Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

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Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Princess Marzipan » Mon May 27, 2013 2:30 pm UTC

Ew.

This is disgusting. The tl;dr is a couple of shady guys have a few shady websites that host profiles and contact information for sex offenders...and sometimes the information is inaccurate or doesn't even belong to a sex offender. Offenders Victims can pay money to have their information removed, but sometimes they pay money and the information stays up. And no one appears to want to prosecute, probably because that'd be helping sex offenders and oh gosh we can't have that.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby sigsfried » Mon May 27, 2013 3:54 pm UTC

If they are using publicly available information then what is the problem? I mean if this information can all be gathered from government websites then these people have already lost the privacy, and the problem is the system that does that not some people copying and reposting the information.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 4:36 pm UTC

The only thing these websites are doing wrong is allowing people to pay to have their information removed. If they want to provide a service whereby people can check up on registered sex offenders, so as not to endanger themselves or others, then I say good for them.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Angua » Mon May 27, 2013 5:00 pm UTC

Did you miss this bit??
Princess Marzipan wrote: sometimes the information is inaccurate or doesn't even belong to a sex offender. Offenders Victims can pay money to have their information removed, but sometimes they pay money and the information stays up


The problems with this are the use of this website for extortion, the fact that it uses inaccurate information, the fact that it doesn't remove said inaccurate information, and the fact that even though this is ruining the lives of those who have paid their dues to society and leading to them being harassed, no one will prosecute because apparently former offenders don't deserve it (and let's not forget that the things for which one can be put on the list vary widely).
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby CorruptUser » Mon May 27, 2013 5:08 pm UTC

But if you are innocent, isn't it libel?

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 5:56 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:But if you are innocent, isn't it libel?


Yeah. We already have a mechanism for dealing with the cases where it's false. In the cases where it's true, these websites are performing a valuable service.

Taking down the details if paid is unethical, but in the end it's the website's own choice what they do with their hosting space. Hopefully the sites that have a reputation for *not* taking down the information will get more hits, more ad revenue and thus be more successful.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Izawwlgood » Mon May 27, 2013 6:01 pm UTC

Reminds me of this

Pretty shitty. Sex offenders seem to have the worst rehabilitation and post incarceration services or treatment.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Thesh » Mon May 27, 2013 6:12 pm UTC

Sex Offender Registries: Indiscriminately destroying lives for the illusion of safety.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 6:28 pm UTC

Thesh wrote:Sex Offender Registries: Indiscriminately destroying lives for the illusion of safety.


Would it be better to have no idea if an individual was a threat to others? Because when you don't have a vigorous means of vetting and barring you get shit like this.

Sex Offender Registries - Inconveniencing shitty people in order to protect the innocent.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Telchar » Mon May 27, 2013 6:32 pm UTC

Ormurinn wrote:
Thesh wrote:Sex Offender Registries: Indiscriminately destroying lives for the illusion of safety.


Sex Offender Registries - Inconveniencing shitty people in order to protect the innocent.


But shouldn't I know of any burglars in my neighborhood? Or car thiefs? or murderers? I can't find a list for any of those.....weird.....

Regardless of how awesome you think Sex Offender Registries are, you shouldn't be okay with using them to extort money from people.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 6:42 pm UTC

Telchar wrote:
Ormurinn wrote:
Thesh wrote:Sex Offender Registries: Indiscriminately destroying lives for the illusion of safety.


Sex Offender Registries - Inconveniencing shitty people in order to protect the innocent.


But shouldn't I know of any burglars in my neighborhood? Or car thiefs? or murderers? I can't find a list for any of those.....weird.....

Regardless of how awesome you think Sex Offender Registries are, you shouldn't be okay with using them to extort money from people.


I'm fine with a website data-mining publicly available information and presenting it to the public. It's immoral for the websites to take bribes to remove the information, but in the end it's their server space.

If you're going to be placing yourself at increased risk of theft or harm (for instance if you're hiring someone) you can have access to their criminal record - and some kind of sex offender registry is essential to ensure vulnerable people such as schoolchildren and the infirm aren't exposed to a threat.

Sex offenses are also fundamentally different to many other crimes in that there's no socioeconomic cause for them. A thief (disregarding fringe cases like kleptomania) who finds themselves in a stable and well-paid job loses most of their motivation for thievery. A rapist, particularly a child sex offender, will always be a threat to vulnerable people.

Its frankly pretty horrifying how there are so many internet subcultures (elements of it here, but mainly places like 4chan and Facepunch) that don't see paedophillia as a problem and express sympathy for paedophiles, sometimes calling for child porn to be permitted - and I've seen arguments on this forum before that the sex offenders registry should be abolished. Usually I roll my eyes when people claim that we have a "rape culture" - but on certain corners of the internet theres certainly an ambivalent-to-the-potential-for-rape culture.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby rath358 » Mon May 27, 2013 6:51 pm UTC

We should stop treating sex offenders like second-class citizens -> Pedophilia is awesome?

I think you are making a few leaps here, dude.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby brenok » Mon May 27, 2013 6:54 pm UTC

Not to mention, the government already has official information. You don't need a false-information-filled blackmailing site to do that

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 6:56 pm UTC

rath358 wrote:We should stop treating sex offenders like second-class citizens -> Pedophilia is awesome?

I think you are making a few leaps here, dude.


That wasn't a reference specifically to this forum, I may be reading into some things a little too much based on other stuff I've seen around the internet. The people on here tend to be good and decent people, so i may have overstepped.

That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable. You can't do that without a sex offenders registry - and while there is a sex offenders registry, it's fair enough that it should be open to the general public too, so they too can make decisions to safeguard their own vulnerable dependents.

brenok wrote:Not to mention, the government already has official information. You don't need a false-information-filled blackmailing site to do that


We already have a mechanism to deal with the false information - libel laws.

If a site takes it upon themselves to collate government data into a readable, searchable index with more user friendliness, they're providing an important service.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby aoeu » Mon May 27, 2013 7:13 pm UTC

Ormurinn wrote:
rath358 wrote:We should stop treating sex offenders like second-class citizens -> Pedophilia is awesome?

I think you are making a few leaps here, dude.


That wasn't a reference specifically to this forum, I may be reading into some things a little too much based on other stuff I've seen around the internet. The people on here tend to be good and decent people, so i may have overstepped.

That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable. You can't do that without a sex offenders registry - and while there is a sex offenders registry, it's fair enough that it should be open to the general public too, so they too can make decisions to safeguard their own vulnerable dependents.

brenok wrote:Not to mention, the government already has official information. You don't need a false-information-filled blackmailing site to do that


We already have a mechanism to deal with the false information - libel laws.

If a site takes it upon themselves to collate government data into a readable, searchable index with more user friendliness, they're providing an important service.

So by you it's alright if they slip in a few extra entries, since you can just sue them for libel after they have spread lies to everybody who knows you? Clearly they should have been taken down already.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 7:16 pm UTC

aoeu wrote:If a site takes it upon themselves to collate government data into a readable, searchable index with more user friendliness, they're providing an important service.

So by you it's alright if they slip in a few extra entries, since you can just sue them for libel after they have spread lies to everybody who knows you? Clearly they should have been taken down already.[/quote]

One libel case would be enough to bankrupt a website - the rest should fall into line after that.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Williks » Mon May 27, 2013 7:37 pm UTC

You realize that public sex offender registries do not effectively deter sex crimes, right? And that in some cases, public registries led to an increase in reported sex crime? So, all this stuff about protecting the vulnerable, what exactly do you mean by that?

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Zamfir » Mon May 27, 2013 7:39 pm UTC


That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable. You can't do that without a sex offenders registry - and while there is a sex offenders registry, it's fair enough that it should be open to the general public too, so they too can make decisions to safeguard their own vulnerable dependents

It's not 'fair enough'. It's a drastic expansion of the scope and power of such a registry. The standard way to implement such a registry is to keep it as closed as possible for it to do its job, not to just open it up for everyone.

For example, a school can file a request, saying 'we work with kids, we are considering to hire person X, is there a record of X being convicted of a child-related crime?' And the result is a simple yes/no, without further info. The registry only answers to specific requests , the burden is on the requester to show they need the info, and it dispenses the minimum info required to fulfill its function.

If you want to go beyond those basics, it's not 'fair enough'. It becomes a government-organized system to hurt the people in the registry. Which is indeed what many people want from a sex offender registry, a special punishment-after-the-punishment. But if that's the goal, let's be honest about it.

An example: when I worked on the nuclear industry, I had to go through some security checks. I had to give the intelligence service information that I would not necessarily share with my employer, and the service got to open some databases on me that would normally stay closed. They shared nothing of this with my employer, except by giving me a clearance. And my employer could only request such a check because of its special circumstances.

That's how it should be: even if the government has a good reason to collect sensitive information about people (like because they will work with kids, or plutonium), that doesn't mean it should share that information with the general public. Quite the opposite: the government can serve the public best by acting as a trusted third party, who condenses the sensitive information to the smallest amount necessary to serve the goal, and shares even that little bit only with the necessary people.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 7:42 pm UTC

Williks wrote:You realize that public sex offender registries do not effectively deter sex crimes, right? And that in some cases, public registries led to an increase in reported sex crime? So, all this stuff about protecting the vulnerable, what exactly do you mean by that?


I've already posted a case where someone who was known to police to be a danger to children was allowed to work in close proximity to them. I chose that case because it led specifically to the stricter requirements we have today in the U.K.

I've worked with vulnerable people, I had to pass that check, I was glad it was there.

It doesn't matter if the registry doesn't *deter* sex crime, as long as once it's committed you have the fucking mark of Cain on you and are never allowed near the people you're a danger to ever again. In the long run, that will make people safer.

Zamfir wrote:

That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable. You can't do that without a sex offenders registry - and while there is a sex offenders registry, it's fair enough that it should be open to the general public too, so they too can make decisions to safeguard their own vulnerable dependents

It's not 'fair enough'. It's a drastic expansion of the scope and power of such a registry. The standard way to implement such a registry is to keep it as closed as possible for it to do its job, not to just open it up for everyone.

For example, a school can file a request, saying 'we work with kids, we are considering to hire person X, is there a record of X being convicted of a child-related crime?' And the result is a simple yes/no, without further info. The registry only answers to specific requests , the burden is on the requester to show they need the info, and it dispenses the minimum info required to fulfill its function.

If you want to go beyond those basics, it's not 'fair enough'. It becomes a government-organized system to hurt the people in the registry. Which is indeed what many people want from a sex offender registry, a special punishment-after-the-punishment. But if that's the goal, let's be honest about it.

That's how it should be: even if the government has a good reason to collect sensitive information about people (like because they will work with kids, or plutonium), that doesn't mean it should share that information with the general public. Quite the opposite: the government can serve the public best by acting as a trusted third party, who condenses the sensitive information to the smallest amount necessary to serve the goal, and shares even that little bit only with the necessary people.


I consider "I have children I want to keep safe, is this person I have suspicions about a threat to them" a legitimate reason to want to check up on someone. Having that information freely available is a good thing.

In this case, the right of individuals to protect themselves and others from sex offenders is MASSIVELY more important than sex offenders not having to face the consequences of others rationally reacting to something they actually did.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Williks » Mon May 27, 2013 8:01 pm UTC

Ormurinn wrote:It doesn't matter if the registry doesn't *deter* sex crime ... In the long run, that will make people safer.

Huh? Is it about deterring crime or not deterring crime? A public registry is not necessary to prevent sex offenders from working with children, as Zamfir has already pointed out. And as I pointed out, public registries have led to an increase in sex offenses. How are people made safer by instituting policies that make people less safe?

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Ormurinn » Mon May 27, 2013 8:04 pm UTC

Williks wrote:
Ormurinn wrote:It doesn't matter if the registry doesn't *deter* sex crime ... In the long run, that will make people safer.

Huh? Is it about deterring crime or not deterring crime? A public registry is not necessary to prevent sex offenders from working with children, as Zamfir has already pointed out. And as I pointed out, public registries have led to an increase in sex offenses. How are people made safer by instituting policies that make people less safe?


It seems empirically speaking I'm wrong. I concede.

I know that given the choice, I'd want to know if someone my children or my girl were around was a threat to them though.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Zamfir » Mon May 27, 2013 8:18 pm UTC

I thought the mark of Cain was a sign from god that Cain had been punished enough, and people should now allow him to live his life.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Sheikh al-Majaneen » Mon May 27, 2013 8:31 pm UTC

0. You DO realize that not everybody on the sex offender list is a paedophile, right? All you have to do to get put on the registry is to get caught peeing an a wall. Some (or perhaps even most on the list) rape adults. I do not know the statistics of sex offender registries, but I am certain that not only paedophiles get put on them. This is an assumption it appears you work from in all your posts.

1. These people decided that it would be a nifty idea to make money off the pain of others. That is their primary offense.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Angua » Mon May 27, 2013 9:28 pm UTC

Just for reference - there are many things that can get you on the sex offender list.

Please note the ones that involve teenagers having sex with other teenagers.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby EdgarJPublius » Tue May 28, 2013 5:33 am UTC

This scam is almost as old as the internet, although this is the first version I've heard that specifically targets sex-offenders. Usually the scam is just arrest records and publicly-available mug-shots
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Carnildo » Tue May 28, 2013 5:48 am UTC

Ormurinn wrote:That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable.


Do you know who is on the sex-offender registries? Mostly, it's people who urinated in public, or forgot to close the blinds before taking a shower, or teenagers who couldn't keep it in their pants, or similar things. Maybe one person in twenty is on there for something that represents a threat to others, and maybe one in fifty is at high risk to re-offend.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Lucrece » Tue May 28, 2013 6:16 am UTC

How can someone possibly integrate successfully to society if you make it so they can't get a job, especially a non- minimum wage job?

I think registries are important, mostly for people convicted of violent crime. However, refusing to prosecute malicious sites that profit on ruining people's prospects just because you dislike the victim is a gross perversion of justice. It's a shame that the current system when it comes to prosecution is so discretionary and out of victims' hands.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby firechicago » Tue May 28, 2013 1:40 pm UTC

Ormurinn wrote:One libel case would be enough to bankrupt a website the person bringing it - the rest should fall into line and pay their couple hundred bucks to get taken off the website after that.


Fixed that for you.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Роберт » Tue May 28, 2013 2:04 pm UTC

Totally awful.

As for whether or not public registries are effective, the linked article (http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/20 ... 165016.htm) seem to be saying that by making the registries public, more sex crimes are reported. Now, the article seems to be assuming that's bad. Why? Perhaps the same number of crimes are being committed either way.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby eSOANEM » Tue May 28, 2013 7:45 pm UTC

I'm aware that this post is in response to Ormurinn who has conceded the point that a sex offenders register may not serve the public interest. I wrote this post as I read down the thread and wrote down the points I thought were relevant at that point in the thread, many of them do not seem to have been brought up and I think they are still relevant. As such, do not take this so much as a response to Ormurinn themself but rather as my thoughts on the issue as prompted by their posts.

Ormurinn wrote:
Thesh wrote:Sex Offender Registries: Indiscriminately destroying lives for the illusion of safety.


Would it be better to have no idea if an individual was a threat to others? Because when you don't have a vigorous means of vetting and barring you get shit like this.

Sex Offender Registries - Inconveniencing shitty people in order to protect the innocent.


Because people who aren't on sex offender registries never commit any sex offences. :roll:

Besides, if the justice system's doing it's job, there should be no bigger a chance of a released sex offender committing a sex offence than an arbitrary member of the general public doing so. Furthermore, as has been said, why is recidivism in sex offences so much worse than that in other crimes?

Ormurinn wrote:If you're going to be placing yourself at increased risk of theft or harm (for instance if you're hiring someone) you can have access to their criminal record - and some kind of sex offender registry is essential to ensure vulnerable people such as schoolchildren and the infirm aren't exposed to a threat.


Employers and other people for whom it's relevant can already access someone else's criminal record (or, actually, can see a report which tells them if anything relevant is on their record) so why on earth do you need a second register?

Ormurinn wrote:Sex offenses are also fundamentally different to many other crimes in that there's no socioeconomic cause for them. A thief (disregarding fringe cases like kleptomania) who finds themselves in a stable and well-paid job loses most of their motivation for thievery. A rapist, particularly a child sex offender, will always be a threat to vulnerable people.


What about murderers/serial killers? Admittedly some murders are socio-economically motivated but many are not yet for some reason we don't need a registry separate to the existing criminal record for killers. Why is this?

Ormurinn wrote:That said, sex offenders deserve to be "treated like second class citizens" inasmuch as people should know what they did and they should be barred from positions where they would pose a threat to the vulnerable. You can't do that without a sex offenders registry - and while there is a sex offenders registry, it's fair enough that it should be open to the general public too, so they too can make decisions to safeguard their own vulnerable dependents.


You and I have very different notions of justice. I do not believe in retributive justice but it is clear that you do. In my mind, if the justice system has done it's job then, as best as can be done, a sex offender will have been rehabilitated and reparation made for their crimes. Once this has done, there should be no reason to treat them differently from any other citizen (making exceptions for criminal records checks just as for any other crime).

And, no, you do not need a sex offenders registry to bar sex offenders from positions where they could pose a threat to the vulnerable because we already stop murderers, people with a history of assault etc. from being a position where they could pose a threat to vulnerable through the criminal record without specific registries. There is absolutely no need to treat sex offences differently from crimes like this.

Ormurinn wrote:I've already posted a case where someone who was known to police to be a danger to children was allowed to work in close proximity to them. I chose that case because it led specifically to the stricter requirements we have today in the U.K.

I've worked with vulnerable people, I had to pass that check, I was glad it was there.

It doesn't matter if the registry doesn't *deter* sex crime, as long as once it's committed you have the fucking mark of Cain on you and are never allowed near the people you're a danger to ever again. In the long run, that will make people safer.


CRB checks only protect the vulnerable from those offenders who have been caught. I would be very surprised if the rates of recidivism in released sex offenders in particular (given the large number of unreported cases and low conviction rate) is larger than the rate of offence in the general population. As such, CRB checks and barring is unlikely to lead to a significant reduction in the number of crimes committed whilst simultaneously making people believe that they are safe. Overall it almost certainly does balance out that they do more good than harm, but they do not protect people to anywhere near the extent you believe.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby lgw » Mon Jun 03, 2013 8:23 pm UTC

eSOANEM wrote:And, no, you do not need a sex offenders registry to bar sex offenders from positions where they could pose a threat to the vulnerable because we already stop murderers, people with a history of assault etc. from being a position where they could pose a threat to vulnerable through the criminal record without specific registries. There is absolutely no need to treat sex offences differently from crimes like this.


This just needs to be said more often. People's emotional response leaps so very far ahead of their rationality on this topic, and the result is harmful to society. Lifetime punishment for public urination (or for leaving your blinds open, or making out in your car as teens, or cetera) is insanely excessive and very far from justice, yet people seem unbothered by such collateral damage.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Choboman » Fri Jun 14, 2013 3:45 pm UTC

I'm a bit confused about sex offender recidivism. Annecdotally I've heard that sex offenders have a much higher likelihood to re-offend than other categories of criminals, but now that I'm looking up actual studies the data seems to be pretty inconclusive. What I've seen so far seems to indicate that the least severe offenses (non-violent offenses such as peeping and flashing) have much higher re-offense rates, and re-offense declines for more extreme offenses such as rape. Also, it's difficult to clearly interpret since most metrics treat any subsequent arrest (drug use, shoplifting, etc) as recidivism, not just subsequent sex offenses.

Does anyone have good data on what the chances of a rapist raping again after release, and how that compares to other types of offenses (murder, theft, etc)?

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Sockmonkey » Sat Jun 15, 2013 6:16 pm UTC

lgw wrote:This just needs to be said more often. People's emotional response leaps so very far ahead of their rationality on this topic, and the result is harmful to society. Lifetime punishment for public urination (or for leaving your blinds open, or making out in your car as teens, or cetera) is insanely excessive and very far from justice, yet people seem unbothered by such collateral damage.
Honestly this is the first thread I've seen about it that wasn't overrun people trying to one-up each other with lists of mideval tortures that they would like to inflict on such people.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby thunder2014 » Sat Jan 11, 2014 3:21 am UTC

I am surprised at many of the replies here and the misinformation/disinformation and downright b.s. which is repeated. Sex offenders have the lowest reoffense rate of any convicted criminal other than a murderer. (BTW there is no "registry" for murderers, as has been pointed out.) The California Department of Corrections & Rehabilitation, which runs the state prisons, reported a reoffense rate of 2.9%. Drunk drivers, by contrast, reoffend at over 80%. So the axiom of "once a sex offender, always a sex offender" is patently untrue.

While one's arrest record is always public record, the ongoing humiliation and punishment of annual (or more frequent) registration is unconstitutional. Registered citizens are required to provide current address, employer, car(s) driven, schools attended, current photo, DNA sample, and until the Electronic Frontier Foundation quashed it - internet ip addresses, passwords, logins, screen ids, etc.

If this information saved one child, it might be marginally acceptable. However, it does not. A reoffense rate that low, combined with the fact that the VAST majority of child sexual abuse is perpetrated within the home or the child's close social circle, tells us we are barking up the wrong tree. Registries damage families, inhibit reintegration and create an underclass of persons who can not find work or a place to live. NO ONE is safer. They also continue punishing the ex offender and give parents such as this writer a false sense of security. Companies which then take such information and disseminate it further, compound the idiocy. By charging their targets a fee for removal, these parasitic organizations do not support public safety, but private enterprise. I hope each and every one of them is put out of business. I hope the sex offender registry is returned to the hands of competent law enforcement professionals who know how to use it. With over 750,000 people required to register nationwide, it is hopelessly bloated with the ignorant, the unlucky, the stupid, the reckless, Romeos and Juliets, and a very few dangerous people (who are already incarcerated and will be for a long, long time.)

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Krealr » Mon Jan 13, 2014 7:39 pm UTC

thunder2014 wrote:I am surprised at many of the replies here and the misinformation/disinformation and downright b.s. which is repeated. Sex offenders have the lowest reoffense rate of any convicted criminal other than a murderer. (BTW there is no "registry" for murderers, as has been pointed out.) The California Department of Corrections & Rehabilitation, which runs the state prisons, reported a reoffense rate of 2.9%. Drunk drivers, by contrast, reoffend at over 80%. So the axiom of "once a sex offender, always a sex offender" is patently untrue.


Could you source that?

When I looked up The California Department of Corrections & Rehabilitation this is what I found.
http://www.cdcr.ca.gov/Reports_Research/Offender_Information_Services_Branch/Annual/Recid3Archive.html

If you look at the most recent report

Page 38 breaks things down into specific types of crimes and lists the recidivism rate for DUI as 45.7% lower than rape at 51.1%

Page 42 lists the overall recidivism rate for sex-offenders as slightly higher than non-sex offenders.

Now most of that is parole violations but the new sex crimes are still 5.9% of that and new non-sex crimes are 9.7%.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Tyndmyr » Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:34 am UTC

thunder2014 wrote:I am surprised at many of the replies here and the misinformation/disinformation and downright b.s. which is repeated. Sex offenders have the lowest reoffense rate of any convicted criminal other than a murderer. (BTW there is no "registry" for murderers, as has been pointed out.) The California Department of Corrections & Rehabilitation, which runs the state prisons, reported a reoffense rate of 2.9%. Drunk drivers, by contrast, reoffend at over 80%. So the axiom of "once a sex offender, always a sex offender" is patently untrue.


You may, perhaps, be thinking of a specific subcategory of sex offenders?

Child molestation, perhaps, given the context of your post? While they are a particularly egregious case of lawbreaker, the category as a whole is much broader. That said, Im curious as to how effective the registries are at all. Does listing someone lower their probable re-offense rate? I've not seen this particular question addressed, and while I grant it's more difficult to answer, it's the question that matters here.

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby addams » Tue Jan 14, 2014 6:55 am UTC

thunder2014 wrote:I am surprised at many of the replies here and the misinformation/disinformation and downright b.s. which is repeated. Sex offenders have the lowest reoffense rate of any convicted criminal other than a murderer. (BTW there is no "registry" for murderers, as has been pointed out.) The California Department of Corrections & Rehabilitation, which runs the state prisons, reported a reoffense rate of 2.9%. Drunk drivers, by contrast, reoffend at over 80%. So the axiom of "once a sex offender, always a sex offender" is patently untrue.

While one's arrest record is always public record, the ongoing humiliation and punishment of annual (or more frequent) registration is unconstitutional. Registered citizens are required to provide current address, employer, car(s) driven, schools attended, current photo, DNA sample, and until the Electronic Frontier Foundation quashed it - internet ip addresses, passwords, logins, screen ids, etc.

If this information saved one child, it might be marginally acceptable. However, it does not. A reoffense rate that low, combined with the fact that the VAST majority of child sexual abuse is perpetrated within the home or the child's close social circle, tells us we are barking up the wrong tree. Registries damage families, inhibit reintegration and create an underclass of persons who can not find work or a place to live. NO ONE is safer. They also continue punishing the ex offender and give parents such as this writer a false sense of security. Companies which then take such information and disseminate it further, compound the idiocy. By charging their targets a fee for removal, these parasitic organizations do not support public safety, but private enterprise. I hope each and every one of them is put out of business. I hope the sex offender registry is returned to the hands of competent law enforcement professionals who know how to use it. With over 750,000 people required to register nationwide, it is hopelessly bloated with the ignorant, the unlucky, the stupid, the reckless, Romeos and Juliets, and a very few dangerous people (who are already incarcerated and will be for a long, long time.)

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby eSOANEM » Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:17 pm UTC

Even if registries do lower recidivism (or at least make it easier to find/catch recidivists), that's an argument for a criminal record not an argument for a separate register.

The only justification I can see for the current system of sex offenders registers is if you believe it is impossible for a sex offender to ever be redeemed in which case, that's what life sentences are for.
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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Jan 14, 2014 2:23 pm UTC

But isn't a criminal registry with the ability to filter on crimes also a sex offender registry? And if it doesn't contain a filter, another site can just copy the data itself and make the website?

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Re: Company Using Sex Offender Registries For Extortion

Postby Spambot5546 » Tue Jan 14, 2014 3:01 pm UTC

The companies that made these sites aren't dirtbags because they datamined publicly available criminal history information. They're dirtbags because they're offering to remove people from their site for money. That's extortion, and it's a Dick Move.
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