Trump presidency

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Quercus
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Quercus » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:42 pm UTC

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics ... ump-resist

The President's committee on the Arts and Humanities has resigned en masse. All seventeen of them. Their letter of resignation spells out the word RESIST in the first letters of it's paragraphs, and calls on the president to resign also. The original letter is a good read.

Predictably Trump responds that he was going to disband the committee anyway, he just hadn't got around to it yet (it would be hilarious if it wasn't so tragic).

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:45 pm UTC

Everyone on all of Trump's various boards: "We quit!"
Trump: "You can't quit! YOU'RE FIRED!"
Everyone: "Too late dudebro."
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Thesh » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:46 pm UTC

Honesty replaced by greed, they gave us the reason to fight and bleed
They try to torch our faith and hope, spit at our presence and detest our goals

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby cphite » Fri Aug 18, 2017 9:58 pm UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:I did say "more like", as in, in the direction of: Greens are generally more socialist and egalitarian, Libertarians are generally more, well, libertarian, and I'd like to see the extreme poles of the political spectrum be extreme liberty and extreme equality instead of moderately-both and fuck-you-I-got-mine like we have now, so that the default compromise is moderately-both, and the best case scenario is maximally-both. I wouldn't want either side of that divide to win entirely.


I like the libertarian platform in spirit... I like the combination of fiscal conservatism and social liberalism. Basically I want a government that does the basics but doesn't get involved with people's private lives. But yeah, the actual party is a little bonkers. They're just not realistic.

And the Greens... those folks are basically crazy.

In other words, I want something like today's Democrats to be seen as centrist, with people advocating for further improvements on that in different but complementary directions, while keeping each others' extremes in check.


The internet is largely to blame. Folks on the fringe on both sides make the most noise, and they drive their respective parties further and further towards the edges. I can actually remember a time when it was okay for a democrat and a republican to work together, compromise, and so forth... today, to even suggest such a thing drives their respective fringe elements crazy.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby The Great Hippo » Fri Aug 18, 2017 10:23 pm UTC

Quercus wrote:Predictably Trump responds that he was going to disband the committee anyway, he just hadn't got around to it yet (it would be hilarious if it wasn't so tragic).
Donald Trump is a living caricature of rich people. He is Montana Max. He is a 70+ year old spoiled white rich man-baby with all the political savvy of a toddler but not nearly as much impulse control. Has anyone baby-proofed the White House, yet? They really ought to; otherwise he might swallow a stapler or something.

What has enraged me most of all -- what is enraging me, and what will continue to enrage me -- is that all of this was obvious from the outset. Of course Donald Trump is a petty, narcissistic, self-entitled twit. Of course he operates from the mindset of a reality TV star. Of course he's a misogynistic, racist, obliviously ignorant shitheel.

Nobody should have mistaken his shamelessness for courage or his charlatanism for charisma. And if you did, you don't belong in politics. And yet -- here we are!

I hope every single politician who supported this turd gets drummed out of office. I don't care if you've recently come around; if you didn't see any of this coming, you weren't paying attention. And if you did? You put your political ambitions ahead of the very country you swore to serve.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:11 pm UTC

Angua wrote:I don't think Boris would go for it, but Nigel Farage would surely be up for it.

Boris is an anti-Trump, in many ways. Boris goes out of the way to make himself look affably stupid, but he's clearly well-educated and calculating beneath. Trump… like I said, the opposite in many ways.

(Have they yet been in the same room, together?)

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Angua » Fri Aug 18, 2017 11:57 pm UTC

Anyone else ready for Trump to go full Azula?
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:06 am UTC

I don't know what that means but I've been ready for Trump to part his hair, revealing the zipper which then reveals he's actually three dwarves, so sure, I'm ready for that.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:50 am UTC

Azula was a consummate liar villain from Avatar: The Last Airbender who lost her shit when other villains started abandoning her near the end of the show and then got rid of everyone else herself until she became a batshit crazy basket case all alone with nobody to back her.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:03 am UTC

So... Nixon with ladyparts.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:17 am UTC

Kennedy probably 'had' far more ladyparts than Nixon. And (as long as it wasn't coercive, of course, albeit that it's hard to disentangle coercion from the general 'attraction' of power) I don't begrudge him for that.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:19 am UTC

Soupspoon wrote:Kennedy probably 'had' far more ladyparts than Nixon. And (as long as it wasn't coercive, of course, albeit that it's hard to disentangle coercion from the general 'attraction' of power) I don't begrudge him for that.

Lady parts isn't code for sex. He's saying female Nixon.
What I'm afraid of is the gop will use Bannon departure as an excuse to go back to the status quo.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Sat Aug 19, 2017 2:29 am UTC

sardia wrote:Lady parts isn't code for sex. He's saying female Nixon.
No, I got the reference. I just thought I'd twist it around. (Mostly 'cos Nixon in possession of lady parts, in either sense, just seemed like an image I didn't want to persist. The presence of Pat and the existence of Tricia and Julie notwithstanding.)

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Liri » Sat Aug 19, 2017 3:30 am UTC

Polls are all over the place right now. I think it's going to take a bit for everything to shake out (in time for the next brouhaha). But, almost perversely, Trump might end up making inroads with some groups who think (or are content to believe) Bannon was behind the insane Charlottesville responses and are relieved he's been kicked out.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Sat Aug 19, 2017 1:47 pm UTC

sardia wrote:
Soupspoon wrote:Kennedy probably 'had' far more ladyparts than Nixon. And (as long as it wasn't coercive, of course, albeit that it's hard to disentangle coercion from the general 'attraction' of power) I don't begrudge him for that.

Lady parts isn't code for sex. He's saying female Nixon.
What I'm afraid of is the gop will use Bannon departure as an excuse to go back to the status quo.


The status quo of Republicans turning a blind eye to far-right supporters instead of openly embracing them would be an improvement at this point.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Sun Aug 20, 2017 6:24 pm UTC

@Corruptuser
Fair point. So it's been pretty quiet lately after Bannon left. I'm not sure if there's gonna be more open violence, or just more unreported hate crimes. I know sessions and Kelly are trying their hardest to terrify blacks and immigrants into hiding. That enables hate groups to move with impunity.

http://www.npr.org/2017/08/20/544134546 ... -alt-right
Aka sex traitors.
Many of these women came into the alt-right initially as anti-feminists.

"They were people who felt that the feminist progressive agenda was not serving them — in some cases they felt like it was actively disregarding them because they wanted more traditional things: home, family, etc.," she says. "And they came into the movement through that channel and then ultimately adopted more pro-white and white nationalist views."
Darby says. "She also said that when she is talking to women she reminds them that white women are under threat from black men, brown men, emigrants, and really uses this concept of a rape scourge to bring them in."

Tldr scare women about minority rapists and offer them the dream of homemaker... Where you teach them the joys of white superiority.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Sun Aug 20, 2017 8:17 pm UTC

Meh, I wouldn't go so far as to call them "sex traitors". I mean, the original Nazis weren't too great to women either but had plenty of women supporters.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Jumble » Mon Aug 21, 2017 5:31 pm UTC

Dear US citizens. You may be trying to enjoy the apocalyptic darkness resulting from the "total eclipse ". Speaking as an once practicing) astrophysicist, and based on as much evidence as contributed to the last US election win, may I suggest that you consider that this may not be an astronomical event.

May I conjecture it is a sign of the end times resulting from the election of a sub-human as master of the human race. Possibly, as predicted by many religions, this has resulted in the sun being consumed by the cosmic Mexican alpaca of chaos.

Enjoy.
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dont blame me because something is president that crawled out from under a rock

Postby morriswalters » Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:02 pm UTC

Jumble wrote:Dear US citizens.
As a practicing US citizen, well..................

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:11 pm UTC

Some of us need more practice than others.

Possibly of interest: Photo of Trump staring directly at the sun.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Chen » Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:18 pm UTC

Jumble wrote:Dear US citizens. You may be trying to enjoy the apocalyptic darkness resulting from the "total eclipse ". Speaking as an once practicing) astrophysicist, and based on as much evidence as contributed to the last US election win, may I suggest that you consider that this may not be an astronomical event.

May I conjecture it is a sign of the end times resulting from the election of a sub-human as master of the human race. Possibly, as predicted by many religions, this has resulted in the sun being consumed by the cosmic Mexican alpaca of chaos.

Enjoy.


I'm not even American, and this comes off pretty smug and patronizing from someone who's country decided to fuck themselves and Europe over recently.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Sableagle » Mon Aug 21, 2017 7:53 pm UTC

62.8 M out of 323.1 M in the USA. 19.44%
17,410,742 out of 65.64 million in the UK. 26.52%

Do you over there have low voter turnout or high infant mortality or are we Brits just fucking stupid?
Oh, Willie McBride, it was all done in vain.

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Hate who you hate, don't hate everybody.

Postby morriswalters » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:15 pm UTC

Sableagle wrote:62.8 M out of 323.1 M in the USA. 19.44%
17,410,742 out of 65.64 million in the UK. 26.52%

Do you over there have low voter turnout or high infant mortality or are we Brits just fucking stupid?
Brits aren't stupid and everybody from the US doesn't like Empty Suit. All I ask is that you don't tar me with his brush.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Jumble » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:43 pm UTC

Chen wrote:
Jumble wrote:Dear US citizens. You may be trying to enjoy the apocalyptic darkness resulting from the "total eclipse ". Speaking as an once practicing) astrophysicist, and based on as much evidence as contributed to the last US election win, may I suggest that you consider that this may not be an astronomical event.

May I conjecture it is a sign of the end times resulting from the election of a sub-human as master of the human race. Possibly, as predicted by many religions, this has resulted in the sun being consumed by the cosmic Mexican alpaca of chaos.

Enjoy.


I'm not even American, and this comes off pretty smug and patronizing from someone who's country decided to fuck themselves and Europe over recently.

Fair point. Ever since we democratically voted to flush our economy down the privey, and electorally decided that we preferred the four horsemen to any of the arseholes in charge of our political parties, I accept that we have probably tried to reassure ourselves that we are not the biggest idiots on the planet by comparing ourselves with a country that votes for Trump.

I totally accept that we have every reason to recognize that we have behaved like a colossal bunch of twats. Still, we didn't vote for the misogynistic, racist, half-wit, orange man-child. We have to cling to what little we have left.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Pfhorrest » Mon Aug 21, 2017 9:50 pm UTC

To be technical about it, most Americans didn't vote for him either.

Not even most Americans who voted voted for him.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby speising » Mon Aug 21, 2017 10:07 pm UTC

Pfhorrest wrote:To be technical about it, most Americans didn't vote for him either.

Not even most Americans who voted voted for him.

Everybody who didn't vote voted for their agreement with either of the two main contestants.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:32 pm UTC

speising wrote:
Pfhorrest wrote:To be technical about it, most Americans didn't vote for him either.

Not even most Americans who voted voted for him.

Everybody who didn't vote voted for their agreement with either of the two main contestants.


Not everybody. And Trump's Department of Justice wants to keep it that way. I'm helping with this event locally to help make a positive difference in voter participation. I hope others will in their communities, too.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Isaac Hill » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:35 pm UTC

ObsessoMom wrote:Possibly of interest: Photo of Trump staring directly at the sun.
Shouldn't (did) the Secret Service step in for something like this? Their job is to keep the President safe after all. If anyone else was about to damage the President's vision, the SS would get POTUS out of there.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Soupspoon » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:40 pm UTC

One would have thought they'd have learnt the dangers of the Sun from that unfortunate incident with President Dracula that had to be hushed up.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby SlyReaper » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:48 pm UTC

Isaac Hill wrote:
ObsessoMom wrote:Possibly of interest: Photo of Trump staring directly at the sun.
Shouldn't (did) the Secret Service step in for something like this? Their job is to keep the President safe after all. If anyone else was about to damage the President's vision, the SS would get POTUS out of there.

Is it the Secret Service's job to protect the POTUS from himself? I don't know. I think he only glanced up at it for an instant at a time, didn't he? The human blink / avert reflex should be quick enough to prevent long term damage from that, so long as you don't force yourself to keep looking at it. I love how the internet has suddenly become so concerned with the orangutan-in-chief's eyesight.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Liri » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:55 pm UTC

It is indeed their job to protect the POTUS from himself. And the danger during a partial solar eclipse comes from your pupils dilating because it's much darker, but there's plenty of light still coming in to damage your eyes.
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Mon Aug 21, 2017 11:58 pm UTC

Isaac Hill wrote:
ObsessoMom wrote:Possibly of interest: Photo of Trump staring directly at the sun.
Shouldn't (did) the Secret Service step in for something like this? Their job is to keep the President safe after all. If anyone else was about to damage the President's vision, the SS would get POTUS out of there.


Um, speaking of which...there was this story today about the Secret Service running of of money:

The Guardian wrote:Secret service agents are resigning and others might have to go without pay after more than 1,000 agents protecting the Trump family hit salary and overtime caps, the head of the US Secret Service said.

With more than four months to go before the end of the year, director Randolph “Tex” Alles told USA Today the Secret Service can no longer pay hundreds of agents it needs to carry out its protective mission, due in part to the size and activities of Trump’s extended family.

Alles said the agency was burdened beyond its typical presidential workload by Trump’s weekend travel schedule to his properties in Florida, New Jersey and Virginia, as well as providing protection for his adult children on their business trips and vacations, both domestically and internationally.

“The president has a large family, and our responsibility is required in law,’’ Alles told the newspaper. “I can’t change that. I have no flexibility.’’

Under Trump, 42 people require protection, including 18 members of his family, compared with 31 during the Obama administration, Alles said. The additional workload had led to an increasing number of agents resigning from the ranks of the agency, he revealed.

Without additional funding, the director warned, the agency would not be able to pay agents for the work they have already done. Alles said he had approached lawmakers with a proposal to raise the combined salary and overtime cap for agents from $160,000 a year to $187,000.

Even if the caps are raised, he added, 130 veteran agents would not be fully compensated for hundreds of additional hours they have already booked.


Link

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Aug 22, 2017 2:17 am UTC

SlyReaper wrote:
Isaac Hill wrote:
ObsessoMom wrote:Possibly of interest: Photo of Trump staring directly at the sun.
Shouldn't (did) the Secret Service step in for something like this? Their job is to keep the President safe after all. If anyone else was about to damage the President's vision, the SS would get POTUS out of there.

Is it the Secret Service's job to protect the POTUS from himself? I don't know. I think he only glanced up at it for an instant at a time, didn't he? The human blink / avert reflex should be quick enough to prevent long term damage from that, so long as you don't force yourself to keep looking at it. I love how the internet has suddenly become so concerned with the orangutan-in-chief's eyesight.


Step 1: Blind the President
Step 2: Hire someone to take over the President's twitter feed, lying to President about what's tweeted
Step 3: Enjoy

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Tue Aug 22, 2017 2:55 am UTC

Well, he managed to read the teleprompter for his "I'm not going to give you any specifics about our strategy for Afghanistan, but trust me, we're going to win this war" speech tonight, so I guess his eyes are okay.

Anyone else worried about their eyes should check out this excellent example of responsible journalism from The Guardian:

How to tell if you damaged your eyes during the eclipse

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Tue Aug 22, 2017 3:35 am UTC

ObsessoMom wrote:Well, he managed to read the teleprompter for his "I'm not going to give you any specifics about our strategy for Afghanistan, but trust me, we're going to win this war" speech tonight, so I guess his eyes are okay.

Anyone else worried about their eyes should check out this excellent example of responsible journalism from The Guardian:
How to tell if you damaged your eyes during the eclipse

Actually it'll take a day or two before people, like me, will know if there's been any damage to their eyes.

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/po ... bout-race/
Some key points in the podcast:
"538 talks how support for Nazis is still low, but support for white supremacy/confederacy is still very high among the unwashed masses. However, Congress is much less supportive of white supremacy. Part of the reason is that a lot of people are ignorant(willfully or not) about what the statues mean to America. For example, a decent percentage of the supporters just want to stick it to liberals, or want government out of their lives. But the underlying issue is that America is built upon being unequal to minorities. Taking on this issue requires dismantling most myths of America that people don't want to confront.
Approval isn't the same as racist/moral.
The only difference between Trump and Republicans is that Republicans prefer to not answer the question(white supremacy/confederate statues) or say 'it's a local issue'. Trump just strips away the ambiguity. The media should not be surprised that Trump is a racist, nor should the media be surprised that Trump's voters are ok with him being racist (and voted for Trump anyway). Liberal/progressive/BLM groups are rudderless/disorganized, especially compared to Fox News/Breitbart/Koch brothers."

The frustrating part is that Trump's favorability polls are right where it was when he won vs an unpopular rival candidate. Which means Trump will have the incumbency bonus when he runs against whatever old white dude the Democrats run. So no guarantees for 2020, but it's not very secure for Trump either. Though 2018 should be interesting. Right now, Democrats have a +8% boost to their 2016 numbers, but that merely makes them competitive to take the House. This still bodes poorly for Democrats to minimize Senate losses. So we're still in trouble.

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Belial » Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:50 am UTC

I'm having difficulty confirming this but if true, it's great.

The only one I can find info on is the Syracuse rally, which is off.

Edit: well, Breitbart is whining about it so....
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They/them

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby ObsessoMom » Tue Aug 22, 2017 5:12 am UTC

The Guardian published a few chapters of Paul Butler's Chokehold: Policing Black Men a week ago. I found Butler's perspective on the implicit racism of "law and order" and "war on drugs" talk such as Trump's (and that of many other Republicans) eye-opening.

Spoiler:
Paul Butler wrote:The chokehold is something like an employment stimulus plan for working-class white people, who don’t have to compete for jobs with all the black men who are locked up, or who are underground because they have outstanding arrest warrants, or who have criminal records that make obtaining legal employment exceedingly difficult. Poor white people are simply not locked up at rates similar to African Americans. These benefits make crushing the chokehold more difficult because if it ends, white people lose – at least in the short term.

Progressives often lambast poor white people for voting for conservative Republicans like Donald Trump, suggesting that those votes are not in their best interests. But low-income white folks might have better sense than pundits give them credit for. A vote for a conservative is an investment in the property value of one’s whiteness. The criminal process makes white privilege more than just a status symbol, and more than just a partial shield from the criminal process (as compared to African Americans). Black men are locked up at five times the rate of white men. There are more African Americans in the US criminal justice system than there were slaves in 1850.

By reducing competition for jobs, and by generating employment in law enforcement and corrections, especially in the mainly white rural areas where prisons are often located, the chokehold delivers cash money to many working-class white people.


Link

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Re: Trump presidency

Postby sardia » Tue Aug 22, 2017 5:26 am UTC

ObsessoMom wrote:The Guardian published a few chapters of Paul Butler's Chokehold: Policing Black Men a week ago. I found Butler's perspective on the implicit racism of "law and order" and "war on drugs" talk such as Trump's (and that of many other Republicans) eye-opening.

Spoiler:
Paul Butler wrote:The chokehold is something like an employment stimulus plan for working-class white people, who don’t have to compete for jobs with all the black men who are locked up, or who are underground because they have outstanding arrest warrants, or who have criminal records that make obtaining legal employment exceedingly difficult. Poor white people are simply not locked up at rates similar to African Americans. These benefits make crushing the chokehold more difficult because if it ends, white people lose – at least in the short term.

Progressives often lambast poor white people for voting for conservative Republicans like Donald Trump, suggesting that those votes are not in their best interests. But low-income white folks might have better sense than pundits give them credit for. A vote for a conservative is an investment in the property value of one’s whiteness. The criminal process makes white privilege more than just a status symbol, and more than just a partial shield from the criminal process (as compared to African Americans). Black men are locked up at five times the rate of white men. There are more African Americans in the US criminal justice system than there were slaves in 1850.

By reducing competition for jobs, and by generating employment in law enforcement and corrections, especially in the mainly white rural areas where prisons are often located, the chokehold delivers cash money to many working-class white people.


Link

While the argument of reducing illegal/minority labor isn't as popular, it still falls under the assumption that the economy is a simple zero sum game.* So no, lower class whites are still wrong, just for slightly different reasons. Though it does correlate to previous ideas that white supremacy is much more popular than politicians think it is. Maybe Trump's onto something here.

*The presence of more people in the economy creates more jobs/grows the economy. http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamespoulos ... ow-people/

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CorruptUser
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby CorruptUser » Tue Aug 22, 2017 3:56 pm UTC

Every economist agrees that more people means a larger economy, but the real question is per worker GDP.

Y = A * K^.7 * N^.3
Y is total economic output
A is "technology", which is anything other than the number of people or quantifiable capital which affects the economy, e.g., overall health, education, weather, etc
K is the vale of all capitol, such as bridges factories mines farms etc etc
N is number of people.

Immigrants increase the number of people, but they can't bring factories with them. Those do get built over time to match the people, but there are limits; you can always build more factories, but fisheries and farms and mines are limited. So the question is, do they being higher tech with them? Usually, but not always, and not necessarily enough to offset the lack of capital.

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Sableagle
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Re: Trump presidency

Postby Sableagle » Tue Aug 22, 2017 4:05 pm UTC

Anyone want to provide me with some answers to or questions for a Trump supporter?

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(Filename does not contain any exaggeration, as far as I can tell.)
Oh, Willie McBride, it was all done in vain.


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