Gamers: The inverted Y-axis poll

[philsov]

always. I played too many flight sims when I was younger that for anything in first person, it's inverse or I simply fumble around the place and likely die.

[Cheshire_Cat]

I would say no, as for flight sims I use a Joystick (for military sims) and used to use a yoke and pedals (for civvy sims [read as- sitting in front of autopilot as you potter across the atlantic]). I used to invert on consoles, but after a break from the world of FPS/TPS I found myself returning to find inverting alien to me. So no it is (as I don't use a mouse for flight sims)

[some kid]

Never Inverted. I grew up playing continuum http://getcontinuum.com/ for years, not until Call of Duty:4 did I delve into fight sims, it felt better pushing forward on the controller to move my view up. I suppose it is because I see the controller as the link in between my self and the one I am controlling. Since most games have you looking upwards as you run forward it also felt more comfortable to push both left and right analog stick forward compared to one back and one forward.

[jahwn lemonjello]

I think that up should be up and down should be down (I don't play many computer games; when I do I do non.)

[Xanthir]

I have *finally* gotten myself retrained onto non-inverted, since several games I have recently bought only allow me to invert the Y, not the X. Inverting a single axis is clearly batshit insane, so I just bit the bullet and remade my reflexes.

[Stay_Puft_marshmallows]

oddly enough I don't invert with a mouse and keyboard but I do invert with a console controller.

[Oktalist]

Mouse inverters, do you also have the y-axis inverted when using the mouse for its original purpose of directing a pointer arrow to select widgets in a desktop GUI

But seriously, "directing a pointer to select widgets" is so close to "directing a crosshair to select what to shoot at"; that's why I can't understand inverting the mouse. I have friends who played a lot of Duke3D in the past, so they still invert now, which is a major pain when playing hotseat style, taking turns on one PC and having to keep toggling the option.

I would've voted "only on flight sims" but... who uses a mouse to fly a plane?

[hotaru]

I would've voted "only on flight sims" but... who uses a mouse to fly a plane?

in most flight sims i've had any experience, there's only one y-axis setting that applies to both mouse and joystick.

[Oktalist]

Playing a flight sim with a joystick, I think pushing forwards to pitch down can correctly be called non-inverted, because that's obviously how it works in a real plane.

And I gotta agree with mousewheel scroll down to select next weapon, up to select previous, just like selecting next or previous page/paragraph/line/whatever in a document.

[headprogrammingczar]

I prefer wheel-up/down to be zoom, so if I am sniping, wheel-up to zoom in, wheel-down to zoom out.

[Welsh Mullet]

I don't invert, that is, i play up is up. I hate it when up is down, even when it's just for flying. Really throws me off. Just got BF:BC2 for the xbox, and i know its different with sticks, but i could not fly a chopper inverted.

[ZeroSkulleton]

You all fail it. Inversion is more realistic.

When looking up, you pull your head back. When looking down, you push it forward. Not the other way. Nod a few times Up and Down, and then Left to Right, and you'll see why Inverted Y-Axis is the way to go.

[Unbeliever]

Flight sims only. I don't care if you think it's more "realistic" when the y-axis is inverted. I'm used to playing with it normal, and I don't care to take the time to switch to inversion. There's no point. It doesn't magically make the game easier or anything.

[rhetorical]

I have never used inverted.

Disclaimer: I use a Logitech Trackman, so that may influence me in some way.

[Aiwendil42]

I've always inverted. Non-inverted seems extremely counter-intuitive to me, and I am simply unable to adapt to it. Actually, back in the days of Doom and Heretic I think I didn't use the mouse at all, just the keyboard.

It's worth noting that when you move the mouse 'up' on the Y-axis, you're not actually moving anything up - you're moving the mouse forward. The mouse never moves up and down, just side to side and forward - bakcward. So it's not a matter of 'mouse up = look up' or 'mouse up = look down' (in which case the latter really does seem illogical); it's 'mouse forward = look up' vs. 'mouse forward = look down'. And to me, at least, forward/down seems to more closely match real life - if I wanted to look at something on the ground, I'd probably move my head slightly forward and downward, while if I wanted to look at something in the sky, I'd tilt my head back.

[Welsh Mullet]

But you move your field of view, and eyes, up.
That's how i think of it anyway.

[phantom16]

I use to play without it being inverted, but then i started playing some shooter on the N64, and it could only be played inverted (there was no option to reverse it) so i just got used to it. Now i only plat inverted because it is what i have become used to playing.

and whenever someone who doesn't plat inverted asks me how i do that because, "when i press up i want to look up" they would say. i tell them that i look at is to similar to flying, and if you lift the back of your head up, you look down. shuts them right up

[BobTheElder]

(inverted) it feels to me like a matter of logic, and I can't see how people can use it any other way, but they obviously can, so I don't think there can be a right/wrong way... i'd be curious to see if I could learn to do it the other way. Not curious enough to actually try, but w/e.... :p

[tetsujin]

I don't even think of it as "inverted". Every time some game asks me if I want to invert the Y-axis, I have to second guess myself. "No, I want pitch control to work normally" - except that my idea of "normal" and everyone else's don't agree...

The basic contradiction, as others have mentioned, is that even when Y is "inverted" (push forward = pitch down), X rarely is (push left = yaw left). The "Y-inverted" system is a lot more self-consistent if X corresponds to roll, not yaw - that way the top of the stick and all the control directions correspond to the first-person "up", and the direction you move the stick is the direction you tilt. But most games don't use roll. Even most flying games don't... Players don't want to make coordinated turns, they just want to "go that way"...

I just hope they leave the inverting option in there, and keep it convenient. That way we can all be happy.

[fooliam]

I don't invert, mostly because I'm just used to the non-inverted mouse movements. It doesn't make any more or less sense to me, I just can't be bothered to re-train myself to an inverted y-axis.

[Xanthir]

Well, I've successfully retrained myself to be uninverted on both axes, simply because I've been playing several games that only give a y-axis toggle. As long as my fingers can handle things without my brain having to care about it, I'm happy.

[phider2]

I used to invert on an analog stick, but not on a mouse, until one of those "you're WRONG" people told me not to invert. I tried it and got the hang of non-invert within 10 minutes or so, and now I can't go back. However, for flight sims (with a joystick) I still invert.

[meatyochre]

Always invert. Used to drive my college buds crazy when we would take turns playing Halo. And I invert Y for world of warcraft, I've been playing that way for 5 years now. Nothing else makes sense to me.

[phider2]

To all the Y-invert people: How many of you have actually put any effort into trying the non-invert? I used to ALWAYS invert, but then I just tried it the other way, playing on easy mode until I got used to it. It only took about 10 minutes of playing to get used to it, and if I ever switch back to invert it takes a few minutes again, but I can get used to it.

[Plankton]

Flight sims and Mechwarrior games only. (Although Ace Combat barely qualifies as a simulator) Inverting the Y axis on anything else just feels odd. Incidentally, my friend always plays console FPS games with the Y axis inverted, and yet he has the audacity to label me a bizarre deviant.

[Xanthir]

To all the Y-invert people: How many of you have actually put any effort into trying the non-invert? I used to ALWAYS invert, but then I just tried it the other way, playing on easy mode until I got used to it. It only took about 10 minutes of playing to get used to it, and if I ever switch back to invert it takes a few minutes again, but I can get used to it.

I've tried. I can get kinda-used to it if I spend 15 minutes with it, but I'll still usually slip up.

I'm much less religious about x-invert. I do prefer inverting x as well, but I can live with non-inverted after some practice. The important thing is just that the game is *consistent* in how it handles the axes. If it inverts for one view and doesn't for another, I'll be fucked *the entire game*.

[Obby]

To all the Y-invert people: How many of you have actually put any effort into trying the non-invert? I used to ALWAYS invert, but then I just tried it the other way, playing on easy mode until I got used to it. It only took about 10 minutes of playing to get used to it, and if I ever switch back to invert it takes a few minutes again, but I can get used to it.

I try frequently when I play with friends. I don't want to make them sit through my scrounging through the options menu to hunt for the "Invert" option, so I give it a shot usually for a little while. After a few minutes I give up because it's just so awkward to me, and have to pause the game and find the option.

I invert Y axis all the time, and X axis when the camera is outside the body.

[MHD]

I only invert on Joypads. Really if I play an FPS on a console system without inverted Y, I fail so hard you'll all laugh your butt off. But on PC I never invert.

[P13808]

The y-axis always feels weird to me either way. Thus I just adjust to whatever is default after a few minutes.

[Noblesaur]

There is something so inherent and natural about the inverted-y on flight simulators (they have it that way for a good reason methinks).

However, with almost every other game, I strongly prefer the standard y-axis, it just seems to make more snese for some reason.

[HarvesteR]

I never invert. Even on Flight Sims...

To me, anything done using the mouse must mimic the mouse cursor movement, so to aim up, I move the mouse up.
On flight sims this is less of a matter since I use my joystick... but if by some reason I'm forced to use the mouse, it makes more sense to me if I'm pointing where the aircraft should point it's nose at than trying to mimic yoke/stick movement with the mouse.

To me the mouse is always a pointing device, and using it in any other way feels weird...

Cheers

[sam_i_am]

I voted invert, but then the question said "mouse" and i never invert when i'm using the mouse. only for analog stick.

[Роберт]

Crappy poll has no correct answer for me so I'm abstaining.

[Iranon]

Depends on the game and whether vertical mouse movement usually feels like "aiming/pointing equipment" or "looking/aligning myself".
So what I pefer may depend on level design as much as the engine... I can adjust to either though.

[Derek]

Never invert if I'm using a mouse. If it's third person camera controls on a gamepad, it depends on how the camera is positioned. The closer in it is, the more it feels like first person and therefore not inverted. If it's further out, it feels like moving the camera, so both axes are inverted. But more often than not, not inverted.

[tkbx]

Flight only. Having grown up on flight games, y-invert feels natural there, but anywhere else it just gets confusing.

[Dataflashsabot]

Flight: Invert Y, always
Mouse&Keyboard, first person: Normal
Mouse&Keyboard, third person: I don't, I grab a gamepad
Gamepad, first person: Invert Y only
Gamepad, third person: Invert Y, Invert X (That is, moving the right stick left should let me see to my character's left)

[Eseell]

I go with whatever the default is. There are a handful of modern games that have inverted controls enabled by default, and I just get used to it for that game. This drives some of my friends crazy if we're playing hot-seat multiplayer games. The exception is that if it's a flight sim then of course it's inverted, because I'm using a joystick.

[Eomund]

For me, up is up and down is down. Its the only way to play.

[AvatarIII]

My girlfriend was playing Ratchet and Clank HD the other day, and asked me to help her on a bit, only for me to discover, it had both inverted Y and inverted X!!! as default!!! I had to change both in the settings to even attempt to help.

Her reason for not minding was that because it is 3rd person, the inverted controls controlled the camera so up moved the camera up (and therefore the view down) and left moved the camera left (and therefore the view to the right).
There is some logic to that, but when you have played a lot of FPSs it seems backwards, because you can essentially imagine the camera being close and close to the character's head, why would the controls suddenly flip when you reached the character's head?

As for inverted Y in flight sims, that makes sense because you are essentially using the joystick to tilt the plane, pulling left brings the left wing down and therefore banks left, vice versa for right, pushing forward pushes the nose down, and pulling back pulls the nose up.