Premise 1. There exist people who want to punch Nazis, White Nationalists, White Supremacists and other Racist Groups so much that they seek out said groups who are marching to punch them. For brevity's sake I will label that group "Antifa", but know that label is incorrect for a number of reasons outside the scope of this comment. Antifa represents a historic but also new violent opposition to Nazis. I say historic as there are gobs of historic examples of people violently opposing racists.... just not so much in the last few decades, at least not on this public of a scale.
Premise 2. There also exist Nazis (as above, using Nazi for brevity's sake though I know it's not accurate, outside scope, etc) who want to commit violence against certain groups for meeting certain racial qualities or, at best, forcibly eject said people from their homes and homelands (because if you're fifth generation in a place, that place is your homeland). They also want to do similar violence to people who oppose them (like Antifa)
Premise 3. Both groups are comfortable with violence.
From those premises, we can figure a few things.
1. Without Antifa, Nazis would have one less oppositional group and less fear of personal violence when marching.
2. Without Nazis, Antifa would..... watch Netflix and eat Cheetos.
My conclusion - It's really fucking hard
for me to take the claim that "Antifa is as bad as Nazis!" seriously. As in, I think less of people making that claim. Way less. Best case is that I think of them like their children who don't know their shapes yet.
Worst case? They're either Nazis or Nazi sympathizer and collaborators. And from there I remind you of the "joke" - What do you call one Nazi and nine Nazi sympathizer? 10 Nazis.
(Oh, re:Bob. I'm personally willing to not do business with a company who won't fire Bob. I can find another contractor, bank, grocery, etc.)
Pfhorrest wrote:I find this "morally justified but should still be illegal" position people are talking about to be interesting and somewhat confusing, as in my mind what the law should be is conformant with ethical principles.
There are lots of things that I do not believe the Government should be involved in policing, and I believe Society should instead. Shunning White Supremacists, for example - making it difficult for them to find work and participate in society... that's not Government's job.
By the same token then, it drives home the seriousness of the situation - that is, to punch a Nazi is to say "I find your ideas so repulsive, so repugnant, so vile that I am going to willingly risk if not guarantee that I be sent to jail for assault in order to make my extreme displeasure known"
It's one thing to have a talking head on a TV somewhere call your beliefs vile.
It's quite another to be punched in the face.
And it's a third thing to see people treated as heroes for committing assault on you based on your beliefs.
"But isn't that just as bad as the people in the 50s and 60s who fought integration?"
Yes. It is. That's why it needs to not be Government's job, but societies. And one of the huge problems in the 50s and 60s were that the people committing the violent acts - and getting caught - were facing little to no jail time or punishment for extreme acts of violence.
That's typically not happening here. Someone punches a Nazi, that someone goes to jail, that someone is hailed as a hero. Government is staying out of it.