Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

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trebor
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Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby trebor » Fri Jun 14, 2013 12:56 pm UTC

I point you towards:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QaqpoeVg ... e=youtu.be

and

http://www.army.gov.au/Our-work/Speeche ... Conference

and

http://images.theage.com.au/file/2013/0 ... AR2013.pdf

Lt Gen. Morrison is a legend in my book, as a former full time and current reserve member of the Australian Army, I can say that I agree with him 100%. We should be expected to uphold the standard that is expected of all of us, and I know a top down and comprehensive re-education of leadership will be effective. I say great leadership on display.

Other caused championed by the man, alcohol and drug abuse in the Army, and recognition and education regards mental health and wellbeing in the Army. Both of which have seen massive reforms and effective education campaigns throughout the Australian Army.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:10 am UTC

A huge undertaking.
I wish him and his people well.

It is by beginning that we get somewhere.
It is amazing how quickly culture can change.

With this man's leadership the Ausie Army can be Better than it is.

The Americans will not address the issue.
From what I have seen and heard a woman in the US military is an At Risk individual.

Women have told me that they Train very hard to be able to physically defend themselves.
Wome have told me that they make 'Family' relationships within the Unit.
Then it becomes Known, My Brothers will Kick Your Ass.

Women are singled out and targeted.
Not evey girl gets Brothers under the informal system.

That adds to the shame. They ask, "Why did thy not help me?"
Yes. It is so common we can type and talk about it.

It was a possible threat at all times.
Homosexual Rape is also a possible threat at all times.

That is a General you can be proud of.
Please support him.

Honor is Nobel. The men and women do need to earn the Right to wear the Uniform.
I wish you and your people well. Of course, the Creeps will attempt to tell you they are Normal.

That is why our militaries need to be made up of Extraordinary Persons.
Inside the Military not only can men behave well because they Love their fellow soldiers and their nation,
but also because they Fear their fellow solders and their nation.

The General wrote about his understanding of Rape used as an instrument of War.
He seems to be saying that no War is worth winning that way. I agree.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
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Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby Diadem » Wed Jun 19, 2013 8:46 am UTC

I saw the video in the first link before, and it's a powerful message.

I'm kind of wondering what he is talking about though. All he says is "distribute inappropriate material". That kind of sounds like some soldiers were sending each other porn, in which case this is rather an overreaction. Does anybody know more?
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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby Telchar » Wed Jun 19, 2013 4:47 pm UTC

My understanding is that it's a scandal involving them sleeping with women, sometimes other enlisted or officers, and taking pictures of either the act or after w/o consent and then sending those pics to other officers.
Zamfir wrote:Yeah, that's a good point. Everyone is all about presumption of innocence in rape threads. But when Mexican drug lords build APCs to carry their henchmen around, we immediately jump to criminal conclusions without hard evidence.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby yurell » Thu Jun 20, 2013 3:40 am UTC

Telchar wrote:My understanding is that it's a scandal involving them sleeping with women, sometimes other enlisted or officers, and taking pictures of either the act or after w/o consent and then sending those pics to other officers.


That's about the short of it.
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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby sociotard » Thu Jun 20, 2013 6:14 pm UTC

Does the Australian army handle crimes of a sexual nature by itself (courts martial, etc)? Or does it remand these to civilian courts?

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Thu Jun 20, 2013 6:51 pm UTC

It seems by the tone of the Generals written statements;

There is to be a Cultural Shift.
The way we treat one another is Going to be Important.

How this one Man will implement such an ambitious Plan is Yet to be Seen.
This has become a Global issue. Who do we admire and feel safe with?

I have seen some amazing people, in Uniform. I know it can be done.
The General Knows it can be done, too. He seems committed to the Idea.

It is, Just, an idea.

It does not, really, matter what the Uniform Looks Like.
Uniforms are like being out in Public.
If you look like Rumpled Foreskin in your Uniform, You must be injured or sick.

I have changed my mind about Military Service. Sort of. "Everyone must Serve." See?
In The Best of All Possible Worlds we will Always Need a Military.

Those are the people that know how to use the Equipment.
Those are the people we turn to when disaster Strikes.

What kind of Disasters Do the Aussies have?
The US keeps calling and asking for More Men and Women?
To do what?

Oh Heavens; What do Aussie Military people know how to do?
They are famous for Drinking. They can Drink. I have heard.

I have never seen an Aussie Drunk. I have seen a few Aussies.
I have never seen one Drunk. I have heard a lot about it.

Maybe Aussies are So Very Strange when Drunk people remember it.
I have mentioned the Drunk Aussie Reputation to Aussies.

They look down and shrug.

This is a Global issue.
The Aussies will handle it Their way.

If it works, maybe, they will help the US.
It would be difficult to help the School Yard Bully.

Let The Aussies work this out.
They deserve our respect and our support.

If the Americans are The Problem then The Aussies have a Right to restrict contact between their people and the people of the US military.
Is their Military their own or is it a Subsidiary of The US military?

Military Intelligence does not Have To be an Oxymoron.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby yurell » Thu Jun 20, 2013 11:12 pm UTC

sociotard wrote:Does the Australian army handle crimes of a sexual nature by itself (courts martial, etc)? Or does it remand these to civilian courts?


We can't let the civil courts deal with sexual assault! I mean, how will they possibly take into account the "military context" of these crimes! And although they may only be 2% as efficient at processing claims as they should be, this is good enough! I mean, who cares about sexual assault victims when we need to fight the Boers Germans Asians Terrorists? Now, we just need to extend these powers to BHP, Commonwealth Bank, Rio Tinto, Westpac and the ANZ and we'll have the perfect just society!

The less sarcastic "I hate military justice" answer is that I'm quite sure all of these are handled internally, although I could be wrong.

Edit: It turns out that you can be tried in both civilian and military courts, although I'm unsure what the laws governing them are.
Last edited by yurell on Fri Jun 21, 2013 9:50 am UTC, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Fri Jun 21, 2013 2:46 am UTC

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQBlnwrffAg

They will get it figured out.
They are all right sorts.
They are Not all white.

They do look that way from a distance.
They will figure it out.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Jun 21, 2013 7:04 pm UTC

yurell wrote:
sociotard wrote:Does the Australian army handle crimes of a sexual nature by itself (courts martial, etc)? Or does it remand these to civilian courts?


We can't let the civil courts deal with sexual assault! I mean, how will they possibly take into account the "military context" of these crimes! And although they may only be 2% as efficient at processing claims as they should be, this is good enough! I mean, who cares about sexual assault victims when we need to fight the Boers Germans Asians Terrorists? Now, we just need to extend these powers to BHP, Commonwealth Bank, Rio Tinto, Westpac and the ANZ and we'll have the perfect just society!

The less sarcastic "I hate military justice" answer is that I'm quite sure all of these are handled internally, although I could be wrong.

Edit: It turns out that you can be tried in both civilian and military courts, although I'm unsure what the laws governing them are.


I can't speak for the australian military, but in my experience, the US military courts are mostly superfluous. There's very little that couldn't be handled by the same court system as everyone else. Now, I can see in like a WW2 scenario, where literally millions of people are deployed, you might have to use military courts. That's one thing...and it's purely a practical matter. It's not that civilian courts are unable to understand the military. Merely being in the armed forces does not make these crimes really that special or different.

If anything, the more authoritarian power structures of the military ENCOURAGES misuse of power and covering it up. That's not really something you fix by relying more heavily on the exact same structure.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby DanD » Fri Jun 21, 2013 9:44 pm UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:I can't speak for the australian military, but in my experience, the US military courts are mostly superfluous. There's very little that couldn't be handled by the same court system as everyone else. Now, I can see in like a WW2 scenario, where literally millions of people are deployed, you might have to use military courts. That's one thing...and it's purely a practical matter. It's not that civilian courts are unable to understand the military. Merely being in the armed forces does not make these crimes really that special or different.

If anything, the more authoritarian power structures of the military ENCOURAGES misuse of power and covering it up. That's not really something you fix by relying more heavily on the exact same structure.


The reason for military courts is that there are crimes that are different for a serving soldier than for a civilian. Walking away from your job during a stressful period is, for a civilian, at most a contractual violation. In the military, it's potentially desertion in a time of war, which is a capital crime. The reverse is also obviously true, after all there is no situation in which it is legal for a civilian to get together with a batch of their coworkers, track someone down, and shoot them.

Sexual assault is not (or should not) be one of these, and maybe the solution is to move it to a civilian court, but military courts do serve a purpose.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Jun 21, 2013 11:53 pm UTC

DanD wrote:The reason for military courts is that there are crimes that are different for a serving soldier than for a civilian. Walking away from your job during a stressful period is, for a civilian, at most a contractual violation. In the military, it's potentially desertion in a time of war, which is a capital crime. The reverse is also obviously true, after all there is no situation in which it is legal for a civilian to get together with a batch of their coworkers, track someone down, and shoot them.

Sexual assault is not (or should not) be one of these, and maybe the solution is to move it to a civilian court, but military courts do serve a purpose.


I'm aware. However, again, those are wartime issues. If it's WW3, then yeah, the courts will probably be busy with such things. However, this particular case, and let's be honest, the vast majority of offenses, are exactly the same. Sexual harassment, discrimination, assault, etc really don't have any compelling "this is different" aspect for the military except for the chain of command having more coercive power. You don't solve that by relying on the chain of command to fix it.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby elasto » Sat Jun 22, 2013 2:15 am UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:However, this particular case, and let's be honest, the vast majority of offenses, are exactly the same. Sexual harassment, discrimination, assault, etc really don't have any compelling "this is different" aspect for the military except for the chain of command having more coercive power. You don't solve that by relying on the chain of command to fix it.


Sexual harassment? Discrimination? I agree. Assault..? Meh...

I'm reminded of how contact sports often have their own 'courts' to deal with assault. For example, one player deliberately tripping another in a game of soccer could be charged as assault if the normal police and justice system were involved - and one player throwing a punch at another definitely would be - but all assaults - from the trivial to the major - tend to be dealt with either by the referee there and then or by a tribunal issuing a punishment such as a fine or a ban of X games.

I can't really think of a time a player sought external redress through the justice system - even on occasions where, for example, a deliberate foul produced a career-ending injury.

Maybe that's wrong too though. Maybe if tv evidence shows a soccer foul was deliberate the perpetrator should have to answer for his actions in court.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Sat Jun 22, 2013 7:22 am UTC

Hell-o;
This courageous General wrote a lot about The Culture.
He wants to help guide the Australian Army toward an Honorable and Noble cultural norm.

Militaries all over the Planet have developed what some people call a Rape Culture.
He wants better than that for his people. He might get it, too.

Those people have Love and Pride for their Nation.
Some have had their minds poisoned.

This General will guide his people to a place where the people on The Street will look at them with admiration.
They will look at one another with Respect. We will look at them with Envy.

Punishment will most likely be used. Punishment is not what he was writing with Passion about.
The General was writing about the Trust The People must have in their Men and Women in Uniform.

I think he is correct in most of what he wrote. The punishments for repeat offenders may be quite harsh.
The punishments may not be much at all. A cultural sift is about what we do Properly. Not what They did Wrong.

People that have been involved with Sexually Damaging activities must have their influence on other members of the team reduced.
This man is a General. That means he is, most likely, a Ph.D. He has skills and he seems to be a smart guy. I wish him well.

How vicious and systematic the Sexual and other assults in The Us Army are a larger problem than he has and we are not addressing it At All.
Again! He gets my respect and support! Bless his Heart for caring. I hope he turns out to be as good a boss as his writing promises.

He is going to need help and support. I hope he gets it.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby bouer » Sun Jun 23, 2013 2:36 pm UTC

elasto wrote:
Tyndmyr wrote:However, this particular case, and let's be honest, the vast majority of offenses, are exactly the same. Sexual harassment, discrimination, assault, etc really don't have any compelling "this is different" aspect for the military except for the chain of command having more coercive power. You don't solve that by relying on the chain of command to fix it.


Sexual harassment? Discrimination? I agree. Assault..? Meh...

I'm reminded of how contact sports often have their own 'courts' to deal with assault. For example, one player deliberately tripping another in a game of soccer could be charged as assault if the normal police and justice system were involved - and one player throwing a punch at another definitely would be - but all assaults - from the trivial to the major - tend to be dealt with either by the referee there and then or by a tribunal issuing a punishment such as a fine or a ban of X games.

I can't really think of a time a player sought external redress through the justice system - even on occasions where, for example, a deliberate foul produced a career-ending injury.

Maybe that's wrong too though. Maybe if tv evidence shows a soccer foul was deliberate the perpetrator should have to answer for his actions in court.


I know why Canada doesn't do that; we don't have enough prisons to hold all the hockey players.

More seriously the cultures around sports have always confused me. We don't let kids watch TV with bad words or nudity in it but we encourage them to make heroes of people perform aggravated assault on others on a regular basis.

We also make heroes of people whose job description includes violence, our soldiers, although that is a little different. The violence inflicted by soldiers on others hopefully has a purpose. I still think we should respect them for their willingness to die for others, and not for the fact they are like action figures. I've noticed a cultural difference between Canada and the USA that seems quite small but is probably indicative of something huge; in Canada advertisements to join the army tend to show soldiers responding to humanitarian crises, erecting flood barriers, airlifting injured people, I don't think I've seen an ad were the soldiers had their guns out. Ads for the US military tend to show male soldiers holding guns and performing action movie poses.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby Derek » Sun Jun 23, 2013 3:35 pm UTC

bouer wrote:I've noticed a cultural difference between Canada and the USA that seems quite small but is probably indicative of something huge; in Canada advertisements to join the army tend to show soldiers responding to humanitarian crises, erecting flood barriers, airlifting injured people, I don't think I've seen an ad were the soldiers had their guns out. Ads for the US military tend to show male soldiers holding guns and performing action movie poses.

The US has tons of ads like that. The Army Reserve is especially fond of the humanitarian crisis ad.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Sun Jun 23, 2013 7:24 pm UTC

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/lifestyle/m ... 6668094794

Read All About It!
The News Papers!

What happened?
oh, It seems Rape, Intimidation, Physical Violence, Incarceration, and Torture are a Part of Warfare!


I think it may be Worse than The General thinks it is.
He is responding in a Way that may Help His People.

I wonder what He is Really Like. He is a General and He is Innocent.
That is, kind of, Sweet.

Any one want to talk to me? What do I Know about The Military?
I Know no one Knows it All.

Do you Remember the Army Adds for An Army of One?
What did that mean to You?

I Liked, "Be All You Can Be!"
I was singing, "We, just, need some Education." Boom de de boom boom. "We, just, need some self control." to the tune of Pink Floyd's 'Against the Wall'.
I Know the words were, 'We don't need no Education.' Boom de boom. I thought that was Stupid. The Rebels Within?

"Be All You Can Be."

"We get more done before 9 o'clock in the Morning than most people do All Day."

"The Hardest Job You Will Ever Love."


I loved Those Mottos. Well; They were Advertisements for Service to Our Nation.
To Serve Ones Nation does not Have To be Hell.

Yes. When Men and Women sign up to wear a Uniform they sometimes sign up to Walk into Hell.
It does not Have To be Hell All the Time.

Would you want to sign up to be an Army of One?
What the fuck kind of an Army is That?

No one reads my stupid Posts, anyway.
When General David Speaks, People listen.

I wonder how he will Implement Change.
He will Begin with Senior Officers and work his way Down?

Then Do it Again and Again and Again until it is like Chemistry Class.

What to do with Men and Some Women that have been involved with
---What do we call it? Sexual Assault?

Is it possible to Rehabilitate the individual human beings?
Well; That would be like ReEducation and That would be like BrainWashing.

We Don't Do That! Right?
Well; If a person is wearing a Uniform, that person must take Classes and Tests and do as the Individual is told to do.

How bad do You think it is?
How bad does General David think it is?

I think he may be a Smart man.
It has been said that he is a man of Integrity.

It is Touching to Me. A Military man is stepping into a Position of Leadership.

Goodness. Has he put his Life at Risk?
If he does This Thing he may have Enemies he did not Know about.

I hope not. Besides; He is a Soldier. They sign up for Dangerous Work.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby DanD » Tue Jul 02, 2013 9:05 pm UTC

I'm aware. However, again, those are wartime issues. If it's WW3, then yeah, the courts will probably be busy with such things.


It's not just wartime issues. Again, a civilian not showing up to work gets them fired. A soldier not showing up to work is a criminal matter even during peacetime. Likewise assault. For civilians, assault is assault. For a soldier assault on a superior officer is a more severe crime. Also, again even during peacetime, soldiers forfeit some of the constitutional rights accorded to civilians. Basically there is a whole book of laws that don't apply to civilians. There's also that fact that many (not all, but many) criminal acts by soldiers occur under federal jurisdiction, which frequently doesn't have specific laws outside of the UCMJ for offenses that the various states do.

I fully agree that the punishments for things that are equal crimes for both civil and military persons (assault on a civilian, rape, sexual harassment) should be identical, but that doesn't obviate the need for separate military courts. Maybe such courts need to be required to remand civil crimes to the civil courts, but they definitely serve a purpose.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Thu Jul 04, 2013 8:23 pm UTC

Lieutenant General David Morrison.

A Four Star General beats a Lieutenant General. Right?

It makes a Great Card Game.
What beats a what?

Does a Bird Colonel beat a Brigadier Marshal?
When those guys walk into a Room, Who out ranks Who?

Well? Would The Ausie have anything to say to Our Four Star?
He can't if the Four Star out Ranks him. Right?

Could You Promote The Ausie?
No! That would look Bad. Right?

Does he have anything to say about The Way The Internet is Being Used?
Only His People?

The way the Four Star Talked his Job is the Defense of Americans and Only Americans, against Terrorists.
The way the Ausie Talked his Job is the elevation of The People both inside and outside The Army of Australia, toward Earned Mutual Respect.
Mostly Inside. His Job is to Foster the Ideals of Earned Respect within his small group.

It is a Tough Concept.
Maybe I did not understand him.

Does someone want to explain it to me?
Be nice. This is difficult.
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.

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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby yurell » Thu Jul 04, 2013 11:59 pm UTC

addams wrote:Lieutenant General David Morrison.

A Four Star General beats a Lieutenant General. Right?


A Lieutenant General is an OF-8 rank, which is equivalent to a three-star rank. Keep in mind that Australia doesn't have a five-star rank in peace time — the Chief of the Defence Force is a four-star rank, and Lieutenant General David Morrison is Chief of Army.
With that in mind, HRH Prince Charles is Marshal of the RAAF, as an honorary rank (that's Australia's OF-10 (five-star) rank for the air force).
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Re: Australian general draws the line on sexual discrination

Postby addams » Wed Jul 10, 2013 5:05 pm UTC

Do you want to Gossip to Strangers about Strangers?
That is all News is.

Spoiler:
Every once in a Great While a friend will end up on The Screen.
Then Gossip with a person about themselves is Fun.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bnl1QXBid8Y

This man is a Good executive?
He does not Watch much of The Porn.

That is what I heard him say. You?

What is he Learning about?
He is Not supposed to be Learning a bunch of New Stuff.

He is so innocent. The Global Communications Network is Open to Both Civilian and Enlisted persons.

The WWW is powerful tool.
That is quite the Guy.

He apologized at the First available opportunity.
I think that is Useful.

What if?
What if his Investigative Team:
1. Start having a 'Real Good Time'?

Spoiler:
Hey! Sex is visually Powerful.
It is Like Food!
See food=Want food.

See Sex=Want Sex.
Visual Stimuli can be mesmerizing.


2. Runs into Data that is
a) Evidence of Criminal Behavior by Military Personnel.
a)1. That behavior is Worse than Chief Morrison is able to Know.

b) International Criminal Behavior by Military Personnel.
b) 2. Those are Not Aussies.

Well? At Least He Cares!!
He may not be able to Save Everyone.
He is a Soldier. He knows there have been Deaths.
He does not want to dwell on Facts he can do Nothing about.

But; There is a part of me that likes to Think that man would Care if he Knew.
He is busy. Does he do The Debriefings?

Layers and Layers of Protection or Layers and Layers of Shared Responsibility.

Do you want to Gossip to Strangers about Strangers?

I have read about a thing called The Rape Culture.
What do you know? Xkcd types know about the Rape Culture.
Not All of us; Some of us!

Chief Morrison may not know what Xkcd knows about Rape Culture.

Is that what Chief Morrison is up against?
A Rape Culture of Men and Some Women In Uniform.

That Culture may go Up and Down with a Military Hierarchy.
Who Has a Secret? Who wants to Know?

Will it Compromise National Security?
Classified. Classified. This is a Great Show!

No One is allowed inside this Room that does not have Clearance.
Who Likes having Top Secret Clearance? Then, What?

Rape Cultue? Let's Train!
How did You Train when You were a Pup?
Spoiler:
The way I remember it we Watched experts after a Lecture.

Then;
I do it. You help.
You do it. I help.

Then;
I do it, you watch. Help, if I need it.
You do it, I watch. Help, if you need it.

Team work produces people that are Competent.


A different day the Americans spoke to the issue.
http://jezebel.com/imagine-that-a-dude- ... -513445291

What did you think?
I am over here, down here in the Threads talking to myself.

What did you think? I think the Mariens have Codes of Conduct.
I vaguely remember them. Each outfit has a complementary code.

The Big Code?
http://usmilitary.about.com/od/justicel ... nduct1.htm
ech. Just umbrella stuff.
Spoiler:
Article I: I am an American, fighting in the armed forces which guard my country and our way of life. I am prepared to give my life in their defense.

Article II: I will never surrender of my own free will. If in command I will never surrender the members of my command while they still have the means to resist.

Article III: If I am captured, I will continue to resist by all means available. I will make every effort to escape and aid others to escape. I will accept neither parole nor special favors from the enemy.

Article IV: If I become a prisoner of war, I will keep faith with my fellow prisoners. I will give no information nor take part in any action which might be harmful to my comrades. If I am senior, I will take command. If not, I will obey the lawful orders of those appointed over me and will back them up in every way.

Article V: When questioned, should I become a prisoner of war, I am required to give name, rank, service, number, and date of birth. I will evade answering further questions to the utmost of my ability. I will make no oral or written statements disloyal to my country and its allies or harmful to their cause.

Article VI: I will never forget that I am an American, responsible for my actions, and dedicated to the principles which made my country free. I will trust in my God and in the United States of America.

So is that.
This may be comparing Apples and Oranges.
The code for cadets:
Spoiler:
You are expected to behave in accordance with each of the codes of ethical behavior of your own Corps. (AAC Policy Manual chapters 6,7 and 8; ANC ABR 128 – Guide to Australian Navy Cadets chapters 1,6 and 10; AAFC Policy Manual chapters 3,6,8,19,20) This means that as a cadet you are expected to:
1. treat others as you would like to be treated yourself
2. recognize that everyone is different and that differences are a great strength because you can learn from others and better appreciate each other as unique human beings
3. make decisions that are fair for everyone—this is about making sure everyone is given a fair go and has the same opportunity to share their ideas and join in activities
4. recognize, avoid and report unacceptable behavior like, harassment and bullying, discrimination, swearing, threats, violence, unsafe activities or abuse of positions of responsibility—behave with integrity by being honest to yourself and others
5. be accountable for your actions and decisions. Be responsible for your actions and do not blame others or make excuses for your behavior.
6. respect your cadet officers and supervisors and obey their lawful directions that relate to you as a cadet
7. carry out cadet tasks assigned to you in accordance with corps policies
8. keep a clean and tidy standard of dress while wearing your cadet service uniform because you
represent cadets and must look and behave in a manner that supports the good reputation of
the cadets, and
9. stay true to our corps values of honor, honesty, courage, integrity, loyalty and teamwork.

I am still looking.
Found something.
http://www.defence.gov.au/dmo/publicati ... ainees.pdf
a. develop professional mastery in technical and personal skills;
b. step up and lead;
c. be mentally and physically tough;
d. make the most of learning opportunities;
e. work effectively as a team, respecting, trusting and helping mates;
f. challenge bullying, unfairness and inappropriate behaviour, and
g. think and act ethically.

What do you think?
Life is, just, an exchange of electrons; It is up to us to give it meaning.

We are all in The Gutter.
Some of us see The Gutter.
Some of us see The Stars.
by mr. Oscar Wilde.

Those that want to Know; Know.
Those that do not Know; Don't tell them.
They do terrible things to people that Tell Them.


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