Twilight?

[GhostWolfe]

Half the book is description of how wonderful Edward is. It gets tedious.

Yeah, round about the third or fourth time she described Edward's chest I started getting that 'okay, we get the point' feeling.

/angell

[animeHrmIne]

@InfiniteLoup: Um, having divorced parents isn't always a bad thing. My parents are divorced, and my dad is remarried, but I live with my mom. Yes, maybe once a year I'll find something that I don't like about the situation, but mostly that's just me being an immature, self-centered teenager. Most of the time I'm even a bit glad they got a divorce, one because I would never have met my step-brother, and two because they really weren't good for each other.

I agree with the points about Bella having no deep emotions about anything, and being a total ass to her parents, but I just wanted to throw in that this "broken families" thing isn't the end of the world for everyone.

[InfiniteLoup]

Um, having divorced parents isn't always a bad thing. My parents are divorced, and my dad is remarried, but I live with my mom. Yes, maybe once a year I'll find something that I don't like about the situation, but mostly that's just me being an immature, self-centered teenager. Most of the time I'm even a bit glad they got a divorce, one because I would never have met my step-brother, and two because they really weren't good for each other.

Sorry if I came across as generalizing. I agree that divorce can be a good thing, as usually when people stay together "for the sake of the kids" it will only hurt the children more. I guess the thing with Bella is that she starts off all depressed about moving to Forks and thinks of it as self-banishment, but then gives this reason of giving her mom and the bf space and it's no big deal. Her reason seemed like such a contrast to the way she complained about moving that it appeared to be a gloss-over of the real reason. Also, if she has such a mature outlook on her parents' situation, one would expect her to be far less naive about her relationship with Edward, especially the fact that

Spoiler:

her very early marriage to him mirrors that of her mother. When she is preparing for the wedding, she worries about her mother and others judging her, but has no real trepidations herself. Of course, we've got hormones-a-ragin', but the fact that this is a romance should imply much greater in-depth character development.

There is also no indication (that I can recall, correct me if I'm wrong) that she ever felt all that different about the situation. It is as if she has always had this "oh, whatever" attitude. The main problem is that Smeyer used the split-up parents as a plot device to make her meetings with Edward easier, but never really returned to the issue despite the four very long books.

InfiniteLoup wrote:Also, is there all that much brown in Arizona?

Yeah. Dirt.

I asked because I've never actually been to Arizona; all I've seen are pictures/TV. I guess it really comes down to what your opinion of "brown" is. Arizona dirt would be much drier than the west coast, and dry dirt is a lot grayer/sandier than when wet. Arizona dirt also has more of an ochre-y colour to it, whilst most sweaters are of the richer burnt umber variety, which is a lot closer to the west coast browns (that would be "covered up" according to Bella - they're really not). I hope that makes sense.

[kapojinha]

I consider this brown. This too. Oh and how could I forget this?

But anyway..

Has anyone managed to read "The Host" or whatever her other book is called?

[animeHrmIne]

Yes, I've read The Host. The pacing is much better than Twilight, for sure. Once you get past the first couple chapters, it flows really well (so well that it took me a week to read the first couple chapters, and 12 hours to read the last bit).

[GhostWolfe]

Has anyone managed to read "The Host" or whatever her other book is called?

Ooooh... I know that the threads gotten over the 20-page mark now, but seriously? Yes, yes people have read the Host.

I agree that it's better than the Twilight books. I really liked the concept, and the execution's pretty good in a "light weight read" sense.

/angell

[Minerva]

P.S. I'd like to strongly register a complaint against the romanticizing of vampires. Vampires are murderous creatures that drink blood. Unless you write them like Terry Pratchett or Christopher Moore, your vampire stories should end up with some undead rotisserie.

You sound like the the Christian fundamentalists complaining about Harry Potter romanticizing witchcraft

[Spacemilk]

The impossible has happened: I hate Twilight more than I already did, purely because it has spawned the Vampire Diaries.

[animeHrmIne]

The impossible has happened: I hate Twilight more than I already did, purely because it has spawned the Vampire Diaries.

Sorry, that's incorrect from where I'm standing. The Vampire Diaries was written during the Vampire craze of the early 90s (1991 to be exact) by Lisa Jane Smith (publishing under the name L Jane Smith at the time), and was re-published for the first time in the late 90s. After Twilight sparked the current Vampire craze, L Jane Smith began re-publishing her books with the new pen name "L J Smith", probably following the same path as J K Rowling in the mid-90s, and new covers (her previous ones had been brightly-colored and cartoonish, while the new ones are dark and edgier). She's also begun to write new Vampire Diaries books, and has short stories from many of her series published on her website for free.

Sure, I'll agree that the current Vampire craze helped launch the pilot into the Television series, but the fact remains that Twilight absolutely did not "spawn" the Vampire Diaries, it simply made it popular again.

((At the library near my dad's house, they have all of L Jane Smith's original books, and I read the NightWorld series before they began re-publishing. I also read Sweep before they started stocking it on Barnes&Noble's shelves again, as with the Wicked series by Nancy Holder and Debbie Viguie.))

[Spacemilk]

The impossible has happened: I hate Twilight more than I already did, purely because it has spawned the Vampire Diaries.

Sorry, that's incorrect from where I'm standing. The Vampire Diaries was written during the Vampire craze of the early 90s (1991 to be exact) by Lisa Jane Smith (publishing under the name L Jane Smith at the time), and was re-published for the first time in the late 90s. After Twilight sparked the current Vampire craze, L Jane Smith began re-publishing her books with the new pen name "L J Smith", probably following the same path as J K Rowling in the mid-90s, and new covers (her previous ones had been brightly-colored and cartoonish, while the new ones are dark and edgier). She's also begun to write new Vampire Diaries books, and has short stories from many of her series published on her website for free.

Sure, I'll agree that the current Vampire craze helped launch the pilot into the Television series, but the fact remains that Twilight absolutely did not "spawn" the Vampire Diaries, it simply made it popular again.

((At the library near my dad's house, they have all of L Jane Smith's original books, and I read the NightWorld series before they began re-publishing. I also read Sweep before they started stocking it on Barnes&Noble's shelves again, as with the Wicked series by Nancy Holder and Debbie Viguie.))

I wasn't aware it was based on a book series so... ok. Thanks, I guess. Either way the TV show is awful and it wouldn't be popular at this time if it wasn't for Twilight - that was my sole point, which you restated and agreed with so um yeah. I was looking more for a discussion of the TV show than a correction my misuse of a word ignoring the existence of books I don't care about.

*does the truffle shuffle*

[Flying_Cookie]

I was rather disconcerted the other day when I walked into a Barnes and Noble bookstore, and say a large table, which on one third had their 'Vampire' Books, and then on the other side, taking up the rest of their table was their 'Twilight' section. There was like two copies of Dracula, and probably four of five of each twilight book, several calendars, some lunchboxes, and other twilight stuff.

And the day after that I saw that our schools book-list had all the twilight books on it, and only one from much more recognized and, in my view, better authors, such as Isaac Asimov, or Tolkien.

[animeHrmIne]

Oh, gods, please tell me I'm misinterpreting the phrase "school's book-list". Because that can't mean required reading list, right?

What bothers me most about the "Vampires" sections that they're putting out isn't the fact that they're not including the classics (as those are mostly for adults, and the current craze is for easy-reading YA), but that they're miscategorizing about half of the books on the table. Every time I see a Vampire section, there are two or three sci-fi or non-vampire fantasy books there that are passingly good, and I can't help but think, "What if someone who hates the whole vampire craze sees them putting Scott Westerfeld on the table, and now won't read his books? They can't do that!"

[Flying_Cookie]

We get a list of about 200 or so books, and we have to read and do 'book talks' (discuss the book with a teacher) for about 1600 pages a year, and we can pick any book. I've been considering protesting them being on there though. One of the worst things about it is that they won't put books like Harry Potter on, because to many people have already read them, and they are kid stories.

[Brother Maynard]

This really doesn't bother me as Westerfeld and Rowling aren't terribly good.

[cathrl]

This really doesn't bother me as Westerfeld and Rowling aren't terribly good.

Aren't terribly good what?

Rowling is a superb children's author. Westerfeld is a superb YA author.

You need to not confuse "good" with "writes for an adult audience". It's apples and oranges.

[Kangaroo]

This really doesn't bother me as Westerfeld and Rowling aren't terribly good.

Aren't terribly good what?

Rowling is a superb children's author. Westerfeld is a superb YA author.

You need to not confuse "good" with "writes for an adult audience". It's apples and oranges.

Actually, it is possible to write "good" books for children. That is books that also adults like and need not sneer at due to their bad quality. I get your point, however, and I'm not saying that Rowling is a bad author.

[casiguapa]

My NightWorld copy from the late 90s is under LJ Smith, I think she started using that name before the emergence of JK Rowling.

Also, both the NightWorld and Vampire Diaries are infinitely better written than Twilight, and the Vampire Diaries tv show is actually surprising good (it also has Ian Somerhalder which helps sway my opinion) and has been a surprise hit when many actually expected it to fail (Twi-hards either love it because it's about vampires OR they hate it because they wrongly think it's a Twilight rip off).

The TV show is somewhat different to the books though, much like the Gossip Girl show is loosely based on the books as it doesn't follow the storylines and creates new ones.

Rowling is a good author, but there are better children's authors out there. I'm all for encouraging children to read, but the sheer amount of pages in Goblet of Fire, Order of the Phoenix, Half-Blood Prince and Deathly Hallows can't really be expected to be read by the average 8 year old.

[BlueNight]

@InfiniteLoup: Um, having divorced parents isn't always a bad thing. My parents are divorced, and my dad is remarried, but I live with my mom. Yes, maybe once a year I'll find something that I don't like about the situation, but mostly that's just me being an immature, self-centered teenager. Most of the time I'm even a bit glad they got a divorce, one because I would never have met my step-brother, and two because they really weren't good for each other.

I agree with the points about Bella having no deep emotions about anything, and being a total ass to her parents, but I just wanted to throw in that this "broken families" thing isn't the end of the world for everyone.

I was watching the New Moon trailer for the Nth time, and this time I heard the intent behind Bella's scream of anguish: she was agonizing over two people she liked or loved, fighting, hurting each other. New Moon is therapy for children of divorcees.

[JoeyJo0]

P.S. I'd like to strongly register a complaint against the romanticizing of vampires. Vampires are murderous creatures that drink blood. Unless you write them like Terry Pratchett or Christopher Moore, your vampire stories should end up with some undead rotisserie.

So true.

Now, I don't really know Christopher Moore...

But the 'Death' character in Discworld is awesome.

'I meant', said Ipslore, bitterly, 'what is there in this world that makes living worth while?'
Death thought about it.
'CATS', he finally said, 'CATS ARE NICE'
'Curse you!'
'MANY HAVE', said Death, evenly.

[Spacemilk]

So I watched the New Moon movie. Here is my 2 pennies, spoiled for some movie stuff:

Spoiler:

The Good: Many many hot shirtless guys. Jacob is an absolute heartthrob. Droooooool. Okay so on to stuff of substance... Kristen Stewart's acting skills have increased, though she does still have a few vacant-eyed, open-mouthed looks of "Huh?" at key points where you'd expect some, y'know, real acting. Also she gets a bit screechy at points.

The Bad: I felt there were deviations from the book; these deviations could be taken as good or bad. In the movie, at no point do you think "Hey, Edward really DID want to protect her, that's why he had to leave!" In the book, Stephanie Meyer makes a seductive case for the idea of "This hurts but it's for your own good" kind of abuse - she manages to cloak it beneath poor writing and other devices meant to make us forget that it really is just abuse. In the movie, it feels like you really do realize that sort of justification for hurting someone ("for their own good") is not acceptable - yet you still see Bella make the decision to take Edward back after he hurt her so badly. I mean, it'd be one thing if Edward had said "Hey, it's not you, it's me - I might hurt you, so we're breaking up, peace out!" but instead he destroys her self-esteem, makes her feel like everything is her fault, and then refuses to have anything to do with her ever again. So big surprise, she doesn't handle it so well.

Also, re: Jacob: In the movie Jacob is MUCH better to Bella. He physically can't tell her anything about the whole werewolf thing, thanks to commands from the Alpha, so he avoids her for a few days. He then realizes how badly he's hurting her (not something Edward did), so he comes to speak with her (not something Edward did) and tries so hard to get across to her what's going on (not something Edward did), even though he has a physical restriction (unlike Edward). Also, in spite of his worries that he might lose his temper, not once do we see him get upset or see him do the "I'm so angry so I'm going to start shaking uncontrollably and I might change and hurt someone" thing that he does in the books. And he is quite simply much, much better to Bella. It's still unnacceptable that once he voices his worries about hurting her, she's all "Oh that's ok, I don't mind if you hurt me!" Great lesson to teach kids - any potential for abuse due to some supposed "loss of control" is totally ok, because it's for luuuuvvvv! Sigh. >.<

There's more, but there's a limit to how much I like to talk about Twilight.

[michaelandjimi]

The main complaints that I walked away with after watching the film were these two:
1) Speaking quietly is not a replacement for acting! Bella actually spoke normally about once in the movie, and Edward wasn't much better.
2) Why did Edward look like a clown? Did they have a proper reason for amping up the white makeup?

I honestly didn't bother to analyse it properly, as I had very little expectations going in aside from surviving, but I found myself agreeing with you, Spacemilk.

The one thing that redeemed the film, but only very slightly, was

Spoiler:

Facepunch.

Yeah.

[Spacemilk]

The one thing that redeemed the film, but only very slightly, was

Spoiler:

Facepunch.

Yeah.

So true.

Also I will say that I enjoyed the musical interludes; the music choices were pretty well done, though it did make it feel a little teen-emo-ish. I did not enjoy the Alice interludes; I found myself spacing out and unable to pay attention fully to what Bella was saying, possibly because there was little to no variation in her voice.

And I totally agree about how Edward looked. In the previous movie I could actually find him attractive, in this movie he looked... frightening. (odd, considering that's how vampires are supposed to look - scary!)

In a non-movie-related tangent: Does anyone else find it weird that one of the supposed "predator" aspects of SMeyer's vampires is that they're attractive to their prey? Where does that occur ANYWHERE in nature? A predator is supposed to look FUCKING FRIGHTENING to its prey. And SMeyer's vampires do freak out regular people, plus the whole pale-skin-red-eyes thing doesn't seem attractive to me. But I seem to recall Edward commenting how they're beautiful to attract people... why the fuck would they need that attribute?! They can move super fast, they're super strong, they're almost impossible to kill - why would they need to resort to trickery and attraction to score some human blood? *sigh* Yet another SMeyer plot device rawr...

Also, this article talks about how hilarious it would be if Breaking Dawn actually became a movie.

[podbaydoor]

The baby kicks so hard it breaks Bella's ribs and then severs her spine. Are you imagining Kristen Stewart wearing a fake pregnancy belly and pretending to have been suddenly crippled by her own fetus? Because I am and it's making me laugh and laugh and laugh.

In a moment that demands to be shown on the silver screen, Edward gives Bella an emergency C-section with his fucking teeth. It's like something out of XTro, for the love of God. It's so horrible it's brilliant, and this scene alone is why I remain firm in declaring that David Cronenberg must direct Breaking Dawn. This is surely his movie.

Yes.

[Kag]

In a non-movie-related tangent: Does anyone else find it weird that one of the supposed "predator" aspects of SMeyer's vampires is that they're attractive to their prey? Where does that occur ANYWHERE in nature? A predator is supposed to look FUCKING FRIGHTENING to its prey. And SMeyer's vampires do freak out regular people, plus the whole pale-skin-red-eyes thing doesn't seem attractive to me. But I seem to recall Edward commenting how they're beautiful to attract people... why the fuck would they need that attribute?! They can move super fast, they're super strong, they're almost impossible to kill - why would they need to resort to trickery and attraction to score some human blood? *sigh* Yet another SMeyer plot device rawr...

Actually that's a really old vampire thing. They're super bad-ass and unstoppable, but they're a devil analog. They are totally incapable of attacking you if you don't let them in. The have to trick you.

Of course, it still falls apart completely in SMeyer's world.

[Spacemilk]

In a non-movie-related tangent: Does anyone else find it weird that one of the supposed "predator" aspects of SMeyer's vampires is that they're attractive to their prey? Where does that occur ANYWHERE in nature? A predator is supposed to look FUCKING FRIGHTENING to its prey. And SMeyer's vampires do freak out regular people, plus the whole pale-skin-red-eyes thing doesn't seem attractive to me. But I seem to recall Edward commenting how they're beautiful to attract people... why the fuck would they need that attribute?! They can move super fast, they're super strong, they're almost impossible to kill - why would they need to resort to trickery and attraction to score some human blood? *sigh* Yet another SMeyer plot device rawr...

Actually that's a really old vampire thing. They're super bad-ass and unstoppable, but they're a devil analog. They are totally incapable of attacking you if you don't let them in. The have to trick you.

Of course, it still falls apart completely in SMeyer's world.

Ahhh true, I forgot about the old "you must invite a vampire in" thing. But being attractive made sense because vampires couldn't come out during the day, just during the night, when most people were indoors, so they DID have to have something to help persuade those suspicious humans to invite them in. Hence attractiveness and thus temptation, which furthers the devil analogy.

But yeah, in SMeyer's universe that falls apart, because (a) vampires can go outside during the day as long as they follow the Volturi's rules and don't reveal themselves to everyone, and (b) I don't recall a single instance where they had to be invited in; in fact Edward's creepy stalkerish "watching Bella while she sleeps" happyfuntimes never involved him being "invited in". In such a universe there is no reason to evolve such that you attract your prey; in fact it would be a negative to do so, because such attractiveness might draw too much attention to you.

[Kendo_Bunny]

12. In Which Death Threats are the Best Possible Foreplay

“"We get permits early on the razz," Jacob said” Do they call reservations ‘razz’? I honestly have no idea…

"I have to get around somehow." I recognized Billy's resonant voice easily, despite the years. Pg 112, another inappropriate italicization. Also, you had completely forgotten that this guy existed, because remembering going fishing with your father and his Injun friend was too painful for you to remember. It’s good to know Bella was always a self-centered little brat, though. It’s not just caused by Edward.

“Then I stood in the door, watching anxiously as Charlie and Jacob helped Billy out of the car and into his wheelchair.” If Bella hadn’t already been established as an absolute monster of selfishness, this could be read charitably. Instead, she’s anxious that Billy is going to tell her it’s a bad idea to date a cannibalistic undead creature and might tell her dad that she’s going around with a murderer. Fun fact – you know who else thought he was only killing the bad people? Hitler.

“Jacob scowled and ducked his head while I fought back a surge of remorse.” Liar. If you were capable of feeling remorse, you wouldn’t spend half your time jerking around his fuzzy little heart.

“"Naw, we ate just before we came," Jacob answered.
"How about you, Charlie?" I called over my shoulder as I fled around the corner.
"Sure," he replied, his voice moving in the direction of the front room and the TV.” Wait, I thought she wasn’t supposed to call him Charlie to his face, because it hurt his feelings. This could be a signal that Charlie doesn’t really care, but since he’s been nothing but caring, this seems more like a mistake.

“"So, how are things?" Jacob asked.
"Pretty good." I smiled. His enthusiasm was hard to resist. "How about you? Did you finish your car?" Wait, what? What enthusiasm? This isn’t even good telling, not showing, because we aren’t told he’s enthusiastic until this moment, and he shows no signs of particular enthusiasm at all during this scene.

“"I think Charlie chewed him out pretty good last time. They haven't spoken much since — tonight is sort of a reunion, I think. I don't think he'd bring it up again."” I think this is more establishing that white people are more reasonable than Native Americans. Billy Black knows what the Cullens are, and is suspicious of them. Charlie only sees Carlisle being a nice ol’ doc, and thinks they’re just so wonderful that he got into a screaming fight with his best friend over how wonderful they are. Maybe this whole family is just unnaturally attracted to the sparklepires… it would explain why laid-back Charlie would form such a strong opinion of how salt of the earth Carlisle is, and why the whole family must then be good. Also… we were told nothing of a coolness between Billy and Charlie. They were fishing together in the beginning of the book.

“pretending to watch the game while Jacob chattered at me. I was really listening to the men's conversation, watching for any sign that Billy was about to rat me out, trying to think of ways to stop him if he began.” I understand she’s worried, but she’s such a disrespectful little puke that I want to smack her.

“"Are you and your friends coming back to the beach soon?" Jacob asked as he pushed his father over the lip of the threshold.” ??? What does that even mean?

“"You take care, Bella," he added seriously.
"Thanks," I muttered, looking away.” GAW. How could he like act like I might need to take some care? Just because my boyfriend has told me that he wants to eat me.

“"Um… Mike Newton," I told him reluctantly.” Why is she so reluctant? Every time she tells him about one of her “friends”, he makes a positive comment about their family and goes along. Maybe she wanted to pretend that Mike’s family was a baby-eating Neo-Nazi group, so she could feel better about shunning him.

“I hurried so I would be ready to go the second Charlie left. I had my bag ready, shoes on, teeth brushed, but even though I rushed to the door as soon as I was sure Charlie would be out of sight, Edward was faster. He was waiting in his shiny car, window down, engine off.” Why are they sneaking around? WHY?! It makes no logical sense! Charlie thinks the Cullens are the nicest people in town! He got into an argument with his best friend over just how super-wonderful they are! So why in the names of all the gods that have ever been named are these two little brats playing out their “forbidden” fantasy as if it’s actually legitimate?

“He grinned his crooked smile at me, stopping my breath and my heart. I couldn't imagine how an angel could be any more glorious.” So… anyone else realize that there is no actual description of Edward? He’s pale, red haired, golden eyed, and has lean muscles and a crooked mouth. Nothing else. He’s just Gee Willikers BYOOTIFUL THOUGH!!!

“There was nothing about him that could be improved upon.” How about his personality?

“"How did you sleep?" he asked. I wondered if he had any idea how appealing his voice was.
"Fine. How was your night?"
"Pleasant." His smile was amused; I felt like I was missing an inside joke.” Good God. That is all kinds of levels of creepy.

“"Can I ask what you did?" I asked.
"No." He grinned. "Today is still mine."” The day is always yours, Sparkle-pants. She got to ask about five questions, you get to spend two days asking every single random thought that comes into your head, and when she dares to protest, you get mad and sulk.

“embarrassing me when he asked about boys I'd dated. I was relieved that I'd never really dated anyone, so that particular conversation couldn't last long.” You know, you don’t have to answer any of his questions. The only question he’s really entitled to ask you about your previous romantic history is whether you have any venereal diseases.

“"So you never met anyone you wanted?" he asked in a serious tone that made me wonder what he was thinking about.
I was grudgingly honest. "Not in Phoenix."” Why wonder what he’s thinking about? He’s just found another way to control you.

“His lips pressed together into a hard line.” It makes me so mad that you like me! How dare you!?

“"That’s okay, it's not that far of a walk."
He frowned at me impatiently. "I'm not going to make you walk home. We'll go get your truck and leave it here for you."” You know, I would be really uncomfortable with that. My boyfriend has driven my car without me in it, but we’ve been dating for a long time, and he doesn’t drive like Batman on his way to foil the Joker. Also, Edward just keeps on showing how unreasonable he is, by making a simple day much more complicated because he has to have her totally in his control for an extra 10 minutes a day.

“"I don't have my key with me," I sighed. "I really don't mind walking." What I minded was losing my time with him.” I weep for her. This poor deluded little fool.

“"All right," I agreed, pursing my lips. I was pretty sure my key was in the pocket of a pair of jeans I wore Wednesday, under a pile of clothes in the laundry room. Even if he broke into my house, or whatever he was planning, he'd never find it. He seemed to feel the challenge in my consent. He smirked, overconfident.” She seems quite okay with the idea of him breaking into her house. I wonder why her dad doesn’t have Brint or something.

“I refused to be convinced to fear him, no matter how real the danger might be. It doesn't matter, I repeated in my head.” You idiot. OF COURSE THE DANGER MATTERS! HE WANTS TO KILL YOU!

“"What time will I see you tomorrow?" I asked, already depressed by the thought of him leaving now.” Wow, co-dependent much?

“His voice turned sharp. "And if you don't come home, what will he think?"
"I have no idea," I answered coolly. "He knows I've been meaning to do the laundry. Maybe he'll think I fell in the washer."” He has just threatened to kill you again. How insane does one have to be to answer that with a stupid joke?

“He scowled at me and I scowled back. His anger was much more impressive than mine.” She’s even fascinated by his anger. Which will make it that much easier for him to become a woman-beating lout. Or, you know, to kill her, which he just admitted that he was very likely to do.

“He seemed bemused by my casual reference to his secret realities.” That is a terrible line. Nothing special, I just wanted to call all my reader’s attention to the fact that this line is awful.

“They sat staring off in different directions, exactly the same as the first time I'd seen them.” *snerk* I just got a mental image of all of them facing different directions with fish-stares. No wonder no one wants to talk to the Cullens.

“"They don't understand why I can't leave you alone."
I grimaced. "Neither do I, for that matter."” How I wish that was a Meta-Bella line, instead of a low self-esteem line.

“"I have a better than average grasp of human nature. People are predictable. But you… you never do what I expect. You always take me by surprise."” First off, no you really don’t. Edward knows nothing about humans. At all. Second off, she only takes him by surprise because he isn’t in her head 100% of the time. If I knew what was going to happen right before it happened, I would think people were predictable too. But he doesn’t know people’s patterns because he knows human nature – he knows because he’s a mind-reader. I think SMeyer was going for a Charles Xavier thing, except Professor X does have a terrific grasp of human nature.

“I felt his eyes on my face but I couldn't look at him yet, afraid he might read the chagrin in my eyes.” YOU ARE NOT CHAGRINED!

“I looked back at Edward — and I knew he could see the confusion and fear that widened my eyes.” So she is capable of being afraid of people who want to kill her… if she doesn’t want to do them.

“I realized slowly that his words should frighten me. I waited for that fear to come, but all I could seem to feel was an ache for his pain.” This is supposed to show that they have a real loving love, but instead, it just makes her look stupid.

“her short, inky hair in a halo of spiky disarray around her exquisite, elfin face” That is terrible description. It’s more flowery than a funeral and a wedding being held in the same place.

“Her slight frame was willowy” *eye roll* Was it also slender?

“"Safe in Forks — what a challenge."
"For you it is a challenge." His jaw hardened. "Promise."” DO WHAT I SAY WEAK WOMAN THING!

“And Edward was worried about the time we'd spent together publicly… if things went wrong. I refused to dwell on the last thought, concentrating instead on making things safer for him.” So instead, you’re going to try to throw suspicion of your murder around a little bit so that he has plenty of time to get away. That’s sweet of you.

“My decision was made, made before I'd ever consciously chosen, and I was committed to seeing it through. Because there was nothing more terrifying to me, more excruciating, than the thought of turning away from him. It was an impossibility.” No, it’s not. You’re just a weak-willed baby who is easily swayed by a pretty face and a bad attitude.

“The lies came more naturally than usual, I noted with surprise.” There’s a good lesson for young girls. Lie! It gets easier the more you do it!

“"You know, you could come to the dance with our group anyway — that would be cool. We'd all dance with you," he promised.
The mental image of Jessica's face made my tone sharper than necessary.
"I'm not going to the dance, Mike, okay?"
"Fine." He sulked again. "I was just offering."” My God, this girl is an ungrateful bitch. Mike is being really, really nice. He thinks she doesn’t want to go because she wouldn’t be able to dance with people, so he says that she can come with the group and everyone will dance. I don’t see him actually sulking, but being rather hurt that she’s getting all snappish with him when he just offered to do something nice.

“The sound of the truck roaring to life frightened me. I laughed at myself.” Chicks, huh?

“Following the same instinct that had prompted me to lie to Mike, I called Jessica on the pretense of wishing her luck at the dance. When she offered the same wish for my day with Edward, I told her about the cancellation.” Got to give him that alibi so my murder is never solved, or better yet, thrown upon an innocent bystander! I hope they get the chair!

“She was more disappointed than really necessary for a third-party observer to be.” Maybe she’s just being sympathetic that this guy that you really, really like has suddenly flaked on you, and is sad that her instincts about Edward being a no-good-nik were accurate.

“I felt so guilty for deceiving him that I almost took Edward's advice and told him where I would be. Almost.” Aw, Dad, I hope they don’t accuse you of my murder.

“He wants me to be safe, I told myself again and again. I would just hold on to the faith that, in the end, that desire would win out over the others. And what was my other choice — to cut him out of my life? Intolerable. Besides, since I'd come to Forks, it really seemed like my life was about him.
But a tiny voice in the back of my mind worried, wondering if it would hurt very much… if it ended badly.” This clinches it. Bella is insane, and would probably be one of those women who marries serial killers in prison because only she understands him. She would have fit in very well with the Manson family, if only Charles were more handsome.


“I knew I was far too stressed to sleep, so I did something I'd never done before. I deliberately took unnecessary cold medicine — the kind that knocked me out for a good eight hours. I normally wouldn't condone that type of behavior in myself, but tomorrow would be complicated enough without me being loopy from sleep deprivation on top of everything else. While I waited for the drugs to kick in, I dried my clean hair till it was impeccably straight, and fussed over what I would wear tomorrow.” O.O So this book also condones drug use, if it’s for an important reason, like looking really pretty the next day. Thank God Bella is naturally skinny, otherwise we might get ‘I threw up dinner’ or ‘I didn’t eat for three days’.

“I woke early, having slept soundly and dreamlessly thanks to my gratuitous drug use.” And she just keeps hammering away that it was totally okay for her to take drugs in a manner inconsistent with their directions.

“He wasn't smiling at first — his face was somber.” Good morning, Bella. I’ve come to kill you. Do you mind if we drive to the coast, so I can throw your corpse into the sea?

“"Good morning," he chuckled.
"What's wrong?" I glanced down to make sure I hadn't forgotten anything important, like shoes, or pants.” So she knows that he only laughs at people.

“"We match." He laughed again.” I have an uncomfortable feeling that he did that on purpose while she was sleeping her drugged sleep.

“I laughed with him, hiding a secret twinge of regret — why did he have to look like a runway model when I couldn't?” It’s all about looks.

“He waited by the passenger door with a martyred expression that was easy to understand.” No, it’s really not. You’ve never been shown as anything but a good driver, so why is it such a sacrifice? It’s just because he can’t control your movements.

“"We're hiking?" Thank goodness I'd worn tennis shoes.
"Is that a problem?" He sounded as if he'd expected as much.” Because Bella’s no good unless she’s being carried around like a child.

“We drove in silence for a while as I contemplated the coming horror.” Bella is a whining baby, blah blah, you know the rest.

“"What are you thinking?" he asked impatiently after a few moments.” I can’t stand five seconds of silence!

“"But Jessica thinks we're going to Seattle together?" He seemed cheered by the idea.
"No, I told her you canceled on me — which is true."
"No one knows you're with me?" Angrily, now.” Well, for once he has a bit of a right to be angry… except the whole forcing his presence on her when he should have the cojones to stay away.

“"Are you so depressed by Forks that it's made you suicidal?" he demanded when I ignored him.
"You said it might cause trouble for you… us being together publicly," I reminded him.
"So you're worried about the trouble it might cause me —if you don't come home ?" His voice was still angry, and bitingly sarcastic.” I haven’t threatened to murder you enough times this morning! Really, Edward is the only person in this book more selfish than Bella. Also, the italics are really weird there.

“We were silent for the rest of the drive. I could feel the waves of infuriated disapproval rolling off of him, and I could think of nothing to say.” He has no right to disapprove. If he wanted, he could call anyone and tell them where you are, because I can’t imagine that he doesn’t have a cell phone. But instead, he’s mad that he might actually have to make a conscious decision not to murder her (trust me, I have a lot of sympathy for that urge), instead of just not murdering her because someone would be sure to know it was him.

“afraid because he was angry with me and I didn't have driving as an excuse not to look at him.” You should never be afraid of your SO.

“"I won't let you get lost." He turned then, with a mocking smile, and I stifled a gasp.” Edward appears half-naked in front of her, so that she’d follow him to the ends of the earth, because she is the most sexually frustrated girl alive.

“It wasn't as hard as I had feared.” Nothing ever is.

“I tried to keep my eyes away from his perfection as much as possible, but I slipped often. Each time, his beauty pierced me through with sadness.” If Edward knew as much about human nature as he claims, he would know that all girls feel ugly at some points. There isn’t a girl alive who is 100% secure in her appearance all the time, and standing next to a nearly shirtless supermodel probably doesn’t help.

“He asked about my birthdays, my grade school teachers, my childhood pets — and I had to admit that after killing three fish in a row, I'd given up on the whole institution. He laughed at that, louder than I was used to — bell-like echoes bouncing back to us from the empty woods.” The death of helpless animals is funny! Also, why her grade school teachers? WHY? It makes no sense.

[Marbas]

Read Sweep before they started stocking it on Barnes&Noble's shelves again

Oh god Sweep! I remember reading Sweep when I was in middle school. I was going through a neo-pagan phase at the time too. I remember the books portrayal of Wicca to be one that confused me greatly.

Those were some special years.

[AwesomeJosh]

"Today, while reading my Bible I found that Isaiah 1:14 says 'I hate your new moon festivals and your appointed feasts, They have become a burden to Me;I am weary of bearing them.' Even God hates Twilight."

[GraphiteGirl]

This is pretty much all that needs to be said about the New Moon film. Here's a highlight:

TAYLOR LAUTNER

Hmm. Maybe if I show you how loyal I am and offer you an endless supply of support without any kind of pressure you'll eventually come to rely on me and that reliance will slowly morph into romantic feelings!

KRISTEN STEWART

Maybe! That's worked for lots of guys, just ask any forum on the internet!

Also, this:

GIRLS IN AUDIENCE

(swooning)

No wonder boys hate Twilight! Nobody can be as perfect as Edward!

BOYS IN AUDIENCE

Are you kidding? We love Twilight! It teaches the next generation of women that, the worse their men treat them, the more in love they should be.

GIRLS IN AUDIENCE

You're right! Want to buy me another movie ticket?

BOYS IN AUDIENCE

Buy your own goddamn ticket you stupid cunt.

WOMEN IN AUDIENCE

(swoon)

[Alder]

A) Thanks for another piece of the review, Kendo_Bunny. Made me chuckle.

B) Heh, I've just left someone reading that Cracked article.

[aleflamedyud]

While it's uproariously entertaining to make fun of the movie, especially while all the fans are on the edge of their seats nearing tears, I do understand Rat's point. I went to Twilight when it came out in theaters because my sister asked me to take her. I was in hysterics for the entire movie (it was so ridiculous, who wouldn't be)- pulling faces at the characters, whispering loudly, "Well THAT's not creepy," basic accommodations for such trash. Looking back, pissing off the teenage girls around me who were such avid fans made me slightly guilty. It wasn't accomplishing anything other than irritating them, it didn't provide any logical arguments as to why the series is unhealthy, it just ruined their "experience." So, do what you like, but keep in mind you'll be viewed as a jackass.

Well then that's a good thing, because as far as I can tell Twilight fans like total jackass douchebag men.

[podbaydoor]

Unfortunately they only like jackass douchebag men with marble chests.

[aleflamedyud]

Unfortunately they only like jackass douchebag men with marble chests.

And once again, hot people are forgiven all their flaws. Goddamn it.

[Spacemilk]

Unfortunately they only like jackass douchebag men with marble chests.

And once again, hot people are forgiven all their flaws. Goddamn it.

The irony is, ice-cold bodies that are as unyielding as marble are now sexy and cuddly. Get your "Medusa'd" look on today and pick up the ladies!

[Ixtellor]

Is anyone else horrifed that the Shakespere thread has 40 posts and the Twilight thread has over 900?

I am not an innocent here, as I threw in my bashes 20 pages ago, but ACK!

Ixtellor

P.S. I realize the irony of me posting it in the thread.

[Kendo_Bunny]

Considering that almost every post is pointing out the blatant inferiority of Twilight...

Twilight-bashing is fun. One of my professors asked me to write something to give to her daughter's school on why Twilight is not appropriate for 3rd graders.

[Spacemilk]

Considering that almost every post is pointing out the blatant inferiority of Twilight...

Twilight-bashing is fun. One of my professors asked me to write something to give to her daughter's school on why Twilight is not appropriate for 3rd graders.

That's got to be tough, because you've got to focus on why it's bad for THIRD graders, rather than the truth which is that it's bad for (FILL IN THE BLANK) graders...

[Alder]

Buffy V Edward. Enjoy...

[JCM]

"Today, while reading my Bible I found that Isaiah 1:14 says 'I hate your new moon festivals and your appointed feasts, They have become a burden to Me;I am weary of bearing them.' Even God hates Twilight."

Wow, the Bible can be applied to everyday life. I have hope again!

[Lumiex]

A shiny albino boy with pointy teeth that sparkles is not a vampire.
A dark colored Indian boy that suddenly crawls onto all fours and becomes hairy just has a sickening gene mutation.

Twilight equals fail.