Taking it seriously: The zombie problem

[Vapour]

Water bottles, some high energy food and some normal food (Canned food), LED flashlight, extra batteries, super glue, bandages + plasters, a crowbar, a pocket knife, pliers, two boxs of matches, zippo lighter with extra fuel, electrical tape, a magnesium bar, string, lots of string, blanket, waterproofs. Floor mat (padding you can use while camping).
Few spare clothes, a map, a weapon (Baseball bat or something) Will mostly be flight rather then fight.

Think that covers most of it, probably a load I've missed though.

[SecondTalon]

yeah, how does that get in there?

Open backpack, put kukri inside, close backpack?

How is that not hard to understand? If your backpack can't handle an object 16-18 inches long, it's.. kinda a small backpack, isn't it?

[Torvaun]

Oh hey, it's a backpack. Wonder what's inside it...


Wait, is that what I think it is?


KUKRI, MOTHERFUCKER!

[Oregonaut]

Well, what would you recommend if cast-iron is too soft to knock the stupid out of a zombie head?

[Josephine]

Why are people bringing magnesium bars? You don't have anything that can light it, what other uses are there?

[Oregonaut]

In the field you take a magbar and shave off some of it, then strike sparks with a metal object and a rock. The sparks light the mag shavings.

[Josephine]

Oh, okay, that makes sense. Yeah, solid magnesium needs really high heat, like an acetylene torch or something similar.

[Torvaun]

Yeah. It's meant for shaving. And mine is a camping one with a flint (not actually flint, some metal alloy) in the spine of it for making sparks. Just use the back of the knife you shaved it with, and bam.

ETA: I'm against melee with zombies whenever possible. Even if you're so damn good you can guarantee they won't be able to injure you in the slightest, most attacks have the potential for sending zombie juices flying around. As far as we know, zombie juice on skin is all it takes, let alone in the eyes or mouth.

[Oregonaut]

I feel the same way, but it is the same principle as a gun or a condom.

That's why I'm going to add some melee weapons to my EPB when I can find some that cover the Zed menace.

[Torvaun]

Nitrile gloves and brass knuckles, then.

[Oregonaut]

nitrile gloves tear easy, and need to be disposed of after each fight. Carrying a box means a limited supply.

[pheonixduprese]

I would have to concur. Your best bet would be a firearm and a flightish nature. Preferably a bow and arrow, because you can always make more arrows/bows if necessary.

[Josephine]

I would have to concur. Your best bet would be a firearm and a flightish nature. Preferably a bow and arrow, because you can always make more arrows/bows if necessary.

A bow and arrow isn't going to do much to a zombie, unless you're a good enough shot to hit the Achilles tendon every time. A gun and plenty of ammo is a lot better.

[Telchar]

Or sever the spinal cord. A shot through the neck with a broadhead arrow would do plenty of damage. Your problem is going to be getting a bow with enough power to sever a zombie neck at a distance.

[Josephine]

A composite bow or a crossbow would be great for that.

[Oregonaut]

I forgot, what kind of zombies were we working with here? Because leaving a bitey-head on the ground after severing the spine makes the kitten cry.

[SecondTalon]

All of them. So if you're applying a solution, it's best to mention which Zombies this will work for, which it will not, and which ones would end up better off due to your actions.

Downer Buzzkillington Logic -

Spoiler:

Since Zombies are completely fictional, it seems only fair that when discussing a defense, one should include every and all zombie types that one has encountered in Fiction, from the kind that have some sort of muscle memory and group in places that meant something to them and seem to actually learn (albeit slowly) [Romero Zombies]... to your notactuallyzombies Zombies [28 Days/Weeks] and even your intelligent zombies [Revenge of the Living Dead]. And all the types I missed that fall in-between those three, or even outside of that triangle.

[Oregonaut]

Ok, that's what I thought. I just didn't want to harsh on their logic if we were discussing the Romero zombies, where severing the head doesn't do pants.

[pheonixduprese]

FRelatedT: If the shit does ever hit the fan, damn. Zombies are scary.

[SummerGlauFan]

Just how much fluids are you expecting to be flying around? Your fairly-typical zombie is undead, and juices in a corpse tend to congeal. Sure, a recent zombie might be somewhat messy, but a month-or-more-old is basically going to be dessicated. Which begs the question of how they move, but we can ignore that.

[Oregonaut]

Well, your truly dead-undead are going to be less of a problem as time progresses, simply due to decay. Unless they are magical dead-undead, at which point they will retain the reanimated state unless acted upon by an outside force of sufficient strength (plus magical weapon +1 or better). If they are 28D/W/M/Y/C-L dead, then they are still living to a degree, and will not congeal, at which point fluid transfer is an issue.

[SummerGlauFan]

Well, if they're actual living zombies, then you would need no special tactics to beat them; they are basically just incredibly stupid and aggressive people.

Still, the benefits of a melee weapon are in it's use as a backup/emergency weapon, either as a last resort (such as out of bullets or you just got tackled from around a corner) or something you are likely to get early on, unlike firearms (for example, I have several swords on my wall, there's hammers and axes in the garage, but guns have to be kept somewhere safe, i.e. hard to access, such as a safe or locked gun cabinet). Not to mention they tend to be silent (you use a ball-peen* hammer to kill a zombie you just can't avoid, instead of firing and attracting more) and can have other uses (axe, crowbar, and machete, for example).

*I apologize if I spelled that wrong.

[pheonixduprese]

Well, if they're actual living zombies, then you would need no special tactics to beat them; they are basically just incredibly stupid and aggressive people.

*cough* *cough* KIM JONG IL *cough* *cough* HITLER *cough* *cough* AHMADINEJAD *cough* *cough*

Incredibly stupid yet aggressive are probably the most dangerous kind of people/being, because they don't have the ability to rationalize.

[SummerGlauFan]

Well, if they're actual living zombies, then you would need no special tactics to beat them; they are basically just incredibly stupid and aggressive people.

*cough* *cough* KIM JONG IL *cough* *cough* HITLER *cough* *cough* AHMADINEJAD *cough* *cough*

Incredibly stupid yet aggressive are probably the most dangerous kind of people/being, because they don't have the ability to rationalize.

Well, when I mean incredibly stupid and aggressive, I mean "charges right at you without any plan or weapon and tries to kill you with bare hands/teeth." No one ever accused the infected in Left 4 Dead* or 28 Days Later of ever being smart.

Also, I should mention that, if fighting smart zombies, I'd probably wind up offing myself, honestly.

* Vs doesn't count!

[Oregonaut]

Or even worse, the desire to rationalize. They also like disproportionate responses.

[SummerGlauFan]

Or even worse, the desire to rationalize. They also like disproportionate responses.

I was thinking zombies that are just as smart as us. For example, there is a book out there in which the zombies have all the memories of their former selves but are still just as aggressive towards living things as mindless zombies are, so they can use weapons, drive, set traps, etc. That would just be bad all around.

[Oregonaut]

Yes, but that's no different than fighting humans. If they are intelligent, they are not as scary. Intelligent creatures have motives, they have rationality, they can be predicted, misdirected, and misled. PSYOPS still function on creatures with intelligence, no matter how basic. Zombies are scary because nothing you do will prevent them from taking over the world eventually.

[SummerGlauFan]

Yes, but that's no different than fighting humans. If they are intelligent, they are not as scary. Intelligent creatures have motives, they have rationality, they can be predicted, misdirected, and misled. PSYOPS still function on creatures with intelligence, no matter how basic. Zombies are scary because nothing you do will prevent them from taking over the world eventually.

No. Something capable of spreading just like zombies, such as a bite (in the book, anyone who dies without massive brain trauma came back, which was even worse because you were one heart attack away from an outbreak in any shelter), just as set on my destruction as a typical zombie, but also capable of making coherent plans, using complex tools, etc is a much scarier threat. Remember, they would still be zombies, they would just have a lot more options on killing you (or driving you out to infect you).

[Oregonaut]

So you're saying more "sentient", instead of "intelligent"? Because if they can communicate with each other, discuss optimal hunting strategies, develop fallback plans, etc. Then you can predict what they are going to do. Zombies with guns are really not that much different than humans with guns.

[SummerGlauFan]

Are you kidding? You can much more easily predict what a typical mindless zombie will do; it will see you, head towards you in the most direct path possible, and try to eat you. That's why tactics like making them fall off cliffs work so well, and why you can rely on nothing more than a static barrier to keep you safe.

Intelligent zombies are much, much, MUCH less predictable. To use a comparison, that's why we have intelligence operations in wars because "psyops" don't freaking work. You need to KNOW what your enemy is up to in order to counter it. Only this time it's different; there is no negotiation. They exist for no reason other than to turn you or kill you. Only now, they can shoot at you, or burn your fort down, or tunnel under a wall, or poison your water, or if they have the resources even pull off an air strike, or anything they can possibly think of doing to get their objective. Heck, they'd even be capable of psychological warfare, such as calling out to remind you that you don't have food for eternity and wouldn't it be better to join their ranks instead of slowly starve to death, or threaten to brutally torture someone near and dear to you until you come out.

[Oregonaut]

Right. Because a thinking enemy won't actively attempt to engage, instead of sitting in the closet for seven years doing nothing because they don't require thought.

<this has been sarcasm>

I would rather face, and have faced a number of times, opponents who actively attempt to pursue me. The danger comes from thinking you are safe only to find out that you really, really are not.

[SummerGlauFan]

Right. Because a thinking zombie couldn't pass itself off as simply a sick person and get into your group.

Pure instinctual biological homing weapon is easier to deal with than adaptive threat any day. Why you fail to realize this astounds me.

Look, both suck, ok? But I'd much rather face an enemy who never thinks than one who does and can learn my habits and tactics. Which is also why, in zombie stories, hostile survivors often become a much more significant threat than zombies.

[Oregonaut]

Hiding that you're really dead is going to be a problem. Most sick people are going to be shunned right proper fast in a zombie apocalypse scenario. Only the "too stupid to live" are going to "la-dee-da" that one away. I agree that both suck, but I have trained to fight against thinking enemies. I have fought against thinking enemies, I'm used to that. The unthinking ones will act in less predictable ways, because they won't do what you expect "people" to do. They're harder to plan for.

[SummerGlauFan]

No, they are not. I listed exactly what a mindless zombie will do when it sees you, which is head straight at you. Whereas one that can think and adapt will keep changing tactics until it finds one that works, and even worse can learn how I tend to act.

Edit: Deleted a rather rude couple of sentences I made. My apologies to Oregonaut and anyone else who read it.

[Oregonaut]

Roooight. Kay. Have fun.

[Azrael001]

The intelligent zombies would be less scary, but obviously harder to fight. If one keeps one's intelligence and only becomes homicidal towards living humans, why not just conver everyone ASAP?

[SecondTalon]

Granted, they do have superpowers, but see Marvel Zombies for a reason as to why that may be bad. If there's an insatiable hunger for living people, at least.

[Azrael001]

I guess being super hungry for a non-existant food group would be bad...

[Oregonaut]

It turned out to really suck for them.

[SummerGlauFan]

And I thought a craving for a cherry pepsi was bad when I couldn't get to the corner store...