Trump presidency

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sardia
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Thu Aug 23, 2018 5:34 pm UTC

We can make hypothesises, some easier than others. Will X rebound after 2020(or gulp 2024)?

trade and market share in areas affected by tariffs/Trump policy?
Will the US continue to poach the best and brightest from other countries?
Will immigrants continue to keep the US young?
Will authoritarian/right wing governments get weaker?
Will interest rates on us debt still be relatively low?
Will R&D start flowing away from the US?
Not all of these are solely on Trump/GOP, but it lends evidence towards theories.

Zamfir, you have good points but what about China's global initiative for influence? That mimics a Pacific Union, with China as the backbone.
I'd argue America's critical imports is human capital.
I also argue that even if it's a superstructure instead of a base, the numbers involved are immense In absolute terms. Just shaving off a point in GDP growth would affect billions.

I'm surprised how realist you are about US Leadership/foreign policy.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Thu Aug 23, 2018 6:34 pm UTC

It seems likely that Trump mostly just represents himself, not a growing trend. He's just that sort of person. Everything's focused on himself, not on building things that last once he leaves.

Now, the voters that voted for him are still there. And other politicians may attempt to copy him. So the effects are not going *entirely* away...but sooner or later, Trump'll lose direct power, and then his influence will rapidly fade.

Specific predictions:
1. Trade. I think long term, trade'll work out just fine. Any trade policy trump makes can be reset, and long term, China, Europe, etc want to sell to us. If we have a power change, they get an excuse to trade without eating the bad PR of giving in to Trump. This can be smoothed over relatively easily.
2. US poaching best and brightest. Sure. Honestly, most countries try for this, and the reasons why the US is good at it largely are outside of Trump's control.
3. I don't actually expect a lot of our current immigration changes to actually fix the root problems. Assume that, say, Trump builds a wall, and how much will really change? It might somewhat affect people walking across the border in that area, but it won't change visa overstays or the like. Ultimately, if you care about immigration related problems, you probably want to try a strategy like reworking the war on drugs. Start breaking down some of the financial backbone that supports drug lords south of the border, and you reduce a lot of pressures. I don't see Trump, Pence, or the like doing this. So, low probability for significant change.
4. Authoritarian governments. Mmmm. I hope so, but I honestly don't know. A lot of people really like advocating authoritarian solutions. Trump didn't invent this...much of his voter base is ultimately comfortable with authoritarianism. That's a hard fix.
5. US economy and military might remain pretty strong. Don't see our debt going bad.
6. R&D will stay here. Bubble effects are strong. More R&D elsewhere is not necessarily a bad thing, though. If a bubble does bust, it tends to be pretty severe(see also, Detroit auto industry), but I don't think that, say, the Silicon Valley is going anywhere just yet, and many of the spin-off tech hubs are also US based.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Zamfir » Thu Aug 23, 2018 7:50 pm UTC

Zamfir, you have good points but what about China's global initiative for influence? That mimics a Pacific Union, with China as the backbone.

Pff, now there's a topic to tackle in one post... Just to be short: I think news articles tend to push Trump into articles about Chinese initiatives that would have happened anyway. "Trump is ceding global leadership to Xi Jinping", that kind of tripe. China is, fairly carefully, experimenting with throwing its weight around. They did so under Obama, and Bush, and Clinton, and they will continue under presidents Pence, Donnie Jr, and Daniels.

The result doesn't look anything like a Pacific Union with China as backbone to me, but I am unsure what you mean there.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:12 pm UTC

Zamfir wrote:presidents [...] Daniels

This thought amuses me.

One step closer to President Dwayne Elizondo Herbert Mountain Dew Camacho.

Who was still a better president than Trump, because he recognized the smartest man on Earth when he saw him (or well, trusted in the institutional procedures meant to assess such competence) and deferred to his expertise, such as it was, when it came to solving complex socio-ecological problems.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Thu Aug 23, 2018 9:59 pm UTC

And then sentenced him to rehabilashun because his policies inadvertently caused the house of cards that was the economy to instantly collapse and no one had any monies.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Thu Aug 23, 2018 10:35 pm UTC

Granted, I'm no Not Sure, but I thought the solution to those knock-on effects was pretty obvious. Brawndo could switch to selling water. Maintain their revenue and reduce their costs and watch profits skyrocket. Now everyone has even more moneys and also the plants ain't dead anymore.

Coca-Cola had that shit figured out 500 years ago, I'm surprised that contingency wasn't already programmed into the computers that ran Brawndo Inc.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Fri Aug 24, 2018 1:45 pm UTC

Programmers: "Eh, it works for now. Log a bug report and let someone else fix it if it becomes relevant"



Also, I've heard that Trump is having a wonderful effect on civility in the white house. Everyone he bumps into in the hall is thoughtful enough to say "pardon me".

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Thesh » Sat Aug 25, 2018 4:39 am UTC

So to end the week it comes out that both the Trump Org CFO and the ratfucker's aide have been granted immunity.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-cour ... fy-n903566
https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/24/politics ... index.html
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Sat Aug 25, 2018 2:01 pm UTC

Thesh wrote:So to end the week it comes out that both the Trump Org CFO and the ratfucker's aide have been granted immunity.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/crime-cour ... fy-n903566
https://www.cnn.com/2018/08/24/politics ... index.html

Don't forget the national enquirer is also giving testimony. Unless that's already in here. There's a lot of people rolling over in this thread lately.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Thesh » Sat Aug 25, 2018 3:15 pm UTC

That was old news by the time I posted.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Sun Aug 26, 2018 6:20 pm UTC

And yet, his approval rating has remained virtually unchanged for the past few months, up about 5 points since the beginning of the year...

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Mon Aug 27, 2018 12:21 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:And yet, his approval rating has remained virtually unchanged for the past few months, up about 5 points since the beginning of the year...

I'm more worried about the inferior position of Democrats in the Senate. Doing ok in midterms means they only lose two seats. That's two more years of free appointments.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby addams » Mon Aug 27, 2018 3:49 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:And yet, his approval rating has remained virtually unchanged for the past few months, up about 5 points since the beginning of the year...
...I'm not sure, but, I heard.
That number is from his party.

Folks have been leaving his party.
So,...It is a high number of a smaller number.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:12 pm UTC

It's an overall approval rating. If people are bailing on the party or not doesn't matter to it.

Approval is highly partisan, of course. At least, these days, it is.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Mon Aug 27, 2018 5:19 pm UTC

CorruptUser wrote:And yet, his approval rating has remained virtually unchanged for the past few months, up about 5 points since the beginning of the year...

It is resilient, bouncing back every time he does something really really stupid, instead of the typical Republican stuff. Then again, Nixon had similar ratings all the way until he resigned. This time might be different with the state sponsored fox media covering Trump's base... Or it might not.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Aug 28, 2018 4:00 am UTC

Bush had approval ratings in the toilet.

Nixon's approval ratings were stellar until Watergate broke, at which point they also went into the toilet. It's important to remember what Watergate was all about; Nixon had been spying on the Democratic convention in order to get the debate questions/answers in order to trounce them in said debates. He did, but it was really irrelevant because he won the 1972 election in a landslide. So why risk it all for something that didn't even matter? He barely won 1968, and was constantly hounded in the media and by his opposition that he didn't "really" win because Wallace acted as a spoiler. Nevermind that they were total hypocrites for not saying the same about Kennedy, who only barely won the electoral college but didn't win the popular vote*. But, Nixon was the guy who invented ratfucking, so yeah, ratfuckers gonna ratfuck. And don't feel too bad, since Nixon also had sabotaged the peace talks with the Viet Cong, which is technically high treason and he should've been executed for that as well...

*Chicago did NOT go for Kennedy. Illinois was blatantly rigged by Daley. Wouldn't have changed the result, Kennedy barely had enough electoral votes (unless you believe Texas was rigged too), but Nixon would've won the popular vote without Illinois

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Aug 28, 2018 6:24 pm UTC

Snitches gets stitches; Trump furious about "flipping".

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby cphite » Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:39 pm UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:It's an overall approval rating. If people are bailing on the party or not doesn't matter to it.

Approval is highly partisan, of course. At least, these days, it is.


Bear in mind, the question is usually along the lines of do you approve of the job he is doing, not what do you think of him as a human being. Right now the economy at least appears to be strong - as long as you don't dig too deeply. Employment is good, consumer confidence is good... people can overlook a lot of awful when they think things are going well.

In short, people can "approve" of the job he is doing, even if they think he's a turd of a human being.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Tue Aug 28, 2018 7:48 pm UTC

Oh sure. A bunch of his supporters justify it that way. They might not care for his personal values, but they manage to overlook them due to other priorities.

Not that I ever get polled, but I'm not certain how I'd answer that. Some things are working out pretty well. The economy's good at present, and sure, that's important. But there's more to the job than the economy, and even if you approve of some of the results, approving of how he's doing his job seems...well, a stretch.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:05 pm UTC

Is there anywhere on the internet we can see an example of the kind of survey approval ratings are based on? I'm curious to know the questions they ask so I can see what my answers would be.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby cphite » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:21 pm UTC

Tyndmyr wrote:Oh sure. A bunch of his supporters justify it that way. They might not care for his personal values, but they manage to overlook them due to other priorities.


Exactly.

Right now the economy seems to be strong, at least if you don't look too closely... unemployment is down, consumer confidence is up... so I can see a lot of people approving of that, especially if their own prospects have improved in the past two years.

He appears to have made progress with North Korea... I don't personally have much confidence that it was real progress, but it at least has the appearance.

In short, there are plenty of things that have happened during his time in office that can be seen as positives. Whether or not they can rightfully be attributed to him is another discussion entirely; but they're there; and for a lot of people they're enough to overlook how utterly repugnant he is as a human being.

Not that I ever get polled, but I'm not certain how I'd answer that. Some things are working out pretty well. The economy's good at present, and sure, that's important. But there's more to the job than the economy, and even if you approve of some of the results, approving of how he's doing his job seems...well, a stretch.


I think I would have to answer in the negative. I think a lot of the good stuff that's happened is either stuff that'd have happened anyway, or stuff that he bumbled into; and there isn't nearly enough of it in any event to make up for the horror show he is as a person.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:28 pm UTC

Approval ratings based on economic well being isn't accurate anymore. It's being distorted by partisanship. If the opposite party is in power, you'll feel less wealthy, think the economy is worse, and spend less.
https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&url=https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/08/27/trump-economy-partisan-influence-consumer-confidence-219602&ved=2ahUKEwjF5P7UypDdAhWRbFAKHfRNAiMQxfQBMAB6BAgKEAQ&usg=AOvVaw2NpKJhIKRXREApi83Yl-K6

You should not make economic decisions based on the party in power in this way. "Republicans in charge, now I'll buy a house"is a terrible idea.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Tue Aug 28, 2018 8:38 pm UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:Is there anywhere on the internet we can see an example of the kind of survey approval ratings are based on? I'm curious to know the questions they ask so I can see what my answers would be.


Hmm, looks like there's actually significant variance depending on the particular poll you follow: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_presidential_approval_rating

The gallup phrasing of "Do you approve or disapprove of the way [Donald Trump] is handling his job as president?" is pretty straightforward, but it's a broad question. I concur with Sardia that this polling has become increasingly partisan, and this probably impacts it's utility as an indicator of...anything. Partisanship and human biases form a pretty messy mishmash of problems, and the idea that folks are making housing decisions based on this...eh. Yeah, definitely not a great course of action.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Link » Tue Aug 28, 2018 10:44 pm UTC

Trump warns Google, Facebook and Twitter in row over bias. He's having his people looking at the possibility of regulation. Just another notch on the fascism tally stick. Big Orange is on a roll this week month year. Image

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:05 am UTC

I think I mentioned it earlier, maybe I didn't.

There is one key detail that every single prior dictator in history has had that Trump does not. They are likable. They are charismatic, friendly, always willing to help, father to his men, etc etc. Pol Pot was widely admired for being calm and soft spoken and always willing to help the rest of his community. Saddam in person was a friendly old man who was always trying to figure out ways to help others. To Godwin's it all up, even Hitler was friendly to his staff and those that had helped his family (including his mother's Jewish(!) doctor). And this wasn't fakery, it was all genuine. Stalin, Robespierre, Franco, all the way back to Julius Caesar, they were all in person nice people, but ultimately did some super duper un-nice things. That's part of what makes dictators so scary; they weren't the raving lunatics we imagine them to be, but the kindly neighbors we always looked up to, and when they ordered the deaths of millions they honestly believed they were doing the cruel but right thing.

But Trump? Trump's entire shtick is that he's not only an asshole, but the biggest asshole around. And it's not pretend; if you are pretending to be an ass, you aren't pretending. He is not a likable old man who you turn to for advice. He is not a respected mediator or peacemaker. He is not everyone's father figure. He won't help you get back on your feet if you have a problem.

That isn't to say that he won't become a dictator. It's more a condemnation on us, that our standards of who gets to be dictator have fallen so low.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Sableagle » Wed Aug 29, 2018 12:08 am UTC

Link wrote:Trump warns Google, Facebook and Twitter in row over bias. He's having his people looking at the possibility of regulation. Just another notch on the fascism tally stick. Big Orange is on a roll this week month year. Image

New law: Search results about the President must start with two full pages of supportive results.

Amendment: This only applies to Republican presidents.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Link » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:37 am UTC

Link wrote:
Trump warns Google, Facebook and Twitter in row over bias. He's having his people looking at the possibility of regulation. Just another notch on the fascism tally stick. Big Orange is on a roll this week month year. Image

And yet somehow, it's the Left that consists of "violent people" who "threaten free speech and free religion".

Image

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby cphite » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:00 pm UTC

Link wrote:Trump warns Google, Facebook and Twitter in row over bias. He's having his people looking at the possibility of regulation. Just another notch on the fascism tally stick. Big Orange is on a roll this week month year. Image


Every couple of years during the Obama administration, some democratic Senator or Representative talked about about bringing back the so-called "Fairness Doctrine" which required broadcasters to present controversial issues of public importance and to do so in a manner that was "honest, equitable, and balanced" as determined by the FCC.

No difference. Any time the folks in power talk about regulating speech in the interest of "fairness" it's a bad thing. It amounts to the party in power saying that people chosen by them, and applying a standard created by them, is going to decide what is "fair" when it comes to information being broadcast.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FCC_fairness_doctrine#Reinstatement_considered

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Zohar » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:22 pm UTC

Link wrote:Trump warns Google, Facebook and Twitter in row over bias. He's having his people looking at the possibility of regulation. Just another notch on the fascism tally stick. Big Orange is on a roll this week month year. Image

Fascists are really great of accusing the opposition for their own misdeeds.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:43 pm UTC

I don't think I've seen one claim against his opponents that hasn't been (arguably more) true about Trump. The latest being a twitterrant about anonymous sources of news from the person who hear "lots of people saying" things, has had a 'credible' source tell him about birth certificates, quotes often unidentified polls about his popularity and of course there was David Dennison…

It's his MO, and has been for a long time.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Wed Aug 29, 2018 2:59 pm UTC

Nate's been mentioning the Senate polling, and I'm starting to worry that there blue wave levels aren't enough to prevent the Democrats from losing seats in the Senate. (Still an above average outcome for Democrats). Every seat loss is going to hurt.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Link » Wed Aug 29, 2018 3:49 pm UTC

I genuinely cannot wrap my head around the fact that intelligent, ordinary people are making the conscious decision to vote Republican right now. Between Trump being a massive manchild and the biggest heel to hold the seat in decades, and the rest of the party's current ideology (as far as I know) offering virtually no direct benefit to anyone except rich white Christian amoral corporate vultures, I just absolutely fail to grok how anyone outside of that demographic can reasonably say "sure, these guys are cool; they have my vote". Like, practically the only way I can reasonably imagine that being the case is if the Democrats' only item is "we will sacrifice all humans to the Dread Cthulhu, so that He may rise and bind the universe into eternal torment". Either that, or a very large portion of the population is living so far up in Cloud Cuckoo Land that they actually believe "muh guns" and maintaining archaic gender roles are more important than having access to multiple independent news sources, maintaining decent diplomatic relations with the rest of the world, having a planet that can still sustain human life in 50 years, and being able to afford to have a house and family without having at least one university degree -- but I have no idea what could cause such massive-scale delusion.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Aug 29, 2018 4:46 pm UTC

Link wrote:being able to afford to have a house and family without having at least one university degree

There are people who can afford a house with only one degree-requiring job providing income? In my experience even two such incomes still doesn't cut it.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Drumheller769 » Wed Aug 29, 2018 4:53 pm UTC

Its cost of living related, sacrifice all the convenience of a large city, large job market, large cost of living for small town, small job market, small cost of living.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Dauric » Wed Aug 29, 2018 5:03 pm UTC

Link wrote:I genuinely cannot wrap my head around the fact that intelligent, ordinary people are making the conscious decision to vote Republican right now.


My $0.02:

First part: Tribal membership. To some people political affiliation defines their social and even familial connections. The human brain places greater weight on emotional investment than it does on verifiable data, it's frequently more important to vote <specific party> because parents and grandparents voted for them than because of actual policies.

Part 1.1: Republican support comes from people involved in a lot of old industries that used to have good employers. Proper pensions, paid vacations, medical insurance, wages that were (adjusted for inflation) generous by today's standards. It's easier to have rose-colored nostalgia about the past when some aspects of the past were fairly decent. Support for coal industries (or manufacturing, or whatever other industry) isn't about supporting a technology, it's about supporting the emotional response to the communities that were built around servicing those industries. The death of Coal and U.S. manufacturing isn't an economic/environmental consideration, it's the slow erosion of the places people were born in and lived most of their lives, turning one vibrant communities in to ghost towns. Trump's promises to support Coal or factory jobs (like his attempt at the Carrier AC plant) appeals to people trying to stop their communities from breaking apart.

Second part: "Every politician is horrible but the other guy is worse". Trump and the Trump-Republicans are a pretty horrible lot, but politicians being horrible shitheads has been a trope for a long time now. Coupled with the very long-standing dogma that "Government is bad" and "the Democrats are the party of big government", then clearly as horrible as Trump is any Democrat must clearly be worse. Democrats haven't done a terribly good job of fighting this line for half a century or more.

Third part: Obama fiscal policy was about coming out of the recession in a controlled manner and to manage the potential instability of economic volatility, and by all measures I've seen it was working. Things were getting better, just not very quickly. Trump's first year (as the first year or two of any presidential administration) rode a wave of economic activity from the policies of the previous administration.

Part 3.1: The previous administration was taking a long economic view towards market stability given that the housing market bubble was one of many bubbles (including tech and oil) that plagued the previous decade. Problem is to really see or feel the benefits of a stable market requires a long view, which most people are really horrible at. Trump's end-of-first-year tax changes brought about significant immediate results compared to most other (more 'mainstream') fiscal policies, a lot of people at all tax brackets got an income boost and immediate short-term results often have more impact on the brain than long-term ones.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Aug 29, 2018 5:05 pm UTC

There are lots of small towns with small job markets and ridiculously high housing costs too. That "just move out of the big city" excuse is bullshit.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Zohar » Wed Aug 29, 2018 5:06 pm UTC

Link wrote:I genuinely cannot wrap my head around the fact that intelligent, ordinary people are making the conscious decision to vote Republican right now.

If the Democrats are seen as literally murdering babies and taking away guns, then yeah - I'm not too surprised. Unfortunately I can't find a good citation for it, but I remember seeing surveys that a lot of Americans who use government welfare programs don't recognize them as welfare, so I imagine a lot of those people don't think welfare programs are important, either.
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Tyndmyr
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Tyndmyr » Wed Aug 29, 2018 7:43 pm UTC

Link wrote:I genuinely cannot wrap my head around the fact that intelligent, ordinary people are making the conscious decision to vote Republican right now. Between Trump being a massive manchild and the biggest heel to hold the seat in decades, and the rest of the party's current ideology (as far as I know) offering virtually no direct benefit to anyone except rich white Christian amoral corporate vultures, I just absolutely fail to grok how anyone outside of that demographic can reasonably say "sure, these guys are cool; they have my vote". Like, practically the only way I can reasonably imagine that being the case is if the Democrats' only item is "we will sacrifice all humans to the Dread Cthulhu, so that He may rise and bind the universe into eternal torment". Either that, or a very large portion of the population is living so far up in Cloud Cuckoo Land that they actually believe "muh guns" and maintaining archaic gender roles are more important than having access to multiple independent news sources, maintaining decent diplomatic relations with the rest of the world, having a planet that can still sustain human life in 50 years, and being able to afford to have a house and family without having at least one university degree -- but I have no idea what could cause such massive-scale delusion.


While I don't particularly wish to defend Trump voters, I think I can at least describe them. Abortion, for some of them, is actually sort of akin to that mass murder scenario you outline. Such a ridiculously large evil as to justify nearly anything when set against it. Particularly the more religious segment.

Firearms matter. I don't particularly care what you offer me, as a candidate, if you're attempting to take away fundamental rights. Now, Trump also fails this test for non-gun related reasons. The slightly up-thread bit about looking into laws regarding saying only nice things about him is a pretty obvious clue that he doesn't really respect freedom of speech. Some people care about the speech more, some people care about the guns more. I think both are pretty important, but it's not really surprising that overtly advertising an attack on what folks view as a fundamental right goes...poorly.

Gender roles I think we can ascribe to traditionalism? Folks will always like how things were, and sometimes maintain nostalgia for old timey things, even if the old times weren't universally great. They sorta conflate things like a two parent family(which is of value for raising kids and affording life) with a one man/one woman family. Fine distinctions are not made, and they pursue a reasonable goal in an unreasonable fashion.

Diplomatic relations are mostly fine with the rest of the world. Trump isn't making us into a pariah state. He's got a different model than Obama, sure, and he's a bit of an ass, but the US is sufficiently important that this won't result in any significant loss of diplomatic ties. The UK isn't going to throw out the US embassy, they're just going to float a balloon to point out that they don't like Trump very much. In terms of a cost, this is actually not great.

Multiple independent news sources are arguably not valued by very many people at all. Both sides are highly partisan and echo chambers are pretty strong at present. There's a lot more cheering when the other side takes a hit than there is careful consideration of the value of a broad range of independent news sources. It's hardly just a republican problem, it's a partisan problem.

The planet will still sustain human life just fine in fifty years. Our progress towards our Kyoto goals has actually quickened under Trump(though surely not due to any conscious decision on Trump's part). This is not a tradeoff in any real sense. It's true that priorities differ here by party,

As for housing affordability, housing is a fuckton more affordable in red areas than blue ones. Republicans view the housing train wrecks in urban, deeply liberal areas as a problem for and with the other ideology, not with theirs.

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CorruptUser
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:01 pm UTC

Housing is only more expensive in 'blue' areas due to a combination of those areas being nicer and the people having more money; things that only happen when your local government provides education and infrastructure. If the town is a poor shithole, landlords can't charge as much.

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Pfhorrest
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Wed Aug 29, 2018 9:16 pm UTC

Yeah I get sick of people born and raised in places where nobody wants to live telling me how easy it is to afford housing if I just abandon the place I was born and raised and move to their shithole towns just because everybody else wants to live where I happen to have been born and raised.

Basically "get the fuck out, I'm rich and I live here now, not you".
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