 pm UTC

Or at least that one is.
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Postby Jesse » Tue May 01, 2007 7:58 pm UTC

But other emotions also aid our survival. Anger helps us defend ourselves from attackers, fear tells us to run away from a situation where we could be harmed.

The difficulties come from emotions either taken to an extreme (Depression, uncontrollable rage etc.) or from a complexity of emotion that confuses us rather than aids. However, these glitches are still preferable to having no emotion at all so they survive.

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Postby Belial » Tue May 01, 2007 8:05 pm UTC

But other emotions also aid our survival. Anger helps us defend ourselves from attackers, fear tells us to run away from a situation where we could be harmed.


Technically, the desire to survive, and a bit of logic, could take over for any of those.

"That thing is charging at me. It may kill me. I like living. Time to run."

Most useful emotions are just shortcuts for more logical processes.

That said, even the ones that *aren't* useful enrich my life in a way that I prefer, so I wouldn't give them up.

That might just be my emotions telling me that, though.
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Postby Jesse » Tue May 01, 2007 8:10 pm UTC

True, but the reason emotions are handy is because they occur really quickly, unlike logic which can occasionally take some time.

Also, yeah, they are just a nice thing to have.

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Postby mrguy753 » Sat May 05, 2007 4:23 am UTC

You have to take the bad ones to get the good ones. Life's all about balance, a mixture. There are very few absolutes. You have to go down to go up again. If there was no dark, how could you tell what was light?

This is what I tell myself when times get rough. I find it actually helps.
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Postby rhalleys5th » Sat May 05, 2007 5:38 am UTC

Jesster wrote:The difficulties come from emotions either taken to an extreme (Depression, uncontrollable rage etc.) or from a complexity of emotion that confuses us rather than aids. However, these glitches are still preferable to having no emotion at all so they survive.


Interestingly, some of the psychotropic medications out there (for bipolar disorder, at least), can and do result in one "having no emotion at all." Whether or not this is preferable to manic episodes, etc. is a question a lot of manic-depressives have to struggle with.

Belial wrote:Without the desire to survive, we'd all die.


But without the desire to die, wouldn't we all just live? Sans emotion, I imagine we'd just be a lot less human and more like animals, surviving based on instinct. Or better yet, we'd be a bunch of automatons.

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Postby Belial » Sat May 05, 2007 5:40 am UTC

Or better yet, we'd be a bunch of automatons.


Without desire to live, logic dictates that survival is no better an outcome than death. Therefore, it's easier to do nothing, and die.
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Postby rhalleys5th » Sat May 05, 2007 6:04 am UTC

Belial wrote:Without desire to live, logic dictates that survival is no better an outcome than death. Therefore, it's easier to do nothing, and die.


It might be "easier" to do nothing, but given that it's pretty painful to die of thirst and hunger, avoiding that discomfort would prevent our species from becoming extinct immediately.

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Postby Hex » Sat May 05, 2007 6:08 am UTC

This is my first hand experience talking: Do not piss her off. Stay friends. Then sleep with her brother.

I never got to the brother part because I pissed her off, but hey, who knows? It might work.

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Postby Belial » Sat May 05, 2007 6:17 am UTC

It might be "easier" to do nothing, but given that it's pretty painful to die of thirst and hunger, avoiding that discomfort would prevent our species from becoming extinct immediately.


Logically, discomfort is not inferior to comfort. The desire for comfort is an emotion.

Basically, our emotional drives give us the "goals" that we work toward logically. We want to live, we want to be comfortable, we want a myriad other things, and we work toward them logically. Without a desired result, our logic has nowhere to go.
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Postby smocc » Mon May 07, 2007 5:06 pm UTC

And then are we dead? How far down does it reach? Is there a "desire to make the heart pump"?

I'm of the opinion that emotions are what make life worth living and emotional decisions are the most powerful decisions there are. However, they of course lead to unwise or destructive decisions, so must be checked with reasoned thought and evaluation.

I also think that which emotions are experienced most often can be changed through concious decision. They are not something the be left alone. For example, the OP feels the emotion of jealousy. He examines this emotion, thinks that it is not a good emotion (as it might lead him to aggressive or selfish behavior) and so decides to take measures that will cause him to not feel jealousy. (Sorry, don't know what those are! :P)

And after writing this, I realized I voted for the wrong option. I should have voted for "sometimes yes, sometimes no"
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Postby mkrauss » Tue May 08, 2007 5:50 am UTC

As far as advice (which I realize you weren't seeking) certainly you've got the best I could possibly give from the other replies. Amazing the caliber of people here.

As to my thoughts on emotion...

Someone (can't remember who) said emotion is the lens through which we focus reason. That statement always resonated very strongly with me. I think that considering emotions as a seperate survival trait, or what not, is off target. Rather, emotion is an essential part of the working of the human psyche, without which nothing much else would work correctly.

There are people who basically lack emotion. They are called psychopaths, and they tend to become mass murderers, so I am pretty solidly on the pro-emotion side. Some of these people manage to get themselves killed or caught, but some manage to mask their condition and survive very effectively, even excelling in life -- though never enough to draw attention. So I also think that emotion is more important to species-survival than individual-survival.

smocc wrote:And then are we dead? How far down does it reach? Is there a "desire to make the heart pump"?


I suppose I would say... yes... tentatively. Through meditation techniques, some can learn to control their heartbeat, so presumably it may be an emotional response in a deep-rooted part of the mind, of which we are normally unaware, that causes it.

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Postby mkrauss » Tue May 08, 2007 5:55 am UTC

Oops, forgot one thing in my last post.

cmacis wrote:I say keep emotions if only for the good times. Yes, that sucks. Yes, I know, I've been there. No, it doesn't get any easier (not by age 19 anyway). No, nothing is worth becoming emo other.


Yes, it does get easier. Over time, with experience, with wisdom, it does. This is not to say that the depth of pain emotions can cause gets any less -- if anything, it grows. But so will you, and at a faster rate. You will grow stronger and better able to handle these kinds of things.

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Postby ArchangelShrike » Tue May 08, 2007 5:59 am UTC

Emotion... I would argue that no emotion can be good at times, like anything else. A "necessary evil," if you would accept it that way. For example, would I rather have a fighter pilot that is panicking and fearful of getting shot down or a pilot that has no thought about anything but the mission? Of course, you can argue that this no-thought is confidence, and that confidence is an emotion, but for the most part there are jobs that computers could excel at doing if that had all the tools/abilities necessary to do it, such as driving a car. No need for road rage or rubbernecking, just a smooth automated process that takes in data and puts out data, data that is used to guide the car.

Like all of my posts, I could be totally wrong.

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Postby mkrauss » Tue May 08, 2007 4:40 pm UTC

That figher pilot does not have no thought about anything but the mission. She simply has her thoughts and emotions well controlled and compartmentalized. If the fighter pilot is not thinking, on some level, of what this is all for -- love of family, country, freedom or other ideals, whatever -- she would probably bolt.

Other than that nit-pick, I see your point and agree. Certainly computer-controlled cars could make the world a much safer place, assuming they aren't running Windows. But note that that is a specialized tool we are talking about. It is obvious that we don't want emotional tools, such a hammer that empathizes with the nails and dislikes the thumb.

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Re: Emotions (I really just need to vent)

Postby WraithXt1 » Wed Nov 21, 2007 4:42 am UTC

You have cemented yourself firmly in the friend zone.

I've had EXACTLY your situation happen to me before. My only solution was to 'next' them as a friend totally until I got over it. Then whenever those feelings are gone I can either come back or move on. It sucks, but once you are in the friend zone, you are stuck there =(
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Re: Emotions (I really just need to vent)

Postby Puzzlemaker » Wed Nov 21, 2007 5:00 am UTC

WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT CONSTANTLY HOPE THAT YOU STILL HAVE A CHANCE AND FOLLOW HER AROUND.

Back off, cool down, come back if you feel ready. If you do feel ready, you are lying and need to take a good look at yourself mentally.
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