The Darker Side of the News

Seen something interesting in the news or on the intertubes? Discuss it here.

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CorruptUser
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Feb 19, 2018 3:23 pm UTC

The problem with giving everyone the bomb but absolutely no one wanting to push the button is that if someone got drunk and fell...

Remember, the US and Russia both came very close to nuking the other due to computer malfunctions saying the other had already launched an attack, only stopped because of the one guy who refused a retaliatory strike. In the case of Cuba, it came to a vote as to whether to nuke the US fleet, while the sub was being hit with depth charges (warning dummy charges but there's really not a good way to tell from the real thing), and the majority voted in favor of the nuclear strike. Luckily it had to be unanimous, but we were far closer to Armageddon than most realize. Also why I hate JFK, who ordered the destroyer to drop those charges.

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ucim
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby ucim » Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:00 pm UTC

The problem with everyone wanting to nuke each other but nobody having the bomb is the seething malaise, resentment, and anger that builds and builds until, bomb or no bomb, something goes off big time. This is arguably how WWII actually did start... seething resentment from WWI and the punishment of Germany by the winners, which led to the rise of the Nazi party. And the development of the actual bomb.

And I'll note that in the JFK case above, the cold war and people wanting to kill each other was the backdrop.

There's no utopia, but I'd rather live where death is accidental rather than deliberate, because in the latter case, living isn't much fun either.

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CorruptUser
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:04 pm UTC

But death is far more likely in the case where everyone has the bomb but doesn't want to use it, as all it takes is someone drunk at the controls or a computer malfunction that says Armageddon already started.

Personally, I'd rather we killed ourselves off intentionally than accidentally, not the other way around. Because if we are going to die, we should deserve it.

These are of course extremes. Where we are now, yes, I'd work more on making people better rather than removing the weapons as is, but it's not static as to which is more important.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Soupspoon » Mon Feb 19, 2018 5:39 pm UTC

Darkly comic incident, in that he makes an absolute meal of the attack. And does it slap-bang on camera!

(And actually nothing to do with the above discussion, but if you want to imagine that in defensive/offensive gun-carrying place then please do try…)

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Chen » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:35 pm UTC

Dauric wrote:Query:

How does gun crime (or crime in general for that matter) compare to "life respecting" policies?

Is it conceivable that all those countries held up as paragons of gun-controlled culture aren't so because of restrictive gun control, but because they have a policy environment that reduces the desire to kill one another? That the reduced 'fear and loathing' of one's fellow man makes gun control more palatable to the public as they see less need to defend themselves from their fellow citizen?

If we removed public social and economic supports from those countries like public healthcare or social safety nets, would there be a rise in illegal weapons smuggling, metal-shops doing a brisk business in illegal weapons manufacturing, or general garage manufacture of improvised killing devices?

Probably difficult to quantify, and I'm not good at statistics so I'd probably muck it up if I tried.


Definitely hard to say. A lot of the high gun death countries are ones with rampant corruption and criminality. Similarly a lot of the low gun death countries do have good social safety nets, but there are others that are just VERY authoritarian (presumably making it very hard to find guns) without as good a social safety net. Course it could also be lack of proper statistics. Zimbabwe has a gun death rate about 5 times lower than Canada for example. Also Finland has something like 14x the rate as the UK.

So there are definitely plenty of other confounding variables there. Perhaps social safety net or the equivalent is one of them, but a cursory look at the data makes it hard to tell.

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CorruptUser
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:46 pm UTC

A lot of the murders are displaced by a functioning justice system. When people can't get justice through legal channels, they turn to other methods.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:41 pm UTC

If you want some statistics, gunpolicy.org have a lot of data:
Spoiler:
http://www.gunpolicy.org/firearms/region/united-states

United States — Gun Facts, Figures and the Law
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Federal firearm legislation is limited (below). Many municipalities and all states regulate gun use with their own local law (Go To).
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StockpilesGun Numbers
Civilian Guns
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Number of Privately Owned Firearms
The estimated total number of guns (both licit and illicit) held by civilians in the United States is 270,000,0001 to 310,000,0002 3
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Rate of Civilian Firearm Possession per 100 Population
The estimated rate of private gun ownership (both licit and illicit) per 100 people in the United States is 101.052 4 1
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Number of Privately Owned Rifles
In the United States, the number of rifles in civilian possession is reported to be 110,000,0002
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Number of Privately Owned Shotguns
In the United States, the number of shotguns in civilian possession is reported to be 86,000,0002
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Number of Privately Owned Handguns
In the United States, the number of handguns in civilian possession is reported to be 114,000,0002
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Number of Privately Owned Firearms - World Ranking
In a 2007 comparison of the number of privately owned guns in 178 countries, the United States ranked at No. 15
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Rate of Privately Owned Firearms per 100 Population - World Ranking
In a 2007 comparison of the rate of private gun ownership in 178 countries, the United States ranked at No. 11
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Proportion of Households with Firearms
Chart
In the United States, the percentage of households with one or more guns is reported to be

2014: 31.0%6
2013: 37%7
2012: 33.1%6 7 8 9
2010: 31.1%
2008: 34.0%
2006: 33.1%
2004: 34.7%
2002: 33.5%
2000: 32.4%
1998: 34.8%
1996: 40.1%
1994: 40.6%
1993: 42.0%
1991: 39.6%
1990: 42.2%
1989: 46.0%
1988: 39.8%
1987: 46.0%
1985: 44.2%
1984: 44.9%
1982: 45.3%
1980: 47.3%
1977: 50.4%
1976: 46.5%
1974: 46.1%
1973: 47.0%
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Proportion of Households with Rifles
Chart
In the United States, the percentage of households with one or more rifles is reported to be

2012: 20.5%10
2010: 19.4%
2008: 25.2%
2006: 20.4%
2004: 21.0%
2002: 22.2%
2000: 21.6%
1998: 22.5%
1996: 25.8%
1994: 27.3%
1993: 25.7%
1991: 27.8%
1990: 27.8%
1989: 29.6%
1988: 27.3%
1987: 30.0%
1985: 31.4%
1984: 29.6%
1982: 32.5%
1980: 31.2%
1977: 33.5%
1976: 30.5%
1974: 28.4%
1973: 30.8%
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Proportion of Households with Shotguns
Chart
In the United States, the percentage of households with one or more shotguns is reported to be

2012: 21.4%11
2010: 19.7%
2008: 25.4%
2006: 20.3%
2004: 20.0%
2002: 23.2%
2000: 20.0%
1998: 22.1%
1996: 27.2%
1994: 27.1%
1993: 29.7%
1991: 29.0%
1990: 28.6%
1989: 30.6%
1988: 26.4%
1987: 30.9%
1985: 30.3%
1984: 28.7%
1982: 32.7%
1980: 33.0%
1977: 34.8%
1976: 30.5%
1974: 29.0%
1973: 29.0%
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Proportion of Households with Handguns
Chart
In the United States, the percentage of households with one or more handguns is reported to be

2012: 21.9%12
2010: 19.6%
2008: 26.2%
2006: 20.0%
2004: 20.7%
2002: 21.0%
2000: 20.5%
1998: 20.5%
1996: 23.7%
1994: 26.2%
1993: 26.1%
1991: 22.1%
1990: 24.9%
1989: 26.8%
1988: 24.4%
1987: 26.1%
1985: 24.1%
1984: 21.4%
1982: 22.9%
1980: 24.9%
1977: 21.3%
1976: 22.2%
1974: 20.3%
1973: 20.3%
Government Guns
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Number of Military Firearms
The defence forces of the United States are reported to have 2,700,00013 14 firearms
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Routine Arming of Police
In the United States, police officers on routine patrol carry one or more firearms15 16 17 18
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Number of Law Enforcement Firearms
Police in the United States are reported to have 1,150,00019 firearms
ImpactsDeath and Injury
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Total Number of Gun Deaths
Chart
In the United States, annual deaths resulting from firearms total

2014: 33,59920
2013: 33,636
2012: 33,563
2011: 32,35120 21
2010: 31,67220
2009: 31,347
2008: 31,593
2007: 31,224
2006: 30,896
2005: 30,694
2004: 29,569
2003: 30,136
2002: 30,242
2001: 29,573
2000: 28,663
1999: 28,874
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Rate of All Gun Deaths per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of all gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2014: 10.5420
2013: 10.63
2012: 10.69
2011: 10.3820 21
2010: 10.2620
2009: 10.22
2008: 10.39
2007: 10.37
2006: 10.35
2005: 10.39
2004: 10.10
2003: 10.39
2002: 10.51
2001: 10.38
2000: 10.19
1999: 10.35
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Homicides (any method)
Chart
In the United States, annual homicides by any means22 total

2014: 15,80920
2013: 16,121
2012: 16,68820 23
2011: 16,23820 21 23 24 25
2010: 16,25920 26 27 23 24
2009: 16,799
2008: 17,826
2007: 18,361
2006: 18,573
2005: 18,124
2004: 17,357
2003: 17,732
2002: 17,638
2001: 20,308
2000: 16,765
1999: 16,88920 28 24
1998: 14,27628 24
1997: 18,20829 24
1996: 19,645
1995: 21,606
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Rate of Homicide per 100,000 People (any method)
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of homicide by any means30 per 100,000 population is

2014: 4.9620
2013: 5.09
2012: 5.3120 23
2011: 5.2120 21 23 24 25
2010: 5.2720 26 23 24
2009: 5.4820 26 27 23 24
2008: 5.86
2007: 6.10
2006: 6.22
2005: 6.13
2004: 5.93
2003: 6.11
2002: 6.13
2001: 7.13
2000: 5.96
1999: 6.0520 28 24
1998: 5.1928 24
1997: 6.724
1996: 7.3
1995: 8.1
1993: 9.9331
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Gun Homicides
Chart
In the United States, annual firearm homicides32 total

2014: 10,94520
2013: 11,208
2012: 11,62220 23
2011: 11,06820 21 33 23
2010: 11,07820 33 23 24 34
2009: 11,493
2008: 12,179
2007: 12,632
2006: 12,79120 24 34
2005: 12,35220 23 24 34
2004: 11,62420 24 34
2003: 11,920
2002: 11,82920 35 34
2001: 11,348
2000: 10,80120
1999: 10,82820 28
1998: 9,25728
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Rate of Gun Homicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of firearm homicide per 100,000 population36 is

2014: 3.4320
2013: 3.54
2012: 3.7020 4
2011: 3.5520 21
2010: 3.5920 24 34
2009: 3.7520 27 24 34
2008: 4.01
2007: 4.19
2006: 4.29
2005: 4.18
2004: 3.97
2003: 4.11
2002: 4.1120 35 34
2001: 3.98
2000: 3.8420
1999: 3.8820 28
1998: 3.3728
1993: 7.0737
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Proportion of Homicides Committed With a Gun
Chart
In the United States, the percentage of homicides committed with a firearm is reported to be

2012: 60%23
2011: 69.6%38 23 25 39
2010: 68.1%38 23
2009: 68.4%
2008: 68.3%
2007: 68.8%
2006: 68.9%
2005: 68.2%
2004: 67.0%38
2003: 67.2%
2002: 67.1%
2001: 55.9%
2000: 64.4%
1999: 64.1%
1998: 65.9%
1997: 68.0%
1996: 68.0%
1995: 69.0%
1994: 71.4%
1993: 71.2%
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Handgun Homicides
Chart
In the United States, according to figures40 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), annual handgun homicides total

2014: 5,56233 41
2013: 5,782
2012: 6,404
2011: 6,251
2010: 6,115
2009: 6,501
2008: 6,800
2007: 7,398
2006: 7,836
2005: 7,565
2004: 7,286
2003: 7,745
2002: 7,294
2001: 6,931
2000: 6,778
1999: 6,658
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Rate of Handgun Homicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, according to figures42 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the annual rate of handgun homicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 1.744 41
2013: 1.83
2012: 2.04
2011: 2.01
2010: 1.98
2009: 2.12
2008: 2.24
2007: 2.46
2006: 2.63
2005: 2.56
2004: 2.49
2003: 2.67
2002: 2.54
2001: 2.43
2000: 2.40
1999: 2.39
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Handgun Homicides (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures40 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), annual handgun homicides total

2014: 78543 41
2013: 853
2012: 872
2011: 843
2010: 899
2009: 1,013
2008: 961
2007: 976
2006: 997
2005: 1,074
2004: 1,011
2003: 1,011
2002: 1,024
2001: 1,014
2000: 1,068
1999: 1,082
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Rate of Handgun Homicide per 100,000 People (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures42 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the annual rate of handgun homicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.2543 41
2013: 0.27
2012: 0.28
2011: 0.27
2010: 0.29
2009: 0.33
2008: 0.32
2007: 0.32
2006: 0.33
2005: 0.36
2004: 0.35
2003: 0.35
2002: 0.36
2001: 0.36
2000: 0.38
1999: 0.39
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Long Gun Homicides
Chart
In the United States, according to figures44 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), annual long gun homicides total

2014: 51033 41
2013: 593
2012: 608
2011: 694
2010: 733
2009: 774
2008: 822
2007: 910
2006: 928
2005: 967
2004: 910
2003: 846
2002: 974
2001: 897
2000: 896
1999: 931
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Rate of Long Gun Homicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, according to figures45 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the annual rate of long gun homicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.164 41
2013: 0.19
2012: 0.19
2011: 0.22
2010: 0.24
2009: 0.25
2008: 0.27
2007: 0.30
2006: 0.31
2005: 0.33
2004: 0.31
2003: 0.29
2002: 0.34
2001: 0.31
2000: 0.32
1999: 0.33
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Long Gun Homicides (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures44 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), annual long gun homicides total

2014: 45446 41
2013: 495
2012: 489
2011: 543
2010: 576
2009: 640
2008: 664
2007: 682
2006: 768
2005: 765
2004: 714
2003: 687
2002: 744
2001: 758
2000: 694
1999: 693
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Rate of Long Gun Homicide per 100,000 People (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures45 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the annual rate of long gun homicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.1446 41
2013: 0.16
2012: 0.16
2011: 0.17
2010: 0.19
2009: 0.21
2008: 0.22
2007: 0.23
2006: 0.26
2005: 0.26
2004: 0.24
2003: 0.24
2002: 0.26
2001: 0.27
2000: 0.25
1999: 0.25
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Gun Homicides (Other)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures47 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), annual firearm homicides (other) total

2014: 2,05233 41
2013: 2,079
2012: 1,885
2011: 1,708
2010: 2,026
2009: 1,924
2008: 1,906
2007: 1,821
2006: 1,461
2005: 1,626
2004: 1,189
2003: 1,068
2002: 1,260
2001: 1,062
2000: 987
1999: 891
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Rate of Gun Homicide (Other) per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, according to figures48 from the US Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI), the annual rate of firearm homicide (other) per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.644 41
2013: 0.66
2012: 0.60
2011: 0.55
2010: 0.65
2009: 0.63
2008: 0.63
2007: 0.60
2006: 0.49
2005: 0.55
2004: 0.41
2003: 0.37
2002: 0.44
2001: 0.37
2000: 0.35
1999: 0.32
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Gun Homicides (Other) (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures47 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), annual firearm homicides (other) total

2014: 9,70649 41
2013: 9,859
2012: 10,261
2011: 9,682
2010: 9,603
2009: 9,840
2008: 10,554
2007: 10,974
2006: 11,026
2005: 10,513
2004: 9,899
2003: 10,222
2002: 10,061
2001: 9,576
2000: 9,039
1999: 9,053
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Rate of Gun Homicide (Other) per 100,000 People (CDC)
Chart
In the United States, according to figures48 from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC), the annual rate of firearm homicide (other) per 100,000 population is

2014: 3.0449 41
2013: 3.12
2012: 3.27
2011: 3.11
2010: 3.11
2009: 3.21
2008: 3.47
2007: 3.64
2006: 3.70
2005: 3.56
2004: 3.38
2003: 3.52
2002: 3.50
2001: 3.36
2000: 3.21
1999: 3.24
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Suicides (any method)
Chart
In the United States, annual suicides by any means total

2014: 42,77320
2013: 41,149
2012: 40,600
2011: 39,51820 21
2010: 38,36420
2009: 36,909
2008: 36,03520 50
2007: 34,598
2006: 33,300
2005: 32,63720 51 50
2004: 32,43920 50
2003: 31,484
2002: 31,655
2001: 30,62220 52 50
2000: 29,35020 50
1999: 29,19920
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Rate of Suicide per 100,000 People (any method)
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of suicide by any means per 100,000 population is

2014: 13.4120
2013: 13.00
2012: 12.93
2011: 12.6820 21
2010: 12.4320
2009: 12.03
2008: 11.8520 51 50
2007: 11.4920 50
2006: 11.16
2005: 11.0420 51 50
2004: 11.0820 50
2003: 10.8520 53 50
2002: 11.0120 50
2001: 10.7520 52 50
2000: 10.4320 50
1999: 10.4620
1993: 12.0654
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Gun Suicides
Chart
In the United States, annual firearm suicides total

2014: 21,33420
2013: 21,175
2012: 20,666
2011: 19,99020 21
2010: 19,39220
2009: 18,735
2008: 18,223
2007: 17,352
2006: 16,883
2005: 17,00220 55
2004: 16,75020
2003: 16,907
2002: 17,108
2001: 16,86920 52
2000: 16,58620
1999: 16,599
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Rate of Gun Suicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of firearm suicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 6.6920
2013: 6.69
2012: 6.58
2011: 6.4220 21
2010: 6.2820
2009: 6.11
2008: 5.99
2007: 5.76
2006: 5.66
2005: 5.7520 4
2004: 5.7220
2003: 5.83
2002: 5.95
2001: 5.9220 52
2000: 5.8920
1999: 5.95
1993: 7.3556
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Handgun Suicides
Chart
In the United States, annual handgun suicides total

2014: 5,38557
2013: 5,388
2012: 5,079
2011: 4,806
2010: 4,603
2009: 4,474
2008: 4,119
2007: 3,801
2006: 3,655
2005: 3,654
2004: 3,609
2003: 3,672
2002: 3,597
2001: 3,489
2000: 3,520
1999: 3,476
Compare
Rate of Handgun Suicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of handgun suicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 1.6957
2013: 1.70
2012: 1.62
2011: 1.54
2010: 1.49
2009: 1.46
2008: 1.35
2007: 1.26
2006: 1.22
2005: 1.24
2004: 1.23
2003: 1.27
2002: 1.25
2001: 1.22
2000: 1.25
1999: 1.25
Compare
Long Gun Suicides
Chart
In the United States, the number of long gun suicides is

2014: 3,03458
2013: 3,025
2012: 3,012
2011: 2,961
2010: 2,957
2009: 2,924
2008: 2,952
2007: 2,758
2006: 2,758
2005: 2,915
2004: 2,798
2003: 2,668
2002: 2,908
2001: 2,814
2000: 2,684
1999: 2,776
Compare
Rate of Long Gun Suicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of long gun suicide per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.9558
2013: 0.96
2012: 0.96
2011: 0.95
2010: 0.96
2009: 0.95
2008: 0.97
2007: 0.92
2006: 0.92
2005: 0.99
2004: 0.96
2003: 0.92
2002: 1.01
2001: 0.99
2000: 0.95
1999: 0.99
Compare
Gun Suicides (Other)
Chart
In the United States, annual gun suicides (other) total

2014: 12,91559
2013: 12,762
2012: 12,575
2011: 12,223
2010: 11,832
2009: 11,337
2008: 11,152
2007: 10,793
2006: 10,470
2005: 10,433
2004: 10,343
2003: 10,567
2002: 10,603
2001: 10,566
2000: 10,382
1999: 10,347
Compare
Rate of Gun Suicide (Other) per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of gun suicide (other) per 100,000 population is

2014: 4.0559
2013: 4.04
2012: 4.01
2011: 3.92
2010: 3.83
2009: 3.73
2008: 3.67
2007: 3.58
2006: 3.51
2005: 3.53
2004: 3.53
2003: 3.64
2002: 3.69
2001: 3.71
2000: 3.69
1999: 3.71
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Unintentional Gun Deaths
Chart
In the United States, annual unintentional shooting deaths total

2014: 58620
2013: 505
2012: 548
2011: 59120 21
2010: 60620 60
2009: 55420
2008: 592
2007: 613
2006: 642
2005: 78920 55
2004: 64920
2003: 730
2002: 762
2001: 80220 52
2000: 77620
1999: 824
Compare
Rate of Unintentional Gun Death per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unintentional shooting death per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.1820
2013: 0.16
2012: 0.17
2011: 0.1920 21
2010: 0.2020
2009: 0.18
2008: 0.19
2007: 0.20
2006: 0.22
2005: 0.2720 4
2004: 0.2220
2003: 0.25
2002: 0.26
2001: 0.2820 52
2000: 0.2820
1999: 0.30
1993: 0.5961
Compare
Unintentional Handgun Deaths
Chart
In the United States, annual unintentional shooting deaths by handgun total

2014: 9662
2013: 79
2012: 69
2011: 68
2010: 91
2009: 81
2008: 89
2007: 90
2006: 107
2005: 107
2004: 93
2003: 83
2002: 108
2001: 108
2000: 120
1999: 130
Compare
Rate of Unintentional Handgun Death per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unintentional shooting death by handgun per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0362
2013: 0.02
2012: 0.02
2011: 0.02
2010: 0.03
2009: 0.03
2008: 0.03
2007: 0.03
2006: 0.04
2005: 0.04
2004: 0.03
2003: 0.03
2002: 0.04
2001: 0.04
2000: 0.04
1999: 0.05
Compare
Unintentional Long Gun Deaths
Chart
In the United States, annual unintentional shooting deaths by long gun total

2014: 6563
2013: 81
2012: 67
2011: 98
2010: 83
2009: 98
2008: 101
2007: 92
2006: 73
2005: 104
2004: 95
2003: 105
2002: 119
2001: 148
2000: 131
1999: 112
Compare
Rate of Unintentional Long Gun Death per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unintentional shooting death by long gun per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0263
2013: 0.03
2012: 0.02
2011: 0.03
2010: 0.03
2009: 0.03
2008: 0.03
2007: 0.03
2006: 0.02
2005: 0.04
2004: 0.03
2003: 0.04
2002: 0.04
2001: 0.05
2000: 0.05
1999: 0.04
Compare
Unintentional Gun Deaths (Other)
Chart
In the United States, annual unintentional shooting deaths by firearm (other) total

2014: 42564
2013: 345
2012: 412
2011: 425
2010: 432
2009: 375
2008: 402
2007: 431
2006: 462
2005: 578
2004: 461
2003: 542
2002: 535
2001: 546
2000: 525
1999: 582
Compare
Rate of Unintentional Gun Death (Other) per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unintentional shooting death by firearm (other) per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.1364
2013: 0.11
2012: 0.13
2011: 0.14
2010: 0.14
2009: 0.12
2008: 0.13
2007: 0.14
2006: 0.15
2005: 0.20
2004: 0.16
2003: 0.19
2002: 0.19
2001: 0.19
2000: 0.19
1999: 0.21
Compare
Gun Deaths from Undetermined Cause
Chart
In the United States, annual shooting deaths in which the cause remains undecided total

2014: 27020
2013: 281
2012: 256
2011: 24820 21
2010: 25220
2009: 232
2008: 273
2007: 276
2006: 220
2005: 221
2004: 235
2003: 232
2002: 243
2001: 23120 52
2000: 23020
1999: 324
Compare
Rate of Gun Death from Undetermined Cause per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unknown-cause shooting deaths per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0820
2013: 0.09
2012: 0.08
2011: 0.0820 21
2010: 0.0820
2009: 0.08
2008: 0.09
2007: 0.09
2006: 0.07
2005: 0.07
2004: 0.08
2003: 0.0820 53
2002: 0.0820
2001: 0.0820 52
2000: 0.0820
1999: 0.12
1993: 0.2265
Compare
Handgun Deaths from Undetermined Cause
Chart
In the United States, annual deaths by handgun in which the cause remains undecided total

2014: 3966
2013: 33
2012: 32
2011: 33
2010: 37
2009: 29
2008: 32
2007: 39
2006: 26
2005: 27
2004: 31
2003: 47
2002: 33
2001: 36
2000: 40
1999: 70
Compare
Rate of Handgun Death from Undetermined Cause per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unknown-cause handgun deaths per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0166
2013: 0.01
2012: 0.01
2011: 0.01
2010: 0.01
2009: 0.01
2008: 0.01
2007: 0.01
2006: 0.01
2005: 0.01
2004: 0.01
2003: 0.02
2002: 0.01
2001: 0.01
2000: 0.01
1999: 0.03
Compare
Long Gun Deaths from Undetermined Cause
Chart
In the United States, annual deaths by long gun in which the cause remains undecided total

2014: 2267
2013: 31
2012: 23
2011: 25
2010: 23
2009: 24
2008: 31
2007: 24
2006: 23
2005: 31
2004: 21
2003: 26
2002: 27
2001: 21
2000: 24
1999: 33
Compare
Rate of Long Gun Death from Undetermined Cause per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unknown-cause long gun deaths per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0167
2013: 0.01
2012: 0.01
2011: 0.01
2010: 0.01
2009: 0.01
2008: 0.01
2007: 0.01
2006: 0.01
2005: 0.01
2004: 0.01
2003: 0.01
2002: 0.01
2001: 0.01
2000: 0.01
1999: 0.01
Compare
Gun Deaths (Other) from Undetermined Cause
Chart
In the United States, annual deaths by firearm (other) in which the cause remains undecided total

2014: 20968
2013: 217
2012: 201
2011: 190
2010: 192
2009: 179
2008: 210
2007: 213
2006: 171
2005: 163
2004: 183
2003: 159
2002: 183
2001: 174
2000: 166
1999: 221
Compare
Rate of Gun Death (Other) from Undetermined Cause per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of unknown-cause gun deaths (other) per 100,000 population is

2014: 0.0768
2013: 0.07
2012: 0.06
2011: 0.06
2010: 0.06
2009: 0.06
2008: 0.07
2007: 0.07
2006: 0.06
2005: 0.06
2004: 0.06
2003: 0.05
2002: 0.06
2001: 0.06
2000: 0.06
1999: 0.08
Compare
Justifiable Gun Homicides
Chart
In the United States, annual legal-intervention gun homicides total

2013: 68169 70 71
2012: 686
2011: 610
2010: 632
2009: 629
2008: 592
2007: 597
2006: 578
2005: 53572
2004: 587
2003: 616
2002: 574
2001: 599
2000: 473
1999: 500
1998: 563
1997: 646
1996: 617
1995: 657
Compare
Rate of Justifiable Gun Homicide per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of justifiable gun homicide per 100,000 population is

2013: 0.224
2012: 0.22
2011: 0.20
2010: 0.20
2009: 0.21
2008: 0.19
2007: 0.20
2006: 0.19
2005: 0.18
2004: 0.20
2003: 0.21
2002: 0.20
2001: 0.21
2000: 0.17
1999: 0.18
1998: 0.20
1997: 0.24
1996: 0.23
1995: 0.25
Compare
Non-fatal Gun Injuries
Chart
In the United States, the annual number of non-fatal firearm injuries73 is

2013: 84,25874
2012: 81,396
2011: 73,88374 75
2010: 73,50574 76 75
2009: 66,76974 77 75
2008: 78,62274 75
2007: 69,863
2006: 71,417
2005: 69,825
2004: 64,389
2003: 65,834
2002: 58,841
2001: 63,012
Compare
Rate of Non-fatal Gun Injury per 100,000 People
Chart
In the United States, the annual rate of non-fatal firearm injury73 per 100,000 population is

2013: 26.6574
2012: 25.93
2011: 23.7174
2010: 23.8174 4
2009: 21.76
2008: 25.8574
2007: 23.19
2006: 23.93
2005: 23.63
2004: 21.99
2003: 22.69
2002: 20.46
2001: 22.11

... on guns and deaths and injuries in particular, Gapminder World have quite a bit on various things including income inequality, perceived corruption and child mortality rates, or gender bias in literacy, life expectancy and HIV prevalence:
Spoiler:
https://www.gapminder.org/tools/#_state_time_value=2009;&marker_axis/_x_which=corruption/_perception/_index/_cpi&domainMin:null&domainMax:null&zoomedMin:null&zoomedMax:null&scaleType=linear;&axis/_y_which=inequality/_index/_gini&domainMin:null&domainMax:null&zoomedMin:null&zoomedMax:null;&size_which=child/_mortality/_0/_5/_year/_olds/_dying/_per/_1000/_born&domainMin:null&domainMax:null;;;&chart-type=bubbles
GMWT1.png

https://www.gapminder.org/tools/#_state ... pe=bubbles
GMWT2.png

... and World Life Expectancy will list countries' death rates from various causes:
Spoiler:
http://www.worldlifeexpectancy.com/cause-of-death/violence/by-country/
WLE.png
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby gmalivuk » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:05 pm UTC

Dinesh D'Souza: terrible excuse for a human being, or the terriblest excuse for a human being?
Image
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:12 pm UTC

Not terriblest, I would say the murderer did more harm to those students than Dinouchbag.

Still, really? Kids watch their friends die in front of them, lives that had just begun simply... cease to be, and his response was " Oh boo hoo, first world problems!"? I mean, granted it IS a first world problem at this point...

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby addams » Thu Feb 22, 2018 6:19 am UTC

I hope those young people earn a seat in The Houses.
Maybe, one or more will work from the Oval Office.

They may need a little encouragement.
D'Souza is exactly what we Don't need.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:25 pm UTC

Trigger warning for pretty much everything.

South Sudan:
Spoiler:
Gang rapes and beheadings revealed in UN report on South Sudan abuses

In the document, released by a United Nations commission, one South Sudanese man is said to have returned home after hiding from government soldiers to find they had blinded his mother, gouging out her eyes with spears.

The woman had tried to defend her 17-year-old daughter from being raped by more than a dozen soldiers. Seventeen soldiers then sexually assaulted the teenager, while the family’s father was beheaded.

One South Sudanese woman told the commission that her 12-year-old son was forced to have sex with his grandmother in order to stay alive, the report said.

Untold tens of thousands have been killed in South Sudan since the conflict erupted in December 2013, just two years after independence from Sudan. More than two million people have fled the country, the largest refugee crisis since the Rwandan genocide 24 years ago. Millions who remain at home face hunger.

The new UN report is an account of the gang rapes, castrations, ethnic violence and other abuses that have left much of the impoverished East African nation in despair, as international frustration with the warring sides grows.

South Sudan’s conflict began as a power struggle between Mr Kiir and former vice president Riek Machar, but has fractured into an estimated 40 armed groups across the country, with many fighting each other.

However, consistent patterns stand out, such as government attacks on unarmed, fleeing civilians in areas where no opposition forces were present, the report said.
UN identifies South Sudan military officers accused of war crimes

Oil-rich South Sudan gained independence from neighbouring Sudan in 2011, but slid into civil war in December 2013. More than 4 million people, a third of the population, have been displaced by violence.

Their report, released on Friday, makes the case for “individual command responsibility for widespread or systematic attacks on civilians” by senior military officers, including eight lieutenant generals, and three state governors.

Mawien Makol, a spokesman for South Sudan’s foreign ministry, said the government was willing to hold people to account. “The government will prosecute anyone responsible for any crimes. This is a responsible government,” he said.

The UN report details what it calls “appalling instances of cruelty against civilians who have had their eyes gouged out, their throats slit or been castrated”. It says such violence occurred during five major battles between government troops and rebels in 2016 and 2017.

The report contains testimony from a mother who witnessed her son being forced to rape his grandmother while his family was held hostage, and an 85-year-old woman who said she was gang-raped before watching the execution of her husband and son.

Whether the investigators’ evidence will result in prosecutions depends on the African Union. Under a 2015 peace deal that fell apart in 2016, the AU and South Sudan were supposed to set up a “hybrid court” made up of South Sudanese and other African judges to try people accused of atrocities.

The UN commission said a year ago that the AU was making itself complicit in South Sudan’s bloodshed by failing to set up the court. It called again on Friday for it to be established.


They're arguing about whose fault it is that they're not doing anything about the problem?
Oil-rich, future-poor.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Sun Feb 25, 2018 3:55 pm UTC

Is it currently a religious conflict, nationalist, or just various warlords trying to prove who is the biggest and baddest?

Because honestly? I think this is one of those conflicts that can be perfectly described by "Dawn of the Peck", one of the Thanksgiving episodes of Bob's Burgers.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Coyne » Sun Feb 25, 2018 4:21 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Is it currently a religious conflict, nationalist, or just various warlords trying to prove who is the biggest and baddest?

Because honestly? I think this is one of those conflicts that can be perfectly described by "Dawn of the Peck", one of the Thanksgiving episodes of Bob's Burgers.

Sounds like plain, "good", old-fashioned genocide to me.
In all fairness...

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Zamfir » Sun Feb 25, 2018 9:54 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Is it currently a religious conflict, nationalist, or just various warlords trying to prove who is the biggest and baddest?

Because honestly? I think this is one of those conflicts that can be perfectly described by "Dawn of the Peck", one of the Thanksgiving episodes of Bob's Burgers.

The article is about atrocities, so you make a joke about chickens in a cartoon. Fuck you.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Feb 26, 2018 12:48 am UTC

Wasn't actually a joke so your statement is attacking a bit of a strawman, but I kinda feel compelled to defend that straw.

That it's a harsh topic, one that is ongoing, is in part why you need to joke about it. Joking and mockery is how you take power away from these people. The entire MO of mass rapes and such isn't so that X victims suffered Y atrocities, but that everyone else is aware of Y atrocities and afraid of the groups committing said atrocities. Remember, the total number of black people lynched in the US was about 3000, far less than the numbers that died from individual diseases; the point was not specifically to murder specific black people but to make everyone else aware of those murders in order that all other black people were afraid of stepping out of line. Humor? That's part of how you stop them. You turn the KKK, Neo-Nazis, Scientology, etc into living punchlines, and that goes farther to eliminate their power than you could ever hope to achieve through anything short of the most violent and direct means.

So yeah, I'm going to compare the mass murderers to a bunch of deranged turkeys. I'm going to mock ISIS as a bunch of clowns, I'm going to keep making the "how do you know when a group of skinheads have been infiltrated by the fbi; the spelling improves" jokes, and those are just as ongoing (and some more local) as/than South Sudan. And I hope you will mock them as well.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby gmalivuk » Mon Feb 26, 2018 1:44 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote:
Joking and mockery is how you take power away from these people.
There's different ways to do joking and mockery, though. Satire done well can be effective.

Your comparison, not so much.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Mon Feb 26, 2018 2:59 am UTC

Alright, it's bad satire. I'll grant you that.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Tyndmyr » Thu Mar 01, 2018 5:43 am UTC

gmalivuk wrote:Dinesh D'Souza: terrible excuse for a human being, or the terriblest excuse for a human being?


That's pretty terrible, yeah. Like, I don't agree with the policies the kids are after but....damn, they've been through a lot. Better to keep the disagreement polite, and maybe not poke fun at tragedy, particularly so soon. One can disagree without being an ass.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby LaserGuy » Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:20 pm UTC

Russian leader Vladimir Putin has just announced that Russia has produced a new line of nuclear weapons specifically designed to counter ballistic missile defense systems.

[Putin] noted that Russia had to develop the new weapons as the U.S. has developed a missile defence system that threatened to undermine the Russian nuclear deterrent and ignored Moscow's concerns about it.

He said that the nuclear-powered cruise missile tested last fall has a "practically unlimited" range and high speed and manoeuvrability allowing it to pierce any missile defence.

The Russian leader said the high-speed underwater drone also has an "intercontinental" range and is capable of carrying a nuclear warhead that could target both aircraft carriers and coastal facilities. He said its "very big" operational depth and a speed that is at least 10 times higher than any other vessel would make it immune to enemy intercept.

The Russian leader said that another new weapon called Avangard is an intercontinental hypersonic missile that would fly to targets at a speed 20 times the speed of sound and strike "like a meteorite, like a fireball."


Scary stuff.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Chen » Thu Mar 01, 2018 6:45 pm UTC

So how much of that is bluster and how much is actually real?

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Yablo » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:08 pm UTC

I would post this in the Other News thread, except for the fact that some people evidently feel racism is in play.

‘Offensive’ caged gorilla statue to return to park after public outcry.

A caged gorilla statue that was a fixture at a Texas playground for nearly two decades was removed after some residents deemed it “racially insensitive”


It's a gorilla, and it's not even the only animal statue at the park.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby SDK » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:15 pm UTC

That is... odd. Pretty sure calling that gorilla “racially insensitive” is the most racist thing about that story.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Yablo » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:42 pm UTC

That was my thought. It may not take an actual racist to think something like that, but the underlying presence of racist thought can't be denied. It honestly would never have occurred to me to think of that statue as anything other than a gorilla statue in a cage.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby orthogon » Thu Mar 01, 2018 11:31 pm UTC

Chen wrote:So how much of that is bluster and how much is actually real?

I don't know, but the translator was apparently going for "make him sound like Trump". "A very big operational depth"?
xtifr wrote:... and orthogon merely sounds undecided.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby sardia » Fri Mar 02, 2018 12:21 am UTC

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features ... e-recalled
How Defective Guns Became the Only Product That Can’t Be Recalled
Taurus sold almost a million handguns that can potentially fire without anyone pulling the trigger. The government won’t fix the problem. The NRA is silent.
TLDR defective gun explodes or shoots if bumped or jostled, even with the safety on. All attempts to give the government power to recall defective guns were defeated by the gun lobby. NRA is buddy buddy with this piece of crap company.
Another price to pay for freedom, I guess. The main victims here are Brazilians, who are forced by buy Brazilian only weapons. Taurus bought/controls 90% of the firearms in Brazil, and the cops are forced by law to buy & equip them. Most of them are injured, or so terrified, that they leave it unloaded. The Americans, who get injured are all shocked that a gun manufacturer would be allowed to sell defective products without a recall or safety warning from either the government that they're afraid of, or the NRA.


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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Yablo » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:03 pm UTC


Wow. So, if I live in an area of Denmark with a population of 30,000 people, and the following is true:

  • 15,001 are non-Western immigrants
  • 14,999 Danish citizens have no education whatsoever, and 2 of the immigrants only completed high school while the rest have PhDs
  • 810 of the Danish citizens have been convicted of something no worse than possession of a controlled substance while none of the non-Western immigrants has a single misdemeanor
This means, not only do I live in a "ghetto," but I'm also subject to a penalty twice as harsh as it would be the next town over. Well done, Denmark.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Mar 02, 2018 9:43 pm UTC

That's a rather unrealistic scenario, but the solution as I said appears to be some idiotic "treat them as second class citizens until they integrate" scheme.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Yablo » Fri Mar 02, 2018 10:26 pm UTC

Oh, it definitely is an unrealistic scenario, but the fact that it appears to qualify implies some level of potential absurdity. I agree it's a terrible and completely unfair solution.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Sableagle » Sat Mar 03, 2018 1:24 pm UTC

Isis fanatic tried to recruit children for 'death squad' to launch terror attacks in London

An unqualified teacher has been convicted of trying to recruit an “army of children” to launch a series of Isis-inspired attacks on dozens of targets across London.

Umar Haque brainwashed young pupils he taught at an Islamic school and mosque and made them act out atrocities.

The 25-year-old was still ranting about the self-proclaimed Islamic State as he was dragged from the dock after being convicted of preparing acts of terrorism.
Teacher tried to create 'army of children' to launch terror attacks in London

A British supporter of Islamic State was found guilty on Friday of trying to recruit children he was teaching into an“army” of jihadists to help carry out a wave of attacks across London.

Umar Haque, 25, showed the children beheading videos and other violent militant propaganda, forced them to re-enact deadly attacks on the British capital and made them role-play attacking police officers.

“His plan was to create an army of children to assist with multiple terrorist attacks throughout London,” said Dean Haydon, head of the Metropolitan Police’s Counter Terrorism Command.“He tried and he did, we believe, radicalise vulnerable children from the ages of 11 to 14.”
Far-right extremists preparing for 'war against Islam', report warns after terror plots exposed

Far-right extremists are preparing for what they believe is a “war against Islam”, a report has warned in the wake of police alerts over attempted attacks.

Hope Not Hate’s annual report forecast further violence emanating from various factions following the Finsbury Park terror attack on Muslims and neo-Nazi murder of Labour MP Jo Cox.

Nick Lowles, chief executive of the campaign group, said that with the combination of “civil war” rhetoric and growing online hatred, “we must be prepared for more terrorist plots and use of extreme violence from the far-right for the foreseeable future”.
Man tried to kill Muslim woman and 12-year-old girl as ‘revenge’ for terror attacks

A man has been convicted of attempting to murder a Muslim woman and 12-year-old schoolgirl in “revenge” for Islamist terror attacks.

Paul Moore, 21, told relatives he was “doing the country a favour” after ramming his car into the victims in Leicester on 20 September – five days after the Parsons Green Tube bombing.

Zaynab Hussein, who is Somali and wears a headscarf, was walking down Acer Close after dropping her children off at school when Moore hit her with his Volkswagen.
Ethan Stables trial: Neo-Nazi convicted of planning terror attack at gay pride event

A neo-Nazi has been convicted of planning a terror attack at a gay pride event after posting violent homophobic rants online.

Armed police stopped Ethan Stables as he was travelling to the celebration at a pub in Cumbria, finding weapons including a machete and axe at his home.

They had been tipped off by a member of a far-right Facebook group who saw the unemployed 20-year-old post a message saying he was “going to war” and planned to “slaughter every single one of the gay bastards”.

The woman, who was added to the chat by Stables and did not support his views, phoned police and posted screengrabs of his messages on social media warning local people not to go to the pub.

“I’ve had enough, I don’t want to live in a gay world and I sure as hell don’t want my children living in one,” Stables wrote in the “National Socialists Union standing against the New World Order” group.

“What happened to our traditional qualities? They’re f***ing ruined. I don’t care if I die, I’m fighting for what I believe in and that is the future of my country, my folk and my race.”


We've got the wall of D.C. to remind us all that you can't trust Freedom when it's not in your hand, when everybody's fighting for their Promised Land and I don't need your civil war!

Sableagle wrote:At least three of the five of us would be included, and it seems a reasonable precaution to assume they'd throw the other two in as well due to the association.
Six of us, actually. At least four of the five of them, and the other two of us would be included by association. My counting gets weird and unreliable when thousands of people are calling for the deaths of my friends. Still, the point remains the same.

At least I'm too old to be conscripted.
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:48 pm UTC

For days, Russia's main national TV channels were practically silent on the attempt to kill former spy Sergei Skripal with a nerve agent, but this changed in Wednesday's main evening bulletins.

The comment by Kirill Kleimenov - the presenter on government-controlled Channel One's flagship Vremya news programme - sounded like a veiled, mocking threat to anyone considering becoming a double agent for Britain.

"I don't wish death on anyone, but for purely educational purposes, I have a warning for anyone who dreams of such a career," he said. "The profession of a traitor is one of the most dangerous in the world,"

He also had a second piece of advice for such "traitors or those who simply hate their country in their free time": "Don't choose Britain as a place to live. Something is wrong there. Maybe it's the climate, but in recent years there have been too many strange incidents with grave outcomes there."


Uh-huh...

After a Cold War-style spy swap at Austria's Vienna airport, Col Skripal was given refuge in the UK, where he kept a low profile for eight years.

His wife Liudmila died of cancer in 2012, a year after they had bought a semi-detached home in Salisbury.

Two years ago, Col Skripal's older brother died in Russia, and last year, his 43-year-old son Alexander died while on holiday with his girlfriend in the Russian city of St Petersburg. He had been rushed to hospital with liver failure.

Family members were suspicious at the time and still believe some of the deaths were under mysterious circumstances.

Both Mrs Skripal and her son are buried in Salisbury.

Col Skripal's daughter Yulia, who was found unconscious next to her father, was visiting from Moscow, relatives told the BBC.


This is some serious cold war level sh*t! Why are we still buying oil and gas from this megalomaniac?

Russia has denied any involvement, but the case has put renewed scrutiny on a string of deaths in the UK in the past two decades. The chair of the home affairs select committee, Yvette Cooper MP, wrote to Home Secretary Amber Rudd on Tuesday calling for a review of 14 other cases.

Those cases were variously found to have been heart attacks, suicides, accidents, and deaths by natural causes, but some allege that they amount to a pattern of state-sponsored murder on British streets.

Security guard Neil St Clair-Ford was driving through Weybridge in Surrey in November 2012 when he saw something lying in the road ahead of him. He pulled over and found Alexander Perepilichnyy, an exiled Russian banker, in the foetal position, pale, cold, and displaying "very faint" signs of life.

Mr St Clair-Ford called a local former Navy colleague, Liam Walsh, to help administer first aid. Mr Walsh told an inquest that Perepilichnyy vomited "greeny-yellow" bile during mouth-to-mouth resuscitation with a strange taste, like "licking a battery".

Initial toxicology tests on Perepilichnyy's body revealed nothing suspicious and police said they had no evidence of foul play. But later tests performed by an expert botanist at Kew Gardens suggested the presence of a rare and deadly plant toxin in Perepilichnyy's stomach.

Gelsemium, a flowering plant native to China and South East Asia, is known as "heartbreak grass", because its leaves, if swallowed, cause cardiac arrest.

The following year, 2013, Boris Berezovsky, a one-time oligarch and close friend of Vladimir Putin, was found hanged in his bathroom. All the evidence seemed to point to a suicide. He had been suffering from depression and was in debt. According to police there was no sign of a struggle. A Home Office pathologist concluded that his injuries were consistent with hanging.

But he had also made himself a sworn enemy of Mr Putin, having fled Russia for exile in Britain and fiercely criticised the regime from afar.

Berezovsky's family arranged for an asphyxiation expert to examine photographs of his body. Dr Bernd Brinkmann testified that the ligature mark on Berezovsky's neck did not share the typical V-shape created by a hanging, and instead suggested strangling. The dead man also had a broken rib and a cut on the back of his head. It was enough to persuade the coroner to record an open verdict.

Among the other deaths flagged to the home secretary on Tuesday are those of Gareth Williams, the so-called "spy in the bag", whose badly decomposed body was found locked inside a holdall in his bath; Dr Matthew Puncher, a British scientist involved in the Litvinenko case who was found in his kitchen with multiple stab wounds from two separate knives; and Scot Young, a business associate of Berezovsky, who was found impaled on railings outside his London flat after falling from a fourth-floor window.

Williams' death was ruled to be "probably an accident" and Puncher's and Young's both suicides


Uh-huh...

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sardia
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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby sardia » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:58 pm UTC

Couple notes.
The USA is a rival energy power now, but any other reasons is usually because the Russians pay well (and companies get past sanctions).
The responses are very limited here. If you weren't going to go to war over the invasion of another country, who gives a shit if you assassinate a filthy traitor?
Lastly, the UK is weak, and Trump likes Russia and Putin.

If you really wanted to start something, arrange an accident and go bomb a few hundred Russian soldiers in Syria. See if they get the message(and pray they don't start a war over it)

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:50 pm UTC

Obviously we can't take any military action against Russia. But Russia supplies 40% of Europe's natural gas imports, for example. How many tens of billions is that worth to Russia's coffers? Why didn't we use our (now deceased) influence in Europe to threaten to pull the plug?

It's a slightly tangential topic but, though global trade is overall a very good thing, energy is one of the few areas I think countries and allied blocs should strive for self-sufficiency in.

It straight-jackets diplomacy way too much if, for example, the US is beholden to Saudi for oil or the EU beholden to Russia for natural gas.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:43 am UTC

Interestingly, France just laughs its ass off every time there's a problem with the Russian natural gas lines, because they are almost fully nuclear. I'm actually convinced that most of the anti-nuclear movement is actually Russian front groups, because they'd be foolish not to try to eliminate nuclear power in Europe.

The US is a net exporter of oil, for now. The Saudi-American alliance was, along with Iran, part of the "twin pillars" policy to help contain Russia. But in terms of diplomacy, Iran... Iran so far away. Gotta get away. Jokes aside, losing Saudi oil is a threat to the US in that the US's allies in Europe will suffer heavily, and that would have devastating economic consequences.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby paulisa » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:11 am UTC

CorruptUser wrote:Interestingly, France just laughs its ass off every time there's a problem with the Russian natural gas lines, because they are almost fully nuclear. I'm actually convinced that most of the anti-nuclear movement is actually Russian front groups, because they'd be foolish not to try to eliminate nuclear power in Europe.


Well, it's not like France or Europe as a whole is self-sufficient in nuclear ressources either, so it comes down to which devil you're willing to deal with. Please forgive my vagueness, but an aquaintance told me a few years ago that he was stationed somewhere in Africa (a former French colony, I forgot where exactly) to help secure supplies of Uranium for France. He is not in the French armed forces.
The smallest unit of time in the multiverse is the New-York-Second, defined as the period of time passing between the traffic light turning green and the cab behind you honking. - Terry Pratchett, Lords and Ladies

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby CorruptUser » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:20 am UTC

There actually is quite a bit of Uranium in Germany and Czech Republic. If this is not sufficient, Australia and Canada have a fuckton, to say nothing of Congo and Kazahkstan. Uranium is actually quite common as an ore, something like 50x more common than silver, but the price per kilogram is surprisingly low at like $50 for "yellowcake", which is already processed, so it's not economically recoverable in most places. That $50 of uranium will be further processed into something on the order of 7 grams of U235, which will be converted into 168,000 kilowatt hours, which is on the order of $17,000 to $50,000 worth of electricity, depending on the region. Clearly the ore itself is not the issue. Uranium is actually found in seawater at high enough concentrations that it'd be recoverable at a price of a mere $400 per kilogram. So if Europe got cut off from the rest of the world, nuclear power based electricity prices would rise by maybe 1%.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:01 pm UTC

As for the UK, there are enormous energy resources off the coast of Scotland in terms of wind, wave, tidal etc.

Scotland currently creates 59% of its electricity from renewables and has a goal of reaching 100% by 2020.

I think it wouldn't be out of the question for Scotland to be able to supply 100% of the electrical demand of the whole of the UK. Seems to me the main hurdle there would be the necessity to upgrade the national grid.

Course, you still need fossil fuels for others things such as transportation, but if the majority of vehicles go electric then all bets are off.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Mutex » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:09 pm UTC

Shale gas could also replace a massive amount of our coal plants. Simple, quick and cheap to build, can turn them on and off to meet demand, and ~ half as polluting as coal.

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby Soupspoon » Fri Mar 09, 2018 2:23 pm UTC

elasto wrote:I think it wouldn't be out of the question for Scotland to be able to supply 100% of the electrical demand of the whole of the UK.
There's an easy way around that problem. IndyRef2! :P

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Re: The Darker Side of the News

Postby elasto » Fri Mar 09, 2018 5:06 pm UTC

Soupspoon wrote:There's an easy way around that problem. IndyRef2! :P

I think Scotland leaving the UK would be a good thing from that pov. I think it would accelerate investment in Scottish renewables as a vital part of their economy. It could feasibly become their biggest export.


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